#robotics Logs

May 01 2012

00:00 biscuitWizard Huh. That would work pretty well.
00:00 rue_house I should hope so
00:00 rue_house :)
00:00 rue_house not sure how many poles yet
00:00 rue_house but definitly operating at ~300V
00:02 biscuitWizard Hefty hefty. How were you going to do the transmission? Pinned single gear or clutched?
00:03 rue_house electronic clutch
00:03 rue_house right now the vehicle is an automatic
00:03 rue_house looking for a standard transmission
00:04 rue_house I dont need a clutch linkage, just a pedal with a switch
00:04 katsmeow-afk why use a clutch at all on a motor? i didn't use one on my electric vw beetle
00:04 rue_house :) makes it easier for ammatures to shift
00:04 biscuitWizard I will likely be keeping the clutch on my convert vehicle.
00:04 e_house clears throat and rubs his
00:04 biscuitWizard It's already a manual.
00:05 rue_house cool
00:05 biscuitWizard I just need to find a dagnabbed motor that fits my design spec.
00:05 biscuitWizard And google is failing me.
00:05 rue_house 6000 the average or redline on the engine?
00:05 biscuitWizard Redline, I'd hope.
00:05 katsmeow-afk the manula trannies are all synchromesh since the 1950's, afaik, heck i often don't use the clutch on the car now when upshifting,, or going into 1 or 2 at a stopsign
00:05 rue_house do yo have a tach on the engine now?
00:05 biscuitWizard It doesn't even have a tach.
00:05 biscuitWizard No.
00:05 rue_house put one in!
00:05 biscuitWizard Hahah! I will. :P
00:05 rue_house how did you get 80 ft-lbs?
00:06 rue_house engine spec?
00:06 biscuitWizard I looked at competing engines for maximum torque.
00:06 biscuitWizard On electronic replacements.
00:06 rue_house did you know that the engine curve is funny
00:06 biscuitWizard I know that it goes down!
00:06 katsmeow-afk you'll need more, you'll be carrying an added 1000lbs in batteries
00:06 rue_house the peak torque is not the peak rpm, its a fair ways under
00:06 biscuitWizard http://www.go-ev.com/images/003_16_WarP_9_SpreadSheet.jpg
00:07 rue_house ickgh 72V
00:07 rue_house you will be pulling ~600A
00:07 katsmeow-afk there's a comparable dc forklift Polish motor for 1/2 the price of Warps
00:08 biscuitWizard I figured it was poor pricing because of what it's being sold for. That's why I'm hunting.
00:08 biscuitWizard I just don't know where to look.
00:08 rue_house whats your 'budget'
00:09 biscuitWizard '5,000'
00:09 rue_house I'v got a battery pack to about $6800
00:09 e_house
00:09 biscuitWizard I have batteries sorted.
00:09 rue_house what type?
00:09 biscuitWizard L16s
00:09 biscuitWizard Deep cycle.
00:09 e_house cri
00:09 biscuitWizard Yep. They're heavy. :|
00:10 rue_house and cheap...
00:10 rue_house ""
00:10 biscuitWizard Indeed.
00:11 biscuitWizard Luckily they're the 12v model instead of the 6v. I got them from a friend from his solar array! Yaaaay. Free things.
00:11 rue_house is it an S10?
00:12 rue_house well, tell me if you find something promising, like I said, I gave up and am planning ot make my own
00:13 biscuitWizard Tell me if you decide you want to make a duplicate of the one you make. :P
00:13 rue_house bedtime, sorry
00:13 biscuitWizard Goodnight! Thanks for the help!
00:13 rue_house I need to makea small model of it
00:19 katsmeow-afk http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/322460131/DC_Motor_for_forklift.html
00:21 biscuitWizard Oh, interesting.
00:22 biscuitWizard Out of curiosity, with the lower RPMs, would you just change the gear ratio so the RPMs/power are appropriate at drive?
