#robotics Logs
Mar 10 2013
#robotics Calendar
00:00 theBear in his belly ?
00:00 theBear hi belly ?
00:00 pheren hides in the corner, afraid of the n
00:00 GuShh3 hill billy?
00:00 theBear you're scaring him
00:00 Shh3 puts his pants bac
00:00 theBear and they call me jiggle billy, for reference
00:00 pheren s
00:01 theBear why does everyone sigh today ? just like, cheer up and stuff
00:01 GuShh3 and I'm wiggle willy!
00:01 Sypheren I'm not sure, I feel I
00:01 Sypheren I've sparked argument
00:01 theBear GuShh3, you sure you aint been drinking
00:01 GuShh3 Not really
00:01 GuShh3 theBear: I haven't
00:01 GuShh3 it's killing me.
00:01 Sypheren Keep accidentally pressing enter prematurely
00:01 theBear Sypheren, nah, definately not you
00:01 Sypheren Good
00:01 GuShh3 Sypheren: that's not an argument, people just hate me
00:01 Sypheren lies
00:01 theBear oooh, don't do that... i bump it sometimes, but more than once every few words sucks
00:02 GuShh3 it's a reality
00:02 theBear i don't hate you
00:02 GuShh3 if you bump it more than twice you are close to being a flyback?
00:02 GuShh3 if I bump it I'm usually one letter short!
00:02 theBear lets not talk about that, that's one of the many reasons i'm here nad not there
00:03 theBear my words usually stop at an apostrophe if i bump it :)
00:03 GuShh3 was looking at a 1987 ninja 400R
00:03 GuShh3 4 cylinders!
00:03 theBear they were sporty little suckers
00:03 GuShh3 then I was told it "doesn't start, needs carb adjustment" which is clear bullcrap.
00:03 theBear so you started it for a testride ?
00:04 GuShh3 doesn't start
00:04 GuShh3 probably needs carb rebuild
00:04 theBear probly needs carb adjusted <grin>
00:04 GuShh3 that's a quad carb... and it needs to be synced
00:04 GuShh3 lol
00:04 GuShh3 I think they never did anything to that bike, it's probably got the stock clutch inside
00:04 theBear ooh, i've done a double, even a triple, not a quad.... that'd be interesting
00:04 GuShh3 When they're tuned up they sound amazing
00:05 GuShh3 I don't think I'd ever buy one like that
00:05 GuShh3 what about spare parts??
00:05 GuShh3 you can't even find the service manual online!
00:05 theBear what about spare parts ?
00:05 GuShh3 can't find any spare parts for it
00:05 theBear well, does it need any ?
00:05 GuShh3 sure it does
00:06 GuShh3 some rubber parts need to be replaced every couple years...
00:06 theBear pfft 'need'
00:06 GuShh3 say the seals on the caliper pistons
00:06 GuShh3 well it's for your own safety!
00:06 theBear not my safety
00:06 GuShh3 at least they're dual piston on each side, on each disc
00:06 GuShh3 lol
00:06 Sypheren GuShh3, For some reason I read caliper pistons as 'Carrier Pigeons'
00:06 GuShh3 lol
00:07 GuShh3 theBear: the guy got offended when I said "it's most likely NOT just a carb adjust issue"
00:07 theBear hehehe, you gotta replace the carrier pigeons, keep em fresh
00:07 GuShh3 otherwise it would start, being 4 separate carbs you'd have to be an idiot to get misadjust them all to the point where the bike won't even start
00:08 theBear hehe
00:08 GuShh3 to get them * jeez
00:08 GuShh3 I like the simplicity of a single cylinder....
00:08 theBear but you only gotta screw up ONE carb and the whole thing dies !
00:08 GuShh3 Not the power, just the fact that there are less moving parts.
00:09 GuShh3 87, it probably has varnished gas everywhere and that's why it won't start
00:09 GuShh3 but the price was too high for a bike that isn't even running anyway (some people want gold for turds...)
00:09 GuShh3 in it's prime it would've done 210KM/h easily
00:10 GuShh3 done, made? I'm not making much sense right now...
00:10 theBear yup
00:11 GuShh3 GPZ 400, the actual model.
