#linuxcnc Logs

Jul 28 2024

01:23 AM Deejay: moin
04:22 AM JT-Cave: morning
04:22 AM BorgPipe: moin moin
05:51 AM Tom_L: morning
06:54 AM rdtsc_away is now known as rdtsc
07:03 AM rdtsc: M
08:07 AM JT-Cave: Tom_L, https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/flexgui/plotter.html
08:07 AM JT-Cave: take note of the note...
09:12 AM Tom_L: JT-Cave, http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:443/~webpage/cnc/JT-SHOP/flexgui/Rpi_Plotter1.png
09:12 AM Tom_L: not sure what P and X are in the note
09:14 AM Tom_L: show_limits_cb should default to checked since it's on when you start up
09:17 AM JT-Shop: yup not done anything with startup states
09:18 AM Tom_L: P & X load up in a given position?
09:18 AM Tom_L: in the note..
09:20 AM JT-Shop: yup but they don't work yet, if you look at the touch example you can see all the controls
09:20 AM Tom_L: i think i got most on your list on the RPI one but i'm looking
09:24 AM Tom_L: how did you turn of the light blue origin on the touch example?
09:25 AM Tom_L: it's on by default... http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:443/~webpage/cnc/JT-SHOP/flexgui/rpi_origin.png
09:28 AM JT-Shop: no clue
09:28 AM Tom_L: i thought it might be a checkbox that wasn't on the webpage yet
09:29 AM JT-Shop: nope, dunno if you can turn that on or off or what's it's called lol
09:29 AM Tom_L: it's off on the touch example and on on mine
09:30 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> that is cool!
09:31 AM Tom_L: JT-Shop, what is show_live_plot?
09:31 AM Tom_L: in flexplot.py
09:33 AM JT-Shop: I don't think that works but I think that turns on and off the plot when the tool is moving...
09:33 AM JT-Shop: but I may be wrong
09:33 AM Tom_L: k
09:33 AM Tom_L: you know you're the goto expert on this now right?
09:33 AM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> lol
09:34 AM JT-Shop: guesspert maybe
09:36 AM Tom_L: i like your buttons better, i may try to make the RPI plot a tiny bit smaller and try arranging those like that
09:37 AM * JT-Cave heads to Ozora Mo
09:37 AM Tom_L: have fun
09:37 AM Tom_L: goin for lunch?
09:38 AM JT-Cave: a benefit car show then lunch at the midway
09:38 AM Tom_L: looks like another slick spot in the road...
09:41 AM JT-Cave: went to the annual Glennoville Mo picnic yesterday town has like 4 streets but they must have had 500 people there
09:42 AM mrec: pcw-home: I wonder do you maintain a second version of linuxcnc/hostmot which supports some more features?
09:42 AM mrec: #define HM2_GTAG_LIOPORT (64) // Not supported
09:42 AM Tom_L: sounds like Sturgis... only a bit smaller
09:43 AM mrec: that's in the official linuxcnc code, while LIOPortTag is defined and set in the VHDL description
09:44 AM JT-Cave: they cooked 600 pounds of chicken yesterday
09:44 AM Tom_L: heh
09:45 AM JT-Cave: the dessert table was 30' long
09:45 AM Tom_L: hard to sample it all
09:46 AM bjorkintosh: geeze.
09:47 AM pcw-home: No it's just that lioport pins are not used by the driver at all (I guess it could if only just to list them)
09:47 AM Tom_L: i'll push a deb once i update my examples
09:48 AM mrec: pcw-home: ah makes sense thanks
09:48 AM pcw-home: (that is there is no setup needed for LIO pins so nothing the driver need do with them)
09:50 AM mrec: LIO is a synonym for local IO? (I'm just curious about the synonym).. PWM uses it so the driver actually doesn't have to mess around with the pin itself
09:50 AM pcw-home: That is for example the 7I97/7I97T use the charge-pump drive module with LIO pins, the driver sets up the module (exports hal pins etc)
09:51 AM pcw-home: but there is nothing else to do (unlike GPIO pins that have direction/invert/open-drain attributes)
09:52 AM mrec: I think I got it so far thank you.