00:24 katsmeow-afk http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7598&highlight=forklift
00:25 katsmeow-afk given my expereince, i'd do as much as possible to eliminate the transmission totally, saving drivetrain efficiencey , weight, and space
00:26 katsmeow-afk i'd make one cogbelt (timing belt) rpm change if necessary
00:26 katsmeow-afk on level gnd, my vw ate ~200amps at 36vdc , and i expect most of that went to heating the transmsission
00:27 biscuitWizard Wouldn't it improve highway efficiency, however?
00:27 biscuitWizard I am trying to select the correct build for expected vehicular use.
00:27 katsmeow-afk it really depends on the motor, your driving habits, the steepness of the road, the vehicle weight, etc
00:29 katsmeow-afk i'd use a forkift motor for durability, i'd play with brush timing changing, and i'd use a 72v motor and a 140v battery pack, and size the drive belt/chain for highway speeds at rate motor wattage
00:29 biscuitWizard What supplier did you use?
00:30 katsmeow-afk supplier for what? i did this in ~1975
00:31 katsmeow-afk i used a *big* golfcart series wound motor with class F insulation, i didn't feel bad giving the 36v motor 48v as long as the current dropped below 250a within a minute
00:31 katsmeow-afk i drove only in town, downtown
00:32 biscuitWizard Ahah! I see. Yeah, I'm reading this thread and that's making sense now.
00:32 katsmeow-afk 10hp was enough for then and there
00:32 biscuitWizard Thanks, this is a big help. o_o
00:32 katsmeow-afk now, i'd prolly put a 15hp on each rear wheel, and a high volt battery pack for better accel and higher top speed
00:33 katsmeow-afk i would NOT use a oem transmission
00:33 katsmeow-afk i used 3rd almost all the time, it wold even hop a curb from a dead stop in 3rd, tho that was hard on the bateries
00:34 katsmeow-afk it was better to do 48v in 3rd than 36v in 4th
00:34 katsmeow-afk rpm was higher to compensate, and current was lower
00:35 biscuitWizard I've actually read that most people pin their transmission at first or second.
00:35 biscuitWizard If they need to reverse, they just reverse the motor.
00:36 katsmeow-afk yeas
00:36 katsmeow-afk but still, there's a lot of gears spinning on several shafts that you don't need
00:37 biscuitWizard That may be true. Do you think dropping or putting in a different transmission would be a superior choice?
00:38 biscuitWizard Just belt it down and put it right to the shaft?
00:38 katsmeow-afk http://www.forkenswift.com/
00:41 biscuitWizard Interesting. Forklift batteries are popular.
00:41 biscuitWizard Or motors, rather.
00:44 katsmeow-afk they are cheaper, and generally build heavier
00:45 katsmeow-afk forlift motors are not made to run every minute all day long, but your batteries won't last that long anyhow
00:46 katsmeow-afk $1000 motors will run at rated power every minute all day, they'll outlast 30 packs of your batteries, all day long, for months, but they won't take much abuse
00:47 biscuitWizard 30 packs of my batteries would weigh 30*124lbs
00:47 biscuitWizard Which in fact weighs more than the car.
00:48 biscuitWizard Too bad we can't have nuclear reactors in our cars. :P
00:50 katsmeow-afk only 124 lbs? not lead acids?
00:51 katsmeow-afk i had 12 of the biggest deep discharge i could find back then, at about 50lbs each
00:52 katsmeow-afk rule of thumb was 1hp-hr per battery if you were willing to abuse them, else half that
00:52 katsmeow-afk so i had 12hp for an hour, or 6hp for 2 hrs, depending on how hard i was on them
00:53 biscuitWizard They're flooded batteries. 370 AH for 20 hours.
00:55 katsmeow-afk you know that's less AH for less hours, right?
00:55 katsmeow-afk if you pull 200amps for an hour, they'll be about flat
00:56 katsmeow-afk the 370AH at 20hr rate is 18.5amps for 20 hrs
00:56 biscuitWizard Indeed. At 6v
00:57 biscuitWizard I have six. That's 2200AH for 20 hours or 111amps an hour.
00:58 katsmeow-afk umm, at 6v
00:59 katsmeow-afk the AH (current) doesn't add up if you put the in series to get 36v
00:59 biscuitWizard Wouldn't you wire them parallel?
