#robotics Logs
Nov 13 2013
#robotics Calendar
01:49 defaultro http://i1133.photobucket.com/albums/m599/clyonsatglassvisions/DRV8825VrefSetup_zpseb53e485.jpg
01:50 defaultro the previous value was 0.94 so that's close to 2A!
01:50 Faek Sorry, not even the same order of magnitude
01:51 defaultro wrong channel
01:53 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: nice, you worked it out :)
01:53 defaultro took me 2 hours, LOL
01:53 defaultro I think what I did is correct
01:53 defaultro Current Limit = VREF Ă— 2
01:53 Triffid_Hunter yep
01:53 defaultro so 0.2A * 2 = .4
01:53 Triffid_Hunter exactly, nice work :)
01:53 defaultro :D
01:54 GargantuaSauce note that it wouldn't have actually hit 2A because of the coil resistance
01:54 GargantuaSauce but this means you can drive it with a higher voltage now if you so desire
01:54 defaultro my coil resistance says it's 30ohms
01:54 Triffid_Hunter yeah would have been running a bit rough, basically half step if there's not enough voltage headroom
01:55 defaultro i've been running it now for more than 7 mins. Speed is 50. Motor is warm but not that much warm
01:55 defaultro looks like 38c
01:56 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: and you can feed it up to 40v and your motor will still be exactly the same temperature, but can turn faster
01:56 defaultro oh very cool!
01:56 Triffid_Hunter such is the magic of smart current-mode drivers :)
01:57 defaultro do you think though I bought a wrong bipolar motor?
01:57 defaultro should I have gotten like 2.8v 1A vs my new one, 12v 0.4A?
01:57 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: yes
01:58 defaultro what would be the advantages of the former?
01:58 GargantuaSauce (but if this one suits your needs it's fine)
01:58 Triffid_Hunter you only need motor voltage = supply voltage for dumb drivers
01:58 defaultro ok
01:58 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: the former allows the driver to have lots of headroom even at 12v. the motor runs smoother and more quietly (and has better torque) when the driver has enough headroom
01:58 defaultro got it
01:59 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: with your 12v motor on a 12v supply, it can only turn relatively slowly because as soon as it starts turning, it generates an opposing voltage and the current drops
01:59 defaultro but since I am going to be using this outside using a 12v battery, is the former still be good or the latter is preferred?
01:59 Triffid_Hunter current is proportional to torque
01:59 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: so if you want it to turn quickly and still be strong, you need a lower voltage motor
02:00 Triffid_Hunter or higher supply voltage
02:00 defaultro k
02:00 defaultro did you see my last question?
02:00 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: http://youtu.be/YV8mXkf_uco <-- this is my 3d printer with 2.8v motors and a 15v supply running basically flat out
02:00 Triffid_Hunter that's with A4982 which are extremely similar to the chip you have
02:00 defaultro looking
02:01 defaultro very cool
02:01 defaultro how hot does the motor get after a complete run?
02:02 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: 40-50c or so. I choose the heat by setting the current
02:02 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/NEMA17-78-Oz-in-CNC-stepper-motor-stepping-motor-1-8A/541709270.html <-- this specific motor if you're curious
02:03 defaultro cool. Looks like I may need a heatsink for that since it's 1.8A
02:03 defaultro does it run for an hour at 50C?
02:06 defaultro update: it's been 17mins, looks like the temp has stopped at 42c
02:10 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: the temperature remains stable, and is independent of speed
02:10 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: I only run them at 1.5A
02:11 defaultro ok. I thought it was dependent on speed because the faster the speed, the lower the torque, less holding
02:12 defaultro i remember when it was running fast, it didn't get warm. Now, I'm running at a lower speed in Arduino which is 10. I'll check the temp in a nfew
02:12 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: no. torque only drops if you can't keep the current up. as long as your driver has voltage headroom, the current will not drop
02:12 defaultro k
02:12 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: current ^ 2 * resistance = power. power * thermal dissipation + ambient = temperature
02:12 defaultro nice!
02:13 Triffid_Hunter so no matter if you're going at ludicrous speed or sitting still it will be the same temperature
02:13 defaultro how bad is 80c for a motor running for an hour?
02:13 defaultro got it
02:13 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: they start getting sad at 80c, something to do with the magnetics inside
02:13 Triffid_Hunter also they can burn you
02:13 defaultro k
02:13 GargantuaSauce or start to deform the pla they're bolted to :V
02:13 defaultro i remember my other motor, it's gets really hot after 1 min
02:14 defaultro got it
02:14 defaultro it gets really hot after 1 min
02:14 Triffid_Hunter GargantuaSauce: heh the X motor bracket on my MMax is a little warped, but that's because I wrap a towel around it and heat the bed to 105c when printing ABS
02:14 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: yeah that's because you're pushing too much current.
02:14 defaultro yup
02:15 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: I did suggest a constant current thing on the center taps ;)
02:15 Triffid_Hunter but having a fancy chip doing it is better.. you get microstepping too
02:15 defaultro The company never came back to me about the specs on the motor
02:15 defaultro Triffid_Hunter: yup
02:16 defaultro correct me if I'm wrong about microstepping. Is it true that steps will be finer?
02:16 GargantuaSauce unless micro suddenly means bigger, yeppers
02:16 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: yeah but it's mostly about noise/vibration and keeping the torque up, rather than better shaft position accuracy
02:17 defaultro ok. because I tried 1/32 earlier but it was moving weird
02:17 defaultro maybe my code was incomplete
02:19 defaultro the motor is hotter now at speed 10. Not sure why. However, I can hold the motor for an hour at this temp. Would that be 50c?
