#robotics Logs
Jun 24 2013
#robotics Calendar
00:03 MrCurious http://www.target.com/p/as-seen-on-tv-schticky-3-piece-reusable-and-washable-lint-roller/-/A-14078641?ref=tgt_adv_XSG10001&AFID=Google_PLA_df&LNM=%7C14078641&CPNG=Storage+Organization&kpid=14078641&LID=PA&ci_src=17588969&ci_sku=14078641&gclid=CLuJnI3y-7cCFUZxQgodWG0AoQ
00:03 MrCurious $20 to find out :D
00:04 codepython777 MrCurious: I need a solution that will page after page after page …
00:04 codepython777 suction seems to be the only reliable way of doing this, unless there is substance that has an easy way to sticking and unsticking to paper
00:05 codepython777 these rollers - even if they work - will need replacement
00:07 MrCurious no
00:07 MrCurious you run them under water
00:07 MrCurious they release all contaminants
00:07 MrCurious you dry them and again as new
00:08 MrCurious eventually they would need replacing
00:08 codepython777 they wud stick toe paper without tearing off the paper?
00:08 MrCurious only 1 way to find out
00:08 codepython777 and only one page at a time?
00:08 codepython777 why?
00:09 MrCurious and if not, it will solve your lint problem
00:09 codepython777 :)
00:10 codepython777 whats the physics of lint rollers?
00:12 codepython777 MrCurious: I've a lint roller somewhere - i'll try it out
00:13 codepython777 but even if it works, i dont want to keep buying lint rollers
00:21 MrCurious i think the deal with this one is its a special material
00:21 MrCurious not like the kind where you peel stickers off
00:22 MrCurious how many books are you talking?
00:22 codepython777 MrCurious: 1000
00:23 codepython777 so a million page flips - i dont think any simple hack will survive. but worth a try for sure
00:24 MrCurious given teh cost of the final turner robot... should be minimal compared to it
00:25 MrCurious i think the best way would be to use a table saw to decimate the spine...
00:25 MrCurious then feed the pages through a sheet fed scanner
00:25 codepython777 what is a final turner robot?
00:25 codepython777 MrCurious: I dont want to kill my books
00:25 MrCurious removing the requirement of reusable books makes it a damn site easier and faster
00:25 MrCurious the final cost of building the device
00:26 MrCurious i have found that robot projects dont come off near as cheap as i think they will at the start
00:26 codepython777 agreed
00:26 codepython777 I was hoping to build something < 1k + my time. You think that is realistic?
00:28 codepython777 MrCurious: also, i already have the camera that i plan to use
00:28 MrCurious possible
00:28 codepython777 well it has to be reliable enough to turn a million pages- thats where i get in trouble
00:28 codepython777 MrCurious: have you played with robotic arm kits?
00:28 codepython777 are these reliable enough?
00:30 MrCurious i think google may have developed one
00:30 MrCurious for their book scanning project
00:30 codepython777 they did for $1500 - its too hard to assemble compared to what i am thinking
00:31 MrCurious http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/09/05/15/1834246/How-Googles-High-Speed-Book-Scanner-De-Warps-Pages
00:32 MrCurious you google image searched this term? homemade book scanning robot
00:33 codepython777 most book scanners seem very expensive
00:33 MrCurious in theory...
00:33 MrCurious books have numbered pages?
00:33 MrCurious and as such, compressed air could be used
00:34 codepython777 compressed air for?
00:34 MrCurious as long as pages are inventoried to detect misses
00:34 MrCurious blow page to the next
00:34 codepython777 thats too unreliable, i was thinking a silicone suction cup
00:34 MrCurious probably also need a rubber wheel on teh edge of the book
00:34 MrCurious to release pages
00:35 codepython777 pressure air push+pull should do that
00:35 MrCurious http://hacknmod.com/wp-content/old/pics/285-1.jpg
00:35 MrCurious my idea was NOT origional it seems
00:36 MrCurious your first step will be to research a variety of terms relating to book scanning robots and page turning... and so on
00:37 codepython777 i've done that to some extent
00:37 MrCurious then you will need to test page turner/holder mechanisms (adhesive, suction, air...
00:38 MrCurious also search youtube and flikr
00:38 MrCurious will you scan pages using a moving scanner, or a camera
00:38 codepython777 camera
00:40 MrCurious http://hackedgadgets.com/2008/09/08/scanrobot-automated-book-scanning-robot/
00:41 codepython777 those are 100k
00:41 MrCurious your not buying them, you are learning from them :D
00:41 MrCurious inventory how others do it, learn, ponder, then choose the cheapest path, or chart a new one
00:42 codepython777 i agree
00:42 MrCurious but i think however you do it, you will need to detect page numbers to spot double turns
00:43 codepython777 i can do that
00:43 MrCurious my thinking was if you can detect page numbers...
00:44 MrCurious you can use less orthodox methods, like compressed air
00:44 MrCurious would double page scans be acceptable?
00:46 MrCurious so you want to scan at a $1 a book
00:46 GuShH suction cups
00:46 GuShH similar to how you pick and place SMT
00:46 GuShH blowing air to flip pages doesn't work.
00:47 codepython777 GuShH: Indeed
00:47 GuShH rather, you'd think it does until you notice how different weights, types and STATES of paper ruin it for you.
00:47 GuShH humidity makes any paper behave differently for instance
00:47 GuShH including laminated paper
00:47 MrCurious i look forward to seeing what you construct :) remember to enjoy the journey...
00:47 codepython777 you mean suction cups?
00:48 codepython777 GuShH: why would suction cups have problems with weights? As long as i can control the pressure?
00:48 GuShH I said bursts of air have issues
00:48 MrCurious GuShH: what do you think of this for sticky stuff http://www.target.com/p/as-seen-on-tv-schticky-3-piece-reusable-and-washable-lint-roller/-/A-14078641?ref=tgt_adv_XSG10001&AFID=Google_PLA_df&LNM=%7C14078641&CPNG=Storage+Organization&kpid=14078641&LID=PA&ci_src=17588969&ci_sku=14078641&gclid=CLuJnI3y-7cCFUZxQgodWG0AoQ
00:48 GuShH not the cups.
00:48 GuShH vacuum is used in almost all industries
00:48 MrCurious periodically clean/dry with water/air
00:48 GuShH including aeronautical
00:49 GuShH it says "as seen on tv" then I'm not even clicking
00:49 GuShH All I've ever seen on tv were guidos and pregnant whores
00:49 GuShH drunk ones.
00:50 codepython777 GuShH: how about i add a robotic arm http://www.lynxmotion.com/c-130-al5d.aspx with a suction cup to build my page turner
00:50 GuShH codepython777: how is google doing it?
00:50 GuShH aside from using SLRs for the capturing
00:50 codepython777 GuShH: Painfully
00:50 GuShH So if this is your idea of getting rich at my expense, I've got bad news for you
00:50 codepython777 GuShH: They are using scanners instead of cameras. I think making that scanner is painful. And it can tear pages if it goes wrong
00:50 GuShH I've seen them using two SLRs
00:50 MrCurious GuShH: its a couple year old sticky meta material
00:51 codepython777 GuShH: Then you are talking about a different design
00:51 codepython777 GuShH: The only one i've seen is the linear book scanner
00:51 GuShH one of them must be older and probably not even in use anymore
00:51 GuShH or both are in use
00:51 GuShH depending on the value of the book
00:52 codepython777 GuShH: what do you think about that robotic arm?
00:52 GuShH 500 bucks for a toy robot arm heh
00:52 codepython777 is it reliable enough?
00:52 GuShH how should I know?
00:52 GuShH my parents used to buy toys for me
00:52 GuShH now the only toys I buy are things like lathes...
00:53 ShH has a mill on his must-have
00:53 MrCurious mills are must have items
00:53 GuShH codepython777: anything using hobby servos won't be reliable
00:53 MrCurious life-changers...
00:53 GuShH and you need constant repeatability.
00:53 MrCurious mills are like drill presses that dont totally suck
00:54 GuShH heh
00:54 GuShH well a drill press with an XY table is not a substitute by any stretch of the imagination.
00:54 GuShH however. cheapo chinese mills seem to be more like glorified drill presses than anything
00:54 GuShH which is why I haven't found anything good so far
00:54 GuShH (aside from big CNC units which I can't afford)
00:54 codepython777 GuShH: Any ideas on how i should go about it?
00:54 GuShH idea was to CNC it myself at some point
00:55 GuShH codepython777: yes, whatever project this is it clearly isn't for you because you are asking for help on an IRC channel.
00:55 GuShH And it has a profitable end and I'm not one for charity.
00:55 codepython777 GuShH: ? and why does that matter?
00:55 codepython777 ah i see
00:55 GuShH Because you are clueless and it takes a very intelligent person to admit so.
00:55 codepython777 GuShH: How about if i make money, i can give you some :)
00:56 GuShH i've heard that at least once.
00:56 GuShH that's enough times to know it's bullshit.
00:56 codepython777 did you make money out of that hearing?
00:56 GuShH you never do.
00:56 GuShH sometimes not even with a contract.
00:56 GuShH weasels be weasels and all that.
00:57 codepython777 There are too many people trying to make book scanners. I dont think you can make money out of them - except of course if you can sell it to the management of a large library which is running in loss already :)
00:57 GuShH We've had severe loss of reading material here in Argentina a few months ago
00:57 GuShH huge storm flooded lots of libraries.
