#linuxcnc Logs

Feb 13 2025

01:44 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> moin
03:44 AM Jym: Thought I'd pop in and say hello =)
03:47 AM Deejay: moin
04:17 AM Tom_L: morning
04:20 AM rifraf: evening Tom_L
04:21 AM rifraf: my current state Tom_L https://i.imgur.com/HGC1FOC.jpeg
04:22 AM rifraf: first day controller free from machine since prototyping started, been a long day
04:35 AM lcnc-relay: <travis_farmer@> Morning
04:39 AM lcnc-relay: <travis_farmer@> 15F and snowing
05:04 AM lcnc-relay: <meisterdippel@> rifraf: suitcase from James Bond ?
05:07 AM rifraf: heh, kinda, little 5 axis controller and drivers, did some rearranging today and managed to remove a few items and fit what needed to
05:07 AM rifraf: added all the aviation plugs too, has been tethered forever till today
05:49 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> i set the parallel port to be EPP and SPP in the bios, can i somehow tell linuxcnc to only use the EPP mode
08:58 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> it does not matter. If linuxcnc see's the printer port - it is working
08:59 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> The epp vs standard mainly is how the printer port is setup.. TTL vs open collector
09:09 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> skunkworks8841@how do i home the mill, like if i zero the axis and then move somewhere, how do i tell it go back to the 0, i click home and nothing happens except the values change to 0, this is on qtdragon
09:13 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> do you have home switches?
09:13 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> no
09:13 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> home is the physical act of homing..
09:14 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> if you have no home switches - and you press home - it homes the machine at the given location
09:14 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> is that how to send back all axis to 0
09:14 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> the 0 set by me that is
09:14 AM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on@> G0x0y0z0
09:14 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> If you want to go 'home' there are a bunch of ways - I usually use G53x0y0z0
09:15 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> so theres no inbuilt button like on mach3
09:15 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> no.
09:16 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> understood, i did a manual tool change but the Z value didnt adjust even though the tools have different heights in the tooltable
09:16 AM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on@> Did you call G43?
09:16 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> you have to.. ^
09:16 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> no just m6 t
09:17 AM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on@> You need G43 to apply the offset
09:17 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> huursabg@ linuxcnc is more like an industrial cnc control.
09:17 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> hmm it makes sense but mach3 did it automatically so i thought its the same
09:18 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> skunkworks8841@: why when i turn on the steppers, theres a quick sound they make and the dial gauge measures a change of 10 microns
09:18 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> you could re-map the tool change to do that.. But really - leaning how it 'should' be done is probably better.
09:19 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> Steppers will lock into a certain coil pattern (depending on the drive) when you first turn them on. (so they may move a little bit)
09:19 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> understood
09:20 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> is it intetional that linuxcnc doesnt have ntp running
09:21 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> what image are you using?
09:21 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> 2.9.4 stable
09:21 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> pre-rt or something
09:21 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> never mind - printer port - so computer - right?
09:21 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> ye
09:22 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> I think at some point debian changed from ntp to something else
09:22 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> well its an lpt header not a normal port
09:22 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> skunkworks8841@: im asking this because i reset the bios and the time/date got changed which is weird because i thought debian automtically keeps time
09:22 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> it should..
09:23 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> keep time
09:23 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> so i thought thats off to save cpu cycles
09:23 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> keep it as rt as possible
09:24 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> skunkworks8841@: is it bad if my time is out of sync by a few hours? i mean the gcode shouldnt care
09:24 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> no - but I have had issues when the time does sync.. You are on the internet?
09:24 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> ye but its not a problem, i use usb to move files anyway
09:25 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> or you mean that it might update the time and make the controller chimp out
09:26 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> (I had really shitty internet a while ago and it was causing issues - but actually switched back to ntp and if fixed the problem) this was on a rpi so YMMV
09:26 AM lcnc-relay: Yes - I have had that problem - but only on the pi. I would probably not worry about it.
09:26 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> but - It should sync the time...
09:26 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> you in the right time zone?
09:26 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> well should be as long as the bios didnt change that as well
09:27 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> what happens when you type timedatectl
09:27 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> are there versions of linuxcnc where its as barebone as possible and just has some gui to save cpu cycles?
