#robotics Logs
Aug 13 2012
#robotics Calendar
00:03 rue_house kat, your wooden box, the module you have in there is damaged yes?
00:03 rue_house are you gonna send that box to the shipper for them to send you the product back in?
00:04 rue_house its a nice box
00:04 e_house tries to flip over kats name b
00:04 rue_house sadmud
00:04 rue_house huh
00:05 rue_house somehow its more fitting
00:05 dumbass yep, sadmud the dumbass
00:05 rue_house is kat on the back of that tag?
00:05 dumbass somewhere
00:06 dumbass the *wooden* box is what i just made to avoid more of the *cardboard* box-type damage
00:06 dumbass the aluminum bits i need to ship are as sturdy as a paper plate
00:23 rue_house I need to keep some eadable charcoal around for when my stomach is like this
00:24 e_house th
00:24 e_house has an icecream sandw
00:26 rue_house its stuck in my nose, everything smells like gas
00:27 dumbass when i stick icecream sammiches in my nose, they don't smell like gas, what kind are you using?
00:30 rue_house no the smell of gas is stuck in my nose ;)
00:31 dumbass ah
00:32 mbass puts the rest of the ice cream
00:32 rue_house 4 computers, a lawn mower, and the truck
00:32 rue_house this has been a repair driven week
00:32 rue_house maybe more, I dont always notice things I have to fix
00:34 dumbass when i start a week fixing something i need to fix something i need to fix something i need to fix something i need to fix something i need to fix something i need on Friday, i wish i has something better to do
00:34 rue_house yea, it makes things hard to get done
00:35 rue_house "getting to zero"
00:35 rue_house thne there are things like mowing the lawn and changing the fishwater "staying at zero"
00:36 rue_house then there is building new garden beds and planting new trees "getting above zero"
00:36 dumbass we finally got rain, so in addittion to 100lbs of pine cones, i haveto pick up big tree parts, and mow the new grass
00:36 rue_house some types of getting above zero make staying at zero easier
00:37 rue_house nature supplies you with firewood
00:37 dumbass gotta say, if i'd been allowed to have my garden and rabbits, i'd have better problems :-/
00:37 rue_house better problems, interesting point
00:37 dumbass well, if i can show one can be satisfied with the btu of pine cones, praps i can convince humans to cut down fewer trees
00:38 rue_house I suppose not being able to buy an 8th farrari for your collection would class as a 'good' problem
00:38 dumbass i nice forest dropping cones can therefore be far more valuable in most terms humans understand than cutting the whole forest for firewood
00:38 rue_house not being able to find a box to live in during a rainstorm would be a bad one
00:39 rue_house now that we know what we want, we should tear it all down and start again
00:41 dumbass i am, unfortunately, with horrible timing: the boat
00:41 rue_house "thankfull for what I have? never! if we dont push the limit we will never get ahead"
00:41 rue_house 'here, to stay in place, you must run as fast as you can"
00:42 rue_house "give a man fire and he's warm for a day, set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life"
00:43 rue_house "you have to know when to hold them, know when to fold them, know when to walk away, know when to run"
00:44 dumbass or hop up and let them go under you and fall on their face
00:44 rue_house yes, damned chickens
00:45 rue_house "if you cant overpower something, underpower it"
00:45 rue_house "sometimes the best way to get something fixed is to help it finish breaking"
00:46 dumbass test fit : http://DesignerThinking.com/benchpsu.html#bottom
00:48 rue_house looking good
00:49 rue_house you want I can send you some heatsink compound?
00:49 dumbass yeas, it's pretty
00:49 dumbass i got goop
00:49 rue_house ok
00:49 e_house picks at kats name badge a
00:50 rue_house oh kat, I'v a new fav trick for layout
00:50 dumbass well, look, i am a tree hugger too, and you hurt me
00:50 dumbass what layout?
00:51 rue_house draft thing in QCAD (or the like) export to postscript 1:1 convert to pdf, print pdf 1:1 put page on material, tape it on or likewise, punch ciritcal locations as desired, optionally remove, paper, and perform tooling to workpeice
00:51 rue_house no need to worry about being square on your layout
00:52 rue_house I didn't mean to suggest your into clear cutting, just that I cant mentally cope with helping you with that project
00:52 dumbass i dunno QCAD
00:52 dumbass yet you burn trees
00:52 rue_house as I would not ask you to help me with a dog related project
00:52 rue_house qcad is a pretty descent free cad program
00:52 rue_house 2d
00:53 dumbass but i don't do nix
00:53 rue_house it does windows too
00:53 dumbass do a dog thing, but understand it's problems (roaming, and teritoriality), so keep it on your own property
00:54 rue_house I dont dislike dogs, but I dont want one
00:55 ace4016 i do!
