#linuxcnc Logs
Dec 30 2022
#linuxcnc Calendar
01:20 AM Deejay: moin
01:29 AM pere: hi
01:53 AM solarwind: Ok every exacto knife holder ever feels cheap
01:53 AM solarwind: next project: solid stainless steel xacto blade holder
01:54 AM solarwind: With a beautiful matte/brushed finish on the handle, a soft knurled grip, precision threaded clamp screw
01:55 AM roycroft: if you're going to do that, don't make it for xacto blades
01:55 AM XXCoder: luxury car with cheapie wheels
01:56 AM roycroft: make it for surgical scalpel blades
01:56 AM roycroft: they're a lot sharper, a lot cheaper, and come in a wide variety of sizes
01:56 AM solarwind: roycroft excellent suggestion, thank you. I was not aware of that
01:56 AM XXCoder: yeah theres massive production because of all the hospitals
01:57 AM roycroft: i buy scalpel blades in boxes of 100 for next to nothing
01:57 AM roycroft: https://www.ebay.com/itm/165180777881
01:58 AM roycroft: random example
01:58 AM XXCoder: geez
01:58 AM XXCoder: I knew it was pretty cheap but 7 cent each cheap? dang
01:58 AM roycroft: https://www.ebay.com/itm/165179411583
01:58 AM roycroft: that is a really nice shape for marking wood
01:58 AM XXCoder: seems to come with handle too
01:58 AM roycroft: yeah
01:59 AM roycroft: and the handle works fine, as in it holds the blade firmly
01:59 AM roycroft: but it's not particularly comfortable to hold
01:59 AM XXCoder: well its nice to get one even if making handle
01:59 AM XXCoder: so you can get holding specs for blade
02:00 AM roycroft: https://mattestlea.com/product/bog-oak-marking-knife/
02:00 AM roycroft: i have one of those that i use most of the time these days
02:00 AM XXCoder: pretty strigghtforward.
02:01 AM roycroft: yeah
02:01 AM roycroft: that marking knife is really well made though
02:01 AM roycroft: the bog oak is hundreds of years old
02:01 AM roycroft: i got a bronze ferrule on mine
02:02 AM roycroft: i've had some really nice japanese marking knives for decades, and they used to be my go-to marking knives
02:02 AM roycroft: but they weren't all that comfortable, and i needed to sharpen them often
02:03 AM roycroft: what i really like about this one from matt estlea is that it's incredibly comfortable to hold and use, and it takes about 10 seconds to change the blade when it gets dull
02:03 AM roycroft: much faster than sharpening
02:03 AM roycroft: i'm not one for things disposable in general, but sometimes it's what makes sens
02:03 AM roycroft: e
02:05 AM roycroft: the only problem with matt's knives is that he only makes a batch every year or so, and they sell out instantly
02:05 AM XXCoder: yeah blades and such its beter to just be dospiable
02:05 AM roycroft: and his website crashes immediately when the go up for sale
02:05 AM roycroft: so it's a crap shoot whether you can order one or not
02:05 AM roycroft: i had to try three times before i finally got through
02:06 AM roycroft: as in three different offerings
02:06 AM roycroft: over the course of as many years
02:06 AM XXCoder: geez
02:10 AM sensille: wow, spindle/vfd are really electrically noisy. a running spindle messes up everything
02:11 AM sensille: i might have to put the vfd back into the case
02:11 AM XXCoder: yeah some emf shelding is good
02:12 AM sensille: but is also adds a fan. i was very glad to have gotten rid of it
02:18 AM sensille: oops. i did not connect earth to the vfd. maybe this already improves things
02:21 AM XXCoder: hope so
02:21 AM sensille: i don't think it was connected in the original case, though
02:24 AM sensille: this is really not the kind of problem i want to debug
02:54 AM travis_farmer[m]: G'Morning, couldn't sleep... worried i made the worst mistake of my life, dropping $2K on an ATC spindle...
02:57 AM XXCoder: it'll work fine. just you are in for more stuff than expected thats all
03:00 AM travis_farmer[m]: the problem is, my tax return was supposed to pay for whatever else was needed, but the refund, minus the spindle, minus the money i owed my father, leaves just short of nothing :-(
03:01 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
03:24 AM travis_farmer[m]: anyway, i tend to worry too much... i will make it work, somehow. i have tons of crap i could sell, but getting people to pay for stuff what it is worth, is tough.
