#robotics Logs

Feb 17 2013

00:15 rue_shop2 they make them with a sphereical profile on the outside to sit in captive holders to self centre
00:15 rue_shop2 self-align
00:28 eadthem maby what i realy want to do is heat the bearing and then put it on
00:29 rue_shop2 eat the bearing? if you want iron have spinnich, its easier on your teeth
00:30 eadthem heat
00:30 rue_shop2 heating it wont do any good, you break a tooth if you try to eat one of those
00:30 dthem slaps rue_shop2 around a bit with the lette
00:30 e_shop2 counter with a
00:31 dthem counters with a h
00:32 e_shop2 knows when he's beat, and runs for the h
00:33 eadthem Ok so what im plotting is a drill press that will also work as a mill
00:33 eadthem i have the motor and etc alredy im planning a way to make a spindle
00:34 eadthem im not 100% shure what kind of taper to put on the spindle. i could do a morse taper and use a jacbos chuck, but they arent ideal for milling
00:37 rue_shop2 I was ust gonna use a fixed drill chuck for the one i was planning
00:37 rue_shop2 1/2"
00:37 rue_shop2 thread-on
00:38 eadthem what im planning atm is for the spindle case ile use 2 sheets of steel seperated by several inches to make the 2 berings plates
00:39 eadthem idealy ile find a bering with a innner ring that has a taper, and have my shaft have 2 tapers on the outside
00:39 eadthem to align it
00:40 rue_shop2 I'ma gonna make a frame from welded 2" or 3" steel pipe
00:40 eadthem im trying to do it all without welding
00:47 rue_shop2 been there
00:47 rue_shop2 welding DOES make things permanently wrong
00:58 eadthem http://final.servegame.com/public/mill/shaft.svg
00:58 eadthem red are a taperd ring of sorts with a slit cut in it
00:58 eadthem the bearing inner race would be on it
00:59 eadthem the yellow outlined areas are threads used for smashing the taperd part under the bearing removing all slack
00:59 eadthem not sure what taper to do
00:59 eadthem planned on a hole in the middle for a pull rod as it might be needed.
01:00 eadthem or to remove the arbor
01:01 eadthem in theory i could use a simiar taperd ring setup on a high grade steel pipe with a smalelr pipe inside
01:01 eadthem and use that as the stationary bearing mount
01:01 eadthem then use 2 spanner nut things to go in the middle
01:02 eadthem in theory if i had or found a bearing with a outer and innner taper that would make it even simpler
01:04 eadthem so wheres kat been lately
01:07 eadthem Mmmm its 1AM i need to sleep
01:07 eadthem cya tomarow
01:31 RifRaf i dun it
01:32 rue_house cool lets see video!
01:32 RifRaf dun did it did i
01:32 RifRaf no, not that dun yet
01:32 RifRaf just need to make it not as responsive, is way fast now
01:32 RifRaf ok will try make vid
01:34 RifRaf need new servo first, worn out another in crazy testing, i think it was old already
01:35 RifRaf and appears i have wiped out my dampening routine, so is just fast as bro
01:45 RifRaf nope this code is just gonna break more servos
01:45 RifRaf back later
02:48 RifRaf code challenge anyone? this code is working when moving very slow but as soon as i move too quick get wild oscilations
02:49 RifRaf http://pastebin.com/mKw8vCyK
02:50 RifRaf have lost the dampening code i had before and not sure where to add it, every time i do just makes the arm move less and not keep up with rotation
02:54 Skwint wild oscillations suggests you are overcorrecting one way, the overcorrecting the result the other
02:54 RifRaf yep thats the one
02:55 RifRaf but i am lost at how to fix it right now
02:55 Skwint you seem to be reading an acceleration from the accelerometer
02:55 Skwint and then changing an angle to match it
02:55 Skwint should you be reading an angle?
02:55 RifRaf with a long delay at the end like 250ms seems okish but not what i had before
02:56 RifRaf it outputs a value between -1000 and 1000 at the moment, depending on rotation
02:56 RifRaf or g force from shaking
02:56 RifRaf so 0 is level
02:57 Skwint OK, but this won't be an angle
02:57 Skwint this will be the linear force
02:57 RifRaf -1000 = 90°
02:57 RifRaf its an angle when stable
02:57 Skwint atleast I assume so I don't know your hardware?
02:57 Skwint hmmm, ok
02:57 RifRaf i can show you code i had earlier that worked, but have turned things kinda upside down
02:58 RifRaf the accelerometer used to be at the end of the arm, but suffered from vibration, so have moved it to base of arm
02:59 RifRaf and trying to get the end of the arm to stay level when the base is physically rotated
02:59 RifRaf which i kinda have, but goes wild too much to leave turned on
02:59 Skwint maybe if you have a very short delay the servo is still trying to deal with the last instruction and gives you dodgy results?
02:59 RifRaf it is an overcompensation thing
02:59 Skwint well, OK, let's dampen in a bit and see if that looks nicer
03:00 RifRaf ok cool
03:00 Skwint it doesn't really fix the underlying problem, but it might work around it
03:00 Skwint act_setSpeed(&servo2,(speedX + addStep))
03:00 RifRaf i have a delay right at the end currently, can remove that
03:00 Skwint addStep is the correction you are about to try to make
03:00 RifRaf yep
03:00 Skwint if I was you I'd limit that to a maximum value in each step
03:01 RifRaf yes the limit is -127 and 127, used to deal with that
03:01 RifRaf just forgot to with these changes
03:01 Skwint if (addStep > maxValue) addStep = maxValue else if (addStep < -maxValue) addStep = -maxValue;
03:01 Skwint well, I'd remember again and see where it gets you :p
03:02 Skwint heh - is it quite a strong servo?
03:02 RifRaf nope sg 90 9gram ones
03:02 Skwint quite fast?
03:02 RifRaf have some to spare
03:02 RifRaf yes pretty fast
03:02 Skwint yeah - that's what my RC plane uses
03:02 Skwint I am wondering how much acceleration the accelerometer measures as a result of the servo moving :)
03:02 RifRaf have the timing right to give me 180 degree sweep
03:03 RifRaf so can sorta use some maths to get the degrees
03:03 RifRaf ok so i should try add that if statement?