02:19 Triffid_Hunter defaultro: less than 45 if you can hold it as long as you want
02:21 defaultro ok
02:23 defaultro the mount I'm designing will be metal. It will act as a heatsink too
02:24 defaultro i need to sleep early today. It's 2am
02:24 defaultro thanks for the help :)
02:26 defaultro good night folks! Disconnecting now. See you all tomorrow
08:26 DagoRed .HaD 5
08:27 makepi DagoRed: 0.) Ask Hackaday: Can you Hack an Appliance into a Spy Device? - http://goo.gl/ZkUrQr
08:27 makepi DagoRed: 1.) - http://goo.gl/NqeaFk
08:27 makepi DagoRed: 2.) 39 Raspberry Pi 3D Scanner - http://goo.gl/LBihpx
08:27 makepi DagoRed: 3.) Peltier Joule Thief Power Supply - http://goo.gl/uZxDjz
08:27 makepi DagoRed: 4.) Sailing With An Autopilot - http://goo.gl/enUSzs
08:59 rue_house yup, those sound like the latest hackaday articles
08:59 rue_house sounds like the next scam
09:02 rue_house wrong widnow :)
09:25 theBear we got a retarded bot now ?
09:25 theBear .HaD 1
09:25 makepi theBear: 0.) BITX, A Return to Hackers’ Paradise - http://goo.gl/qA0Ctl
09:25 theBear sigh, but why ?
09:27 GargantuaSauce because hackaday is your #1 source for maker news!!
09:32 rue_house a lot of articles we know about long before hackaday
09:35 GuShH GargantuaSauce: hmmm they took the "more for less" route a long time ago
09:36 GargantuaSauce there was a little sarcasm in there, just to be clear
10:01 GuShH bah this is both hilarious and sad at the same time, there's an aluminum store/supplier that has a few listings on the local ebay, but also of course their own eshop... I emailed them and also contacted them through ebay, they answer the ebay messages rather quickly but their emails, well that's another story... now, I sent them another message and they said "we're still quoting your request, we'll email you soon" (they said the
10:01 GuShH same thing twice already) is it that hard to quote a few materials?
10:01 GuShH And, if you are taking the time to quickly answer those messages, why can't you do the same with the emails?
10:01 GuShH Of cuorse it's been 3 days now and I haven't got a quote.
10:02 GargantuaSauce what sort of volume are you looking for?
10:02 GuShH low
10:02 GargantuaSauce i bet they just dont give a shit about small fry
10:03 GuShH then they wouldn't be on ebay sir
10:03 GuShH and they wouldn't answer the messages
10:03 GuShH I have stumbled upon several that didn't give a crap about small business
10:03 GargantuaSauce oh missed the ebay, thought you were still dealing with local 20th-century style distributors :V
10:03 GuShH Only one was honest enough to tell me they don't really work with good alloys and when they do it's upon request, so you'd have to buy the whole bar (6 meters long) otherwise it just sits there
10:04 GuShH I am
10:07 GuShH GargantuaSauce: they're mostly dickheads
10:07 GuShH they would make a lot more money selling to hobby guys
10:07 GuShH maybe not more than they do now, but it would be a big chunk
10:08 GuShH (these were resellers I talked to, not distributors)
10:08 GuShH So really, anyone buying a ton of aluminum won't be buying it from a reseller anyway
10:09 GuShH Hrmm I can't engage the belt tensioner on the lathe all the way back unless I move it forward... leaving a huge gap between the wall
10:09 GuShH sigh
10:09 GuShH Maybe a shorter handle would do
10:09 GargantuaSauce goddamn
10:09 GargantuaSauce i have this amazing talent
10:10 GargantuaSauce it's like the sleight of hand a magician uses to make things "disappear"
10:10 GargantuaSauce except it only works on me
10:10 GuShH Everyone's got it!
10:11 GuShH GargantuaSauce: but don't worry you'll find it when you aren't looking for it.
10:11 GuShH Why is everyone talking about that justin boy?
10:12 GuShH Mofo mopped the floor with our flag, now I hate the little cunt even more -- and I'm not even into patriotism.
10:12 GuShH But that kid is getting shot one of these days, I bet.
10:13 GuShH They should gangbang his mom first, have him watch. Little shit!
10:13 GuShH Why do people even pay 600 or 800 dollars to have a picture taken with that little shit of a boy?
10:14 GuShH They pay just as much if not more in plane tickets and whatnot to see him and the little shit doesn't even sing but they still "love" the guy? what's going on are they that dumb? is everyone just plain stupid?
10:15 ShH stares at the news and they're still talking about him -- now his mom got mobbed and she whines about a sweater... NO WONDER YOU GOT MOBBED YOU ARE IN CHILE WHAT DID YOU EXP
12:22 mutilator hey all!
12:23 mutilator so i'm wondering if anyone here has any experience with pan & tilt heads, i need something that i can poll/set the position of the head
12:23 mutilator only needs to move a 3lb camera
12:23 mutilator wondered if anyone had any experience with such a setup
12:23 GuShH making or buying?
12:24 mutilator depends on the cost difference
12:24 GuShH professional rigs aren't cheap
12:24 mutilator making would be more fun and cheaper in the long run
12:24 GuShH not sure if toys exist
12:24 mutilator buying is exp as hell
12:24 mutilator yea
12:24 GuShH I guess it depends on what exactly do you need...
12:25 GuShH high speed footage, timelapse, real time tracking...
12:25 mutilator this is for remote positioning of a camera
12:25 mutilator camera is one room you're in the next
12:25 GuShH still vague
12:25 mutilator just need to know if i'm pointing at a wall
12:25 mutilator or a ceiling
12:25 mutilator thermal camera
12:25 GuShH if we're going to be this vague, buy a wifi camera with pan and tilt
12:25 mutilator cant necessarily tell
12:25 GuShH glue your thermal camera on top
12:26 mutilator o_O
12:26 GuShH alright if you can't tell I can't either.
