#robotics Logs

Sep 09 2012

13:47 katsmeow-afk <BBC News quote> Mr Soros is to outline his ideas in a specch on Monday in Germany
14:05 rue_mohr "the best way to play catchup is quickly"
14:53 rue_house ok, lunch, then shopping, then dr who, then birthday party with uncle, then 3d printer, then attic ductwork, then supper, then bed, then shower, then breakfast, then work, then ...hmm have to see
14:53 rue_house oh and before bed I have to order the days $1 ebay item
14:58 Atak anyone know of any free shell hosts or subdomain hosts?
14:59 Atak i was using hypeshell but they went offline
15:00 rue_house I looked once, it was overly complicated
15:00 rue_house even web ssh clients are hard to find
16:07 rue_house what came after groceries?
16:08 rue_house dr who, but thats at 3, its 1:56 now
16:08 rue_house so I suppose I can work on the 3d printer
17:02 rue_mohr well, I got a sear cleared
17:02 rue_mohr seat
17:08 home so
17:08 home 3d printers
17:08 home and robotics
21:09 rue_house printer and robots my my!
21:09 Tom_itx do you recall what ebayer you got your 2560 from?
21:15 rue_house seraching...
21:16 Tom_itx it's ok, i'll guess like you did
21:17 Tom_itx one's as good as the next probably
21:17 Triffid_Hunter Tom_itx: fwiw the hong kong clones are higher quality than genuine italian ones
21:18 Tom_itx so get the electronics from ebay instead of a store?
21:18 rue_house where do puchases go that you archive?
21:18 orlok Triffid_Hunter: arduino's?
21:18 rue_house it looks like a write-only archive...
21:18 Tom_itx rue_house dunno
21:18 Triffid_Hunter orlok: yep
21:18 orlok Triffid_Hunter: what do you think of the freetronics gear?
21:18 Triffid_Hunter Tom_itx: most of the stores get from hong kong I'm sure
21:19 Triffid_Hunter orlok: looks like arduino clones with a bit more variety, haven't looked closer than that
21:19 orlok ahh, PCB quality is very very nice
21:20 rue_house Seller: womarts
21:20 orlok Triffid_Hunter: Been going through mendel prusa parts list, etc, it seems the only stuff you dont sell are nuts and washers?
21:20 orlok Or did i miss those?
21:21 Triffid_Hunter orlok: yeah we don't have small fasteners yet, trying to wrangle a sane deal from a fastener supplier.. also no decent instructions for our customised kits
21:21 rue_house http://www.ebay.com/itm/w-Tracking-ATmega2560-16AU-Board-Free-USB-Cable-ARDUINO-MEGA-2560-A070-/251130236155?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a78874cfb
21:21 rue_house goin up, 25 now
21:24 Tom_itx i'm lookin at full kits too
21:24 Tom_itx with the ramps board
21:24 Tom_itx not sure yet
21:25 rue_house what are the full kit worth
21:25 rue_house the ramps board is a joke, make that yourself
21:26 Tom_itx http://www.ebay.com/itm/Complete-set-RAMPS-1-4-electronics-SD-RAMPS-and-cables-RepRap-3D-printer-/170905480381?_trksid=p2045573.m2042&_trkparms=aid%3D111000%26algo%3DREC.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D27%26meid%3D1936347917970826900%26pid%3D100033%26prg%3D1011%26rk%3D2%26
21:26 Tom_itx SD
21:26 Triffid_Hunter Tom_itx: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/aL_pHVdGiNe2rhwacUjNQQ https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/oxSHmuY2Y84gtsdi2Tp5dg and https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/hq6v_oZ5fo3z6l42PHAAPtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0
21:26 Triffid_Hunter making own electronics is easy ;)
21:27 Tom_itx 404
21:27 Triffid_Hunter ramps is just a breakout for 3 mosfets, 4 stepper drivers, 2 thermistor inputs and a few endstops
21:27 Triffid_Hunter Tom_itx: there's 3 links there, try one at a time :P
21:28 rue_house yea, its just a jumper board
21:28 Tom_itx i suppose
21:28 Tom_itx i'm gettin lazy
21:29 Tom_itx Triffid_Hunter are those pololu drivers under the heatsink?
21:30 Triffid_Hunter yes
21:31 Tom_itx had any problems with em?
