#linuxcnc Logs

Sep 02 2023

01:08 AM mrec: does anyone have some knowledge about variable air pressure?
01:19 AM mrec: I wonder if there's some kind of reasonable module available
01:19 AM XXCoder: regulators to set psi to whatever you want?
01:19 AM mrec: yes
01:19 AM mrec: eg I'd like to optimize the air pressure for small 0402 modules they almost need no pressure
01:19 AM mrec: modules/components
02:04 AM Deejay: moin
02:22 AM travis_farmer: Morning :-)
02:49 AM Deejay: good morning travis
02:51 AM travis_farmer: :-)
03:16 AM XXCoder: bleh myfordboy made puesdoscience thing in newest video
03:16 AM XXCoder: dowsing lol
04:46 AM Tom_L: morning
04:50 AM JT-Cave: morning
06:28 AM JT-Cave: rooster just crowed
09:18 AM Tom_L: 75°F hi 96°F
09:50 AM JT-Cave: high of 86°F
09:50 AM JT-Cave: was around 62 this morning
09:51 AM Tom_L: you takin a break from mesact?
10:29 AM JT-Cave: https://www.hostinger.com/tutorials/create-wordpress-theme-html5
10:30 AM JT-Cave: trying create a theme from scratch
10:32 AM Tom_L: i don't know a thing about wordpress
10:38 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
11:01 AM rigid_: is there a cli version of latency-test?
11:08 AM pcw---home: Theres cyclictest
11:10 AM rigid_: ah, the one from rt-tests
11:11 AM roycroft: i haven't ever tried creating a theme from scratch
11:12 AM roycroft: most folks use a theme builder like divi, oxygen, or bricks to do that
11:33 AM JT-Shop: thanks
11:35 AM markgonz: hello friends
11:36 AM markgonz: anyone familiar with the vfdmod userspace?
11:36 AM JT-Shop: nap time
11:37 AM markgonz: I am trying to control my spindle with modbus via rs485
11:43 AM travis_farmer: if that is what i think it is (UART through Mesa board pins), i think andypugh_ is the man for that
11:45 AM markgonz: I am not sure is that, is about a usb adapter directly wired to the vfd, then setting some valvues and ini and hal files
11:45 AM travis_farmer: oh, that sounds different...
11:45 AM markgonz: but some values are hexadecimal and vfd manual don't appear like this and I am really lost
11:46 AM markgonz: seems that I need to understand everything before figure it out, there is no shortcut
11:47 AM travis_farmer: i think the Debian calculator program can convert hex to decimal
11:47 AM travis_farmer: set it to programmer mode
11:49 AM markgonz: I will look into it
11:49 AM markgonz: I think I will start a new thread see if people can help me
12:08 PM jdh: I have a usb-serial ->rs485->cheapchineseVFD
12:10 PM travis_farmer: well, i am done with the forum until it gets fixed... it responds so slow that the session timed out and i lost another large reply!!! it is not my connection, as the rest of the internet loads just fine.
12:29 PM andypugh_: travis_farmer: With all forums now I tend to Cmd-A / Cmd-C to copy the text to the clipboard before sending.
12:32 PM travis_farmer: i understand. it is just really aggravating to lose a large post. being on the Autism spectrum, i tend to react badly to aggravations ;-) i did the copy-all method in the past, but with so many of the forums auto-saving a draft, i guess i get complacent
12:35 PM _unreal_: I typically always generate large posts in a text editor. and copy/paste. always have
12:36 PM _unreal_: I'm trying to figure out what to do with this new VFD I got
12:36 PM travis_farmer: good one?
12:37 PM _unreal_: omron sysdrive 3g3ev-inverter
12:37 PM _unreal_: I got it free
12:37 PM _unreal_: its a .75kw
12:37 PM travis_farmer: small
12:38 PM _unreal_: it has something on the bottom of it but i'm not sure what it is yet
12:38 PM _unreal_: maybe a line filter?
