#robotics Logs

Feb 07 2013

00:40 rue_house they are only 2.30 from china direct
00:40 rue_house its the DT-830B ?
00:42 RifRaf qm-1502, nice small one
00:42 RifRaf we got 10000 leds from chine today direct
00:43 RifRaf 1.5w each, pretty shitty compared to wat i normally use but they were cheap
00:45 rue_house ooo
00:45 RifRaf so rue did you see i got things working again and got past the hurdle
00:46 RifRaf making a sweet arm this time, even gripper is balanced
00:46 rue_house good show, what was the trick?
00:46 rue_house do send pics as you can eh?
00:46 RifRaf go back to C, same code but something in the
00:46 RifRaf C++
00:46 RifRaf nah
00:47 rue_bed was the resulting code smaller?
00:48 RifRaf um about the same, did not pay attention, i know i am only arpound 50% usage
00:48 RifRaf actually might be bigger, is about 11k now, sure it was around 9k before
00:49 rue_bed huh
00:49 RifRaf it was not a concern so did not look, i could be wrong
00:49 RifRaf and anyway the code would not compile with c++ so cannot compare it
00:50 RifRaf the lines of code are the same though
00:50 rue_bed yep
00:50 rue_bed huh
00:51 RifRaf i just copyed and pasted the other code
00:51 rue_bed cool
00:51 RifRaf but exported my hardware as C, not c++
00:51 rue_bed want to see a video of it being cool eh?
00:51 RifRaf and helped with another issue that i think is related
00:52 RifRaf now the servos are named correctly, with c++ had to add underscores to get it to work, like &servo1 had to be _&servo1_ for c++
00:52 rue_bed do tell
00:52 RifRaf nope
00:52 rue_bed its nice to have someone in the channel making stuff again
00:52 RifRaf well others don't like it
00:53 rue_bed what?
00:53 GargantuaSauce c++ is a bag of dicks stay away
00:53 RifRaf people think i am silly cause i cannot code like a geek, but screww them, i get shit done
00:54 GargantuaSauce and i am making stuff! i am just too lazy to blog about it properly
00:54 RifRaf i know you are GargantuaSauce, is good to see stuff happening
00:54 rue_bed uh, knowing to code for your own wil help get your stuff done faster and more like you want it, its taken me a long time to learn what I consider good habits
00:55 GargantuaSauce and i actually do follow your things and gain inspiration from your ridiculous experiments rue
00:55 rue_bed heh
00:55 RifRaf yes and i'll keep studying C, did a bit at lunch, have a c compiler on every computer now and the book
00:55 rue_bed I do alot of things for the sake of having done them, sometimes I need to do things and I'v been all over hte problems bfore, so it just happens
00:56 rue_bed RifRaf, anything your wondering about as far as the C goes?
00:56 RifRaf nope, i have not working out the EOF char yet, thats my current test, i did make a smily face though
00:57 piney_ my coding issue is i'll do a project, then take a break. if i stay away from programming for ~ a year, i forget a lot and it takes a good bit to get back on track.
00:58 rue_bed RifRaf, do you know what header file defines EOF ?
00:58 RifRaf yes am getting back on track here too, i did have exposure to alot of C but just never learnt from scratch, with i am now
00:58 RifRaf must be stdio.h only one i am using so far
00:59 RifRaf i'll do a bit of C once i get this arm assembled\
00:59 GargantuaSauce i am a software dude by training and trade but anything mechanical brings out the moron within me
00:59 rue_bed yup
00:59 RifRaf but then i'll probly want to make the arm do some new stuff
00:59 rue_bed do you know what data type EOF is?
00:59 RifRaf a chat or int
00:59 rue_bed ok,
00:59 RifRaf char
01:00 rue_bed how do you print the value of a character?
01:00 RifRaf i am using char to try make it display, is hidden as an int
01:00 RifRaf or something like that
01:00 RifRaf putchar
01:00 RifRaf ()
01:00 GargantuaSauce use printf
01:00 RifRaf only know a few commands so far
01:00 RifRaf am not upto printf :)
01:00 GargantuaSauce its format parameter allows you to specify the interpretation of the other parameters
01:01 rue_bed really?
01:01 RifRaf yes, am on page 20
01:01 rue_bed they dont do printf early?