21:31 Tom_itx are these Rattm steppers any good? http://www.robosprout.com/motors/stepper-motors.html
21:33 Tom_itx ahh, that appears to be one in kthnx list
21:35 Triffid_Hunter Tom_itx: nope, those are the original 4 pololus I bought over a year ago, still working perfectly
21:35 Tom_itx i think alot of problems arrise from the end users
21:35 Triffid_Hunter Tom_itx: since they're known to die if you unplug a motor while powered, I suspect tales of their untimely death are largely due to their modular nature
21:36 Triffid_Hunter ie dodgy contacts
21:36 Tom_itx yeah
21:36 Tom_itx so use screw terminals
21:36 Triffid_Hunter works for me
21:36 Triffid_Hunter also skip female headers, no way those things are happy with amps flowing through them, I've opened them up
21:37 Tom_itx no
21:37 Triffid_Hunter more recent electronics have everything soldered onto one board
21:38 Triffid_Hunter apart from skipping issues with crappy female headers, it also allows a proper thermal design
21:38 Tom_itx i've seen the new arm boards
21:38 Tom_itx not sure i want an arm board
21:38 Triffid_Hunter I'm excited about them
21:39 Tom_itx i think they're great, just not sure i have time to learn another chip
21:39 Tom_itx i was a little weak on all his SMT headers though
21:40 Tom_itx the new driver chip looks promising
21:42 Triffid_Hunter A4982?
21:43 Tom_itx yes
21:56 Atak those robosprout prices look kind of high
21:58 Tom_itx for 5?
22:00 Atak was looking at stuff on there like the Arduino Mega 2560 for $70
22:00 Atak doesnt that go for $50 everywhere
22:00 rue_house everything for a reprap is $100
22:01 Tom_itx i wouldn't get an arduino from them anyway
22:01 Tom_itx rue_house you're not including steppers
22:01 Tom_itx because you have them
22:01 rue_house yes
22:02 Tom_itx the ones i have aren't big enough
22:02 rue_house plastic kit is $100, hardware is $100 head is $100 rolls of plastic are $100 (for 2)
22:02 Tom_itx oh
22:02 Tom_itx i thought you meant the whole darn thing
22:02 Atak sorry im not familiar with a reprap, whats it do?
22:02 Tom_itx 3d printer
22:02 rue_house people put out $1000 to $2000 for a finished reprap
22:03 Tom_itx not these people
22:03 Tom_itx :D
22:03 rue_house :)
22:03 rue_house but I'm $300 so far
22:03 Atak hmmm thats not bad
22:03 rue_house mines not finished
22:03 rue_house but I think I have everything I need
22:04 Tom_itx i'm still in the wishing stage
22:04 Tom_itx i should have you send me a couple gears but i don't think the gears you have are strong enough
22:05 Atak so what material do they use to create or print objects
22:05 rue_house I'm told printing a parts set for a reprap chews back almost a whole roll of plastic
22:05 rue_house which dosn't add up, their 2kg rolls and the parts kit is NOT 2kg
22:06 rue_house Atak, ABS or PLA
22:06 Atak im going to have to look into this
22:07 Tom_itx #reprap
22:08 Atak cool I have some tinkerforge parts I've been wanting to put to use
22:48 rue_bed http://www.endangeredfishalliance.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/car5.jpg <-- you idiot! seriously? seriously? you locked the keys in??? how the hell do we get in now!?
22:49 GuShH rue_bed: ever used low-kickback chains?
22:50 rue_bed kickback?
22:50 GuShH chainsaw.
22:51 rue_bed http://www.globaltoronto.com/uploadedImages/Global_Toronto/News/OttawaCarSinkhole.jpg <-- is was official, johns soul was owned by his wife, to square up, satan has to take the car
22:51 rue_bed I dont use a chainsaw much
22:52 rue_bed http://s3.amazonaws.com/heirnet/photos/17405/dog-window-car.jpg <-- and now you know where rolls roice got inspiration for thier early car designs
22:53 katsmeow-afk "low kickback" = "won't cut oak or heart pine"
22:54 rue_bed ok
22:54 GuShH katsmeow-afk: it won't cut ANYTHING
22:54 GuShH that's why I'm asking.
22:54 GuShH it's as if I had the chain backwards, but I didn't.
22:54 GuShH Sure it cuts, but probably 20% of what my regular chain cuts
22:54 katsmeow-afk yea, the drag links are way too high, the teth rake *down* too steeply
22:54 GuShH and it's as sharp as I can get it
22:55 rue_bed http://www.divapor.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/car-insurnace.jpg <-- no, no wait, after the first one the cars on the blocks, maybe it we put it on the roof instead
22:55 GuShH I'm disappointed at it.