00:11 GuShh3 And the funny thing is... they were all imported as used bikes, from Japan
00:12 GuShh3 that's why there's so little support material
00:12 GuShh3 in the western end of the world
00:25 theBear heh, i feel pretty good thismorning... accidentally didn't drink fer 36 hours, but last night i made sure to get a skinful, now i feel nice :) and my hands don't shake
00:25 Sypheren I havent drank for 16 years
00:25 theBear it's a hard life on mind numbing painkillers, you forget the important things
00:25 theBear well that's probably good too, so long as yer hands don't shake
00:25 theBear do what i say, not what i do :)
00:26 theBear wait, does that mean something different in irc ?
00:26 theBear do what i type, not what i action :)
00:26 pheren act
00:26 GuShh3 lol
00:27 theBear heh, that's some crazy meta stuff right there
00:27 GuShh3 theBear: how much is one of those bikes in AU anyway?
00:27 Sypheren I'm so meta, even this acronym
00:27 theBear i dunno, i aint hung around shops for 5 years and aint known someone with one of them for over 10
00:27 GuShh3 meh try your local ebay
00:27 theBear what is a sypheren ? oooh, is that a badly spelled action ?
00:27 Sypheren Sypheren stems from Altheren
00:28 GuShh3 I'm looking at a GPZ 500 (well, says 600 on the sticker!) right now, 1993
00:28 theBear i thought it was halfway between cypherin and syphoning
00:28 theBear i didn't know ebya had bikes.. interesting
00:28 Sypheren thats still better than syphilis
00:28 theBear hmm, i can get yer new mirrors from uk for 42 bucks
00:28 theBear totally
00:28 theBear i used to know a punk called scabies... lovely guy
00:28 GuShh3 -_-
00:29 Sypheren I knew a guy named skippy
00:29 Sypheren the police called him skippy
00:29 Sypheren he shot at things in our back yard
00:29 Sypheren while i was 5
00:29 theBear actually lots of spares,no rubber yet
00:30 GuShh3 theBear: not a fan of it's looks http://moto.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-452750954-kawasaki-gpzninja-500cc-ano-1993-_JM that's like 4.000 usd at the official exchange rate
00:30 Sypheren Well, I need to build this frame for the robot, now that I ahve a game plan
00:30 Sypheren thanks everyone, I really appreciate it!
00:30 GuShh3 make it as light as possible
00:31 Sypheren I will, I need to find cheap brushless motors too
00:31 theBear no bikes, but lots of spares
00:32 theBear good luck mr sypheren
00:32 GuShh3 the one that won't start http://moto.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-452745148-kawasaki-gpz-400-mod-87-_JM
00:32 theBear wow, that's a hitech looking timing chain
00:32 theBear jeez, i hope your money worth a LOT less than dollars
00:33 GuShh3 smaller engine http://moto.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-449968192-kawasaki-zzr-250-impecable-_JM
00:33 GuShh3 theBear: divide by 5 for official rate, divide by 7 or 8 for the illegal rate
00:33 theBear hmm, still a little steep, but if you had some foreign money and converted illegal it'd be allright if it aint too hard to get goin
00:34 GuShh3 well that's what I argued, you need to put money on top of it to get it going
00:34 GuShh3 except for the first one I linked to, it seems to be in working order
00:34 GuShh3 as is the third one, in theory
00:34 Shh3 sh
00:35 GuShh3 I wonder what's the mpg on each one of those
00:35 GuShh3 in theory the bigger the engine the worse it gets
00:35 theBear i don't even think about it on bikes.... it's still nothing next to a car
00:35 GuShh3 that's true
00:35 theBear well, unless you always drive a gear or two too high just on idle :)
00:36 theBear but thats no fun, road bikes get fun when you rev silly high all the time, zoop zip zoop
00:36 GuShh3 lol
00:36 GuShh3 well some of those engines go up to 17K RPM
00:36 GuShh3 they scream!
00:37 theBear yeah, my bro had a little modern 250 when he was learning, i think redline was 21k !
00:37 theBear scary fast
00:37 GuShh3 I was looking at new (well used with under 1.000KM) naked / street bikes but they cost just as much and they've got less than half the power...
00:38 GuShh3 thing is, you can get spares for those.
00:38 GuShh3 good luck finding a piston or ring assembly for one of these old Ninjas
00:38 theBear mmmm, the new ones are a different thing.... all small and light and cheap
00:38 GuShh3 Oh, I mean like the FZ16 from Yamaha
00:38 theBear i dunno, if you can get rings for 70's stuff
00:39 theBear i dunno new bike names
00:39 GuShh3 it's the weird looking humpy dumpy yamaha every kid wants and when they get it they find out it's not as fast as it looks so they want to sell it NOW
00:39 theBear hehe, oh, i know that one
00:39 GuShh3 http://moto.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-451401613-yamaha-fz-16-_JM
00:39 theBear ah
00:40 theBear i mean yeah
00:40 theBear stupid window switch delay
00:40 GuShh3 153cc, single cylinder... you'll get 110KM/h if you're lucky
00:40 theBear damn that's small !