03:03 Skwint give it a shot yeah
03:04 Skwint you also need to choose a maxValue but you can experiment with that - I'd start small and work up
03:06 RifRaf oh, i made it 127, its not the servo maxPosition?
03:06 RifRaf ok will make it 5
03:08 RifRaf this compiles, is it put in the correct place? http://pastebin.com/BRWSU23A
03:09 RifRaf well it certainly works a shitload better sir
03:09 RifRaf will increase to maxValue to 10
03:11 RifRaf no i won't still jumpy, will go lower
03:14 RifRaf ok with maxValue is nice when picked up and moving around, keeps trying to stay level fairly smoothly
03:14 RifRaf however it won't sit still very easily
03:14 RifRaf maxValue =3; i mean
03:24 RifRaf addStep must always be to big, its in degrees * 1.41
03:25 RifRaf but if i say /10 then it only moves 1/10 of the riquired step
03:25 RifRaf so the only step it does is maxValue all the time
03:31 RifRaf oh yeah , fixed it, just needed more brackets
03:34 Skwint you can never have too many brackets!
03:34 Skwint I'm still curious how much of the perceived acceleration from the accelerometer is actually caused by the servo itself trying to correct it
03:34 Skwint but I'm not sure how to go about preventing that
03:34 Skwint atleast not easily :/
03:35 Skwint I Wish you luck :)
03:37 RifRaf its going good, you up for a bit, will take video when its good and post code
03:58 RifRaf had enough for one day, but has been good one, thanks to all that helped
03:59 RifRaf good point to stop
04:00 RifRaf current code that is performing pretty well http://pastebin.com/A6xDPj84
04:07 RifRaf Skwint http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AalBO4x4K5s
04:10 NightRavenXS DAT LCD
04:13 RifRaf is just a standard lcd
04:14 NightRavenXS well, that
04:14 NightRavenXS 's a big standard
04:14 NightRavenXS :D
04:14 RifRaf wow if i fix the upside down part its almost like part of a leg
04:15 RifRaf HD44780
04:15 Skwint keeping it's foot level with the ground :p
04:15 RifRaf yeah
04:15 RifRaf wow
04:15 RifRaf just have to reverse a few bits
04:15 RifRaf balancing robot here we come
04:15 RifRaf in a few weeks
04:16 RifRaf still pretty cool for cheap servos eh
04:17 NightRavenXS guys, can you change the color of an LCD?
04:18 NightRavenXS I hate that lame green i want it to be red for example
04:19 RifRaf yes if you want to spend 3X the price
04:19 RifRaf you can get full colour now even, so you can choose foreground and background
04:19 NightRavenXS ahh for special color LCDs?
04:20 NightRavenXS wow fg and bg
04:20 RifRaf lots of blue ones about though
04:20 NightRavenXS and how much do they cost?
04:20 RifRaf like $50+ each
04:20 GuShH_Lap the blue comes from a plastic film strip
04:20 GuShH_Lap you can take it apart and remove it, place your own filter.
04:20 RifRaf whereas these you can salvage from anything with a creen almost
04:20 NightRavenXS HOLY <censored> <censored>!!!
04:21 RifRaf blue only are not that much, i was refering to multicolour
04:21 GuShH_Lap you can thus make a custom multi colour filter.
04:21 NightRavenXS $50 for an lcd?
04:21 GuShH_Lap for example half red, half blue
04:21 RifRaf yep you betcha, and more, like upto $130 for ones i was looking at, but i would never spend as much as a monitor on lcd
04:21 GuShH_Lap RifRaf: irrelevant information
04:22 RifRaf i just recycle all mine, have not bought one for years
04:22 RifRaf GuShH_Lap yep i am full of it :)
04:22 NightRavenXS RifRaf, $130?
04:22 NightRavenXS why that expensive?
04:22 GuShH_Lap there's always going to be expensive things
04:22 GuShH_Lap in any subject matter.
04:22 GuShH_Lap including socks.
04:23 NightRavenXS :D
04:23 RifRaf GuShH_Lap did you like todays robotics related project though?
04:23 GuShH_Lap NightRavenXS: depends on the LCD at hand
04:23 NightRavenXS looks like i will have to disassemble a calculator again :D
04:23 GuShH_Lap the type of matrix, interface, etc
04:23 RifRaf NightRavenXS will find so you can see
04:23 GuShH_Lap NightRavenXS: you can get a parallel lcd for under 4 bucks on ebay though
04:24 GuShH_Lap RifRaf: no clue, wasn't here
04:24 RifRaf http://shop.4dsystems.com.au/
04:24 GuShH_Lap NightRavenXS: anyway the blue comes from a filter, when the backlight is white you can replace the filter with any colour you want.
04:24 NightRavenXS now this is a cool color http://www.ebay.com/itm/Serial-Parallel-12864-128x64-Dots-Graphic-LCD-for-Arduino-AVR-PIC-White-Blue-/251221205521?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a7df36211
04:24 RifRaf GuShH_Lap have a look http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AalBO4x4K5s
04:24 GuShH_Lap and also, if you wanted to, you could replace the backlight color or make it rgb
04:25 GuShH_Lap NightRavenXS: avoid any product with "arduino" on it
04:25 RifRaf touch screen ones as well
04:25 GuShH_Lap prices will be inflated.
04:25 ghtRavenXS makes a mental
04:26 GuShH_Lap you could get a touch panel and place it on top though, for a few bucks
04:26 RifRaf i am yet to get my graphic lcds working right
04:26 NightRavenXS btw "any product" includes Arduino itself right? :D
04:26 GuShH_Lap naturally
04:26 Skwint there are a number of arduino-like clones which are a fraction of the price
04:26 Skwint for those who don't feel like wiring up their own :p
04:27 RifRaf yep i get nanoduinos for under $10 off ebay, they are much better
04:27 Skwint personally, when I wanted a nice display for my robotics, I bought a bluetooth module
04:27 Skwint and used a smart phone :p
04:27 RifRaf easy to breadboard or wire directly to or use pins, cause they come without pins
04:27 GuShH_Lap RifRaf: neat project
04:27 RifRaf cheers GuShH_Lap
04:28 GuShH_Lap Skwint: actually that's not a bad idea in general
04:28 GuShH_Lap but for monitoring purposes
04:28 GuShH_Lap lots of laptops and phones use bluetooth and the modules are cheap
04:29 RifRaf and i don't use the nano's with the arduino ide, just as a decent little avr breakout board that has mini usb
04:29 GuShH_Lap too bad there isn't a cheap alternative to wifi if you want distance or more throughput
04:29 GuShH_Lap (don't mention xbee, cheap they ain't)
04:30 GuShH_Lap why are xbees still alive?
