#robotics Logs
May 04 2012
#robotics Calendar
00:00 home furrywolf: nah,
00:00 katsmeow-afk just to get tot he water that's in the creek
00:00 katsmeow-afk furry is over 3 min lagges atm
00:02 furrywolf bbl, work
00:02 katsmeow-afk happy works
00:04 katsmeow-afk no ping back from furry in 5 minutes
00:07 katsmeow-afk no ping back from furry in 7 minutes
00:08 katsmeow-afk one is back:
00:08 katsmeow-afk [ChanServ PING reply]: 0 secs
00:08 katsmeow-afk [furrywolf PING reply]: 10mins 17secs
00:14 katsmeow-afk [furrywolf PING reply]: 14mins 17secs
00:14 katsmeow-afk [furrywolf PING reply]: 11mins 53secs
00:16 katsmeow-afk he should have pinged out by not replying to the PING/PONG from the server
00:17 home lol
00:17 katsmeow-afk hmm?
00:18 home ??
00:19 katsmeow-afk what was so funny that you laughed out loud?
00:20 home the part where he could have prevented himself from not pinging himself out XD
00:20 katsmeow-afk how could he prevent it?
00:20 katsmeow-afk [furrywolf PING reply]: 13mins 54secs
00:20 katsmeow-afk [furrywolf PING reply]: 5mins 53secs
00:22 orlok hmm
00:22 orlok i think i might need a thicker/bigger toothed belt than the one rue sent me
00:22 katsmeow-afk [orlok PING reply]: 1 sec
00:22 home who knoed XD
00:22 orlok will see how it goes
00:22 orlok also, i should get some teflon sheets
00:24 katsmeow-afk how will you stay in bed?
00:36 katsmeow-afk well, the lag isn't to his free wireless host, it's tween that host and the wireless link to him
00:43 katsmeow-afk [furrywolf PING reply]: 10mins 21secs
00:47 katsmeow-afk A 23-year-old California college student who was left in a dark federal detention cell for five days without food, water, or a toilet has filed a claim against the U.S. government for $20 million.
00:47 katsmeow-afk The lawyer for Daniel Chong, a senior at the University of California at San Diego, said his client was subjected to "torture" after Drug Enforcement Agency officers forgot he was placed in a holding cell, where he languished for nearly a week, drinking his own urine and contemplating his death.
00:55 delinquentme Running a motor at higher voltages leads to a faster rise in the current through the windings when they are turned on, and this, in turn, leads to a higher cutoff speed for the motor and higher torques at speeds above the cutoff. << "cutoffs"
00:55 delinquentme what does it mean?
00:56 katsmeow-afk turn off
00:57 katsmeow-afk generally, voltage turnoff at the speed limit set int he controller, because with higher voltage you get more current faster and a steady state, hence more torque
00:59 katsmeow-afk Even after the advent of anesthesia in 1846, surgeons continued to "choose slashing speed over precision," Gawande wrote, describing a 19th century leg amputation in which the surgeon accidentally cut an assistant's finger along with the patient's limb. "The patient and the assistant both died of sepsis, and a spectator reportedly died of shock, resulting in the only known procedure with a 300 percent mortality," he wrote.
01:00 delinquentme higher torque above the cutoff?
01:00 delinquentme katsmeow-afk, that doesnt make sense in that context
01:01 delinquentme you're getting no torque when its turned off... right?
01:02 katsmeow-afk right
01:02 katsmeow-afk try it, you'll see
01:02 delinquentme I mean in reading the text above it mentions higher torque at speeds above the "cutoff"
01:02 katsmeow-afk getting torque with it turned off is like cramming a new shaft thru a stepper and expecting it to step
01:02 delinquentme == higher speeds above the "turn off"
01:03 katsmeow-afk right, you don't set the cutoff in a working machine to the max
01:03 delinquentme ohhh the cutoff is something youll set
01:04 delinquentme ok so how do I calculate how much voltage I can push through a stepper?
01:04 katsmeow-afk with complicated math that's usually wrong in the real world anyhow
01:05 katsmeow-afk you set a current limit and a speed limit in the controlelr, and then give it maybe 10volts under the controller spec
01:05 katsmeow-afk the voltage is ramped down when the current hits the limit, which you set tot he stepper motor spec
01:05 katsmeow-afk it's all very automagic
01:09 katsmeow-afk [furrywolf PING reply]: 0 secs
01:14 delinquentme katsmeow-afk, ive not set speed limits and current limits in a controller ...