00:59 katsmeow-afk if all you want is 6v, sure
01:00 katsmeow-afk how far will your car go on 6v?
01:00 biscuitWizard I am obviously a noob. :|
01:01 biscuitWizard Can these batteries be salvaged for anything? I didn't pay for them, so it's not terrible, but it would certainly be nice.
01:02 katsmeow-afk i thought you were using them in a car
01:03 biscuitWizard Can they be used for the EV or is 6v too little? :?
01:04 katsmeow-afk if you put them in series, the voltages add up
01:05 katsmeow-afk you have 6, that's 36v , most nev cars are 36-48v
01:06 katsmeow-afk 36v motors are easy to get for the hp you will need at 30mph
01:06 katsmeow-afk i goto bed, gnites
01:06 biscuitWizard Thanks! Goodnight!
08:36 rizlah Should one's initial breadboard be medium or large?
08:37 rizlah medium having ~400 pins, large having ~800
08:37 rizlah s/pins/points/
08:40 joink do you have to choose?
08:40 joink I've found uses for all sizes
08:40 joink depends on how long term the bread board setups you have are supposed to be
08:40 rizlah Right now I have a lot of things to buy, so one or the other.
08:40 rizlah What do you mean "long term"?
08:41 joink like, is what you test on a bread board only there for like a day or so
08:41 joink or do you plan on having some designs over a longer time
08:41 joink in that respect, I've found the smaller ones better, and then interfacing them again to a bigger
08:42 rizlah Ah, well seeing as I'll be learning more than making things first of all, the circuits would probably be disposable
08:42 rizlah Might be a good idea to get a large and small breadboard initially.
08:42 joink but I have no sense of size difference between large and medium
08:42 joink the smaller ones are good for ICs/chips,
08:42 SolarNRG Why do batteries have much shorter cycle lives than petrol tanks?
08:43 joink rizlah: but to be honest, I have no idea what to recommend here :P
08:43 rizlah Ah, no problem
08:44 joink it's easier to build stuff on the larger ones, but better to spend time on compacting stuff for long term use on the smaller-medium ones, that's basically what I think I think :P
08:51 rue_house SolarNRG, energy storage capability
08:52 rue_house in a lead acid battery, the power is just stored in a thin layer on the plates of the battery
09:07 SolarNRG Would supercapacitors be better?
09:07 SolarNRG I have this experimental dielectric called Copper Calcium Titanate
09:07 SolarNRG http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcium_copper_titanate
09:07 SolarNRG And it features in my latest video
09:08 SolarNRG yes my own hand has touched this material
09:08 SolarNRG http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlxbVKkm71E
09:08 SolarNRG Skip to about halfway across my video
09:08 SolarNRG It didn't make a good microwave susceptor, but it make make an awesome power storage medium,
09:10 rue_house not than a gas tank for energy storage
09:10 rizlah Would something like: http://media.digikey.com/photos/Twin%20Industries%20Photos/TW-E40-1020.jpg be a good starter breadboard?
09:11 rue_house yes, it shouldn't cost more than $8 tho
09:11 rizlah That is 7,49�
09:12 rue_house so its twice the cost it sould be
09:12 rue_house ? is a pound?
09:12 rizlah Hmm, possibly. I assumed digikey was the cheapest place to find components.
09:12 rizlah Euro
09:13 rue_house whats a euro worth?
09:13 rizlah 1$ = 0.7545e
09:13 rue_house ah, hmm
09:13 rizlah So that board is 10$
09:14 rue_house thats pretty close to a good price
09:14 rizlah Ah, ok
09:14 rizlah I still need to find everything else I need :x
09:14 rizlah Can someone look through my list when I've compiled it?
09:16 rue_house ...
09:17 rizlah For things I've missed out/something better could be added/etc
09:17 rue_house do you have 1k resistors on the list
09:17 rizlah I do not have anything on the list right now. I'm still compiling it
09:18 rue_house add 1k resistors
09:18 rue_house and blue leds
09:18 rizlah Ok, why?
09:18 SolarNRG Is it better to turn electricity into chemical energy than to store it as charge in a battery or capacitor?
