#linuxcnc Logs

Apr 14 2023

#linuxcnc Calendar

01:04 AM Deejay: moin
03:15 AM guest29057 is now known as KimK
04:45 AM Tom_L: morning
04:49 AM JT-Cave: morning
06:48 AM JT-Cave: forum is down
06:48 AM JT-Cave: and I don't know why
06:56 AM travis_farmer[m]: i can confirm as well, it is down
06:57 AM travis_farmer[m]: Morning, BTW ;-)
07:01 AM JT-Cave: morning
07:26 AM dudul[m]: It was down on one of my isp's always
07:31 AM Deejay_ is now known as Deejay
08:18 AM Guest8441: forum is down?
08:18 AM travis_farmer[m]: yes
08:19 AM Guest8441: ETA?
08:19 AM travis_farmer[m]: no idea
08:19 AM Guest8441: :(
08:19 AM travis_farmer[m]: i believe they are working on it
08:29 AM JT-Cave: unfortunately they (me) has no idea what happened nor can I get to the admin panel
08:30 AM travis_farmer[m]: ... that's not good. sounds like hardware fault, or service not running...
08:30 AM travis_farmer[m]: can you SSH in?
08:36 AM JT-Cave: yes
08:38 AM travis_farmer[m]: so the hardware is running, that's good. anything in the logs that looks interesting?
08:40 AM JT-Cave: basically something happened yesterday that went from 61% to 95% disk space
08:40 AM travis_farmer[m]: oh dear lord!
08:40 AM JT-Cave: anyway time to clean chicken shit
08:41 AM travis_farmer[m]: enjoy
09:14 AM Unterhaus__: someone on an rpi group wants to send a keypress by email
09:14 AM Unterhaus__: talk about lag
09:48 AM Loetmichel_: *giggle* Coworker just came by. "Here are the 8 TB6560 chips you are waiting for the CNC Mill. What do they do anyway? *cue short explanation abiut stepper motor drivers and stepper motors* [incomprehending look]. "Well, it basicalls does what i do here by hand: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXkU_5Vk4Z4 ... "AH, NOW i understand!" :D
09:59 AM CloudEvil: :)
10:18 AM solarwind: If I remember correctly, someone on here was an expert on mechanical watches?
10:18 AM solarwind: I forgot who, perhaps roycroft?
10:20 AM solarwind: My question is: I'm looking for a mechanical stopwatch (well technically something with an analog dial, not an LCD). Can anyone recommend anything? It doesn't have to be fancy. Just looking for something affordable, like < $200
10:23 AM travis_farmer[m]: Forum looks to be back up :-D
10:43 AM roycroft: i would not say i'm an expert on mechanical watches
10:43 AM roycroft: but i have a few, and i enjoy wearing them and using them
10:44 AM roycroft: i don't have any stop watches, though
10:57 AM Unterhaus__: if you tell amazon you want a ring light for your milling machine, it costs over $100. Any other purpose it's less than $30
11:06 AM skunkworks[m]: Cradek..
11:07 AM skunkworks[m]: solarwind: Cradek - but I think he fixes and is an expert on older watches 🙂
11:09 AM roycroft: yeah, cradek would be the one to talk to here, if anyone
11:19 AM CloudEvil: I was looking over on lcsc, for raw LED price. You can buy 1W 100lm LEDs, enough to make the equivalent of a square meter of sunlight for about $10
11:22 AM CloudEvil: https://www.lcsc.com/product-detail/Light-Emitting-Diodes-LED_HONGLITRONIC-Hongli-Zhihui-HONGLITRONIC-HL-AS-2835D1W-2C-S1-08-PCT-HR3-R9_C2683774.html correction, $15
11:27 AM jpa-: not very long if you don't invest at least 2x that in cooling the 1kW array :)
11:28 AM CloudEvil: For second-long pulses, it'd be fine.
11:28 AM CloudEvil: More than that, yes.
11:55 AM roycroft: do any of you use the small (2.2kw) 80mm water-cooled spindles on routers?