12:26 GuShH and nobody will.
12:26 GuShH go force people to sign NDAs and be prepared to make some hefty checks
12:26 mutilator heh
12:27 GuShH as far as I'm aware nobody has made millions by stealing some random idea off of irc and almost nobody has made millions on irc by getting other people to provide the solutions either.
12:27 mutilator i'm looking for advice not a solution
12:28 GuShH why ask for help if you won't be open
12:28 mutilator as far as i'm aware people do sometimes give that
12:28 GuShH as long as both parties are willing to share enough information to meet each other's demands sure
12:28 mutilator what am i not being open about?
12:28 mutilator i dont have crazy specs
12:28 mutilator i need to be able to tell the position of a camera in a remote room
12:28 GargantuaSauce GuShH misinterpreted "cant necessarily tell" as you being tight-lipped and not about thermal cameras being indecipherable
12:28 GargantuaSauce s/cameras/images
12:29 GuShH do you walk into a car dealership and shout "I WANT CAR" no, you tell the guy exactly what you're looking for, unless you are an idiot then you'll end up buying a Prius anyway.
12:29 GargantuaSauce always assuming the worst!
12:29 mutilator i still dont know what you're looking for GuShH
12:29 GuShH Worst case scenario it's a pink one.
12:30 GuShH mutilator: I don't like to play guessing games!
12:30 mutilator me either
12:30 GuShH If you need smooth tracking or not, what's your budget, etc.
12:30 GuShH Then others will be able to chip in with ideas
12:30 joga you basically need a ptz camera?
12:30 mutilator no
12:30 mutilator i need a pan & tilt head
12:30 mutilator forget it even has a camera on it
12:30 GuShH joga: that was the joke, go buy a pan tilt wifi cam and glue the thermal on top...
12:30 mutilator it needs to hold 3lb
12:31 joga so you need two motors?
12:31 GuShH joga: plus if you align the two to the desired distance you can overlay the images
12:31 GuShH in fact, that's what they're doing now adays to get a crisp thermal image
12:31 joga ah ye
12:31 GuShH using an edge detect filter and an overlay.
12:31 mutilator ideally it would have smooth tracking yes
12:32 GargantuaSauce what sort of remote control interface are we talking
12:32 mutilator pc
12:32 GuShH Still vague sir.
12:32 mutilator can interface with whatever it needs to
12:32 GuShH May I present #arduino
12:33 GargantuaSauce wifi? ethernet? serial? smoke signals?
12:33 mutilator GuShH: if i knew more specifically what i wanted i wouldnt be asking
12:33 GuShH lol
12:33 GuShH You can know what you want but not how to achieve it though
12:33 joga this goes up to 6lb it seems http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motorized-Pan-Tilt-Head-Remote-Controlled-Bescor-MPH1-MPH-1-MP-101-MP101-NEW-/350918432676?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51b45e57a4
12:33 GuShH mutilator: The easiest way would be to use a couple servos with brackets, but you won't get exactly smooth panning
12:33 GargantuaSauce how about it connects to freenode and interprets irc snark as angles
12:33 GuShH for that you'd be looking at reduction gearboxes at least
12:34 mutilator GuShH would make it go insane
12:34 GuShH why?
12:34 mutilator http://www.servocity.com/html/pt785-s_pan___tilt_system.html
12:34 mutilator something like this is as close as i've come
12:34 mutilator but it's not exactly pollable
12:34 GuShH servos even high quality hobby grade ones are not exactly going to provide you with what you're looking for unless you get 360° ones (not limited) and reduce them somehow.
12:35 GuShH also what's your focal distance in general
12:35 GuShH the farther away the smaller your increments / steps will need to be
12:35 GuShH mutilator: people used to replicate those pan tilt mounts with wood and hobby servos
12:35 GuShH for kites and rc airplanes
12:36 mutilator 5' maybe
12:36 GuShH say, I remember watching them 20 years ago.
12:36 GuShH is this for a security application? research of some type?
12:36 GuShH oh the secrecy
12:36 mutilator wouldn't you like to know
12:36 mutilator !
12:36 GuShH if you want to protect your precious from others may I suggest a bank vault?
12:37 GuShH MY PREEEECIOUSSSSS
12:37 mutilator lol
12:37 mutilator theres an idea
12:37 mutilator i could put it inside the vault once i'm done
12:37 mutilator and no one would ever see it!
12:37 GuShH along with your crystal meth
12:37 mutilator why would i put that in the vault
12:37 GuShH it's also part of your precious
12:37 joga obviously teledildonics
12:38 mutilator i need easy access
12:38 GuShH pfhahaha
12:38 GuShH joga: I thought about it
12:38 joga I think about it often...
12:38 GuShH we should do something about it
12:38 GuShH either get you out of the closet or build one
12:38 GuShH actually could be both in no particular order
12:39 GuShH mutilator: I need 3 billion dollars, doesn't mean I'll get them easily.
12:39 mutilator if you had a bank vault you might
12:39 GuShH so I should buy a bank vault and hopefully it'll be full when I open it?
12:40 GuShH DUDE THAT'S GENIUS
12:40 GargantuaSauce go to sleep with it under your pillow
12:40 ShH offers joga some
12:40 ga smokes eag
12:40 GargantuaSauce the inflationfairy will come in the night
12:40 mutilator obviously it will
12:40 mutilator because if it's not inside a bank it's not a bank vault
12:40 GuShH haha
12:40 ShH rolls up joga and smokes
12:41 GuShH mutilator: anyway, have you looked at steppers, servos and just plain dc motors?