09:52 AM pcw-home: Yes LIO = local I/O because they are mainly used for on-card IO as opposed to expansion ports
09:55 AM mrec: thank you for the clarification
09:55 AM pcw-home: On the 7I96S I mainly used LIO on the PWM because I wanted the same GPIO arrangement (ports and pins) as the 7I96
09:57 AM mrec: I think I will need them later for the tool changer
09:59 AM mrec: https://streamable.com/swj1d6
09:59 AM mrec: I'm sure with Linuxcnc I can speed that up
10:04 AM JT-Cave: mrec, is that a bridgeport?
10:04 AM mrec: Mitsubishi / Manford
10:04 AM mrec: I figured out so many *ford machines are from Taiwan
10:05 AM JT-Cave: that's the same tool changer as my bp 308 but mine spins a bit faster
10:05 AM mrec: it's a PLC thing
10:05 AM mrec: the pulse frequency is set in it, I don't want to mess with it, I just want to remove it
10:05 AM JT-Cave: https://gnipsel.com/shop/unload-308/unload-308.xhtml
10:06 AM mrec: the integrator added some copy protections in the PLC/ladder they made it impossible for the people to just copy the PLC to another machine back then
10:06 AM mrec: but nowadays Mitsubishi released several tools the whole thing is EOL
10:07 AM mrec: by checking the ladder I was able to figure out which bits had to be set and the entire machine started to work again (also after replacing some defect electronic parts, one amplifier, one encoder)
10:08 AM mrec: so evil, at the point where I had jogging work cycle start (=run program) just end up with an emergency error
10:09 AM mrec: flipping a latch bit on the internal cassette fixed that problem.. also the ladder is a bit obfuscated
10:10 AM JT-Cave: I've ran into that a few times and would think wtf was that programmer smoking when he/she wrote that
10:10 AM mrec: heh I thought the same and cursed Mitsubishi until I understood
10:11 AM mrec: I respect Mitsubishi for what they have done, it's really solid and even now disclosing the service manuals at least helps a lot
10:11 AM mrec: detailed information are terms of reverse engineering of course.
10:17 AM * JT-Shop heads out
10:22 AM mrec: the hostmot vhdl description is nice, I'm still learning some tricks from it
10:23 AM mrec: I never heard about alias or 'REVERSE_RANGE before
10:49 AM rdtsc is now known as rdtsc_away
11:14 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> mrec: I tend to rip out any old controls/PLC and just do it modern and right or you end up fighting things like this
11:14 AM mrec: that's my plan, but I'd like to recycle the 2KW motors
11:14 AM mrec: first of all I ensured that everything's workable now I just need to work on the motors and wire up the rest accordingly.
11:16 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> yeah sometimes the motors and drives are worth saving
11:17 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> i find many ladder diagrams to be "obfuscated"
11:19 AM mrec: I didn't have any documentation about that CNC
11:19 AM mrec: luckily I was able to pull the ladder from the machine and decode it
11:20 AM mrec: the original owner surprised me a lot for not knowing anything about that machine he just left it rotting in the corner
11:21 AM rdtsc_away is now known as rdtsc
11:21 AM mrec: he just said that machine works it works... first time powering it on no screen there, after checking the cabinet the main controller was missing
11:22 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> it ran away
11:22 AM mrec: oh I forgot the distributor has it on the shelf because there was an issue 3 years ago.
11:23 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> I can often retrofit a machine with LCNC faster than trying to save the old controls
11:23 AM mrec: it has mitsubishi stuff inside
11:24 AM mrec: the controller is sending commands to the amplifier, I'd have to rip out the amplifier too. to retrofit it quickly with linuxcnc
11:24 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/1324/DSC_9713.JPG
11:24 AM mrec: it will take some time to implement the mitsubishi amplifier protocol, as long as I can get it work until september I'm fine
11:25 AM mrec: I have no documentation at all about the machine.. the decoded PLC is my documentation
11:25 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> ^^ 286 PC with floppies and a ~8inch CRT
11:25 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> the arm that held the display and keyboard is worth saving
11:26 AM mrec: I'm just used to use Axis
11:26 AM rdtsc: Looking to build such an articulating arm for a small machine, and "tricky" isn't the best descriptor.
11:27 AM mrec: so table + display + PC beneath.