09:28 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> the livecd is pretty basic
09:29 AM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> skunkworks8841@: i gave up with the date shit and didnt try also im not that good with linux, i prefer openbsd because i always seem to have issues with linux
09:31 AM lcnc-relay: <vibram@> sorry to ask again but i'm struggling with my spindle PID
09:32 AM lcnc-relay: <vibram@> i dont know which signal i should put in HAL scope in order to monitor and improve the PID tuning
09:37 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> measure PID error.
09:37 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> then pid command and pid ouput
09:38 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> output
09:38 AM lcnc-relay: <vibram@> do you have the sinal name by any chance please?
09:46 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> lol - no.. https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/man/man9/pid.9.html
10:11 AM lcnc-relay: <unterhausen@> is libera down, or is it just me?
10:11 AM bjorkintosh: it's fine here.
10:12 AM bjorkintosh: no issues at all.
10:29 AM lcnc-relay: <unterhausen@> okay, I have had trouble getting it to reconnect before
10:34 AM bjorkintosh: it's surprising. on freenode there were netsplits several times a day. how did libera fix it?
10:34 AM roycroft: it's snowing here, but i'm not down because of it
10:35 AM roycroft: i can't speak for the rest of libera, though
10:35 AM Unterhausen: everything is melting today, reminding me I should have cleaned the gutters
10:35 AM bjorkintosh: I've never seen a netsplit on libera.
10:35 AM roycroft: the snow is supposed to turn into rain by mid-day
10:36 AM roycroft: i hope it does
10:36 AM roycroft: i have to go into town at the end of the day
10:36 AM Unterhausen: I blame hexchat for not reconnecting, but it's not obvious. Only happens every few weeks
10:37 AM Unterhausen: solidworks is taking forever to uninstall, and seemingly leaves gigs of cruft behind
10:39 AM roycroft: sw definitely does not uninstall cleanly
10:39 AM Unterhausen: still 34% of the storage in the programs directory
10:40 AM Unterhausen: I was hoping for 0%
10:40 AM bjorkintosh: hmm. maybe it should be installed in its own drive!
10:40 AM bjorkintosh: that way, you wipe out the drive when you're done with it.
10:41 AM Unterhausen: I have another drive for this computer, sitting in a box
10:42 AM bjorkintosh: got bitten once too many times by ubuntu botched upgrades. I now separate /home from everything else.
10:42 AM bjorkintosh: that way a re-install leaves my /home alone.
10:42 AM Unterhausen: getting a cheap drive just for sw seems like a good idea
10:44 AM Unterhausen: I wish I had known about wiztree before, but it only comes up when I install sw
10:45 AM Unterhausen: sw says it needs 20gb, but it only uses 7gb. I blame france
11:08 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> my intel B580 should be here tomorrow.. Kinda excited,
11:08 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> 250 for a 12gb video card with ray tracing..
11:10 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> (I have been running a a750 for a while now and happy with it.
12:38 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Hi, my library has a Nomad 3 Carbide that speaks GRBL. Can I just pipe a g-code program to the USB or maybe use Minicom to send it?
12:43 PM jpa-: there are various gcode sender programs, but linuxcnc definitely isn't one of them
12:45 PM jpa-: looks like carbide 3d has its own program, why not use that?
12:49 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Some folks said yesterday that it was okay to ask general questions here, too. I am a total newbie
12:50 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> As for the program, I use Linux exclusively
12:50 PM jpa-: i guess, just decided to clarify that linuxcnc as a program won't help there, maybe the channel will :)
12:51 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Yeah, thanks! I am not opposed to running LinuxCNC when I buy something for my home although it seems like GBRL has the market cornered
12:52 PM jpa-: yeah, low-end market is dominated by grbl-like devices because they are very cheap
12:52 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
12:52 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> How do the high-end devices talk to LinuxCNC? Is it USB?
12:52 PM jpa-: i'd suggest using a program like "universal gcode sender" because it will handle flow control better than plain serial terminal programs
12:53 PM jpa-: nowadays mesa electronics FPGA cards with either PCIe or ethernet connection are popular
12:53 PM roycroft: lechner: linuxcnc is the controller software - you load your files into linuxcnc and linuxcnc talks to the device
12:53 PM jpa-: tormach machines use linuxcnc but with their custom frontend
12:54 PM roycroft: you can generate your gcode files however you wish, and transfer them to the linucnc machine however you wish
12:54 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> yeah, i got that. i just wasn't sure where to plug in the stepper motor
12:54 PM roycroft: linuxcnc either uses a parallel port interface to the device or an ethernet interface to the device
12:55 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> also thanks for the g-code sender hint. that makes sense given that g-codes can span multiple lines
12:55 PM roycroft: you would build whatever controller you wish
12:56 PM roycroft: and as jpa- said, the mesa fpga cards are the most common ways to interface with the machine these days
12:56 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> So the core strength of LinuxCNC is to calculate the path?
