#robotics Logs

Feb 05 2014

01:29 GuShH_ but, got it all assembled, new oil... it sure could use new seals on the pistons but they don't sell them anymore... although I'll ask around maybe some shop has surplus kits...
01:43 GuShH_ rue_house: hrmm commutator is still bad, the motor runs on 12vdc but it clicks every time it goes past those two contacts which may have lifted up slightly
01:44 GuShH_ that's why it sounded odd on mains, it was arcing after it lifted up the brush on that part
01:44 GuShH_ I wonder if I should put the whole rotor on the lathe and machine the contacts perfectly flat
01:44 GuShH_ at the expense of some lost copper....
01:45 GuShH_ but if one contact catches or for some reason lifts up it would strip the whole commutator...
01:46 GuShH_ toolpost grinder would be a safer bet but I don't have one
03:04 GuShH_ rue_house: ! you were right, 2 wires are not connected to the first of the two bad contacts, the second bad contact only has one wire (they all loop around, but one is severed) ... here's the thing though, they _are_ soldered... but not potted in that area
03:04 GuShH_ not even with varnish
03:05 GuShH_ I only found out after I took it to the lathe to rectify the commutator because it was quite bad and the brushes were leaving an uneven pattern after I ground them flat
03:06 GuShH_ anyway need to make sure there are no tiny bits shorting out some contact and... resolder those bad connections, it might just be the vibrations like you said that caused this
03:06 GuShH_ commutator looks brand new, hopefully it'll run smoothly.
03:07 ShH_ offers rue a beer or an icecream in case he doesn't d
03:22 RifRaf GuShH_, it was hard work to try get him to have a beer, can't remember now if i succeeded
03:33 GuShH_ RifRaf: in real life?
03:33 GuShH_ ok on 12vdc it runs a lot better now... a bit noisy but that's the nature of brushed motors I guess
03:33 RifRaf yep
03:33 GuShH_ also due to the bigger gap between those two contacts I guess it does change the sound
03:34 RifRaf what are you making today?
03:34 GuShH_ just fishing my pressure washer
03:34 GuShH_ it died on me while I was cleaning up the driveway :(
03:34 GuShH_ err fixing *
03:34 RifRaf keeping goldfish in there?
03:34 GuShH_ >_<
03:34 GuShH_ finishing or fixing... I think I mixed both and came up with fishing, brain fart.
03:35 GuShH_ I just need to figure out why the pump won't turn over now that it's been reassembled
03:35 RifRaf cool, mine has been playing up too last time i used it
03:35 GuShH_ high pressure not coming up?
03:36 RifRaf yep, but think its air leak maybe, or the water not going in right
03:36 RifRaf will try on weekend
03:36 RifRaf i had really dirty water for a bit, maybe blockage
03:36 Jak_o_Shadows Mine doesn't spit out high pressure as reliably as it used to
03:37 GuShH_ it turns out in this case it was the motor, two contacts were burnt up and 3 wires were disconnected from the windings, fixed that (rue called it) and I also rectified the commutator on the lathe, cleaned up the brushes... and I took the entire pump apart because I noticed some water in the oil, so I replaced the oil while I was at it and used silicone grease on all o-rings and whatnot, cleaned it up inside... not much I can do
03:37 GuShH_ without a kit to rebuild the valves etc.
03:37 GuShH_ RifRaf: I always used an inline filter in mine, blockage was never a problem...
03:37 GuShH_ but if the high pressure doesn't come up it's the valve
03:37 GuShH_ mine would sometimes act up
03:38 GuShH_ I actually took it all apart, the valve was stiff with sediments
03:38 RifRaf GuShH_, yep have an inline filter on house now, my pressure washer has done the job though, was only a cheap unit and been going for years
03:38 GuShH_ RifRaf: this was a karcher... bought on 1992... it just died today
03:38 GuShH_ and the reason I want to fix it is because I know the new stuff won't last over 20 years.
