#linuxcnc Logs

Jan 23 2024

01:32 AM Deejay: moin
01:49 AM duatepe: Hello everyone,
01:49 AM duatepe: I am building an CNC 5 axis and I load the my .ini and .hal file with an example .ngc file. I started the machine and stop it after that I tried to move axis A to previous position but axises moved different I mean it couldn't reach the right position , one axis move faster and passed the position. I think it is about the some motor parameters I
01:49 AM duatepe: dont know. If it is about parameters , how can I enter these parameters. For example;
01:49 AM duatepe: Motor Harmonic Drive 4th Axis
01:49 AM duatepe: Table Diameter: 150 mm
01:49 AM duatepe: Center Height: 100mm
01:49 AM duatepe: Center Bore: 30mm
01:49 AM duatepe: Blacklash: 0
01:49 AM duatepe: Absolute Tolerance: +-30
01:49 AM duatepe: Max Torque Output: 50 NM
01:49 AM duatepe: I have seen these parameter on motor.
01:49 AM duatepe: My configuration file and .hal attached.
01:51 AM jpa-: is it moving in correct direction?
01:51 AM jpa-: could also be just wrong PID tuning
01:51 AM duatepe: direction is ok
01:52 AM duatepe: but i didnt set these parameter
01:52 AM duatepe: [10:48:56] <duatepe> Center Height: 100mm
01:52 AM duatepe: [10:48:56] <duatepe> Table Diameter: 150 mm
01:52 AM duatepe: [10:48:56] <duatepe> Motor Harmonic Drive 4th Axis
01:52 AM duatepe: [10:48:56] <duatepe> Max Torque Output: 50 NM
01:52 AM duatepe: [10:48:56] <duatepe> Absolute Tolerance: +-30
01:52 AM duatepe: [10:48:56] <duatepe> Blacklash: 0
01:52 AM duatepe: [10:48:56] <duatepe> Center Bore: 30mm
01:53 AM duatepe: I wil try to explain it with more detail
01:53 AM jpa-: those parameters probably won't matter for the basic axis moving
01:57 AM duatepe: First I upload the example file in simulation called impeller-7bl-xyzac.nc
01:57 AM duatepe: I started the machine and move and started to handle the workpiece(actually is not there just for observation)
01:57 AM duatepe: But axis maybe rotate too much I dont know what ever I stop the machine and I moved the axis A to starting position but problem started
01:57 AM duatepe: rotation and axis Y didnt move good. didnt match . Y moved too fast as much as remember. It means some parameter didnt macth with the machine kinematic situation
01:58 AM duatepe: This is my idea
01:58 AM jpa-: so does the axis move correctly in jogging?
01:58 AM duatepe: I m not sure what is going on the backround
01:58 AM duatepe: hmm
01:58 AM jpa-: you could also first check with identity kinematics that the joint control works ok
01:58 AM duatepe: I didnt tried it. because in this condition means jogging also not good
01:59 AM duatepe: I used xyzac kinematic equations
01:59 AM duatepe: you mean the cnc use xyzab maybe isnt it?
02:00 AM duatepe: first I need to check the joggin ?
02:03 AM duatepe: I asked this question also on forum and I got the answer like that
02:03 AM duatepe: Sounds like your step_scale is off or you are loosing steps. Have you tried running the gcode at a lower feed rate?
02:03 AM duatepe: And I asked this
02:03 AM duatepe: "You mean it is about step scale or loosing steps. it is not about motor parameters right? Then I will try my works with this information"
02:18 AM jpa-: first make sure that joints move ok when jogged (either in unhomed state or with identity kinematics)
02:18 AM jpa-: after that start figuring out the proper kinematics for your system
02:21 AM duatepe: OKay also includes STEP_SCALE in your words. Right?
02:21 AM jpa-: sure, when you jog X mm or X degrees, make sure that it matches the actual movement
02:22 AM duatepe: Okay thank you then this creates a question , How I will decide STEP_SCALE, just with observation? or using mathematic using several parameters?