12:56 PM roycroft: it does the gcode to machine motion work
12:57 PM jpa-: i'd say core strength of linuxcnc is having very small latency between user interface and hardware; and you can easily customize to add more realtime things
12:57 PM roycroft: and using the fpga cards mentioned above is preferred because they handle the motion control and you don't have to worry about latency on your linuxcnc machine
12:57 PM jpa-: additional plus is having real g code support (like loops & variables etc.) but that can partially be handled using preprocessing for the limited subset grbl code
12:57 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> you program these separately, then? http://www.mesanet.com/fpgacardinfo.html
12:58 PM jpa-: lechner: mostly you just configure the IO pins and then you connect them in the linuxcnc HAL configuration
01:00 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> those cards are pricey
01:00 PM roycroft: you need to configure the mesa card one time per machine configuration, and there are tools to help with that
01:00 PM jpa-: roycroft: well, they only handle step generation or similar; you still need less than 1 ms latency
01:01 PM jpa-: lechner: there is also remora project that aims to use the cheap 3d printer controller cards for linuxcnc usage
01:02 PM jpa-: lechner: but for cheapie few hundred dollar CNC machines the cheap grbl clones are probably good enough.. at least if you get one that has low enough latency when you press pause (some have terrible multiple second delays) :)
01:03 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Thanks! Why was the Raspberry Pi 3 not suitable for LinuxCNC? Slow floating-point math?
01:03 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> How is something like this? https://www.amazon.com/LUNYEE-MAX-All-Metal-Switches-Emergency-Stop/dp/B0C6WQWX3R/140-3502159-7709905?pd_rd_w=e6xwZ&content-id=amzn1.sym.d95110a4-e921-4e5d-83f5-db6ab3273304&pf_rd_p=d95110a4-e921-4e5d-83f5-db6ab3273304&pf_rd_r=R812109R4EDWFMS95656&pd_rd_wg=kKUCl&pd_rd_r=54aa2059-664c-49f7-8ddf-8fef6895168b&pd_rd_i=B0C6WQWX3R&th=1
01:04 PM jpa-: terrible :)
01:04 PM jpa-: but an ok machine to learn the basics on and you can make PCBs with it ok enough
01:05 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Worse than this one? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0C9DFZC9S?th=1
01:06 PM jpa-: supported rails on the second one is slightly better, but i think the bad spindle will be the limiting factor
01:07 PM jpa-: i have a 10+ years old CNC3020, it has that exact same spindle and it is the worst part of the machine.. also non-standard size so hard to figure out a better replacement
01:09 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Where may see the supported rails, please?
01:09 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> I
01:09 PM jpa-: in the first machine linked, axes slide on round bars supported only at ends
01:10 PM jpa-: in second machine, there are square rails that are bolted all along their length
01:10 PM jpa-: so they don't flex and bend as much
01:10 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Okay, thanks!
01:12 PM jpa-: the second machine also looks like it could be slightly easier to upgrade the spindle.. some of their videos show a model with better spindle, and the mounting part looks like it can be changed
01:13 PM jpa-: funnily *none* of the product videos feature the crappy spindle they are selling it with :D
01:13 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> How is this one, which my librray has https://carbide3d.com/nomad/
01:14 PM jpa-: well, it is better build quality but quite limited by the size
01:14 PM jpa-: it also feels weird that so many of those small machines have a spindle that only goes to 10 krpm, when they can't really handle big endmills and for small ones you'd want 20+ krpm
01:16 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> https://www.makera.com/products/carvera-air this is one i'd put in the same class as the Nomad
01:16 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> and about $700 cheaper
01:17 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Hi, ccatlett1984. thanks for your help yesterday! i came back to learn more
01:21 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Smaller endmills have to run faster because their radius (and edge velocity) is smaller?
01:21 PM jpa-: yeah
01:24 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Hi, is it possible to focus a laser cutter inside a piece of acrylic?
01:30 PM roycroft: yes, but not with a blue diode laser
01:32 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> CO2?