12:38 PM travis_farmer: they look to go for around $100 on ebay
12:38 PM _unreal_: at first I thought it was a breaking resistor. but then traced down the wires and found it was tied to AC input
12:38 PM _unreal_: ya I got it from work free
12:38 PM _unreal_: it was being used to drive some elevator? ether single person or DUMB waiter. I dont know
12:39 PM _unreal_: I didnt work on "that" boat
12:39 PM travis_farmer: aren't you the one in Florida, IIRC? how did you fair the storm?
12:40 PM _unreal_: never saw it
12:40 PM _unreal_: I'm south east
12:40 PM travis_farmer: ahh, ok
12:45 PM travis_farmer: well that was bizarre... just got a FB text about a server i am selling... and it disappeared... i wonder if it was from one of the scammers i have blocked... never had it do that before
12:49 PM travis_farmer: just curious, what is the LinuxCNC forum running on for a server? it doesn't seem to have enough resources for the number of users...
12:52 PM JT-Shop: a digital ocean droplet whatever that is
12:53 PM _unreal_: I have a lenovo thinkserver I'm working on rebuilding
12:53 PM _unreal_: still not sure what the maximum cpu I can intall in it is though. and lenovo them selfs are ZERO help
12:54 PM _unreal_: lenovo thinkserver rd330
12:54 PM _unreal_: sn:mjylfhf
12:54 PM _unreal_: I've been trying to figure out what the maximum cpu supported it
12:54 PM _unreal_: errr cpu's
12:54 PM travis_farmer: ok, says a "digital ocean droplet" is a VM on a server. similar to what i run for a server
12:54 PM _unreal_: I want to install the max supported CPU's and max out the ram
12:55 PM * travis_farmer is running a pair of 20-core Xeons with only 128GB ram, _unreal_
12:55 PM _unreal_: does anyone know how to find out what the maximum supported xeon cpu is for that server I just listed? because I sure as hell cant find a single thing
12:55 PM _unreal_: travis_farmer, I'm trying to solve what cpu is supported
12:55 PM _unreal_: maximum
12:56 PM _unreal_: if I can I would like to install the E5-2470 v2 processors.
12:56 PM _unreal_: but I cant prove or disprove if they will work in it
12:57 PM _unreal_: the "pdf" manual only says 2400 series 95watt cpu's supported
12:57 PM _unreal_: I have the RD330, the RD340 says it supports the E5-2470 v2 native. yet both have the same motherboard chipset
12:59 PM travis_farmer: says it supports the E5-2400 series, so i would expect the E5-2470 would work, best i can tell
12:59 PM _unreal_: v2
12:59 PM _unreal_: I said v2
01:00 PM travis_farmer: looking...
01:00 PM _unreal_: the v2 is 10 core
01:00 PM _unreal_: non v2 is 8 core
01:02 PM _unreal_: Intel® Xeon® Processor E5-2470. 8 core 20mb cache 3.1gz/turbo I believe is for sure supported. its the fastest turbo speed in the 95 watt range
01:02 PM _unreal_: I had come across one PDF file that had both the rd330 and rd340 listed. and it talked about the V2
01:03 PM _unreal_: in a way that seemed like the 330 supported it. but I for the freaking life of me can not find that PDF again now. and I never saved it./
01:05 PM travis_farmer: https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/75266/intel-xeon-processor-e52470-v2-25m-cache-2-40-ghz.html looks like it may be compatable, with a very quick scan of info
01:07 PM travis_farmer: same socket
01:09 PM travis_farmer: the core count and thread count may be an issue...
01:09 PM _unreal_: right, I'm only worried about bios support.
