Back
[00:10:15] <rue_shop3> you still working on that?
[00:10:38] <rue_shop3> may I suggest building some of the ideas and seeing what the REAL WORLD benifits and pitfalls are?
[00:10:55] <DagoRed> lol
[00:38:10] <anonnumberanon> me?
[00:38:43] <anonnumberanon> I've been putting 10 hours a day at my new job then commuting and sleeping. My lab is 3 hours away.
[00:38:56] <anonnumberanon> My robot is sulking right mew.
[00:39:51] <DagoRed> :(
[00:40:25] <Jak_o_Shadows> rue, did you ever get anywhere with the electric truck project?
[01:00:42] <anniepoo> sorry, I've got 2 computers, was sworking at the other one
[01:00:59] <anniepoo> linear bushings are meant for just that - linear motion
[01:01:10] <anniepoo> you might consider a plain bronze bushing?
[01:01:32] <anniepoo> though this is not a subject I'm expert in
[01:02:25] <DagoRed> anniepoo: irissi or weechat + screen + ssh. Your IRCing from multiple computers will become a thing of the past.
[01:02:48] <Jak_o_Shadows> Or just a bouncer.
[01:03:13] <DagoRed> I use weechat at my bouncer, works great on my phone too (android's only as far as I know, unless you want to use znc)
[01:05:00] <rue_shop3> why bother?
[01:05:07] <rue_shop3> just run a client on each device
[01:05:26] <DagoRed> because that is a pain rue
[01:05:43] <rue_shop3> how is that a pain
[01:06:01] <anniepoo> Dago - no, it's just that I'm only running irc from one computer
[01:06:13] <anniepoo> the other one's running some full screen 3D editors
[01:06:31] <anniepoo> and I'm not looking at the one running IRC
[01:06:54] <anniepoo> so the real issue can only be solved by some fix to my perceptual system
[01:07:07] <DagoRed> hmm
[01:07:15] <anniepoo> telepathic mind meld with someone perhaps
[01:07:33] <DagoRed> rue_shop3: It's a pain because I don't like trying to see what window is on what machine.
[01:07:50] <anniepoo> I suppose I could run a bot that feeds text to speech, but that'd get really annoying fast
[01:07:51] <DagoRed> Plus... I have 1 machine that has all the fun things in the background.
[01:07:58] <rue_shop3> how many channels are you in?
[01:08:01] <DagoRed> anniepoo: it does, I've tried it.
[01:08:06] <DagoRed> Only 34 or so.
[01:08:36] <DagoRed> 8 of them are split between being a dev for 2 distros.
[01:08:40] <rue_shop3> are ANY of them active?
[01:08:47] <DagoRed> a lot of them
[01:11:01] <DagoRed> right now, no. Most people are sleeping.
[01:11:04] <anniepoo> I have a channel that has a bot. Contractors can join that channel and give the bot the secret word and it does set off festival, which announces over our integrated sound system that somebody wants me on IRC
[01:11:32] <DagoRed> anniepoo: that's awesome.
[01:11:40] <DagoRed> I could integrate that with makepi but... no.
[01:11:57] <anniepoo> however I don't want to give that out freely since I'd get called back all the time to the machine when I need to be doing other stuff
[01:12:00] <DagoRed> Sweet! Fixed a build for aiengine.
[01:12:10] <rue_shop3> festival, I feel sorry for you
[01:12:18] <anniepoo> why?
[01:12:23] <rue_shop3> from what I'v seen, in 10 years, its not improved at all
[01:12:27] <anniepoo> it works fine for me, and has nice voices
[01:12:49] <anniepoo> uh, thats sort of like not using ping because it hasn't changed much in 30 years
[01:13:07] <rue_shop3> 10 yeras ago, you could only understand it if you knew what it was saying
[01:13:19] <anniepoo> festival just plays the voice - all the quality issues are in the voice itself
[01:13:21] <rue_shop3> last I heard, it'd not improved at all
[01:13:29] <rue_shop3> uh-hu
[01:13:38] <anniepoo> and there are now very nice voices for festival, see the festvox project
[01:13:44] <anniepoo> 8c9
[01:13:47] <rue_shop3> I started writing FRANC, but never bothered finsihing it
[01:13:57] <rue_shop3> er, PHRANC
[01:14:03] <rue_shop3> hmm
[01:14:18] <anniepoo> the women's music singer?
[01:14:24] <rue_shop3> PHonetic Reader And Noise Compiler
[01:14:34] <rue_shop3> tts
[01:14:48] <rue_shop3> a russian worked on it with me, its got a russian accent
[01:14:53] <rue_shop3> :)
[01:15:07] <rue_shop3> but thats just phonetic rule corrections
[01:16:01] <anniepoo> cool
[01:16:08] <anniepoo> I'm just a poor user of such things
[01:16:23] <rue_shop3> my goal was a tts that could be understood
[01:16:33] <rue_shop3> I worked with festival a lot
[01:16:40] <anniepoo> well, the festivox voices are quite beautiful
[01:16:48] <rue_shop3> placeholder media for a kits educational software comapny
[01:17:07] <rue_shop3> they all sounded like a duck being trangled
[01:17:12] <anniepoo> there's a company that sells incredible voices for it, commercially
[01:17:16] <rue_shop3> ah
[01:19:08] <rue_shop3> I was building a recording-based phoname set, but I wanted to 100% synth everything
[01:19:10] <anniepoo> and some UK university that has a bunch of CC licensed ones that are quite nice
[01:19:20] <rue_shop3> I'm still kinda working on it, research wise
[01:19:36] <rue_shop3> whats the name of the voice your using?