00:55 dumbass same here, and i caught hell for not wanting a free dog
00:55 rue_house I was really shocked that it took more effort than anything to get the distributor cap back on
00:55 dumbass turn the engine around sidewayes
00:55 ace4016 dogs aren't for everyone; i'd feel bad if a dog ended up with someone that didn't want or couldn't take care of them :/
00:55 rue_house there is a "lot" of room under that hood
00:55 ace4016 sad situations as they cause problems to the dog and the people around them
00:55 dumbass remember, i moved a 350 cuin V8 forwards 3 inches to make distributor access easier
00:56 rue_house dispite the fact that I can barely fit my thin alien arms between the hoses, cables, and manifolds to get to the two philips screws that hold the cap on
00:56 rue_house 3 inches? where did you get the 3 inches from?
00:56 rue_house the driveshaft?
00:56 dumbass it was either move the engine or the firewall, that cap had not been off since that engine was crammed into that truck
00:57 dumbass had to goto a 2-piece driveshaft and center hanger
00:57 rue_house prolly better in the long run
00:57 mbass
00:58 rue_house what did you hang it on?
00:58 rue_house was there a provision?
00:58 dumbass tends to reduce push on the tranny when bounding, because the rear shaft is splined at the hanger bearing
00:58 e_house picks at kats name
00:58 e4016 pokes dum
00:58 dumbass there were chassis holes, i laid in a 1x3 channel
00:58 ace4016 should change it back to kats >_>
00:58 rue_house cool
00:58 ace4016 :)
00:59 katsmeow i could chose setting the crosspiece above or below the main rails to adjust the hiegth of the center bearing
00:59 katsmeow mounted up nicely
01:00 rue_house I want to get some of my "beyond zero" things done
01:00 rue_house if you were here the mecha would be finished by now
01:00 katsmeow prolly
01:00 rue_house I have managed to get the pulley mould in sand
01:01 rue_house I'm supposed to have all the pipes for the control cage finished this summer
01:01 rue_house :(
01:01 katsmeow i have 3 boxes of bearings, because i can't lift 2 boxes of bearings
01:01 rue_house now many people would understand that
01:01 rue_house ;)
01:02 rue_house no box strong enough for 1 box of bearings
01:02 katsmeow steel box
01:02 rue_house heh 1/4" plate? :)
01:02 rue_house I dont know if I'm the right person to make the first mecha like this
01:03 rue_house It needs to be someone more like you
01:04 e_house drips some crazyglue in behind kats nametag with hopes it finds a good
01:05 lok ponders a 3d printer thats also capable of light milling with a head
01:05 orlok well, just an XYZ table i guess
01:05 rue_house I think toms cnc feeds fast enough for 3d printing
01:05 orlok but all aluminium framed
01:06 orlok ahh, theres a minimum speed?
01:06 rue_house supposadly
01:06 katsmeow i wonder if i should tell you where the bearings came from that are going in this 2" thinck steel plate : http://designerthinking.com/images/lathe-big/DSCF2059.jpg
01:07 rue_house I wonder if I could have ever worked out how to make a hole in a peice like that
01:08 rue_house I was thnking kat, a lathe is kinda all about the chuck isn't it
01:08 rue_house I mean I can use my drillpress for tiny things, but
01:08 rue_house a lathe head can grab so much more
01:09 katsmeow and grab it offcenter, inside, or outside, and a 20lb chuck is real steady
01:09 katsmeow and be a pass-thru too
01:09 rue_house I dont know if I could have even moved a piece like that
01:09 katsmeow so you can feed 20ft sections in thru the head, and lathe off sections
01:10 katsmeow well, i never moved it personally either, i used other machines and jigs to move it
01:10 katsmeow i didn't pick up and move that truck engine bare-pawed either
01:11 rue_house is the grinder mounted by the handle holes?
01:11 katsmeow this month last yr i was outside under the grape tree, thinking i'd never see them ripening again because i'd be in fla,, and here i still am
01:11 katsmeow yeas
01:11 katsmeow via a hing and such
01:12 rue_house was the outside of those peices precut or did you cut them?
01:12 katsmeow there's words about it all over http://designerthinking.com/biglathe.html
01:12 katsmeow i had 2 pcs of 1ft x 2ft cut out of 2 inch thick plate
01:13 katsmeow had a industrial cad torch cut most of the hole out, ~1/4 undersized for the bearing OD
01:18 katsmeow http://designerthinking.com/images/lathe-big/DSCF2054.jpg
01:19 katsmeow there's a piece of steel wrapped around the backside of the grinder gearbox tho : http://designerthinking.com/images/lathe-big/DSCF2051.jpg
01:19 katsmeow that's where the bolt rides that sets the diameter of the hole it's grinding
01:21 rue_house gnight
01:21 e_house retires trying to keep his eyes
01:22 rue_house *sigh* climb into bed again
01:22 e_house looks at the la
01:22 katsmeow the bolt and retract spring are visable in the avi
01:22 rue_house if your ever building a ladder, 24" is NOT a good rung spacing
01:23 tsmeow notes
01:24 katsmeow-afk gnites
01:24 rue_bed gnight
01:25 rue_bed why did a freezer and a router trip a 15A breaker...