01:14 delinquentme like i have a variable for max speed on the stepper
01:15 delinquentme but certainly no current limit in the controller
01:15 delinquentme OHH or you mean with components and not in software
01:16 katsmeow-afk did you see Tom's new controller? his sets current limit with a resistor
01:16 delinquentme and thats done with just resistors?
01:16 delinquentme nah cant say I have...
01:16 katsmeow-afk i am sure there's some set with software
01:18 delinquentme do you know what the equation is called ooc?
01:18 katsmeow-afk by setting the current limit and then overvolting it, you can force more current faster, and be more sure of hitting rated motor current before cutoff
01:18 delinquentme so you're effectively messing with the shape of the pulse
01:19 delinquentme instead of a /\
01:19 delinquentme youre getting more of a | \
01:19 katsmeow-afk no i don't, it involves the inductance of the motor windings (which int he real world willv ary depending on rotor position), and the voltage Dv
01:19 katsmeow-afk yeas
01:19 katsmeow-afk _
01:19 delinquentme see the thing is im working w a 12 volt motor so like -10 volts is over 80%
01:19 katsmeow-afk | \
01:20 delinquentme yeah =] its a burst pulse
01:20 delinquentme instead of a gradual one
01:20 katsmeow-afk steppers are driven by pulses, you didn't know?
01:20 katsmeow-afk i don't give a damn what the motor volatge is, i said the controller voltage
01:21 delinquentme yeah im familiar w pulses in steppers
01:21 katsmeow-afk afaik, Tom is suing a 50vdc supply to feed his 80v controlelrs, and the motors are 24v
01:22 delinquentme ohhhh ok ok sooo the voltage being fed to the controller isnt necessarily that which is getting to the stepper
01:22 katsmeow-afk correct, and the delay in getting that basic idea is why i don't think you're going far in this bio-thing
01:23 delinquentme lol
01:23 delinquentme noted
01:23 delinquentme thanks for sharing?
01:23 delinquentme also dont ever breed
01:24 katsmeow-afk and you never told me how trashing a stepepr motor so it slides on a shaft will do anything useful
01:24 delinquentme bc thats a really shitty thing to say to anyone ... ever
01:24 katsmeow-afk someone should clue you in, to get you to pick a field you may be better in
01:25 katsmeow-afk kanzure tried to tell you gently
01:25 delinquentme lol
01:25 delinquentme sure
01:25 delinquentme thanks for your help
01:26 katsmeow-afk so how will punching a new hole in a stepper motor going to help anything?
01:29 rue_house gnight
04:05 Tom_itx http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Moss_Table_generates_electricity_using_photosynthesis-article-fajb_biophotovoltaics_may2012-html.aspx
05:42 KongfuPanda Steffanx, hola senior !!
05:42 Steffanx Ha KongfuPanda
05:42 Steffanx Can you fix this notebook for me?
05:42 KongfuPanda me? yeah I guess so. I'm good at stuff
05:42 Steffanx Cracked display, replaced the lcd, but now there's no video
05:42 KongfuPanda what is the problem?
05:43 KongfuPanda display isn't working?
05:43 Steffanx Backlight is fine
05:43 KongfuPanda is it alighned properly and everything is connected properly?
05:43 Steffanx Should be
05:43 Steffanx Even ordered a new flat cable to rule out the cable :(
05:43 KongfuPanda so is it just black screen ?
05:44 KongfuPanda connect an external monitor to VGA port and see if it's working first
05:44 KongfuPanda then switch the output to normal LCD screen
05:44 Steffanx That works
05:44 KongfuPanda with some keyboard shortcut
05:44 Steffanx the external screne
05:44 Steffanx screen
05:45 KongfuPanda if it's not working then you connected the LCD incorrectly, take it off, realight, check everything again
05:45 Steffanx or I received the wrong display :)
05:45 KongfuPanda what model is your laptop?
05:45 Steffanx sony vaio something
05:45 KongfuPanda I see
05:46 KongfuPanda have you tried taking it off and realighning again?