03:25 AM c101horse[m]: here we go again, and not a great start, still got the same kernel for some reason
03:28 AM travis_farmer[m]: i haven't tried LCNC on a rpi, so i am not sure i would be of any help... well, correction, i loaded it onto an rpi, but never got it working, so that is why i don't think i would be of much help. i think Tom_L and JT are likely still sleeping.
03:34 AM serp6 is now known as serp
04:56 AM JT-Cave: morning
05:14 AM c101horse[m]: `koen@raspberrypi:~/source/linux $ make -j4 zImage.gz modules dtbs... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/2aa47602036c5cae6765af0e0c7e5ca4a0173fa3>)
05:14 AM c101horse[m]: guess its frustration time again
05:21 AM c101horse[m]: up until building and installing the kernel everything went without problem this time round
05:54 AM JT-Cave: booting up to a fresh install of 2022-09-22-raspios-bullseye-armhf-full.img.xz
05:54 AM JT-Cave: https://downloads.raspberrypi.org/raspios_full_armhf/images/raspios_full_armhf-2022-09-26/2022-09-22-raspios-bullseye-armhf-full.img.xz
05:56 AM TurBoss: c101horse🇳🇱: morning, you forgot to set this variables first... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/b673e4be0951b94d3e34b676328d84d4e5ef1a4f>)
05:57 AM TurBoss: https://www.raspberrypi.com/documentation/computers/linux_kernel.html#building-the-kernel-locally
05:58 AM JT-Cave: hmm that's in my instructions
05:59 AM JT-Cave: morning TurBoss
05:59 AM TurBoss: morning
06:00 AM JT-Cave: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/rpi4-11.html
06:01 AM JT-Cave: CONFIG_LOCALVERSION="-v7l-MY_CUSTOM_KERNEL that's not in my instruction thou
06:01 AM * travis_farmer[m] has finished off a plate full of X-Mas bacon, and now proceeds to continue research...
06:02 AM JT-Cave: ah that's in .config
06:02 AM TurBoss: yep can be set in make menuconfig
06:03 AM JT-Cave: ok, I'll look... I'm just starting from scratch to verify my instructions https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/rpi4-11.html
06:05 AM c101horse[m]: im just following the instructions from JT
06:33 AM Tom_L: morning
06:33 AM c101horse[m]: afternoon
06:47 AM JT-Cave: instructions updated... seems the 64bit uses make -j4 zImage.xz and the 32bit uses make -j4 zImage with no extension
06:54 AM * travis_farmer[m] considers that he may have to get a job, to pay for things he needs for his job...
06:59 AM * JT-Cave gets his coat so when the rooster crows he can open the chicken doors in the rain
08:12 AM * JT-Cave has finished verifying the rpi4 rt instructions and goes to start his chicken day
08:19 AM * travis_farmer[m] opts to watch a movie on YouTube, so as to avoid spending more money that he doesn't really have...
08:23 AM c101horse[m]: does that mean the installing lcnc bit is still good?
08:25 AM c101horse[m]: not that im at that point yet
08:27 AM c101horse[m]: and as i say that it finished
08:38 AM JT-Shop: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc-old/uspace/rpi4-emc.html may work, I'll check it in the morning
08:38 AM JT-Shop: so you have a rt kernel now?
08:55 AM c101horse[m]: everything went smoothly so i asume i do
08:58 AM c101horse[m]: i started going off of this one https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/debian-11-emc.html
08:58 AM roycroft: uname -a will tell you
08:59 AM c101horse[m]: the po4a deb link gets me a 404 tho
09:00 AM c101horse[m]: do i need a reboot somewhere along the line?
09:01 AM c101horse[m]: im currently getting this when i do uname -a Linux raspberrypi 5.15.76-v7l+ #1597 SMP Fri Nov 4 12:14:58 GMT 2022 armv7l GNU/Linux
09:01 AM c101horse[m]:
09:12 AM JT-Cave: did you reboot?