01:01 rue_bed hmm
01:01 RifRaf maybe after chapter 1
01:01 RifRaf actual i lie
01:01 RifRaf am sure hello world uysed printf
01:01 GargantuaSauce so printf("%d", 55); will give you 55
01:01 RifRaf yep
01:01 GargantuaSauce printf("%c", 55) will give you 7
01:02 RifRaf ah ok, so i will use printf, i think that must be the trick to this exercise, think about other stuff they have showed me
01:03 GargantuaSauce just remember that all the types are inherently numbers, char has no special semantics that make it a character
01:03 rue_bed RifRaf, your inspiring me to finish my new cnc
01:03 RifRaf %d is an int, %c is an int, and %f3.2 would be a float to 3 numbers and 2 decimal points
01:03 RifRaf woops %c is char
01:04 RifRaf this may all be wrong, but using my limited memory
01:04 rue_bed your right
01:04 RifRaf to prove i am actually doing C
01:04 theBear you're :)
01:04 rue_bed hah, you dont need to prove it
01:04 rue_bed I dont need no stinking approstrophies
01:05 rue_bed :)
01:05 theBear or e's i spose :) silly vowels
01:05 rue_bed theBear, you wanna move to canada get free room and board for being a shop henchmen?
01:05 theBear i mean slly vwls
01:06 rue_bed heh
01:06 theBear ok, send me a ticket
01:06 theBear i should warn tho, i may never be able to lift more than 10kg again
01:06 rue_bed well, the current roommate is $3k behind on rent
01:06 GargantuaSauce this is in BC?
01:06 rue_bed theBear, its ok, we will put you in a mecha suit and you can carry cars around
01:07 rue_bed I'm in bc, yea
01:07 RifRaf sounds like he is taking you for a ride rue
01:07 GargantuaSauce how many hours of shop henchmanship are we talking
01:07 theBear cool
01:08 rue_bed if I'm gonna have a gimped, broke roommate, rather have one like theBear who is smart about electronics n stuff
01:08 theBear i'll do all my waking hours so long as i can play in the snow and eat occasionally
01:08 theBear and i don't eat much
01:08 theBear gimped and plumped, like a fancy french couch
01:08 rue_bed we dunt get no snow this year
01:08 theBear i can wait
01:09 rue_bed wait, this might not work,
01:09 theBear and i only eat about 2/5ths as often as most things
01:09 rue_bed any girlfriend I would try to get would automaitcally stick the the ozy
01:09 RifRaf heh i have a friend on his way to BC to go snowboarding, won't he get a surprise
01:09 theBear apart from being crippled, my body is amazingly awesome
01:09 theBear lol
01:09 rue_bed well there is snow on the mountian
01:09 RifRaf phew
01:09 theBear i'm much less attractive as a cripple
01:10 rue_bed dosn't matter, the hair and accent
01:10 rue_bed zzzt-> girl
01:10 theBear my hair is kinda awesome
01:10 theBear i suppose one of us could turn gay
01:10 theBear that'd solve the issue
01:10 rue_bed no
01:10 rue_bed that wouldn't be good
01:11 rue_bed really, there has to be a solution for this...
01:11 rue_bed he's $3k behind, thats accumulatily 6 months
01:11 theBear what if we make me uglier ?
01:12 rue_bed more scars? :)
01:12 RifRaf BC buds will solve everthing theBear
01:12 theBear i wouldn't mind a large face-scar of some kind, but that might have the opposite result :)
01:12 rue_bed maybe being run over a few more times with a car?
01:12 theBear mmm, they are known internationally for goodness
01:12 theBear i aint been run OVER yet, but ya know, i already crippled, i give it a go
01:13 theBear i rolled over a car if that helps
01:13 rue_bed ah, you run over cars
01:13 rue_bed hmm
01:13 RifRaf heh a cow rolled over my car
01:13 rue_bed theBear, you were ok when I was down, weren't ya?
01:14 rue_bed RifRaf, ?
01:14 theBear yeah, i was 'fine' then
01:14 theBear times have changed
01:14 theBear hehe, crazy cows.. was it skateboarding and you ran a redlight ?
01:14 rue_bed I recall a string of problems you encountered
01:14 rue_bed one of the 100km/hr back roads
01:14 RifRaf just what a said rue, just appeared out of knowwhere as i was heading home at 4am
01:15 theBear damned pills.. i was thinking of taking some earlier, i don't THINK i did... hmmm
01:15 RifRaf nope in my driveway, one of the reasons i no longer live there
01:15 rue_bed ah
01:15 rue_bed at the farm?
01:15 RifRaf yeah
01:15 rue_bed oooo
01:15 theBear crap.... should probly visit a chemist before the end of the day
01:16 rue_bed I think you were offline when that happened weren't ya
01:16 rue_bed !time
01:16 tobbor My watch says its 11:08PM Wed Feb 06 2013
01:16 theBear your watch si crazy !