12:41 GuShH what's your level of arduinoness?
12:42 mutilator GuShH: yea i've tried to modify an existing cheapo commercial system with some rotary pots but there wasnt enough room w/o taking all the casing off
12:42 GuShH If you want to assemble something similar to those camera mounts from servicity.com just buy some aluminum extrusion with your favorite profile and get cutting to begin with.
12:42 mutilator created a little analog controller i interfaced with a teensy
12:42 ShH is sad... he can source extrusions just about anywhere but not solid
12:42 mutilator so i could move it but i couldnt get the rest of the gear in there to poll/set positions
12:42 GuShH two C brackets are all you often need for a quick and dirty pan / tilt
12:43 joga get a big kuka arm so you get a nice neck with the head too
12:43 mutilator the main thing that is nice about prefabs is they're all housed in a nice looking unit which also limits noise somewhat
12:43 GuShH oh yeah mount the camera onto a 2 million dollar robotic arm, presto.
12:43 GuShH get two arms, give one a gun.
12:44 GuShH GargantuaSauce: take note, noise is also an issue, 5 feet focal distance, secrecy++
12:44 mutilator i just dont have the resources (mostly time) right now to get into a whole fabrication process for them
12:44 GuShH HE WANTS TO SPY ON THE GIRLS BATHROOM DOH
12:44 mutilator well
12:44 GuShH you don't have the machine shop? aww
12:44 mutilator focal distance doesnt matter for panning and tilting so it's not part of the requirements
12:45 GuShH sorry subject distance, you pedantic frustrated photographer.
12:45 mutilator also doesnt matter
12:45 GuShH it does.
12:45 mutilator do, not really
12:45 GuShH do, yes really
12:45 mutilator no*
12:45 mutilator nah
12:45 mutilator not really
12:46 GuShH almost got it, let's keep pulling info out of him.
12:46 mutilator yea, lets
12:46 mutilator get some more info that doesnt matter
12:46 mutilator um
12:46 mutilator oh shit
12:46 mutilator yea
12:46 mutilator it is going to be used inside
12:46 GuShH now I know more.
12:46 mutilator so .. keep that in mind
12:46 GuShH sorry but it already exists, moving on.
12:47 mutilator thats for your experience on the matter, you provided a lot of useful information
12:47 mutilator always appreciate the help
12:47 GuShH mutilator: you'll need gearing anyway, try and source the parts first. see if it's cost effective to build it
12:48 GuShH you could even use a timing belt and pulley set... it's just not as compact for this type of movement
12:49 GuShH mutilator: my hidden agenda is to turn you into an arduinian as to get you far, far away from here!
12:49 GuShH numbers just in, you can't possibly have all the parts machined for less than what those units cost.
12:50 GuShH you'll spend just as much on the bare aluminum if you buy from a reseller.
12:50 GuShH also, expect a one to two car garage sized room with reinforced floor to house a milling machine and a lathe, sir.
12:50 Tom_itx but it's more fun that way
12:51 GuShH plus a year or so practicing, plus just as much money spent on accessories and tooling.
12:51 ShH g
12:51 mutilator i dunno i like my teensy
12:51 GuShH truth be told a small hobby grade mill converted to CNC and lots of patience could be enough!
12:51 GuShH but, still more expensive.
12:51 mutilator and i wasnt specifically speaking to fabrication process as me doing it
12:51 mutilator i was talking more to the fact i dont know of any companies that do
12:52 GuShH yes but if you have someone else doing it, it's still going to cost more.
12:52 mutilator or have references from anyone that uses them
12:52 GuShH also a one-off prototype will cost you several 1000s
12:52 m_itx gets his milling done for
12:52 mutilator or know of any possible solutions to make that process less expensive by off the shelf solutions that can be modified
12:52 GuShH Tom_itx: leave your friend out of this!
12:52 Tom_itx haha
12:52 GuShH unless an old fart with a need for beer money comes across your project...
12:52 GuShH oh, slavery!
12:52 mutilator thats what i currently do with my existing setup
12:52 mutilator i just buy plastic enclosers
12:53 mutilator and mill them own on my cnc at home
12:53 GuShH can you mill yourself a new keyboard or possibly a new set of hands?
12:53 mutilator get the pcb printed and assembled in china
12:53 mutilator then put it all together myself
12:53 GuShH oh no he's outsourcing
12:53 GuShH why not have the chinese put it together?
12:53 mutilator i couldnt find anyone to mill the enclosures cheap
12:54 mutilator and send all the stuff to one spot to get it done
12:54 GuShH if you visit their model factory they'll put the whips away and line up the prettiest workers nearest to you, of course the dumb western folk are always sent to the one and only model factory in china, in reality stuff is made in a rotten warehouse by 3 year olds.
12:54 ShH runs
12:55 GuShH mutilator: where are you located?
12:55 GuShH sooner or later your manufacturer will find out what it is and cut you off
12:56 mutilator huh?
12:56 GuShH or you'll get killed, like the cannon-orbit guy
12:56 mutilator i'm leaning that way
13:03 GuShH mutilator: yeah next thing we know you were part of HARP...
13:44 GuShH rue_house: still narrowing it down... seems nominal sizes match that of a 31/64 x 26tpi tap... which is not a common size.
13:45 GuShH sharpened my 60° tool and now I'm getting horrible results when threading, seems carbide likes to be a little bit on the dull side so it tears and pushes instead of just cutting
13:45 GuShH in fact I ruined my first attempt to make the tap, but that's no biggie.
13:45 GuShH if only I could find the stainless steel rods I had, somewhere...