09:13 AM JT-Cave: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/rpi4-11.html refresh that page
09:16 AM c101horse[m]: not yet
09:16 AM c101horse[m]: will do in a sec
09:37 AM * JT-Shop heads out
09:57 AM c101horse[m]: i think i need help again, or atleast a step by step guide that is known to work
09:58 AM c101horse[m]: im looking at two tutorials and both look somewhat the same but i have no idea which one to go with
10:57 AM JT-Cave: what are you looking at?
11:03 AM sensille: https://photos.app.goo.gl/m32rSrAVtDWagq1S9 <-- probe input when the spindle is running
11:04 AM JT-Cave: pretty noisy
11:05 AM roguish[m]: JT-Cave: good morning. when I install an rt kernel, should i use a 'signed' version? also, should I get the associated header files? I don't want to compile anything, just run it....
11:06 AM zephyr9900: sensille what signal are you looking at?
11:06 AM sensille: the output of the 3d probe, viewed from the board
11:06 AM sensille: so it's a 1us spike with 1000Hz
11:08 AM zephyr9900: OK so probe wire is picking up a lot of noise from your VFD. The probe is just a switch contact and it is using 5V correct?
11:08 AM sensille: the gpio pins don't have a filter option
11:08 AM JT-Cave: roguish[m], what os?
11:09 AM zephyr9900: How is your scope ground connected?
11:09 AM sensille: zephyr9900: no, let me check the probe what is uses as an output circuit
11:09 AM roguish[m]: JT-Cave: right now I'm doing a VM with bullseye. I need to get probe screen working with axis.
11:10 AM JT-Cave: you don't use rt with vm... just use a sim
11:10 AM roguish[m]: just installed 5.10 rt. not too worried about any NIC problems, it's all going to be in sim
11:11 AM sensille: zephyr9900: but basically everything is picking up the spindle signal
11:11 AM roguish[m]: good point.... but what about on my mill system. do i need the header files for anything?
11:12 AM JT-Cave: I always install the headers for the kernel I'm using but forget why...
11:12 AM sensille: zephyr9900: yes, it is basically a switch with a 10k pullup
11:12 AM roguish[m]: JT-Cave: ok, thanks. I just take your lead. how are the chicks ?
11:12 AM sensille: i have another 3.3k pullup near the board
11:13 AM roguish[m]: gotta a cam link?
11:14 AM sensille: i could go for a much much smaller pullup
11:14 AM c101horse[m]: JT im looking at these two
11:14 AM c101horse[m]: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/debian-11-emc.html
11:14 AM c101horse[m]: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc-old/uspace/rpi4-emc.html
11:14 AM JT-Cave: one actually laid and egg today the rest in coop deux look pretty shabby with their molt going on
11:15 AM JT-Cave: I
11:15 AM * travis_farmer[m] settles in for a delightful boneless fried (baked) chicken TV dinner :-)
11:15 AM JT-Cave: I'd try the rpi4 one, when I get a chance I'll run through it and create a new page to match the rt one
11:15 AM roguish[m]: the prices of eggs out here are outrageous.
11:16 AM roguish[m]: average dozen is like $6
11:16 AM zephyr9900: sensille the VFD has 2 ground terminals. One on main terminal for earth PE and another one for the I/O common connection.
11:16 AM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (43KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/yLyyQPiPOkNqpucevWqKorIp/image.png >
11:16 AM c101horse[m]: this one has the po4a deb thing that lends me a 404
11:16 AM roguish[m]: I like the jumbo size, they're over $10 now
11:16 AM roycroft: i buy organic free range eggs
11:16 AM roycroft: they are $4.99/dozen
11:16 AM roycroft: factory eggs are about half that, i think
11:16 AM roycroft: i don't even pay attention
11:17 AM roguish[m]: roycroft: not here
11:17 AM travis_farmer[m]: roguish: pricey eggs... a lot of money for something that comes out of a chickens butt... ;-)
11:17 AM zephyr9900: sensille on my VFD I have the input power in a flexible metallic conduit that is connected to earth.
11:17 AM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (41KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/JSQviGJiNaFxIotVIsXhufYJ/image.png >
11:17 AM c101horse[m]: and this one has the debian 10 bit im unsure about
11:18 AM sensille: zephyr9900: what about the common i/o ground?
