#robotics Logs
Jun 22 2013
#robotics Calendar
00:12 Jak_o_Android Yeah.
00:14 GuShH rue_house: or a rock
00:14 GuShH ...your hands alone too
00:15 GuShH I'm just saying, it annoys me.
00:15 rue_house todays ebay item was an led that alternates red/blue
00:15 rue_house flashing...
00:15 rue_house OOOoooOooo..
00:15 GuShH see if anyone will buy a lathe just to make a silencer, when you can buy it either legally or ilegally for a lot less than the lathe costs
00:15 GuShH heh
00:15 rue_house maybe I dont like commercial silencers
00:15 GuShH shit man, don't be buying end caps and pipe at the hardware store either
00:16 GuShH they'll think you are about to blow a building down.
00:16 rue_house or maybe I just like the serial number 1
00:16 GuShH heh why would you even need a serial number on a home-made silencer
00:16 rue_house ITS 1 HOW COULD YOU NOT!
00:16 GuShH lol
00:17 GuShH 00000001
00:17 GuShH I'd rather get 00001337
00:17 rue_house ok I have to work out an electric motor for a truck
00:17 GuShH or 00000666
00:17 rue_house heh
00:17 GuShH truck?
00:17 rue_house I think I'm about to get an S10 truck
00:18 GuShH neat, what vintage? heh
00:18 GuShH I almost got an old one once
00:18 GuShH but the frame was crooked
00:18 rue_house 1993
00:18 GuShH dude argued it wasn't a 2010 and I should get lost
00:18 GuShH yeah it was around that old
00:18 GuShH ...I argue if you take good care of things it doesn't have to be new, it could be 80 years old and still be in good shape
00:18 GuShH bah, most used cars around here are destroyed.
00:18 rue_house yea
00:19 rue_house hmm
00:19 GuShH or have been "manipulated" by "mechanics"
00:19 GuShH like everything I've ever serviced, it was always made worse by whoever touched it after it went bad
00:19 GuShH and it cost them more because of it.
00:19 rue_house they had to get going on the next one
00:20 rue_house http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/455690067/10KW_48_120V_electric_car_motor.html
00:20 rue_house shoud I shoot for 80hp continious or is that crazy
00:20 GuShH so it was an ORANGE coloured S10, pictures taken by the entrance of his property where there was a tiny incline, so you couldn't tell the chassis was all bent up lol
00:20 GuShH rue_house: is it a lot heavier than your other option?
00:21 rue_house its probably a bit heavier than my orig truck
00:21 rue_house its an extended cab, mine isn't
00:21 rue_house I dont know how much power I actually use driving
00:21 GuShH I wonder if you can easily measue that
00:21 GuShH measure*
00:22 rue_house not without a realtime drive shaft torque
00:22 GuShH maybe by knowing the power curves and measuring intake
00:22 GuShH you could then get an estimate
00:22 rue_house yea, that might approximate it
00:22 rue_house but its an old engine
00:22 rue_house hmm
00:23 GuShH I bet you could rebuild it and it would last another 20 years
00:23 rue_house its got an automatic transmission right now
00:23 GuShH is it a diesel?
00:23 rue_house I'd bet, there is a hydraulic pressure somewhere equiv to the torque
00:23 rue_house gas
00:23 GuShH bah
00:23 ShH likes di
00:23 rue_house if it was diesel I wouldn't be converting it
00:23 GuShH except for turbo diesels and them running away.
00:24 rue_house easy just have an EM gas shutoff and something to choke it with
00:24 GuShH right, the one I almost got was diesel, but like I said it would've been too expensive to get her fixed
00:24 GuShH I wonder why they don't all have a servo to choke it
00:24 GuShH aside from cost
00:24 rue_house I think trucks should be services, just lok at how many man-hours go into making them
00:25 rue_house cars are just stupid and shouldn't exist
00:25 GuShH my brother's jetta has a servo mechanism on the intake but I'm not sure if it's for that sort of safety or to just prevent crap from getting in when it's off
00:25 GuShH actually now I can't remember exactly how it is, maybe it was just spring loaded but something had to push it out...