00:57 codepython777 GuShH: but good luck making money on book scanners - that ship sailed 5 years ago, — google did not open source their scanner for no reason
00:58 GuShH some books were painfully dried by hand, others were thrown away... it was all mitigated with a "donate your unused books" campaign though and now they have more books than they did before.
00:58 codepython777 Ah, Argentina might be a different - cant talk about that
00:58 GuShH different how?
00:58 GuShH we're talking flood and paper...
00:59 GuShH water and humidity will ruin any book
00:59 codepython777 Anyways, Lets drop it, since you think i want to make money, and you want a part of it :)
00:59 GuShH the biggest libraries have pumps, so what, everything got overwhelmed
00:59 GuShH codepython777: I said I didn't want to help someone who clearly wants to take advantage of others but I said it in other words...
01:00 codepython777 Its ok.
01:00 GuShH on the other hand I already suggested a vacuum pickup system, what else do you want, a full proven design on solidworks?
01:00 GuShH oh sorry this is the age where a 12 year old can make anything on sketchup and even make more money than everyone else in this channel does by selling whatever piece of shit he pseudo invented.
01:00 GuShH the fuck with weasels.
01:01 MrCurious wow
01:01 MrCurious did he hangup on you?
01:01 GuShH Hmm I don't have MrCurious on ignore yet I can't tab him!
01:02 GuShH Silly client.
01:02 Jak_o_Shadows GuShH: I prefer inventor
01:02 GuShH When exactly did you realize a mill was a life changer anyway
01:02 MrCurious tab him?
01:02 GuShH tab, complete.
01:02 MrCurious ahhh
01:02 GuShH your nick is not in the list.
01:02 GuShH but my ignore list is empty, so that couldn't be the reason why it's not listed.
01:02 MrCurious MrCurious:
01:02 MrCurious i can tab me
01:03 GuShH I get everyone but you!
01:03 ShH p
01:03 GuShH Question still stands.
01:04 MrCurious oh!
01:04 GuShH Also about that guy, I feel very strongly against googloids. The term refers to someone who depends 99% on Google to subsist.
01:04 MrCurious when i tried to make a cnc
01:04 MrCurious using a drill press
01:04 MrCurious and found it was not accurate, repeateable
01:04 MrCurious and could not make a hole perpendicular to the wood surface
01:04 GuShH I'm not sure about professional / heavy duty ones, but the cheapies are crap.
01:04 MrCurious then i got a mill and suddenly i could make better holes
01:04 GuShH less chatter and all
01:04 MrCurious then i learned about step drilling and realized i didnt need the mill
01:05 GuShH step? pecking?
01:05 MrCurious but by then i was hooked on its power
01:05 GuShH I call it pecking.
01:05 MrCurious make a 1mm hole, change bit
01:05 MrCurious make a 3mm hole
01:05 MrCurious change bit...
01:05 MrCurious until you get to the 20mm hole you wanted
01:05 GuShH Oh... well yes that's standard practice to reduce chatter and stress on the tool
01:05 GuShH of course you start with a center bit anyway
01:05 MrCurious apparently they didnt teach it at the computer-programmer school i went to
01:05 GuShH that's the first step to any drilling or even boring for that matter
01:06 MrCurious so i am learn by trial and error and try to preserve fingers
01:06 GuShH why only just fingers?
01:06 GuShH eyes, arms, balls..
01:06 GuShH they are just as important!
01:07 MrCurious i need the fingers to program at speed
01:07 GuShH I wonder if they teach to remove the lint from your belly button before you even start the lathe in Italy.
01:07 MrCurious i have upgraded goggles to some nice ones that keep even the most persistent metal out
01:08 MrCurious no long hair, loose clothing or jewlry in the grown up toy room
01:08 GuShH (because stereotype dictates the italian dude is working without a shirt on)
01:08 MrCurious and think twice power once
01:08 MrCurious who is italian?
01:08 GuShH I'm half italian
01:08 GuShH so I can joke about it.
01:09 MrCurious can you grow a full beard in like 4 hours?
01:09 GuShH It's like jews making fun of jews; it's alright
01:09 MrCurious all italians i knew could do that
01:09 GuShH lol
01:09 MrCurious had to shave like 3 or 4 times a day
01:09 MrCurious hairy mo fo's
01:09 GuShH I'm the other kind...
01:09 MrCurious ahhh
01:10 ShH wonders why almost everyone in Sicily is bald or bal
01:10 GuShH At least the fishermen...
01:10 GuShH They are hairy but in all the wrong places.
01:11 GuShH But in theory the less hair you've got, the more evolved your genes are... are least to some regard...
01:11 GuShH at*
01:12 GuShH It depends highly on the conditions your ancestors were living anyway
01:13 MrCurious i dont know what it was, but some time around 40, my hair pulled back to make the image of florida in front, and a friar tuck in back
01:13 GuShH Yeah it's like it wants to migrate toward your arse, what's so interesting down there anyway?
01:14 MrCurious and at the same time, i now can generate a pair of ear-muffs with hair from my ear holes in 3 days
01:14 GuShH I think in reality you went too fast on your motorcycle though, that's what happened. Your hair just blew back
01:14 MrCurious but the really annoying old age hair phenomenon
01:14 MrCurious is the stray single blonde super thin hair that sprouts near an eye, and only gets noticed rarely, then you can never re-locate it to find it
01:15 MrCurious HOURS of fun
01:15 GuShH That's odd, I've only noticed my nose hairs growing larger but nothing else so far.
01:15 MrCurious patience :D
01:16 GuShH Bah they've modified the inlet on this thing and now I can't screw on my test fitting because there's fibre glass wool and crap all around... I hate working with high pressure steam.
01:17 GuShH Well it's 250PSI, does that count as high pressure these days? because the guys working with water jet / cutters and all that fancy stuff surely deal with a lot higher pressures...
01:18 GuShH I've seen the crimp tools they use, they cost a fortune.
01:18 MrCurious cant you mix some particulate with that steam and use it to cut?
01:18 GuShH even more than the big ones used for electrical lugs
01:18 MrCurious or does the water vapor work as a particulate?
01:18 ShH sh
01:18 GuShH I know the brass fittings wouldn't last
01:18 GuShH should be ceramic at least for the nozzle
01:19 GuShH it seems not only steam comes out but also water droplets at very high speeds
01:19 GuShH possibly picked up from a sort of vacuum effect inside the boiler or maybe just condensation around the top?
01:20 MrCurious what are u using steam for?
01:20 MrCurious cleaning?
01:20 GuShH nothing I'm just servicing it but sure it's used for cleaning, ironing, whatever...
01:20 GuShH their biggest one does 2500PSI (170BAR)
01:20 GuShH never touched one... I think they've only sold a few
01:20 MrCurious dont point it at your dangly bits....
01:21 GuShH even at 4BAR which is what the household models would do can get you very injured...
01:22 GuShH It's no different from working on a big engine or a turbine of any kind, it's all dangerous and if you screw up, someone will get hurt.
01:22 MrCurious i was playing with a pressure sprayer once
01:23 MrCurious aimed it at my bare foot
01:23 GuShH I actually have one of this which I've never used http://www.sanitech.com/products_mark1.php that's similar to what I usually service...
01:23 MrCurious it removed some skin
01:23 MrCurious and i moved it rather fast...
01:23 GuShH I know someone who lost his toenail by doing that with a pressue washer
01:23 MrCurious learned respect
01:23 GuShH you'd lose half a foot if you do it with one of these things
01:23 GuShH and it would smell like boiled meat.
01:24 MrCurious had a 16" frenel lense solar furnace that turned bricks to glass.
01:24 MrCurious learned respect for lead and WD 40 using that device
01:24 GuShH I want to play with fresnel lens :(
01:24 MrCurious they are fun
01:24 GuShH Never had a chance to take apart a big old retro tv
01:25 MrCurious always wanted to use a big one to focus the sun rays
01:25 GuShH AND DOMINATE THE WORLD
01:25 MrCurious then a 2nd lense to straiten them into a death ray
01:25 GuShH lol
01:25 MrCurious never found anyone who said that could be done
01:26 GuShH wouldn't the losses from each lense make it self destroy
01:26 GuShH one would melt the other
01:26 MrCurious probably
01:27 ShH is considering cloning some of these machines since there's a bit of demand but no su
01:27 GuShH mostly people and their crazy start-up ideas
01:28 MrCurious power washer machines?
01:28 GuShH no, high pressure steam systems
01:28 GuShH basically a glorified boiler with solenoid driven outlets and several accessories...
01:29 MrCurious hahahah, the guy who played max headroom is in "fallen skies" episode :D
01:29 GuShH no imports means no new machines get into the country and the old ones nobody can service except for a few idiots like me who still have some spare parts and the knowledge...
01:29 GuShH the only locally made steam thingies are for dry cleaners
01:30 MrCurious sounds like a start up opportunity
01:30 GuShH out of every client out there, the absolute worst are hotels. big hotels.
01:31 GuShH I've worked with the 4 seasons and they are some of the biggest assholes out there. I'm pretty sure others like Hilton could be just as bad if not worse though.