11:56 AM roycroft: i need another coolant pump/sump system for my new one, and i'd rather not use the huge one i have on my router table
11:56 AM roycroft: i wonder how big of a coolant reservoir one really needs for one of those
11:56 AM roycroft: my current one holds about 2 gallons
11:57 AM roycroft: 1l would be a lot better, if that is enough to keep it cool
11:57 AM roycroft: i don't have a radiator on my current one, but if i get a small enough reservoir for the new one i can make room for a radiator and fan
11:59 AM solarwind: roycroft I do
11:59 AM solarwind: You don't need any reservoir at all if you get yourself a cheap CPU cooling radiator
11:59 AM roycroft: https://www.amazon.com//dp/B000HEUYIM
11:59 AM roycroft: that's what i currently have
12:00 PM solarwind: That is enormous
12:00 PM roycroft: yes
12:00 PM roycroft: and the coolant never gets even a tiny bit warm
12:00 PM CloudEvil: I would want a flow indicator at least.
12:00 PM solarwind: I either use a small diaphragm pump or something made for CPU water cooling
12:00 PM roycroft: that one is also really noisy
12:00 PM roycroft: the coolant pump on my horizontal bandsaw has failed
12:00 PM solarwind: Yes mine _never_ gets hot because I use it at high RPM/low current
12:01 PM CloudEvil: Watts into water would be a useful number
12:01 PM CloudEvil: I would be surprised if it'd go over 400
12:01 PM roycroft: i'm thinking of moving that one over to the bandsaw, if i can find a smaller one that works will with the spindle
12:01 PM solarwind: any cheap CPU water cooling pump will work
12:01 PM roycroft: i see some folks use cpu cooling pumps
12:01 PM roycroft: they never talk about them, though, other than the installation process
12:02 PM solarwind: I personally stick to positive displacement pumps like diaphragm pumps used for RV water supplies because I like the high pressure in case of kinks
12:02 PM roycroft: i'd like to see a "i've been using this for a year and it works brilliantly" post from someone
12:02 PM roycroft: and a flow meter is entirely possible
12:02 PM solarwind: If I had to, I could also just hook it up to my TIG welding cart's water cooler
12:02 PM roycroft: i might mount it in the front panel where i control the spindle speed and th elike
12:03 PM CloudEvil: 400W gives you 20C heat-rise with 5ml/s flow
12:03 PM roycroft: my tig welder is in a different building to where the spindles are
12:03 PM roycroft: so that would not work too well
12:03 PM roycroft: anyway, thanks
12:04 PM roycroft: it's good to know someone has used a cpu cooler and can confirm that it's effective
12:04 PM roycroft: i don't know how much waste heat is generated by the spindle, cloudevil
12:04 PM CloudEvil: It'd be nice if it was specced
12:04 PM roycroft: so it's hard to determine that
12:04 PM roycroft: yes, but those spindles are from china
12:04 PM CloudEvil: Indeed.
12:04 PM roycroft: so the important specs are "shininess" and "cheapness"
12:05 PM CloudEvil: Could approximate it with I*r^2*2, I guess.
12:06 PM roycroft: btw, when i got the coolant system i linked to above it cost me <$100, and that was only about 5 years ago
12:06 PM roycroft: even with the cheetoh tariffs there's no good reason for it to have more than doubled in price
12:07 PM roycroft: other than that they can get away with it
12:08 PM roycroft: mine is also dual-voltage, so i don't have to use a step-down transformer to run it
12:08 PM roycroft: probably the one i linked to is dual-voltage as well, although they don't advertise it as such
12:11 PM Unterhaus__: we bought a spindle coolant pump at work, it was pretty expensive considering what's in it. Then I had to replace the motor coupling right away
12:13 PM roycroft: solarwind: is your cpu coolant pump mounted near the spindle, or some distance away?
12:13 PM roycroft: my current pump is about 1m away from the spindle, and 1/2m below it
12:13 PM roycroft: and that's for an undertable spindle
12:14 PM roycroft: for an overhead spindle on a cnc router, it would be about a meter below the spindle, and probably would have 6m of hose in total
12:14 PM solarwind: I'm not using a CPU cooler pump for this, I've only tested it in the past and it worked. I mounted it to the frame of the router to keep the length of the moving hoses relatively short.