01:16 rue_bed yours has the wrong hours
01:16 theBear i always thought 16oclock sounded crazy
01:16 RifRaf man have mounted this servo 4 times and still getting it wrong
01:17 RifRaf where are the plans when you need em :/
01:17 RifRaf everything is alot closer on the gripper, stuff getting in the way
01:18 rue_bed RifRaf, I'd like to try to make one myself if you could send me 1:1 pdf's with part outlines
01:18 RifRaf rue will be happy to
01:19 RifRaf will email you a set when its made
01:19 rue_bed bah, wind is gonna invert my damn work tent
01:19 RifRaf is still morphing
01:20 GargantuaSauce i'd go for it too, i'd be extruding it though
01:20 RifRaf rue it is going to use 3 different servos motor types, but the cool thing is
01:20 RifRaf i am drawing less power with a bigger stronger servo that is not overloaded like the sg90 in places
01:21 RifRaf though this version has not moved yet, but based on earlier models its gonna be sweet
04:22 fRaf is happ
04:22 RifRaf anyone wanna see new arm?
04:25 Triffid_Hunter sure
04:26 RifRaf triffid i forgot to post the stuff today, but knock off early tomorrow and will get it done for sure
04:26 Triffid_Hunter no worries :)
04:27 RifRaf http://imagebin.org/245788 http://imagebin.org/245789 http://imagebin.org/245791
04:27 Triffid_Hunter here, let me show you somthing I'm working on
04:27 Triffid_Hunter heh cute, looks like it'd be pretty wobbly
04:28 RifRaf yep, where it wobbles will thicken the acrylic, have all sizes to choose from, starting with 3mm to keep it light
04:28 RifRaf upto 25mm thick
04:28 RifRaf but won't need that
04:29 RifRaf maybe shortening the final arm would make things easier
04:29 RifRaf it works awesome upside down though, like a hanging arm
04:29 RifRaf which is kinda what i wanna make in the long run anyway
04:30 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: http://github.com/triffid/BLDC
04:30 RifRaf k
04:30 RifRaf what versionis that in?
04:30 Triffid_Hunter 6.2
04:31 RifRaf i only still have an old one. will try
04:31 RifRaf too new
04:31 RifRaf will see what i can do about it
04:31 Triffid_Hunter *shrug* that's the one in my distro's package manager
04:31 Triffid_Hunter can post screencaps I suppose
04:31 Triffid_Hunter although it's pretty tricky without being able to turn the layers on and off
04:32 RifRaf yeah is ok, i saw the stuff you were doing before, can imagine it pretty intricate
04:33 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: http://triffid-hunter.no-ip.info/bldc_sch.png bldc_brd.png
04:33 RifRaf i have had big goggles on to make that arm, sucks not being able to see anymore, but increase the magnification and the fingers are still stable
04:33 Triffid_Hunter I'm curious to see how many amps I can push with this design before it blows up
04:34 RifRaf thats quite a cap array goin on there
04:34 Triffid_Hunter I take my decoupling seriously, when numbers indicate this thing should be getting warm at 100A
04:35 RifRaf so what is the main chip?
04:35 Triffid_Hunter A4960
04:35 Triffid_Hunter the allegro one, not the analog devices one
04:36 RifRaf pretty cool, can't wait to see you gadgets one day, i have not even used a brushless motor yet
04:36 Triffid_Hunter I have one sitting here waiting for me to play with it.. rated 4200kV, 87A
04:37 Triffid_Hunter has a 3.17mm shaft which seems pretty insane considering the current rating
04:37 RifRaf serious
04:37 RifRaf lol yep, would like at least 6mm or more
04:37 Triffid_Hunter hobbyking had them on special for $12
04:37 Triffid_Hunter so I don't mind much if I blow it up testing something interesting
04:38 RifRaf yep
04:38 Triffid_Hunter I keep looking at this schem and thinking I need diodes, but then I remember how big 100A diodes are
04:38 RifRaf i like testing shit till it breaks, but that will take some testing to blow up i'd say
04:38 RifRaf the motor drivers will be smokin :)
04:39 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: esp considering those mosfets are 0.8mOhm, max current 429A (silicon limited) 240A (package limited)
04:39 RifRaf its getting crazy now
04:40 RifRaf what do you plan to drive with it?