01:25 rue_bed that means more than 12A pulled
01:26 e_bed notes to check the freezer current
08:49 rue_house wow, 3am+ coulnd't get to sleep
09:10 GuShH rue_house: hows the printer coming along?
09:11 rue_house I was hoping to get the heater working, but I had a pile of software problems
09:12 rue_house right now I cant compile for avr on the dev machine
09:12 rue_house when thats fixed I can recompile the firmware for a proper baud rate so I can connect to it to operate the head
09:13 rue_house and I had to fix my truck
09:16 GuShH :(
09:16 GuShH what was wrong with the truck?
09:17 rue_house the timing pickup coil that I asked the mechanics shop to change, and they said was fine and didn't, completely failed, luckily I still had the spare I bought for them to install
09:17 GuShH assholes
09:17 rue_house runs better than ever now
09:17 GuShH I don't like mechanics
09:17 GuShH I try to do it all myself
09:17 DagoRed likewise
09:17 GuShH I don't like -anyone- in fact, which is why one day I'll end up dead... but I better die trying.
09:18 rue_house they did change the rotor and cap, which was prolly eaten out because of the failed pickup
09:18 GuShH now I'm slowly becoming a "roofing guy" because of my past experience with one of them was exactly what I thought it would be.
09:18 GuShH only just to fix a few minor leaks on my roof.
09:19 GuShH I don't know what's wrong with most people, they just think they can rip you off and treat you like an idiot
09:19 GuShH no word, no respect, no fucking morals whatsoever.
09:19 rue_house I think these guys genuinely didn't think there was a problem with the pickup
09:19 rue_house I wasn't 100% sure
09:20 rue_house it should be better on gas not
09:20 rue_house now
09:20 rue_house I was up to like 3am last night, couldn't sleep, today is going to be trying
09:22 GuShH rue_house: is it because you keep thinking about doing things and just can't bother with sleeping?
09:23 rue_house or my stomach was pushing up too much acid, not sure
09:23 GuShH heh
11:43 rrywolf hops on katsmeow-afk's lap, happy to see she's back to her usual n
12:57 furrywolf "Witnesses said they saw juveniles running through the parking lot, pursued by two sheriff's deputies. Witnesses said the deputies caught the three male juveniles -- who looked to be about 9-years-old -- and threw them in the back of a patrol vehicle. Witnesses said a deputy then proceeded to take each boy out of the vehicle, slamming them up against the car and handcuffing them. "
12:58 furrywolf "Sheriff's office spokesman Sgt. Ernie Stewart said the boys were pursued after their parents called to report the youth were beyond their control. He said the deputies ran after the juveniles and detained them after the youth fled on-foot. "
12:58 furrywolf at least they didn't shoot them, which is what the police here usually do.
13:00 DagoRed true
13:06 theBear so ? they ran
13:08 furrywolf they're 9 years old. can't control them? response by the sheriff's office for misbehaving kids?
13:08 theBear well it is odd that cops would do anything when told that by parents, but running from cops is completely seperate
13:42 furrywolf bbl, off to get insurance quotes, then pick up my spare tire from the tire shop.
13:43 furrywolf checked under the carpet to see what kind of spare tire my new car came with... it came with the "driven several miles with no air, and now has giant holes all around the sidewall" special.
15:41 furrywolf woot, got a nice looking tire mounted up for $6. :)
15:42 Tom_itx what year bmw?
15:42 furrywolf the local tire shop has a keyword you use when you want a really cheap tire... "holds air". it tells the guy you don't care if it has tread, so he goes out back and finds something the right size in the pile of tires for disposal, and doesn't charge you for it. :)
15:42 furrywolf '95
15:42 Tom_itx 2002 models were kinda cool
15:43 Tom_itx the model 2002
15:43 Tom_itx iirc
15:43 Tom_itx it was that
15:43 furrywolf it's a '95 740i
15:44 Tom_itx parts are too high for them for me
15:44 furrywolf yep
15:44 furrywolf but the car was cheap... the cheapest running vehicle I could find.
15:44 Tom_itx but it may not end up that way
15:44 furrywolf most of the problems with it need time rather than money thrown at them
15:46 furrywolf it was cheap because neither front door would open, then it sat a while and got mildew and half the switches stopped working. I fixed both front doors already...
15:46 furrywolf getting out of your bmw by climing over the seats looks a little okie, so he didn't drive it. :)
15:47 Tom_itx hah
15:47 Tom_itx yeah i'd say so
15:47 Tom_itx after all that's why they are purchased normally
15:48 furrywolf both doors are working great now, cost $36 for the new cables and shipping from bmw...