01:09 PM _unreal_: it has the ? 606 chip set I believe
01:12 PM travis_farmer: maybe just running the BIOS update utility
01:14 PM travis_farmer: the utility only seems to run on windows/redhat/suse
01:18 PM rigid_: btw. everyone can now easily bake rpi4 image with latest 64 bit raspbian lite + 6.1.35 rt-kernel + self compiling LinuxCNC (master): https://github.com/heeplr/linuxcncpi (except if you don't get some gcc-aarch64-linux-gnu installed)
01:18 PM rigid_: it's even a bit tested
01:19 PM travis_farmer: i would say, aquire a windows loaded OS hard-drive, _unreal_ and download the windows BIOS updater
01:19 PM _unreal_: it runs fine and has win server 2k8
01:20 PM _unreal_: just it has a single 4 core xeon. and 4gb ram
01:20 PM _unreal_: I got it free. I'm trying to solve what cpu it can support
01:20 PM travis_farmer: oh, ok
01:20 PM _unreal_: I've already hacked into it and cleared the windows account password crap
01:21 PM _unreal_: its older windows easy enough
01:21 PM _unreal_: I'll prob load win10 on it and linux
01:21 PM CaptHindsight: the forums are running really slow
01:21 PM travis_farmer: yes Capt, i mentioned that ;-)
01:22 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, your like the 5th person to mention
01:22 PM CaptHindsight: who will be 6th? what did I win?
01:22 PM _unreal_: winnaa winnaaa chicken dinna
01:22 PM travis_farmer: i wish i had fiber-internet, i coud donate some bandwidth to host the forum...
01:23 PM _unreal_: travis_farmer, I would assume its a server loading issue or a hardware issue before network issue
01:23 PM travis_farmer: no, my issue for hosting is network
01:24 PM travis_farmer: if i hosted it for LinuxCNC
01:24 PM _unreal_: your really getting that much access
01:25 PM travis_farmer: i only have Cable internet, my upload is around 4MB, so it takes very little to tax it
01:26 PM travis_farmer: and i have been told my router is sub-standard ;-)
01:26 PM rigid_: what are bad/acceptable/good max. jitter values for a rpi4?
01:27 PM CaptHindsight: servo thread for the Rpi4
01:27 PM CaptHindsight: unless you are trying the DMA GPIO stuff
01:27 PM CaptHindsight: then that would be base thread
01:28 PM CaptHindsight: <200K for servo threads is great with Mesa over Ethernet
01:29 PM travis_farmer: wow, digital ocean only goes up to 8 CPUs... i could do 12 for about free, if i had the bandwidth....
01:29 PM rigid_: CaptHindsight: hm, how should I load the system? I ran apt search and some i/o heavy processes and get 31639 (servo) and 23833 (base)
01:30 PM CaptHindsight: rigid_: the test we use that always gets the most jitter is running Firefox and playing a youtube
01:31 PM rigid_: ehrm
01:31 PM CaptHindsight: latency is worst on AMD when the kernel is allocating memory
01:31 PM rigid_: i hoped for something more realworldy for a CNC hw controller :-P
01:31 PM rigid_: ...when your CNC is rickrolling you for calibration
01:32 PM CaptHindsight: https://github.com/NTULINUX/ntu_overlay Gentoo installer for a LCNC system
01:32 PM rigid_: well, now pulseaudio and stuff is still active. i guess without X, latency will go down a bit more
01:32 PM _unreal_: travis_farmer, https://psref.lenovo.com/syspool/Sys/PDF/ThinkServer/ThinkServer_RD340/ThinkServer_RD340_Spec.PDF
01:32 PM CaptHindsight: almost done, the 5.15 and later kernels seem to have poor latency results
01:33 PM rigid_: CaptHindsight: that's what I'm using https://github.com/NTULINUX/ntu_overlay/blob/main/sci-electronics/linuxcnc/linuxcnc-9999-r6.ebuild
01:33 PM rigid_: gentoo is probably a great choice for that. i used raspbian lite for now
01:33 PM CaptHindsight: he just walked out
01:33 PM _unreal_: oooo never found this pdf before https://media.cnetcontentsyndication.com/FTP/ContentCast/Lenovo/inlinecontent/servers/thinkserver/rd330/cnet_lenovo_thinkserver_rd330_datasheet_02.pdf
01:33 PM _unreal_: this says intel c600 chipset
01:33 PM CaptHindsight: I'll tell him that I found someone that knows how to use it
01:34 PM _unreal_: for the 330, other pages say 606
01:34 PM CaptHindsight: rigid_: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/18-computer/48079-can-the-opi5-be-configured-to-run-lcnc
01:34 PM rigid_: CaptHindsight: i'm using 6.1.38-rt14-rc1-v8 here
01:35 PM rigid_: CaptHindsight: i saw that, i think it's roughly based on the official rpi image
01:36 PM rigid_: i wonder what those max latency values are. never could get it running.