04:40 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: yeah at 100A they're dumping a mere 8 watts excl. switching losses
04:40 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: no idea, maybe my E-bike when I make it
04:41 RifRaf yep cool, needs to be something decent, i can use em for me next bionic arm
04:43 RifRaf lol, i fortgot this android computer was plugged into me monitor, is still running fine after 2 weeks or so
04:43 RifRaf just switched inputs and it was there
04:43 RifRaf would be nice to use on a robot when i can code
04:43 RifRaf i wanna learn android stuff too
04:44 RifRaf does not seem too different
04:46 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: probably easier to get something that runs vanilla linux without a shit-fight for robotics stuff, rpi and similar
04:46 Triffid_Hunter then add an arduino or cortex-m3 or similar for all your I/O
04:48 Triffid_Hunter those big striped sections from the power input to the mosfets are an experiment, basically it's a combo of tstop and tcream so if the boards are ever professionally made they'll expose the copper there and add solder paste to beef up the connections
04:51 RifRaf you really know your stuff, do you do this kinda stuff to earn a crust as well?
04:52 Triffid_Hunter sort of.. I'm working with a 3d printer manufacturer in the states on next generation firmware, luckily it involves some eletronics too
04:52 RifRaf i am so happy to have this new thing here
04:52 RifRaf a week ago i wanted a bracket to be able to use a servo, and it turned into something way cool
04:52 Triffid_Hunter laser cutter?
04:53 RifRaf just a router that i run at work
04:53 RifRaf 4000mm x 2000mm bed
04:53 Triffid_Hunter I've been up to my eyeballs in 3d printers for the past year, check this out -> http://youtu.be/0m7qMmTXLNo and http://youtu.be/0l3Z7WVfa9c and http://youtu.be/C8OcIe47-4s
04:53 RifRaf with huge motor, i just cut boring shit mainly all day, but decided to make the most of it now that its kinda mine
04:54 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: "it.. er.. needed.. um.. some recalibration!"
04:56 Triffid_Hunter I worked with CSIRO for a while doing robotics stuff.. dealing with massive bureaucracy was kinda tedious though
04:57 RifRaf Triffid_Hunter very nice, so the parts were made on the printer, do you consider them strong?
04:57 RifRaf i have been relying on the bonding of acrylic glue, which kinda welds, and is stronger than the acrylic itself
04:58 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: absolutely, almost as strong as lego
04:58 RifRaf thats very nice, and withstands heat after its made?
04:58 RifRaf or remelts?
04:58 Triffid_Hunter I broke the foot by dropping the whole leg onto concrete, but it was always a weak point
04:58 RifRaf i am thinkin it must be a chemical reaction that sets solid
04:58 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: can print from ABS if you're worried about heat
04:58 Triffid_Hunter ABS is good to ~105c
04:59 Triffid_Hunter the parts in the vid are PLA, it goes soft at 60c
04:59 RifRaf k
05:00 RifRaf i was cutting a bunch of 20mm acrylic today and other thick stuff, the possibilities are endless, need to get some tools to do 3d stuff
05:00 RifRaf have no ball nose and such
05:01 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: right, so next time I'm doing pc case mods I should contact you for tri-color etching?
05:02 RifRaf how is the tricolor done?
05:02 RifRaf oh i get it, you can do that but i cannot :)
05:02 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: 3 really thin sheets, etched, side-lit with RGB, one colour each sheet
05:02 RifRaf wow cool, i have alot of rgb leds and stuff
05:03 Triffid_Hunter get a subtle 3d effect from the parallax vs sheet thickness
05:03 RifRaf yep would like to see pictures
05:04 RifRaf i know we can polish acrylic so its like glass
05:04 RifRaf way better than flaming it
05:04 RifRaf all my bits are just rough cut with 3mm bit
05:05 RifRaf you would hardly see it if it was polished
05:05 RifRaf so light travels really well throught it
05:07 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: perfect.. I have seen it done several times, can't find links atm though
05:08 RifRaf i make these 20mm thick letters at work that are pretty nice, they go on pylons and stuff, back illuminated
05:11 RifRaf can't wait to wake up in morn and get this new creation moving, need to double check wiring and stuff when sober
05:12 RifRaf had this idea to save alot of wires, by only using 1 + and - for all servos
05:12 RifRaf so i need to make sure i have not shorted anything etc
05:13 RifRaf alot less tangles
05:15 Triffid_Hunter yeah can bus the servo power, best hope your regulator can handle the draw though
05:15 RifRaf is a 2A one
05:15 RifRaf i know thats not alot
05:16 RifRaf but am testing loading the servos with bench supplu and should be ok
05:17 RifRaf the psu cost 1.65 or something so will see how it goes :) , have spares
05:17 RifRaf Triffid_Hunter you think i can gang these supplies, i know you have some, like put 2 in paralell?