15:48 Tom_itx i've rebuilt a couple older ones' engines
15:49 furrywolf got a new spare tire today... the old one was completely shredded, obviously had been driven on for quite a distance while flat... can't beat $6. :)
15:49 furrywolf it's even slightly above the wear bars, which is better than most "holds air" tires. :)
15:51 Tom_itx do they still use wafers to adjust the valves?
15:51 Tom_itx i've done that a few times on various cars
15:53 furrywolf I would wager it has hydraulic lash adjusters, like roughly everything remotely modern...
15:53 furrywolf bbl, time for work
18:58 Pupuser hi *
19:07 rue_shop3 "I can see into your mind" "well dont you, for one second, think I'm gonna take any responsibility for any mental damage you incur by doing so."
19:13 Tom_itx rue_shop3, i don't understand why the settings in interfaces won't take and revert back to the dynamic settings
19:13 Tom_itx any ideas?
19:58 operator1 how is a way to make a material myself for robot body as that of a RealDoll(TM) s-x doll. Want her to be female very realistic and humanoid (not for S-X!) Please any help or advise
19:59 operator1 purchased one of these from japan, but it got here today and Is IN FACT a blow up doll... not at all what I wanted...
19:59 ace4016 you can say sex...we're not immature here :P
19:59 operator1 okay then. sex
19:59 ace4016 do you mean the skin?
19:59 operator1 any tips
19:59 operator1 ?
19:59 operator1 ?
20:00 operator1 I found some links for Silicone Caulk+corn starch.. sems hopeful, but concerned about mold. Wish I wasn't so nerdy. Maybe then I could find a willing female to mold of body
20:01 ace4016 you can find one if you put an add for it
20:01 ace4016 just compensate her
20:01 ace4016 ad*
20:01 operator1 No ace4016 I mean the whole body. A pourable material to place into a mold
20:02 ace4016 yea...you can put in an ad for a woman to get molded :P
20:02 operator1 where?
20:02 operator1 paper?
20:02 ace4016 craigslist
20:02 ace4016 sure, newspaper works too
20:03 operator1 oh thank you. I'll check into that
20:04 ace4016 the material...i'm not sure how to make; i'm not very familiar with most materials :P
20:04 operator1 is there a #chemistry channel???
20:04 operator1 join #checmistry
20:04 operator1 join #chemistry
20:04 operator1 guess not
20:04 ace4016 /
20:05 operator1 oops
20:06 operator1 ##chemistry; (don't know why but I always ended up with checmistry instead of chemistry
20:06 operator1 );
20:06 operator1 hi em
21:01 delinquentme brown,black,red (space) gold << 10K resistor @ +/- 5% right?
21:02 katsmeow-afk no
21:07 rue_shop3 no 1k
21:08 rue_shop3 brown -1 black -0 red -2 (00) 1000 ohms
21:14 rue_shop3 katsmeow-afk, hello?
21:14 Tom_itx this has to be screwed up. root won't even let me edit interfaces now
21:15 furrywolf LOL, censoring "sex".
21:15 furrywolf operator1: I occasionally talk about my latest strap-on. you can say "sex". :P
21:16 katsmeow-afk mou?
21:16 rrywolf hops on katsmeow-afk's
21:16 tsmeow-afk pats the furry's
21:16 Tom_itx but you are testing your authority by saying it's ok too
21:17 furrywolf mrrf :)
21:17 furrywolf why, are you 12?
21:17 katsmeow-afk what can one say witout taking the test?
21:18 furrywolf ?
21:18 katsmeow-afk Tom said there was a test
21:22 Tom_itx there is no test, let's just say furry was pusing his bounds of authority by saying it was ok
21:22 katsmeow-afk furry, you shouldn't pus your bounds in here
21:23 furrywolf ... seriously?
21:23 katsmeow-afk it's mess, we con't have a cleaning service
21:24 operator1 it's all good
21:24 operator1 I referencing skin and texture much more so than I amm refering directly in any sense to sex
21:24 furrywolf you're really going to tell people what they are and aren't allowed to say?
21:25 operator1 blurb
21:25 operator1 what about any projects (worthy ones???) using NITINOL in place of motors. Is THAT possible?
21:25 katsmeow-afk skin and texture : http://boingboing.net/images/xeni/ps_1880.jpg
21:26 Tom_itx no, i'd just rather this channel didn't turn into another ##electronics
21:26 Tom_itx where there is no sense of bounds
21:26 operator1 join##electronics
21:26 operator1 oooops
21:27 furrywolf ##electronics is full of crap because people say stupid shit instead of trying to be helpful or contribute in any way, not because of a lack of censorship.
21:27 furrywolf censorship is unacceptable.
21:28 tsmeow-afk sighs and writes a postit to NEVER PLAY IN WORDS AGAIN IN #Robo
21:28 Tom_itx so is arguing about it
21:28 katsmeow-afk oops, #robotics
21:29 furrywolf good, because I don't plan to stop saying anything just because one person doesn't like it.