01:38 PM rigid_: ...and I _still_ can't toggle a GPIO :-(
01:39 PM _unreal_: I designed a mini tower for the OPI5
01:39 PM _unreal_: its on github
01:39 PM _unreal_: designed as a split shell so it can be 3d printed with different feature options
01:39 PM CaptHindsight: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/34987/ernest-26Jun2023-39271.png
01:40 PM rigid_: CaptHindsight: times out
01:40 PM travis_farmer: _unreal_ that pdf says up to 95W CPU, and the E5-2470V2 happens to be 95W
01:41 PM _unreal_: right I agree travis_farmer but I dont know that it will support the V2
01:41 PM CaptHindsight: rigid_: the forums are running slow, try later or refresh
01:41 PM travis_farmer: the documents may have been written before the V2, so there's that...
01:41 PM _unreal_: everything regarding the 330 says supports e5-2400 not e5-2400 v2 series
01:42 PM CaptHindsight: rigid_: https://i.imgur.com/4UXorIu.png
01:42 PM _unreal_: again agreed
01:43 PM travis_farmer: that cnet one was writted 2012
01:43 PM travis_farmer: *written
01:44 PM _unreal_: travis_farmer, https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/sku/63984/intel-c602-chipset/compatible.html
01:44 PM _unreal_: link from https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/series/98463/intel-c600-series-chipsets.html
01:44 PM _unreal_: I cant find c600
01:47 PM _unreal_: travis_farmer, sx52400 thats the motherboard
01:49 PM _unreal_: its amazing there is just nothing for info
01:49 PM travis_farmer: i see that
01:52 PM travis_farmer: almost like it is some sort of upgrade secret or something...
01:54 PM solarwind: I bought one of those "linear actuators" consisting of a ballscrew, linear rail, stepper motor assembly
01:54 PM solarwind: $100, very impressed with the quality
01:55 PM solarwind: Have to see how well it holds tolerances with a dial indicator or something. I bought it as a focus rack for my stereo microscope. Overkill, but I like a rigid setup
01:57 PM _unreal_: travis_farmer, what blows me a way is that the chipset info says e5-2600 support
01:58 PM _unreal_: so i'm not crazy
01:59 PM travis_farmer: are you sure you aren't? ;-)
02:01 PM memleak: hi rigid_ , I'm the Gentoo dev :)
02:02 PM CaptHindsight: solarwind: the cheap Chinese ballscrew positioners are go for +- a few thou over temp and abuse
02:02 PM memleak: I'm working on a Gentoo installer + image for AMD64, I ran into latency issues though even with a heavily tuned 6.5 PREEMPT_RT kernel, I hit spikes with 5.15, 6.1, 6.4 and 6.5
02:02 PM solarwind: CaptHindsight so absolutely perfect for a microscope focus rack
02:02 PM solarwind: like better than anything else you can get for the price
02:03 PM CaptHindsight: solarwind: which linear bearings does it use?
02:03 PM memleak: Did you modify the linuxcnc ebuild for arm64?
02:03 PM memleak: I didn't add arm64 to the KEYWORDS but I probably should.