09:18 rue_house cause it dosn't matter what project your building, you need those
09:18 rue_house bateries are chemical energy
09:19 rue_house capacitors are good, but dont exceed batteries yet
09:19 SolarNRG I meant say instead of charging lithium ions, you use the electricity to turn carbon dioxide and water vapour into methane for instance?
09:20 SolarNRG Rue, I was asking about a copper calcium titanate capacitor, it doesn't yet exist but I have the raw powder
09:20 SolarNRG Could I make a capacitor out of it and would it be any good?
09:20 rue_house try it
09:20 SolarNRG How?
09:21 rue_house I imagine ou would need to spray it so hot onto aluminum sheet that it would fuse in
09:21 rue_house carbon might work better
09:23 SolarNRG hmm, how about a microwave sandwich?
09:24 SolarNRG sandwich it and microwave it
09:31 rizlah FML can't find sets of wires on dkey
09:57 rizlah When you have something like http://www.digikey.fi/product-detail/en/923345-20-C/923345-20-ND/20257 , I assume it isn't stuck on that shape?
10:17 sw0rdfish hey
10:17 sw0rdfish anyone wanna join me for some ice cream :)
10:18 rizlah http://www.digikey.fi/product-detail/en/A000028/1050-1011-ND/2638999 How does this look?
10:31 rizlah Am looking around to see if it's cheaper/better to get the wires/board/etc seperately, and what things to cut out. But how does the general "things included" look on that link? Would you add anything there (other than the mentioned 1k resistors and blue LEDs)?
10:31 biscuitWizard Hey, Rue.
10:32 sw0rdfish .fi?
10:32 sw0rdfish cool.
10:32 sw0rdfish http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/223395
11:26 katsmeow-afk rizlah, 2mm red led and 470 ohm resistors, so you can run them off 5v and indicate something besides the blue leds off 12v
11:26 katsmeow-afk leds and resistors are prolly much cheaper on ebay
11:27 rizlah Ah, will add to list.
11:27 katsmeow-afk SolarNRG, how do you fasten leads to the copper calcuim tantanate, and how conductive is it? why is it better than the aluminum oxide layer used now?
11:28 rizlah You think the above link is too broad? Should I buy them seperate or go with a kit
11:28 katsmeow-afk which link?
11:28 rizlah http://www.digikey.fi/product-detail/en/A000028/1050-1011-ND/2638999
11:29 katsmeow-afk ack!! what is it you will be doing with your kit?
11:30 rizlah http://www.digikey.fi/product-detail/en/A000032/1050-1012-ND/2639000 I'm thinking this may be better. If I get this link I have a cheap bb with wires, and can add more when I need.
11:30 rizlah I will be learning with my kit. :D
11:30 Tom_itx you can get most of that from an old printer
11:31 rizlah Tom_itx: I don't have an old printer, nor the tools/skills to unsolder things.
11:31 katsmeow-afk i hate to say it, but othr than the tilt sensor, even *i* prolly throw away stuff when all it has on it is the stuff in that kit
11:32 katsmeow-afk for $38, that kit is aripoff
11:32 DanFrederiksen is that a russian name :)
11:32 katsmeow-afk 1) decide what you want to do , 2) get parts to do it
11:33 rizlah katsmeow-afk: I'm looking to learn all about electronics, hence the breadboard rather than a ready made board.
11:34 katsmeow-afk so 1) pick an led color for your arduino (or get a plain avr) to blink 2) get 10 of those parts for $5 off ebay
11:34 dunz0r rizlah: Unsoldering is easy. All you need is a soldering iron and some desoldering braid or a solder suction-thingie.
11:34 katsmeow-afk ok, not arguing the plugboard , but all the otehr stuff on it is way overpriced
11:34 dunz0r If you're skilled enough you can even do it with just a soldering iron.
11:35 rizlah hmm.
11:35 katsmeow-afk look, i have picked up 2000 of thos capacitors on ebay for 99 cents, 50 transistors for 99 cents, why pay $38 ? , heck, i have over 6000 smt transistors out int he dirt int he driveway for fre!!
11:35 dunz0r I only used old PC PSUs as my sole source for capacitors for years.