01:32 PM roycroft: co2 can do it with many types of acrylic
01:32 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> What happens? Does it create a cavity?
01:32 PM roycroft: teh youtube has heaps of videos on the topic
01:33 PM roycroft: it can't really create a cavity because there is nowhere for the acrylic to go
01:33 PM roycroft: it can create craks
01:33 PM roycroft: cracks
01:33 PM roycroft: some folks do 3d sculptures doing that
01:34 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> bubblegrams
01:38 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on@> Acrylic is not transparent to CO2 laser wavelengths (10600nm) so you can't focus inside a sheet. I step down the laser focal point to get better edge definition when multipass cutting but otherwise there is not much you can do.
01:38 PM roycroft: maybe it's uv lasers that do it
01:38 PM * roycroft has had no need for that and hasn't paid close enough attention
01:39 PM roycroft: i do have a need to cut clear acrylic, but not right now
01:39 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on@> I know people use fiber lasers in glass to do "hologram" type 3d structures.
01:40 PM roycroft: the fiber lasers are uv, right?
01:41 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on@> ~1000nm IIRC
01:42 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Hi, you folks ever smooth surfaces after machining (or lasering)?
01:42 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> smoothe?
01:43 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> polish
01:43 PM bjorkintosh: Finnish?
01:43 PM roycroft: post processing is common with both additive and subtractive machining methods
01:46 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Thanks! What's an example for an additive method, please? Or subtractive?
01:47 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> Ideally for acrylic
01:49 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> i guess paint is additive
01:50 PM bjorkintosh: lechner, are you new to machining?
01:51 PM roycroft: i was referring to the machining process, not the post-processing
01:52 PM roycroft: milling/turning/etching/cutting are subtractive processes
01:52 PM roycroft: squirting is an additive process
01:52 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> with subsequently finer bits?
01:54 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> and squirting means to add filament, right?
01:54 PM roycroft: welding/brazing can also be additive
01:54 PM roycroft: but most folks don't think of those methods as such, in most cases
01:55 PM roycroft: and yes, squirting means adding filiment
01:55 PM roycroft: filament, dammit
01:55 PM lcnc-relay: <lechner> okay, those bits are pricey https://www.multicamtooling.com/tooling/cnc-router-bits/diamond-polishing-tools/
01:55 PM roycroft: you have an unfinished part
01:55 PM roycroft: if you are removing material from the part, you are using a subtractive method
01:56 PM roycroft: if you are adding material to the part, you are using an additive method
01:57 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> I know some use YAG lasers for "sub surface" engraving (the 3d stuff inside crytals)
01:57 PM roycroft: note that your unfinished part can begin with zero mass
01:57 PM roycroft: yes! yag lasers are a method i've seen!
01:58 PM roycroft: i'm not sure if they work with acrylic though
01:59 PM roycroft: i just got a big box of not fun work - 200' of pex tubing and a bunch of pex connectors
02:00 PM roycroft: i'm not looking forward to that work, but having the big utility sink installed in my house will enable me to do so much stuff that's been difficult or impossible so far
02:01 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on@> Should be fine. Acrylic is transparent out to about 1100nm and YAG is 1064nm. The only problem is the transmission is only 90% so you might have a larger spot size than in glass.
02:02 PM roycroft: so you can make lego sculptures in your acrylic
02:02 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> @lechner before we can really offer any more useful suggestions, we really need a better description of the end thing you are attempting to make
02:03 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> you keep mentioning acrylic, but not enough else
02:03 PM roycroft: because that is the question that was asked
02:03 PM roycroft: aah, that was to lechner
02:04 PM roycroft: i have been giving generalized answers because it was a general question
02:05 PM roycroft: i was also assuming transparent acrylic, because it would not make much sense to me to want to focus a laser in the middle of opaque acrylic
02:05 PM roycroft: perhaps a bad assumption on my part
02:06 PM roycroft: i'll get back to wrestling with a phone switch now, and leave the laser questions to them more qualified than myself to answer
02:06 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> an example of something similiar would be a great help
02:09 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> this
02:09 PM lcnc-relay: https://3dcrystal.com/media/catalog/product/cache/e479de60b9b6205c3fe3184d4a80bda2/0/1/01_9_3.webp
02:09 PM lcnc-relay: vs
02:09 PM lcnc-relay: https://artsigns.com/images/office-signs/3d_office_corporate_sign.jpg
02:09 PM lcnc-relay: ... long message truncated: https://jauriarts.org/_heisenbridge/media/jauriarts.org/rjFXXgoriSppQveCjdoygusu/kRybsmEfBKk (6 lines)
02:14 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on@> The first one is very different than the second two. The second two can be done with a CO2 laser or diode laser. The first one needs a more specialized fiber laser ($$$).