05:18 RifRaf the chip on the psu gets warm but never has burnt out yet, and some servos got might hot
05:19 RifRaf they are those 2A adjustable voltage regulators
05:20 Triffid_Hunter RifRaf: ah yeah I have a drawer full of them, LM2596 boards from china right?
05:20 Triffid_Hunter might be able to parallel them, note that there will always be one providing the first 2A and it'll run hottest
05:20 RifRaf the microcontroller is using same supply and all good so far, the uC pcb has a 6V to 5V convertor onboard, the 2A drops the 7.2V nimh down to the 6V
05:20 RifRaf yep
05:20 Triffid_Hunter need resistors to help them share if you want to avoid that, just like with BJTs
05:21 RifRaf got some with a 3 digit 7seg on them today in mail
05:21 Triffid_Hunter I got a 5A ubec from hobbyking, that's just two 3A ones in parallel
05:21 RifRaf yeah was gonna get some 5A ones to be sure
05:22 RifRaf these are nice and smal though, got alot in this arm without using much space
05:23 RifRaf my task for the weekend is to get the 4 buttons making the arm do stuff from gaits i program with the gait designer thing
05:23 Triffid_Hunter the firmware I'm being paid to work on at the moment is on an lpc1769, these would make really nice chips for robots
05:23 Triffid_Hunter we're running callbacks between C++ classes at 100khz!
05:25 RifRaf must be pretty cool to do that stuff, makes my projects seem so small, but i am doing it just for meself, cause i once said i would do it
05:25 RifRaf one day foxy will get me a beer!
05:25 Triffid_Hunter yeah that's how I started off.. I'd still be working on this project if they weren't paying me, just wouldn't be focusing quite as hard
05:26 RifRaf yep work really gets in the way of doing what you want :)
05:28 Triffid_Hunter hah I simply can't work that way
05:29 Triffid_Hunter if I try to do something I don't want to do, my brain turns off
05:30 RifRaf lol, i just use that time to think of my own stuff, good thing about the router is it takes time to do its job once programmed
05:30 theBear you can do thing that aren't what you want to do but still not not want to do them
05:30 RifRaf and have to keep an eye on it, but can also think about me oun stuff
05:31 Triffid_Hunter theBear: most people can.. I have far more difficulty with it than most folk though.. for me it's a full on internal battle whereas others tell me it's a simple choice for them
05:33 theBear i think you misunderstand what i'm saying... for example, i might want to go to the pub, but i can still go to work or work on a project, so long as those aren't things i specifically don't want to do
05:33 RifRaf theBear yep, but we have to live, i could not afford shit if i didn't have a job, so when i do work for money i just do what they want
05:33 theBear not-wanting to do something is different to wanting to do something else
05:33 RifRaf yep, a means to an end
05:34 RifRaf we never find that end, and if i did i think i'd be bored
05:34 theBear so long as you don't specifically dislike what you are doing, just don't specifically desire to do it, you can probably do it if you have a reason
05:36 RifRaf i hate computers, fixing them, and don't have to do it anymore, yay
05:37 RifRaf theBear i got butterfingers playing, funny old tunes
05:38 theBear heh very good
06:13 MrTrick hehehe, another discussion about procrastination?
06:13 MrTrick Sufferers, check out; http://www.stanforddaily.com/2011/10/04/philosophy-prof-wins-ig-nobel-prize-for-structured-procrastination/
06:14 NightRavenXS lol
06:18 RifRaf heh, too true
06:20 RifRaf and 'butterfingers, i love work' is playin, worth a listen if you never heard it
06:35 theBear oi rif ! you got credit to send a potentially important text message for me ? i just ran out and the only shops i can limp to are closed and my stupid landline is stuck on engaged signal for some stupid reason
06:36 NightRavenXS landline stuck on engaged?
06:36 NightRavenXS how many phones do you have at home?
06:36 theBear landline and mobile... is that unusual ?
06:36 NightRavenXS yes
06:36 NightRavenXS quite
06:36 eBear shakes
06:36 theBear kids these days
06:37 NightRavenXS yes i am 126 and haven't used dialup
06:37 NightRavenXS oh lol *16
06:38 theBear it's not about dialup, it's about 'naked' dsl costing more than getting a package with a landline, and as a bonus local calls are cheaper on a landline, they also don't go flat or run out of credit in most cases... also haven't seen one screw up in the last 20 years or so
06:45 theBear meh, landline started working again... pffft, why does this shit always happen when i'm way too drunk or drugged up to deal with it ?
06:45 Rif cool, cause i still cannot get my phone going, hardly use it
06:45 Triffid_Hunter you're like that frequently so poisson distribution is favourable?