11:36 Steffanx :)
11:36 dunz0r katsmeow-afk: Why on earth do you have 6000 smt transistors in the dirt of your driveway?:)
11:36 katsmeow-afk i need new paws, rue, get on that sooon as you have my tree climber robot done
11:36 dunz0r rizlah: And I only used a soldering iron and pliers for it :)
11:36 rizlah katsmeow-afk: I'm not arguing price. My initial messages regarding the links were about the items contained, not the package itself
11:37 katsmeow-afk dunz0r, they are on 300 pcb in boxes, still out there because ic annot get them inside atm
11:37 dunz0r katsmeow-afk: Ah. I thought they were buried in the dirt of your driveway. Which would have been weird.
11:37 dunz0r rizlah: The contents look good.
11:38 rizlah This is a make-a-shopping-list conversation, rather than a lets-buy-stuff-now
11:38 katsmeow-afk rizlah, ok, get 10 of each item (not 3) on ebay, and get a more assorted list (not just non or n-channel) and (not just mosfets but also bipolar) for less on ebay
11:38 rizlah breadboard from ebay too?
11:38 katsmeow-afk they are available
11:38 dunz0r rizlah: I you can, get some "regular" value resistors. I mostly use 100 ohm, 330 ohm, 1k ohm and 10k ohm for example
11:39 dunz0r So I have a bunch of those.
11:39 dunz0r You can get almost anything off ebay.
11:39 dunz0r I think my next robots motors are going to be bought on ebay. Saw a nice pair of 600RPM 12V motors.
11:39 dunz0r They'll run great at 18V >:D
11:41 dunz0r Just waiting for the seller to get back to me with stall currents. If they're within sane limits I'm buying them.
11:41 katsmeow-afk 220, 470, 4.7k resistors
11:42 rizlah How much would a breadboard with 840 pins be worth?
11:42 dunz0r About 5-10 usd probably.
11:43 dunz0r rizlah: http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p5197.m570.l1313&_nkw=breadboard+840+pins&_sacat=See-All-Categories
11:43 dunz0r Here's a kit with both jumper wires and a breadboard: http://www.ebay.com/itm/840-Pin-Breadboard-66mm-x-174mm-140-Jumper-Wire-Kit-/150443611053?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item23072353ad
11:44 dunz0r That seller seems to have quite a lot of stuff in his store as well.
11:44 dunz0r 100 pack of resistors and such
11:44 katsmeow-afk dunz0r , this is one truckload, ~1/2 ton, i got maybe 3 truckloads like this : http://designerthinking.com/images/misc/0983M.JPG
11:44 rizlah katsmeow-afk: ... What do you need all that for?
11:44 katsmeow-afk i pulled the pcb out, returned the steel, my total cost for all the electronics = the gas to go there
11:45 katsmeow-afk rizlah , free parts
11:45 dunz0r katsmeow-afk: Oh right. Those cable boxes.
11:45 dunz0r Sweet lord. Half a tonne of cable boxes :)
11:45 rizlah dunz0r: That seller looks good. Very cheap stuff
11:46 katsmeow-afk over 300 mosfets 600v , 1800 512k rams, 300+ psu , etc
11:46 dunz0r rizlah: Yeah. I'll save him for later, seems good :)
11:46 katsmeow-afk 300+ 10bit and 8bit 20Mhz analog to digital convertors
11:47 katsmeow-afk 300+ serial 16bit dac volume controls
11:47 katsmeow-afk 1200+ led readouts, 300+ IR pickups/filter/ttl
11:48 katsmeow-afk 3000+ pcb pushbuttons
11:48 katsmeow-afk besides, *free* fits my budget
11:49 katsmeow-afk funny , some of you guys looking for this sorta stuff, but if i put it on ebay no one bids
11:50 dunz0r Put it up as "buy it now". I'm too lazy to do auctions
11:50 dunz0r And make sure you ship everywhere.
11:51 rizlah http://ideone.com/e5JAa list so far, links are just model links not buying suggestions. Not sure what else to add
11:52 rizlah The breadboard will probably inlucde jumper wires when bought, so didn't list there.