05:46 Steffanx Yes
05:49 KongfuPanda oh well
05:49 KongfuPanda I can't really help more without being there
05:49 Steffanx :)
05:49 KongfuPanda I actually never replaced the screen on laptops :D
05:50 Steffanx It's not that hard actually, that's why i'm surprised it doesn't work
05:50 KongfuPanda but I have Thinkpax x61 tablet, and I replaced SOOO much stuff over 4 years: the screen bezel, the screen swivel, the fingerprint reader, the CPU fan, the HDD, x5 batteries, x6 power cables
05:50 KongfuPanda but it's still working :)
05:51 KongfuPanda although need to replace the CPU fan again, started buzzing again
05:51 Steffanx batteries 5 times?!!?
05:51 Steffanx Y
05:51 Steffanx y
05:51 KongfuPanda yeah
05:51 Steffanx :S
05:51 KongfuPanda over 4 years
05:51 KongfuPanda it just basically stops working after 1 year... just as warranty expires
05:51 Steffanx wtf
05:51 KongfuPanda I dunno ..
05:52 Steffanx Even Apple doesn't do things like that :P
05:52 KongfuPanda in power manager it says "volagete: 16V, current : 0"
05:52 Steffanx volagete ?
05:52 KongfuPanda I noticed lenovo batteries stop working after ~600 cycles
05:52 KongfuPanda voltage*
05:53 Steffanx 600 cycles, that's ~2 cycles/day
05:53 KongfuPanda something like that
05:53 Steffanx Hmm
05:53 KongfuPanda is that a lot?
05:53 Steffanx I think my laptop is ~2 years old and has 78 cycles :)
05:53 KongfuPanda oh :D
05:53 Steffanx Health 91%
05:53 KongfuPanda I used to take my laptop to lectures, because it's a tablet
05:54 KongfuPanda the batter life ~ 4 hours, and I had 2 x 8 cell batteries
05:54 KongfuPanda so I could take notes all day basically
05:56 Steffanx The sucky thing of the other broken laptop is .. it doesn't show anything on the external screen until the windows drivers are loaded
06:04 Steffanx And windows xp is crap.. connect a second screen, the desktop gets automatically expended
06:04 Steffanx Try to open the desktop settings and it shows the window on the wrong screen :S
06:04 Steffanx :)
06:04 Steffanx *expanded
06:06 DanFrederiksen 600 is probably a good number for laptop cells
06:10 DanFrederiksen lifepo can often do a few thousand cycles
06:16 sw0rdfish good morning peeps
06:16 sw0rdfish DanFrederiksen!
06:43 DanFrederiksen hi
06:56 SolarNRG Morning
08:11 any99338552 hmm, those 1000 static 15ns rams (32megabytes total) will draw 345 watts if all in use at one time
09:55 tsmeow-afk is uploading w
11:04 SolarNRG IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT, MICROWAVE EXPERIMENT 9: SODIUM POLYACRYLATE IS NOW LIVE AT: www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuWEUnxG1SE
12:07 Steffann SolarNRG with his experiments ..
12:07 rizlah ...
12:07 Steffann Next time play with it OUTSIDE SolarNRG ?
12:13 SolarNRG yeah no shit
12:13 Tom_itx we may read about you in the news otherwise
12:14 SolarNRG :)
12:14 SolarNRG Meanwhile I have chicken thies in blue cheese sauce and a can of red stripe
12:21 elektrinis hi
12:22 elektrinis anyone using CNC mill software?
12:22 elektrinis I am looking for a light software to generate G code
12:22 elektrinis not necessarily free
12:23 joink elektrinis: I would start here perhaps: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_EMC_G-Code_Generators
12:23 elektrinis btw, on windows
12:24 joink I've only played with EMC2
12:24 joink believe I used dxf2gcode through inkscape back in the days
12:24 elektrinis sorry, but these free apps are worthless
12:25 elektrinis I am looking for something more serious
12:25 elektrinis I am not going to use separate apps for drilling, square pocketing, round pocketing ...
12:25 DanFrederiksen Tom_itx, ever think about making a pick and place?
12:25 joink I was only unserious when playing with that CNC, so out of my experience
12:26 dunz0r elektrinis: There' mac3 if you like to pay for your software.
12:26 dunz0r Emc2 is better though imo
12:26 elektrinis mach3 you mean?
12:26 dunz0r I don't trust Windows enough to let it run a cnc.
12:26 dunz0r elektrinis: Yes.