03:39 RifRaf no way
03:39 GuShH_ If I could source a seal / gasket / oring kit it would be brand new again.
03:39 GuShH_ but it still had good pressure, motor died today.
03:40 RifRaf print some
03:40 GuShH_ DanFrederiksen: no it wasn't a chinese motor.
03:40 GuShH_ lol
03:40 DanFrederiksen ?
03:40 Jak_o_Shadows wait, Dan is here?
03:40 GuShH_ you were going to assume just because something failed = china
03:40 DanFrederiksen obviously. seems freenode servers took a break right now
03:41 GuShH_ Jak_o_Shadows: aye
03:41 GuShH_ DanFrederiksen: they were DDoSing it yesterday
03:41 GuShH_ not sure now
03:41 DanFrederiksen I'm sure cemented stupidity will resume very shortly
03:42 GuShH_ I wonder though now that those two commutator contacts and the windings have been soldered... how much does it have left...
03:44 GuShH_ only problem is I spent all night on this instead of going to sleep... now I'm buggered up.
03:47 RifRaf GuShH_, so you got it all repaired then? thats good isn't it
04:09 GuShH_ RifRaf: nope, I put it all back together and the pump wasn't turning.. I just took it apart again and drained the oil, inspected the only bearing I didn't inspect and ... it's bad.
04:10 GuShH_ it's a big thrust bearing and it's broken, this would explain why it seized up and the two windings could have melted from the over-current (ie. stalled and that's when the compound failure happened) .... OR they were unrelated and I just damaged on reassembly, but I'm not sue it looked OK so that's why I didn't remove it from the sump, since there was some oil left and I didn't want to fool around with it
04:11 GuShH_ however I just did and two balls fell from the bearing
04:11 ShH_ hopes it's a standard
04:12 GuShH_ and if I did damage it on reassembly.... how to avoid it, since it won't be a cheap bearing...
06:02 Jak_o_Shadows BAUDRATE is one word.
06:58 rue_house keyword maybe
07:08 Tom_itx 4� F
07:25 rue_house wow crap, the boilers all subzero
07:26 rue_house the outsize sensor says -4c
07:26 rue_house ooo this could be bad
08:18 DanFrederiksen you rue the day :)
10:30 sherlock rue_house: dont die
10:38 aemquo ... pls
19:30 rue_shop3 so, the boiler feeder pipes are frozen up
19:30 rue_shop3 the tank is still ok, and the boiler is now warm, with a small fire
19:31 rue_shop3 plastic pipe
19:31 rue_shop3 IM THINKING that if I wrap #16 wire under the insulation of the pipes, and run about 10A thru it, I can thaw them
19:32 adam789654123 do you need resistance though to generate heat?
19:32 adam789654123 would it be better with a resistance, instead of just wire?
19:32 rue_shop3 wire has resistance
19:33 LoRez you don't think the warm boiler will defrost the pipes?
19:33 rue_shop3 18 has 12R/km
19:33 rue_shop3 LoRez, all the pipes are outside
19:33 rue_shop3 so is the boiler
19:34 rue_shop3 hmm if this uses 80 feet of wire
19:34 rue_shop3 24m
19:34 adam789654123 i was thinking for generating heat, that a high resistance conductor would be preferable to wire, but not that i have any idea on what that would be, or how to set it up
19:35 rue_shop3 .288 ohms
19:35 adam789654123 hmmm
19:35 rue_shop3 Wattage is: 28.799999
19:35 rue_shop3 Current is: 10.000000
19:35 rue_shop3 Voltage is: 2.880000
19:35 rue_shop3 Resistance is : 0.288000
19:35 adam789654123 ok
19:35 adam789654123 30 watts seems good actually
19:36 rue_shop3 dunno, over day 60 feet of pipe?
