#robotics Logs

Dec 29 2014

00:16 Hyratel ace4016, well first you need to decide on a scope
00:16 Hyratel as in project scope
00:16 Hyratel WHERE, WHAT
00:16 Hyratel are your active questions
00:17 ace4016 i'm aware :P
00:17 ace4016 jotted down a few things after deciding
00:19 ace4016 loads of sensors i can think of putting on this thing. need to figure out what task it will perform though to isolate what it should have and how it will complete its task
00:20 Hyratel sounds like you have your eyes on the prize then
00:20 ace4016 yea, but the What is where i get stuck the longest
00:21 Hyratel well, what bodies of water are convenient to you
00:21 Hyratel is a good starter Q
00:21 ace4016 it's usually what drives the design for me, but...
00:21 ace4016 primarily a river (i believe it's a river)
00:22 Hyratel fast or slow flow?
00:24 ace4016 i believe it's slow
00:24 ace4016 well..not sure how slow slow is
00:24 Hyratel 5 knots
00:27 ace4016 hrm, can't seem to find any info on it
00:29 Hyratel get a flowspeed impeller
00:32 ace4016 hrm, will i need a boat to get far enough out to tell? :P
00:37 ace4016 heh, of course there are no gauges this far down stream
00:39 Hyratel is there a dock you can go out on?
00:39 ace4016 nay
00:42 ace4016 hrm, apparently it's around 5ft deep at the shore...
00:43 ace4016 it's at the outlet into a sound
00:43 ace4016 at least where i am
00:43 ace4016 it's fairly wide; there's a ferry that crosses from my side to the other side of the river
00:44 ace4016 could probably ask some of the guys i know that fish
00:45 Hyratel another question: how independent do you want this vehicle?
00:45 Hyratel ie, batteries onboard or onshore/
00:45 ace4016 onboard :P
00:46 ace4016 hoping to make this autonomous; throw it in the water, do it's thing, come back
00:54 rue_more throw a floating C4 charge into the river, use a radar gun to measure its speed downstream
00:54 rue_more technically you dont HAVE to use C4, but...
00:54 ace4016 lol, wonderful idea; especially close to a military base :D
00:55 rue_more ye, they will have lots of C4
00:55 ace4016 heh
00:55 rue_more they prolly wouldn't even notice if you walked in a borrowed a little
00:58 rue_more I tried a tylonol this time
00:58 rue_more I hope something works
00:59 rue_more anyone have a count of how many secret service counters we tripped today?
01:01 ace4016 i think between ##electronics and #robotics, the many secret services have stationed a constant observer
01:04 delinquentme if I want to find literature for the state of the art in speed / accuracy in piezo actuation ... what should I be googling?
01:14 ace4016 state of the art typically means there are no publications apart from white papers
01:16 rue_more http://bit.ly/1vCvTMr
01:16 rue_more delinquentme, ^^
01:18 rue_more ok, so I'm about 24 hours of feeling like my head is gonna split open
01:18 rue_more none of the pain killers are helping
01:18 Loshki ace4016: Look on the bright side. Maybe it'll lead to job proposals from the secret service
01:18 Loshki rue_more: worst headache you've ever had, by any chance?
01:18 ace4016 lol
01:19 rue_more no, but longest I think
01:19 Loshki rue_more: been evaluated, for hbp/stroke risk etc. etc. yawn...?
01:20 rue_more my blood oxygen level is ok
01:20 rue_more I have a thing from the hospital I fixed that says so
01:20 rue_more I was worried when my right arm went numb, but it seems I had been sleeping on it
01:36 Red_Onyx haha
01:37 Red_Onyx an arm going numb may be a sign of a heart attack
01:41 rue_more or if I was sleeping on it
01:43 rue_more just_corey, hey, you awake?
01:58 rue_more just_corey, I'm gonna head into the hospital, if it turns out my brain is mush and I die, keep this log as your evedence that I bequeeth to you my reprap!
01:59 rue_more and the heads arriving in about 22 days from aliexpress
02:00 mrdata rue_more, do you smoke?
02:01 rue_more only after I been carelessly setting myself on fire
02:01 mrdata you probably slept on your arm
02:01 rue_more I'm sure I did
02:01 rue_more but no pain killers are touching this splitting headache
02:02 rue_more and technically, I been having pretty hefty headaches on and off for over a month now
03:17 theBear "it might be a tuma..." "IT'S NOT A TOO-MAH !"
03:17 theBear drink more clear fluids, which unless my research is flawed, is a fancy way of saying "water"
03:36 mrdata chronic headache is worth following up to find out the cause
03:36 mrdata my severe headaches all had fairly trivial causes
03:36 mrdata eg: migraine
03:36 mrdata but at least i know my triggers
03:37 data avoids chocolate, carroway seed, and bur
06:08 theBear rue_more, curiosity is killing me and the dude gone to bed now... wtf is the big black solenoid pressure-switch looking thing on this old fridge compressorizer, and why ain't there a starter cap anywhere ? https://www.dropbox.com/sh/ud6sz2vok6srdlf/AADVuDq3yJelfroloIOHstwka?dl=0#/
07:42 rue_more theBear, its an overoad starter
07:43 rue_more the run winding draws a heap of current whent he stator is stalled, that pulls in the start winding during that period, it either thermally cuts out or the current drops to something 'normal' when the motor gets goinmg
07:43 rue_more no caps
07:44 rue_more theBear, and emergency said, more water and more advil
07:44 rue_more so technically your right
11:31 theBear oh, that explains the big bimetal... but what's the solenoidey pressure (temp-tube-sensor looking thing) black box sposed to do ? the crazy monkey went to "fix a simple earthing issue" and ended up like this all with spare wires and the motor not starting :)
12:35 rue_bed hah
12:35 rue_bed there should be a schematic on the bcak of te fridge!