02:23 AM jpa-: typically you would just calculate it from the parameters
02:23 AM duatepe: OKay what parameters they are
02:23 AM jpa-: but if that seems too difficult or you don't know the parameters, you can do it experimentally
02:23 AM duatepe: hm
02:23 AM duatepe: what are they parameters roughly?
02:23 AM jpa-: you'd start with the motor, steps per revolution, and then any mechanical gearing / transmission you'd take the ratio
02:24 AM duatepe: hmm okay very spesific info
02:24 AM duatepe: thank you
02:24 AM jpa-: oh, and the microstep count of the stepper motor driver
02:24 AM duatepe: I got it. Thank you for this information. It was very helpful
02:25 AM jpa-: you're welcome
03:46 AM NoSpark: jpa-: I figured out what was going on with those drives yesterday
03:47 AM NoSpark: I had accidently swapped the encoders between 2 drives
03:47 AM jpa-: heh :D
03:48 AM NoSpark: so the wrong encoder was providing feedback
03:48 AM NoSpark: I'm such an idiot
03:48 AM NoSpark: It took me hours of fiddloing with the software before I thought to double check the hardware
03:48 AM NoSpark: I've now labled every cable
03:49 AM NoSpark: reset
03:49 AM NoSpark: *oops
04:12 AM Tom_L: morning
04:48 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
04:58 AM JT-Cave: morning
06:48 AM Tom_L: looks like it's staying just above freezing
07:02 AM andypugh: Tom_L: Yes. You can run the uspace linuxnc package on RTAI (if you have the helper app, which I haven’t figured out how to compile…) but not the RTAI linuxcnc package on the preemt-rt kernel.
07:03 AM Tom_L: thanks
07:03 AM JT-Cave: damn ; in the .qss file was making me nuts
07:03 AM Tom_L: the helper isn't one of the 3 files on the dl page is it?
07:04 AM Tom_L: RTAI MOdules?
07:11 AM Tom_L: andypugh, btw, the new RTAI files look good and have roughly the same latency as my wheezy install. thanks
07:14 AM andypugh: Tom_L: No, it’s “linuxcnc-uspace-rtai” and exists for 2.8 but I have not figured out how to make it for 2.9.
07:14 AM andypugh: https://www.linuxcnc.org/dists/buster/2.8-rtpreempt/binary-amd64/
09:21 AM linext: is there a consumer grade CNC that can make parts like this from aluminum or brass? https://www.ebay.com/itm/265292819380
10:09 AM Gothia1 is now known as Gothia
10:59 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
12:50 PM andypugh: linext: Define “Consumer grade”? https://tormach.com/machines/mills/pcnc-440.html = probably, https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/364608631270 = probably not
12:50 PM linext: i was looking at this: https://shop.carbide3d.com/products/nomad-3/?variant=32912906354749
12:53 PM andypugh: Hmm, A 130W ER11 spindle is not going to be very productive. And it doesn’t run LinuxCNC….
12:56 PM andypugh: I am a bit confused by some of their accessories too. For example https://shop.carbide3d.com/products/low-profile-vise looks like junk, and costs more than https://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Workholding/Machine-Vices/ARC-Versatile-SG-Iron-Milling-Vices
01:07 PM linext: is there a machine that can make these in brass/aluminum: https://www.ebay.com/itm/265292819380?hash=item3dc4af2bb4:g:aD4AAOSw91Vh3tAs
01:10 PM bjorkintosh: yes. a mill.
01:11 PM linext: a cheap machine
01:11 PM linext: automated
01:12 PM bjorkintosh: oh that's easy.
01:12 PM bjorkintosh: Make It In China.
01:12 PM linext: do you think they're using a large CNC in china?
01:13 PM bjorkintosh: they're using every possible machine you can imagine.
01:13 PM bjorkintosh: but for that particular product? who knows.
01:14 PM bjorkintosh: you can certainly do it on a small mill.
01:57 PM roycroft: a $2k mill-drill with a $1500 cnc conversion can make those parts inexpensively and in quantity
01:58 PM roycroft: it would cost more to set up for anodizing safely than for manufacturing the parts
02:17 PM bjorkintosh: sounds like a used bridgeport.