19:36 adam789654123 probably not then
19:36 rue_shop3 mmm might make the diff I usppose
19:36 rue_shop3 1/2W/ foot
19:36 rue_shop3 I bet it'll be enough
19:36 adam789654123 the think is that the pipes act like a heat sink
19:37 rue_shop3 its only -1c out now, hmm
19:40 adam789654123 i am wondering what you think of increasing the resistance by reducing the strands of wire (if you can) in the length
19:41 adam789654123 throughout the lengthe
19:41 rue_shop3 heh, pipes are frozen, this is a fine time to change the pipes I couldn't cause there are no shutoffs
19:42 adam789654123 is the wire stranded, because im thinking you might be able to generate more heat by reducing the number of strands that run the length
19:43 adam789654123 via increasing the resistance, generating more heat
19:43 adam789654123 but of course, use your own discression
19:44 robotustra_ milling robo face
19:45 robotustra_ progress 5%
19:45 adam789654123 hey robotustra
20:22 rue_shop3 so far this is easy, remove all the pipes that are frozen up and replace them with new ones
20:22 rue_shop3 (pipe upgrade)
20:22 adam789654123 haha. nice!
20:26 rue_shop3 hmm it says the tank is at 1.5c
20:26 rue_shop3 so, hmm
20:26 rue_shop3 I might get wet next
20:28 adam789654123 good luck
20:29 MrCurious GuShH_: you there?
20:33 MrCurious GuShH_: I hear argentina's banks are having a problem. are people rioting yet? http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/14/02/05/2131205/fire-destroys-iron-mountain-data-warehouse-argentinas-bank-records-lost
20:37 robotustra_ progress 50%
21:04 rue_shop3 ok, pipes are replaced, (upgraded) now to lace them all with 18 guage wire and insulate them
21:04 rue_shop3 then apply a 3.3V power supply
21:04 rue_shop3 a switching one...
21:04 rue_shop3 consumer grade...
21:05 adam789654123 like a pulsing power supply?
21:06 adam789654123 robotustra, perhaps you will enjoy some of the wise words of krang as you are waiting. :D
21:07 adam789654123 robotustra http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDb3Htw80DM
21:08 adam789654123 i guess this one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Switched-mode_power_supply
21:24 rue_shop3 if the leak isn't as big as the pipe, you dont have a problem yet
21:30 GuShH_ MrCurious: people are sheep
21:31 GuShH_ MrCurious: no more monthly installments on most banks
21:31 GuShH_ we used to have up to 12 without any extra taxing / fees
21:31 GuShH_ that's gone.
21:31 GuShH_ soon, civil war or worse.
21:34 rue_shop3 GuShH_, do you mean the citizens of the usa no longer have access to borrow money they cant pay back?
21:35 GuShH_ argentina
21:35 GuShH_ the US does... that's how people end up living back at their paretn's because they can't pay the bank for all the fancy shit they bought
21:38 rue_shop3 this pipe insulation works really well, dispite all the heat from the surrounding boiler, these are still frozen solid
21:42 wildmage i think maybe I should run up credit cards and then declare bankruptcy
21:42 MrCurious so the bank thing has caused issues?
21:58 adam789654123 GuShH_: you think you're gonna be able to hang in there? How bad do you think its gonna get?
21:58 GuShH_ adam789654123: bad
21:59 adam789654123 you gonna have problems?
21:59 GuShH_ MrCurious: the new devaluation has basically doubled prices of most things even though it wasn' that bad
21:59 GuShH_ but the weasels like to take advantage.
21:59 adam789654123 always
21:59 MrCurious i thought the loss of bank backups would only be an issue for banks that lose onsite records
22:00 GuShH_ it means actually the lowest income is now 460 usd, which is ridiculously low, it used to be over 4600.
22:00 GuShH_ of course USD is a bad word, you can't really buy US currency
22:00 GuShH_ unless you're rich or you don't mind paying more and doing it illegally.
22:01 GuShH_ we haven't got an army anymore, I wouldn't mind the army taking over this bitch.