12:36 rue_bed if not, I can dig up one for my old freezer, same gig
12:36 rue_bed 110/220 permitting
13:15 devshark so, whats up?
13:49 Tom_itx blue sky
14:23 deshipu got my robot to play wav files through DAC
14:24 deshipu download the portal turret lines now
14:24 rue_more SD card?
14:24 rue_more wait, is it a raspberry pi?
14:27 rue_more oh cool, the seller of that touchscreen I cant get working is willing to help me out
14:33 deshipu no, it's the pyboard
14:33 deshipu actually I could put an sd card in it
14:33 deshipu good thinking
14:52 mumptai do the singing turret thing ;)
14:52 rue_more I have to youtube this
15:00 Tom_itx rue_more did you ever get your SD to work right?
15:26 rue_more when I took the uno shield with sd reader and put it on an uno, it worked
15:26 rue_more I'm waiting for some generic access boards to arrive
15:26 rue_more might be int he box now
15:26 rue_more its cold out
15:27 rue_more the CD4050 or 74HCT4050 is used as a level converter to the SD card, but not from, which is done direct
15:28 Tom_itx odd
15:29 rue_more the voltage levels for inputs on the avr would even suit direct 1.8V input, even if the avr is running at 5V
15:31 rue_more I suppose I have to eat too eh?
15:33 Tom_itx fuel the engine
15:33 rue_more can I upgrade to a nice clean electric motor?
15:34 Tom_itx still requires powre
15:34 ShH pokes Tom_itx with an end
15:37 GuShH are there any uses for big broken endmills?
15:37 rue_more yea
15:38 rue_more carbide?
15:38 rue_more or just HSS?
15:39 rue_more did you break off a dull HSS endmill?
15:39 rue_more or did you just jog into the workpeice
15:39 rue_more I did that once
15:39 rue_more on the lathe
15:39 rue_more bit too far on the carrige
15:40 GuShH hss
15:40 GuShH I didn't break it, got it in a box with other tooling
15:40 GuShH big one
15:40 GuShH I can't imagine how scary one of those must be when they go
15:40 Tom_itx have them resharpened
15:40 deshipu aww, aren't those cute? http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-5pcs-lot-New-High-Quality-MR-RC-Plane-Mini-Gear-Micro-SG90-9g-Servo/32242343990.html
15:40 GuShH I don't have the other part heh
15:40 rue_more I keep large broken stuff to make custom things
15:41 GuShH the shank is missing.
15:41 GuShH rue_more: is there anything you don't keep :p
15:41 GuShH also, any clues on lubrication for desk fans? I thought it was a graphite bushing but it seems to be iron!
15:41 Tom_itx how big was it?
15:41 rue_more deshipu, even $2.50ea is good for those
15:41 GuShH at any rate, silicone lube didn't last long, friction is high
15:42 Tom_itx i crashed a 5" shell mill once
15:42 deshipu rue_more: yellow!
15:42 rue_more well if its the cutter end, no, I'd prolly not keep it
15:42 deshipu I already have a whole bag of them
15:42 deshipu but those are yellow, not blue
15:42 deshipu so pretty
15:42 rue_more GuShH, ditch it, get a dual bb one
15:42 deshipu I got the blue ones for $1.5
15:43 rue_more I need to go find food
15:44 deshipu hunter-gatherer
15:44 deshipu on the prowl
15:56 GuShH dual bb?
15:56 GuShH Tom_itx: about an inch or so
15:57 GuShH wasn't center cutting from what I can see
15:57 GuShH who ended up paying for the crashed shell mill? :p
15:59 GuShH I need to get a couple, the indexable ones are neat but $$$ hard to justify
15:59 rue_more do we get to see this broken cutter?
15:59 GuShH most shell mills are called spider mills around here
16:00 rue_more this alegid , illusive broken cutter
16:00 rue_more that you calim to not be the breaker of
16:00 GuShH hah, if you want to. I asked about it a long time ago
16:00 GuShH rue_more: I'm not, otehrwise I would have both parts
16:01 rue_more and I ask you people I ASK YOU! is this NOT, REASONABLE DOUBT!???
16:01 GuShH although Tom_itx would have you think I buried the other part to hide the crime
16:01 GuShH haha
16:01 rue_more :)
16:02 rue_more I want to go play with an arduino in the shop but my head is pounding too much
16:02 rue_more I also want to feed the reprap crisco and see if all its problems go away
16:03 rue_more I think I propigated the ssh keys to everything now
16:03 rue_more I'm good till the next time 4 machienes bail at once
16:03 rue_more (they seem to fail in groups, not sure how that works)
16:04 deshipu parts from the same series? power surges?
16:04 rue_more no, totally different failures
16:04 GuShH my head is also pounding, but that's due to the heat. too hot outside
16:05 rue_more one may have caps go, antoher a hard drive, another has ram go bad
16:05 deshipu rue_more: one of them failing puts more stress on the rest?
16:05 rue_more heh
16:05 GuShH I would just blame China.
16:05 deshipu blame canada
16:06 GuShH http://imgur.com/gallery/PI9OHY1 lol
16:07 rue_more haha
16:07 GuShH the first comment is so true.