12:14 PM roycroft: if it were mounted below, like the current one
12:14 PM roycroft: my experience with moving beer through hoses is that there's a lot of friction in those hose walls
12:14 PM solarwind: Right now I use a diaphragm pump because I don't mind the noise and I like that it's a positive displacement pump
12:15 PM solarwind: But keep in mind that the TIG torch water cooler that we have isn't a positive displacement type, and they have to push water through far more restrictive channels
12:15 PM roycroft: yeah, like mine
12:16 PM Tom_L: i used a fishtank recirculation pump on my 'spindle cooler' :) http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Assembly/spindle_cooler/Cooler5.jpg
12:16 PM Tom_L: worked excellent actually
12:17 PM Tom_L: i've since upgraded spindle motors
12:17 PM solarwind: Tom_L yup that's similar to what I do on my 15kW industrial air compressor
12:17 PM Tom_L: 5gal bucket of ice water and it's usually good for a part run
12:17 PM solarwind: mostly so I can tuck it away in a corner and not worry about airflow
12:18 PM solarwind: but in my case, I most certainly have to use a car radiator
12:18 PM roycroft: that's a little bigger than i'd like
12:18 PM roycroft: i'm looking at small pond pumps
12:18 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Assembly/spindle_cooler/Cooler1.jpg
12:18 PM Tom_L: trick to no kinks is full of water and pinch the ends off
12:19 PM solarwind: I also like to use PEX or the "braided" stiff vinyl tubing that doesn't kink
12:19 PM roycroft: i think i still have a small little giant pump that might work well
12:19 PM Tom_L: mine was eheim iirc
12:19 PM Tom_L: fish stuff
12:19 PM solarwind: are you using any thermal grease?
12:20 PM Tom_L: cause i already had it
12:20 PM Tom_L: no
12:20 PM Tom_L: i'm not using that setup anymore now either
12:20 PM roycroft: that setup is kidn of overkill
12:20 PM roycroft: i'm not sure it needs thermal grease
12:20 PM Tom_L: it was all stuff i had on hand
12:21 PM roycroft: i'm pretty sure i have one of these which, while not having a great flow rate, might work:
12:21 PM roycroft: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BYFLOCI/
12:22 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Assembly/spindle_cooler/Cooler4.jpg
12:22 PM roycroft: the problem being it's 115v
12:22 PM Tom_L: plenty of flow
12:22 PM roycroft: and i really need a 230v pump
12:22 PM roycroft: or else i need a transformer to bring the voltage down
12:23 PM roycroft: having 120v at the router table might be useful anyway, in case i need to plug a lamp or something else in there
12:23 PM Tom_L: i have a switched outlet on my lathe bench and keep it off most of the time due to chips
12:24 PM roycroft: i could get a 1 gallon bucket to use as a reservoir for the little giant
12:24 PM roycroft: one of my biggest frustrations with my new bandsaw was the light socket
12:25 PM roycroft: i rewired the saw to 240v, and that also rewired the light socket to 240v
12:25 PM roycroft: and the light i got for it is dual-voltage, but the plug and receptacle were 120v
12:26 PM roycroft: i couldn't bring myself to using those with the higher voltage, and i found that the receptacle was proprietary, and would require a lot of work to replace with a proper 240v receptacle
12:26 PM roycroft: so i ended up getting a step-down transformer for the light
12:26 PM roycroft: and had to rewire the whole saw, of course, due to that, plus the mag switch and hour meter i added
12:27 PM roycroft: if you recall that i dropped a 10mm wrench down into the saw, that is why i was using the wrench - for the rewiring
12:28 PM Tom_L: yup
12:28 PM roycroft: anyway, i think the little giant pump will be fine for the router table
12:28 PM roycroft: but for the cnc router, something mounted up by the spindle would probably be better
12:30 PM JT[m]: Tom_L did Chris figure anything out?
12:31 PM JT[m]: No access to devel from here
12:31 PM JT[m]: Also status is 3000
01:10 PM Unterhaus__: I didn't notice our sump pump was running and when I finally did, the water in the sump was near boiling
01:10 PM Unterhaus__: It is a Zoeller M53 Mighty-mate Submersible Sump Pump and seems no worse for the experience
01:11 PM Unterhaus__: they might make small ones, dunno
01:11 PM Tom_L: JT[m], not sure
01:11 PM Tom_L: nothing was said after you left
01:12 PM Tom_L: seems the forum is up though
01:14 PM * travis_farmer[m] just replaced our in-sink garbage disposal, that decided to crap out at the worst time....