22:01 adam789654123 just sometimes in a rush to make things different, we make them worse
22:02 rue_shop3 I doubled the wire back along the same pipe, so technically at 10A its 1W/foot
22:02 GuShH_ no she only wants to get richer at the expense of everyone
22:02 GuShH_ she already has more than you can spend in 10 life times
22:02 GuShH_ and shes still stealing from us
22:02 GuShH_ and nobody is doing jackshit about it....
22:02 GuShH_ because the ones close to power are well paid for.
22:02 GuShH_ they clap and nod.
22:02 MrCurious well, maybe you should get in cahootz with the govt and get your share
22:03 GuShH_ that's similar to how most people get famous... giving head.
22:03 GuShH_ you don't just get into politics here.
22:04 GuShH_ I could sell everything and move to Italy, but what then?
22:04 GuShH_ and legally you can't move the money around anymore, it's all locked up on purpose.
22:05 GuShH_ they want sheep and sheep they are getting.
22:05 GuShH_ it shouldn't be legal / allowed but the political party brainwashes kids at school from a very early age
22:05 GuShH_ it's worse than a dictatorship if you ask me.
22:06 GuShH_ all the brownies are taken care of so that's a cheap force they have full access to, they're ignorant and they don't know any better.
22:06 GuShH_ plus, votes.
22:06 ShH_ goes to bed and crawls up in a co
22:07 MrCurious turn money into THINGS, move THINGS, then trade THINGS for new money
22:08 adam789654123 hope you do ok though
22:14 rue_shop3 ok, heat trace is on one of 8 pipes
22:14 rue_shop3 I wonder how long it takes to thaw 1 foot of 3/4" pipe (insulated) at 1W
22:17 adam789654123 rue_shop3: if you care to record it, id be interested on how you do
22:20 adam789654123 rue_shop3: i guess over a long enough time, a change in even a few degrees would make a big difference
22:21 adam789654123 rue_shop3: wonder if you could use some kind of thermostat resistor to change the resistance as the pipe changes temperature
22:32 rue_shop3 if guess I can roll 3 feet one way, 3 feet the other
22:32 rue_shop3 the temp guage says the first line is up to 2.5c
22:32 rue_shop3 I'm guessing still an ice core tho
22:34 adam789654123 i would think so
22:35 adam789654123 thats still good though, so 1 watt was able to raise the temp about 2.5c in what, maybe half an hour or so
22:36 adam789654123 "1/2W/" foot i mean
22:37 adam789654123 *per foot
22:37 rue_shop3 1w/foot
22:37 rue_shop3 the wire doubles back at the end of the pipe
22:37 rue_shop3 u
22:38 rue_shop3 how do you know a roll of electricians tape is too cold?
22:38 rue_shop3 it breaks
22:38 adam789654123 :)
22:38 ace4016 </canadian problems>
22:39 adam789654123 thats good though, it seems. The temp was boarderline freezing to begin with if i remember though, but i suppose you could figure wattage per foot giving off a certain amount of temperature
22:39 gushhtab Eh
22:39 adam789654123 wonter if i can find a chart, or formula
22:40 adam789654123 http://www.efunda.com/glossary/units/units--thermal_conductivity--watt_per_meter_per_celsius_degree.cfm
22:41 adam789654123 thats too confusing for me
22:42 adam789654123 or is wattage actually synonymous with degrees, or degree over a given time
22:42 adam789654123 grrr
22:46 adam789654123 http://van.physics.illinois.edu/qa/listing.php?id=11926
22:46 adam789654123 was helpful for me :)
22:46 adam789654123 "A Watt is one Joule per second. A calorie is a little more than 4 Joules. So you can raise the temperature of a gram of water by 1°C in a little more than 4 seconds with a 1 Watt heater."
22:47 adam789654123 not that the setup of wire on the pipe is highly controlled of course
22:50 adam789654123 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joule_heating
23:15 rue_shop3 I'm really close to clearing the boiler loop
23:51 rue_shop3 ok I put a 12V battery across it, up to 14c now
23:51 rue_shop3 (under insulation)
23:59 rue_shop3 YES
23:59 rue_shop3 boiler loop just opened