04:30 NightRavenXS shouldnt they?
04:30 NightRavenXS i think they're good
04:30 NightRavenXS and not so expensive
04:31 GuShH_Lap too expensive when you look at other alternatives
04:31 GuShH_Lap specially for production
04:31 NightRavenXS what other alternatives are there?
04:31 ShH_Lap is falling as
04:31 NightRavenXS (and do they work at same frequency?)
04:31 GuShH_Lap cheap rf modules and your own stack
04:31 NightRavenXS nooo GuShH_Lap wake up!
04:31 GuShH_Lap it's a compromise
04:32 GuShH_Lap ....I spend all night playing hitman absolution :(
04:32 GuShH_Lap spent*
04:32 NightRavenXS sorry, go to bed
04:32 NightRavenXS :D
04:33 GuShH_Lap RifRaf: now you just need to get bigger servos to stabilize my bed, then I could move anywhere and not worry about earthquakes
04:34 RifRaf lol, well am going to start with a few mg996 and a camera platform, once i know it won't shake the camera to bits, you would want to be wary as well with a full size version
04:34 GuShH_Lap why is it that every used car photo I see includes exposed/dangling wires and some missing part
04:34 GuShH_Lap most are missing the engine covers...
04:34 GuShH_Lap why are people so useless they can't take care of a piece of plastic
04:35 RifRaf they forget tp remember what screws went where, or break the plastic tabs that hold covers on these days
04:35 GuShH_Lap well, older covers generally used screws, newer ones don't
04:35 RifRaf indeed
04:36 RifRaf hence why i covered both
04:36 GuShH_Lap I just can't see how you can lose one.
04:36 GuShH_Lap maybe if it got stolen somewhere...
04:36 ShH_Lap eyer
04:36 GuShH_Lap my point is, some of those missing parts are not trivial to find.
04:36 RifRaf working on grass and dirt, easy to lose bits
04:37 GuShH_Lap a two laptop sized plastic bit!
04:37 RifRaf yep, but it also means someone inexperienced has been playing and trying to fix stuff
04:37 RifRaf they cover was chucked out when they could not put the tabs back in silly
04:38 GuShH_Lap I helped my brother cut new lining / foam for his jetta's engine cover last week, the original foam fell apart... I jokingly said the new one wouldn't last him a day, turns out the car didn't --- timing belt went bust and it was recently replaced just to avoid that whole situation!
04:38 GuShH_Lap well, jettas are boras in the UK I think, like they are here.
04:39 GuShH_Lap why do they have a need to use different names for the same cars... it's silly
04:39 GuShH_Lap I know Bora is "wind", but what is Jetta?
04:40 RifRaf yep have not seen many here, but heard the name jetta somewhere
04:40 RifRaf jetta sounds pretty fasta
04:40 GuShH_Lap I don't know how some cars make it into production these days
04:40 GuShH_Lap Like just about everything Citroen puts out.
04:40 GuShH_Lap and Fiat.
04:41 RifRaf both non names over here
04:41 GuShH_Lap well it's Citro�n :p
04:41 GuShH_Lap RifRaf: I hate French cars with a passion.
04:42 RifRaf we have fords holdens, mazda toyota and not much else unless you want a 4wd
04:43 GuShH_Lap I like VolksWagen...
04:43 GuShH_Lap Audi...
04:43 RifRaf only like fords meself, but even my car is no longer in production, and its so usefull
04:43 GuShH_Lap specially the mechanical aspect.
04:44 GuShH_Lap I don't care just about looks, that's what clueless people do :p
04:44 GuShH_Lap It's the same with Thinkpads
04:44 RifRaf i drive hundreds of thousands of km on a car and they don't skip a beat
04:44 RifRaf yep i go for station wagons, great for camping fishing and partys
04:45 RifRaf and moving house even
04:45 GuShH_Lap hippie!
04:45 RifRaf lol
04:46 GuShH_Lap hippies naturally drive diesels
04:46 ShH_Lap is looking for a tdi at the mo
04:46 GuShH_Lap ...makes you a fast hippie
04:47 RifRaf ok i don't think i can fix the unsidedown part of this arm tonight, have removed all references to Z axis
04:47 RifRaf would love a diesel, but still on fuel
04:47 GuShH_Lap gotta get a diesel, otherwise it's too expensive
04:47 RifRaf Gargantuasauce have you woken up yet?
04:48 RifRaf yep $1.55 per liter here now
04:48 RifRaf but about the same for diesle, they just use a bit less
04:48 GuShH_Lap USD??
04:48 GuShH_Lap that's more or less what premium gas costs here per liter.
04:48 RifRaf AU but still pretty close to $6 a gallon
04:48 GuShH_Lap premium diesel is also near the same, regular diesel is quite cheaper
04:48 RifRaf or more
04:49 GuShH_Lap but you can't run that crap on a TDI engine
04:49 RifRaf GuShH_Lap where are you again?
04:49 GuShH_Lap you could, and people do... but the injectors get fouled quite fast.
04:49 GuShH_Lap Argentina
04:49 GuShH_Lap It's because of the high sulphur content
04:49 RifRaf really, wow, well maybe i didn't know
04:50 RifRaf oh yes i remember that garage sales in argentina are dangerous
04:50 NightRavenXS GuShH_Lap, you dont care about the look of your car?
04:50 GuShH_Lap NightRavenXS: it's not the primary concern.
04:50 GuShH_Lap it's secondary
04:50 RifRaf NightRavenXS people would probly just steal a nice car
04:50 GuShH_Lap otherwise, go get that paper porsche with the bicycle inside
04:50 NightRavenXS lol yeah
04:51 GuShH_Lap I don't currently have a car, looking for one.
04:51 GuShH_Lap moving to diesel.