13:45 GuShH they'll be hell to machine but just what I need
13:46 GuShH hell even a printer rod would be better than this shit steel I got
13:46 GuShH (some are indeed stainless)
13:48 GuShH although they might be a tad smaller if memory serves right
14:25 GuShH snap... we've got air in our carb fuel intake!
14:25 ShH took it apart and put it back together just to find out it was a damaged fuel
14:27 GuShH anyhow got the OEM replacements for 2 bucks... just goes to show, check your fuel lines!
14:28 GuShH this explains the shitty behavior based on working position of this particular tool, I think one of my chainsaws also has a similar problem... might be time to swap out all the lines.
14:28 GuShH we don't even have to worry about ethanol but they still break down
14:44 Ropesfish Mutilator: have you looked @ the Actobotics stuff that Servo City is making? they have some interesting PTZ solutions using their parts
14:49 GuShH Ropesfish: I think he should let go of the pot first
14:50 Ropesfish Always a good idea
14:51 GuShH hrmm so the black hoses are nitrile, but what about the transparent yellow ones?
14:51 GuShH much stiffer
14:51 GuShH too stiff to be silicone
14:51 GuShH unless they come in different grades
14:52 GuShH the only silicone hoses I've used were on my RC airplane and they are matte, soft and seem to last forever
14:53 Ropesfish I've got a few feet of 6" silicone exhaust hose on the boat. It is much easier to work with, but at the price, it better last a very long time
14:54 GuShH it is expensive compared to this stuff I just got
14:54 GuShH and it only lasted 2 years ... heh only, it's a long time but not anywhere near the 10+ years the silicone one has lasted (and still does, although it's a little bit stiffer now)
14:55 Ropesfish flight or marine hardware better be the best you can find or there is adness in your future
14:55 Ropesfish sadness
14:55 GuShH there was but in my case due to an expired epoxi adhesive
14:55 Ropesfish ouch
14:55 GuShH can wings applaud? why yes they can.
14:56 Ropesfish lol...but not for long
14:56 GuShH That's true... Also, can motors embed themselves into the ground? YES.
14:57 GuShH Here's the shocker: the engine still works perfectly.
14:57 GuShH I think an electric motor would just end up with a bent shaft or broken housing
14:57 GuShH (100+ meter fall straight down)
14:57 Ropesfish Gravity and inertia are at the core of many sad stories
14:58 GuShH It will too reach you at some point in life, things will become to sag down.
14:58 Ropesfish :) I am 58. No news flash to me. :)
14:59 GuShH That's not too bad.
14:59 Ropesfish Takes the fun out of those class reunions...
15:00 ShH bl
15:01 GuShH another day, no news from the aluminum suppliers... what a bunch of dicks.
15:01 GuShH and when I call, they ask me to email them the list... what the hell man
15:03 Ropesfish you buying sheet, bar or tubing?
15:03 GuShH bar and tubing
15:03 GuShH also some hexagonal bars
15:03 GuShH I can source sheets and extrusions just fine, those are available everywhere here
15:04 GuShH even though things like X profiles aren't cheap you can still pick them up
15:05 Ropesfish nothing aluminum is cheap. I used to use an aircraft surplus place called The Yard in Wichita. I realllllly miss that place
15:06 GuShH hey aircraft grade alu is even less cheap.
15:07 Ropesfish They do some internet sales...they have a massive amount of product
15:09 pesfish is set as away : Reason(life requires attenti
15:21 defaultro hey folks, good afternoon
15:27 GuShH defaultro: is it good?
15:27 defaultro hey
15:27 defaultro what's up?
15:29 defaultro I posted a question to another channel earlier: how do you calculate the distance of a timing belt being moved by a motor? The step angle of the stepper motor is 1.8 degrees. The pitch of the timing belt is 2mm. If stepper motor moves 1 step, what would be the distance made say you place a marker A to the new location? Would the formula be 2/1.8 which would be close to 1.11mm?
15:31 DagoRed Really? Did someone really need to build this?
15:31 DagoRed .HaD
15:31 makepi DagoRed: 0.) Flying RC Toaster - http://goo.gl/TtIBRz
15:31 ShH is watching a silly review of a silly product http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRx9vgM6-6Y
15:32 Tom_itx so if it's that silly why share?
15:32 m_itx doesn't c
15:33 GuShH slime tire inflator....
15:33 GuShH SLIME ... why is everything they make overpriced?
15:33 GuShH 90 bucks and it doesn't cutoff on a preset pressure, lame.
15:34 GuShH the B&D ones do.
15:35 GuShH you know what's also lame? no battery protection (low bat cutoff, switchable) ... bah.
15:43 Ropesfish defaultro. it has more to do with the diameter of the pulley than the pitch of the belt
15:44 GuShH Ropesfish: pulleys!
15:44 defaultro Ropesfish: yup, someone helped me with the formula
15:44 Ropesfish k
15:46 defaultro (circumference/360)*1.8
15:47 defaultro I used 1.8 because that's the degree per step of my stepper motor
15:47 Ropesfish That will work.
15:50 defaultro thanks
15:51 defaultro I'm still wondering why the distance will change when a bigger pulley is used even if step is still 1.8 degrees
15:52 GuShH ratios
15:52 GuShH what distance?
15:52 defaultro the difference is about 1mm between a 0.5inches diamater pulley versus 5inches
15:52 defaultro i was expecting a big difference but it wasn't
15:53 GuShH what are you trying to do?
15:53 GuShH get more torque? speed things up or down?
15:53 defaultro no
15:53 GuShH you need big ratios to see big differences :p
15:53 defaultro just figuring out the distance it will make when it moves the timing belt
15:53 defaultro yup
15:54 defaultro I tried 10 inches diameter pulley, the distance it will make each step would be 4mm
15:54 defaultro amazing
15:55 Ropesfish 1/360th is not a big piece of anything
15:55 defaultro it will be always exact in math but in real life, it won't be exact
15:55 defaultro yup
15:55 Ropesfish try that on a pie!