11:28 AM mrec: https://streamable.com/w6t2bv
11:28 AM mrec: everything's dirty there
11:35 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> are you sure it's not just dirty grease slowing down the tool changer? 🙂
11:35 AM rdtsc: cd Download
11:35 AM rdtsc: oops lol
11:36 AM mrec: haha no the tool changer is as it is, the machine is dated somewhat 2000, the PLC is sending some PWM and it just stops when it activates some sensor
11:37 AM mrec: I'd rather add an absolute encoder there and let it rotate without pausing at every pocket
11:38 AM mrec: there are many ways to do this better
11:44 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> there were better ways to do it 25 years ago as well
11:44 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> that changer is slow
11:44 AM lcnc-relay: <captainhindsight_.> maybe they were trying to get around patents
11:46 AM Tom_L: JT-Cave, http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:443/~webpage/cnc/JT-SHOP/flexgui/rpi_plotter1.png
11:49 AM rdtsc: Lookin' good Tom!
11:57 AM rdtsc: P.S. Andypugh needs to update https://forum.linuxcnc.org/29-forum-announcements please and thank you.
12:06 PM rdtsc: Interesting, in Rpi4 / Bookworm LCNC iso, positive that LCNC was updated to 2.9.3, but LCNC has no "--version" command, and it is totally not listed for a "apt search linuxcnc"
12:13 PM Tom_L: did you try apt search linuxcnc*
12:14 PM Tom_L: i get better results without the '*'
12:14 PM rdtsc: Yeah get nothing with the asterisk... picky :)
12:14 PM Tom_L: try linuxcnc-uspace
12:15 PM rdtsc: cnc@linuxcnc:~$ apt search linuxcnc-uspace
12:15 PM rdtsc: Sorting... Done
12:15 PM rdtsc: Full Text Search... Done
12:15 PM rdtsc: linuxcnc-uspace/stable 2.9.0~pre1+git20230208.f1270d6ed7-1 armhf
12:15 PM rdtsc: motion controller for CNC machines and robots
12:15 PM rdtsc: linuxcnc-uspace-dbgsym/linuxcnc 1:2.9.3 amd64
12:15 PM rdtsc: debug symbols for linuxcnc-uspace
12:15 PM rdtsc: linuxcnc-uspace-dev/stable 2.9.0~pre1+git20230208.f1270d6ed7-1 armhf
12:15 PM rdtsc: PC based motion controller for real-time Linux
12:15 PM rdtsc: cnc@linuxcnc:~$
12:19 PM rdtsc: interesting, the 2.9.3 debug symbols is for amd64 only
12:26 PM rdtsc: "apt search 2.9.3" nor 2.9.2 is returning anything useful, and refuses "*2.9.3" as a regex compilation error. Hmm.
12:28 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
12:40 PM Tom_L: JT-Shop, PR #50 up
12:55 PM rdtsc: wonder if it could be that https://www.linuxcnc.org/dists/bookworm/2.9-uspace/binary-arm64/ shows files, while https://www.linuxcnc.org/dists/bookworm/2.9-uspace/binary-armhf/ does not?
01:43 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> wow - the coupling for the b axis on the k&t (72 index postions - 5 deg) is more than just a simple radial spline..
01:44 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> https://jauriarts.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/GVHZCBeZSCRcHYFcmzgapKXC/PXL_20240728_154753817.jpg
01:44 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> https://jauriarts.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/PSxyAedrPptGHJExTkpaTPQN/PXL_20240728_151349313.jpg
01:44 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> https://jauriarts.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/eAxNfpuyphwIaiCGglKINwDk/PXL_20240728_151420259.jpg
01:45 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> one has concave splines and the other is convex
01:46 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> the manual (from the 60's) says the table repeatabillity is +/-10 arc-seconds
01:52 PM rdtsc: cheese and rice
02:01 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> hey guys I have a somewhat odd question to ask: is it possible to define a mill in pncconf WITHOUT a Y axis? I am modifying my sherline lathe to have a live spindle tool on the cross slide for milling. However, it will be awhile before I create a true cross slide Y axis, but in the mean time, I should still be able to mill things out, they would just be circular or tending to the centerline of the stock.