04:51 NightRavenXS is it cheaper?
04:51 GuShH_Lap If you drive a lot, yes
04:51 GuShH_Lap although an SDI or similar engine would be even cheaper (to maintain)
04:52 GuShH_Lap a bit more response but overall less power.
04:52 GuShH_Lap that's the down-side of a turbo, the lag.
04:52 GuShH_Lap also, the fact that a bad seal will make your engine run off it's own oil :p
04:56 GuShH_Lap https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiBxwGQQ8Js
04:56 RifRaf i stick with simple solid 6 cylinder motors that are proven, taxis here use them and do like 2M km
04:56 RifRaf well they are not so simple these days, but still reliable
05:16 GuShH_Lap awww I want one of these https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbcXBZU_U98 :(
07:43 robertj I need to control a pair of bipole 24v stepper motors, but may have other doodads I want to contorl later. Is there a go-to motor control board I should know about?
07:44 ace4016 the control scheme for a stepper motor is more or less specific, so unless the other motors you're adding on are also steppers, not really
07:44 ace4016 iirc
07:45 robertj ace4016, i was wondering if there was anything more generic that would let me basically control each step/half step from the arduino and just handle the power end of things
07:46 ace4016 http://arduino.cc/en/Main/ArduinoMotorShieldR3
07:47 robertj voltage too low, amperage maybe too low
07:47 robertj plus it can only control 1 stepper motor :(
07:47 robertj is there a favored stepper motor controller I should look at?
07:47 ace4016 not that i know of
08:24 Tom_itx robertj, have you looked at reprap hardware?
08:24 Tom_itx they use 2A drivers
08:26 Tom_itx Allegro 4988 stepper driver
08:26 Tom_itx there is a new one out though
08:26 Tom_itx i forget the number
08:27 Tom_itx 4984 possibly
08:27 Tom_itx http://www.allegromicro.com/Products/Motor-Driver-And-Interface-ICs/Bipolar-Stepper-Motor-Drivers/A4984.aspx
08:35 Celelibi Are brushless motors designed to run slow?
08:37 Celelibi A friend of mine told me it was a hell to make a controller for its motor because it's not based on a hall effect sensor but on a coil. And thus he have no feedback until the motor reach some speed.
08:41 ace4016 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brushless_DC_electric_motor#Controller_implementations
08:41 ace4016 you can use a hall effects sensor or encoder with them
08:42 Celelibi (this is just general discussion for my information, I'm not planning to implement a controller)
08:43 ace4016 if you don't use a sensor or so, you'll have to rely on the back emf which isn't very accurate below a certain speed
08:45 Celelibi ok
13:57 robertj Tom_itx, I have a while ago, I think i'm probably going to want something a bit more heavy duty - http://buildyourcnc.com seems nice
14:04 robertj also it strikes me that someone has probably built a pretty swell CNC system and err... used it to make more kits and so it may be practical to just buy one :P
14:13 Tom_itx gecko make good drivers
14:32 rue_house they charge good for them too
14:38 Tom_itx some things are worth it
14:39 robertj what makes it worth the big bucks?
14:39 Tom_itx several things
14:40 Tom_itx it does 10 step microsteppng, settable current limiting, DSP to smooth out the power band for a few
14:41 Tom_itx and the one i have has good protection for surges etc
14:41 Tom_itx 203v
14:41 Tom_itx i gained from 20 ipm on my old drivers to 80-90 ipm
14:41 Tom_itx partially due to a boost in the psu voltage too
14:42 Tom_itx going from 24v to 50
14:42 Tom_itx same steppers
14:43 robertj what is 10 step microstepping?
14:44 Tom_itx steps generated between regular steps
14:45 robertj sinsuinoidal
14:45 robertj ?
14:47 Tom_itx not sure, maybe
14:49 Tom_itx http://www.geckodrive.com/support.html
14:49 Tom_itx maybe that will explain what they do
14:50 robertj their web page sucks, too hard to find pricing :P
14:50 Tom_itx get them from keelinginc or someplace
14:50 Tom_itx http://www.kelinginc.net/GeckorDriver.html
14:51 Tom_itx http://www.pmdx.com/GeckoDrivers
14:51 Tom_itx i've used both
14:52 Tom_itx the 540 is your best bet probably
14:52 Tom_itx for multiple steppers
14:52 Tom_itx some of the chinese drivers are ok as well
14:52 Tom_itx not as rugged
19:44 RifRaf Tom_itx what did you make on the CNC?
19:52 Tom_itx a couple patterns to spin some metal against
19:52 rue_house Tom_itx, have you cut gears on yours?
19:52 Tom_itx nope
19:52 rue_house mastercam does gears no?
19:52 Tom_itx i think i'd need a rotary head for that
19:52 Tom_itx i can generate gears
19:52 rue_house you can xy them
19:53 Tom_itx i can do gears and sprockets
19:53 Tom_itx i wrote a template for sprockets myself
20:32 RifRaf i cut some more gears just before, making use of new bit after i snapped one
20:32 RifRaf just for more grippers
20:32 rue_shop2 I know how you feel, all the stuff I'v been able to make having a lathe have been awesome
20:32 rue_shop2 a sturdy cnc and software would be sweet
20:33 rue_shop2 RifRaf, this week, shall we make up a sound player with an i2c chip?
20:34 RifRaf sure, but i need to make the accel write to sd card tonight
20:35 rue_shop2 k
20:35 RifRaf have got some micro amplifiers on the way and got some micro speakers
20:35 rue_shop2 you can get around the voltage level conversions?
20:35 RifRaf gonna do the text to speech again and biuld it into arm
20:35 RifRaf wat levels rue?
20:35 rue_shop2 "lifting" "shaking violently"
20:35 rue_shop2 :)
20:35 RifRaf i have 3.3V on the nanoarduino
20:36 rue_shop2 the sd card is 3.3
20:36 rue_shop2 k
20:36 RifRaf using the 3.3 for the accel already
20:36 RifRaf rue did you see last night video that you asked for?
20:37 RifRaf of the sensor in the base of arm?
20:37 rue_shop2 no
20:37 rue_shop2 stil have link?