15:55 GuShH Mmmhh pie
15:55 defaultro :D
15:55 GuShH icecream pie!
15:55 defaultro glad to learn a new formula
15:55 Ropesfish always a safe subject on IRC
15:55 GuShH oh snap
15:55 defaultro :)
15:56 GuShH it never crossed my mind.
15:56 defaultro GuShH: btw, the new motor I got has a lot of torque
15:56 defaultro i got the stepper driver yesterday and I played with it. It's awesome! :)
15:56 GuShH now you can ride along with the camera
15:56 defaultro hahaha
15:56 Ropesfish what driver?
15:56 defaultro drv8825
15:57 defaultro very easy to configure
15:57 Ropesfish nice. \
15:57 defaultro but I am still wondering if other pins I connected are needed like SLEEP and forgot the other one
15:57 Ropesfish now I am back to the dock to check the boat in this gale. BBIAB
15:57 GuShH the datasheet will know
15:58 defaultro ok
15:59 defaultro Btw, I'm kinda worried with Pololu support. They don't respond quickly
16:00 defaultro also, I tested the motor last night for 30 mins at a low speed/high torque, the motor's max temp was like 45c
16:00 GuShH that's fine
16:00 defaultro I used my wife's food temp checker. I used it on my neck first and I got around 98f
16:01 defaultro :D
16:01 GuShH I'd be worried if you couldn't touch it
16:01 defaultro it's good, I hold it but it was bearable
16:01 GuShH my drill press overheats after about half an hour use (mid use, nothing light nothing hard)
16:01 defaultro ok
16:01 GuShH should replace the motor some day with a 3 phase and a vfd
16:01 GuShH :<
16:02 defaultro really wanted to build a cnc
16:02 defaultro however, I'm still not sure if cnc can make it
16:02 defaultro the material should be aluminum
16:02 defaultro what I'm trying to build is the mount for the motor
16:02 defaultro which will also act as a heatsink
16:03 defaultro the shape is like letter L with opening
16:03 defaultro the opening is where the shaft will go
16:03 defaultro is cnc the right tool for it?
16:05 GuShH huh?
16:05 GuShH you could use a milling machine and do it by hand, as far as machining goes for the brackets
16:06 defaultro let me draw it
16:06 GuShH I can picture it
16:06 GuShH you could make it out of two parts
16:06 GuShH or mill it out of a solid block, too expensive though
16:07 GuShH the L with the hole is easier to do out of two parts, countersunk holes for the allen bolts (M4, M5, M6 or bigger depending on the scale of your machine) and you can bore the hole with a drillpress and lots of patience unless the diameter is over 30mm or so, then even with a reduced shank and a small drill press it might take a long while to peck the aluminum out!
16:09 defaultro done, uploading
16:09 wildmage this channel is busier than I remember
16:10 GuShH wildmage: really? we should get a cookie
16:10 defaultro GuShH: here it is, http://i.imgur.com/14sxHkF.jpg
16:11 GuShH those are some high tech design tools right there
16:11 defaultro looks good?
16:11 wildmage it was very dead for several years
16:11 wildmage how long have you guys been here?
16:11 GuShH I don't know, we just woke up here
16:11 GuShH who are you? do you come in peace?
16:12 wildmage yes, I am your founder
16:12 GuShH my mother?
16:12 wildmage before i turned over the reins to Tom_itx
16:12 GuShH wait, you created the channel? but you left?
16:12 GuShH YOU INFIDELS
16:12 wildmage well, yeah... i had to do my phd
16:13 wildmage sucks i know
16:13 GuShH Excuses.
16:13 defaultro so if two parts, how do I connect them together? I don't want superglue because they might break
16:13 GuShH why not have a round hole for the .... round ... shaft?
16:14 GuShH should I undust the cad?
16:14 GuShH don't have anything better to do other than wait for tomorrow or fix this little engine for which I already got the new hoses.
16:17 defaultro ok, I can do round as well
16:18 defaultro so the right tool for this job is miling machine? I've never seen one
16:18 GuShH then chances are you've never used one!
16:18 GuShH what's the scale ? nema what?
16:19 mutilator yea Ropesfish, i've been talking to someone there about a possible solution
16:19 defaultro which one is the milling machine here, the router or the one that clamps? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igfqYZPdQ78
16:19 defaultro nema 17
16:20 GuShH that's a machinist's vise on an xy bed from a knee milling machine ("bridgeport") most likely, without watching the video just by looking at the first frame.
16:20 defaultro k
16:21 GuShH I assume it's a knee mill due to the sheer size of the bed
16:21 GuShH yeah it should be
16:21 defaultro ok
16:21 GuShH those are way over 2 tons each
16:21 GuShH you'd be looking at a hobby grade milling machine if you don't have the space or means to house a real one
16:21 defaultro ok
16:22 GuShH also big ol' bridgeports would most likely have a 3 phase motor in them which will require a beefy VFD or actual 3 phase wiring
16:22 defaultro would they cost around $500-$800
16:22 defaultro if I buy a working one
16:22 GuShH I don't know where you are, where I'm at you can buy a car with what they cost
16:22 defaultro omg
16:22 defaultro so looks like it's better to just have it done by someone
16:22 GuShH And it takes a lot of knowledge and pricing to run these machines, plus you spend as much on tooling for them
16:23 GuShH defaultro: a hobby milling machine will be cheaper, but it's scaled down, less rigid, for small jobs and one-off deals
16:23 defaultro k
16:23 GuShH in the US not long ago you could buy surplus mills for cheap
16:23 GuShH since most of the industries moved to china, mexico, etc. they had no use for them
16:24 GuShH http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result?q=milling+machine hobby grade
16:24 defaultro i found this, http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/281096910343?lpid=82
16:24 GuShH pro tip, don't buy a new chinese knee mill, buy good old used american stuff instead. and as far as hobby mills go, try to avoid the round column ones.