16:07 GuShH rue_more: here... 1" broken endmill http://imgur.com/qiPajPT
16:08 rue_more I suppopse you could grind a new shank into it
16:08 GuShH I bet if I welded a rod I could use it as a weapon to chase Tom_itx around with
16:08 rue_more 3" long?
16:08 GuShH rue_more: how would you keep it in center?
16:09 rue_more well, cut the end flush and drill a 2nd centre in it....
16:09 rue_more :)
16:09 GuShH it was a 5" long endmill
16:09 rue_more "Impractical ideas 101"
16:09 GuShH chunk is almost 5"
16:09 rue_more wow
16:10 rue_more is there a centre dimple in the good end?
16:10 GuShH yeah but one of the cutter flutes is chipped out
16:10 ShH idly grabs the imaginary EDM and gets t
16:11 GuShH oh I know, an endmill hammer!
16:11 GuShH for when you are really annoyed, and willing to shower the whole place with bits of hss
16:12 GuShH probably had a 1/2" shank or similar, hence why it broke there.
16:12 rue_more ah, I bet the two breaks are related!
16:12 GuShH yeah I imagine the piece wasn't held tight
16:13 GuShH or just a random crash
16:13 GuShH don't know
16:13 GuShH I'd be very annoyed if I did this, because they're not cheap so you'd know about it!
16:14 rue_more yea
16:15 rue_more do you think there is a way to chuck it on a lathe and grind a new shank on it as a 'disposable' bit?
16:15 GuShH_Lap you'd need soft jaws
16:16 rue_more or wrap it in some 1/16" alumuinum
16:16 GuShH_Lap so maybe copper shims on the 4 jaw chuck, if you dared.
16:16 GuShH_Lap aluminum gulls up and the part comes loose easily
16:16 rue_more light grinding
16:16 GuShH_Lap that's what happened with that part I showed you, used an aluminum shim
16:16 GuShH_Lap broke lose
16:16 rue_more you did break it!
16:16 GuShH_Lap no
16:17 GuShH_Lap the part I showed you was a handle for a lathe...
16:17 GuShH_Lap and I was turning it, not milling it
16:17 GuShH_Lap why the hell would I lie about anything at all, that's not me
16:17 GuShH_Lap woah a 4 set of endmills up to 1" in cobalt nearly 500 usd
16:17 rue_more awefull sharp handle
16:17 GuShH_Lap no, the tapered handle
16:17 GuShH_Lap with the steady rest
16:17 GuShH_Lap you've seen it
16:18 rue_more I believe you
16:18 GuShH_Lap it had a threaded portion which I used to chuck it with using an aluminum shim, which came loose and I crashed the hss tool (chipped it) and marred the part.
16:18 GuShH_Lap bad idea was bad
16:19 GuShH_Lap I don't remember ever crashing anything that wasn't steel, because these china lathes aren't stiff enough and the compound clamp just lets go easily.
16:19 ShH_Lap has to finish his custom clamp sooner than l
16:19 GuShH_Lap I was getting so much chatter I stopped
16:20 rue_more how am I supposed to keep my fluid levels up when they keep leaking out eveywhere
16:20 GuShH_Lap corks and hot glue gun
16:20 GuShH_Lap http://www.mscdirect.com/product/details/01886035
16:20 GuShH_Lap if I broke one of those I'd be crying, literally.
16:21 GuShH_Lap hey it has a rust spot
16:21 GuShH_Lap rue_more: seen any diy grinder / sharpener projects?
16:22 GuShH_Lap with follow guides and all the bells and whistles, so you can resharpen tooling
16:22 GuShH_Lap seems you can't easily do it on tiny endmills because the rake angle turns negative very easily, given how little material there is
16:29 rue_more hmm
16:39 GuShH_Lap rue_more: it used to be the old timers had all sorts of nice tricks when it came to repurposing and resharpening tooling
16:39 GuShH_Lap seems most of that knowledge has gone missing
16:39 GuShH_Lap and I know you can just buy new tooling, and overall if you don't mind crap you can get it cheap from china, but still what about a sunday, "now"
16:41 GuShH_Lap rue_more: Tom_itx this came from a colleague in Spain https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8ZZZWh0Hk8 we're still laughin' at it.
16:41 GuShH_Lap prior to this the idea was to cut the blade into a parting blade (works perfectly) however he got lazy.
16:42 GuShH_Lap that's a roughing carbide blade
16:42 GuShH_Lap for wood
16:42 GuShH_Lap the holder http://i1318.photobucket.com/albums/t650/lolodeceuta/20140823_104911_zps733e7cd5.jpg
16:42 GuShH_Lap I suggested a lock washer, but he claims it works fine
16:43 GuShH_Lap otherwise the holder can be made long enough that you can pin the blade from the opposite side
16:43 GuShH_Lap with a shcs
16:43 GuShH_Lap http://i1318.photobucket.com/albums/t650/lolodeceuta/20140822_165012_zpse25bd57c.jpg
16:47 Walkerdine_ Do computer engineers belong in the robotics feild?
16:47 GuShH_Lap no, they belong in a corner
16:48 deshipu it's not nice categorizing people like that
16:48 DagoRed Walkerdine_: If anything, computer engineers help define the field of robotics.
16:48 DagoRed .shrink
16:48 makepi DagoRed: http://goo.gl/ODoDAa
16:49 ShH_Lap puts deshipu back in a co
16:49 deshipu what does even "computer engineer" mean?
16:49 GuShH_Lap maybe systems engineer?
16:49 GuShH_Lap like, my brother. he's a dummy.
16:49 deshipu maybe telcom engineer?