20:37 RifRaf the arm balances now when i place it upside down, is neat, trys to walk
20:37 RifRaf nope, not here
20:37 RifRaf multiriffo is youtube username
20:38 RifRaf http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AalBO4x4K5s
20:38 RifRaf there ya go
20:40 rue_shop2 saweet
20:41 RifRaf yep my first robot thing that does stuff by itself depending on other stuff
20:46 rue_shop2 how many bytes to 16kb
20:46 rue_shop2 2048?..
20:46 rue_shop2 must be
20:48 theBear wtf ? 16000 or 16 1024s, you weirdo
20:49 rue_shop2 bits
20:50 theBear what i said times 8
20:50 rue_shop2 16384 bits, /8 bits is 2048 bytes?
20:50 rue_shop2 am I asleep?
20:51 theBear err, it's 2000 somethings
20:51 theBear oh, yeah , ok.... 16kb/8, 2kb
20:51 theBear i'm having a grumpy morning, so i'm a little drunk even for me before 11am
20:51 rue_shop2 16kb= 2kB
20:52 theBear at least for a day i'm driving
20:52 theBear oh, now you capitalising... yeah, i'll buy that, tho i think you got the caps reversed
22:50 GuShH_Lap theBear: usually b is bit, B is byte
22:51 Tom_itx rue_shop2, why were you asking about gears?
22:54 Tom_itx RifRaf i think accelerometers are slow for measuring angular data
22:54 RifRaf oh? wats better a gyro?
22:55 Tom_itx the good ones i've seen are both inclinometers and gyro combination
22:55 RifRaf this outputs at upto like 5000 pulses a second or more
22:55 RifRaf well have a gyro on the way
22:55 Tom_itx one i was looking at several years back was around $600
22:55 Tom_itx you need math to combine the results of both
22:56 Tom_itx gyros drift
22:57 Tom_itx http://www.microstrain.com/inertial?loc=left
22:57 RifRaf well i paid $20 and $ for inclinometer
22:58 Tom_itx i know
22:58 Tom_itx those are industrial
22:58 Tom_itx they use kalman filters to combine the data
22:59 RifRaf i saw a cool module that has everything including gps, all on single bus, but was 160 or so
23:02 RifRaf this is good, just no gps http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/9-Axis-Attitude-Indicator-L3G4200D-ADXL345-HMC5883L-BMP085-Module-10DOF-Module-/221190120041?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item337ff56269
23:02 Tom_itx yeah the 345 is a 3 axis mems sensor
23:03 MrCurious i just ordered 3 similar ones off ebay, each was about $16US
23:03 MrCurious try the keyword 10DOF
23:04 MrCurious http://www.ebay.com/itm/10DOF-L3G4200D-ADXL345-HMC5883L-BMP085-Nine-Axis-IMU-Module-ge-/281043201090?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item416f7aec42
23:04 Tom_itx same board
23:05 orlok yay, apparently my home internet has been connected
23:05 orlok finally
23:05 Tom_itx orlok, how _is_ your home?
23:05 MrCurious seems cheeper on the US ebay
23:13 RifRaf cheaper cause my link likely had arduino in the title
23:14 GuShH_Lap haha
23:15 rue_house it DOES seem to add to the price
23:16 GuShH_Lap guess I didn't make that up huh
23:16 GuShH_Lap rue_house: if you take a look, the same happens with micro-usb connectors
23:16 GuShH_Lap they're sold "for nokia n9" and such
23:16 GuShH_Lap so they sell them for 20-30 usd a pop
23:16 rue_house hah
23:16 GuShH_Lap likewise with any 1666 ram sold for macs
23:17 GuShH_Lap the 2x8GB packs cost a lot more when they're listed "for mac"
23:17 GuShH_Lap same ram, with no mac on the title... a lot cheaper
23:18 efex just buy pc ram, it works if it has the same specs
23:18 GuShH_Lap most products sold for mac are a lot more expensive, you'll be able to find similar products with the same specs for a lot less when they're not marketed toward mac fanboys
23:18 GuShH_Lap efex: it's the same.
23:18 GuShH_Lap I gave that as an example.
23:18 efex aha you are a brand fanboy then
23:18 efex cool
23:19 GuShH_Lap I meant to write 1600.
23:19 GuShH_Lap DDR3
23:19 efex yeah figured
23:19 GuShH_Lap I'm not a brand fanboy, I'm the opposite.
23:19 GuShH_Lap and I don't own anything made by apple
23:19 efex no, you hate certain brands right? that makes youba fanboy, people who are not fan boys don't care much about brands
23:20 GuShH_Lap any common product listed specifically for a brand or other product will cost you more.
23:20 efex right, a "brandie" is another term for brand fanboys that are haters
23:20 GuShH_Lap efex: Did I say I hate them?
23:20 rue_house people pay so much for the apple sticker they keep the stuff forever (or buy new almost daily)
23:20 GuShH_Lap or did I imply I hate marketing retards
23:20 efex no, but the use of the fanboy term implied it, pardon if I misinterpreted :-)
23:20 GuShH_Lap I'm a thinkpad fanboy if you must know
23:20 efex yeah the apple stuff lasts many years
23:21 efex cool, thinkpads are nice
23:21 GuShH_Lap I like the hardware quality of the macbook air and such, I don't like the shit around it.
23:21 GuShH_Lap it's neat, the price isn't.
23:22 GuShH_Lap apple loves to tie strings to your balls and move you around like a puppet.
23:22 efex I looked at the ultraboooks but the fit finish was not as good, they had a weird old style power cabel too, and they need a lot of work to run stuff like logic. I thought they would be cheaper than the air tho wtf
23:22 GuShH_Lap the air has a beautiful finish
23:22 efex yeah the air is expensive! same as macbook pro, $1099 for a macbok pro is not cheap
23:22 GuShH_Lap I would buy one if it costed less and had no apple logo
23:22 GuShH_Lap lol
23:23 efex yes the air is lovely, and the same price as the ultrabook, which is weird
23:23 GuShH_Lap it's the same price, just because.
23:23 efex I figured the ultrabook, having h=those issues, should be cheaper than the air
23:23 rue_house the spam I get in my inbox is limited to the rate at which spammers go under
23:24 rue_house if every spammer kept going since my account had been created, I would recieve absolutly stupid volumes of mail
23:24 rue_house I'd like to know how many other had their email address since 1994
23:24 GuShH_Lap efex: see if I needed a tablet I wouldn't get an ipad...