01:18 PM roycroft: i think i'm going to look for the little giant fountain pump that i'm sure is buried somewhere in my shop, and figure out what i can use as a reservior for it, and that will take care of the router table
01:18 PM roycroft: i need to spend some more time looking into cpu cooler systems for the cnc router
01:25 PM JT[m]: Tom_L I deleted a bunch of old logs to free up space before we left
01:25 PM roguish[m]: JT: thanks
01:26 PM JT[m]: Your welcome
01:26 PM JT[m]: Hopefully Chris figured out what the mysql issue was
01:27 PM roguish[m]: radek is a smart dude, he'll get done
01:28 PM roguish[m]: especially if jepler helps
01:34 PM Unterhaus__: now that I'm recalling the cooler at work, there was a pump that was made for pumping soda inside. Had to replace that pump and the coupling. The cooling was done with some kind of refrigeration unit. I should have worked harder to document it. The company basically forced us to reverse engineer it, they were useless for support. It was all commercially available stuff
01:35 PM Unterhaus__: well, except that control panel and the case.
02:33 PM Unterhaus__: can you swap the output pin for step and dir on a mesa board? I'm looking at someone's hal file and I don't see an assignment
02:41 PM Unterhaus__: seems like it would be easier to swap the wires
02:45 PM roycroft: this is not going to go well
02:45 PM Unterhaus__: the help says to redirect dmsg into a text file to find the pins
02:45 PM roycroft: the credit union where i have most of my accounts are issuing new debit cards to all members
02:45 PM roycroft: the instructions say that the old card will stop working on may 8th, and that the new card cannot be activated until may 8th
02:46 PM roycroft: that's pretty much a guarantee that on may 8th their website will be unusable
02:46 PM Unterhaus__: nice
02:46 PM * roycroft will plan on not needing his debit card on may 8th
02:47 PM Unterhaus__: after the help tells you to redirect the output of dmesg into a text file, it tells you to clear it first and then load lcnc
02:49 PM Unterhaus__: deletes 20000 line text file, starts again
02:51 PM Unterhaus__: so changing the pinout requires rebuilding the driver?
02:51 PM Unterhaus__: sorry, rebuilding the firmware?
02:59 PM pcw-home: If you want to swap step/dir its easiest to do it in the wiring (though some stepgen firmware versions do support swapping pins)
03:00 PM Unterhaus__: how would you know if the stepgen supports it?
03:00 PM pcw-home: there would be a hal parameter
03:05 PM Unterhaus__: what's the mesa utility to check the firmware?
03:05 PM pcw-home: something like hm2_7i96.0.stepgen.00.swap_step_dir
03:05 PM pcw-home: mesaflash
03:05 PM Unterhaus__: thanks
03:07 PM Unterhaus__: you made me look, that pin doesn't exist on my 7i96
03:08 PM pcw-home: The option is not common, mainly on firmware that has step/dir index support
03:09 PM pcw-home: 7i96_dsti.bit for example
03:10 PM pcw-home: Also not sure if it's supported in 2.8.4
03:11 PM Unterhaus__: I'm using 2.9
03:13 PM pcw-home: ok so should work
03:13 PM Unterhaus__: helping people with lcnc on facebook is even more frustrating than other channels
03:32 PM Unterhaus__: apparently the gecko he's using has a ribbon cable connector
03:33 PM Unterhaus__: is there a 7i92 firmware with swappable pins?
03:34 PM andypugh_: None of the firmwares support swapping pins, other than using unused function pins as GPIO.
03:36 PM Unterhaus__: I imagine he's not using the g540 firmware
03:36 PM Unterhaus__: leave it to gecko to swap pins from the parport standard
03:36 PM Unterhaus__: I assume that's why there is a specific firmware
03:38 PM Unterhaus__: of course, that's exactly the kind of thing I do when designing circuit boards
03:38 PM andypugh_: Well, the “standard” parallel port pinout is for drving a printer...
03:40 PM Unterhaus__: I trust PCW to use the most likely pinout
03:40 PM Unterhaus__: most people can just take their bob from a parport and hook it up to a 25 pin mesa board and have it work
03:41 PM Unterhaus__: Mario, not so much
03:41 PM andypugh_: Can’t the guy just flash the G540 firmware?
03:42 PM Unterhaus__: I told him to do that once I looked at the available firmware. he's worried that pathpilot will overwrite
03:42 PM andypugh_: Pretty sure thay Pathpilot can’t write firmware on 7i96
03:43 PM Unterhaus__: 7i92
03:43 PM andypugh_: Or that.
03:43 PM Unterhaus__: that's mostly a pci thing right?
03:44 PM andypugh_: Well, 5i20 7i43 era mainly.