[01:20:06] <anniepoo> I'm using whatever's default with install, at the moment
[01:20:13] <anniepoo> the annunciator doesn't need much
[01:20:24] <anniepoo> and does sound like a movie robot
[01:20:57] <anniepoo> the CC festvox ones are by Carnegie Mellon
[01:21:41] <anniepoo> many aren't that nice, but a few are good
[01:21:50] <anniepoo> CMU Arctic is one of the good ones
[01:26:08] <rue_shop3> huh, on average, over 2 years, the shop prints 1page/day
[01:26:32] <rue_shop3> so your the only one who understands it
[01:26:59] <rue_shop3> ... kinda defeats everything you were just saying
[01:27:29] <rue_shop3> :/
[01:27:57] <anniepoo> ok, found it
[01:28:11] <anniepoo> http://tcts.fpms.ac.be/synthesis/mbrola.html
[01:28:24] <anniepoo> I think these are better
[01:31:04] <anniepoo> so, long story short- some time ago I needed to work this problem, and did so, and what I remember is that there are better voices around if you hunt about, including some nice commercial ones that I was able to get free for research
[01:34:10] <eadthem> I dont supose anyone has seen katsmeow lately?
[01:35:20] <rue_shop3> yup, shes already gone to bed
[01:36:59] <anniepoo> I'm headed to bed myself
[01:37:00] <anniepoo> nite all
[03:35:47] <rue_bed> http://www.martinreddy.net/gfx/3d/DXF10.spec
[04:27:28] <rue_house> ARG, they screwed up!
[04:27:36] <rue_house> the BASIC code is WRONG
[04:27:53] <rue_house> it gets stuck in a loop when it does the gosub to 1400
[04:28:35] <rue_house> THIS IS WHY I WRITE MY OWN CODE
[04:28:35] <rue_house> arg
[05:00:43] <rue_house> ok, the code is close
[05:44:30] <theBear> goto line number ? i thought line numbers didn't exist this century
[05:46:50] <SpeedEvil> rue_house is trapped in 1988.
[05:47:18] <veverak> SpeedEvil: we got used to it
[05:47:39] <SpeedEvil> Listening to 'Belinda Carlisle - Heaven Is A Place On Earth' over and over.
[10:49:12] <rue_bed> i rewrote it
[10:49:39] <rue_bed> but the problem is that the dxf I tried to open has tags that weren't defined back then
[11:36:31] <scope> hello serious question here
[11:36:47] <scope> how come no one has developed an iron man suit or gundamn suit yet
[11:37:02] <scope> surely we have the tech
[11:37:22] <joga> but who has a deathwish
[11:37:27] <scope> ??
[11:37:28] <rue_house> I'm building a 12' servomecha
[11:37:39] <rue_house> but I'm not getting in it, thats just stupid
[11:37:54] <scope> why
[11:38:03] <rue_house> ... falls over and you get a COMPUTER thru the chest
[11:38:05] <scope> seriously im not trying to be a troll or anything im just really curious
[11:38:20] <scope> but theres a thing called padding for that
[11:38:20] <rue_house> I'm gonna use remote control
[11:38:28] <rue_house> with force feedback, dont get me wrong
[11:38:45] <joga> I'm not really that well versed with what the iron man or gundam suit can do but I guess you can fly with it or something? it would be a glorious suicide though, but a costly one
[11:38:47] <scope> surely it could be done like a gindam where by a cockpit is created first
[11:38:55] <scope> then the robotics added after
[11:39:13] <rue_house> http://cyberneticzoo.com/wp-content/uploads/ge-Hardiman-front-x640.jpg
[11:39:31] <rue_house> but it HAS been done, long before colour pictures
[11:39:59] <rue_house> that was __1965__
[11:40:02] <scope> if we can fly planes and drive tanks whats the difference with a gundam
[11:40:08] <joga> well, uh..
[11:40:16] <scope> wah that looks brutal
[11:40:22] <joga> ...and useless
[11:40:22] <rue_house> http://dsg.files.app.content.prod.s3.amazonaws.com/gereports/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/22040000/tumblr_n2dzgrNArl1qk4ealo2_400.gif
[11:40:37] <rue_house> dont go thinking boston dynamics came up with anything new either
[11:40:58] <rue_house> that might be a model, but it did exist
[11:41:24] <scope> looks like darpas canceled robo hauler or what ever it was called
[11:41:35] <scope> military cancelle the use because marines said it was way to loud
[11:41:38] <rue_house> cause BN went under?
[11:41:47] <rue_house> heh YES
[11:42:43] <scope> but if you had like a gundam suit or pacific rim style suit (not the mind joining just the robot) you could possibly goto space and back
[11:43:00] <rue_house> http://blog.machinefinder.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/a633909031245413596.jpg
[11:43:11] <rue_house> DO YOU KNOW how long THAT thing has been around!?
[11:43:59] <rue_house> you do realize that we are challanged to make batteries good enough to operate even a full sized car, right?
[11:44:10] <scope> yes
[11:44:21] <scope> but if you could use a nuclear core
[11:44:46] <scope> i suppose power is the main issue
[11:44:48] <rue_house> you do realize how large nuclear power sources are, right?
