#robotics Logs

Sep 04 2012

00:03 rue_house ...
00:04 rue_house does that toal say $5865.99?
00:04 rue_house wait, wtf?
00:05 rue_house thats not something you bought is it?
00:05 katsmeow-afk yeas, but how is 4 bnc connectors going to cost $5064 to ship?
00:06 rue_house write to ebay immediatly and tell them there is a problem
00:06 katsmeow-afk i am kinda hung up on that, and have asked the shipper to reconsider
00:06 rue_house otherwise it might be too late
00:06 rue_house ....
00:06 rue_house $5.06 sounds ok, 4.00 sounds ok, 5064.00 dosn't
00:07 rue_house did it autocalculate shipping?
00:08 rue_house you have a lot of things on your desktop...
00:09 katsmeow-afk my desktop is full
00:09 eadthem mmm ya
00:09 rue_house get another one :)
00:09 eadthem so i think they might of pushed a couple extra zeros
00:09 rue_house I think they entered two numbers without pressing enter between them
00:09 eadthem that would make sense
00:09 rue_house one of those automated listing programs
00:10 rue_house means all their products shipping costs are out by 1 line now
00:10 eadthem well ya know how those BNC connectors are
00:10 katsmeow-afk so they appended strings instead of adding numbers
00:10 eadthem pritty dam heavy things
00:11 rue_house katsmeow-afk, there are programs where you enter everything into a spreadsheet and it lists all the items for you
00:11 eadthem and i guess it cost a bit to have a lift gate truck deliver to the contry
00:11 rue_house so, if they forgot to hit enter when making the sheet....
00:12 eadthem maby there solid gold BNC connectors :p
00:12 rue_house katsmeow-afk, if you need help expalining this to someone who is being stupid, do ask me ok?
00:12 katsmeow-afk ok
00:13 dthem thinks rue_house's thought on the spreadsheet makes the most se
00:13 rue_house to my knowledge ebay bans people for using those listing systems
00:14 eadthem they have there own automated lister system dont they?
00:15 eadthem well im off to bed, keep in mind kat ebay has polocys aganst outragus shipping charges
00:15 eadthem to the point you can get things undone after the fact, so you shuld be protected from this error.
00:16 eadthem cya
00:35 katsmeow-afk seller offered to lower s&h to $5.64, i accepted
03:30 katsmeow-afk 8-wheel drive robot cannon : http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/images/h81000/h81481.jpg
08:54 rue_house oh good!
08:55 rue_house removed some zeros
08:55 rue_house amazing how much subtracting zero can do
08:58 katsmeow-afk yeas, 3 zeros, i got it for 99.9% off the original asking price :-)
19:36 any57622051 damn isp
20:28 DagoRed I want to make a robot around this http://hackaday.com/2012/09/04/open-source-brushless-motor-controller/
20:31 katsmeow But yes one could use a later version of OBLDC called CLogic as a replacement for the control board in Castle Creations motor controllers. But that is not the main focus at the moment. :)
20:31 katsmeow Join us in #open-bldc on freenode or the mailinglist. :)
20:33 DagoRed joining!
20:34 DagoRed And true... one could.
21:22 MrTrick Has anyone here looked at building a SCARA robot before? I need to build a small one for drawing.
21:26 DagoRed Link?
21:27 katsmeow http://www.google.com/search?q=SCARA+robot 564,000 links
21:28 DagoRed katsmeow: I've heard of 3 robot kits in the past referred to the SCARA. One of which was made by OWI.
21:28 katsmeow ok
21:29 DagoRed One used to be based on an older version of this http://www.owirobot.com/wao-kranius/
21:29 DagoRed Which was good for drawing basic shapes.
21:31 MrTrick based on the kranius? It just looks like a turtle-bot.
21:31 katsmeow well, maybe eventually, before Hell freezes over this winter, ...........
21:32 MrTrick I'm okay with having to build it myself, I suppose.
21:38 DagoRed MrTrick: Look at the designs used for robot soccer. You need 4 wheels from a lego mindstorms and 4 motors.
21:39 DagoRed Add another server for lifting a pen and you should have a decent basic design.