11:18 AM zephyr9900: sensille also the output wires are short and well separated from everything else
11:18 AM sensille: i don't have it connected
11:18 AM sensille: rs485 is just A/B atm
11:18 AM zephyr9900: I have the I/O common only connected to the RS485 adapter common
11:19 AM zephyr9900: I don't have too much noise even when running 7.5 kw VFD
11:20 AM sensille: the cable running to the spindle is not shielded
11:21 AM travis_farmer[m]: sensille: i just bought some of this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/144237870674
11:21 AM zephyr9900: I think the key is to keep the VFD input and output well separated from everything. My spindle motor wires are not shielded. but the motor frame needs to be well grounded
11:21 AM JT-Cave: c101horse[m], you have the rt kernel right?
11:21 AM c101horse[m]: yes
11:21 AM c101horse[m]: that worked
11:22 AM JT-Cave: that last image is part of building the rt kernel so nothing to do with getting linuxcnc
11:22 AM c101horse[m]: oooh ok
11:23 AM zephyr9900: sensille I have the VFD far from other electronics and good PE grounds.
11:23 AM sensille: about 1m away
11:24 AM zephyr9900: that seems reasonable
11:24 AM c101horse[m]: @JT where do i start now then now that i have the rt kernel?
11:24 AM JT-Cave: c1 for debian 11 on the rpi4 start at "From a terminal"
11:24 AM JT-Cave: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc-old/uspace/rpi4-emc.html
11:25 AM JT-Cave: buildbot doesn't have a prebuilt deb for debian 11 arm
11:25 AM c101horse[m]: but, that just gets me back at that edit debian/configure thing
11:26 AM c101horse[m]: im confuse
11:28 AM sensille: i could also just tell lcnc to ignore the probe inputs when the spindle is running
11:29 AM zephyr9900: sensille do you have a shielded cable for probe input?
11:30 AM sensille: i just connected the shield and it changes everything
11:30 AM JT-Cave: c101horse[m], you may be able to skip that step nano debian/configure
11:30 AM sensille: i definitely underestimated what the spindle does when i wired it up
11:31 AM zephyr9900: sensille good to hear that you are making progress.
11:31 AM c101horse[m]: so, the from terminal bit first, skip, skip, edit debian/control?
11:32 AM JT-Cave: yep
11:33 AM JT-Cave: I gotta get some chores done after that I'll test it
11:33 AM c101horse[m]: okay, how/where do i edit that?
11:33 AM JT-Cave: edit what?
11:34 AM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (8KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/TvGgXmIeLcpguTzMJNvnvzMx/image.png >
11:34 AM c101horse[m]: or do i skip that aswel?
11:34 AM JT-Cave: prob best to wait a bit for me to test
11:35 AM c101horse[m]: aight, will do
11:35 AM sensille: zephyr9900: well, the probe cable runs in parallel to the spindle cable for over 1m
11:36 AM sensille: so i really could have expected that
11:37 AM zephyr9900: that is not good. but if shielded you can probably do it.
11:39 AM sensille: but to be honest i also expected the spindle cable to be shielded. but i didn't check
11:40 AM zephyr9900: Well a lot of VFDs don't want you to use shielded cable especially if long because it put more stress on the power devices from switching higher capacitive loads.
11:40 AM zephyr9900: But 1m is pretty short and I don't think a shielded cable would be bad
11:42 AM sensille: makes sense. the cable is 2-3m all in all, running through the cable chain
11:43 AM zephyr9900: I think that is still short
11:47 AM zephyr9900: sensille Actually the Huanyang VFD manual says to use shielded cable for motor power with shield connected to motor frame at one end and PE at the other end. I would think that the PE should be near the the VFD since that it where the noise currents are trying to get back to.
11:48 AM zephyr9900: In my case the unshielded motor power is laying against the metal frame of the machine and is only 0.7 m long
11:55 AM sensille: still one spike when the spindle turn on and one horrific spike when it turns off
11:56 AM sensille: with the relay clicking. but it might also be the pump
11:56 AM zephyr9900: yes relays can make a lot of noise too!