12:26 elektrinis :)
12:26 DanFrederiksen elektrinis, don't really know. try googling for cnc software. maybe solidworks can
12:26 elektrinis I dont need a cnc controller
12:26 elektrinis I already have it
12:27 elektrinis and it runs my G code just fine
12:27 elektrinis I need a powerful tool to generate G code
12:27 elektrinis for 3 axis cnc
12:27 DanFrederiksen elektrinis, which controller did you get?
12:27 DanFrederiksen diy machine?
12:27 katsmeow-afk loud : overweight neighbor's cat chasing lizards across a hot tin roof
12:28 dunz0r elektrinis: Can't your CAD software do that?
12:28 elektrinis not diy
12:28 elektrinis :)
12:28 elektrinis no cad software can do that
12:28 elektrinis cad -> g code -> controller -> machine
12:28 elektrinis separate apps and hardware
12:28 dunz0r Ah.
12:29 DanFrederiksen elektrinis, some cad might have g code generation
12:29 nz0r needs to figure out that whole process with foss t
12:29 elektrinis if they do, its rubbish
12:29 nz0r is building his own
12:29 DanFrederiksen ok that might be a bit hasty conclusion :)
12:29 dunz0r Steel and those oddly tapped rods on the way
12:30 elektrinis http://www.edingcnc.com/
12:30 elektrinis this is the controller i am running
12:30 elektrinis but that has nothing to do with my question about sw for G-code generation
12:30 dunz0r It'll be great. Finally I can do pcbs without using scary chemicals \o/
12:31 saschi elektrinis: you need a CAM :)
12:31 elektrinis yes I do
12:31 elektrinis and I am asking for recomendations :)
12:31 saschi depends by the application
12:31 elektrinis for nine minutes now
12:31 elektrinis 3d parts
12:31 elektrinis from steel and plastics
12:32 elektrinis not engraving
12:32 elektrinis my machine is 200kg (450lb)
12:32 dunz0r :o
12:32 saschi how many axis?
12:32 elektrinis 3
12:32 elektrinis so far
12:32 saschi old gcode?
12:33 elektrinis what is that :)
12:35 saschi gcode is, what most old fashioned cnc are able to read ;P
12:35 saschi if so, you could use mastercam
12:35 saschi i mean, it depends by your application set up, which CAD program for proper integration & so on
12:36 saschi i guess, you don't need virtual machining?
12:36 saschi how ever, mastercam is good
12:36 saschi :)
12:37 saschi elektrinis: if you're using solidworks, you should try SolidCAM
12:37 elektrinis I do
12:37 elektrinis and I tried solidcam
12:37 saschi and?
12:37 elektrinis incredibly buggy
12:38 saschi well
12:38 saschi buggy?
12:38 elektrinis cand go even through part config
12:38 elektrinis cant
12:38 saschi i guess, you're doing it wrong
12:38 elektrinis maybe.
12:38 saschi maybe "undongled" version? ^^
12:38 elektrinis :)
12:38 elektrinis maybe
12:38 saschi ah, ok
12:38 elektrinis cant buy stuff without trying it out
12:38 saschi request a demo
12:39 elektrinis m.
12:39 elektrinis will do
12:39 saschi or look for a better "undongled" version
12:40 saschi and yes, there are no good open source CAM solutions out there
12:40 SolarNRG OMG I HAVE CHROMIUM
12:40 SolarNRG AND TANTALUM
12:41 SolarNRG The chromium is so hard I can cut steel with it!
12:41 saschi hm
12:41 elektrinis at least not open source and not as big and expensive as solidcam
12:41 saschi SolarNRG: nice :D
12:42 saschi elektrinis: okay, tried rhinocam?
12:42 elektrinis m, no
12:43 saschi rhino(the NURBS modeller) + rhinocam is "affordable"
12:44 saschi bbl
18:27 home so I have been reading up on
18:27 home how accelerometers work
18:28 home I am getting data back in x,y,z
18:29 home but what is this data?
18:29 home the program is detecting 1.x G's, so its calculating gravity alright
18:29 home but what is raw data?
18:33 dunz0r home: Isn't it amount of Gs in xyz?
18:33 dunz0r Or some function of it at least
18:37 home using adxl345
18:37 home its returnning this data for y,x,z
18:38 home Raw: -40 22 262 Scaled: -0.16G 0.09G 1.02G
18:40 home how do I use the raw data
18:40 home how do I use the raw data
18:40 home lol
18:40 home what is it returning?