[11:44:54] <rue_house> https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/1b/1c/ff/1b1cff81a82d22955221a8ac965949fc.jpg
[11:44:59] <rue_house> that one looks pretty well thought out
[11:45:05] <rue_house> compliance and everything
[11:45:15] <rue_house> bit cramped tho
[11:45:37] <rue_house> that cant be more than a 24" iphone
[11:46:07] <rue_house> once again we will need suitcases for carrying phones
[11:46:19] <scope> nuclear is only large because of the amount of power we need to use
[11:46:31] <rue_house> nope, it cant scale down
[11:46:34] <rue_house> physics
[11:46:41] <scope> it can
[11:46:43] <scope> and has
[11:46:46] <rue_house> the reason it works is based on critical mass
[11:47:05] <rue_house> sattilite nuclear batteries do NOT work the same
[11:47:47] <scope> you have micro nuclear reactors that are small enough to be flown in
[11:48:23] <scope> the only one i can think of is toshiba
[11:49:36] <z64555> Sattelite nuclear batteries are radiothermal
[11:49:49] <z64555> They're basically a hot brick
[11:50:25] <scope> yer they're about the size of a small office dustbin
[11:50:29] <rue_house> I wonder how many watts the average satillite consumes
[11:50:34] <z64555> They don't output a whole lot of power per second, but they're the ultimate energizer bunney
[11:50:41] <z64555> it just keeps going and going and going
[11:50:45] <scope> not much because of the solar panels
[11:50:59] <z64555> I'd say, maybe 10W or so
[11:51:13] <z64555> depends on the electronics they're using
[11:51:17] <scope> the biggest problem would be heat
[11:51:21] <z64555> yes
[11:51:29] <scope> heat you need but to much and you damage the components
[11:51:46] <scope> subs are different because they have the ocean to cool th reactor
[11:51:56] <z64555> yep
[11:52:34] <z64555> so they can use a fission reactor without worrying about coolant reserves
[11:52:39] <z64555> mostly
[11:52:52] <scope> so their must be an efficent way to get a nuclear reactor down to about washing machine size and produce enough energy
[11:53:19] <scope> liquid nitrogen isnt an anwser its too temporary
[11:53:27] <z64555> and too cold
[11:53:35] <rue_house> I think I'm starting to understand parsing a dxf
[11:53:42] <scope> fussion might work but were still 30 years away
[11:54:03] <z64555> fusion reactors are larger than fission ones, IIRC
[11:54:09] <scope> the too cold bit isnt a problem you can regulate how much is poured over the reactor
[11:54:17] <z64555> sigh.
[11:54:18] <scope> again no
[11:54:30] <scope> fussion can be the size of a washing machine
[11:54:54] <z64555> tokamak designs? what about those huge ass supporting hardware for the lasers
[11:55:10] <rue_house> my mecha needs to be 12' tall cause thats the smallest I can build it with the parts and budget available
[11:55:43] <rue_house> did you know the actuation of human fingers is really trickey?
[11:56:02] <z64555> stellarators are probably the smallest you can get, they're about the diameter of two or three pickup trucks
[11:56:28] <rue_house> how are you at chemistry?
[11:56:39] <rue_house> want to invent a battery that beats them all hands down?
[11:56:47] <rue_house> makes you richa nd famous?
[11:57:02] <scope> if a 14 year old can build a nuclear fussion reactor in his parents garage i think its safe to say its smaller than a pick up truck
[11:57:08] <scope> the problem is containing the heat
[11:57:26] <rue_house> no, he can just collect enough smoke detector matter to make the FBI freak out
[11:57:35] <scope> haha
[11:57:49] <scope> my google searches are enough to freak out any gov on the planet hahaha
[11:57:59] <z64555> scope: link?
[11:58:06] <rue_house> you didn't hear?
[11:58:24] <rue_house> kid was collecting radio active material from smoke detectors...
[11:58:38] <scope> https://www.ted.com/talks/taylor_wilson_yup_i_built_a_nuclear_fusion_reactor?language=en
[11:59:33] <scope> a guy 50 something built a fusion reactor from parts on ebay
[11:59:38] <z64555> :/
[11:59:46] <z64555> Is there any pictures of the reactor itself
[11:59:53] <z64555> or the schematics
[12:00:02] <scope> let me check
[12:00:08] <scope> it was a while ago i looked
[12:03:53] <z64555> only images I found so far that are accredited to him, are of a fission reactor
[12:04:31] <z64555> fission != fusion
[12:05:59] <scope> which taylor
[12:06:08] <scope> theres a lot about him
[12:06:14] <scope> it went global all in the news etc
[12:06:21] <scope> science mags
[12:06:27] <scope> another guy was Mark Suppes
[12:06:33] <scope> there was a video a long time ago
[12:06:50] <rue_house> yea, lots of places blew it up into something it wasn't
[12:06:58] <rue_house> and lots of people blew up the blow up
[12:07:10] <scope> of a guy who made fussion reactor he bought a glass top so you could see the reaction but it failed
[12:07:17] <scope> he was around 40 at the time
[12:07:22] <scope> cant find the video at all
[12:07:53] <rue_house> there were a lot of people claiming to have made fusion reactors that hadn't
[12:08:35] <rue_house> the media gave lots of them lots of publicity, they collected a lot of money from people who believed them when they said they could make it work with just a bit more money
[12:09:05] <z64555> scope: you keep saying fussion and I can't tell if you mean fission or fusion
[12:09:16] <rue_house> then they dissapeared, but because the government was hiding them away, but because they couldn't make the reactor and had to hide from the people who gave them money
[12:10:02] <Snert> the scientific community were all over that like stink on shit. They were not fooled.