02:41 PM XXCoder: andypugh: thats nice vise. (second link)
02:43 PM andypugh: Certainly looks good for £99
02:43 PM lcnc-relay: <travis_farmer (@_discord_731083529441640538:jauriarts.org)> mom slipped in the driveway ice again... i wish she would wear her Yak-Traks... (she is alright, so far, but my back is dead from picking her up...)
02:44 PM andypugh: I have one of these and it’s been entirely adequate for many years: https://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Workholding/Machine-Vices/Precision-Tool-Vices-Type-2
02:44 PM XXCoder: also nice. I like how its set so moving jaw dont lift on tight
02:45 PM XXCoder: the router is fine for as light engrave and is a toy basically
02:47 PM Rab: linext, that Leatherman tab is a tiny part with tiny features, and a deceptively good surface finish in the pics. If I were tooling up from scratch specifically for that part, I would think about a used Taig CNC mill rather than a full-size mill. https://taigtools.com/product/micro-mill-2019cnc/
02:47 PM XXCoder: I wonder if millenium project mill would do
02:48 PM lcnc-relay: <travis_farmer (@_discord_731083529441640538:jauriarts.org)> hmmm, seems i am invisible, i may as well move on... 😦
02:51 PM bjorkintosh: <lcnc-relay> <travis_farmer (@_discord_731083529441640538:jauriarts.org)>
02:52 PM bjorkintosh: all that, just to refer to you!
02:52 PM bjorkintosh: it's looooong
02:52 PM Tom_L: they're more special with long names
02:53 PM bjorkintosh: i think it's the (@wherever) bit that makes it eye-noying!
02:53 PM bjorkintosh: wait. I'm about to coin a term.
02:53 PM bjorkintosh: Eye-gnawing!!!
02:53 PM Tom_L: i thought turboss had that shortened once
02:53 PM XXCoder: yeah some issue is happening, not sure whats happening
02:54 PM Tom_L: i ignore more than half of them they're so annoying
02:54 PM Tom_L: rather counterproductive
02:58 PM travis_farmer: left the discord server, so i am less annoying...
03:00 PM bjorkintosh: hi travis_farmer!
03:00 PM bjorkintosh: the new word is eye-gnawing. it was just the line noise from the discord thing.
03:01 PM roycroft: i don't like discord - i much prefer harmony, and i've avoided the discord server for that reason alone
03:01 PM Tom_L: i hope we're as annoying to them :)
03:01 PM bjorkintosh: hahaha
03:01 PM travis_farmer: still, i think more oftin than not, i am annoying...
03:02 PM Tom_L: you could do a survey
03:03 PM travis_farmer: at this point in my life, i couldn't handle the answers
03:03 PM Tom_L: so the dealer wanted $400 to change a fan belt on one of my vehicles
03:03 PM Tom_L: i went to the parts store and bought one for $23
03:04 PM bjorkintosh: the dealer didn't want the $400.00
03:04 PM bjorkintosh: the dealer is usually *given* that amount for belt changes!
03:04 PM roycroft: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw-w5S8e6y4
03:04 PM Tom_L: i just wanted to see what they'd say
03:04 PM bjorkintosh: he doesn't quibble.
03:04 PM Tom_L: and he lied to me and said there were 3 belts when i knew full well there was only one
03:05 PM bjorkintosh: where are the other belts?
03:05 PM bjorkintosh: on his waist?
03:05 PM Tom_L: one on the muffler :)
03:05 PM bjorkintosh: hah!
03:05 PM Tom_L: i said if he could find it he could change my muffler belt
03:05 PM XXCoder: other 2 belts is for his 2 cars
03:06 PM XXCoder: muffler belt? he seriously tried to sell that?
03:07 PM Tom_L: no but i can play his game too
03:07 PM XXCoder: lol
03:15 PM JT-Shop: I'm glad my dealers are not like that
03:16 PM Tom_L: time to build?