11:52 dunz0r rizlah: With LEDs I would suggest; red, green, yellow (5mm) and RGB (5mm) as well.
11:52 rizlah Added
11:52 dunz0r LEDs are great to show status of what your project is doing :)
11:52 furrywolf I'm trying to sell an inverter and a charge controller, but no bites yet.
11:53 rrywolf hops on kat's
11:53 rizlah dunz0r: By RGB, you mean an LED capable of all three colours?
11:54 dunz0r rizlah: Yep.
11:54 rizlah ok
11:54 dunz0r Those aren't really necessary though. But they're fun to play with.
11:54 dunz0r rizlah: For example, a colour sensor could be constructe with an RGB LED and an LDR.
11:54 furrywolf I've gotten some interesting parts from the local scrapyard... one day I brought back twelve 400A, 600V darlingtons... small bricks. other times I get motors, or gears and sprockets, or all sorts of random things.
11:55 tsmeow-afk automatically absentmindedly pr
11:55 furrywolf mrrf :)
11:55 dunz0r rizlah: Old printers are golden btw.
11:55 rizlah dunz0r: What about power sources for board?
11:55 dunz0r Lots of cogs, rods and sensors in those
11:56 dunz0r rizlah: Ah. Get some LM7805s, 100uF poly capacitors and 1uF ceramic disc capacitors too.
11:56 dunz0r And some diodes possible.
11:56 katsmeow-afk i picked up 2 golfcart transaxles with motors and springs, plus two forklift motors, plus 4 12vdc hydraulic pump packs, for 10 cents per pound
11:56 dunz0r With that you can build a 5V power supply
11:57 dunz0r rizlah: http://www.sparkfun.com/tutorials/57
11:57 dunz0r That circuit there is a good power supply for 5V.
11:57 rizlah Is it better to buy something like: http://www.ebay.com/itm/15M-STARTER-PACK-MIXED-EQUIPMENT-WIRE-15-METERS-16-STRAND-0-2MM-ELECTRONIC-/160766910534?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item256e746046
11:57 dunz0r I build those all the time on my breadboard :)
11:57 rizlah Than to get the box of wires
11:57 furrywolf katsmeow-afk: nice. any of the hydraulic pump backs servicable? I need a 10000PSI one for my crimper. (has a 10000psi hand pump, but the seals are going, and electric would be nice...)
11:58 furrywolf s/backs/packs
11:58 rizlah http://www.ebay.com/itm/840-Pin-Breadboard-66mm-x-174mm-140-Jumper-Wire-Kit-/150443611053?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item23072353ad This has wires in the box, but not as much as the link above
11:58 dunz0r rizlah: No, those are quite large wires. Won't fit in your breadboard.
11:58 rizlah But if you can find proper size I mean
11:58 rizlah A roll of wire is cheaper/more usable than pre-cut, right?
11:59 dunz0r rizlah: The wires in the second link just have one thick conductor, so they're easy to plug in to the breadboard.
11:59 rizlah Ah
11:59 katsmeow-afk i have not tested them for pressure, because of the move that didn't happen, things are all screwed up here, worse than normal, including my back, and i have no running water in the house yet
11:59 dunz0r Regular multiconductor wire usually takes a bit more work to get in to those small holes
12:00 furrywolf no running water in here, either.
12:00 katsmeow-afk you have a bad back? can you carry the water needed to flush the toilet?
12:00 rrywolf moves in with katsmeow-afk, because being in a backwoods shack is always better when you have someone else to share all your complaints
12:00 furrywolf toilet? that'd be nice!
12:01 katsmeow-afk nice, sure, but atm i cannot get outside to use the woods, again because of back
12:01 furrywolf :(
12:02 furrywolf the previous resident here put in a composting toilet... which is a glorified shit bucket.
12:02 katsmeow-afk those work, if they are big enough, seeded right, and well built
12:02 furrywolf re-installing a toilet is very high on my priority list.
12:03 katsmeow-afk and you need two, for the 6mo idle time after-last-use-to-empty timeframe
12:04 katsmeow-afk if you install a flush toilet, youneed septic tank etc and rainwater collection off your roof
12:04 dunz0r I don't think you need two... just dig a hole and empty the bucket in there when it's full
12:04 katsmeow-afk rainwater tanks freeze in winter, need winter water storage too
12:04 furrywolf I have a tank, just not a field. the original cause of the non-toilet was because the field was orangeburg pipe, and collapsed.