02:15 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> exactly, we need a better idea of the indented use, before we can offer more that general capabilities
02:15 PM lcnc-relay: <ccatlett1984@> ^than
03:36 PM JT-Shop: yippee the weekend is here
03:45 PM memleak: xxcoder, since you love sriracha, i came across something new at the grocery store. a brand new flavor of doritos; golden sriracha.
03:45 PM memleak: addictive asf
03:45 PM xxcoder: lol ok. ill try if I see em
03:57 PM xxcoder: oh the promised snow is starting to come down
04:21 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> when you change the backlash by using the ini.0.backlash pin with M68 E0, does it rewrite the ini or changes the backlash temporarely as long as qtdragon is open because it does change it but the ini seems to remain the same
04:21 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> temp
04:21 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> +it
04:21 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> temporarely
04:22 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> the ini is only read at the boot of linuxcnc
04:22 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> do i have to use queue buster before changing the backlash
04:22 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> or just M68 and continue
04:22 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> oh - I don't know - you might have to experiment..
04:23 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> I don't know if the backlash would change during a running program..
04:23 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> good question
04:23 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> why would you want to change the backlash during a running program?
04:25 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> well it seems like the backlash on Y can change by 2x if the X table is pushed to the side so a varying backlash compensation can help
04:26 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> Yah. Off the top of my head - I don't know. You would have to experiment...
04:26 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> Might be better to look at kins...
04:26 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> i saw a thread on the forum of someone doing it in a running program so it should work
04:26 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> Cool
04:26 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> can i somehow monitor the pin
04:27 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> like in the terminal
04:27 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> to check its value
04:27 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> Halmeter
04:27 PM lcnc-relay: <huursabg@> thx
04:29 PM C3-Shop: show hal too
04:29 PM C3-Shop: Axis GUI?
04:29 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> Lol.. after a while you will see linuxcnc as a solution to a ton of problems:)
04:53 PM rifraf: 5 axis and dual spindle rewired and still works https://imgur.com/a/qEPjRVA
04:55 PM JT-Woodshop is now known as C3-Shop
05:30 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
05:30 PM JT-Shop: yea the steering gearbox is clean...
05:30 PM xxcoder: no more forbidden nutella eh
05:30 PM JT-Shop: the 43 year old grease smell reminds me of my childhood vacations at my grandparents farm in the shop
05:30 PM JT-Shop: the shop smelled exactly like the grease in the gearbox
05:35 PM roycroft: most importantly, it's the fifth and final canidate for the new conductor position tonight
05:36 PM roycroft: they've been auditioning the finalists all season
05:36 PM roycroft: our current maestro is leaving us, which does not surprise me
05:36 PM roycroft: he's going to be conducting a major symphony soon - he's really really good
05:36 PM roycroft: too good for a smallish town
05:37 PM bjorkintosh: I love Brahms.
05:37 PM roycroft: i don't know where he'll go, but it will be a big move up, i'm sure - somewhere like cleveland or philly or boston
05:37 PM bjorkintosh: Hungarian Dances
05:37 PM roycroft: i like brahms too
05:38 PM roycroft: and yeah, the hungarian sailor dances are nice, as are his lullabies, but i really like his symphonies
05:38 PM bjorkintosh: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP-JegU49tk
05:38 PM roycroft: oh, the big box of work that i got today looks to be the right size for 4 cisco switches in bubble wrap
05:38 PM roycroft: so if we come to an agreement on equipment, i think i have the shipping box now
05:38 PM bjorkintosh: ah fantastic.
05:39 PM roycroft: i also carved out access to the pile of switches, but i've not pulled any out yet
05:39 PM bjorkintosh: no rush.
05:46 PM bjorkintosh: I'd heard the first movement of that piece many many years ago, and heard it in Tskaikovsky's music as well. never made the connection to the Tsar until I heard it being sung: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECPYGmyrOnQ
05:46 PM bjorkintosh: then it all made sense.