16:49 DagoRed It means "Electrical engineer that doesn't want to do as much math."
16:49 Walkerdine_ Computer engineer is an electrical engineer with more programming classes
16:49 GuShH_Lap that's not a computer engineer then
16:49 deshipu DagoRed: you mean calculations, not math
16:49 Walkerdine_ And no, I have to take just as many classes as electrical engineers do
16:50 Walkerdine_ Math classes that is
16:50 ShH_Lap sh
16:50 Walkerdine_ But I've always wanted to go into robotics and I felt like I needed the programming
16:50 DagoRed deshipu: Not at my school, CprE's took 2 less math classes. Granted they still HAD to take calc III and Diff Eq. EE's had to take 2 more math electives.
16:51 DagoRed Granted I graduated about 5 years ago.
16:51 deshipu DagoRed: ah, so a computer engineer is someone who graduated the university with that speciality?
16:52 Walkerdine_ BScompE
16:53 Walkerdine_ I've always wanted to get a job dealing with "Robotics" however it seems very loosely defined and that stil confuses me
16:54 DagoRed deshipu: Computer Engineers are Electrical engineers that fork after somewhere around in the junior year of corriculumn. Computer engineers are taught the arts of Assembly and digital design where as the electrical engineers choose to either mess with power and distribution or focus on the analog design aspecs of chips (or communications which takes more math than any computer engineer can handle).
16:55 DagoRed Walkerdine_: If robotics is loosely defined and still confuses you, then why do you want a job in it?
16:55 Walkerdine_ What people consider Robotics confuses me
16:55 deshipu we don't even have a definition of a robot :D
16:56 Walkerdine_ ^thats what I mean
16:56 deshipu I'm working with a draft definition "anything that walks around and shoots lasers from eyes"
16:57 DagoRed robot: device that uses electronics to interface with the real world with or without a human direct control.
16:57 deshipu DagoRed: that makes your phone a robot
16:57 deshipu and makes the Jaquard loom not a robot
16:58 DagoRed deshipu: Does a phone interact with the physical world? Without some add on, no.
16:58 DagoRed A phone at most can be either a robot "brain" or controller.
16:59 Walkerdine_ I asked if anyone had a job in robotics and I was told that there is no such thing
16:59 DagoRed .w robot
16:59 makepi robot — noun: 1. A machine built to carry out some complex task or group of tasks, especially one which can be programmed, 2. (chiefly science fiction) An intelligent mechanical being designed to look like a human or other creature, and usually made from metal
16:59 deshipu DagoRed: it certainly does
16:59 DagoRed Well I don't see it.
16:59 Walkerdine_ Now what am I supposed to ask in order to get the answer I need
17:00 deshipu DagoRed: it makes sounds and lights and has a bunch of sensors
17:00 deshipu Walkerdine_: what answer do you need?
17:00 deshipu Walkerdine_: 42?
17:00 rue_more I just define a robot as a computer controlled amchine
17:00 rue_more machine even
17:00 DagoRed rue_more: I like that.
17:01 rue_more there are boderline cases
17:01 rue_more like a vcr
17:01 rue_more but a lot of tape changers are called robots
17:01 deshipu your car is a computer controlled machine
17:01 Walkerdine_ I need more of an answer than there is no such thing
17:01 deshipu as well as an aeroplane
17:01 rue_more no, its sitll hunam controlled
17:02 rue_more what are we talking about? I was away
17:02 Walkerdine_ I made a comment on how robotics was loosely defined
17:02 rue_more what is there no such thing?
17:02 deshipu Walkerdine_: there are many things that could be called "robotics"
17:02 Walkerdine_ A job in robotics
17:03 deshipu Walkerdine_: there are the scientists in the labs that are trying to build robots, such as Boston Dynamics etc.
17:03 rue_more heh, they like to avoid 'robtics' and call it 'mechatronics'
17:03 deshipu Walkerdine_: there are the movie special effects people who build props for movies
17:03 rue_more animatronics
17:03 deshipu Walkerdine_: there are the industrial design people, who build the industrial robots
17:03 Walkerdine_ I was considering a degree in mechatronics if that helps me build autonomus machines that carry out tasks
17:03 rue_more industriotronics
17:03 rue_more :)
17:03 deshipu Walkerdine_: and there are the grunts that actually do maintenance on those
17:04 rue_more yea, a board replacer
17:04 deshipu I suppose the latter is the easiest to get a job as
17:04 Walkerdine_ Would manufacturing robots help get my foot in the door to be considered someone that does robotics or is that too specialized
17:04 rue_more sometimes adawned "service technician"
17:05 deshipu Walkerdine_: why do you want to be considered "someone that does robotics"?
17:05 deshipu ah, there are also those few people who design robotics kits for hobbyists
17:05 rue_more there are also just hobbyists
17:05 deshipu but often that's just a side-job to one of the previous jbs
17:05 deshipu jobs
17:06 rue_more http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/robots/robot_family2.jpg
17:06 deshipu or something totally unrelated
17:06 rue_more do you want to like robotics or make money in a robotics field?
17:06 ace4016 what type of robotics do you want to get into Walkerdine_?
17:07 devshark mehatronics perhaps?
17:07 devshark or just... challenges, like EuroBOT and such?
17:08 Walkerdine_ I like robotics and I want to make money doing it
17:08 deshipu oh, and there are also those teenagers who pilot giant figthing robots in Japan ;)
17:08 Walkerdine_ I did lego league and FIRST Robotics and Ive been wanted to do something that gives the same vibe ever since
17:09 devshark why not just make 3d printers instead?