21:30 tsmeow-afk is on furry's ignore
21:35 operator1 brb
22:01 tsmeow-afk takes the authority test .... rue (Tom too), to avoid drinkable antacids that contain magnesium (laxative) or aluminum (linked to alzheimer's), drop a dozen flavored chewable **calcium** antacids into a blender, add an inch of water, make a "milkshake" ,, it works really fast against reflux, you don't even need to drink it
22:02 tsmeow-afk pats the top of her head,, nope, no @uthority t
22:06 katsmeow-afk note: USPS is not amused when you ask for a "trashing number" when shipping a package
22:06 furrywolf lol
22:09 tsmeow-afk sent this box today: http://designerthinking.com/images/Tektronix/DSCF2897m.jpg with NO fragile signs on
22:10 katsmeow-afk 2x4 lumber and 1/2" plywood, 2" screws
22:10 katsmeow-afk overwrapped it in a cardboard box
22:11 furrywolf heh
22:13 katsmeow-afk i do not know for sure it will arrive intact, i sent this also : http://designerthinking.com/images/WT-100A/DSCF2179s.jpg and they managed to shatter every piece of glass in the unit
22:15 katsmeow-afk the one today has no glass in it tho
22:16 furrywolf my connection seems to be sucky. I'll try loading it late.
22:16 furrywolf later
22:17 katsmeow-afk http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/motors/bearings/double-row-spherical-roller-be/120mm-bore-180mm-od-60mm-w-steel-cage-w33-c3-irc
22:17 katsmeow-afk i know that's cheaper elsewhere, but i can't find it
22:18 furrywolf I always gave everything a couple inches of bubble wrap... helped the survival rate.
22:19 katsmeow-afk 3" at least
22:19 furrywolf what are you building that needs such a bearing? would truck wheel bearings suffice?
22:19 katsmeow-afk bubbles do not help with crushing tho, when they sit on the boxes, or drive over them, or set them against the loading dock and back the truck into them
22:20 katsmeow-afk those are my lathe spindle bearings
22:20 katsmeow-afk not those specifically, i got mine at the recycler for under $5
22:20 furrywolf ah
22:21 katsmeow-afk the large bore lets me use a 1/2" wall tube, for passthru stuff
22:22 furrywolf heh, the ID of the spindle on my lathe is 10mm.
22:22 katsmeow-afk a 1/4 wall tube would let me do small truck or car driveshafts
22:24 furrywolf I need to either learn a 3d cad program with cam package, or write a g-code generator... I need to make a part on my mill and have no idea what software I could use to model it.
22:24 katsmeow-afk Tom would know
22:24 GargantuaSauce I am enjoying learning openSCAD
22:24 katsmeow-afk GargantuaSauce would know
22:25 GargantuaSauce i am not so sure about that, but I do know openscad is cool :P
22:27 furrywolf I broke my lawnmower... need to make new shiny aluminum bits to fix it.
22:27 GargantuaSauce what sorts of shiny aluminium bits?
22:28 katsmeow-afk unbroken sorts
22:28 furrywolf it's a high-wheel string trimmer... I got a branch jammed between the frame and the head, and broke the string holders off the top of the head.
22:28 tsmeow-afk hands furry some 14 awg steel
22:29 furrywolf they hold the string by looping it through three times, like /V\, with it extending off the ends.
22:29 katsmeow-afk or aluminum
22:30 furrywolf but it needs nice radiused curves, to keep the string from breaking when you hit something, and it needs to be sloped on the ends, so it doesn't catch grass. I can write the g-code to do it, with enough work, but there should be a nice cad/cam package for making it...
22:30 tsmeow-afk needs a fish sammich,
22:38 GargantuaSauce skeinforge will generate gcode for milling from an stl input....i've only used it for extrusion but the functionality is ostensibly there
22:41 delinquentme how do I check if my potentiometer is outputting grey code?
22:42 delinquentme I'm checking the continuity between 2 of the wires ... and it seems that every other click in the rotation will give me a connection
22:52 theBear it's not a pot, umm, been a while, i'd have to look at a grey table to be sure, but it sounds like yer on the right track
22:53 theBear if you find a table just look down it, each wire should be one column
22:54 GargantuaSauce rotary encoder, and no it's not gray code
23:03 theBear if it's only 3 wires it's probly just err, quadrature? the one with things overlapping by about 90deg, so you get direction and amount of rotation, but no position
23:07 furrywolf yep, that's most likely. if you're measuring pulses with just a meter, it's not optical or anything fancy.
23:09 furrywolf you should find one is a common, that will measure on 50% of the time to each of other two, while if you try measuring between the other two, it'll only be on 25% of the time.