05:47 PM memleak: i love driving on snow and ice, driving a crown vic in the middle of a blizzard, back-end out the entire time, so much fun
05:47 PM roycroft: i'm fine driving in snow
05:47 PM roycroft: ice, not so much
05:47 PM roycroft: but i'm always more concerned about other drivers
05:48 PM roycroft: i know i can control my vehicle and not hand control over to the snow and ice, but others around here don't seem to do so well
05:48 PM roycroft: ack, mischan
05:48 PM JT-Shop: I was born in Alaska and learned how to drive there
05:48 PM bjorkintosh: hah!
05:48 PM bjorkintosh: so what's the secret JT-Shop? Stay home when the roads are bad?
05:48 PM JT-Shop: other people are the biggest risk
05:49 PM JT-Shop: nope just drive within your limits for the tires you have
05:49 PM memleak: i once was on a bridge and it was a red light, foot all the way down on the brake, if the car in front of me didn't start moving when it did, i would have slid into him at less than a mile an hour
05:49 PM JT-Shop: I used to drive my Honda 50 Super Sport all year up there
05:50 PM JT-Shop: with home made studded knobby tires in the winter
05:50 PM JT-Shop: ice can be interesting to drive on
05:50 PM memleak: studded tires are illegal in ilinois
05:51 PM memleak: where you at JT-Shop ?
05:51 PM JT-Shop: swamp east Missouri now
05:51 PM memleak: ah
05:52 PM bjorkintosh: it still snows in Mo
05:54 PM JT-Shop: yup
05:56 PM roycroft: studded tires should be illegal everywhere
05:56 PM JT-Shop: I've seen a foot of snow before but not in a long time
05:56 PM roycroft: it surprises me that people even use them
05:56 PM JT-Shop: I'm surprised you can get them
05:56 PM roycroft: it would annoy me seriously to drive around all winter on them
05:56 PM JT-Shop: but if you live in a rural area they might make sense
05:57 PM roycroft: chains make more sense
05:57 PM roycroft: they're easier to put on and remove than studded tires
05:57 PM xxcoder: it took a bit but snow is now staying
05:57 PM roycroft: if i lived in central oregon or higher up in the mountains i'd get auto chains - they are available for my pickup
05:58 PM roycroft: it would cost me $4k to get them, but it would be worth it, i think
05:58 PM xxcoder: https://youtu.be/aEMT7D7O-ts this?
05:59 PM roycroft: yes
05:59 PM roycroft: all the school buses around here have them
05:59 PM roycroft: which is kind of funny, because schools here shut down whenever the word "snow" is whispered
06:00 PM xxcoder: reminds me of that texan joke
06:00 PM xxcoder: "snowflake have landed and melted instantly on hot sidewalk! schools is closed fora day, good luck everyone!"
06:00 PM roycroft: onspot are supposed to be the best autochains, btw
06:00 PM roycroft: so you find the right video
06:00 PM xxcoder: it was first suggested lol I guess I know why now
06:01 PM roycroft: it doesn't even have to snow here for the schools to close
06:01 PM roycroft: there just has to be a chance of snow in the forecast
06:02 PM roycroft: that $4 is because i would need two sets for my pickup, btw - they go for $2k/set
06:02 PM roycroft: $4k, rather
06:02 PM roycroft: but with the amount of snow we get here, i'm pretty confident that my pickup in 4wd low and the big knobby tires would handle anything we get just fine
06:03 PM roycroft: i think my only snow prep will be to add some ballast to the bed and to install the winch
06:03 PM roycroft: my winch currently is mounted to a hitch bracket, so i can slide it in the back in an instant
06:04 PM roycroft: eventually i want to permanently mount in the front, but i'll need a new front bumper for that
06:05 PM roycroft: that's the best solution, and will certainly give me more opportunity to complain about how long my pickup is, because it would add another 200mm or so to the length of the vehicle
06:05 PM roycroft: making my turning radius about a mile and a half :)
06:13 PM JT-Shop: https://youtu.be/OCdrRSt0ysc?t=445
06:13 PM JT-Shop: sounds classical
06:13 PM xxcoder: roy wouldnt that not alter the wheel base at all, so turn radius not changed
06:18 PM roycroft: except i would need more clearance to turn
06:18 PM roycroft: so i'm not sure what that should be called
06:18 PM roycroft: effective turning radius?