00:26 rue_house I'm wondering if I should build a motor for the truck
00:26 GuShH rue_house: trucks, vans, etc... they cost a lot more here in argentina... and even the insurance costs more
00:26 rue_house someone here was versed in brushless airplane motors
00:26 GuShH it should be the other way around!!
00:26 GuShH if it's a utility vehicle you shouldn't have to pay more
00:26 GuShH it should be cheaper.
00:26 rue_house those little electric airplane motors must have more kick/kg than any other motor
00:27 GuShH but they fall in a pseudo professional category and they charge you for it
00:27 GuShH but they are tiny
00:27 rue_house LOTS of them
00:27 GuShH and without the airflow they cook up
00:27 GuShH THEY COOK UP!
00:27 rue_house ganged and severly geared down
00:27 GuShH then it's all a big cock-up
00:29 GuShH wtf? http://articulo.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-464235100-herramientas-para-motos-destornillador-a-90para-carburador-_JM
00:29 GuShH 100 dollars for that piece of shit, is it even ratcheting... why would anyone want to buy one of those let alone make it
00:30 GuShH you can just grab a cheapie T holder, bend it... and be done with it, or just buy a 90° one
00:30 GuShH they even make short stubby screwdrivers that would fit in that bike
00:30 ShH doesn't know why this thing exists, maybe someone else doe
00:30 GuShH it says to adjust carb low side... you don't need to torque that, why would you need such a long handle
00:31 GuShH plus it's alu
00:31 Jak_o_Shadows rue_house: was it Triffid_Hunter?
00:31 GuShH rue_house: just buy the drivers for the brushless motors... way cheaper
00:33 rue_house I'm looking for 80Hp, from 72 to 600vdc, 100A or under, for $2000 or under
00:33 rue_house 5000 rpm / 167Nm torque
00:33 rue_house ish
00:34 GuShH are you going to use the actual transmission?
00:34 GuShH will have to carefully control the torque...
00:34 GuShH it wouldn't be hard to strip it heh
00:35 GuShH was it the Tesla that had issues with the original trans?
00:35 GuShH and some e-bike too
00:36 rue_house thats within what the orig engine specs are
00:36 GuShH yeah but the electric motor has a different power curve
00:36 GuShH it could be so instantaneous that it would simply strip the clutches or worse
00:36 rue_house yup
00:37 rue_house which is why I'm kinda lost
00:37 GuShH but that's why a good controller is required
00:37 GuShH to mimic what the gas engine would do, in a way
00:37 rue_house http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/858148378/High_Quality_Red_1580_RPM_V.html?s=p
00:37 GuShH it seems they baby the gears up until a certain point
00:37 GuShH on these e-bikes and cars
00:38 rue_house $2000 would buy, up to 294 of those
00:38 GuShH rue_house: how would you gang them up?
00:38 GuShH so add the cost of ganging
00:38 GuShH reminds me of the chainsaw motorcycle
00:39 GuShH which I've never seen running on any video, that is rolling on it's own power... just idling
00:39 GuShH heh
00:39 rue_house 16A * 18V...
00:39 GuShH how is regen braking actually applied? direct drive?
00:39 rue_house it would take about 207 of them ganged to = 80hp
00:40 GuShH remember those specs are chinese specs
00:40 rue_house ... so far this works
00:40 GuShH divide by two for a real number
00:40 GuShH if you buy 500 you get a "high discount"
00:40 Jak_o_Shadows With regenerative breaking, you need to take the energy out of the car very quickly, to brake properly, then you'd use a generator/(w/e) to get power out?