23:09 theBear mmm, sounds about right
23:09 furrywolf so it's easy to find the common. :)
23:10 katsmeow-afk the common may be labeled too, like with a 'c' or something
23:10 rrywolf curls up on kat's lap and yawns, having worked way too hard the last week, and no end in s
23:11 tsmeow-afk absentmindedly rubs the bridge of furry's
23:11 furrywolf mrf :)
23:11 furrywolf yay emails aimed at idiots... "Please don't reply to this email. It'll just confuse the computer that sent it and you won't get a response."
23:12 p1r473 anyone know anything about 15 vs 20 amp wall outlets?
23:12 katsmeow-afk i seen that one before somewhere
23:12 furrywolf I have ~50 pages of forms on my desk I need to go through and fill out.
23:12 furrywolf p1r473: yes. maybe you should ask a more specific questions?
23:12 katsmeow-afk yeas, REAL 20amp plugs for 20amp outlets don't exist
23:13 furrywolf sure they do, they just have the sideways pin.
23:13 p1r473 basically im looking at buying a UPS but the ups says that it needs a 20 amp wall outlet
23:13 katsmeow-afk try buying one in a local store tho
23:13 p1r473 I have no idea what I have. my circuit breaker is pretty unlabelled
23:13 p1r473 my wall outlet doesnt have the sideways thing
23:13 furrywolf katsmeow-afk: they're everywhere, no?
23:13 p1r473 does that mean its 15?
23:13 furrywolf yes
23:13 p1r473 whats involved with installing a 20? does it need a new breaker too?
23:13 katsmeow-afk means it may be wired with a 20amp breaker and 12awg wire anyhow
23:14 katsmeow-afk how the heck do you *require* a 20amp breaker?
23:14 p1r473 i went to the breaker in the basement, half the breakers are 20 and half are 15. and its not labelled. is there an easy way to check?
23:14 furrywolf if you have #12 wiring and a 20A breaker, you can install a 20A outlet. If you have #12 wiring on a 15A breaker, you can investigate whether you can switch to a 20A breaker. If you have #14 wiring, there's no way to safely get 20A through it, and you'll need to install new wiring.
23:14 p1r473 I have no idea about any of this, so I dont know
23:14 furrywolf yep. plug a light in. turn off breakers until the light goes off. make a note of which one it was. :)
23:14 p1r473 How can I tell what wiring I have?
23:14 furrywolf it sounds like you need an electrician, even if just to install the outlet.
23:15 katsmeow-afk you call an electrician and pay them, so we don't get sued for you not knowing :-/
23:15 p1r473 lol
23:15 p1r473 maybe ill just get a cheaper UPS unit then
23:15 katsmeow-afk why does then ups NEED a 20amp outlet, i ask again?
23:15 p1r473 no idea
23:15 p1r473 but thats what it says in its description
23:15 katsmeow-afk does it REALLY need 2400 watts to charge it's battery??
23:15 furrywolf it's probably a 2000VA 120V unit or something.
23:15 p1r473 its a 1500 watt ups
23:16 katsmeow-afk 1500 continuous?
23:16 furrywolf it's quite possible that, as long as you only use it at reduced power, it'll be fine on a 15A circuit.
23:16 orlok ignoring the big red tag on the cable that comes with it
23:16 p1r473 its 2200VA
23:16 p1r473 1500 uninteruptable
23:16 katsmeow-afk 1500 watts is only 12.5amps on 120vac, 15amps will do fine
23:16 p1r473 I was going to get a 2000 va / 1200 watt one, but if my next comp had a 1500 watt power supply id want to future-proof my UPS
23:16 orlok katsmeow-afk: charging plus draw of the things plugged into it?
23:16 furrywolf katsmeow-afk: plus a few hundred watts to charge the battery, etc.
23:17 katsmeow-afk how the heck do you buy a puter with a 1500 watt psu??
23:17 orlok p1r473: lol 1500w PSU
23:17 p1r473 triple graphic card
23:17 orlok p1r473: stop buying them based on the numbers. they lie
23:17 p1r473 right now my double graphic card is on a 1200 watt ups
23:17 orlok p1r473: buy them based on weight
23:17 p1r473 but next system, in a few years, maybe 3 cards :)
23:17 furrywolf 1500W PSU... does it say "deer 180W" on the inside like the last 450W one I took apart? :P
23:17 katsmeow-afk furry, most ups are rated "power output" , so they won't pull any more than that also
23:17 katsmeow-afk is it a Sparkle brand?
23:18 p1r473 this was the 1500 watt one http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16842102019CVF and this is the 1200 watt one http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1815470&Sku=ULT33046
23:18 p1r473 so the 1200 watt one is good for my current pc, but the 1500 watt would be good if i ever got a triple gfx card system
23:18 p1r473 which I might for my next pc
23:18 orlok p1r473: um, different things
23:18 orlok p1r473: you dont need a bigger UPS
23:18 katsmeow-afk Battery Run Time4 Minutes at Full-load
23:18 furrywolf figure out if any of the 20A circuits run to the room you want to put it in. turn off all the 15A breakers, leaving the 20A ones on, then see if any of the outlets are still on.