02:03 PM solarwind: CaptHindsight https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B07MG8ZG1K it doesn't specify, but it looks like MGN12 *I think*
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: solarwind: ah ok profile rails
02:04 PM solarwind: Yeah, so pretty decent. Can be quite sure they're not genuine Hiwin
02:05 PM CaptHindsight: solarwind: they are in a category I call prosumer
02:05 PM solarwind: but out of the box, there are no rough spots or grime, although still going to disassemble and clean and oil it properly
02:06 PM CaptHindsight: not complete crap like 3d printer parts (consumer), drawer slides etc etc
02:06 PM solarwind: I wouldn't stick this assembly as is on a router Z axis, but for general purpose use, I'm satisfied so far
02:06 PM CaptHindsight: but not as good as https://ph.parker.com/us/en/404xr-ballscrew-driven-square-rail-guided-high-precision-linear-positioner
02:06 PM travis_farmer: "drawer slides" ??? for real???
02:07 PM solarwind: travis_farmer yes what some 3D printers come with, you'd be surprised
02:07 PM travis_farmer: dang!
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.reddit.com/r/Reprap/comments/3ay0vv/low_cost_3d_printer_that_uses_drawer_runners_for/?&rdt=40714
02:07 PM travis_farmer: my Ender 3 seems ok...
02:07 PM solarwind: the "profiled" linear rails as CaptHindsight calls them (MGN series hiwin clones) are decent
02:07 PM solarwind: and the HGR rails although more expensive are _very_ solid
02:08 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPkwIG7og44
02:09 PM solarwind: travis_farmer your Ender 3 comes with POM wheels riding on the V groove of the aluminum extrusion right?
02:09 PM travis_farmer: yes, i think so
02:09 PM rigid_: memleak: awesome, thanks for it :)
02:09 PM solarwind: yeah the first thing a lot of people do is replace that with MGN rails
02:10 PM travis_farmer: i don't use it much... maybe eventualy. there are a lot of upgrades i want to do
02:10 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.automation-overstock.com/categories.asp?cat=14
02:11 PM solarwind: yeah ^ I bookmarked that the last time you linked it
02:11 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.automation-overstock.com/hiwintech.asp
02:11 PM solarwind: Going to pittsburgh in a couple of weeks, so might order some things to smuggle back
02:11 PM travis_farmer: yeah, those look like the slide rails/blocks on my cnc router
02:11 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.automation4less.com/store/hiwinlegacy.asp
02:11 PM solarwind: the "heavy duty" rails are quite impressive
02:12 PM solarwind: the large format 4'x8' CNC routers use them
02:12 PM travis_farmer: mine is 4 x 4
02:12 PM solarwind: oh yeah I remember, you posted that messy pic'
02:13 PM travis_farmer: yup, that is mine ;-) :-D
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: solarwind: flying or driving?
02:13 PM memleak: rigid_, for which part?
02:14 PM solarwind: CaptHindsight driving
02:14 PM memleak: I don't have any arm64 gentoo linuxcnc stuff available.
02:14 PM solarwind: cousin's wedding. I'm taking my motorcycle, but mom will be driving her car, so she'll be doing the smuggling technically
02:15 PM solarwind: Mostly going for the ride and to listen to more stories from my uncle (professor of cardiology at U of Pittsburgh) about how dumb his med school students are
02:16 PM solarwind: apparently they don't understand the concept of "pressure" and the working principle of reading someone's blood pressure with a cuff and gauge
02:16 PM solarwind: I love it
02:17 PM rigid_: memleak: the arm64 part is from me, i used your ebuild to get it on amd64
02:17 PM memleak: ah ok!
02:18 PM rigid_: i'n trying to run the UI on gentoo and the hardware stuff on the pi
02:19 PM memleak: With a PREEMPT_RT ARM64 kernel and adding ~arm64 to the ebuild, you should be able to do both on the pi
02:19 PM memleak: Just never tested it on gentoo arm64
02:19 PM rigid_: i used raspbian on the pi for now to get up & running quickly
02:20 PM solarwind: The official ballscrew conversion kit for my First LC 1-1/2 VS vertical mill from the manufacturer cost ~$1,000. Was the last one in stock, so the distributor sold it to me "at cost" for some reason. They're supposed to be genuine C7 ballscrews
02:20 PM memleak: If you run into any problems with the gentoo stuff let me know.