21:40 MrTrick DagoRed: I don't follow... SCARA is a type of robot arm, where the 'shoulder' and 'elbow' joint axes are both vertical.
21:41 DagoRed oh....
21:41 MrTrick Some inverse-kinematics (all you need is basic trig) and you can make the end point move in cartesian terms.
21:41 MrTrick My main concern in building something, is making the joints strong so that the arm won't sag at all.
21:42 MrTrick and figuring out whether to use a direct stepper connection, or something indirect and more complex.
21:50 MrTrick has anyone here found or used stepper motors that have a double-ended shaft? (eg out of either end of the motor?)
21:52 delinquentme 1/4"-20 screws
21:52 delinquentme are the standard 1/4in in diameter
21:52 delinquentme right?
21:53 tsmeow
21:53 rue_house :)
21:53 rue_house "rue, the tv remote dosn't work"
21:53 rue_house "why not?"
21:53 katsmeow "we have no tv"
21:53 rue_house "there are no batteries in it"
21:53 rue_house "why not?"
21:53 rue_house "you removed them?"
21:54 rue_house "no, I didn not remove the batteries from the remote"
21:54 rue_house "there are no batteries in it tho"
21:54 katsmeow "so tell the new robot to bring you it's batteries"
21:54 rue_house "there, are, infact, still batteries in the remote"
21:54 rue_house "no there aren't"
21:55 rue_house "I'm truthfully telling you there, are, can you figure out this mystery?"
21:55 rue_house what I did, was to add another remote to the livingroom that has no batteries in it :)
21:55 rue_house its identicle to the normal remote
21:55 rue_house :)
21:56 tsmeow can imagine how pleased the roommat
21:57 delinquentme and what does the 20 correspond to in that number?
21:57 katsmeow damn
21:57 katsmeow 20 = the tpi
21:57 rue_house 20 threads per inch
21:58 orlok so, my GF is now all "hurry up and buy a 3d printer"
21:59 MrTrick *snerk*, what did you tell her you'd make for her?
21:59 tsmeow looks offe
21:59 orlok nothing, i ordered a 3d printed gear heart for her
22:07 rue_house she gonna kick in for the $2000 it costs?
22:07 delinquentme reprap 800
22:07 rue_house whats 800 get you?
22:08 MrTrick orlok: have you seen the rostok?
22:10 orlok rostok.. dont think so
22:11 orlok ahh yeah, nifty
22:15 katsmeow 50 PCS STEC SPXCF1GM1UI 1GB COMPACT FLASH MEMORY CARDS FREE SHIPPING! ; 0 bids $49.99 ; Free Shipping Time left: 20hrs
22:15 katsmeow just the thing for your robots to arry a map witht hem
22:17 delinquentme MrTrick: yeah its AWESOME
22:17 delinquentme I dont get the feed mechanism though
22:21 rue_livingrm 50pcs 1G, china
22:21 rue_livingrm 1G = a card that reports 1G but loops its writes over a 128M storage space
22:21 katsmeow they are in usa, rue
22:21 katsmeow o
22:22 katsmeow 1500 PCS INTEL GT28F320B3TA10?0
22:22 katsmeow $1.25 + $18 s&h : 320kx16 BGA48 100ns access time
22:42 katsmeow http://www.rci.rutgers.edu/~cfs/472_html/Intro/TinkertoyComputer/TinkerToy1.html
22:45 katsmeow Then, in 1961, James Slagle wrote a program that could solve symbolic calculus problems at the level of college students (it got an A on an MIT exam). Around 1965 Bobrow's program solved high-school algebra problems.
22:45 katsmeow And only around 1970 did we have robot programs, like Terry Winograd's, which could deal with children's building blocks well enough to stack them up, take them down, rearrange them, and put them in boxes.
22:46 katsmeow In the early 1950's, Turing began a Chess program, Oettinger wrote a learning program, Kirsch and Selfridge wrote vision programs
22:47 rue_house we been goin nowhere for a long time eh?