23:19 orlok p1r473: and your system load is likely nowhere near that
23:19 katsmeow-afk it isn't gonna pull 100watts over the 1500 to charge it's battery, it's too small to put 100 watts into
23:19 furrywolf 4 minutes? lol
23:19 katsmeow-afk Battery Recharge Time8 Hours
23:19 katsmeow-afk especially taking 4 hrs to do it
23:19 p1r473 Right now my current system gets up to 800/900 under full load
23:19 katsmeow-afk err, 8 hrs
23:19 orlok p1r473: you know basic elecitral formula?
23:19 p1r473 I do not
23:19 katsmeow-afk also, youo don
23:19 p1r473 was a comp. sci student
23:20 orlok so stop throwing hardware at your problems!
23:20 p1r473 lol
23:20 katsmeow-afk t NEED sine wave, i have run 10 puters at a time on square wave "modified sine"
23:20 orlok 800/900 based on what?
23:20 p1r473 Yea one advantage of the 1500 watt ups was its pure, whereas the 1200 watt ups was simulated
23:20 katsmeow-afk simulated?
23:20 p1r473 800/900 watts based on the watt meter thing
23:20 p1r473 I bought one of those tester things with a screen
23:21 orlok what watt meter?
23:21 orlok killawatt?
23:21 p1r473 shows oyu how much youre pulling
23:21 p1r473 yea
23:21 orlok 120v?
23:21 orlok or 240v?
23:21 orlok 120 i gues
23:21 orlok being a merkin
23:21 p1r473 either 110 or 120, I dont know what it is up here in canada
23:21 p1r473 I hear a lot of both
23:21 katsmeow-afk damn must be a lot of puter, i don't pullt hat much with my cluster
23:21 p1r473 but not 240, 240 is like our fridge/dryer etc
23:22 p1r473 but i think its a good idea to get a ups that could hold my entire theoretical system load if it were at full load.. and the next system may be a 1500 watt pc, plus the bonus of the pure sine wave, the 1500 watt unit looks great to me, except for the whole 20 amp outlet thing
23:23 p1r473 the 1500 watt one is for rack mounted servers, more for business use than home use
23:23 p1r473 maybe thats why they want the 20 amp outlet? no idea
23:23 katsmeow-afk we cannot say what your house is wired with, and you have less clue than we have, you sould call an electrician to come out,, 1500w is fine on 15amp
23:24 theBear maybe cos 110/120v @ 1500a is more than 10a
23:24 katsmeow-afk specially if the 15amp is 12awg copper
23:24 orlok p1r473: got a smoke alarm?
23:24 p1r473 lol
23:24 theBear err, 1500w
23:24 orlok p1r473: and fire extiguisher?
23:25 p1r473 just realized id have to call an electrician anyways, it says Requires 110/120 volt 20 amp NEMA 5-20R receptacle.
23:25 p1r473 thats the outlet with the sideways thing
23:25 p1r473 damn
23:25 p1r473 and that i for sure dont have
23:26 katsmeow-afk it comes witht hat plug on it?
23:26 p1r473 i guess
23:27 p1r473 so i might end up getting the 1200 watt ups unless i can find a better suited 1500 watt one
23:27 p1r473 i know i can find some in the 600-900 range, but im looking in the 200-300 range
23:27 p1r473 $ that is
23:28 p1r473 is there any easy way to calculate the minimum number of va's I need if I want 1500w?
23:28 katsmeow-afk what puter do you use that needs 1200 watts?
23:28 p1r473 is it just 2200va or it depends on the unit?
23:29 katsmeow-afk my 2.6Ghz P4'swith 2gigs ram and 3 hds and several cards pulls barely 120watts if i am using 100% of cpu
23:30 p1r473 well my max system load right now is like 800/900. but it was a safer bet to get one that supports the full power supply, because the price difference between like an 800 and that 1200 watt unit was not very much
23:30 p1r473 I got 4 GPUs in my system
23:30 p1r473 2x 2GPU cards
23:30 katsmeow-afk va's vary depending on the bad design of the psu in the load, plain watts are based on a resistor load
23:31 p1r473 i see
23:31 katsmeow-afk a psu with active PFC will look like a resistor,a nd "watts" would apply
23:31 katsmeow-afk an typical usa psu will not look anything like a resistor, and "va" would apply
23:32 katsmeow-afk but you're right, if you are drawing 900w atts for real now, a 1200w psu will hold it up long enough to shut down, and that's about it
23:32 katsmeow-afk a 1500 watt psu would be better
23:33 katsmeow-afk err, ups
23:33 p1r473 yea im just looking to either buy a minute or 4 for a proper shutdown, or for brownout protection
23:33 p1r473 getting so many brownouts out here lately, and its just awful for computers
23:34 katsmeow-afk can you split up the load, like put router, monitors, etc on one ups, and the puter on one by itself?