[12:10:19] <rue_house> lots of people give people like that money
[12:10:31] <z64555> just like on kickstarter :P
[12:11:06] <rue_house> go ahead, make a machine that looks fancy with flashing lights, take a good video, put in on youtube, say it generates power, but not enough to be usefull unless you can get funds to build a bigger better version
[12:11:19] <rue_house> you could rake in a few thousand
[12:11:30] <rue_house> the world is full of wealthy idiots
[12:11:36] <z64555> polywell looks interesting, but I don't have enough data to see how it works
[12:12:11] <rue_house> smoke mirrors, batteries and flashing lights, your set
[12:13:07] <rue_house> tesla did it
[12:13:11] <rue_house> you can too
[12:18:34] <scope> fussion is fuseing together two nuclei fission is splitting the attom
[12:18:41] <rue_shop3> well I dont think anyone is comming by for robotics today
[12:18:43] <scope> im talking about fussion as its cleaner
[12:19:06] <z64555> fusion, then
[12:19:35] <z64555> fussion looks like some bastard between fusion and fission. :P
[12:20:19] <scope> sorry bad at speeling haha
[12:21:03] <z64555> :)
[12:22:43] <z64555> regardless, it seems that most fusion reactors are still heat capture machines
[12:23:15] <z64555> in which heat generation is the goal
[12:24:07] <scope> yer thats the main problem we dont have a material that can withstand the heat
[12:24:12] <scope> brb
[12:25:31] <z64555> or have a coolant that can pipe out the heat fast enough?
[12:27:45] * z64555 starts to wonder if he should really study nuclear physics
[12:30:46] <scope> back
[12:31:19] <scope> if we could get a material that could withstand the heat it would be better than removing it
[12:31:35] <scope> then a reactor could be the size of a basketball
[12:31:50] <scope> that would easily fit into a robot
[12:31:56] <scope> and its clean
[12:34:27] <scope> but on the robotics side would it be possible to create a gundam suit
[12:34:51] <scope> if you had the power obviously
[12:35:22] <rue_shop3> why not make a battery
[12:35:36] <rue_shop3> storage is just as good as conversion you know
[12:36:36] <z64555> rue_shop3: energy density has been a long-time problem. super caps have been a main interest for a while
[12:37:04] <z64555> "if we could get a material that could withstand the heat it would be better than removing it"
[12:37:16] <z64555> think you're missing something here
[12:37:50] <z64555> you still have to remove heat from the reaction, because that's a big part of the energy that is harvestable from it
[12:38:27] <rue_shop3> yea I just said I have a new tech that just needs someone to sit down and do some basic chemistry for a while
[12:38:59] <z64555> you could continously contain the heat, but then it'll just leak through the material or otherwise become some other form of radiation that's not as easy to convert into electricity
[12:39:21] <z64555> such as light, X-rays
[12:40:21] <z64555> also
[12:40:21] <scope> hhhmmm
[12:40:36] <z64555> fusion and fission reactors are made to generate electricity, not force
[12:40:56] <scope> and rue with batteries we have kinda hit a dead patch nothing has been updated in a long time nothing note worthy
[12:41:35] <z64555> If you use something such as a combustable fuel, it's easier to transfer power to machinery than to convert to electricity, transfer across cables, and use a motor to convert to mechanical power
[12:41:53] <rue_shop3> yea, your not listening, so I'm not gonna bother telling you
[12:41:55] <z64555> scope: lithium ion and lithium polymer don't count?
[12:42:01] <scope> with my idea for a gundam you would use the reactor to charge a battery
[12:42:11] <scope> there not really that special
[12:42:25] <scope> i mean their ok but even the big companies say its not enough
[12:42:38] <scope> that the battery industry is too stagnent
[12:43:17] <scope> id say the biggest notion was the hydrogen fuel cell
[12:43:28] <scope> and thats still in baby stages.
[12:43:50] <scope> its another 20 - 40 years before your iphone has a hydrogen cell
[12:44:15] <rue_shop3> what I have is a worst 5x the best lithium ion density
[12:44:37] <z64555> rue_shop3: which is?
[12:44:52] <rue_shop3> rue_shop3> yea, your not listening, so I'm not gonna bother telling you
[12:44:56] <scope> and this is merely a personal opinion. batteries and better power sources are stagnent because of big companies wanting to profit from other tech
[12:45:28] <scope> im listening but i dont see how chemicals can help improve battery power
[12:45:32] <z64555> rue_shop3: I have been listening, but I've been busy arguing the case of nuclear generators
[12:45:32] <scope> would of been done already
[12:45:47] <rue_shop3> battery is just electrical storage, if you can store more than enough, it dosn't matter that its just storage
[12:45:47] <scope> haha i wouldnt say arguing more discusing
[12:46:01] <scope> problem is charging
[12:46:05] <rue_shop3> no
[12:46:14] <scope> the more you store the longer it takes to charge
[12:46:14] <rue_shop3> there are a million places to charge a battery
[12:46:24] <scope> take eclimo
[12:46:33] <scope> malaysias firt electric scooter
[12:46:35] <scope> its shit
[12:46:39] <scope> absalute crap
[12:46:46] <scope> 4 hours to charge the battery
[12:46:51] <scope> 2 hours of use
[12:46:58] <scope> if you drive like a sunday driver
[12:46:58] <z64555> I'm facepalming so many times that I've lost count
[12:47:25] <rue_shop3> I think in about 5 to 15 years, its gonna come out,
[12:47:31] <scope> z64555 with ??