00:40 rue_house that was the continious current rating
00:41 GuShH I thought you just disingaged the motor/s and let them load up the cells
00:41 GuShH said load would slow down the shafts
00:41 GuShH but if it's more involved than that, I wouldn't even consider it
00:41 rue_house they are 1.58k/v
00:41 Jak_o_Shadows You could pull a fair amount of power out when not breaking hard.
00:41 rue_house 18V
00:41 Jak_o_Shadows Then kick in normal brakes.
00:41 Jak_o_Shadows braking*
00:42 rue_house 28.4k rpm
00:42 GuShH well if it's setup like I think it is, then it brakes on it's own due to the resistance from the load
00:42 rue_house enigne is 5000rpm
00:42 rue_house 5.6:1
00:42 GuShH try it with a stepper, short the windings and try to turn it over by hand, much harder than no load
00:42 rue_house it would sound like a jetengine
00:43 GuShH rue_house: sounds like you'll be spending several months even years to get this thing going
00:43 rue_house that would be worth it right there
00:43 GuShH and more money than you originally thought you'd spend on it :p
00:43 GuShH Match: For iPad Mini
00:43 GuShH wtf?
00:43 rue_house 40hp motor, North America: $6000
00:43 GuShH I wouldn't be buying a brushless motor from them... what's the ipad mini got to do with it
00:43 rue_house oh and thats 40hp peak, continious is about 15hp
00:44 GuShH if you've got the right cooling you can always push 'em a bit
00:44 GuShH cooling on cells and motor
00:44 GuShH which is rather important
00:44 GuShH actually not just cooling, heating as well for winter
00:44 rue_house 200 of them
00:44 rue_house hmm
00:44 GuShH but are you going to end up using lead acid or lithium?
00:45 GuShH it's not as trivial as it sounds with lithium cells / banks
00:45 rue_house if the lithium AA's work out, I'll use them
00:45 Jak_o_Shadows Yeah, but there's a limit to how much that sort of breaking has.
00:45 rue_house about 1500 of them iirc
00:45 GuShH Jak_o_Shadows: for city use or for entering corners at the highway it works great
00:45 rue_house heh, aggratate current would be crazy
00:45 GuShH instead of throwing the energy as heat you just repurpose it
00:45 rue_house 200*16
00:46 rue_house 3200A
00:46 rue_house hahah
00:46 GuShH how legal is it to drive a diy electric vehicle in the US?
00:46 GuShH I doubt it's legal here
00:46 Jak_o_Shadows Yeah, but what if some jerk cuts you off? You'd need another system for that?
00:46 GuShH since registration involves the engine block
00:46 GuShH Jak_o_Shadows: naturally!
00:46 GuShH drum or discs
00:47 rue_house there are a LOT of shops doing conversions and conversion kits
00:47 GuShH and a potato launcher on the roof, for revenge.
00:47 rue_house its legal
00:47 GuShH so many wrong things are legal in the US... and so many right things are illegal
00:47 Jak_o_Shadows Potato Launcher? Why not a 3D printed bazooka?
00:47 GuShH I just can't fully wrap my head around it
00:47 rue_house how the heck does one arrgregate 200 motors...
00:48 GuShH lots of tiny gears!
00:48 GuShH I'm sure there's a clever way
00:48 GuShH but it's the differential power of each unit that throws me off
00:48 rue_house you know, at the torque/motor, the pinions could prolly be plastic
00:48 GuShH you'd need some sort of clutching mechanism for each, or some other system I'm not aware of
00:48 rue_house just run them all the same speed
00:49 GuShH it was rather hard to picture it with 2 stroke engines all ganged up
00:49 GuShH like on that chainsaw bike
00:49 GuShH they don't really run all at the same speed
00:49 rue_house the torque will sort them out
00:49 GuShH you might use PID on each
00:49 GuShH rue_house: I don't know... look what happens when a cylinder quits firing on a 4 cyl
00:50 GuShH or if it misfires
00:50 rue_house it smokes a lot
00:50 GuShH whole thing turns into a cocktail maker
00:50 GuShH (that's due to imbalance) but you also lose power, efficiency / fuel, etc...