16:24 defaultro k
16:24 defaultro i like this one, http://www.harborfreight.com/two-speed-variable-bench-mill-drill-machine-44991.html
16:24 GuShH defaultro: it's hard to find a used machine in good condition with all the parts you need and want, and if you do, it may have excessive play on the bed, spindle, etc.
16:25 defaultro what do you think about the one I pulled?
16:25 GuShH ask Tom_itx he knows more about mills than I do, he owns one or two. I haven't got mine yet, because I'm trying to avoid chinese stuff.
16:25 defaultro :)
16:25 GuShH it's tiny, I've seen it at the store
16:25 GuShH it fits on the bed of the mill you linked to on the video, for scale reference.
16:26 GuShH there's a slightly bigger model that looked more promising
16:26 defaultro ok
16:26 GuShH X3 or something, I forgot
16:26 defaultro k
16:26 GuShH you then need to buy the collet set... the endmills, the whatnot.
16:26 GuShH and a vise.
16:26 defaultro i would want something not beyond $1k
16:26 GuShH blocks
16:27 GuShH countersinks
16:27 GuShH I think the list goes on ad infinitum
16:28 GuShH http://www.mini-lathe.com/X3_mill/X3rvw/X3.htm
16:28 GuShH I was going to get one of those, but I would rather buy used old equipment that I know is going to outlive me after I recondition it
16:29 GuShH the site makes a good point on moving the thing and housing it on it's bench, it's not simple... I did it with my lathe and it's not even a big old lathe (but it's a meter long) you have to plan ahead!
16:30 GuShH said lathe got to sit for a month in it's wooden crate until I had the bench on a usable condition (made it from scratch out of steel) then I needed help getting the bare bed on, the rest of the components I could move myself just fine
16:31 GuShH Let's see, new, for the money... the x3 is a good deal, but you can find better machines used if you are willing to spend some time reconditioning them (my biggest problem would be to find the missing parts, if any --- remember some of those companies do not exist anymore)
16:31 GuShH and you will want a bigger mill / lathe at some point, so invest wisely.
16:32 GuShH also keep in mind the shipping cost.
16:32 GuShH as mentioned on the site (and it happened to me as well) some truckers will just deliver it to your door, with luck they will lower it to the entrance of your property but they will rarely move it to where you want it.
16:33 GuShH so again, have a means to transport a big heavy crate.
16:33 GuShH or be prepared to take it all apart, get all greased up and hope you can lift the separate parts.
16:33 GuShH (that's what I did)
16:34 GuShH for some reason private properties such as residencies do not come with loading docks... shame.
16:35 GuShH defaultro: am I talking too much?, keep in mind these chinese hobby tools are not as rigid as a similarly sized old unit
16:36 GuShH I'm still ironing out kinks on my lathe... next time I'll get a big old used one from a better time.
16:38 ShH bl
16:44 defaultro hey sorry, I got called
16:45 defaultro that's X3 looks realy cool
16:46 GuShH add the cost of the accessories though
16:46 GuShH without them it's just a drillpress with tighter tolerances.
16:47 GuShH vise is not always required, clamps are just as useful if not better for bigger parts but you'd want both...
16:49 GuShH not sure the X3 is the one on HF, looks like they only sell the X2 equivalent now?, make sure you aren't buying the smaller brother thinking it's the bigger one...
16:49 defaultro ok
16:49 defaultro hey bro, I got to go
16:50 defaultro i'll be online again tonight :)
16:50 GuShH see ya
18:00 GuShH http://www.northernstar.com.au/news/pig-steals-beer-gets-drunk-and-starts-fight-cow/2015755/
21:06 rue_house my usb sound card alarm clock works, I think I should take out my pci sound card now, try adding the other video card
22:25 defaultro evening folks, I'm using 4n35 to trigger my camera's shutter pin. It's wired. What I'm planning to do is trigger the camera's shutter wirelessly. So I'm thinking of a wireless switch that I can connect to my camera. Then on the arduino side, it will talk to the remote device wirelessly and trigger the switch. What's the easiest and reliable way to do it? Should I use wifi, blutooth, rf, etc?
22:26 ace4016 depends on range
22:26 ace4016 also, wifi and bluetooth are rf :P
22:26 defaultro range would be only 8-10 is the max
22:26 defaultro oh ok
22:27 defaultro 8-10ft
22:27 ace4016 8-10 what? meters or feet?
22:27 ace4016 ah; bluetooth works and is lower powered
22:27 defaultro ok
22:27 ace4016 zigbee does too
22:27 defaultro never heard of zigbee, i'll check it later
22:27 ace4016 IR switches work as well
22:27 defaultro how does it work?
22:28 defaultro can I tell it to switch on and then switch off after certain seconds?
22:28 ace4016 not quite
22:28 ace4016 just another method, and might be simpler and less noisy as it's LoS
22:29 defaultro because currently with my 4n35, I'm sending a high and I have a delay of like 15 seconds depending on how long I like. After 15 seconds, I send a LOW to switch off
22:29 defaultro which would be the stable and works 99% of the time?