[12:47:33] <rue_shop3> a data storage drive thats write-only
[12:47:47] <rue_shop3> but with massive capacity to the point it dosn't matter that its write-only
[12:47:54] <z64555> lmao...
[12:47:57] <rue_shop3> when its full, you just get another one
[12:48:05] <z64555> What's the point of a storage drive if all you can do is write to it
[12:48:20] <scope> im completely lost now
[12:48:25] <rue_shop3> what I mean, is no rewritability
[12:48:35] <rue_shop3> write once, read as much as you like
[12:48:42] <scope> technically we already have that
[12:48:43] <z64555> so basically a ROM
[12:48:44] <rue_shop3> in the order of 350Pb
[12:49:25] <rue_shop3> it just invalidates the 'deleted' data
[12:49:53] <rue_shop3> rewriting a 100M file 3x takes up 300M
[12:50:41] <scope> are we talking about batteries or harddrives
[12:50:45] <scope> haha
[12:50:55] <z64555> scope: the reason why batteries take so long to charge has to do with their chemistry. First, you have to have a voltage higher than the battery's voltage in order to charge it. Second, there's a limit to what that voltage difference can be before damaging the battery. Third, Coloumb's law
[12:51:04] <rue_shop3> I'm not gonna tell you about the battery cause your not listening
[12:51:11] <rue_shop3> I'll just work it out myself
[12:51:18] <scope> yer that i know
[12:51:25] <rue_shop3> part of my point was that if the storage is big enough, it dosn't matter that its limited
[12:51:38] <scope> it does if you want to be green
[12:51:48] <scope> will the battery be recycleable
[12:51:54] <scope> what materials will you use
[12:52:09] <scope> whats the cost to produce
[12:52:11] <rue_shop3> it dosn't wear out like existing batteries
[12:52:21] <z64555> being re-writable does matter if you have documents that you really don't want to be read
[12:52:23] <rue_shop3> the downside is that it can be REALLY unstable
[12:52:28] <rue_shop3> but so are li-ion
[12:52:33] <rue_shop3> and were doing fine with that
[12:53:03] <scope> but thats small scale and were not
[12:53:22] <z64555> if you want to destory a file, then you'd have to physcially destroy the entire drive that it's on
[12:53:24] <scope> theres a big problem to the planet in production of batteries storage refuse etc
[12:54:00] <scope> z64555 if your talking about a hard drive you would need to destroy either the disk and the memory chips
[12:54:21] <z64555> scope: I'm talking about rue_shop3's idea for a mega ROM
[12:54:24] <scope> ive destroyed hard drives before but the disk was intact and was able to recover data from it
[12:54:34] <rue_shop3> amazing how small some thoughts can be reduced to
[12:54:34] <scope> ah
[12:55:12] <rue_shop3> did you know there are people who wouldn't but an electric car because there were no charging stations in their area?
[12:55:24] <scope> yer i wouldnt
[12:55:33] <scope> thats why i got rid of the eclimo motorcycles
[12:55:45] <scope> i used to run a tour company no electric bikes
[12:55:45] <rue_shop3> did you know almost NO electric car owners charge their cars anywhere but at home cause its more convienient?
[12:56:00] <scope> thats because people charge rediculous amounts
[12:56:09] <rue_shop3> did you know there are a lot of people who wont buy an electric car cause the range is less than 300km?
[12:56:17] <scope> some people were actually trying to charge me 10 to charge the bikes
[12:56:34] <rue_shop3> did you know that almost no electric car owners drive 300km on one charge?
[12:56:42] <scope> i do
[12:56:51] <rue_shop3> most dont
[12:57:01] <scope> i can also tell you the best place in the world to go for electric cars is in the netherlands
[12:57:06] <rue_shop3> most people drive a few km/trip
[12:57:06] <z64555> because most live in the city, not in rural Australia :P
[12:57:30] <scope> theirs over 10000 charge points
[12:57:47] <rue_shop3> so all these people are gonna be buying up all the new electric cars with long range batteries, and then realizing they could have bought the car with less range, saved a ton of money, and toherwise not known the difference
[12:57:48] <scope> and yer their just not feasable and honestly producing these things now is wasting resources
[12:58:31] <rue_shop3> did you know operating an electric car costs less than 1/10 that of a gas car?
[12:58:52] <rue_shop3> do you know what the service of an electric car consists of?
[12:59:03] <scope> rue no it doesnt
[12:59:13] <scope> your not taking into account the cost of time waiting
[12:59:21] <rue_shop3> waiting for what?
[12:59:25] <scope> people always forget that time is money
[12:59:31] <rue_shop3> waiting for what?
[12:59:31] <rue_shop3> waiting for what?
[12:59:31] <rue_shop3> waiting for what?
[12:59:32] <rue_shop3> waiting for what?
[12:59:36] <scope> you waiting for 4 hours for a charge
[12:59:45] <rue_shop3> you charge over night
[12:59:46] <rue_shop3> duh
[12:59:50] <scope> thats an avaerage of 35 dollars
[12:59:59] <scope> just to charge a ca
[13:00:01] <z64555> or charge when you're not using the car
[13:00:06] <z64555> like
[13:00:12] <z64555> when you arrive at home
[13:00:15] <scope> but then you damage batteries
[13:00:21] <z64555> how
[13:00:21] <rue_shop3> your electricity must come from genorators, charging an empty electric car costs about $4
[13:00:30] <scope> i ran the ecilmo rental company for 2 years
[13:00:42] <scope> after the first year all the batteries had to be replaced
[13:00:58] <scope> because people were charging them when ever
[13:00:59] <z64555> If you damage the batteries by leaving them plugged in, then the charging circuit you are using is utter crap
[13:01:00] <rue_shop3> what model car?