01:31 MrCurious i hate mondays
01:31 MrCurious really could use another day this weekend
01:31 GuShH we've had a 4 day weekend
01:31 GuShH which ruined my plans of getting a lathe by saturday
01:31 GuShH thursday and friday were national holidays
01:32 GuShH and they only work 'til 2PM on saturdays, no shipments though.
01:32 ShH shakes
01:32 MrCurious heh
01:33 MrCurious why is this stuff so tempting
01:33 MrCurious http://www.epictinker.com/category-s/1850.htm?searching=Y&sort=5&cat=1850&show=150&page=1
01:34 GuShH It is?
01:34 GuShH Why would you even want one of those kits
01:34 GuShH Having a mill and a lathe there's hardly anything you can't do
01:34 MrCurious its a wood laythe
01:34 GuShH except for the extruded rubber parts
01:35 MrCurious lathe, and it lacks any good vises
01:35 GuShH I'm going to make a "bed" for the toolpost so I can use it as a sander with a custom face plate
01:36 MrCurious and the only time i tried to lathe wood, it turned into a horrible splintery toothpick. i think the wood wasnt dense enough for latheing
01:36 GuShH in reality the other side of the spindle is threaded just for that (the "deluxe" version came with the sanding attachment)
01:36 GuShH I think you didn't have a sharp enough tool
01:36 GuShH and the position was wrong
01:36 GuShH either trying to cut too high or too low
01:36 GuShH too high probably
01:36 GuShH I only get splintery mess when the tool catches
01:36 MrCurious it was pine and left lots of tearing
01:36 MrCurious but sure threw the chips
01:36 GuShH most pine turns fine
01:37 GuShH the goal is to throw a constant long chip
01:37 GuShH specially on green wood
01:37 GuShH the last thing I turned out of pine was from a random branch that fell off one of the pines at home, it had been attacked by worms (or whatever eat through the wood and leave tiny holes and tunnels) but it turned just fine
01:38 MrCurious oh it was definately dry i think
01:38 MrCurious i think it was a 2x2 from home depot
01:38 GuShH it's actually just a stick used to level the coffee grains from the espresso before tampering them.
01:38 GuShH I haven't turned anything fancy yet
01:39 GuShH but most of it comes from "found" wood
01:39 GuShH turning square stock isn't fun, lots of interrupted cuts before you actually get to turn the wood
01:39 MrCurious maybe i should try again, using some green wood from a felled tree
01:40 GuShH my problem with green wood is being too impatient and maybe even not knowing exactly how to dry the pieces
01:40 MrCurious no... it will be just another project! must remained focused on one of the 50 currently open projects
01:40 GuShH I know you should store them with newspaper and the shavings in a box, on a place that isn't too warm or dry
01:40 GuShH so I don't do that and I can't wait so I start using it right away and a few days later on... I get several cracks
01:41 GuShH specially when it's green wood, you can't finish it right away it has to dry first and when it does it deforms, with luck it doesn't crack
01:41 GuShH so you can't seal it right away... that's the bad thing
01:41 GuShH cuts easy, hard to dry properly.
01:42 MrCurious hmmm seems like a plastic bag
01:42 MrCurious with some dried chips could minimize the drying
01:42 GuShH and what do you do about the patience issue?
01:43 GuShH you just spent an hour or two turning something that you won't be able to see nor use for months while it dries
01:43 GuShH I CANT HAVE THAT
01:43 MrCurious i think if i turned things, i would do it for the fun of making the little its of wood (sawdust)
01:43 GuShH lol
01:43 MrCurious perhaps you need a humidor
01:43 GuShH it's not so fun cleaning it up
01:43 MrCurious with a glass panel
01:43 MrCurious that you can observe your treasure with
01:43 MrCurious or a humidor room that you could sit in and play with your prescious...
01:43 GuShH perhaps I should start buying dry wood instead
01:44 GuShH I never made anything to be sold, just things I need or want.
01:44 MrCurious i have a nice shop vac, and a 6' tall 2.5hp 4" vaccuume system for wood working
01:44 GuShH my shop vac is too loud
01:44 MrCurious yes
01:44 MrCurious you should make an enclosure for it :D
01:44 GuShH makes short work of cleaning after the lathe but the noise is way too loud.
01:45 MrCurious this one i believe would suck up kittens like no mans business, and sadly turn them into liquid...
01:45 GuShH and if I'm using ear protection + vacuum then I can't tell when the phone rings or if someone is at the door...
01:45 GuShH lol
01:45 GuShH does it have multiple motors?
01:45 GuShH mine is only a single motor
01:45 MrCurious one day i noticed that my cats could fit in teh hose opening
01:45 GuShH seen a shop vac with 4 motors, it was the rolls royce of shop vacs.
01:45 MrCurious then my mind took it to the bad place very quickly without warning
01:46 MrCurious currently the shop vac is serving as a cat hammoc
01:46 MrCurious i need to move it to the new tool room, and get it installed
01:47 MrCurious right now i think there is a 50% chance i will experience a sick day tomorrow
01:48 GuShH heh
01:52 MrCurious today i replaced a failed garage light
01:52 GuShH let me guess, it's been "failed" for months?
01:52 MrCurious and purchased a second one so the garage will be completely lit when i go in it to work
01:52 MrCurious 3 days
01:52 GuShH heh that's not bad
01:53 GuShH most people I know would let it be for months
01:53 MrCurious the washer/dryer is in there...
01:53 MrCurious it made it emergent and critical
01:53 MrCurious and put a 7 day timer on the task
01:53 GuShH should've used some magnesium to make light, pfft.
01:53 GuShH or an arc light
01:53 GuShH some carbon rod, couple car batteries.. what could possibly go wrong?
01:53 MrCurious yeah, walking into a pitch black garage full of sharp machines and litered with aluminum shards and forgotten storage items..
01:54 MrCurious i have a pair or 300W haligen shop lights in there
01:54 MrCurious they are PAINfully bright and annoyingly hot
01:54 GuShH only got a 250W one (well 250W at 220VAC)
01:54 MrCurious i think the dual 40W florescent lights will be optimum
01:54 GuShH I've been meaning to install a 500W one, fixed to one of the walls.. but meh
01:55 GuShH They make some neat high power CFLs now
01:55 GuShH when I need a lot of light I end up bringing the light to whatever it is I'm doing, not just lighting up the whole place
01:55 GuShH since in that event you'd need a lot of light sources (shadows are even more annoying)
01:55 MrCurious i open the garage door and let the sun in
01:56 MrCurious but lately, i like to mill between 9 and 10pm
01:56 GuShH most people tinker at night!
01:56 GuShH So you open the garage door and let the mexicans in now?
01:57 MrCurious thats the worse fear
01:57 MrCurious someone gets in my garage and liquifies themselves
01:57 GuShH are you threatening them?
01:58 MrCurious ?
01:58 MrCurious mexicans are our friends....
01:58 GuShH they are?
01:58 MrCurious they are useful
01:58 MrCurious work hard
01:58 MrCurious and are tiny, so they can fit in difficult hard to reach palces
01:59 GuShH hahaha
01:59 GuShH they are? I didn't know that
01:59 GuShH well the last mexican I've seen was rather tiny
01:59 GuShH ...he looked like a drug cartel type of guy
01:59 MrCurious the ones i see that i think are illegals are like 4'8"
01:59 GuShH with an old leather jacket
01:59 GuShH aren't they all illegals?
01:59 MrCurious no
01:59 GuShH aw
01:59 GuShH some are super illegal, right
01:59 MrCurious i dont like to think legal/illegal
02:00 GuShH "I like to think, there goes a wetback"
02:00 MrCurious i think of it as people, like me, who want to live in this land
02:00 MrCurious they are US
02:00 MrCurious and we need to stop vilifying them
02:00 GuShH Since I'm not in the US
02:00 GuShH I can do that!
02:00 MrCurious your in argentina?
02:00 GuShH They're not even a "problem" here, we have other kinds
02:00 GuShH Like Peruvians
02:00 GuShH And all of those.
02:00 GuShH they're our mexicans, but worse.
02:00 GuShH Oh I could write a song if I keep going
02:00 MrCurious doesnt argentina have a BRAZILLIAN enemies?
02:01 ek G
02:01 ShH sh
02:01 GuShH brazil... I have nothing to say about brazil, other than it's a shemale factory.
02:01 GuShH scary.
02:01 MrCurious dating in brazil... the odds are good, but the goods are odd
02:02 GuShH lol
02:03 MrCurious i got nothing on my planned todo list done
02:04 MrCurious but ended up doing other stuff of value
02:04 GuShH I should take a nap....
02:05 GuShH I watch these videos on youtube of people unboxing their fancy tools and I can't help but feel betrayed by this country...
02:05 GuShH We simply cannot import stuff, at least not legally.
02:05 MrCurious wait. you have a mill right
02:05 GuShH I don't
02:05 MrCurious cant you make a lathe?
02:05 MrCurious oh!
02:05 MrCurious you need one
02:06 MrCurious life changing...
02:06 GuShH I said I would buy one soon if I found one I could afford and that it wasn't a cheap glorified drill press
02:06 GuShH I bought a metal lathe.
02:06 GuShH Which I may get today or tomorrow, we'll see how it goes.
02:06 GuShH I don't even know where I'll put it
02:06 MrCurious i got this one for $450
02:06 MrCurious http://www.harborfreight.com/two-speed-variable-bench-mill-drill-machine-44991.html
02:06 GuShH that thing is almost as big as the wood lathe, and said lathe is already on a very annoying spot.