22:47 rue_house just look at how long hdtv took
22:48 katsmeow yeas, that idiot sidetrack into digital svga
22:48 rue_house yep
22:49 rue_house :( when I wrote my hex file dumper I didn't put the dumping part into libary functions
22:49 rue_house I cant just pull it out of the code
22:49 rue_house it dumps into ihex and C too
22:49 katsmeow and after Winograd's success, no one developed a robot to get me a root beer from the fridge
22:49 katsmeow even Rif gave up
22:49 e_house puts wheels on the fridge for
22:50 rue_house and I dont drink beer
22:50 katsmeow and a genny to power it
22:50 katsmeow root beer != beer
22:50 rue_house and WHAT IS wrong with a computer-side bar fridge?
22:50 tsmeow sh
22:51 rue_house I cant see hwo to librarize this code
22:52 rue_house heh I see, I cheated
22:52 rue_house I read the file 16 bytes at a time, which is one line
22:53 katsmeow rue, what is the cpu opcode that does the least, besides the nop ?
22:54 katsmeow 1949 The
22:54 katsmeow Whirlwind
22:54 katsmeow computer,
22:54 katsmeow constructed
22:54 katsmeow under the
22:54 katsmeow leadership of
22:54 katsmeow Jay Forrester at
22:54 katsmeow MIT to be the
22:54 katsmeow first real-time
22:54 katsmeow computer, is
22:54 katsmeow placed in service
22:54 katsmeow during the third
22:54 katsmeow quarter. It
22:54 katsmeow contained 5,000
22:58 katsmeow 1893 The first four-function calculator is invented.
22:58 katsmeow 1967 At Texas Instruments, Jack Kilby, Jerry Merryman, and James Van Tassel invent a four-function handheld calculator.
22:59 rue_house cycle wise of data modification wise?
22:59 katsmeow 1970 Shakey, developed at SRI International, is the first robot to use artificial intelligence to navigate.
22:59 tsmeow sings "what have you done ___ lat
23:00 katsmeow either/any
23:00 rue_house you can add 0 to an accumulator
23:00 katsmeow i don't mean the most useless, i mean that actually does the least
23:00 rue_house that may modify flags tho
23:00 katsmeow and it uses the adder
23:00 rue_house 1 cycle
23:01 rue_house I cant think of amny instructions that will do nothing on a regular basis
23:01 katsmeow depends on the cpu, it ffed a zero on one buss, the acc on the other buss, and then gets a result back and stores it to the accumulator, that's not a small amount of activity
23:02 katsmeow not "nothing" , that's nop, i want to know "next to nothing"
23:02 rue_house I assume x86 arch
23:02 rue_house oh oh oh
23:02 rue_house jump to the next address
23:03 rue_house :)
23:03 e_house st
23:03 katsmeow that's preloading the address generator
23:04 rue_house I think that does as little as nop
23:04 katsmeow what about a shift?
23:04 katsmeow or a swap registers? or a clear register?
23:04 rue_house that would modify data tho?
23:05 e_house dosn't understand the games r
23:05 rue_house :(
23:05 katsmeow it modifies data, i don't care, but it wold use less cpu hardware?
23:06 rue_house so the instruction that uses the least hardware?
23:06 katsmeow yeas
23:07 rue_house register t register transfer
23:07 rue_house or clearing the zero flag
23:08 katsmeow ok, which uses the most? fetch indirect indirect indirect relative?
23:08 katsmeow or fetch indirect indirect relative relative?
23:08 katsmeow those use alot of math
23:09 rue_house :) an MMX instruction if this register is this value and that bit is clear of the value pointed to by that register than set this flag
23:09 katsmeow ouch
23:09 rue_house the z80 has a one instruction value search
23:09 rue_house you set the staart address, the value you want to find, and the number of memory locations to search
23:10 katsmeow i didn't consider iterations, in which case, wouldn't "stuff all to stack" be more?
23:10 katsmeow no, i think you're right
23:11 rue_house there are a few one-instruction-multiple-data on x86, I cant remember tham tho
23:20 katsmeow i need to built a baseball batter thing, and experiment with bats and swing speeds and things till i can get the right combination to knock me out, to sleep at night
23:22 rue_house repeated trauma isn't a good thing, just stay up
23:22 rue_house that said, i go to work every day
23:23 katsmeow and i get less done ,, or nothing done, outside
23:23 anannie hi katsmeow
23:23 katsmeow hi anannie
23:23 anannie how are you doing katsmeow?