02:20 PM solarwind: a lot larger in diameter than this. Hopefully the price reflects how seriously they take their tolerances
02:20 PM memleak: I'm the sole maintainer lol
02:20 PM solarwind: memleak of Gentoo??
02:21 PM Tom_L: it's lonely at the top
02:21 PM memleak: solarwind, of the linuxcnc gentoo stuff
02:21 PM solarwind: ah
02:21 PM memleak: Tom_L, haha yeah
02:23 PM solarwind: $100 USD for a focus rack which uses plastic wearing components in the "slide ways": https://amscope.com/collections/microscope-parts-accessories-microscope-focusing-blocks-racks/products/fr-a6-v331
02:23 PM travis_farmer: maintainer of gentoo as a whole? or the LinuxCNC portion of it?
02:24 PM solarwind: nooooo thank you. I prefer mine. Full electronic control too
02:24 PM solarwind: travis_farmer I just asked that above LOL
02:24 PM travis_farmer: lol, oh
02:24 PM memleak: Only the LinuxCNC ebuild, gentoo has many active devs
02:25 PM memleak: but I also help people out with preempt_rt and other kernel related things.
02:25 PM Tom_L: memleak, is also the RTAI guy right?
02:25 PM memleak: yes lol
02:25 PM travis_farmer: oh, lol. and here i was almost impressed ;-)
02:25 PM Tom_L: you should bow
02:25 PM travis_farmer: lol, Tom_L
02:26 PM memleak: I helped get kernel 5.4 + RTAI working on LinuxCNC
02:26 PM Tom_L: i recall that
02:26 PM pere: opencamlib just entered debian. it provide CAM features using by FreeCAD. <URL: https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/opencamlib >
02:26 PM travis_farmer: i help LinuxCNC by getting in the way :-D
02:27 PM memleak: haha
02:27 PM solarwind: memleak OHHHH I _think_ I know who you are
02:27 PM solarwind: I love RTAI
02:27 PM Tom_L: it _was_ a well kept secret
02:27 PM solarwind: true realtime
02:28 PM solarwind: none of this "hopefully realtime, some of the time" stuff from preempt_rt
02:28 PM travis_farmer: oh, and i have an unofficial mirror of the LinuxCNC source code on my GitLab... but i am unsure how much of a help it is
02:29 PM solarwind: memleak someone told me all your embarrassing childhood stories ;)
02:31 PM travis_farmer: clearly nobody finds my contribution impressive... ;-)
02:32 PM solarwind: well I can ddos it and we'll know when someone complains
02:33 PM Tom_L: it's probably slow enough as it is
02:33 PM memleak: Tom_L, do you still like testing things?
02:33 PM Tom_L: some yes
02:33 PM solarwind: I've been looking into RT-Thread a lot, I'm impressed with it so far. microkernel, MMU, POSIX API
02:33 PM travis_farmer: :-(
02:33 PM Tom_L: been helping jt with his config tool a bit
02:34 PM Tom_L: i'm a bit rusty on the kernel stuff
02:35 PM Tom_L: not as young as i was yesterday either
02:35 PM solarwind: tell me about it
02:35 PM memleak: I have a tool that's almost done which wipes out your entire drive and puts real-time gentoo on it :)
02:35 PM Tom_L: sounds like a scary tool
02:35 PM solarwind: memleak RTAI kernel?
02:36 PM travis_farmer: solarwind: i could easily shut it down and watch as nobody complains... but i like trying to help
02:36 PM memleak: preempt_rt and lol
02:36 PM Tom_L: i can say i've never run gentoo
02:36 PM memleak: I was trying to make gentoo more accessible to debian/ubuntu folk
02:36 PM Tom_L: isn't it a pita to build?
02:37 PM memleak: If you're not familiar with Linux internals, yes
02:37 PM Tom_L: that would be me
02:37 PM memleak: hence the installer.
02:37 PM rigid_: or if your platform sucks
02:38 PM travis_farmer: how rude...