03:44 PM Unterhaus__: i suppose they could exec a mesaflash command :)
03:46 PM andypugh_: And if they do? no harm done.
03:49 PM Unterhaus__: I doubt they would bother, it's just asking for problems
03:57 PM Unterhaus__: microcenter has lots of rpi4, for those who need one
04:03 PM Unterhaus__: well, the guy gave up and is going to build a breakout board
06:00 PM andypugh_: Unterhaus__: Could build a non-ribbon cable up with M20 connectors.
06:01 PM Unterhaus__: he says it pathpilot runs mesaflash every time. Seems like it must be configurable or you can just make it find the right firmware
06:01 PM Unterhaus__: I can't imagine he's the first to have this problem
06:01 PM andypugh_: I doubt that it does, that would wear out the eeprom.
06:02 PM andypugh_: And, it’s Linux, it will be in an editable script.
06:04 PM andypugh_: Anyway, I use these for Mesa card headers, lets you wire individual wires into boc headers. https://uk.rs-online.com/web/c/connectors/pcb-connectors-wire-housings/wire-housings-plugs/?searchTerm=M20&applied-dimensions=4294881960
06:04 PM andypugh_: (Pictures do not correlate to sizes…)
06:20 PM Tom_L: .1" spacing?
06:20 PM Tom_L: iirc molex makes those too
06:23 PM Tom_L: C-gric connectors
06:23 PM Tom_L: C-grid connectors
06:25 PM Tom_L: https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/wire-housings-plugs/3606229
06:35 PM JT-Shop: Tom_L, did you see the status changed to 3000?
06:35 PM Tom_L: nope
06:35 PM JT-Shop: called them at lunch to see if it changed
06:36 PM Tom_L: oh.. i had to stop and think
06:36 PM Tom_L: cool
06:36 PM JT-Shop: next biggie is 3300
06:39 PM JT-Shop: I brought the River Ridge winery owners son more tools today... a 4x36 belt 6 disk sander and a couple more tap handles
06:40 PM JT-Shop: he is a real talented gear head so I feel good sharing my tools with him
06:40 PM Tom_L: nice
06:41 PM JT-Shop: the sander just sat on the shelf, it was my dad's but when I got the 6x48 I never used it again
06:41 PM Tom_L: didn't he pass some on too? iirc
06:42 PM JT-Shop: no, I've been giving him tools that he doesn't have
06:42 PM Tom_L: ahh
06:42 PM JT-Shop: he just got his car back together after an engine rebuild
06:42 PM JT-Shop: he reminds me of a younger me
06:42 PM Tom_L: yeah, i've done a few of those
06:43 PM Tom_L: not in a while
06:44 PM JT-Shop: damn check engine light came back on on the way home... I try one more time to clean the secondary air injection check valve for bank 2 before taking off the intake and replacing it
06:45 PM Tom_L: i think you're doomed
06:45 PM JT-Shop: lol
06:46 PM Tom_L: imagine how many more sensors are on the C8
06:47 PM JT-Shop: I can't even imagine lol
06:48 PM JT-Shop: the c8 has so many settings it's mind boggling
06:51 PM Tom_L: you dl the manual already?
06:51 PM JT-Shop: been reading it every day
06:51 PM Tom_L: i even wonder if heim still publishes service manuals
06:51 PM JT-Shop: 400 pages
06:51 PM Tom_L: i have a set for the S10 i no longer have
06:51 PM JT-Shop: I used to get a shop manual with every new car/truck
06:52 PM Tom_L: you didn't used to need them for most things
06:52 PM JT-Shop: I have the GM shop manual for a S15
06:52 PM Tom_L: probably the same set
06:52 PM Tom_L: 3 book set
06:53 PM Tom_L: i wanted a colorado until they started getting too big
07:01 PM Tom_L: all they have is owners manuals now
07:01 PM Tom_L: https://www.helminc.com/helm/Result.asp?Style=helm&Mfg=GMC&Make=CHV&Model=CVET&Year=2023&Category=&Keyword=&Module=&selected%5Fmedia=
07:01 PM JT-Shop: they are free at chevrolet
07:02 PM Tom_L: nice
07:02 PM Tom_L: didn't used to be
07:02 PM JT-Shop: hmm the links were on the corvette forum
07:08 PM * JT-Shop calls it a day
07:20 PM Unterhaus__: service manuals are very generic nowadays, not worth the trees they are printed on
07:20 PM Unterhaus__: 3rd party ones anyway