23:24 GuShH_Lap the screen is awesome, sure.
23:25 GuShH_Lap I disagree with the price tags.
23:25 rue_house I got a tablet, $67, from china, android, its SWEET
23:25 efex GuShH_Lap I have an ipad cause it was the first out and I needed a tablet. I would look at the copies now as well for sure
23:25 GuShH_Lap plus, when I tried the ipad 2 at the store... it crashed
23:25 GuShH_Lap browsing a news site
23:25 GuShH_Lap so fuck them
23:25 robotnut ipad is getting old - and dont ever upgrade ios unless you plane to be tabletless
23:25 rue_house I'm setting it up as a ROV remote
23:26 GuShH_Lap I'm looking into the nexus 7 or similar
23:26 robotnut been ios since the beginning and moving over to android 100%
23:26 efex I'm happy (as a user of both pc and mac) about the mac software prices...like osx is $19.99....win 8 access all your ram version is like 200$ wtf
23:26 GuShH_Lap efex: costs like 400 bucks here,windoze
23:26 robotnut lololol
23:26 GuShH_Lap although I had an option to upgrade from 7 to 8 for 15 or 20 bucks
23:26 GuShH_Lap but I didn't care for it
23:26 GuShH_Lap win8 looks like a kid designed it on ms paint and they shipped it out before he hit the save button
23:27 robotnut bizspark msdn subscription = free - all the ms licenses you need FREE
23:27 efex same with stuff like logic pro...$199 = pc software cubase and DP at 600 to 2000$
23:27 robotnut lol
23:27 GuShH_Lap I got win 7 pro on this thinkpad, with the free office bundle
23:27 rue_house you know when os11 comes out for apple, you will have to buy all new apps for it cause there wont be ANY backwards compatability...
23:27 efex robotnut I have an old iphone and a droid raz here, it is fun seeing the differences between them actually
23:27 GuShH_Lap had an option to get a lesser model with FREEDOS for the same money..... stupid.
23:27 robotnut efex, i bet
23:28 robotnut dare i ask - but - has anyone tried a windows tablet yet?
23:28 GuShH_Lap so far what other tablets have similar retina screens and don't cost a fortune?
23:28 efex rue LOL the machine I am trying on had the os installed in 2001, and the same os withno reinstall but three upgrades still runs all the same mac apps from 2001
23:28 GuShH_Lap robotnut: win8 is meant for tablets
23:28 GuShH_Lap we've tried win8... we don't like win8.
23:28 robotnut nor i
23:28 robotnut windows 7 is fine
23:28 efex err the machine I am trying on (I vnc into a remote mac server which is whatever the most recent free mac I can scrouge is)
23:29 GuShH_Lap in fact, because lenovo has some tablets they even ship out their laptops with some of the tablet software
23:29 efex trying = typing
23:29 GuShH_Lap like that one-touch bullshit
23:29 robotnut prefer ubuntu desktop though :D
23:29 GuShH_Lap it's pointless on a notebook
23:29 robotnut funny
23:29 rue_house microsoft thought apples success was due to alienating users, so they are trying it now
23:29 GuShH_Lap or one tap, two tap, whatever it was called
23:29 GuShH_Lap it didn't last long here.
23:29 robotnut my 1st gen ipad - 64gb only wifi - 700 bucks
23:29 GuShH_Lap ah, SimpleTap (makes you tap twice, fires up randomly)
23:29 robotnut a nexus 4 and 7 and 10 - three devices = 800 bucks
23:29 efex robotnut same here, I still use it all the time and see no reason to upgrade
23:30 GuShH_Lap gives you an iphone-ish menu of "appz"
23:30 efex yup, but when we got the ipad the copies didn't exist eitther... you pay to have stuff first, always
23:30 GuShH_Lap the nexus 10 costs 1000 usd here....
23:30 robotnut efex, and for dev work - i upgraded vs.net to the latest - and wound up uninstalling it
23:30 GuShH_Lap and up
23:30 robotnut the ui just plan sucks
23:30 GuShH_Lap nexus 7 is half
23:30 efex robotnut I use mine for notes, reading and midi control
23:31 GuShH_Lap I would mostly use a tablet to watch videos
23:31 GuShH_Lap and read datasheets
23:31 robotnut i will say - being an avid tablet user - you need two tablets lol
23:31 robotnut a small and a big one
23:31 GuShH_Lap how about a phone and a tablet
23:31 robotnut i use my ipad now for personal and biz - and truthfully hate it for personal use.. too big
23:31 robotnut no
23:31 GuShH_Lap I'm inclined to insult you now
23:31 robotnut phone and two tablets
23:32 robotnut lol
23:32 GuShH_Lap you effing weirdo
23:32 efex the ipad mini for $300.00 looks fine but I don't need one, and te full size ipad shows pdf academic articles at readable size while the smaller tablets don't
23:32 robotnut a small 7 inch screen is perfect on the sofa or bed farting around with it
23:32 GuShH_Lap ipad mini is little under 1k here... 800usd if you are lucky
23:32 GuShH_Lap 16GB
23:32 robotnut or in a plane / bus / train
23:32 efex they are all scanned the same size, and unless you wanna zoom in and fly about to see the text the full size ipad is required to read and mark them up
23:33 robotnut but for biz - you just need more real estate than 7 inches esp for reading docs etc etc
23:33 robotnut a phone is just assumed
23:33 robotnut only thing i see lacking - is the media aspect of it all
23:33 GuShH_Lap robotnut: biz like, taking someone's order? you effing barista!!
23:33 robotnut apple has - iphone, ipad, appletv etc etc
23:33 GuShH_Lap appletv is like the cake, a lie.
23:33 robotnut android is lacking in a nice standard there - although i have the mini pc and it rocks!
23:34 GuShH_Lap android + manufacturers = no standards
23:34 robotnut lol
23:34 robotnut id prefer to have one hardware vendor for my own personal use..
23:34 GuShH_Lap having to jailbreak an android device makes me want to murder people.