23:24 anannie katsmeow: Tried melatonin?
23:24 katsmeow i am not "doing" katsmeow!
23:24 katsmeow ;-)
23:24 katsmeow yeas
23:24 katsmeow and herbs
23:24 katsmeow and drugs
23:25 katsmeow if i eat enough stuff to knock me out that way, i stay groggy all the next day
23:27 anannie katsmeow: Then you can use modafinil
23:27 anannie I'm quite serious it works wonders for me
23:27 anannie modafinil gives me a nice 10 hour high in which I can do work
23:27 katsmeow i can't afford moafinal, i have adrafinal
23:27 anannie and then I switch off
23:27 anannie armodafinil works as well
23:28 tsmeow senses a $200/month drug habit coming, just to fall asleep and wak
23:30 rue_house kat, if you never had to sleep, would you miss it?
23:31 katsmeow i hear this body isn't made for "no sleep"
23:31 anannie katsmeow: It's about $3 down here... At the most
23:32 katsmeow for how much?
23:32 katsmeow thee should be a #nootropics or something
23:33 MrTrick katsmeow: how about the Halt-and-catch-fire op?
23:34 rue_house 0010: 0C 0C 0C 0C 0C 0C 0C 0C - 0C 0C 0C 0C 0C 0C 0C 0C ................
23:34 anannie katsmeow: For a month
23:34 katsmeow oh right
23:34 anannie katsmeow: Drugs are cheap down here
23:35 katsmeow you shold open an ebay business then
23:35 katsmeow because everyone is paying too much
23:35 MrTrick delinquentme: A bowden cable - think like how a bicycle's brakes work. The hot end is in the moving end, and the extruder is attached to the stationary frame. Filament is forced down a bendy but not stretchy hollow tube into the hot end.
23:35 katsmeow you should open any online business with paypal
23:36 rue_house todays ebay item opened was an 1/8" to rca audio cable
23:37 katsmeow was it s&h of $5,046 too ?
23:38 rue_house free chipping
23:39 katsmeow new monitor, free Chipping
23:41 katsmeow rue, why do some idiot web servers make the same index.html with 16 versions of ?D=S after them?
23:41 katsmeow ?S=D , ?D=N , etc
23:42 tsmeow googles for "anannie's nootropics and he
23:45 katsmeow Your search - "anannie's nootropics and herbs" - did not match any documents.
23:46 anannie katsmeow: Too many legal hassles... I'll be giving up most of my profits to my lawyers!
23:46 katsmeow research how other poeple do it
23:46 anannie Besides it's a cut throat business it makes much more sense to start a business doing something more unique
23:47 katsmeow right, and i'll keep on paying $70 for what you get for $3
23:48 anannie katsmeow: I bet other people are solving this problem as well
23:48 katsmeow they aren't saying how
23:49 katsmeow doesn't matter
23:49 anannie if you want I'll send you some in a dedicated way after checking the legalities of it
23:50 anannie I'll do it for free as long as you pay for the shipping...
23:50 katsmeow nevermind
23:51 katsmeow i already had one run-in with someone who wanted to do everything "legally", he pissed off everyone around me and they took it out on me
23:52 wizaqua I'm looking for a textbook on AI that covered inference engines that operate on the system's own software. Anybody know a title?
23:54 katsmeow ever hear of SHRDLU ?
23:55 anannie wizaqua: LISP???
23:55 katsmeow lisp is a language, not an Ai itself
23:56 katsmeow http://hci.stanford.edu/winograd/shrdlu/
23:56 anannie true katsmeow, but lisp code can process other lisp code
23:56 katsmeow read the dialod tween the computer and the human on that page
23:57 katsmeow yeas, and SHRDLU is written in LISP , but it's not the LISP doing the inferences
23:57 katsmeow and i promptly give up any more arguement i could make
23:59 wizaqua Yeah I just need a textbook that actually covers self-reflexive reasoning.
23:59 katsmeow ask your library or prof
23:59 wizaqua All i can find on google is researchers talking about it. But I want to see an actual implementation.
23:59 wizaqua I dont havea prof
23:59 katsmeow oh