19:22 rue_house add it all togethor and call it the meaning of life
19:34 0rdfish pokes rue_ho
19:37 rue_house hmm
19:37 rue_house I need to make a hack-a-day post on how to store gas in a lightbulb
20:29 katsmeow-afk ok, i got a bit more than 2000 gallons of water uploaded
20:38 SolarNRG I'm drunk
20:38 SolarNRG woo
20:38 SolarNRG how ar u
20:38 katsmeow-afk undrunk
20:38 SolarNRG Good4u katsmyaow
20:39 katsmeow-afk maou
20:53 SolarNRG James blunt is daed
20:55 katsmeow-afk i will need him to confirm that
20:56 SolarNRG I wachd hm lve
20:56 SolarNRG sry 4 bed spelin but im pissed
20:58 katsmeow-afk i not trying to be insensitive, i never heard of him, i know nothing about him, sorry
20:58 SolarNRG http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oofSnsGkops
20:59 SolarNRG He was a baby murderer
20:59 katsmeow-afk o
20:59 SolarNRG But I had the opportunity of seeing him perform live on coke at cornbury last year
20:59 SolarNRG He was a royal marine in afghan
20:59 SolarNRG growing royal heroin
20:59 SolarNRG for royal junkies
20:59 SolarNRG killing familes so the heroin trade could flourish
21:00 katsmeow-afk i prolly wuld not have liked him
21:01 SolarNRG http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oofSnsGkops
21:01 SolarNRG Here's his song
21:01 SolarNRG youre beuatful
21:01 SolarNRG your beudtilful
21:01 SolarNRG ts truo
21:01 SolarNRG i saw ur face
21:01 SolarNRG in a crowded place
21:01 SolarNRG and i dont no what to do
21:01 SolarNRG cos ill enver be wiht u
21:04 dunz0r SolarNRG: I think someone just made it up.
21:05 dunz0r The wikipedia page has changed now.
21:06 SolarNRG hes alive
21:06 dunz0r http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=James_Blunt&diff=490727110&oldid=490726911
21:06 SolarNRG i can c him again at cornbury again?
21:06 SolarNRG hurray
21:06 SolarNRG :)
21:06 SolarNRG im so happy
21:28 katsmeow-afk [furrywolf PING reply]: 0 secs
21:28 katsmeow-afk . 9:18:23pm 05/04/12 Friday Steffann Ping timeout: 272 seconds .
21:30 katsmeow-afk hmm
21:32 tsmeow-afk thinks the "women" on the Bachelorette show look amazingly like real women, most act like it
21:36 katsmeow-afk i put it in quotes not out of disrespect, but since the show itself is outing them as small bachelors, the game, as they say, is already up
22:24 ninjapig hey guys
22:24 ninjapig anyone good with automatic and feedback control subjects?
22:24 ninjapig got a quick question on nyquist stability
22:25 ninjapig Nyquist stability
22:25 ninjapig no one here's familiar or proficient on the topic?
22:29 rrywolf flops on kat's lap in an exhausted wolfy
22:33 tsmeow-afk automatically starts preening a
22:34 furrywolf mrrf :)
22:34 katsmeow-afk it won't be a long preen i am exhausted also
22:35 katsmeow-afk i did manage to upload a bit over 2000 gallons of water today
22:35 furrywolf heh. I had work at 10:00 last night, 5:00 this morning, then 2:30 this afternoon. just got back now.
22:35 furrywolf not enough hours for wolfy sleep!
22:36 katsmeow-afk 3 works? how much time each work?
22:36 furrywolf use your solar panels to run a 12v pump down by the stream where no one can see them.
22:36 furrywolf first was an hour-ish, then another hour-ish, then the usual daily 5-ish hours.
22:38 katsmeow-afk i don't have 1/2 hp of panels, they'd be stolen or busted up if found, and it's amazingly wonderfully wooded down there
22:38 furrywolf no, you don't need 1/2hp... a little shurflo diaphragm pump. they pull about 80W.
22:39 furrywolf I use them for my water system.
22:39 katsmeow-afk to push gallons per minute up 70ft of mountan thru 250ft of pipe?
22:40 furrywolf the flow is only about 1gpm at 70ft head, but you put a tank on the end, and let it pump all day, while the tank supplies water quickly when you need it.
22:41 furrywolf my internet connection is even crappier today than yesterday. bleh.