02:07 GuShH the wood lathe is... 4 foot long, about.
02:07 MrCurious this is about 2' wide
02:07 MrCurious it could have less backlash
02:07 MrCurious but i havent worked out how to tune that yet
02:07 GuShH 90KG... sorry that's about 200 LB I guess
02:07 GuShH the metal lathe is 130KG, and almost as big
02:07 MrCurious heavy is a good thing
02:08 GuShH it's not good if you plan to take it upstairs
02:08 GuShH 450 on sale? it says 540!
02:08 MrCurious yeah, on the heavy topic, my jointer... when put in a friends car lowered the car 6"
02:08 GuShH and of course they pretend it was 600
02:08 MrCurious on one side
02:08 GuShH lol
02:08 MrCurious 25% off i think
02:08 GuShH I moved the wood lathe on my brother's jetta
02:08 GuShH it wasn't so much a weight issue as it was getting the thing to fit
02:09 MrCurious the jointer is like all solid multi inch thick steel
02:09 GuShH a guy with a massive 4x4 truck went by at the parking lot and snickered
02:09 MrCurious i have used it as an anvil to straiten my miter saw back fence
02:09 GuShH I bet he thought "how on earth is he going to fit that thing into that car"
02:09 MrCurious i have a van
02:09 MrCurious it moves big things now
02:09 GuShH I didn't even have a wrench with me to take it all apart
02:09 GuShH Heh is it a white van?
02:10 MrCurious how did you know!
02:10 GuShH If it is, you'll be the white van man from now on.
02:10 MrCurious with a friendly bear and bag of candy painted on teh side
02:10 GuShH haha that's all theBear ever wanted
02:10 MrCurious its a sea breeze green honda oddessey
02:10 GuShH "free icecream" plottered on the side
02:10 MrCurious or some other fruity form of green
02:10 GuShH ah the colour nobody else wanted!
02:11 MrCurious it was a good price
02:11 MrCurious i wanted BLACK
02:11 GuShH I'd like a pickup truck or a van...
02:11 MrCurious black cars are cool
02:11 GuShH sure we all want black or silver or matte black even better, but if it's a used car, good luck
02:11 MrCurious if you take out the middle row, its a limo
02:11 MrCurious if you fold down the 3rd row, its a hauling machine
02:11 GuShH if you crash, what does it turn into?
02:11 MrCurious it was new
02:11 GuShH and more importantly what do you turn into
02:11 MrCurious i got the last one from the sale
02:11 GuShH oh I see
02:11 MrCurious and i am fond of green
02:12 GuShH if I were to buy new I'd demand whatever color I want.
02:12 MrCurious which is probably why i let it fly instead of black
02:12 GuShH I wear green, but I don't like green on cars
02:12 GuShH specially the dark land rover green
02:12 GuShH (the old one)
02:13 GuShH deep green, metallic I do like.
02:13 GuShH but in that case you can't tell it's green right away
02:13 MrCurious i think it is a metalid darker green
02:14 darsie hi
02:15 MrCurious man that was a good episode of fallen skies
02:16 MrCurious have a good one GuShH i am off to bed
02:26 GuShH you too MrCurious
02:26 GuShH hi darsie
02:26 darsie hi GuShH
02:26 ShH wonders if a chicken sammich constitutes an actual sammich or if a sammich by definition contains no m
02:27 GuShH MrCurious this is the only mill I can find http://articulo.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-461218590-fresadora-vertical-de-banco-16mm-550w-monofasica-_JM it's very similar to yours in a way
02:28 GuShH however it costs almost 2k usd here
02:28 GuShH (see what I mean about no imports and not being able to buy tools)
02:29 RifRaf i could not imagine having a sandwich without meat
02:32 rsie is eco ve
02:37 GuShH darsie: what's that?
02:37 GuShH some made up shit to make you seem better than everyone else?
02:37 GuShH "I eat organic, I'm better than you!" no you are a retard wasting your money on the same crap everyone buys for a fraction of the cost.
02:38 darsie GuShH: vegan for ecological reasons. The animal industry produces a lot of green house gases, destroys rain forest to grow soy as animal food, overfishes seas, etc. But if it's no more harmful than vegan food I also eat animal producs, such as honey or wild animals which were not fed and are not endangered.
02:39 GuShH lawl
02:39 darsie Eating invasive species such as burmese pythons in Floridas everglades or camels in Australia is actually good, as they threaten or extinct native species.
02:39 GuShH you are still part of the problem and whatever you think you're doing won't change anything.
02:40 darsie I try to do my best.
02:40 GuShH but if it makes you feel better because in your head you are "superior" to the rest, go ahead with your own dilusions.
02:40 darsie Won't kill myself for it, though.
02:40 Hukka GuShH: How about calling other retards to make yourself feel superior?
02:40 GuShH every vegan person I've ever met were dilusional to some degree.
02:40 Hukka That work any better?
02:40 GuShH Call things by their name.
02:41 GuShH darsie can defend him or herself, he or she doesn't need a little bitch (oh I feel so superior now)
02:41 GuShH In fact I'm sky high in ego, soon it will displace all the air in your room and kill you.
02:41 GuShH Mwahaha
02:41 darsie GuShH: I didn't say I'm superion. I just don't want to destroy our planet. Everybody can make that decision, too.
02:42 orlok lol at stupid "organic" buzzwords
02:42 GuShH darsie: problem is it doesn't change a thing.
02:42 GuShH but feel free to eat grass.
02:42 darsie GuShH: It does, a little.
02:42 GuShH At the grand scale that's nothing
02:42 orlok like being classed as "organic" always makes things better
02:42 GuShH lol
02:42 orlok except when it makes them much much worse
02:43 GuShH cyanide is organic right?
02:43 darsie It would matter at the grand scale, if enough people acted responisbly. I don't have much hope, though. But I try to lead by example.
02:43 GuShH must have some for dessert.
02:43 orlok ie, organic mercury, organic chlorine
02:43 darsie 'organic' has several meanings.
02:43 GuShH so you are against felling trees for wood, heat, energy in general too? even if we replace every fallen tree by 3 or more plants?
02:44 darsie GuShH: Heating or generating power with wood is good, if it's done sustainably.
02:44 GuShH I've seen what happens to a cow when it enters and goes through the slaughter house, I still eat beef. Am I happy with how it was fed and treated?, not always but they were born for that particular purpose and no other.
02:44 darsie Better than using fossile energy.
02:45 GuShH darsie: it's still used by the trucks that move the wood.
02:45 GuShH and the chainsaws
02:45 darsie Cows produce too much methane, so I don't eat them.
02:45 Faek Didnt i read that wood smoke is carcinogenic ?
02:45 GuShH pfahahahahaha
02:45 GuShH as if not eating them would contribute to the cause
02:45 GuShH Faek: in theory everything is...
02:45 GuShH what about the liquid smoke they add on everything americans eat?
02:46 darsie GuShH: If we ate less or no cattle, there would be less cattle and less methane.
02:46 Faek I do not know what you are talking about as i am not american
02:46 GuShH and if we all loved each other, there wouldn't be a need for firearms!
02:46 GuShH darsie: the methane can be harnessed easily
02:46 GuShH secondary methane from their poopy.
02:46 darsie GuShH: I haven't seen that happen.
02:46 GuShH Not primary from their toots
02:46 darsie k, yes.
02:47 GuShH but you too generate methane.
02:47 darsie not much, in human farts.
02:47 GuShH I'm responsible in the sense that I don't eat you.
02:47 GuShH So I must be super green
02:48 GuShH All of this due to a chicken sammich, see what happens when you claim to be better than others?
02:48 darsie I'd eat humans, but vegans preferably.
02:48 GuShH If you didn't feel that way you wouldn't even mention you are "vegan" or whatever the hell you think you are
02:49 Faek I think GuShH is making far too big of a deal about this
02:49 GuShH Just eat whatever you want and don't impose it on others.
02:49 darsie The highe up in the food chain the more toxic the food is.
02:49 GuShH No, if I want to eat a chicken sammich I don't want to hear anything from a vegan.
02:49 GuShH So if that's the case and the vegan respects the non vegan, then the non vegan shall respect the vegan
02:49 darsie Plus, vegan food is healthy and avoids harming animal.
02:50 GuShH until then, the hell with whoever tries to impose it on us.
02:50 GuShH that's like imposing homosexuality on you because you are straight.
02:50 GuShH darsie: you don't know that.
02:50 GuShH it's not transported by magic either
02:50 darsie organic food has lower CO2 (equvalent) emissions, too.
02:51 GuShH in most cases what you refer to as organic produce is actually the labour of underpaid people who struggle on a daily basis and the produce is transported by the same type of truck that transports non organic food.
02:51 GuShH however in reality it's the same crap sold with a higher price.
02:51 GuShH often "selected"
02:52 GuShH fact... true organic food has less nutrients per unit of weight
02:53 GuShH seeds have already been egnineered to withstand most pests as to reduce the production cost.
02:53 darsie Recently I found a fish merchant, selling fish from a local lake. They grow CO2 neutral and are not endangered. I could eat them. But they are a little pricey. But that's affordable occasionally, if I want to.
02:54 GuShH co2 neutral?
02:54 darsie Yeah, plants grow, fish eat them. A CO2 neutral cycle.