[13:01:03] <scope> even if not empty
[13:01:06] <rue_shop3> lead acid batteries?
[13:01:13] <scope> li-ion
[13:01:20] <scope> and a new battery costs 5000
[13:01:31] <scope> not car
[13:01:34] <scope> motorcycle
[13:01:42] <z64555> your charger was crap, then
[13:01:51] <rue_shop3> batteries in new cars are garunteed 15 years
[13:02:03] <z64555> For li-ions, once the battery is fully charged, the charger is supposed to shut off voltage to it
[13:02:05] <scope> but the batteries in cars are mostly hydrogen fuel cells
[13:02:36] <z64555> If you are not going to be using said battery very often, then you can reduce its charge to 33%
[13:02:40] <rue_shop3> all my information is direct from the 6 electric car owners I know in the area
[13:03:06] <rue_shop3> the boss put solar on his roof, the solar offsets the car charging and more
[13:04:10] <rue_shop3> (he has a hot-tub, so he's not net +)
[13:04:59] <rue_shop3> ahh, my kitties are giving the documents on the table their stomp of approval
[13:06:21] <rue_shop3> I think if you dig, you can find the tesla survey that says that the public tesla chargers are almost completely unused
[13:06:34] <rue_shop3> all the car chargers around here are free
[13:06:49] <rue_shop3> but even they are almost never used
[13:07:13] <scope> its because of convienience
[13:07:30] <scope> everything in life thats developed is to make our lifes more effiecent
[13:07:59] <scope> if you have to take 4 hours out of your day or if you like to drive away at weekends an electric car isnt feasable
[13:08:16] <scope> for me travelling from kl to penang using an electric car would be a night mare
[13:09:56] <scope> and then if i owned one yer k in a city its no problem. short distance etc but then i would need a car for long distance so why have both
[13:10:12] <scope> i already have a car and a motorbike
[13:11:56] <rue_shop3> gas here is $1.08/L
[13:11:59] <rue_shop3> hows it there?
[13:12:10] <scope> bike cost 2k car cost 70k bike one week in petrol 10 car 30. refuel time 2 minutes
[13:12:13] <scope> depends
[13:12:29] <scope> if i convert from pounds to ringgit its 20p
[13:12:35] <scope> if i pay in ringgit
[13:12:38] <scope> 1.80
[13:12:48] <z64555> average everyday commuters would benefit from having an electric car
[13:13:08] <z64555> dunno about families in your area, but most around here have more than one per household
[13:13:15] <scope> yer same here
[13:13:21] <scope> in kl public stransport is shit
[13:13:30] <scope> so each house has maybe 4 or 5 cars
[13:13:39] <scope> our house has 4 plus 2 bikes
[13:13:48] <z64555> apartment dwellers usually use just the one car, but then again most apartment dwellers don't do a lot of long road trips
[13:13:49] <scope> (bikes are both mine :P)
[13:14:14] <scope> no i live across the road from apartments so i have to disagree
[13:14:22] <scope> it depends on the appartment
[13:14:26] <scope> if its shared
[13:14:30] <scope> how many rooms
[13:14:32] <z64555> high density apartment dwellers don't even own cars, they use bikes, public transportation, or walk
[13:14:35] <scope> id say 2 per appartment
[13:14:42] <scope> not here
[13:14:55] <scope> here everyone drives only the malays or indians ride bikes
[13:15:03] <scope> very rare you see chinese bikers
[13:15:12] <scope> and when you do its the big harleys or cbrs
[13:15:30] <scope> public transport is really really bad
[13:15:53] <z64555> depends on who's using it, really
[13:17:39] <scope> id say depends on the quality of the public transport
[13:17:50] <scope> when i lived in ausria i always used it
[13:17:51] <rue_shop3> oooo, making marble raceways is harder than it looks
[13:18:06] <scope> never even thought about buying a car or bike
[13:18:07] <rue_shop3> they really pick up speed
[13:18:14] <scope> hahah
[13:18:32] <scope> anyway
[13:18:37] <rue_shop3> ugh, right off the end every time
[13:18:49] <scope> its been fun chatting sorry for being so off topic hahah although i did start on topic
[13:19:08] <scope> its been a fun disscussion
[13:19:30] <rue_shop3> oh we havn't had the topic spec on there for a while have we?