02:38 PM rigid_: install isn't automated. all custom tailored on setup
02:38 PM memleak: what gets me is how often they're still working on ppc64 and such
02:38 PM Tom_L: install from a thumbdrive or what?
02:38 PM memleak: and now Loooongarch :)
02:38 PM solarwind: whaaat, you don't have to be that familiar with kernel stuff to build gentoo
02:39 PM solarwind: just know basic compiling workflow
02:39 PM memleak: by default gentoo doesn't come with a pre-built kernel, you're expected to build your own.
02:39 PM Tom_L: i figured as much
02:39 PM memleak: but there's now pre-built images you can "emerge"
02:39 PM solarwind: yeah but it's not hard
02:39 PM Tom_L: do they use kernel.org files?
02:39 PM solarwind: you don't have to know anything about the code
02:40 PM memleak: solarwind, not many people know how to work with kconfig
02:40 PM Tom_L: not the settings...
02:40 PM memleak: 90% of the options are gibberish to the average linux user
02:40 PM memleak: i.e. ISA-style DMA
02:40 PM solarwind: Yeah I suppose. I find it pretty intuitive
02:41 PM solarwind: anything like that ^, you just search and read
02:41 PM rigid_: phew, now I need a working config that toggles the gpio as fast as possible
02:42 PM * rigid_ high dives into the docs
02:42 PM solarwind: memleak help me petition the PCI-SIG to draft a special low-speed mode for PCIe for direct interface to FPGAs/microcontrollers without high speed transceivers :)
02:42 PM memleak: that's above my paygrade.
02:43 PM CaptHindsight: yeah that sounds like hardware
02:43 PM solarwind: :( 2.5GT/s is way too fast for anything but dedicated transceivers
02:44 PM CaptHindsight: I wonder if the silicon is all dynamic and if you could even slow it down to 10MHz or something
02:44 PM solarwind: should be a walk in the cake for them to just lower the clocks
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: if the config registers go down that low
02:45 PM solarwind: There are PLLs and clock dividers, it's minimal effort for them to add a low speed mode
02:45 PM solarwind: because right now, other than ethernet, there is no easily accessible I/O on standard PCs
02:45 PM solarwind: realtime I/O I mean
02:45 PM solarwind: there is the ISA bus, but it's not exposed on the board
02:46 PM CaptHindsight: current cpu's may only be underclocked to ~100mhz
02:46 PM solarwind: Only the transceivers need to change clocks speed, that's why it's super easy for them to add this mode
02:46 PM CaptHindsight: you'd be surprised by how much that would be helpful gets crippled
02:47 PM solarwind: say again?
02:47 PM solarwind: then pcw---home has no excuse for not implementing PCIe directly :P
02:48 PM travis_farmer: there, mirror is shutdown and deleted, so i won't be the butt of the jokes anymore :-(
02:48 PM CaptHindsight: if the clocks can be turned down that low I doubt if the silicon gets verified to work that low
02:48 PM solarwind: speaking of which, pcw---home, I got a PCIe test program communicating successfully with my Artix 7 325 M.2 module over PCIe
02:49 PM solarwind: it was pretty easy, and it's insanely fast and super low latency
02:50 PM CaptHindsight: low power pcie
02:50 PM solarwind: that's a better marketing selling point
02:51 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.electronicdesign.com/technologies/industrial/boards/article/21776742/not-so-fast-use-pci-express-for-lowerspeed-interconnects-too
02:51 PM solarwind: As far as FPGAs and other electronics go, unless you're relying on specific transmission line properties like PCI, you can almost always blindly turn down clocks
02:52 PM solarwind: I've never had something not work because I reduced the clock
02:52 PM CaptHindsight: hah https://www.electronicdesign.com/technologies/industrial/boards/article/21776742/not-so-fast-use-pci-express-for-lowerspeed-interconnects-too
02:52 PM travis_farmer: see, no response... nobody cares about me, my existance, or anything i do to try and help :-(
02:53 PM solarwind: CaptHindsight see, there's clearly a demand for it
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: how low does your BIOS let you set it?