02:54 darsie Plants consume CO2, fish exhale CO2.
02:54 GuShH so grass grows, cows eat them, a CO2 neutral cycle
02:55 GuShH you just forget the simple fact that transport is still using fossile fuels
02:55 GuShH as are the industries processing the food
02:55 GuShH just slicing the fish, gutting it and placing it on ice requires a lot of energy
02:55 GuShH you think the ice is generated by pedalling fairies?
02:56 darsie Cows are CO2 neutral, strictly, yes. But they produce methane in their guts and methane is a more potent green house gas than CO2 (22 times as much, IIRC) so they are CO2 *equvalent* positive.
02:56 ShH s
02:56 GuShH You are increasing your "carbon footprint" by being online every second.. you knew that right?
02:56 darsie There's fossil fuels used to grow plants, too. We're not all CO2 neutral, yet. I gotta live on something.
02:57 GuShH Do you wear potato sacks instead of regular clothing as well?
02:57 GuShH Since that would be greener than feeding the massive textile industry.
02:57 darsie Dunno what electrity they use here in the (un)employment course I'm in. At home I use Oekostrom.
02:57 GuShH Oh wait, someone has to make the sacks
02:58 darsie I wear mostly evil cotton.
02:58 darsie But much of it was given to me.
02:58 darsie second hand.
02:58 GuShH You should live off grid.
02:58 darsie I'm not good at buying clothes.
02:59 GuShH Me neither, but that's another story
02:59 GuShH I think you aren't good at it because you keep thinking about the CO2
02:59 GuShH I'm not good at it because I keep thinking they're screwing me over the price (I know how much everything costs in reality) so that makes it hard to "bend over" to them.
02:59 darsie Nah, I've been bad at buying clothes before I got ecologically conscious.
02:59 GuShH Why were you not born ecologically concious?
03:00 darsie It's not part of our genome.
03:00 GuShH Here's what I do, all of my organic waste goes to the land for compost.
03:00 GuShH I turn off the lights when I'm not using them.
03:00 darsie Good :).3
03:00 darsie -3
03:00 GuShH I've been thinking about turning all of the plastic waste into fuel, but the required energy to do so far exceeds what you get in return.
03:01 GuShH However I don't limit my diet like you do.
03:01 GuShH And I certainly don't think about it in the way you do.
03:01 GuShH I try to be efficient so I can save money, you try to be "efficient" by wasting it.
03:02 GuShH For instance I need to seal up a few windows because I'm loosing heat during the winter and that means more gas is used which means it costs more.
03:03 GuShH I'm not exactly sure where the gas is coming from, maybe fracking somewhere far away?, but that's no concern for me... for I try to use as little as possible so I don't have to keep feeding these assholes from the utility companies, so that's my reason for being efficient.
03:03 GuShH not to directly save the world or pretend to be doing so.... but to directly save money.
03:04 GuShH if in turn it means I'm doing something "good" then that's a plus, but that's not why I do it.
03:04 ShH slaps darsie around with a non organic t
03:05 darsie Was it fed with food that was grown with artificial fertilizers?
03:05 GuShH possibly, radioactive as well.
03:05 darsie 40-K is radioactive.
03:06 GuShH I have my own green garden.... but it doesn't yield any food.
03:06 GuShH I'm no gardner...
03:06 darsie I have a peach bonsai on my window sill.
03:06 GuShH everything sprouts but then it doesn't seem to do anything!
03:06 GuShH I bet if I used some fertilizer everything would grow in a couple weeks.
03:06 GuShH like magic.
03:07 GuShH maybe the soil everyone is using has been so soaked in those chemicals that is already very fertile.
03:07 GuShH I'm using "organic" compost and I get nothing in return.
03:07 darsie We get humus from our waste facilities, who turn compost to humus. Good for ferti0lizing.
03:07 darsie It's free there.
03:07 GuShH It's not strictly free
03:07 GuShH see if it's waste, it means I bought something first
03:08 darsie Well, we don't pay for it.
03:08 GuShH someone did
03:08 GuShH so egg shells, banana peels...
03:08 GuShH as long as it's produce, you've paid for it in weight
03:08 darsie People separate compost which is collected and turned into humus.
03:08 GuShH so it makes sense to compost it, at least it does to me.
03:08 GuShH most people here just throw everything together
03:09 darsie Garden waste from cutting trees/grass also goes into the compost.
03:09 GuShH I don't have a mulcher
03:09 GuShH can't do that
03:09 GuShH and if I had one, it would run off gasoline.
03:11 darsie There are interesting plants to grow for energy. miscanthus x giganteus, switch grass.
03:11 GuShH I could use grass clipppings for energy, but instead it's turned into compost.
03:12 GuShH too much work to spread it out so it can dry, not efficient.
03:12 darsie But the sun provides enough to produce our current energy demand as solar electrity.
03:12 GuShH not the way you think it would.
03:13 GuShH manufacturing the panels, lenses, etc. is not "green" per your defintiion
03:13 GuShH adhesives, wires, semiconductors, transport.
03:13 GuShH extruded aluminum, pvc, etc.
03:13 darsie I didn't define green.
03:13 darsie Still, it would be less harmful than burning fossil fuels.
03:14 GuShH I'm not sure
03:14 darsie And eventually we could become sustainable.
03:14 GuShH solar panels are not that efficient yet
03:14 GuShH and they don't last forever either
03:14 GuShH plus cost is the issue
03:15 darsie They create the energy required for their production in a few years.
03:15 GuShH energy cannot be created
03:15 GuShH nor destroyed
03:15 darsie yes
03:15 darsie you are right.
03:15 darsie The deliver it.
03:15 darsie they
03:15 GuShH I'd say it's converted
03:15 GuShH with losses.
03:16 darsie I like solar power towers.
03:16 darsie higher efficiency.
03:16 GuShH I like icecream
03:16 darsie I even like nuclear fusion plants.
03:16 darsie They are very compact.
03:16 darsie Don't waste much area/habitat.
03:17 GuShH until mother nature decides to have fun with them
03:17 darsie like what?
03:17 GuShH natural disaster
03:17 darsie go on :)
03:18 GuShH dl
03:18 GuShH do I have to?
03:19 GuShH earthquakes, tsunamis, etc. while not too common in those locations, it can happen and that's when nuclear turns dirty.
03:19 darsie The worst thing to happen might be that the lithium blanket breaks, contacts the water from a tsunami produces hydrogen which burns/explodes.
03:19 GuShH actually how the nuclear waste is disposed of is another issue
03:19 GuShH other than that, very clean and efficient.
03:19 darsie But then, the lithium is not radioactive.
03:19 darsie You don't have to, but I'd appreciate it.
03:20 GuShH mining of lithium is dirtier than most other mining!
03:20 darsie If you have a clue how fusion plants could become harmful.
03:20 GuShH the biggest or one of the biggest mines is in Chile, just a few KMs from here.
03:20 darsie hmm
03:20 darsie Uranium mining is very dirty.
03:21 GuShH Most mining is
03:21 darsie Gold mining sucks.
03:21 GuShH Even from the sewers?
03:21 darsie Gold from the sewers? Don't think that's economical.
03:21 GuShH it is in places like Japan
03:21 GuShH pays for some of their costs.
03:22 GuShH I find it amusing.
03:22 darsie Dunno how they do it, so I don't know how bad it is.
03:22 GuShH gold just sinks
03:22 darsie k
03:22 GuShH different metals will be at different levels
03:22 GuShH they can separate it rather easily
03:22 darsie cool
03:25 GuShH darsie: anyway the fusion with lithium still requires radioactive materials, whether they decay faster than uranium or others is irrelevant since what matters is how it's produced, used and kept / disposed of
03:26 GuShH sure it becomes relevant if the decay rate is much higher, but it's still a dangerous process
03:26 GuShH not that I've ever been near any of this...
03:26 GuShH I have no interest in it.
03:26 darsie The reactor in a fusion plant gets activated by neutrons. But I don't think it will leach much during a tsunami. Maybe in a fire. Then there's the tritium storage. That's dangerous, but it quickly spreads to harmless levels and has a very low biological half life.
03:27 GuShH Which is still higher than the average life of a regular cat
03:27 GuShH (I'd argue stray cats hardly reach 10-15 years!)
03:27 GuShH also, new stray cat at home.
03:30 darsie HTO has a short biological half-life in the human body of 7 to 14 days, which both reduces the total effects of single-incident ingestion and precludes long-term bioaccumulation of HTO from the environment.
03:31 GuShH how long have you been googling since I began to talk?
03:31 GuShH if I were to google I'd sound so much smarter.
03:31 darsie I didn't take time.
03:32 darsie That was an excerpt from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T2O, invoked directly, without google.
03:32 darsie I started to read on lithium mining, too.
03:33 GuShH Should I?
03:33 darsie dunno
03:33 GuShH I just know of a few horror stories involving lithium mining in Chile, that's all
03:33 GuShH I can't remember if Argentina has any big lithium mines or not
03:33 GuShH possibly undiscovered if not.
03:34 darsie Bolivia seems to have lots of lithium.
03:34 GuShH mining there can't be clean or healthy
03:34 darsie Where are you (from)?
03:35 GuShH The moon
03:35 darsie Very credible :).
03:35 GuShH Totally
03:35 GuShH You should see how everyone reacts when I tell them you're from planet earth!