02:01 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> I went into pncconf, and set it up as a mill, but it forces me to define a Y axis
02:02 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> whereas instead I just need A axis, Z axis, and X axis
02:02 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> https://jauriarts.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/wbckhMyJkNvLxxQrgxHFUnmu/jf0H3wQCmAYvAHtAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC.png
02:02 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> thus allowing me to do something such as this (milling holes off center):
02:02 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> The A axis is a positional stepper with harmonic drive that drives the spindle when lathe mode is off
02:14 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on> You can always define the Y axis and just not use it. You will need to program the gcode to use A/X anyway.
03:37 PM Tom_L: skunkworks, those cut that way for better accuracy?
03:56 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> I would assume so?
03:56 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> It suprised me...
03:57 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> when I saw the one - convex - I just assumed the other was convex so it only clamped on 1 point.. But there was no wear line - so I looked at the other half and it was concave..
03:59 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> https://jauriarts.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/YCrlNzffVkacJnkXNlltqRtE/PXL_20240728_205149875.MP.jpg
03:59 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> the k&t's we got were the 'precision' version
04:00 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> Probably why I like using it.. it just works.
04:01 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> the 'precision' added about 3ft to the top of the controller.. lol
04:01 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> 4 card racks? I don't remember
04:18 PM Tom_L: heh
04:21 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
04:31 PM Tom_L: JT-Cave, i figured out DRO
04:31 PM Tom_L: set self.enable.dro = True and it's just like the one in axis
04:34 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:443/~webpage/cnc/JT-SHOP/flexgui/rpi_plot_dro.png
04:34 PM Tom_L: it's a bit big for a rpi stock screen.. even after changing the default font size
04:36 PM Tom_L: also, it changes to inch with the checkbox
04:37 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:443/~webpage/cnc/JT-SHOP/flexgui/rpi_plot_dro2.png
04:37 PM Tom_L: so it doesn't rely on widgets to display in the graphic
04:38 PM Tom_L: i went down 4 points on the font for that
04:40 PM Tom_L: LN 248 enables it or a checkbox to change that
04:44 PM Tom_L: looks to me like 547 sets the view
04:44 PM Tom_L: mmm, my line numbers may be off since i copied the 2 font lines
04:48 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> but what does that mean to “not use it” like set it’s range to 0? Or remove any Y axis stuff out of hal or ini?
04:49 PM Tom_L: just don't hook hardware up
04:49 PM Tom_L: set homing so it ignores it
04:49 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> but won’t the machine try to use the Y axis as part of its determination of how axis need to move to get to a spot you define?
04:50 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> like let’s say in fusion360 I set a bunch of holes arranged in a circle on the face of the stock
04:50 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on> No, because that is done in CAM.
04:50 PM Tom_L: X will only move in X
04:50 PM Tom_L: Y will only move in Y
04:50 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> what would prevent the machine from saying let’s use y axis to get to the top hold
04:50 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> instead of using A axis to rotate it
04:50 PM Tom_L: what zinc said
04:51 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on> You need to define your CAM post so that it outputs X, A, and Z and not Y.
04:51 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> ohhhhh ok ok so i set those kinematics in my fusion post? i recall doing this for a 5 axis
04:51 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> like axis arrangements
04:51 PM lcnc-relay: <ffffrf> i think i get what you mean now
04:51 PM lcnc-relay: <zincboy_ca_on> I have done this in the past. Basically you convert from rectangular coordinates to polar and feed that to your X and A.
04:54 PM Tom_L: JT-Cave, consider adding the 'checkbox' items to the menu also.... take a peek at axis 'view'
04:54 PM Tom_L: 'V' toggles between them all there
05:14 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> lookin good so far
05:14 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> @Tom_L lookin good so far
05:15 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> keep in mind the task bar though, otherwise you always have to run it fullscreen
05:15 PM Tom_L: running out of room on that littel rpi screen
05:15 PM Tom_L: this is a set size for the 'rpi' touch screen
05:15 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> i always had to make it 20px less on the y
05:16 PM Tom_L: task bar at the bottom?
05:17 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> or top, where ever your wondowing has it set
05:17 PM Tom_L: that's what the red is
05:17 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:443/~webpage/cnc/JT-SHOP/flexgui/Screens/Dark/Status.png
05:17 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> its a place holder for the windowing system?