23:34 robotnut although many hw manufs are healthier for the industry
23:34 robotnut wish they had something mature with ubuntu
23:35 robotnut ubuntu tablet phone etc etc that would be ideal
23:35 ex is about to buy a mac laptop, the wife dumped coffee on her 2006 macboook pro, so she wants my 2008, so I get a new one. Man I hate buying laptops, this one is only 5 years old and it's great so seems a wste to buy but so it
23:35 robotnut for me at least
23:35 GuShH_Lap ubuntu.... you mean black boy's osx?
23:35 robotnut lmao
23:35 GuShH_Lap not in a racist way, you all know where ubuntu comes from.
23:35 GuShH_Lap >_<
23:36 GuShH_Lap and you all know it's trying to be osx.
23:36 GuShH_Lap in the graphical / user interaction department
23:36 GuShH_Lap so to speak.
23:36 robotnut wuteva
23:36 GuShH_Lap not like windoze hasn't tried to copy them
23:36 robotnut good artists copy - great artists steal
23:36 GuShH_Lap rasta man one love ubuntu <smokes>
23:37 robotnut for the record - everyone ripped off xerox
23:37 GuShH_Lap I just feel most people holding tablets are doing it to look cool. You could replace it with a piece of wood and they wouldn't find out.
23:37 robotnut well you are right about that
23:37 GuShH_Lap I really know people who got tablets and never use them
23:37 robotnut its like going to the coffee shop or barnes and noble - with all these turds playing on the macbook air
23:37 GuShH_Lap just because other people bought them, they had to have them.
23:38 robotnut as if they are doing anything else other than email, youjizz and facebook
23:38 robotnut or for the ladies out there - pinning their food pics on pinetrest or instragramming
23:38 GuShH_Lap it shouldn't be allowed for someone to stay there several hours with the excuse of having ordered a small coffee...
23:39 robotnut nah thats good for business
23:39 GuShH_Lap it's not
23:39 robotnut howdy
23:39 GuShH_Lap if your tables are taken by idiots
23:39 GuShH_Lap new customers can't take tables!
23:39 GuShH_Lap just because a place looks packed doesn't mean it's doing well
23:39 robotnut true but one person brings more and more
23:39 robotnut becomes a hang out
23:39 robotnut and they spend money
23:39 robotnut on something
23:39 GuShH_Lap in theory when someone notices a lot of people in a place, they tend to walk in
23:39 GuShH_Lap it's sadly a theory.
23:39 robotnut very true
23:40 rue_house its lemmingology
23:40 robotnut iits like an empty resturant - most people wont go in
23:40 GuShH_Lap I don't think it works out
23:40 GuShH_Lap I would
23:40 robotnut even if the food is good
23:40 robotnut you arent the norm
23:40 robotnut i would and do as well
23:40 robotnut i prefer it
23:40 GuShH_Lap lol
23:40 GuShH_Lap I don't like places packed with idiots
23:40 robotnut but people - like those buying the macbook and hanging at the coffee shop - like to belong
23:40 robotnut i dont like idiots packed with places either
23:41 GuShH_Lap So you don't like Donald Trump?
23:41 RifRaf home time, back to annoy ya all soon
23:41 robotnut hes funny
23:41 GuShH_Lap he should give me a million dollars.
23:41 robotnut wish he would change his hair style though
23:41 GuShH_Lap just to prove hes got 'em
23:41 ShH_Lap
23:42 GuShH_Lap robotnut: is it actually considered a style
23:42 GuShH_Lap isn't it his only option
23:42 robotnut yeah
23:42 robotnut gushh, the comb over
23:42 GuShH_Lap I'd either shave my head or buy the most expensive nano-tech wig out there
23:42 robotnut thats not a style - thats a patch jjob
23:42 robotnut shaving head would be easier
23:42 robotnut end the shampoo bills
23:42 GuShH_Lap my hair sucks
23:43 robotnut amazing
23:43 GuShH_Lap if I had his money I'd do something about it, then when I realize most of my body is plastic I would probably revert back.
23:43 robotnut my laptop - 8gb ram - i7 blah blah
23:43 robotnut windows 7 pro -
23:43 GuShH_Lap I could've got a shitty laptop with an i7 but I went with a thinkpad with an i5
23:43 robotnut i have two vms that i can run on it - one is my ubuntu desktop the other is windows 7 pro test machine
23:44 GuShH_Lap previous plasticky laptop flexed to death.
23:44 robotnut i run ubuntu with twice the memory and cpu allocated - no isssues
23:44 robotnut i run the windows 7 vm - and blah
23:44 GuShH_Lap I only got winxp and ubuntu VMs
23:44 robotnut mind you - SSD hdd so its not like i have a throughput issue here lol
23:44 robotnut the installer for win 7 tanked the pc completely..
23:45 GuShH_Lap vmware?
23:45 robotnut yah
23:45 GuShH_Lap hmm I should go to sleep
23:45 robotnut however - virtual box with macos does the same shit as win 7 does under vmware on my laptop
23:45 robotnut lol
23:45 ShH_Lap doesn't feel like sleeping, perhaps he should buy some sleeping p
23:45 efex I have yet to meet a mac owner who cared about being seen in public with the mac, but I meet lots of brand haters who have a thing about thinking mac owners are like that. Wehere does the idea come from that the mac people care about that?
23:46 GuShH_Lap mac users, that is.. baristas, are hipsters.
23:46 robotnut i cant say im annoyed by those coffee mac goers
23:46 robotnut however
23:46 GuShH_Lap they naturally want to be seen with macs
23:46 robotnut the mac "genius"
23:46 robotnut jesus
23:46 robotnut some punk graduated from a 1 day course in how to be a pompus idiot
23:46 efex GuShH_Lap where did you get that idea into your head?
23:46 GuShH_Lap efex: you should sit on an apple
23:46 robotnut bought themselves some black glasses with no prescription
23:46 robotnut and now - they are wicked smart
23:47 robotnut thats just lame
23:47 GuShH_Lap they don't know shit.