00:40 GuShh3 for what it is I think it's too expensive, but that's because it's "2012"
00:41 GuShh3 yerp my lawn mower has a bigger engine
00:41 theBear :)
00:41 GuShh3 doesn't produce as much hp but it's got a bigger displacement >_<
00:42 theBear hmm, i think more coffee is in order
00:42 GuShh3 funny enough they race lawn mowers in some countries
00:42 theBear yeah, i was just thinking about motorbike engine mowers :)
00:43 Shh3 needs a bike to move around... it just can't be anything fancier than t
00:43 theBear yeah, defimanately more coffee
00:43 theBear heh, fixed a tv remote for a neighbor last night... took the plastic shrinkwrap off the batteries <grin>
00:43 GuShh3 by the time I'm about to buy one I bet the prices will go up
00:46 theBear then buy one a little before or after that time :)
00:49 theBear hmm, so those 'anti hammer' tap valves with the little springs in them, are they supposed to just spring as they close, or is the sping soft and involved thru the whole normal travel of the tap ?
00:53 GuShh3 theBear: no clue, I've never seen water hammer in this house
00:53 GuShh3 I used to get it on the previous one with the mono faucets
00:53 GuShh3 (only if I shut them fast)
00:54 GuShh3 heh another old nasty, with video http://moto.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-451789071-kawasaki-ninja-ex-250-con-motor-recien-hecho-a-nuevo-_JM
00:54 theBear this one the pipes don't hammer, but one of the taps is too old and ground WAAAY down, and it tends to squeek, i think those valves might help
00:54 theBear well, oscillate, you know, like blowing a wine jar
00:55 GuShh3 we don't blow on wine jars we suck on them until they run dry!
00:55 theBear then what do you do for entertainment while you drink the next one ?
00:55 GuShh3 beat up some arduinians
00:55 theBear c'mon, be nice to your new friend, you're building bridges, henry kissinger style
00:57 GuShH o.o
01:00 GuShH theBear: quite frankly I'm not aware of any other bikes in that category
01:00 GuShH the honda cbrs are too expensive even when old
01:01 GuShH the yamaha R6, R1, etc are way too expensive as well
01:01 GuShH crazy stuff.
01:05 theBear there aint a lot... buddy used to have a old yamaha, i should really remember what it was called...
03:48 Lokiteh Any know much about the (assuming) radio recievers on top of vending machines?
03:48 Lokiteh anyone*
04:22 zap0 likely just a SMS modem (phone without keypad/screen)
04:28 zap0 i have one.. RS232 port on it
08:09 Hukka Tom_itx: Have you tried your programmer in OS X? I'me getting some errors and wondering if I should just switch to my linux machine (which works ok, I tested that earlier) or try to google the errors
08:09 Hukka avrdude: stk500v2_recv_mk2: error in USB receive
08:09 Hukka avrdude: usbdev_send(): wrote -34 out of 7 bytes, err = Result too large
08:09 Hukka Things like that
11:20 Tom_itx Hukka, yes
11:21 Tom_itx not me personally but ppl have
11:22 Tom_itx you need to run the Crosspack and run the avrdude that comes with it
11:22 Tom_itx select 'avrisp2' as the programmer
11:23 Tom_itx http://www.obdev.at/products/crosspack/download.html
11:34 Hukka Tom_itx: Ok, I'll try that. I do have crosspack installed, but I was trying with the macports avrdude
12:57 Hukka Hmh, didn't help
12:58 Tom_itx i've been told that's the fix
12:58 Tom_itx you have the most recent crosspack?
13:00 Hukka Yeah
13:00 Tom_itx i don't use mac so i'd find someone in #avr that does and ask
13:00 Hukka I guess I'll have to get creative... compile on the mac and send the firmware on linux
13:01 Hukka My xmega is too new for the avr-gcc shipped in the distro repos *rollseyes*
13:01 Tom_itx add it to avrconfig
13:02 Tom_itx or copy from another avrdude conf
13:03 Tom_itx weekends are sometimes slow in there
13:03 Hukka I'd need to recompile avr-gcc with the right patches, I guess
13:04 Tom_itx i know avrdude works under os x but it may not be as quick as under linux
13:04 Tom_itx i can't verify that
13:05 Tom_itx does arduino have an osx ver?