12:04 katsmeow-afk bucket? for a composting toilet? that is seriously too small
12:05 katsmeow-afk real civilus multrum types are closet-sized
12:05 dunz0r katsmeow-afk: Oil drum maybe?
12:05 dunz0r That's what I use in my summerhome.
12:05 dunz0r Oil drum with the top cut off.
12:06 katsmeow-afk not for composting, compost needs air, tanks aren't so airey
12:06 furrywolf I need to dig a new leach field... annoying project, but not too bad.
12:06 dunz0r katsmeow-afk: Ah. No, doesn't work for compositing.
12:06 furrywolf but that won't do any good without running water. I have water in the pump shed, which was 90% of the battle. (drilling well, etc)
12:06 dunz0r I don't have any place to grow stuff there anyway, no need for composited earth.
12:07 katsmeow-afk know what beats *digging* ? locate an area that needs raising, lay pipe on ground, bury it to raise the ground level
12:08 furrywolf problem is that would involve raising the tank too.
12:08 katsmeow-afk you didn't plan ahea
12:08 katsmeow-afk d
12:08 furrywolf I didn't build this place. heh.
12:09 dunz0r If the winters weren't so damn cold here I would also live in a cabin in the forest.
12:09 furrywolf when I got here, it had no water, no power, about 47 roof leaks,...
12:09 dunz0r But for it to be liveable in winter I have to isolate like crazy.
12:09 dunz0r Or use more firewood than a small russian town
12:09 katsmeow-afk i bought woods, built a big enough, well built cabin, it's called a house
12:10 furrywolf it had a rainwater catch before, but didn't work very well. the original water source was a hand-dug well that always produced barely usable water, and had filled in.
12:10 rrywolf can't afford to buy propert
12:10 katsmeow-afk you are renting the place you are improving??
12:11 furrywolf it's a friend's place... he's "renting" it to me in trade for improvements, no money involved.
12:11 rizlah What chip would you suggest for using when learning ? Something quite general I would think
12:11 dunz0r rizlah: Define "chip"
12:11 rizlah CPU
12:12 rizlah Uh, MCU
12:12 dunz0r rizlah: AVR or PIC. Whichever you fancy.
12:12 katsmeow-afk any avr dip bigger than 20 pins
12:12 dunz0r I like AVR
12:12 dunz0r rizlah: Maybe an Attiny2313?
12:12 furrywolf for learning what? I'd suggest a 74ls00 for learning ttl logic, an avr for learning microcontrollers, anything with olestra for learning why you should buy natural potato chips,...
12:13 rizlah Ah, avr it is.
12:13 furrywolf and don't get an arduino, or I'll have to not like you.
12:13 katsmeow-afk i doubt you can get 74LS parts anymore
12:14 rizlah I wouldn't learn much by writing arduino software
12:15 dunz0r rizlah: If you're starting out with microcontrollers you should read all parts of this: http://www.sparkfun.com/tutorials/57
12:15 dunz0r I learned a bunch :)
12:16 rizlah Reading
12:26 rizlah dunz0r: That tutorial is stepping down from a wall socket, right? is it the same process if you use a 9v battery, or would it be easier?
12:26 rizlah Oh nvm, stupid question
12:29 rrywolf pokes to see if that's actually a spacekitteh or a recon
13:21 rizlah https://www.sparkfun.com/products/112
13:21 rizlah http://www.ebay.com/itm/840-Pin-Breadboard-Solderless-Prototype-66mm-x-174mm-/150443602485?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item2307233235
13:21 rizlah Does it matter that the latter does not have the black bottom layer?