22:55 katsmeow-afk get a "true chisel" or a "semi-chisel" chain, and keep it aggressively sharp, my electric Ryobi cuts 16" thick oak like butter
22:56 katsmeow-afk it will drop thru 4" pine like it wasn't there
22:56 katsmeow-afk and not bog the motor, and need no push at all
22:56 katsmeow-afk throws 1/4 chuncks of wood
22:56 GuShH the sharpest chain I have is a no-name chinese one, the oregon ones I just can't get them as sharp
22:57 katsmeow-afk oregon is a brand name, not a chain profile
22:57 GuShH they're all the same profile, I'm just saying I don't like the brand.
22:57 GuShH it seems brand isn't everything
22:58 katsmeow-afk it isn't,, also, like you know now, low kickback won't cut,a nd is hardly any safeer if you use a saw properly
22:58 katsmeow-afk if you haveto fight it to cut, it isn't safe
22:58 GuShH I noticed on one of the oregon chains they have tiny holes to carry more oil inside the bar
22:59 Tom_itx http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/5pcs-NEMA17-78-Oz-in-CNC-stepper-motor-stepping-motor-1-8A/704350_554160664.html
22:59 Tom_itx good or bad?
22:59 katsmeow-afk you can do without the holes in the tangs
22:59 GuShH katsmeow-afk: I already had the chain but I never used it, gave it a go today... put the regular one back on, I think they're gimmick chains and they aren't good for anything.
22:59 GuShH the chain just hovers on the wood instead of cutting through
23:00 Tom_itx cut wrong
23:00 ShH eyer
23:00 Tom_itx sharpened wrong
23:00 katsmeow-afk Insultion Strength--------500VAC for one minute
23:00 GuShH let's blame oregon ?
23:00 katsmeow-afk so don't insult it at 700v
23:01 Tom_itx grind a more agressive bite on it
23:01 GuShH Tom_itx: low-kickback chains are a gimmick.
23:01 GuShH there's no way it can bite with that massive link in between
23:02 Tom_itx cut it off
23:02 katsmeow-afk http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saw_chain#Chisel_and_semi-chisel_teeth <<== note no drag links, only small cut gauges
23:03 katsmeow-afk also, i use a size smaller dremel abrasive than the chisel calls for, so i get some undercut, it cuts faster
23:03 GuShH I like agressive, full chisel chains.
23:03 GuShH katsmeow-afk: but it dulls faster too, in theory
23:03 Tom_itx i just set my grinder to cut that nub down further
23:04 katsmeow-afk keep the chain tight, without those drag links the teeth can get wobbley, tight (when cold), with a roller tipped bar, cuts much smoother,, and get oil on it before you hit wood
23:04 GuShH sthil has some funky designs on their low-kickback chains... not sure if they make any difference
23:04 GuShH sure, the gimmick chain gave me a cleaner cut, but it took 4 times longer.
23:04 katsmeow-afk clearer pics of the tooth profile on http://www.sawmillchainsaws.com/sawchains.htm
23:05 katsmeow-afk the chipper tooth is like cuting the wood twice
23:05 GuShH half chisel, but instead of wood chips it was pulling out tiny curls
23:05 katsmeow-afk but it beats anti-kickbacks
23:05 katsmeow-afk yea, curls=you aren't getting a bite on the log
23:06 GuShH I actually had to force it down, tell me how is that safer than letting it cut for you?
23:06 katsmeow-afk use a body grinder to take downt he drag links, and if that doesn't help , then litely take .020 ata time off the depth guages in front of the tooths
23:06 GuShH you shouldn't have to apply force.
23:07 GuShH I'll deal with it once my good chain wears down :p
23:07 katsmeow-afk "taking down" the drag links won't help a lot, but it will get them to let the bar get closer to the wood
23:07 GuShH just find it hard to believe people would want these chains...
23:08 Tom_itx average jo doesn't know
23:09 katsmeow-afk Rakers between the teeth:
23:09 katsmeow-afk The rakers in between the teeth are very important and should be filed down to 35 thousands so the sawchain can get a decent bite,
23:09 Tom_itx i probably go more than that on my big saw
23:10 katsmeow-afk if you got a big saw, why are you running a chain with rakers in the first place?
23:10 GuShH lol
23:10 Tom_itx it may not have them, i'm not really sure
23:10 GuShH my biggest saw has a skip tooth chain and that's how I like it.
23:10 katsmeow-afk rakers are what makes the chain low kickback
23:10 Tom_itx i got 3 different sets of chains
23:11 Tom_itx maybe 4
23:11 Tom_itx mine may be skip tooth i'm not really sure
23:11 Tom_itx never payed much attention to them
23:11 Tom_itx stihl on 2 of em
23:11 Tom_itx the other is an old mac
23:12 Tom_itx 24" bar iirc, maybe 28
23:12 GuShH I like an agressive cut, I don't think it should be any other way.