02:54 PM solarwind: what do you mean? set what?
02:54 PM CaptHindsight: PCIe clock speed
02:55 PM solarwind: Not all do, but the way PCIe works is with link training and auto negotiation
02:55 PM solarwind: you can restrict the max speed in the BIOS sometimes. Like you can select in a menu to limit it to PCIe 1.0 speeds
02:56 PM CaptHindsight: how low do you want? 10MHz for easy micro interfacing?
02:56 PM solarwind: Like even 100MHz is great
02:56 PM solarwind: the PCIe ref clock is already 100MHz
02:57 PM solarwind: but yeah I think they should allow multiple clocks like 1MHz, 10MHz, 100Mhz, whatever
02:58 PM solarwind: Most FPGAs can easily do 500MHz on all pins
02:58 PM solarwind: But 1.25GHz is crossing that line into "high speed transceiver" territory, which is a pain in the ass
03:00 PM solarwind: Which is why only specific Artix and Zynq chips can do PCIe, they need to have that high speed transceiver on the chip
03:00 PM CaptHindsight: lots of things get ignored in x86/am64 and arm that would help with real time
03:01 PM CaptHindsight: but the high volume world they target doesn't care about RT
03:01 PM rigid_: with this minimal halrun script, do I need to enable anything more to get actual hardware output? https://gist.github.com/heeplr/ebbc0535d45dc3b9bbb1abe82344a9c9
03:01 PM solarwind: CaptHindsight nailed it
03:01 PM rigid_: has anyone ever tested the pi_gpio driver on rpi4?
03:01 PM CaptHindsight: 10-15 years ago we could not even get ARM SOC's with PCIe
03:01 PM solarwind: consumers just care about their HDMI and ad-riddled movies
03:02 PM CaptHindsight: AMD put some GPIO on the CPU's and could be toggled at 200MHz but only put 5 or 6 of them on there
03:03 PM CaptHindsight: would have been great for software stepping
03:03 PM solarwind: Damn, did not know that
03:04 PM solarwind: There is a chip that does this which I mentioned to pcw---home a while ago https://www.asix.com.tw/en/product/Interface/PCIe_Bridge/AX99100
03:04 PM solarwind: very cheap
03:04 PM solarwind: It's a PCIe to local bus/serial port/parallel port/GPIO
03:04 PM solarwind: used on almost every cheap PCIe serial port card. $10 on amazon
03:05 PM solarwind: they're usually hard wired on the card to DB-9 and parallel port connectors, but you can change the configuration registers directly from Linux and put the card into local bus mode to interface with a microcontroller
03:07 PM CaptHindsight: yeah I like that chip
03:07 PM solarwind: their "demo board" is like $200 or so lol and it's almost identical to the $10 cards on amazon, but with a couple of extra pin headers
03:30 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.amazon.com/Syba-Parallel-Centronics-Interface-SI-PEX10011/dp/B01LWT30HO?th=1
03:31 PM rigid_: why does halrun tell me "Unexpected realtime delay on task 0 with period 5000. Run the Latency Test and resolve before continuing." ?
03:40 PM memleak: rigid_, because your latency spiked
03:41 PM memleak: 5000 nanoseconds (5 microseconds) might be too fast
03:42 PM memleak: have to go, bbl
03:51 PM rigid_: ah
03:51 PM rigid_: i'm trying to figure out how to benchmark the gpio
03:52 PM rigid_: currently i have it running at 80kHz max but I guess I need sensible values
04:09 PM rigid_: hm, why can't set I "setp stepgen.0.steplen" < 10000? it seems to ignore smaller values
04:22 PM unreal is now known as _unreal_
04:23 PM XXCoder: blondihacks is a cat confirmed
04:38 PM pcw---home: rigid: the steplength cannot be shorter than the base period (in normal mode) It _can_ be shorter in "doublestep" mode
04:41 PM rigid_: pcw---home: ah of course. thanks