22:42 furrywolf blah, I'm already starting to lag.
22:42 furrywolf http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&safe=off&q=shurflo+2088&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=6712048204814677496&sa=X&ei=4p6kT6X6G8e5tweasO3tBA&ved=0CNsBEPMCMAM
22:43 tsmeow-afk calcul
22:43 furrywolf god damnit... connection already reaching barely usable stage.
22:43 katsmeow-afk furry, type !ping
22:44 katsmeow-afk 1 gpm is 1400 gal/day, that would be good for gardening
22:44 furrywolf I have four of those for my water system... two get the water from the well into the big tank, two pressurize the water from the big tank into the bladder tank.
22:45 furrywolf if it's running off solar, figure 2-5 hours/day, not all day. :)
22:45 katsmeow-afk i have a baby one of those, bought years ago to pump garden water, then put on the hot water system to recirculate ( what a waste), but it's 120vac
22:46 katsmeow-afk would cost 25 cents per day to get 1400 gallons to the house
22:46 katsmeow-afk at 13 cents /kwh
22:47 furrywolf that's a lot of water.
22:47 furrywolf the average daily usage per person is, what, 80 gallons or so?
22:47 katsmeow-afk what's an "average person" ?
22:48 furrywolf dunno
22:48 furrywolf I don't use more than 200 gals/day even watering the garden.
22:49 katsmeow-afk i drink a gal per day, figure 3 gal for washing face and paws thru the day, 150 gal week for a load of clothes, 5 gal a day for toilet, no, unless i plant a garden, i can't use 80 gallons per day
22:50 katsmeow-afk i am going to change out this $#%YWTRHJWROTYJB @$%(^@U$%^ @B lowflow toilet tho, i am tired of flushing 2x then using the plunger, every day
22:50 furrywolf those shurflo 2088 pumps will do about 120ft pressure head and 20ft suction head, but not at the same time.
22:50 katsmeow-afk the webpage also says it's intermittant
22:51 furrywolf I've run them for >12 hours
22:52 furrywolf heh. I hate low-flow toilets.
22:53 katsmeow-afk me too, and got 2 of them, identical, 22 yrs ago, and they are both wasting water because they haveto be flushed repeatedly
22:54 furrywolf how are you getting water now? I don't think you carried 2000 gallons...
22:55 katsmeow-afk godamned webpages
22:58 katsmeow-afk i usd something like this down at the creek : http://www.homedepot.com/Flotec/h_d1/N-25ecodZ5yc1vZl1Z12l4/R-100142693/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=pump&storeId=10051
22:58 katsmeow-afk it LOOKS cast iron, it actually is plastic
22:59 katsmeow-afk today they had knocked $20 off the price of this one : http://www.homedepot.com/Flotec/h_d1/N-25ecodZ5yc1vZl1Z12l4/R-100140720/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=pump&storeId=10051
22:59 furrywolf web sites require greater internet connectivity than I currently have.
23:00 furrywolf cast iron shallow well pump... it says cast iron, but is plastic? lol
23:00 katsmeow-afk the smaller pump is doing 2.5 gals / minute, which is about creek flow after no rain in 2 weeks,, the bigger one will pump 10 gal / min and haveto cycle a lot when the creek is low,, but will fill the 2000 "tank" in a couple hours after rain
23:00 furrywolf hrmm, if you have enough power down there to run that, why do you need to use buckets to flush the toilet? heh
23:00 katsmeow-afk because the creek is 300ft from the toilet
23:01 furrywolf that black polypips is a cheap and works amazingly well. :)
23:01 furrywolf s/ a //
23:01 katsmeow-afk so far the water is outside the house, in an open pool, it's not fed into the house in any way yet,, i just GOT THe WATER TO THE HOUSe TODAY
23:01 furrywolf ah
23:01 katsmeow-afk i buried 3/4 pvc
23:01 furrywolf I'd send you a spare well pump with pressure tank, but shipping would exceed their value.
23:02 katsmeow-afk the electrical is 10-3,w/g
23:02 katsmeow-afk i have a well pump with pressure tank, but until sunset tobloody day, i had no water up here to pump
23:03 furrywolf ah. I thought this was an ongoing thing, not a recent improvement.
23:03 katsmeow-afk what?
23:03 furrywolf I should hurry up and get my indoor plumbing working! heh.