23:13 katsmeow-afk well, if you aren't useto an aggressive cut, the first time it bite it may try to jerk you off your paws
23:14 katsmeow-afk i put an aggressive biter on a bow saw once, that thing was impossible to control overhead after that
23:14 katsmeow-afk i went back to a slower chain on it
23:14 GuShH actually my small saw has a semi skip full chisel
23:15 GuShH small is 16"
23:16 katsmeow-afk imo, roller tip bars are mandatory too
23:16 katsmeow-afk grease them, you can get adaptors for a regular grease gun, or you can get hand-sized push greasers
23:17 GuShH mandatory?
23:17 katsmeow-afk less work for the saw, longer life on the chains
23:18 GuShH all new chainsaws I've seen come with them
23:18 katsmeow-afk *much* easier on the saw when cutting on the top of the bar
23:18 tsmeow-afk is old and useto haveto special order bars with roller
23:19 katsmeow-afk which reminds me, top cutting with skip-tooth chain is rather dangerous
23:19 GuShH I buy some grease that already comes with the proper tip to apply it
23:19 GuShH lithium stuff
23:22 GuShH so chainsaw gimmick number 2.... the "no tool" chain tensioners...
23:22 GuShH specially the ones poulan came up with! what a joke
23:22 GuShH all plastic.
23:22 tsmeow-afk
23:24 GuShH probably one of the most returned chainsaws in history.
23:26 GuShH katsmeow-afk: http://www.northerntool.com/images/product/images/395610_lg.jpg
23:26 katsmeow-afk i luved my Homelite 330, 18" bar, true square chisel chain, it would keep up with some husquavarnas, and was a lot easyer to handle
23:26 katsmeow-afk hurt back = i can't pull start it now
23:27 GuShH no decompression valve?
23:27 GuShH I wish I could retrofit one of those valves...
23:27 katsmeow-afk the ryobi electric cuts surprisingly well, 18" bar, chisel chain, keep it sharp, don't bog it down, spits out huge hunks of wood
23:27 GuShH oh 330, maybe 33cc? not a fan of homelite these days
23:28 katsmeow-afk the 330 is circa early 1970's, not lot of features on it
23:28 katsmeow-afk i hatesd all other homelites
23:28 GuShH if I ever get a massive big ass chainsaw it will have to come with a valve.
23:29 katsmeow-afk imo, homelite xl should be melted down as scrap metal
23:29 GuShH katsmeow-afk: I would've thought you could easily come up with a way to lock the chainsaw onto something so you can pull start it with ease
23:30 katsmeow-afk when out in the woods? heh,, and besides, it's the low-back twist that gets me
23:30 katsmeow-afk at the end of the pull stroke
23:30 katsmeow-afk http://www.vintagechainsaw.org/wp-content/uploads/HomeLite330.JPG
23:31 GuShH that's quite a design for the 70s
23:31 katsmeow-afk i'd have prolly put a gas-pressure starter on it by now,, and a chain oil pump, like i said, no features on those old saws
23:32 katsmeow-afk it could handle a 20" bar and the fastest chain you could find
23:32 GuShH they sell additional oilers you can use on any chainsaw, but you could easily make one yourself for a fraction of the cost
23:32 GuShH I think the guys using them as mill saws love them
23:32 katsmeow-afk 16" on that saw is stupidly short, i ran an 18 just because i felt the 20 was too long for the wood i was cutting
23:33 GuShH hmm looks like it's got a 53cc engine
23:33 GuShH but maybe I got it wrong
23:34 katsmeow-afk bow saw : http://www.vintagechainsaw.org/wp-content/uploads/HomeLiteSuperEZ.png , the one i used was more triangular, much less rounded on the end than those
23:34 ShH saw a winch that you can hook to a chainsaw engine the other
23:35 katsmeow-afk and generators, and poeple used them to power airplanes
23:35 GuShH o.o
23:35 katsmeow-afk saw a circular saw blade on some
23:36 GuShH by airplanes you mean RC planes?
23:36 katsmeow-afk yeas
23:36 GuShH oh.
23:36 katsmeow-afk specially the low profile engines like the 330
23:36 GuShH yes, although the whipper snippers have a lot more suitable engines for that!
23:36 GuShH at least the modern stuff
23:38 ShH doesn't get why the miniature 10 inch chainsaws are so expen
23:39 katsmeow-afk more precision, i expect
23:42 GuShH katsmeow-afk: oh I see what you mean about generators... http://www.best-chain-saws-reviews.good-stuffblog.info/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/chainsaw-gas-can.jpeg
23:42 GuShH haha