[13:21:43] <rue_shop3> wow, google cant find a log of it
[13:21:43] <scope> i duno i joined honestly wanting to understand why we dont have robotic gundams
[13:22:03] <rue_shop3> we do
[13:22:12] <scope> i mean ones i can sit in
[13:22:12] <rue_shop3> we have since about 1967
[13:22:13] <scope> fly in
[13:22:17] <scope> and shoot shit
[13:22:25] <rue_shop3> we do
[13:23:07] <rue_shop3> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-07/fighting-robots-face-off-after-japanese-firm-accepts-challenge/6600076
[13:23:27] <rue_shop3> YOUR NOT LISTENING
[13:26:04] <scope> doesnt fly
[13:26:15] <rue_shop3> if your not building them, your not the guy who will have one
[13:26:37] <rue_shop3> so buy a welder and learn to use it
[13:26:51] <rue_shop3> and DONT LET THE PEOPLE UPSTAIRS STOP YOU
[13:29:21] <rue_shop3> any gundam worth its weight can break out of the apartment it was constructed in
[13:29:50] <rue_shop3> damage deposit be damned
[13:39:01] <z64[afk]> more of a mechwarrior, really
[13:39:05] <z64[afk]> or battlemech
[13:39:36] <z64[afk]> main reason we don't have robotic gundams is because tanks do a much better job of things
[13:39:44] <z64[afk]> so what if they're not as cinematic
[13:40:37] <rue_shop3> well gee, I got all this stuff ready for kids robotics last night and nobody came
[13:40:46] <z64[afk]> :(
[13:41:03] <rue_shop3> I shouldn't have spent till 2am on it
[13:41:42] <z64[afk]> well you didn't know that nobody would show up
[15:37:37] <rue_house> I'm waiting for paint to dry
[15:37:49] <rue_house> hmmmm
[15:52:32] <flyback> BMCC
[16:49:49] <anniepoo> I'm making a portfolio piece game today. I'm spending lots of time cutting out paper dolls (I'm using scans of paper cut art as assets)
[16:52:34] <MrCurious> .clear
[17:37:13] <rue_shop3> anniepoo, cant you just do that all in flash
[17:37:14] <rue_shop3> ?
[17:37:52] <rue_shop3> zlog
[17:39:20] <rue_shop3> DagoRed,
[17:40:05] <Tom_itx> rue_house nobody showed up!!
[17:40:20] <Tom_itx> spring break?
[17:40:42] <rue_shop3> :) maybe they are all ill
[17:40:55] <rue_shop3> DagoRed, sand blaster looks good
[17:41:17] <rue_shop3> red and black
[17:44:23] <zzz64> doot
[17:44:45] <z64555> Huh, so it's a live log
[17:46:06] <rue_house> http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/images/sandblaster.jpg
[17:46:26] <rue_house> looks ok eh?
[17:46:53] <rue_house> have a light going in it to try to dry it out
[17:49:02] <rue_house> low rez images rock, you cant tell I did it with a spray bomb
[17:49:26] <rue_house> runs and the overspray just dissapear
[17:49:29] <rue_house> :)
[17:50:40] <rue_house> Tom_itx, ?
[17:53:46] <Tom_itx> what?
[17:54:33] <Tom_itx> did you make that?
[17:54:37] <Tom_itx> looks good
[17:54:43] <rue_house> yea
[17:54:50] <rue_house> just making a proper image folder for it
[17:55:12] <Tom_itx> collecting aluminum blocks?
[17:56:02] <rue_house> me billets
[18:03:16] <anniepoo> not really
[18:03:49] <anniepoo> I suppose there's some artist somewhere who could, but they'd probably have to make some real cutouts to use as models
[18:12:20] <DagoRed> rue_house: nice.
[18:12:44] <DagoRed> I would have inverted the colors. But damn, that looks good.
[18:12:59] <rue_house> heh, inverted would be too red!
[18:13:12] <rue_house> thanks for the help
[18:13:18] <DagoRed> That's how mine was back at my old shop.
[18:13:27] <DagoRed> Mostly red with a little black.
[18:13:47] <DagoRed> rue_house: I get more and more jealous of your shop.
[18:13:50] <rue_house> I'm drying it now
[18:13:59] <rue_house> thats my deck, the shop it out of room
[18:14:15] <DagoRed> Ahh. Still... So jealous.
[18:14:34] <DagoRed> Didn't you have a lathe in the family room once?
[18:14:49] <rue_house> that was rifraf
[18:14:57] <rue_house> I'm not that crazy
[18:15:22] <Tom_itx> rue_house, what's a good MB to get nowdays?
[18:15:23] <DagoRed> Oh...
[18:15:34] <DagoRed> MB as in mother board?
[18:15:39] <DagoRed> Gigabyte.
[18:16:28] <rue_house> http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/projects/sandblaster/slide.htm
[18:18:49] <rue_house> anyone who wants to make the pause, forward and back links work, feel free to forward me a copy
[20:21:42] <rue_house> ok , after a nap, and some experimentation, I'm really starting to get how dxf files work
[20:23:59] <Jak_o_Shadows> Is this the CNC code writing?
[20:24:47] <rue_shop3> for the cam program I'm writing
[20:25:00] <rue_shop3> it would mean the world to be able to import dxf files
[20:25:05] <Jak_o_Shadows> that's the word I was looking for.
[20:25:28] <Jak_o_Shadows> Yeah, it'd be nice to have a good CAM program
[20:25:29] <rue_shop3> dxf files have a _LOT_ of junk
[20:26:02] <Jak_o_Shadows> Probably.
[20:26:04] <rue_shop3> all the good stuff is in a section called 'ENTITIES' which is the code 2 label right before the code 0 label called 'SECTION'
[20:26:17] <rue_shop3> it ends at code 0 ENDSEC
[20:26:29] <Jak_o_Shadows> I'm currently dealing with some fixed position files. E.g. characters x->x+y are this bit, etc.
[20:26:35] <rue_shop3> its all in sections, un-nested
[20:26:58] <rue_shop3> I might be able to suck lines (just a start) from a dxf tonight
[20:27:37] <rue_shop3> and I have the framework for holding the list of cnc commands
[20:27:45] <rue_shop3> the two ends come ever closer
[20:28:07] <rue_shop3> Jak_o_Shadows, want something to work on to help?