23:47 robotnut they are tarded
23:47 GuShH_Lap careful, efex might work as one
23:47 GuShH_Lap teheheehe
23:47 robotnut who cares
23:47 robotnut its the truth
23:47 GuShH_Lap YOU CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH
23:47 robotnut LMAO
23:47 efex the genius guys are not geniuses but they are nice people who actually want to help you. They recently gave me warranty coverage to fix my wife's 2006 lptop, 4 years out of extended warranty
23:48 robotnut no doubt
23:48 robotnut but still
23:48 GuShH_Lap pfahahaha
23:48 robotnut they dont have to try and pretend to be a genius either
23:48 robotnut and last time a checked - a genius doesn't necessarily need glasses - it wold impare learning
23:48 GuShH_Lap efex: don't worry, my brother is a mac fanboy and I always make fun of his apple stuff.
23:48 robotnut but hey
23:48 efex it was cause we compained about battetry charging in warranty, and when we had a battery issue (battery lasted llike 6 months wtf) I called and complained
23:48 robotnut maybe its steve jobs
23:48 robotnut he gave them options when they got hired
23:49 GuShH_Lap specially when it crashes or takes a long time to open a program
23:49 robotnut option 1 - black shirt, cacky pants, comb your hair
23:49 robotnut option 2 - black shirt, cargo pants, you need an afro a tatto and a piercing
23:49 efex they don't pretend to be a genius, there is a sign above them that gives them a marketing name, that's all
23:49 robotnut option 3 -the genius - black shirt, jeans (because they need to work), and black framed glasses
23:49 GuShH_Lap it's meant so idiots think they're a genius
23:50 GuShH_Lap oh, the thick glasses?
23:50 efex like for example a barrista vs a bartender, the name depends where they work, nothing to do with them as an individual
23:50 GuShH_Lap makes me want to punch them.
23:50 robotnut efex, dont take offense to my blabbing - im stereotyping
23:50 robotnut i want to trip them
23:50 robotnut watch them drop an ipad on the floor
23:51 GuShH_Lap and then shove the pieces up their rectum as part of their ceremonial burial?
23:52 robotnut lmao
23:52 robotnut yes
23:52 robotnut all i know
23:52 efex robotnut fair enuff. I have used macs since day one cause in music audio there was no choice, so we all used macs and everyine still does. That means a lifetime of having pc brandies people bashing me, it got old like 20 years ago
23:52 GuShH_Lap 89.78% of mac users are scientologists.
23:52 efex lol!
23:52 robotnut efex - hey what happened to amiga?!!!
23:52 efex that's a new one and funny
23:52 robotnut lmao!!!!
23:52 robotnut scientologiests
23:52 robotnut thats a good one
23:52 efex amiga never made it in music audio cause they never got proper audio interfaces etc
23:52 robotnut actually - you bring that up - did anyone notice - they are advertising all over youtube now.. they were on the front page today
23:52 robotnut hrmmmmm
23:52 robotnut and sgi?
23:52 GuShH_Lap they've been doing it for years
23:52 efex atari did!!! but they went bankrupt, leaving mac as the only choice
23:53 GuShH_Lap you could afford sgi?
23:53 efex sgi dunno, never saw any commercial music stuff for them, not a player
23:53 robotnut amiga was basically the same hardware as mac back then
23:53 robotnut amiga used 680XX cpu - same as the mac for a long time
23:53 efex the hardware for mac audio in 1989 was close to hardware from 2013
23:53 efex not the mac itself
23:53 robotnut i think they even went ppc for a while not sure
23:53 efex the third party hardware hosted by the mac
23:53 robotnut i agree with you there - mac had superior hardware - always had until now
23:54 robotnut i started looking down upon mac the day they switched from RISC architecture
23:54 efex sure today the hardware for pc audio is just as good as mac
23:54 efex same stuff
23:54 robotnut i still have my mac 7500
23:54 robotnut lol
23:54 robotnut loved that pc
23:54 robotnut solid!
23:54 GuShH_Lap you nerds.
23:54 robotnut agreed
23:55 GuShH_Lap I bet your pocket protectors just ejaculated by thinkin about them.
23:55 efex but after 15 yeasrs of no choice but mac, the industry was mac and so it remains. 3d modelling is all linux and pc, not like mac was any good for that
23:55 robotnut WHATTTTTTTT
23:55 efex robotnut I have my quadra 650 with pro tools 1 and two samplecells
23:55 robotnut efex - mac was 1000x better at 3d back then
23:55 robotnut my mac 7500 would render 3d animations a million times better than my pentium
23:55 efex robot not what i heard, the rendering speed on the pc side won
23:55 robotnut stratastudio and bryce!!! wtf
23:55 robotnut nope
23:56 efex yeah?
23:56 GuShH_Lap better or faster?
23:56 robotnut not at all
23:56 efex what year
23:56 robotnut mac faster
23:56 robotnut hrmmm
23:56 robotnut 1993-1997 or so
23:56 GuShH_Lap depends a lot
23:56 robotnut i did a lot of 3d work back then
23:56 robotnut A LOT
23:56 GuShH_Lap perhaps their intel pipeline wasn't as optimized
23:56 robotnut 3d studios on PC and strata on mac
23:56 GuShH_Lap perhaps their lead programmer/s were not intel guys at all
23:56 robotnut mac - hands down - beat it
23:56 robotnut weeks rendering on pc
23:56 robotnut days on mac
23:56 robotnut that was the difference
23:56 robotnut literally lol
23:57 GuShH_Lap also this just makes me think again about how much energy is lost over video ads and bullshit GUIs
23:57 efex robotnut no kidding...I am thinging when it got to be that people neded rendering farms they went pc/linux, didn;t think of before
23:57 robotnut now the argument is moot - same cpu, gpu blah blah
23:57 GuShH_Lap robotnut: and yet we gotta write shaders for each pipeline :p
23:57 robotnut efex- will heavy lifting was usually done by sgi
23:58 robotnut and you had render farms yes - but that was like mecca for some.. not all places / shops had a farm at their disposal
23:58 efex robotnut fair enough, it was later the render farms arrived i thought too
23:58 robotnut mac should have stayed risc
23:58 robotnut blah
23:59 robotnut funny - chips were made by ibm and motorola
23:59 robotnut in a mac
23:59 robotnut up until recently - microsoft made 90% of mac software
23:59 efex I was happy when they dropped ppc, I went from a G5 to a dual xeon
23:59 robotnut lol
23:59 GuShH_Lap shit I need more storage space...