17:09 devshark that will get you paid for sure.
17:10 devshark and can totally touch on "robotics" topic :)
17:10 deshipu in my experience, making a job out of a hobby only makes you start hating the hobby
17:11 devshark maybe.
17:11 devshark but, i got a different side of the medal story.
17:12 Walkerdine_ Eh I have other hobbys
17:12 Walkerdine_ I feel like that applies to most creative jobs
17:12 rue_more Walkerdine_, aha, you cant mix job and pleasure
17:12 rue_more if you like making robots, then keep that as a hobby, and use a subset or spinoff of it for work
17:12 devshark i've been modding all my life. and after being involved with gamedev and proving to myself that i very much can code and make games..... i just wanna move into that industry and say "fuck you Android, both low-level and app-level" and enjoy working on shitty games instead. it's for the paycheck anyways.
17:13 devshark but when you come back home, there's a certain feeling. that you're doing something you've always wanted to do.
17:13 devshark ever since you were a kid.
17:14 Walkerdine_ I have a far fetched dream of starting a business
17:14 rue_more Walkerdine_, a successfull busniness is soemthing that just happens under the right conditions
17:14 devshark start a 3d printing business then ;)
17:15 Walkerdine_ And maybe doing things on my own will get me the skills I would need, but I don't think I would be able to get by without some kind of expirience
17:15 rue_more Walkerdine_, do you have a 3d printer?
17:15 rue_more Walkerdine_, robotics is 3 things,
17:15 rue_more programming
17:15 rue_more electronics
17:15 rue_more mechanics
17:15 devshark no rue_more, he'd make one. :)
17:15 Walkerdine_ I see the only way of making money in the 3d printing world is to make a plastic that sells for less than 50 bucks a pound
17:15 Walkerdine_ I wish I had the funds to do that
17:15 rue_more heh
17:16 devshark ah
17:16 Walkerdine_ I have access to a 3D printer from school
17:16 Walkerdine_ Printing is free
17:16 rue_more its comming down, sounds like its as low as $23/kg now
17:16 rue_more so, what can you do with a 3d printer
17:16 devshark well yea, if you're unfunded, then ..... you'd need a better printer eventually.
17:16 devshark scan people, and print their mini-me's
17:17 rue_more fixing the mesh' is evil
17:17 devshark kinda beats taking selfies.
17:18 devshark plus, you keep their scanned models, and sell them to people from #unrealengine to use as NPCs ;) heck, even on UE4 marketplace.
17:18 devshark there's options there. but also...
17:18 devshark needs planning and funding :)
17:18 Walkerdine_ Well I'm halfway though my schooling as of now
17:18 Walkerdine_ I've got plenty of time
17:19 Walkerdine_ I just want to be prepared for what is going to come when I get there. I hear companies want personal projects that they are excited about and a magnitude of other things. I just want to cover all the bases
17:20 deshipu I think the best option is to aim for the scientist :)
17:20 devshark best option is - aim to go to japan and work there.
17:21 Walkerdine_ I've always wanted to visit there
17:22 Walkerdine_ I live in michigan which is huge on manufacturing. Should I start there?
17:22 devshark see :)
17:23 Walkerdine_ I actually have all the qualifications for this
17:23 Walkerdine_ https://careers-irobot.icims.com/jobs/2341/robotics-engineering-intern/job
17:23 rue_more Walkerdine_, go to a few factories and ask for a tour, you might be surprised
17:24 rue_more cat hurt
17:24 rue_more cant
17:24 Walkerdine_ Right now I'm an intern at an automation company doing mechanical work even though I'm doing computer engineering as a major
17:24 deshipu for instance, Randall Munroe used to work as a robot scientist at NASA, and now draws comics for living
17:24 deshipu a lot of career options
17:24 Walkerdine_ I got the job because of my CAD expirience and I was originally working in the shop
17:25 rue_more <rue_more> Walkerdine_, robotics is 3 things,
17:25 rue_more <rue_more> programming (SW)
17:25 rue_more <rue_more> electronics (EE)
17:25 rue_more <rue_more> mechanics (ME)
17:25 rue_more well, sounds like your off to a good start
17:26 rue_more you have any robots you have made for youself?
17:26 e_more appologizes for not being able to type properly la
17:27 Walkerdine_ I picked up some stuff from sparkfun and plan on getting more but Ive got soemthing in mind
17:27 Walkerdine_ and a personal goal of mine is to build a "robot" that plays Jenga
17:27 rue_more http://www.ebay.ca/itm/RepRap-Assembled-J-head-hotend-extruder-with-Nema17-stepper-motor-Prusa-Mendel-/181351861095
17:27 rue_more hahahah 5 sold!
17:29 devshark well, if you need to brush up on the software side........ i'm cheap :D
17:29 Walkerdine_ I'm taking computer science II and Data structures soon
17:30 Walkerdine_ C++ based
17:30 rue_more http://www.ebay.ca/itm/5pcs-Reprap-ceramic-heat-power-resistor-for-J-head-hotend-prusa-mendel-extruder-/191131686075
17:30 rue_more ahahahah ^^^ ahahhahaha
17:30 Walkerdine_ what do you do
17:31 Walkerdine_ I think I am going to apply for that internship
17:34 Tom_itx rue_more, are those 5w resistors?
17:35 Tom_itx 2w?