03:36 darsie I imagine similar to when I do it.
03:36 GuShH Argentina.
03:37 darsie There was a big gold mine planned near Austria and there were protests. Dunno if they gonna do it.
03:37 darsie open pit. Distroys a lot of nature.
03:38 darsie We should first use the gold hoarded in vaults.
03:41 GuShH hmm
03:41 GuShH gold for what purpose?
03:42 GuShH industry or greed.
03:42 GuShH the electronics industry doesn't really use that much gold
03:42 GuShH compare to what rich housewives buy.
03:42 darsie industry, jewelry, investment.
03:44 GuShH darsie: like you don't own anything with gold
03:44 darsie I do.
03:45 darsie electronics. And I bought about 1 g gold sheet many years ago.
03:45 darsie Tried to buy gold leaf, but was defrauded.
03:45 GuShH :(
03:45 GuShH what was it?
03:45 darsie Got plastic foil with brass or so.
03:45 darsie ebay
03:45 GuShH oh like mylar
03:45 darsie yep
03:46 GuShH jeez
03:46 darsie At first I thought it was genuine and gave a positive feedback.
03:47 darsie I like self replicating space settling robots.
03:47 GuShH o.O
03:47 GuShH I like strawberries.
03:47 darsie I eat beans, corn, broccoli.
03:49 GuShH are you trying to blow the place up?
03:49 darsie By farting?
03:49 GuShH terrorist!
08:03 GuShH LOL http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8NqeD73ZZ4
08:41 MrCurious gush pretty mill
08:41 MrCurious looks like a sherline
08:41 MrCurious is it expensive?
08:47 GuShH MrCurious: 2k usd
08:47 GuShH and it's the same crap they sell for 500 bucks in the US
08:47 GuShH (pretty sure of it)
08:48 GuShH Looking at prices of alu stock... they list the sizes and weight by a certain length (1 meter) but they give you no calculator or easy way to build a BOM, so you gotta run all the numbers by hand... annoying, specially since they won't give you the prices until you send them the BOM
08:48 GuShH Also trying to figure out how to chuck a 200mm cylinder
08:48 MrCurious dang
08:49 GuShH I'm thinking the best way around this is to cast the parts instead of buying round stock
08:49 GuShH so I could cast a shoulder for the chuck
08:49 ShH s
08:49 GuShH I've only ever cast tiny pieces...
08:50 GuShH there's probably a trick I don't know (other than using a massive chuck)
08:50 GuShH I doubt I could drill and tap an "axle" in the middle and chuck that instead, not sure it would hold.
08:51 GuShH plus without a mill doing an accurate job on a heavy piece like that won't be doable
08:51 MrCurious do you have a vice for the lathe?
08:51 MrCurious to grip the stock
08:51 GuShH to use it as a mill? no
08:51 GuShH it comes with a 3 jaw chuck and a 4 independent jaw chuck
08:52 GuShH neither will accomodate 200mm
08:52 MrCurious to hold your 200mm cylinder
08:52 MrCurious solid aluminum ?
08:52 GuShH yeah
08:52 GuShH I need to machine a couple "caps"
08:52 MrCurious cant you just drill and tap a bolt into it to hold on to?
08:52 GuShH still thinking a cast would be the only way
08:53 MrCurious glue?
08:53 GuShH all the way through? I can only have a half an inch hole at a maximum, I was planning on using a 1/4 fitting in the center, but I could use 1/2 and step it down
08:53 MrCurious drill center holes, and use glue to hold it?
08:53 GuShH half inch on 200mm seems not too realistic, it would just strip the threads I think
08:53 MrCurious hmmm
08:54 GuShH I don't know off hand how to calculate the actual mass of the piece in alu, I should look that up
08:54 GuShH given the radius and length I should be able to come up with a figure
08:54 MrCurious ask the google :D do a picture search, receive inspiration(mana) from above
08:54 MrCurious or saw teh end of the stock to make a hex shape, chuck that
08:54 GuShH cast alu is so much cheaper than buying solid stock like that
08:54 GuShH it has to be cylindrical
08:55 MrCurious gonna guess home made aluminum will not have the same delightful properties of proper stock
08:55 MrCurious so once done, cut off the bit used to hold it
08:55 GuShH I cannot cut it like that, don't have the tools.
08:55 MrCurious no table saw?
08:55 GuShH if I had a mill I could bore it in and chuck using the reversed jaws
08:56 MrCurious oh good thinking
08:56 GuShH otoh tiny endmill + big radius = almost impossible without CNC
08:56 GuShH big endmill = expensive
08:56 GuShH and anyway, no mill here. so I'll keep thinking
08:56 MrCurious can you fit a sleeve over teh end of it
08:56 MrCurious half way on, and chuck inside the sleve?
08:56 GuShH doubtful
08:57 MrCurious i knopw...
08:57 MrCurious you have a sanding plate
08:57 MrCurious drill 4 or 5 holes in that, then drill, tap, and screw in 5 screws
08:57 MrCurious or bolts
08:58 GuShH 25mm length 200mm diameter = 2.12KG ouch
08:58 GuShH on 6000 series alloy
08:58 GuShH (cool calculator! http://www.aalco.co.uk/online-tools/weight-calculator/ )
08:58 GuShH I'm pretty sure the machinist handbook has all the math you'll ever need, but I couldn't be arsed.
08:59 MrCurious be a shame to waste the short cut the internet tempts you with
08:59 GuShH lol
09:00 MrCurious use the handbook after the apocolypse when you are powering eht mill with a foot petal because all electricity is not working
09:00 GuShH sounds like a plan
09:00 MrCurious that 6 hour adventure into not sleeping sucked
09:01 MrCurious for some reason my legs keep flipping between too hot and too cold
09:01 GuShH although I'd probably use the book to either kill someone or to set it on fire to cook said someone, if I'm drunk then in no particular order and I'll probably starve to death.
09:01 MrCurious resulting in a dancing-in-the-sheets effect
09:01 GuShH are you sure that wasn't just flatulence?
09:01 MrCurious 6 hours worth?
09:01 MrCurious i am not that big and inflatable...
09:03 GuShH someone might be
09:04 GuShH alu tubes are so much forgiving... 200mm length 160mm diameter, thickness 10mm = 2.54KG on 6000 series
09:05 MrCurious i need to go to the metal store and get more aluminum to power-ize
09:05 GuShH still, need the mighty caps. I even considered using stainless steel, but I can't source it from anywhere near
09:06 GuShH (stainless sheet, then just welding... would have to invest on a tig setup though)
09:06 MrCurious i too have considered moving from Al to steel just so it could be weilded
09:06 GuShH (I can stick weld just fine, although for cylinders you do need a jig)
09:06 MrCurious but steel is ugly and heavy
09:06 GuShH you can weld alu but not easily, certainly not with arc. it's a lie
09:07 MrCurious you need tig for Al?
09:07 GuShH and when you do weld alu, you need to anneal it at least
09:07 GuShH tig or mig works fine depending on what you're doing
09:07 GuShH I'd go for tig since that's what I know
09:07 MrCurious i think for this portion of life, i will accept drilling and tapping joints
09:07 GuShH lol, don't forget rivets.
09:08 GuShH they're great
09:08 GuShH I mostly fix steel stuff, I never actually built anything from scratch using steel
09:08 MrCurious rivots never struck me as stable or good enough to withstand much force
09:08 MrCurious and their rather ugly
09:08 GuShH meh!
09:08 MrCurious rather have tiny bolt/nut pairs
09:09 MrCurious this extrusion looks like it would be fun to have in 6' lengths
09:09 MrCurious http://www.epictinker.com/Makeblock-4WD-Robot-Kit-p/c4wdrk-gd.htm
09:09 MrCurious especially if pre-machined with holes
09:10 GuShH TIG would be ideal, but I can't invest on a TIG setup specially if I can't even source the stainless heh
09:10 MrCurious have now been pondering staying awake vs returning to sleep for 15 minutes
09:10 MrCurious i believe that means my thinking process is clowded. do not trust my words this session
09:10 GuShH makeblock...
09:11 MrCurious suppose if i had a working CNC, i could fab my own make block like stuff
09:11 GuShH I guess
09:11 GuShH you'd still have to tap all the holes
09:11 GuShH by hand
09:11 GuShH btw what's a SPECAIL nut?
09:12 GuShH bunch of dipshits can't even proof read their own shit. makecock.
09:12 GuShH if specail is a word I'll have sex with an arduino.
09:12 MrCurious specail
09:12 MrCurious i believe thats pronounced with a southern american accent
09:12 theBear i'd tap that, specail style !
09:12 MrCurious spay-shual
09:13 MrCurious put some spay-shual love into that task
09:14 MrCurious if you had access to a 2' pedo-bear static sticker, that could be safely applied to vehicles and removed... would it be fun to video tape friends faces as they go to work, and see the pedo bear on teh side of their car?
09:14 theBear i dunno, i can barely remember having friends, letalone ones with cars
09:15 MrCurious going to guess that while the sentence they will utter first will be divergent, it will universally contain at least one occurance of a specific word
09:15 GuShH lol
09:15 MrCurious if i stay up and feel like shit all day, then sleep should be easy tonight
09:15 MrCurious if i sleep now and feel better sleep will be painful tonight
09:16 MrCurious but, as i am up 2 hours before wake time... is there a solution that gives me SOME sleep without ruining tonights sleep
09:17 MrCurious hmmm, what i am doing is called typing... what i meant to do was called thinking...