06:18 PM xxcoder: true, more stickout I would say? dunno also
06:19 PM roycroft: i just wish one could buy a pickup these days without a crew cab or extended cab
06:20 PM roycroft: i certainly take advantage of mine, since i have it
06:20 PM roycroft: but i'd prefer a shorter pickup
06:20 PM roycroft: and i'm not willing to get a 6' bed to make it shorter
06:20 PM xxcoder: maybe in future telo will be a thing
06:20 PM * JT-Shop really likes his Honda Ridgeline
06:21 PM roycroft: it used to be a thing
06:21 PM xxcoder: telo? nah its new company still prototyping ev trucks. small ones
06:22 PM xxcoder: but it has full 8' bed when second gate is down
06:22 PM roycroft: but then every suburban father who has no use for a pickup but who breeds excessively decided that it was somehow "macho" or "manly" to buy a big pickup and drive it around town hauling nothing but the kids
06:22 PM roycroft: get a fripping mini-van
06:22 PM xxcoder: shinyback trucks
06:23 PM roycroft: i have no problem with people driving big vehicles who need big vehicles
06:23 PM roycroft: i have a big pickup
06:23 PM JT-Shop: I drive my truck when it makes sense to use it otherwise I drive something more sensible
06:23 PM roycroft: i drive it only when i need it to haul stuff
06:23 PM roycroft: otherwise i drive my little car that gets 3x the mileage
06:23 PM roycroft: exactly, jt-shop
06:24 PM xxcoder: indeed jd
06:24 PM xxcoder: *jt
06:24 PM roycroft: my bad typing is rubbing off on xxcoder now
06:24 PM JT-Shop: I knew what you meant
06:24 PM * xxcoder goes off to clean roy off him
06:25 PM JT-Shop: my insight doesn't get triple the mileage but double for sure
06:26 PM JT-Shop: insight 50+ C8 30 ridgeline 24 C3 something around 20 I think
06:26 PM JT-Shop: oh and the bluewing 45 or so
06:29 PM xxcoder: my ford focus is around 29 mpg
06:29 PM JT-Shop: if my wife is riding with me I get 50 on the bluewing
06:29 PM xxcoder: not too bad, but not best
06:30 PM roycroft: it's not quite triple
06:30 PM JT-Shop: say goodnight Gracie
06:30 PM bjorkintosh: 50? you slow down?
06:30 PM roycroft: but the f350 gets around 15mpg on average, and the veloster 39mpg
06:30 PM bjorkintosh: hahaha
06:30 PM xxcoder: or negative mass
06:31 PM JT-Shop: insight is a hybrid
06:32 PM JT-Shop: well at 85 mph the insight gets about 40mpg
06:32 PM bjorkintosh: that's pretty good.
06:32 PM xxcoder: yep, beats my car
06:57 PM memleak: my maxima gets around 22 i think
06:58 PM memleak: 22 city 28 highway
07:10 PM roycroft: i don't know if i've driven at 85mph since i was in montana in the '90s, when that was the night time speed limit (there was no speed limit during the day)
07:10 PM * roycroft realizes how long it's been since he has traveled through montana, and thinks he needs to plan a trip there soon
07:11 PM roycroft: it's a really beautiful state
07:11 PM roycroft: and really really big - it's an entire timezone long
07:18 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> My ex's dad lived a lot of the time in Montana.. we visited him a few times
07:19 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> (great white hunter)
07:49 PM memleak: i once went 155..
07:50 PM memleak: it was years ago so the STATUE of limitations at this point applies
07:50 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420@> km/h?
07:50 PM memleak: a monument of limitations
07:50 PM memleak: mph
07:50 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420@> o thats pretty fast
07:52 PM memleak: yeah it was fun
07:52 PM memleak: dumb thing is, is that i did that right where cops like to run radar
07:54 PM memleak: big_kevin420 what country are you in?
08:18 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841@> I think he is in the US - although he could be canadian... (we met in wisconsin at tormach)
08:38 PM xxcoder: man. snow is very strong and dry
08:39 PM xxcoder: I kept getting "taller" as I walked
11:21 PM bjorkintosh: tormach has meetups?
11:25 PM NetPipe: https://netpipe.ca/?p=7810 trying to figure out how to grow bigger tomato's
11:28 PM lcnc-relay: <ntulinux2467@> miraclegrow
11:28 PM lcnc-relay: <ntulinux2467@> * miraclegro
11:30 PM lcnc-relay: <ntulinux2467@> and if pee isn't working out for you, make sure it's lance armstrong's