13:05 Tom_itx you could try the avrdude that comes with that
13:05 Hukka Yeah, arduino work
13:05 Hukka +s
13:05 Hukka Good idea
13:06 Tom_itx it's just avrdude
13:06 Tom_itx copy it over to the other directory
13:26 GuShH dude it's just avrdude!
13:27 ShH wonders if the avrdude guys are sto
13:27 Ademan_ is there any reason why I should use 624ZZ instead of 623ZZ? (I have a ton of M3 screws and no M4, there won't be much force on it)
14:52 rue_house Ademan_, need more context
15:05 home hey rue_house
15:25 rue_house hey
15:27 RifRaf hey cya later
15:28 rue_house RifRaf, did that last program get working?
15:36 Ademan_ rue_house: http://imgur.com/pIKmnvv that's a M3 screw opposite the servo shaft. I intend to put a 623ZZ around the M3 and then a (modified) version of the bracket from this: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5784 will connect to it
15:37 rue_house well thats better than most people do
15:41 Ademan_ heh, I guess I'm just really averse to gluing crap to my servos
15:45 Ademan_ probably unreasonably so. I just don't want to "destructively" modify my servos
16:47 home well
16:47 home that was faster than expected
16:48 home gotta learn PID, and do a Proportional implementation first XD
16:48 home there goes my Android learning time
18:09 GuShH home: ?
18:10 home ????
18:14 GuShH home: were you talking alone? heh
18:16 home GuShH: what?
18:16 home what are you talking about
18:24 GuShH home: you were talking about PIDs
18:38 home GuShH: yah
18:38 home just some P
20:48 Rif to use avr as voltage meter for 0.00 to 30.00v ?
20:48 Rif simple voltage divider with a few resistors?
20:49 Sypheren I dont understand what you're asking?
20:50 Rif i want to measure voltage with an avr, as one sensor into adc
20:50 Sypheren Oh
20:51 Tom_itx sounds reasonable
20:51 Tom_itx your scale is from 0 to ~5v
20:52 Rif yes, hence the divider resistors
20:52 Rif need to go asbout 24v
20:53 Rif ok slightly trickier, how to measure current to about 1 amp using adc
20:55 Tom_itx precision resistor
20:56 Tom_itx ask inflex
21:16 Rif one of these ? http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=RR3420
21:16 Rif want something i can pickup today after work
21:18 theBear yeah something like that, but for any kind of useful resolution you gotta either have a very low dac ref (not sure that's possible with avr) or scale it up with a opamp
21:19 theBear actually, if you only wanna do 1a you probly want more like .1r
21:20 theBear v = r . i ... .1 * 1 = .1v for 1a, acceptable voltage drop and not too small to measure over noise/etc, but 1a on .01r is only .01v, 100mA is only .001v, that's starting to get a bit hard to measure accurately
21:21 theBear that's why you wanna scale it too, with opamp multiplier or ridiculously low adc ref (oops, i meant adc last time too)
21:21 Jak_o_Shadows The government, in its boundless wisdom, have declared incandescent bulbs to be the work of Satan and will soon be banning them completely on environmental grounds. We, the consumers have to adapt to the alternatives, usually so-called energy saving fluorescent globes that are totally unsuitable in some applications. We have a range of drop-in replacement halogen globes that will fit standard bayonet or Edison screw fittin
21:21 theBear even if the avr adc will take a stupid low ref, that's probably much harder to generate accurately than multiplying exactly 100 or so with an opamp
21:22 theBear Jak_o_Shadows, they been banned here between 15 and 100w for years now
21:22 theBear except for oven bulbs pretty much, maybe car headlights too, haven't checke
21:22 theBear d
21:22 Jak_o_Shadows Yes, banned here also, but i'm more laughing at the "work of satan" and "boundless wisdom" bits
21:23 theBear so much for pretty coloured festoon lighting at the bowling club
21:23 theBear huh ? i thought you just added that out of disgust :)
21:41 Rif theBear cheers, will get a few bits and have a go
21:43 Rif jayvar only has the 0.01ohm so will try with that first
22:56 Rif does the adc have 255 steps or 1024?
23:02 Rif 1024