17:35 rue_more dunno, but they ARE overpriced
17:35 rue_more the cartridge heaters are 40w
17:35 Tom_itx 4.7ohm 8W
17:35 Tom_itx says so if you scroll down
17:36 rue_more zippo:/files/graphics/pictures/2014/temp# ohm -v 12 -r 4
17:36 rue_more Wattage is: 36.000000
17:36 rue_more Current is: 3.000000
17:36 rue_more Voltage is: 12.000000
17:36 rue_more Resistance is : 4.000000
17:36 rue_more k
17:36 rue_more I use a 3 or 4 ohm heater
17:36 devshark hmm, C++ nice.
17:37 devshark altho, you might wanna stick to C for robotics and odd boards. C will teach you more about stuff than C++ will, in my personal opinion.
17:37 devshark *personal profesional opinion
17:37 Walkerdine_ Isn't C++ the same thing as C but without classes
17:38 deshipu without tentacles strapped to a dog
17:38 rue_more http://www.ebay.ca/itm/ALL-METAL-STATE-OF-THE-ART-CNC-3D-PRINTING-EXTRUDER-REPRAP-J-HEAD-HOT-END-/171131632506
17:38 rue_more check it out, isriel factory!
17:38 devshark walkerdine.... what?
17:38 devshark C isn't the same as C++ without classes.
17:38 devshark C++ has classes. in fact, alot of things in C++ are objects, instead of data or data structures.
17:39 deshipu I like this for an explanation: http://yosefk.com/c++fqa/
17:39 rue_more it C++ you can obscure and cross abstract things to the point where the code is useless and unreadable
17:39 Walkerdine_ I meant the opposite my bad
17:39 Tom_itx http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RWM06344R70JS09E1/RWMC-4.7-ND/2712605
17:40 Walkerdine_ C++ has classes and C does not
17:40 devshark yep.
17:40 devshark but, functionally looking
17:40 devshark C has structures, and can extern variables.
17:41 deshipu C is little more than assembly with syntax
17:41 deshipu C++ is a beast
17:41 rue_more Tom_itx, yea, well dk ...
17:41 devshark thus, one can completely "emulate" classes, which are also transparently visible in memory, unlike class instances.
17:41 devshark and @deshipu - i think C is "stronger" than C++ really is. but, i might be wrong on that one, i didn't encounter or work alot with C++ in embedded environments
17:41 deshipu devshark: well, you can 'emulate' anything the computer does in machine code, doesn't mean the machine code has classes
17:42 devshark no you cant :)
17:42 Tom_itx http://www.ebay.com/itm/Reprap-ceramic-heater-power-resistor-4-7ohm-8W-for-J-head-hotend-prusa-mendel-/271449464737?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f33a61fa1
17:42 deshipu you can, because anything gets converted to machine code eventually anyways
17:43 rue_more unless its native java, in whcih case it eats up all the memory and crashes
17:43 devshark no, i totally have a few things in my mind that you cannot emulate. like, crossing to Ring-0 priviledge level.
17:43 rue_more Tom_itx, still overpriced for a blooming resistor
17:43 Walkerdine_ Doesnt C++ have stuctures and extern varibles too though?
17:44 devshark yes it does walkerdine :)
17:44 deshipu devshark: the distinction between OO language and non-OO language is that the first has features that are supposed to make OO-style programming easier, whereas the second doesn't, but still lets you do it with some extra work and/or libraries
17:44 rue_more http://www.ebay.ca/itm/30x30mm-plastic-fan-duct-for-Geeetech-All-Metal-J-head-Hotend-RepRap-extruder-/321416163767
17:44 rue_more hahaha
17:44 devshark C++ has everything C has, but it also has a bloated library stack that the usual C program does not.
17:45 rue_more ok, I'm sure thats substancially less than $1 in material
17:45 deshipu devshark: except for simplicity and standard :)
17:45 devshark i dont quite understand what you mean by that.
17:45 deshipu devshark: are you familiar with the link I posted?
17:45 deshipu devshark: it's all explained in there
17:45 devshark i didn't open any links
17:46 devshark maybe i just didnt see it :/
17:46 deshipu it may be a little outdated
17:46 rue_more http://www.ebay.ca/itm/10-x-Reprap12v-40W-HotEnd-J-Head-Ceramic-Cartridge-Heater-1m-Wire-For-3D-Printer-/141339697265
17:46 deshipu the two (!) new C++ standards kinda "improve" things
17:46 rue_more tom, ^ the cartridge heaters are just better
17:46 deshipu assuming you can assume one of them
17:46 devshark can you give me a brief point i was supposed to see on that link? :)
17:46 devshark aha, so you're putting alot of hope in C++ standards?
17:47 deshipu devshark: no, not really
17:47 devshark thats good.
17:47 deshipu devshark: but a standard is one thing that C++ lacks that is important
17:47 Walkerdine_ I need to learn more about C
17:47 deshipu Walkerdine_: you do
17:47 devshark because there's no "simplicity and standards" that can explain some code you'll run into :)
17:48 Walkerdine_ They didn't put me in the intro to C class
17:48 deshipu devshark: exactly
17:48 devshark and btw, i totally thought that C++ standards drive their compiler development.
17:48 deshipu devshark: that's why C is actually better in many ways
17:48 devshark they all try to be "up to standard"
17:48 deshipu devshark: even though C++ has more things in it
17:48 Walkerdine_ They said I was too advanced for it already
17:48 devshark dude, i said C is better when we started off :D
17:48 devshark functionally, even tho it misses "alot of things", it has everything C++ can offer you.
17:48 deshipu devshark: you also said that C++ has everything that C has
17:48 Walkerdine_ Although I dont think they really went into much compared to COmptuer Science I
17:48 deshipu devshark: and that's not true :)
17:49 devshark i don't quite follow C/C++ standards so.... i'm sorry, i don't play coder-lawyers.