05:18 PM Tom_L: few weeks ago i didn't know what designer was... baby steps
05:18 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> https://raw.githubusercontent.com/cakeslob/regularmac_800/main/images/2022-10-19-204354_1024x768_scrot.png
05:19 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> i mean the thing that the clock and stuff
05:19 PM Tom_L: ahh
05:20 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> but also theres my screen layout for rpi
05:20 PM Tom_L: is it touch?
05:21 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> i mean i set it up that i can make the buttons/text and sliders bigger to use as touch
05:21 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> thats why the tabs are bigger yeah
05:24 PM lcnc-relay: <big_kevin420> i might axe the task section and try and put it up top with the menus if possible by the looks of it
05:40 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
05:40 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
06:19 PM * JT-Shop had a nice day
06:22 PM lcnc-relay: <roguish> JT-Shop: ya need that occasionally
06:22 PM JT-Shop: yup
06:23 PM JT-Shop: had a good ride and spent some time with friends at a tiny car show in the middle of nowhere
06:23 PM lcnc-relay: <roguish> very good.
06:40 PM * roycroft just got back from eugene with a truck full of air compresssor and dust extractor
06:41 PM roycroft: i'm not feeling inspired to unload the stuff right now
06:41 PM roycroft: but i probably should
06:41 PM lcnc-relay: <roguish> go inside and have a beer
06:41 PM roycroft: i am inside at the moment
06:42 PM roycroft: and i'll certainly have a refreshing beverage before considering unloading
06:42 PM roycroft: that will either inspire me to do the job, or conform that i don't feel like doing it right now
06:42 PM roycroft: confirm
06:47 PM rdtsc is now known as rdtsc_away
07:15 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> Hmm - beverage...
07:15 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> I just took the 21ft 1.5 inch water pipe up to the top of the hill.. Getting pretty close to having everything ready for the tower.
07:15 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> SO - I have to figure out how janky I am going to lift it.
07:16 PM JT-Shop: carefully...
07:16 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> I found the 80ft cable dad had for pulling trees out - so that is a start. I also found a couple tubs of atleast 1 inch rope..
07:17 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> Just have to figure out what I am going to use for the gin pole..
07:17 PM JT-Shop: an A shape is really stable
07:17 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> I have that already - just don't know if I can do that..
07:18 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> it is really heavy - and bolts into the existing tower pin points..
07:19 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> https://jauriarts.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/vleukZsrOngIhuPaZZdRFvXz/PXL_20240610_005205347.jpg
07:19 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> that is 3ish inch water pipe
07:20 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> wish there was photos of how dad did it..
07:20 PM JT-Shop: that looks heavy
07:20 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> it is.. It takes all of me to flip it over
07:21 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> the tower is already connected with 2 pivit points - I bet i could pick it up with a single gin pole
07:21 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> (7ish ft apart)
07:22 PM JT-Shop: a single pole would need guy wires on the sides
07:23 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> https://jauriarts.org/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/ZsrJztRIPYYqFuTlvFMCpbTT/PXL_20240610_005151353.jpg
07:23 PM JT-Shop: on my sailboat the guy ropes were fastened to the rails at the pivot point of the mast so they stayed tight
07:23 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> That would be easy too - here
07:24 PM JT-Shop: no loading here might be my connection
07:24 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> or I tip the tower up as high as I can with 1 tractor (over center) and pull it up with the other..
07:27 PM * JT-Shop is worn out and calls it a day
07:42 PM xxcoder: id add another wire on other side, which is little bit longer than tower standing length, so if it screws up it wont just fall foward into you
07:42 PM xxcoder: well way I picture it anyway
08:14 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> lol - I think there would have to be a very bad failure for the tower to fall on me.. - I am going to be pulling from a distance that is further away than the tower is tall
08:15 PM xxcoder: I suppose, though it also serves as anti-damaging if it falls over, even if its impossible for it to fall over t0o you
08:16 PM xxcoder: honestly im sure youre fine. im just thinking too much as usual
08:16 PM lcnc-relay: <skunkworks8841> sure - I think I am going to have one tractor tethered so that the tower won't fall once it is over center.
08:17 PM xxcoder: cool :)