00:52 GuShH I wonder if the machinists handbook has anything to say about this
00:52 rue_house http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Brand-New-hobbymate-1200Kv-brushless-motor-for-rc-airplane-model/642774486.html
00:52 rue_house 290W
00:54 GuShH rue_house: will it be as inefficient as your mower bots?
00:55 ShH runs
00:55 rue_house they are over 90% eff ea
00:56 rue_house http://www.aliexpress.com/item/KV3800-6V-15V-Brushless-Motor-Model-airplane-For-450-RC-Helicopter-Hobbies-ESC/654843466.html
00:56 rue_house ! only $792 to make 80hp with those!
00:56 rue_house (132 of them)
00:59 GuShH I want to see the space it takes to gang 130 of them
00:59 GuShH and the time involved and all the wiring
00:59 GuShH ...and extra parts
01:00 rue_house 57krpm
01:00 rue_house 11.4:1
01:00 Jak_o_Shadows On the other hand, you could make a lot of planes
01:00 GuShH lol
01:00 GuShH tie them all together and fly yourself to the grocery store
01:01 Jak_o_Shadows or an 800-copter
01:01 GuShH lay off the peyote!!
01:01 rue_house I think controllers bust my price, but they have their own budget
01:12 GuShH rue_house: I think you've finally gone coo-coo
01:13 Faek I find this conversation entertaining
01:14 MrCurious i wish someone here was making a 15' tall bipedal bot. that would be a fun build to watch
01:15 rue_house mines actaully 12'
01:15 rue_house this is the summer I HAVE to get the rings bent
01:20 MrCurious you have a 12' robot with nipple rings!
01:20 MrCurious thats extreme!
01:20 GuShH o.O
01:21 MrCurious did i mis-understand?
01:26 Faek That was my interpretation as well MrCurious, fear not for your sanity
01:45 GuShH Faek: it could well be you are both messed up though
01:46 Faek What are the chances of two of us being messed up thouh?
01:47 MrCurious i dont know which is more intriguing... robotic nipple rings.. or robotic nipples...
01:48 GuShH Faek: if you are both american, 99%
01:48 GuShH that is, not uncommon at all.
01:48 Faek Sadly for that statistic i am not american
01:49 MrCurious english born, does that count?
01:49 GuShH bollocks
01:49 MrCurious smeghead
01:49 GuShH oi
01:49 GuShH don't be such a wanker
01:49 MrCurious you taking the piss mate?
01:49 MrCurious sling your hook
01:49 GuShH aye
01:49 Jak_o_Shadows filthy pom
01:49 GuShH cheers
01:50 Faek (~~)
01:50 MrCurious its a fin brit moonlit nit to nit
01:50 GuShH cup o tea?
01:51 MrCurious fancy a cuppah
01:51 GuShH lovely!
02:12 MrCurious ta
02:14 RifRaf http://tinyurl.com/repraphangout
02:16 MrCurious i dont hear nuttin
02:17 RifRaf no sound
02:17 Jak_o_Shadows camera mounted on it?
02:18 RifRaf yep
02:18 RifRaf been trying to print this all day
02:48 MrCurious finally some success
03:16 GuShH MrCurious: with?
03:18 MrCurious installing cyanogenmod on my galaxy tab2 10.1
03:18 MrCurious a 2 day battle that could have been solved much faster by reading the decorative text more carefully
03:20 GuShH speaking of carefully... gotta take a solenoid valve apart, it's leaking...
03:22 MrCurious with a little luck i will have play store shortly
03:27 MrCurious crosses fingers
03:27 MrCurious so far this rom is way better than the stock android
03:28 MrCurious sweet success
03:53 ShH takes MrCurious' ta
04:33 Jak_o_Android ebay time. Suggestions?