09:18 MrCurious http://www.epictinker.com/v/vspfiles/photos/URK-GD-4T.jpg
09:18 MrCurious that plastic... i think its from a kids toy
09:18 MrCurious but i think it could be useful for building the fun stuff
09:26 ShH idly shrinks everything down to save c
09:26 rue_house http://eds.dyndns.org/~ircjunk/cut-n-nut/cut-n-nut.html
09:26 rue_house stuff with holes is really nice
09:27 eBear shrinks the kids to save on food c
09:27 GuShH what kids?
09:28 theBear exactly !
09:28 MrCurious dang
09:28 MrCurious this makes me remember that the metals store has large sheets of 6020? aluminum sheets 2 or 3mm thick with perferations
09:28 MrCurious i.e. cut-n-nut
09:29 theBear 6020 ? that sounds a bit hightech for something like that
09:29 GuShH most 6000 isnt though
09:29 GuShH 70xx is higher tech :p
09:30 GuShH I'd love to find something like that
09:30 GuShH although if the threads are formed by forcing the threaded rod through then if you consider the thickness of the material, it's not very strong.
09:30 MrCurious and the stamped holes will reduce the total weight
09:30 GuShH I'd rather rivet 2mm sheet
09:30 MrCurious making it cheeper to buy
09:31 MrCurious cut with sheers?
09:31 MrCurious no! cut with a table saw. neatness counts!
09:31 GuShH I cut alu with my mind
09:31 rue_house cut-n-nut comes with holes convenentially sized to fit machine screws thru :)
09:32 GuShH but it's a forced thread then
09:32 MrCurious or machine screwqs come in a variety of sizes to fit any holes you have handy :D
09:32 rue_house I did mine for #6
09:32 MrCurious so buy a tap and tap it proper
09:32 GuShH might as well not bother with the cut-n-nut bs
09:32 MrCurious and put a nut on teh other end, and it will be much stronger!
09:32 GuShH WHY EVEN BOTHER WITH IT THEN
09:33 rue_house cut-n-nut is an awesome product, did you get a knockoff?
09:33 GuShH the nut is heavy
09:33 GuShH defeats the purpose then
09:33 GuShH seriously.... maybe it's good for rapid prototyping
09:33 GuShH I can't see any other use
09:33 rue_house :)
09:33 GuShH could use delrim too
09:33 rue_house its FOR rapid prototyping!
09:34 GuShH rapid failing
09:34 MrCurious could use glue! its lighter
09:34 rue_house that page needs more about spacers and stuff
09:34 rue_house cut-n-nut comes in plaxiglass and lexan too
09:34 MrCurious bend with pliers... NO use a bending brake!
09:34 rue_house not many people have a break :/
09:34 MrCurious reminds me. i need to drill bolt holes in my bending brake so its easier to clamp
09:34 rue_house proper one anyhow :)
09:34 rue_house do you have a break?
09:35 MrCurious they are like $30 at harbor freight
09:35 rue_house oh, so its not a box break?
09:35 MrCurious get it on sale
09:35 MrCurious http://www.harborfreight.com/30-inch-bending-brake-67240.html
09:36 rue_house Only: $79.99
09:36 rue_house Sale: $62.99
09:36 MrCurious they have a variety of sales. this sale is a non-sale
09:37 rue_house bets they dont ship to canada for anything reasonable
09:37 MrCurious i imagine steel is drillable
09:37 MrCurious ROAD TRIP!
09:37 MrCurious come see america
09:37 rue_house its on my todo list
09:37 MrCurious just dont break teh rules
09:38 MrCurious the prisons suck
09:38 MrCurious australia has much more accomidating prisons
09:38 rue_house ok I have to run
09:39 MrCurious imagine this would work better for bending cut-n-nut
09:39 MrCurious http://www.harborfreight.com/18-inch-sheet-metal-folding-tool-96523.html
09:40 MrCurious and lower those eyes, stop staring at that...
09:41 rue_house heh
09:43 MrCurious oh wow. i used to love ordering from these guys as a kid... http://www.scientificsonline.com/
09:47 MrCurious if you were challenged to make a artistic, working, take on the idea of pandora's box. what would it be
09:47 MrCurious would the box be unclosable for a time period after opening while it lets out bad noises or smells or lights
09:50 MrCurious anyone have one of these for soldering? http://www.scientificsonline.com/edmund-stereomicroscope-with-fluorescent-ring-illumination.html
09:53 GuShH no
09:53 robotustra http://www.smartplanet.com/blog/smart-takes/uncanny-valley-when-robots-are-too-life-like-humans-dislike-them/17704
09:54 MrCurious DONT DATE ROBOTS!
09:58 GuShH o.o
09:58 GuShH well, now it's all down to realistic sizes... waiting on a quote
09:59 GuShH I actually wonder how accurately I can find the center of the round stock and drill it with a cheapie drill press, tap it and use a bolt to chuck it...
09:59 GuShH doing it by eye how much runout should I expect on a good day? heh
10:00 MrCurious got a calipur?
10:00 GuShH sure
10:01 MrCurious or a a marking jig that scratches
10:01 GuShH if I lower the cutting speed I should expect the threads to hold until the "shoulder" has been turned to mount it on the chuck properly
10:01 MrCurious use that to mark center
10:01 GuShH 1/2" bolt though
10:01 MrCurious use locktight to secure the bolt
10:01 GuShH this is equivalent to 1KG of aluminum (2.2pound)
10:01 GuShH no, I'd need to remove it later easily
10:01 MrCurious then again, removal could be treacherous then...
10:01 GuShH red locktite would require a torch :p
10:02 GuShH I still think I should cast this.
10:02 MrCurious free it with FIRE!
10:02 GuShH but you don't want to mess with the alloy
10:16 theBear use geometry, compass or something
10:19 GuShH theBear: I know the how, I just don't know the how-good
10:20 GuShH it's important because if I start with 178mm stock I don't want to end with 170 or less due to the runout of the center hole.
10:20 theBear if you know exactly set the compass to half that and do 2 or more arcs, should be damned close
10:22 GuShH because if I design for a bigger stock, the price goes way up
10:22 GuShH but that would allow me to deviate as much as I want
10:23 theBear heh deviant
10:25 GuShH bah this is when a drink can help...
10:27 theBear pfft, stop wavering
10:27 theBear be a man not a moose
10:27 GuShH o,o
10:36 GuShH theBear: if drinking makes you such a man... will you remove the asbestos insulation from the furnace water tank for a box of wine? heh
13:28 theBear box wine doesn't count as drinking
13:29 GuShH theBear: a box of wine, not box wine
13:30 GuShH contains 6 bottles of your favorite grapey substance
14:15 MrCurious hahahaha
14:16 MrCurious knock knock, who's there, George Zimmerman. George Zimmerman who? good, your on the jury
14:18 MrCurious the prosecutor said that... jumping lead balloons batman
15:58 GuShH MrCurious: yey, tomorrow morning I'll be receiving the lathe!
15:59 GuShH problem is, I'll have to help get it off the truck, it seems they only employ one guy for the deliveries... (wtf?)
16:01 LoRez why would they employ more than one?
16:01 LoRez per truck?
16:02 ace4016 two man lift?
16:04 GuShH So the client doesn't have to move around a 140KG box by himself?
16:04 GuShH I don't own a forklift.
16:04 GuShH Up to 90-95KG I'm ok, can't handle more than that when the bulk is too big.
16:05 GuShH Anyway that's only one little issue compared to where am I going to put it
16:13 MrCurious GuShH: sweet! go get a haircut and plan some short sleeved tight fitting clothing
16:13 MrCurious and take off your bling so you dont kill yourself
16:13 GuShH lol
16:13 GuShH I don't wear any bling
16:13 GuShH whatsoever..
16:13 GuShH not even a watch.
16:14 GuShH as for the hair, it's rather short and for the clothing, tight fitting is for faggets.
16:14 MrCurious only cave men wear watches in the age of the cell phone
16:14 GuShH and hipsters.
16:14 GuShH well that's the reason why I don't wear a watch
16:14 MrCurious well your no hipster!
16:14 GuShH sigh why is that mill so expensive here
16:14 GuShH I called and it doesn't even come with a single endmill
16:14 GuShH nothing.
16:14 GuShH not even a flycutter or anything but a cheap jacobs chuck
16:14 MrCurious i imagine the govt owns 50% of the patent on the machine?
16:15 GuShH more like someone buys it at harborfreight for 500 bucks, brings it illegally (somehow) and sells it to some random dude with a store who in turn resells it.
16:15 MrCurious my mill didnt either
16:15 GuShH so that's how it ends up at 2k
16:15 MrCurious and thats why we have ebay!
16:15 GuShH I argue it should at least come with a single twist bit for the price of 2k usd.
16:15 MrCurious if its 2k us
16:15 MrCurious buy a ticket to america
16:15 MrCurious buy one
16:16 MrCurious ship it back UPS/DHL slow
16:16 GuShH max dutyfree is like 300 usd
16:16 MrCurious and return to wait for it
16:16 GuShH I think the roundtrip costs more than 2k
16:16 MrCurious maybe its time to move to a more progressive part of the world
16:16 GuShH also don't I need an up to date visa? mine expired a few years ago
16:16 MrCurious better to move before you get lots of tools
16:16 GuShH actually 10 years ago now.