13:21 Steffanx No
13:22 Steffanx Be aware of the fact that cheap doesn't always means good quality
13:22 Steffanx I have some cheap chinese breadbords that a CRAP
13:22 Steffanx boards
13:23 rizlah Sure, I know that. Just wondering what the bottom layer is used for
13:24 Tom_itx there is no bottom layer
13:25 Tom_itx it's an aluminum mounting block they glued the cheapass chinese breadboard to and added 2 posts for power
13:25 Tom_itx or 3
13:25 Tom_itx get the cheap one
13:25 Tom_itx or a dozen of them
13:25 rizlah I see. So it isn't really used for anything special? and by cheap you mean the ebay one?
13:26 Tom_itx it may make you feel better
13:26 Tom_itx it's still a cheap chinese breadboard
13:27 Steffanx Yes, but probably a better quality versions
13:27 Tom_itx Steffanx, it weighs in at 50v and 18A
13:27 rizlah Right. Note that I'm still learning, hence I don't know what is/isnt worth buying
13:27 Tom_itx Steffanx, i doubt it anymore
13:27 Steffanx I don't
15:07 katsmeow-afk $15 from recycler: 3gal shopvac, 36x8 stainless steel for making faceplates, 120v-24v@2.5a transformer, 3pcs 12v small engine starter motors, one very short halfshaft with good bearings (universals) to connecting engine to genny (or motor to tranny, or etc)
18:16 katsmeow-afk actually, it's a 10 gal shopvac, but i figure it's 3 gallons before it sucks water into the motor
19:25 Tom_itx got a little bit more done today: http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/cnc/psu/heatsink3.jpg
19:25 Tom_itx http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/cnc/psu/driver_wiring.jpg
19:29 DanFred how much do they cost each?
19:29 DanFred the geckos
19:32 Tom_itx http://www.kelinginc.net/GeckorDriver.html
19:50 katsmeow-afk why did you mill some of the fins off?
19:51 Tom_itx so i can mount it thru a pannel
19:52 Tom_itx i would heat an aluminum hub to slip it over a frozen shaft wouldn't I?
19:55 katsmeow-afk i think you would
19:56 katsmeow-afk you have said you would in the past, and i believe you
20:38 Tom_itx katsmeow-afk i wonder how thick the hub should be
20:41 katsmeow-afk thick enough to hold the screws, at least the thickness of the axle (0.25")
20:41 katsmeow-afk plus a screw to hold it on the axle
20:49 katsmeow-afk wow, i are passing out again
20:50 katsmeow-afk bbl
22:26 Tom_itx katsmeow-afk
22:33 Tom_itx progress so far: http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/kat/hub1.jpg
22:33 Tom_itx http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/kat/hub2.jpg
22:33 Tom_itx http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/kat/hub3.jpg
23:30 katsmeow-afk oh wow, nice fit! that's gonna hold it in place no matter how the screws fit, real nice Tom :-)
23:30 katsmeow-afk does leaving the copper on it help?
23:30 katsmeow-afk how did you cut the hole so neat in the fr4?
23:31 tsmeow-afk would have used a drill bit, and ended up with a 3-lobed
23:48 katsmeow-afk this ebay digital dvm is pocket sized, works well, has very good backlighting, doesn't look as cheap as it is, many ebay sellers have it, http://www.ebay.com/itm/190606079584 and it looks better than http://www.ebay.com/itm/130685733881
23:50 katsmeow-afk two gotchas tho: 1) open it up and 1a) make sure the continuity beeper wires are not pinched anywhere, 1b) secure the little fuse so it cannot pop out , 2) the shell around the inner plugin holes will break off exposing the terminals, sorta voiding any european fancy voltage protection rating, but the meter still works fine with the enclosed double-insulated leads
23:51 tsmeow-afk is just trying to be hel
23:52 home_ is that made with a lathe?
23:52 home_ I think I only saw a hub made once..
23:52 katsmeow-afk no, you canot make a dvm on a lathe!
23:52 home_ I am not really good when it comes to mechanical things..
23:52 home_ katsmeow-afk: ah :D
23:53 home_ what do you make that with?
23:53 katsmeow-afk if you don't care about backlighting or looks, the cheap yellow and red centech meters work too
23:54 katsmeow-afk Tom is making a prototype experimental motor armature for me
23:55 katsmeow-afk i want to see if i can get zhanx's spider to hop 4ft up for less than $1000, and using no explosives