22:30 ace4016 all of them would work 99% of the time with provisions; it's really up to preference
22:30 defaultro ok
22:30 defaultro i want something that is light since I'll be attaching it to the shutter pin port of the camera
22:31 defaultro so if blutooth, that means, I need 2 bluetooth devices
22:31 ace4016 using IR to transmit the signal may be the easiest (not a simple IR signal, more like what you'd see in your tv remote)
22:31 ace4016 two radios, yea
22:31 defaultro oh, IR is point to point
22:31 defaultro i'm worried about point to point
22:34 defaultro if I'll be using blutooth, what else do I need near the camera side? can I still use 4n35?
22:35 defaultro i'm not sure what the blutooth device does
22:36 GargantuaSauce defaultro: i use nrf24l01 modules
22:36 GargantuaSauce much much cheaper than *bee
22:36 defaultro what does it do?
22:36 defaultro and it's not point to point right?
22:36 GargantuaSauce it's just a packet-based wireless transceiver
22:37 GargantuaSauce it is
22:37 defaultro is this it? http://www.nordicsemi.com/eng/Products/2.4GHz-RF/nRF24L01
22:37 defaultro do I need two of it? one near arduino and the other one near the camera?
22:38 GargantuaSauce http://www.ebay.ca/itm/400594944844
22:38 defaultro i need something that will act similarly to my 4n35 which is an opti isolator
22:38 GargantuaSauce yes you'll need a second microcontroller on the carriage for that
22:38 defaultro it switches pins 4 and 5 which is connected to my camera's shutter. The voltage is 0
22:38 defaultro you mean, another Arduino?
22:40 GargantuaSauce or whatever else
22:41 defaultro ok. I thought it would only be small
22:41 defaultro I was thinking it would just be hanging near the side of my camera since it's light
22:41 defaultro about 1.5"x1.5" max
22:41 GargantuaSauce http://www.ebay.ca/itm/221283333405 i guess you could use something like this
22:42 defaultro ah, this reminds me of something
22:42 defaultro someone told me last year about car remote control
22:45 defaultro thanks
22:45 ace4016 so what's your current setup again?
22:45 defaultro I'm using 4n35 to trigger the camera shutter pins
22:46 defaultro the output pin of 4n35 is 0volts
22:46 defaultro the pins are pin 4 and 5
22:46 defaultro however, i am using a cable for my camera
22:47 ace4016 ah; most solutions will require an MCU, which it seemed you already had
22:47 defaultro what is MCU?
22:47 defaultro microconroller unit?
22:47 ace4016 yea
22:47 defaultro k
22:47 defaultro i don't want to have 2 arduinos
22:48 defaultro i just want to trigger a device remotely like car remote control
22:49 ace4016 you'd only need 1 and a remote control if you went the IR route (i know i'm selling the IR route hard, but it's honestly pretty simple; the remote can be a selfmade circuit even that just outputs the necessary signal to the IR receiver)
22:50 ace4016 basically on the camera side, you'd have an MCU that has an IR receiver attached, and ouputs to the 4n35
22:50 ace4016 and that's it
22:50 defaultro i believe you because I made a lirc device before. Problem is that, it's pt to pt
22:50 ace4016 ah, right
22:50 ace4016 what was the issue with pt to pt? need to be able to do out of line of sight?
22:51 defaultro if the blutooth worked like the ir, it would have been awesome
22:51 defaultro yes
22:51 ace4016 ah
22:51 defaultro and the camera is moving since it's on a camera slider
22:51 defaultro i think the car remote idea is great
22:51 ace4016 they do have bluetooth remotes :P
22:51 defaultro ok
22:52 ace4016 though there's a lot more electronics in them than the IR remotes
22:52 defaultro i really want it simple, send a HIGH to the device that is connected to the arduino. That device then tells the remote device, hey, turn it ON :D
22:52 ace4016 bluetooth's protocol was meant to send data more complex than a single command
22:52 defaultro yes
22:53 defaultro i want it in physical layer
22:53 defaultro :D
22:53 defaultro OSI
22:53 defaultro don't have to climb up the data layer
22:53 ace4016 hehe
22:55 faultro is currently decommission TIp122 that are still on the breadboar
22:55 defaultro decommissioning
22:56 ace4016 the NRF24L01 don't seem like a bad idea actually
22:56 defaultro ok, I will read it again
22:56 ace4016 but yea, you'll need two MCUs
22:56 ace4016 well...
22:56 defaultro oh yup, that's the issue
22:56 defaultro or maybe the arduino nano
22:56 ace4016 i don't know if you'll need two
22:57 defaultro i was hoping I can power it with a circle battery
22:57 ace4016 you may be able to get away with a simple circuit to initiate it, but i've not seen the datasheet for it
22:57 defaultro k
23:02 GargantuaSauce it needs an mcu for sure
23:02 GargantuaSauce so if you absolutely require something small and simple on that end, that car remote is probably the way to go
23:02 defaultro ok
23:02 GargantuaSauce you could just use the relay it has on the business end, or replace it with the optoisolator
23:02 defaultro i'll have to find something that uses low power
23:03 defaultro got it
23:21 MrCurious you down with cnc... yeah you know me! https://twitter.com/itsagreenone
23:24 MrCurious better link https://twitter.com/ItsAGreenOne/status/400851696944812032/photo/1
23:30 defaultro nice
23:32 MrCurious oddly i only budgeted 1 day for it.. it went a year or two over :)
23:32 MrCurious shoud be done by xmas
23:33 defaultro :)
23:34 MrCurious and yes, the x axis is super noisey. .seems the table acts like a resonator
23:34 defaultro you should make a youtube of it
23:35 GargantuaSauce it will all be whisper quiet compared to the tool anyway
23:37 MrCurious you raise an execllent point. the porter cable 690 is a bit loud
23:37 MrCurious not sure it was made for 8 hours continous operation. may have to replace that part
23:37 MrCurious GuShH: come check out the "poser update" :)