23:34 p1r473 how long would a 1200 watt ups last while pulling 1200 watts?
23:34 p1r473 yea thats exactly what im doing
23:34 p1r473 its like 900 for the computer itself
23:34 katsmeow-afk damn
23:34 p1r473 cant remember, i think it was more like 800
23:34 theBear depends on the batteries, a 1200w ups CAN have hours of battery attached to it
23:34 katsmeow-afk how long = what the oem says it will, the ones you pointed to say 4 minutes
23:34 p1r473 right now i got the killawatt meter measuring my external hard drive wattage
23:35 p1r473 full load run time is 1 minute
23:35 p1r473 hmm
23:35 p1r473 if I alt f4 should kill my gpu usage and give me enough time ot shutdown :)
23:36 p1r473 kind of weird that half run time is 7 minutes if full run time is 1
23:36 katsmeow-afk if you want longer time, and better wattage, faster recharge time, etc, use a separate battery-convertor system, like furry, rue, and i use
23:36 p1r473 but I never did well in physics so :P
23:36 p1r473 Just need a few minutes max
23:36 p1r473 and keep in mind Im rarely ever at the 800 watt mark
23:36 p1r473 computer idles at around 300-400
23:37 p1r473 when I say idle I mean while Im not gaming
23:37 katsmeow-afk get a 1200 then, unless you can get an electrician out there to certify you a 20 amp outlet all to it's lonesome
23:38 p1r473 any idea how bad simulated sin wave will be?
23:38 katsmeow-afk if you can get the real 20amp, get the 1500 watt
23:38 p1r473 assuming im only running off the battery for a moment?
23:38 katsmeow-afk never heard of simulated
23:38 katsmeow-afk it's either a sine wave or it isn't
23:38 orlok p1r473: also.. if your system is really drawing that much power, what sort of power socket is it plugged into
23:39 theBear you get those modified sine, it's more of a 6 or 8 step square than a square
23:39 katsmeow-afk 800w will do fine on any 120vac outlet
23:39 p1r473 it isnt but they try to make it sin wave
23:39 p1r473 yea square or something
23:39 katsmeow-afk bear, most all from china are plain square wave
23:39 p1r473 orlok, its just plugged into a regular wall outlet
23:39 p1r473 nothing fancy
23:39 theBear maybe, but i stand by my statement
23:39 p1r473 the diff between the 800 and 1200 watt price wasnt very much
23:40 p1r473 but once you start going higher prices start jumping
23:40 katsmeow-afk http://designerthinking.com/invertors.html <<== with scope pics
23:41 p1r473 im assuming that if im running my pc through the ups, itll be pure sin wave until the battery kicks in then it switches to square?
23:42 katsmeow-afk no
23:42 katsmeow-afk i sine convertor should deliver sine all the time
23:42 p1r473 so ill always be on modified sin
23:42 p1r473 i hope that wont kill my power supply too quickly
23:43 katsmeow-afk want it to die slowly?
23:43 theBear well that's not square, it's 3 steps
23:43 katsmeow-afk where's 3 steps?
23:43 theBear high, zero, low
23:43 theBear square is high/low
23:44 theBear either way, there are a few out there with a couple more steps inbetween
23:44 katsmeow-afk err, ok, difefrent pov
23:46 p1r473 yea I cant find what the sin wave is, but I saw somrwhere last week it listed this model at "simu;lated sin wave"
23:47 furrywolf back. $##$@ing internet connection.
23:47 katsmeow-afk so many sellers change the meaning of words to mean what they want them to me, i can't even guess what simulated sine means
23:47 katsmeow-afk wb
23:47 furrywolf it's yet another name for modified sine, aka square with off time...
23:47 katsmeow-afk k
23:47 rue_house ok I'm back from work again
23:47 rue_house fire alarm went off at the hospital and wouldn't reset
23:48 furrywolf how the heck are you burning 400W at idle? I'm using ~30.
23:48 furrywolf that can keep your house warm!
23:48 katsmeow-afk 4 gpu
23:49 p1r473 iT WAS LAST WEEK i HAD THE KILLAWATT PLUGGED INTO THE PC
23:49 p1r473 Sorry caps
23:49 p1r473 I think it was 400
23:49 p1r473 I cant remember
23:49 theBear checkout http://www.brucebnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/puresinewave.jpg and http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll50/Nanu_28181/SteppedPure-1.jpg
23:49 p1r473 Im gonna unplug the killawatt from the harddrives
23:49 p1r473 and plug it back into the pc
23:49 p1r473 but I got lots of stuff in the pc
23:50 p1r473 so simulated is even worse than stepped huh
23:50 p1r473 that pic is brutal
23:51 theBear what kat said still applies, sales people switch and change and make up words
23:56 tsmeow-afk y
23:56 rrywolf tucks katsmeow-afk in sn