03:17 PM JT-Shop: I discovered a small bug while creating a config for the bp so wait till I fix that
03:17 PM Tom_L: ok
03:18 PM Tom_L: i was messin with that script a bit last night just to learn a few things
03:18 PM JT-Shop: estop latch is not working :(
03:18 PM Tom_L: check for old deb file and delete if it's there
03:19 PM Tom_L: never messed with scripts til now
03:19 PM roycroft: so i was looking at my steel balls full of jbweld-like stuff today, wondering how to easily make them smooth and round again, and rememberd that my wood lathe is still sitting on the bench
03:20 PM roycroft: i chucked up a 3/8" bolt, spun a ball on, and turned the lathe on at 500rpm - that worked brilliantly
03:20 PM roycroft: and then i put masking paper around the lathe, turned it on at 30rpm, and did a nice even spray paint coat
03:20 PM * roycroft never thought of a wood lathe as a painting jig beore
03:21 PM XXCoder: lol nice. I guess all it needs is something to cover ways etc when painting
03:21 PM XXCoder: wait wood lathe dont really have those right?
03:21 PM Tom_L: kinda
03:22 PM roycroft: yeah, but not like on a metal lathe
03:22 PM roycroft: there's a machined but not precision machined slideway for the tail stock
03:23 PM roycroft: i just taped some masking paper over the bed, and around the head stock
03:29 PM XXCoder: cool
03:35 PM Tom_L: i would have chucked the bold in a hand drill, dipped the ball in a bucket of paint then ran the drill after pulling it from the bucket to remove the excess paint and help it dry fast :)
03:35 PM Tom_L: s/bold/bolt
03:35 PM XXCoder: thats nice way to decocate shop walls too!
03:36 PM XXCoder: just wave the color ball around as its spinning
03:44 PM Tom_L: reminded me of those spinner paint things at the carnival
03:44 PM Tom_L: haven't seen one of those in years
03:52 PM roycroft: the method i'm using is working great
03:52 PM roycroft: the only drawback is that i can only paint one of the balls at a time
03:53 PM roycroft: but the greatest benefit is that i don't have to do anything with the ball after shooting paint - it can just stay mounted to the lathe until the paint dries
04:05 PM roycroft: i should also mention that, while the center of mass is close to the spindle axis, it's impressive to me that my small lathe spins the balls so smoothly without any tail stock support
04:05 PM roycroft: i expected some vibration, but there's virtually none
06:56 PM Unterhaus_ is now known as Unterhausen
06:56 PM solarwind: the lathe is an excellent way to check how non concentric and angled the handles on your screwdrivers are
06:57 PM solarwind: and then turn to desired shape
06:57 PM Unterhausen: luthiers mercantile closed for good
07:04 PM Unterhausen: I think my wera screwdrivers would look pretty funny if I turned down the handles
07:05 PM Unterhausen: Tom_L can you link to your spring making video again?
07:15 PM Tom_L: coil or the V?
07:15 PM Tom_L: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lonf4ypINVM
07:56 PM XXCoder: man. kinda glad I dont work now. more and more boeing fail news. they found even more loose bolts
07:57 PM XXCoder: place I worked at, it was around 70 to 90% of jobs
07:57 PM solarwind: Why, were you the one who left the bolts loose?
07:58 PM XXCoder: impossible. I dont do assembly.
07:58 PM XXCoder: I was cnc machinist
07:58 PM XXCoder: news like this heavily impact number of jobs we get
07:58 PM solarwind: In mother Russia, I too was CNC machinist
07:59 PM solarwind: I'm just being stupid
08:33 PM bjorkintosh: russians didn't care about CNC it turns out.
08:34 PM bjorkintosh: because they didn't care at all about productivity. just production volume.
09:30 PM firephoto__ is now known as firephoto_
09:54 PM bjorkintosh: s/russians/soviets.
09:54 PM bjorkintosh: not the same.
10:21 PM roycroft: i think russians mostly care about survival these days
10:51 PM * roycroft just finished painting the steel balls, so all that's left is a little assembly
10:52 PM XXCoder: nice
10:52 PM roycroft: yeah - this project took too long
10:52 PM roycroft: it will be nice to move on to a new one
10:53 PM roycroft: but it will be nicer having a book/veneer press
11:03 PM Centurion_Dan1 is now known as Centurion_Dan