17:49 devshark i just play hardcore coders and code reviewers :)
17:49 deshipu devshark: if you review C++ code, then you have my condolences
17:49 deshipu especially if it's from different teams
17:49 devshark or nations.
17:50 deshipu everybody picks a different subset of c++
17:50 devshark or utterly bad and sloppy indian coders (i really hate how they learn C++, like, for fucks sake...)
17:51 deshipu devshark: well, for those the language doesn't matter so much
17:51 deshipu devshark: they can be very inventive
17:51 devshark thus, i mostly prefer C++ that pretty much looks like C, but also uses a few classes here and there :D
17:51 deshipu you can write bad code in any language
17:51 devshark and i hate the Microsoft thing with C++ where they really have 1 class, but 9 typedefs (renames) of the same class under different names.
17:52 devshark InterCAL doesn't let you write bad code :P
17:52 devshark but then again, that's a joke, not a tool that gets a job done.
17:52 deshipu I've heard about a guy who had to pick a language at the university to learn
17:53 deshipu and picked InterCAL not knowing it was a joke
17:53 deshipu and learned it and actually got stuff done in it, thinking that's just how all the computer languages are designed
17:53 deshipu got really upset when they told him
17:55 devshark ..... could've picked Malbolge.
17:55 devshark like..... i was decently good at computer sciences, and coding, and cryptography but man, damn.
17:55 devshark "Hello, world" is kinda ..... very hard to impossible to code in that.
17:56 devshark the best I got was "Hello wrld!" and had an idea how to get a "hello world" but..... no point. my thing was done, didn't really want to waste more time on it :D
17:57 rue_more there was a statement by the creator of c++ what it was just a joke
17:58 devshark yea, i read a few
17:58 devshark saying that "you know, we make so much money, so easily... that i just figured - hey, why not make coding harder, so fewer of us can make a bit more money doing the same shit we usually do every day all day. and i think it turned out ok for most of us" :D
17:59 devshark whether that article or point was satire or not...
17:59 devshark i can't disprove it or say "no" to it :)
17:59 deshipu that joke thing was actually a joke itself
17:59 rue_more you have to love a language where 2+2 can result in anything you want
18:00 deshipu rue_more: that's any language with operator overloading
18:00 devshark deshipu hit it on the head.
18:00 devshark and while we're at operator overloading - i'm against operator overloading
18:00 devshark except for a few, very distinct cases
18:00 deshipu at least for arbitrary types
18:00 devshark 1) Matrixes.
18:00 deshipu it's fine for your own types
18:01 devshark 2) ...... i kinda forgot what my #2 was. crap.
18:01 deshipu vectors?
18:01 deshipu sets?
18:01 devshark so no, only for matrixes. it's fine there. in every other case, just write a damn function and cut the crap ok.
18:01 devshark no :)
18:01 devshark i'm taking about a case
18:01 devshark in which you're looking at the code
18:01 deshipu finite state automata?
18:01 devshark and you see thing like
18:01 devshark FSM? damn no
18:02 devshark like really, damn no :)
18:02 deshipu you can sum and multiply them :)
18:02 devshark and that's what really?
18:02 deshipu algebra
18:02 devshark which one changes states, and which one adds a new ending state out of the "+" and "*" operators involved there? :D
18:03 deshipu devshark: you basically add and multiply the languages that they accept
18:03 devshark oh like that.
18:03 devshark hm
18:03 deshipu it's a whole theory
18:03 deshipu pretty neat
18:03 rue_more haha! I'm not the only person ont he world who knows what a state machine is!!!!
18:03 devshark whats.... multiplying accepted languages though?
18:03 rue_more SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET
18:03 deshipu you can easily create huge state machines that no human would be able to analyze :)
18:03 devshark like, my graduation paper had something like "modular state machines VS regular FSMs"
18:04 devshark even tho my graduation paper was pretty much "Game AI vs Academic AI"
18:04 devshark or rather
18:04 rue_more cool
18:04 devshark (lemme find the real topic)
18:04 deshipu I had a boring topic
18:04 rue_more nested state machines?
18:04 deshipu "parsing context-free grammars"
18:04 devshark ah, CFGs :D
18:04 devshark i remember that
18:05 devshark ok found it
18:05 devshark i'm translating as i'm reading so it might not be the best but.... "Comparison of algorithms and methodologies of artificial intelligence in a anthill simulation"
18:06 devshark so i had a paper on GameAI vs AcademicAI, and a neat little "computer vs computer" simulation game in which two anthills have to collect food to spawn more ants and kill other anthill.
18:07 deshipu devshark: did they do chemical marking as parts of their algorithms?
18:07 devshark ants were a simple machine which looks for food, when finds food it takes it back home, then it looks for water to quench thirst.
18:07 devshark actually, one of my AIs had pheromones
18:07 deshipu I love that part of ant behavior
18:07 devshark but most of them didn't. one of my AIs had a "working memory"
18:07 deshipu there is actually a whole class of algorithms based on that
18:08 deshipu called 'ant algorithms'
18:08 devshark yea, ants and bees are kickass ;)
18:08 Loshki devshark: so which anthill wins?
18:08 deshipu I wonder if I could use the marking of territory somehow with robots
18:08 devshark it was mainly about me talking about differenes between GameAI and AcademicAI
18:08 devshark while the game runs in teh background
18:08 deshipu possibly without painting the floor
18:09 devshark of course, the random AI doesn't stand a chance against an AI that actually 'sends' or tells ants where to go.