16:16 MrCurious i hear Brazil is very nice and progressive
16:17 GuShH I already own too much shit
16:17 MrCurious and the womenish folk are very easy
16:17 GuShH no thanks
16:17 MrCurious some of the women there come with kick-stands
16:17 GuShH the lathe is just an investment I can always resell it
16:17 GuShH in fact the wood lathe I got for half the retail price...
16:17 GuShH yeah tripod women.
16:18 GuShH woo...men.
16:18 GuShH let's get a quote to some part of the US to prove my point
16:18 GuShH where, florida, new york...?
16:18 MrCurious hello Amanda
16:18 MrCurious A MAN DUH!
16:18 GuShH not san francisco, although I always wanted to visit
16:19 MrCurious now i have excercized my inner austin powers i can be serious for a while
16:19 GuShH but I hear it's full of hipsters and such
16:19 MrCurious SF is nice, but its uphill in both directions
16:19 GuShH but cali in general is nuts, at least the laws...
16:19 GuShH or whatever they want to call 'em
16:20 MrCurious the laws here seem lax
16:20 MrCurious i have had no hastle from cops but 1 illegal left turn directly in front of a cop down town
16:20 GuShH 349 hotels found in san francisco, let's see the flights...
16:20 GuShH oh shit it's in local currency and contains 5 total digits
16:20 GuShH (the cost of the lathe)
16:21 GuShH I told you!
16:21 GuShH there's even a gay looking character that shows up while the ajax does it's thang http://www.despegar.com.ar/shop/flights/results/roundtrip/BUE/SFO/2013-06-26/2013-06-28/1/0/0
16:21 GuShH oh wait, with taxes it costs even more than the lathe.
16:21 MrCurious very
16:21 MrCurious LOL
16:21 GuShH oh and I forgot to mention...
16:21 MrCurious 5 digits
16:21 GuShH I can't buy US currency
16:22 MrCurious uhm, are argentina and USA enemies?
16:22 GuShH I would need a highly stable job to even be allowed to buy currency for travel
16:22 GuShH and even so they may only award me with something ridiculous like 100 bucks a day
16:22 GuShH I shit you not.
16:22 MrCurious does argentina have a problem with people ESCAPING AT THE FIRST CHANCE?
16:22 GuShH I don't think we're enemies, it's just the crazy whore in charge that enjoys ruining everyone's lives.
16:23 MrCurious escape to BRAZIL, then to america
16:23 GuShH I told you I even had my US visa and all...
16:23 MrCurious if you dont go post-surgery....
16:23 GuShH ha
16:23 GuShH they do that in Chile as well
16:23 GuShH they're famous for it
16:23 MrCurious erm post-operative!
16:23 GuShH It might be cheaper to get the tools from Chile actually
16:23 GuShH oh, see what I did?
16:24 GuShH but in reality you'd lose your tool in Chile, ha.
16:24 MrCurious now you have me imagining a short brown ahem woman teaching lathe...
16:24 MrCurious i think you have found your calling!
16:24 GuShH Turning sausage on the lathe PT1/4
16:24 GuShH YouTube here I come
16:24 MrCurious so it comes tomorrow
16:24 MrCurious you should go out and get stock enough to make 50 baseball bats / trunchents
16:25 GuShH So in official exchange rate that's about 2600 USD for the roundtrip alone no
16:25 GuShH ...not accounting for anything else
16:25 GuShH such as the hotel.
16:25 MrCurious yeah, i dont know seeing it here is worth that
16:26 MrCurious unless you are really into the SF scene...
16:26 MrCurious *wink*
16:26 GuShH ew Delta airlines
16:26 GuShH I always wanted some sour bread shaped like an alligator
16:27 GuShH damn that's not even in biz class
16:27 MrCurious http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v644/Springbok747/FunnyImage.jpg
16:27 GuShH this has turned into Cuba
16:27 GuShH or worse.
16:27 GuShH let's see how much it would cost me to meet Dave and kick him in the head.
16:27 MrCurious hmmm
16:28 MrCurious bet this is in Cali...
16:28 MrCurious http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_D_Z-D2tzi14/S2yopma22EI/AAAAAAAABlk/LijHmYjHJU4/s400/yogapenis.jpg
16:28 GuShH let's see brisbane... no flights...
16:29 GuShH no clue where he's at, this was simply meant as a funny exercise.
16:29 GuShH he's not worth the trip.
16:30 MrCurious so
16:30 MrCurious you have some stock and tools ready for the lathe?
16:30 GuShH oh, to Perth it would cost me 3.3k
16:30 MrCurious though it will likely take a day or 2 to set it up
16:30 MrCurious and a week to tune it
16:30 GuShH maybe I should start one of those kickstarters
16:30 GuShH help me fund a beating
16:31 GuShH should use theBear's picture instead of mine, it would look more realistic then
16:31 MrCurious Bomb Defusing Sloth... http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/uXAsgqRW6_k/hqdefault.jpg does that only make ME laugh?
16:32 GuShH so there's 946 bucks in taxes,plus a new resolution that costs you 476 bucks... plus "extra charges" (not explained) for 255 bucks... the actual ticket is 1695 but you end up paying 3372, wtf.
16:32 GuShH heh
16:32 MrCurious hmmm
16:32 GuShH who says slow doesn't win the race
16:32 MrCurious do they at least feel you up good in teh airport?
16:33 MrCurious if not its not worth it!
16:33 GuShH not like the TSA does
16:33 GuShH Yeah I'd be like "waaaait a minute, where are all the anal probes at? I DEMAND ANAL PROBING NAO"
16:34 GuShH I'd be wiggling my arse while yelling ALLAHU AKBAR in the meantime.
16:34 Curious imagines gushi in the airport pointing at the chap ahead of him and saying "he is smuggling drugs inside
16:34 GuShH If I had a reason to believe it, I'd do it.
16:34 MrCurious gonna make his vacation MEMORABLE!
16:35 GuShH "he's too fat, must be smuggling dope"
16:35 GuShH what happens if you point out everyone, do you get away with the actual drugs you are smuggling?
16:35 GuShH also for the amount they pay you, I wouldn't even consider it...
16:35 GuShH at the risk of death or prison, not worth it.
16:36 MrCurious suppose if you were big enough... you could smuggle a lathe...
16:36 MrCurious or a bunch of.... ENDMILLS
16:36 GuShH recently they've found a dead pig stuffed with drugs
16:36 GuShH they even had the patience to stitch it all up
16:37 GuShH but they had the stupidity to carry it in their luggage.
16:37 ShH g
16:37 GuShH who on earth travels with a dead pig inside their luggage??
16:38 GuShH I think the pros are smuggling all sorts of goods through the river / sea....
16:38 GuShH I don't own a boat, so...
16:38 MrCurious that sounds like a planned-fall to make the paid police seem effective
16:38 ShH would probably get caught before he even steps into the
16:38 MrCurious gotta head off to the doctors
16:39 MrCurious find out whats wrong with my legs
16:39 GuShH restless legs syndrome
16:39 GuShH you'll get a pot license.
16:43 GuShH Bah the big metallurgy supplier won't even answer my emails... or the phone.
16:43 GuShH how am I supposed to get bits for the lathe?
16:45 GuShH MrCurious: this is neat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNajMA4I20A I've only known about using the dial indicator or reversing to thread, not to manually index like that
16:46 GuShH pretty neat trick, makes sense actually
17:23 MrCurious thats HUGE
17:24 MrCurious self threading!
17:24 MrCurious man i need that
18:25 MrCurious you ever find a hornets nest in a tree, and paint it like a pinyatta
18:39 MrCurious when life gives you lemons...
18:39 MrCurious make lemon aid...
18:39 MrCurious it pisses off the guy handing out the lemons
18:43 Aivaras Guys, can stepper motor be used as precisely as servo for movements control?
18:43 MrCurious it can be much more precise
18:43 MrCurious especially if you use gears to gear it down
18:44 MrCurious however, unlike a servo, it has no feedback on if the step was registered, or if the motor was overpowered and moved to a new position
18:44 Aivaras damn. Then it is a bad thing.
18:44 MrCurious nah, encoder disks/hall sensors are cheap
18:44 MrCurious and easy
19:45 rue_house is there a guy in here that works at a aompany that makes controllers for brushless mtoors?
19:46 Tom_itx do you need one?
21:27 rue_house na, I just have indepth questions
21:28 Tom_itx then you should ask on linuxcnc
21:28 Tom_itx i'm betting they can help
21:28 rue_house ah
22:32 MrCurious i took some pics of my extruder axis build and my cnc axis build. feel free to mock. http://www.flickr.com/photos/89612859@N04/sets/72157634316119864/
22:47 RifRaf MrCurious is that gonna be your 3d printer or a different cnc
22:48 MrCurious the 2x3 aluminum extrusion axis is for extruder following eventorbot style design
22:48 MrCurious the big one with huge rods is for CNC Z axis
22:49 RifRaf k
22:49 RifRaf is looking great
23:28 MrCurious MPJA.com has some cheap sterppers on sale today
23:28 MrCurious i accadentally ordered 8 :D
23:47 MrCurious woo hoo! found chocolate
23:47 MrCurious hmm, i hope that was chocolate