04:39 GuShH russian girlfriend
04:44 Jak_o_Shadows1 Also looking at ali-express
04:44 GuShH chinese girlfriend
04:44 Jak_o_Shadows1 lol
04:44 GuShH https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3c0iwFgORo
04:45 GuShH everyone swears by southbend precision and look at those crooked holes
04:55 GuShH cool http://www.ebay.com/itm/Digital-Probe-Indicator-Dial-Test-Gauge-25-4-0-01mm-1-/130687355233?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e6d92c961
04:55 GuShH I can see how it's easier to read, but depending on cells is a bit wanky
04:56 Faek Chocolate
07:55 Skwint http://www.seas.harvard.edu/news/2013/06/printing-tiny-batteries
07:55 Skwint apologies if that's old news ...
09:19 theBear hehe, someone actually started a thread to RECOMMEND what is done VERY poorly in this picture http://fs03.androidpit.info/userfiles/417560/image/2011-09-25%2019_06_44111.jpg ! kids these days
11:22 rue_house theBear, whats that shorting out?
11:23 rue_house the battery connector?
11:24 rue_house on the printed battery thing, they could use some advise from the reprap community
12:45 GuShH theBear: the hell is that "fix"
12:45 GuShH looks like 1.5mm mains wire
12:45 GuShH or 2mm cheapie
12:46 GuShH I can only guess it's a shitty attempt for an antenna
12:47 GuShH but if it were for gps that seems to be the wrong size
12:47 GuShH ie length
12:47 GuShH unless my sense of scale is wrong
13:01 GuShH bah another dead cfl...
13:01 GuShH main cap measures < 10nF and it's rated 4uF, most of the smt resistors have arced through
13:01 GuShH stupid insects
13:07 GuShH http://gushh.net/tmp/dscn3650f.jpg bah it's pure chroma aberration, but you get the idea... I hate smt in this regard, can't tell he original value after this happens!
13:08 GuShH the top carbonizes and becomes highly conductive
13:10 GuShH (when things go bang you must analyze why it happened!)
13:10 GuShH turns out bugs collected on the inside and covered up the convection path
13:11 GuShH cap cooks, throws the circuit off, resistors overheat, they carbonize... in the end the fuse opens and you ain't got no light no more.
14:19 rue_house sounds like a compact flourescent
14:27 theBear well yeah, the original antenna was a straight copper strip mounted on the plastic cover between the two sprung (and now destroyed) contacts :)
14:37 theBear and on that note, fuckit ! i gotta undo 3 whole screws and uncrack the back of MY fone and do something about the gps antenna blatantly disconnecting :-( i suspect the 3rdparty high capacity and TINY (like a sticker worth) bit thicker battery is making the ultra-thin-fancy-metal cover lift the contacts
14:38 theBear but with the rubbery cover on it just doesn't wanna squeeze easy enough for practical use
14:39 theBear and no, there isn't a sticker i can remove :(
22:53 codepython777 I need to design/build an automatic book page flipper. Has anyone here ever done that?
22:54 Jak_o_Shadows1 Never done it, but i've seen a little bit about them.
22:55 codepython777 Jak_o_Shadows1: I'd like to design build a simple one, as simple as possible
22:56 codepython777 Jak_o_Shadows1: most i see seem complicated
22:57 Jak_o_Shadows1 I wonder if you could use static electricity to flip the pages
22:57 Jak_o_Shadows1 or, you know, HV
22:57 codepython777 whats hv?
22:57 codepython777 how do laser printers pull one page at a time?
22:58 Jak_o_Shadows1 high voltage. Um, i don't know
23:42 codepython777 Jak_o_Shadows1: Any ideas who might be a good person to talk to about this?
23:58 codepython777 anyone can help me with the design of a page turning for books?
23:59 ace4016 you can charge the sheet and stick it to plastic, or you can use rollers like printers use