18:09 Loshki deshipu: I was just reading about that last night. There's a set of algorithms for robots which can drop unique markers...
18:09 Loshki devshark: tell that to irobot's roomba...
18:10 devshark irobot's roomba?
18:10 devshark the robot vacuum cleaner?
18:10 Loshki devshark: yes, it's modelled on insect behaviour patterns, partly...
18:10 devshark what, like flocking?
18:10 deshipu Loshki: how are the markers detected? are they IR beacons? NFC? magnets?
18:10 devshark :)
18:11 Loshki deshipu: left as an exercise to the reader. Theory book, ya' know?
18:11 deshipu :(
18:11 devshark for the markers...
18:11 deshipu I want to try to do positioning based on IR beacons one day
18:11 devshark what if they're just pictures and you do some picture recognition? ;)
18:11 devshark and when i say "picture" i mean "glyphs"
18:11 deshipu devshark: doable
18:12 devshark i know, we had that on EuroBOT.
18:12 devshark the team that actually won Europe had a muchmuch more expensive version of our robot :)
18:12 deshipu devshark: but requires a stronger computer than I'd like to have
18:12 devshark like, it had a dual-lense camera worth a couple thousand euros.
18:12 Loshki devshark: no, basic exploratory stuff, with the goal of complete coverage over time. Contrast with Neato, which uses SLAM to plan coverage.
18:12 deshipu unless I could get my hands on one of these: http://hackaday.io/project/1313-openmv
18:13 devshark our whole bot was like.... under or around 300 euros? i forgot.
18:13 Loshki A used Neato is like, $60 on ebay. Worth it for the pseudo-lidar unit alone...
18:14 codepython777 does anyone know of a neat gps unit i could use with the raspberry pi?
18:18 deshipu [crickets]
18:28 rue_more we already got you one
18:29 billmania codepython777: I'm very happy with this GPS module: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8975
18:30 Tom_itx rue_more would you change the #avr topic to reflect my new webpage?
18:30 Tom_itx no-ip.biz
18:30 Tom_itx i gotta leave...
18:31 rue_more I thought we did that
19:07 Tom_itx rue_more we did that here but not avr
19:08 Tom_itx ok, what should i draw tonight?
19:23 devshark comics.
19:24 devshark or, mecha real robots. or heck, even super robots. or go "all-in" and draw a comic featuring a mixed real robots led by a super robot thing.
19:24 devshark like as if gundam were led by Voltron.
19:24 devshark vs alien bugs or robots :)
19:26 deshipu what is a super robot?
19:27 devshark Voltron is a super robot. a big robot not made to evade shots, but to just take em.
19:27 devshark a real robot is a robot made to evade shots because one might kill him.
19:28 devshark you usually know the difference because a super robot pilot would say "hey, it's gonna hit us! brace for impact" and just take it. :) the other kind will try to dodge or die :)
19:28 deshipu you can't kill something that is dead already
19:28 devshark it's pretty much how mecha cartoons split themselves.
19:28 devshark oh wow, you're really taking it literally huh :)
19:29 deshipu it's 2 am
19:29 devshark time to be serious eh?
19:29 deshipu and I just finished adding a timer callback that checks the battery voltage on my robot
19:29 deshipu no more dead lipos
19:31 deshipu what's the safe voltage for a lipo?
19:31 deshipu I use 1.85V per cell now, which is probably a tad low
19:34 deshipu ah, I need to double that
19:34 deshipu 3.7
20:43 rue_bed iirc 3V is dead for a lion
20:52 codepython777 is there an easy to use gps , preferably usb that one can use for a robotics project?
20:52 ace4016 like this? http://www.amazon.com/Globalsat-ND-105C-Micro-USB-Receiver/dp/B00N32HKIW/ref=pd_sim_e_6?ie=UTF8&refRID=00RAF2DPYP588T6KXZ1F
20:53 codepython777 ace4016: have you used it yet?
20:53 ace4016 nope
20:53 ace4016 never needed a GPS module
20:55 Loshki codepython777: plenty of google hits for 'arduino gps'...
20:55 codepython777 Loshki: i need to use one with a odroid board
20:56 codepython777 preferably usb/bluetooth or something simple that i can talk to using ubuntu
20:57 Loshki codepython777: lotta board for the money. Sorry, never used one myself.
20:59 Loshki I do see GPS receiver USB dongle for laptop PCs, but they look like real chinese crap (crosses self)
20:59 rue_bed http://ruemohr.org
20:59 Loshki And at least one that claims to work on Latpop
21:00 rue_bed thats better!
21:01 Loshki rue_bed: love the warning...
21:01 rue_bed apparently when you google for rue_mohr my website is early in the list, and I thought that a little crude to have it a directory listing with 2 folders
21:01 rue_bed I wanted to do something but couldn't quite work out what
21:01 rue_bed during a severe fever that came to me in a dream
21:02 rue_bed and I thought, yea, thats it!
21:02 Loshki I particularly liked "Exactly what you're looking for"...
21:02 rue_bed :)
21:03 rue_bed oh, I need to change that, geez, that emails was deleted by microsoft years ago
21:05 Loshki Oh. It never occurred to me that the email would *work*.
21:05 rue_bed it used to
21:05 rue_bed but I didn't check it much and microsoft deleted it a few times and I said screw it
21:06 rue_bed they deleted an email I had from the crocodile hunter
21:06 rue_bed before he got himself lanced
21:06 Loshki Bummer..