[20:29:04] <rue_shop3> need to work out how to group lines/arcs into... maybe I'm not ready for that yet
[20:29:21] <Jak_o_Shadows> argh, I would, but I don't have the time in the next few days.
[20:29:32] <Jak_o_Shadows> TBH, I don't know that I have the time for a few months
[20:36:24] <s34n> hello
[20:37:03] <Tom_itx> rue_shop3, you should get with JT about that
[20:38:05] <s34n> as a first time project I put stacking headers on an adafruit 16x12-bit pwm servo shield to try to drive some motors I pulled out of an old printer/scanner
[20:38:48] <s34n> but when I connect a motor to the shield, there is power
[20:39:07] <s34n> I expected that I would have to send power to the correct pin
[20:39:10] <Tom_itx> servo pwm is different than the pwm you need for that motor
[20:39:30] <Jak_o_Shadows> rue_shop2, if you chuck it up on github (or something that'll be updated), I'll definitely keep an eye on it
[20:39:43] <s34n> Tom_itx, ??
[20:40:48] <s34n> Tom_itx, different in what way?
[20:41:26] <Tom_itx> a servo receives a pulse every few ms to keep it's position
[20:41:49] <Tom_itx> where a motor uses a pulsewidth to control the motor speed
[20:42:22] <Tom_itx> -|---|---| compared to ___----____----
[20:43:02] <Tom_itx> usually a servo pulse is ~1.5-2ms every 20-30ms
[20:43:22] <Tom_itx> where a motor pwm is a square wave with varying on time
[20:43:41] <Jak_o_Shadows> Servos are generally smarter than motors. For a motor, the PWM signal is directly controlling the average voltage to the motor. For a servo, it's some sort of protocol thingy
[20:43:57] <s34n> Tom_itx, I'll come back to that in a sec, but either way there shouldn't be power by default, true?
[20:44:06] <Tom_itx> Jak_o_Shadows, i suspect he's talking about hobby servos
[20:44:32] <Tom_itx> instead of an industrial servo
[20:44:35] <Jak_o_Shadows> Yeah. Hobby servos are smarter than dumb motors still.
[20:46:14] <s34n> I'm just taking my first baby steps, so I pulled the motors from a home printer/scanner/copier
[20:46:52] <s34n> one seems to be a stepper, so I've set it aside for now
[20:47:12] <Tom_itx> yeah that's a whole different animal
[20:47:45] <s34n> one is a sun c6487
[20:48:46] <s34n> and the one I'm starting with is a c6419
[20:51:55] <s34n> Tom_itx, should power be on by default?
[20:52:04] <s34n> that seems wrong to me
[20:54:02] <s34n> these motors only have 2 leads, so I'm guessing they don't PWM
[20:54:46] <Tom_itx> sure they could
[20:55:08] <Jak_o_Shadows> Dumb DC motors. PWM would change the voltage oon the motor, which changes speed.
[20:58:52] <s34n> k. but mostly I'm concerned about the always-on status
[20:59:18] <s34n> I'm wondering if I should look harder for a sloppy solder
[20:59:31] <Jak_o_Shadows> What do you mean always on?
[21:00:29] <s34n> I mean that the shield is sending power to the motor all the time
[21:00:36] <s34n> without being told to
[21:07:48] <mrdata> sometimes you want that, for instance with a stepper motor that needs to hold
[21:08:31] <Jak_o_Shadows> For a servo motor, that is expected. Hobby servos will hold posiion, and generally you want that
[21:08:33] <s34n> but then I should manually turn the power on for that pin
[21:08:51] <s34n> my motor spins
[21:09:11] <Jak_o_Shadows> Yeah. You don't have a hobby servo.
[21:10:16] <Jak_o_Shadows> If you have this (
https://www.adafruit.com/products/1411), that's to be expected.
[21:11:32] <s34n> yeah.that's it
[21:18:41] <s34n> no good for plain dc motors?
[21:18:49] <Jak_o_Shadows> I think so.
[21:19:14] <deshipu> Jak_o_Shadows: actyally the chip on that board is a led driver
[21:19:28] <deshipu> so it should be able to drive a small motor
[21:20:44] <Jak_o_Shadows> OH yeah, it should be. But is it worth the effort?
[21:21:33] <s34n> Jak_o_Shadows, being brand-new, I don't know what effort is involved
[21:21:34] <deshipu> what effort?
[21:22:20] <s34n> I had figured I would just turn it on/off or adjust the speed
[21:22:46] <deshipu> it shouldn't rotate with duty cycle at 0
[21:24:11] <Jak_o_Shadows> Sure, it has a nice PWM chip on it. But surely it isn't quite configured for just shoving out the PWM. Like, motors generally want to be driven at above 20kHz?
[21:24:56] <Jak_o_Shadows> Also, the arduino i2c library that probably comes with it.
[21:25:25] <Jak_o_Shadows> "can sink up to 25 mA at 5 V" That's not a lot
[21:25:38] <Jak_o_Shadows> so I suppose the board has something special on it?
[21:26:42] <deshipu> PCA9685
[21:27:13] <deshipu> Each LED output has its
[21:27:14] <deshipu> own 12-bit resolution (4096 steps) fixed frequency individual PWM controller that operates
[21:27:16] <deshipu> at a programmable frequency from a typical of 24 Hz to 1526 Hz with a duty cycle that is
[21:27:19] <deshipu> adjustable from 0 % to 100 % to allow the LED to be set to a specific brightness value.
[21:35:20] <rue_shop3> TLC5940 as a genorator of motor pwm ;)