23:04 furrywolf the lack of water. something that you weren't in the middle of fixing.
23:04 katsmeow-afk i used creek water till i was brainwashed to use county water, and i needed filters on that, and then they cut me off mid February(?), so i have been without water since
23:04 katsmeow-afk tween then and now, i had county water for 20 years
23:05 furrywolf is the creek water drinkable?
23:05 katsmeow-afk now i say screw them ALL, and am back to using the free creek with unlimited water supply and no garden-killing chlorine
23:06 katsmeow-afk you have forgotten the time i spent putting in filters and replumbing the house last month?
23:07 furrywolf I don't think I was in here last month!
23:07 furrywolf I haven't been in here for a few years, until a couple weeks ago...
23:08 katsmeow-afk you were here
23:10 furrywolf you sure? I stopped in the other day to ask about hydraulic pumps, and that was the first time I've been here in many years.
23:11 katsmeow-afk are you aware last month was 4 DAYS ago?
23:11 furrywolf bah. I'm defining it as >30 days ago. :P
23:12 rrywolf curls back up and y
23:16 katsmeow-afk "membrane housing" is what RO filters go into, not "filter housing" or anything else, even tho some "membrane housings" look like they'd take a regular filter, but they won't
23:16 katsmeow-afk and no one, not even company which makes the things, will say which RO filter goes to which housing
23:17 furrywolf heh
23:17 furrywolf the best information I've found on what membrane fits which housings is companies selling generic replacement membranes.
23:17 furrywolf or do you mean the filters, not the membranes?
23:18 katsmeow-afk i look at housings .. "this housing will take most of this kind or this kind of filter" , and i look at filters, ... they don't mention the same numbers, and don't say which housing they use
23:18 katsmeow-afk a membrane IS a filter
23:18 furrywolf I've never found a filter that won't fit a filter housing... they're all generic ten inches long, unless you get into weird stuff. membranes are very brand-specific.
23:18 katsmeow-afk it's like a tyvek paper filter, but with holes so tiney, etc etc
23:19 katsmeow-afk so far 3 sellers on ebay won't sell me a RO filter in a housing, ready to connect pipes to
23:20 katsmeow-afk ironically, one of the nicks is "luvstosellthings"
23:20 furrywolf I have two RO units, but both probably need new membranes. I'll need to get a TDS meter to check, but I doubt they're good.
23:21 furrywolf got them from the thrift store.
23:21 katsmeow-afk http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=%22membrane+housing%22&_sacat=See-All-Categories
23:22 katsmeow-afk some say "fits all standard 12 inch membranes", the other says "fits all standard 10 inch membranes",, i say "so which is the REAL standard here??"
23:22 katsmeow-afk because most of the membrane filters on ebay do not give their size
23:23 katsmeow-afk they may also be 1.5 dia or 2.5 dia, and they don't say
23:23 furrywolf I found a web page once, from one of the membrane sellers, that listed brands/models/sizes with quite a bit of detail.
23:23 furrywolf no idea where it was, though.
23:23 katsmeow-afk and i'll bet a 12inch membrane 2.5 dia is not gonna fit the standard 10 inch housing for 1.5 filters
23:25 katsmeow-afk i think i'd like this housing: http://www.ebay.com/itm/REVERSE-OSMOSIS-10-CLEAR-HOUSING-1-4-NPT-/170434488585?_trksid=m7&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D3%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D8192979528385939156
23:25 furrywolf when I have indoor plumbing, getting one of my r/o units up will be the next step... stop buying bottled water.
23:25 katsmeow-afk but i cannot find if any membrane will fit it!
23:26 furrywolf that's for a filter cartridge, not a r/o membrane
23:26 katsmeow-afk REVERSE OSMOSIS 10" CLEAR HOUSING WITH 1/4" NPT
23:27 furrywolf yes, I know what the auction title is.
23:27 furrywolf you'd put your sediment and carbon filters in those, not an r/o membrane.
23:27 katsmeow-afk it doesn't say anywhere that it's a regurlar filter
23:27 furrywolf it is. :P
23:27 tsmeow-afk cu
23:28 rrywolf has worked on too many water fil
23:28 katsmeow-afk and all thhese membranes : http://stores.ebay.com/Water-Filter-Store/_i.html?_fsub=334179219 and not a one in a housing
23:29 furrywolf if you're running creek or rain water through it, I'd recommend a UV unit before the RO, otherwise stuff will grow on the membrane and kill it.
23:30 katsmeow-afk hmm, i was gonna UV after it
23:30 furrywolf no, you need to keep stuff from growing on the membrane.
23:30 furrywolf things like living on the nice porus surface...
23:30 katsmeow-afk recommend me one?
23:31 furrywolf one of the $40 ebay specials would be fine for a small RO system.
23:32 katsmeow-afk 9w? 6w? 5w? and what's the exposure time?
23:32 furrywolf hrmm, price has gone up, they're now $70 ebay specials. blah.
23:32 katsmeow-afk and they use electricity
23:33 furrywolf exposure time is pretty long, which makes up for the low power. even with a pretty wasteful membrane, you're not flowing more than a fraction of a gallon a minute.
23:34 furrywolf If you can afford it, you might just go for a system like http://www.ebay.com/itm/Reverse-Osmosis-System-24-35-50gpd-6-Stage-RO-UV-White-Water-Filter-H2O-Splash-/400255997725?pt=Small_Kitchen_Appliances_US&hash=item5d311dd71d
23:35 katsmeow-afk no
23:35 furrywolf except replace one of the carbon filters with another sediment filter, say a cotton string followed by a paper, to give much longer life with your water. the two carbons are good for city water with chlorine, which isn't an issue you have.
23:36 katsmeow-afk i need a number on "pretty long", because an inch of pipe exposed for 5w UV for a 150gpd filter is not the same as 10ft of tubing coiled around a 50w tube for a 25gpd filter
23:36 furrywolf blah, I'm getting too lagged again to have a conversation.
23:39 furrywolf "-:- CTCP PING reply from furrywolf: 150.931 seconds" yeah, I should give up on irc. bleh.
23:41 katsmeow-afk you have a fast tracert, furry, you maybe need to work other ways to get online
23:41 furrywolf I'm connected through a bouncer.
23:41 furrywolf I can drop offline and reconnect repeatedly and no one sees anything.
23:42 furrywolf the bouncer handles server pings too, so I don't ping timeout, even if I have ten minutes lag...
23:42 katsmeow-afk maybe that's also the problem <shrug>
23:42 furrywolf no, the problem is the 63% packet loss between me and the access point.
23:42 katsmeow-afk so send more packets
23:43 furrywolf tcp doesn't do that. tcp instead dies horribly when there's packet loss.
23:43 furrywolf tcp treats all packet loss as congestion, so when packets get lost, it assumes the link is overloaded, and keeps slowing down.
23:43 katsmeow-afk one tcp connection is that way, so make another
23:43 furrywolf but since the loss is due to things other than congestion, and doesn't go away at lower rates, tcp fails.
23:44 katsmeow-afk tcp loss != dsl negotiations
23:45 tsmeow-afk gives up in advance, because it's that kinda
23:45 furrywolf I haven't found a working tunnel that handles packet loss better.
23:45 furrywolf it's quite possible, but I haven't found one.
23:47 furrywolf non-tcp tunnels and nat seem to not play well
23:48 tsmeow-afk
23:48 katsmeow-afk i plan on sleep tonite, of some kind, and when the sleepy pills i ate catch up with me, i am gonna go out fast, and stay out till time to work my ass off aain to morrow
23:49 katsmeow-afk at least, that's the plan
23:49 furrywolf I'm contemplating heading off to bed too... with starting work at 5am, after finishing work at 11:30pm, I'm short on sleep.
23:51 tsmeow-afk
23:53 katsmeow-afk the hole in the floor where i was going to recess the bridgeport, has conduit for power, i am retasking that to be water into the cellar
23:53 katsmeow-afk no clue if i will ever have that bridgeport under roof
23:54 katsmeow-afk http://designerthinking.com/Bridgeport.html it's been 10 yrs now
23:54 rrywolf curls up next to kat for bed
23:56 rue_house I think I forgot who I am and what I do when I'm not working
23:56 katsmeow-afk zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
23:56 rue_house I think I forgot (who I am and what I do) when I'm not working
23:56 katsmeow-afk rue, post-it notes help at times like those
23:57 katsmeow-afk else, a rbot to slap you upside the head
23:58 katsmeow-afk ok, i am crashing, and my brain shuts off iin 12 minutes anyhow, so gnites
23:59 rrywolf tucks ka