11:57 AM Tom_L: put a diode across the relay
11:57 AM Tom_L: unless it's AC
11:57 AM sensille: yeah, that's the pump
11:57 AM sensille: AC
11:57 AM zephyr9900: sensille you can try grounding the probe cable shield at each end that may help. if not then leave only one end connected
11:58 AM sensille: i only connected the board side to avoid ground loops
11:58 AM zephyr9900: sensille but if you ground at both ends it should be PE ground
11:59 AM sensille: Tom_L: maybe a cap across the relay contacts
11:59 AM Tom_L: what are the contacts driving?
11:59 AM Tom_L: AC or DC?
12:00 PM sensille: AC, 230V to the pump
12:00 PM Tom_L: probably not a good idea
12:00 PM sensille: because you still have a small current flowing when turned off?
12:00 PM Tom_L: more an issue when it's on
12:01 PM Tom_L: hmm.. i dunno
12:01 PM sensille: when it's on it does nothing, it is shorted
12:01 PM Tom_L: i've never heard of that personally
12:02 PM travis_farmer[m]: maybe swap the AC 230V relay for a solid-state relay?
12:02 PM Tom_L: Diodes should NOT be used on AC relays. If volt spikes are a problem you may use a suitably rated varistor or a resistor and capacitor in series across coil to act as a "snubber".
12:02 PM Tom_L: i'd imagine that's for the coil..
12:03 PM * JT[m]1 uploaded an image: (258KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/ojrBYPBwdEqySIivIPlRzrvd/20221230_120139.jpg >
12:03 PM sensille: RC parallel to the contacts
12:03 PM travis_farmer[m]: i think he meant the relay load is AC 230V, not the coil, Tom_L, but i may be wron
12:03 PM travis_farmer[m]: wrong
12:03 PM Tom_L: both i believe
12:04 PM sensille: i guess the coil is DC, haven't opened th VFD
12:04 PM sensille: "RC snubber"
12:04 PM Tom_L: the contactor i put on the mains for my vfd was an ac coil
12:05 PM sensille: https://www.weschler.com/blog/relay-contact-protection
12:06 PM Tom_L: i wondered about that also
12:06 PM Tom_L: i've never had to do that
12:06 PM sensille: it triggers ESTOP when i turn off the spindle
12:07 PM Tom_L: maybe a MOV
12:08 PM sensille: now i need to decide which device to open and "borrow" a mov or snubber from
12:08 PM Tom_L: before MOVs were a thing they probably used the RC thing
12:09 PM zephyr9900: I wouldn't worry about the pump relay if it is rated for use with a motor.
12:09 PM sensille: i don't worry about the relay. i want to get rid of the spike
12:09 PM Tom_L: pull one from an old protected power strip
12:10 PM sensille: in theory a good idea :)
12:13 PM zephyr9900: sensille just to see if it works I think you should connect the probe shield to earth ground at each end. and make sure you have a good ground to the motor frame. I know people will say this is bad because of a ground loop, but if both ends are already well bonded to earth you can get away with it over a short distance. I know this is sometimes
12:13 PM zephyr9900: done in industry.
12:13 PM travis_farmer[m]: just got notification that both my new spindle and VFD have shipped :-) so in a little over a week (or more), my mental trauma and anguish will skyrocket... :-)
12:16 PM * Tom_L lines up a therapy session for travis_farmer[m]
12:16 PM sensille: travis_farmer[m]: i once bought a guiter for $2k. i totally crashed the next day. but now i'm very happy with it :)
12:16 PM travis_farmer[m]: lol, Tom_L
12:17 PM travis_farmer[m]: oh, i know i will be happy to get it, it is just going to cost more than expected to get it up and going
12:40 PM sensille: my improvised snubber help, but it's not perfect
12:42 PM Tom_L: does it still trip estop?
12:48 PM sensille: not in 10 tries
12:49 PM sensille: good enough for now and i'll order a proper mov
12:49 PM sensille: improvised :) https://i.imgur.com/6297tC2.jpg
12:50 PM Tom_L: yay
12:50 PM Tom_L: what size resistor?
12:51 PM sensille: 330R
12:57 PM sensille: and 6000mm/min feedrate is so much nicer than 1200mm/min :) for facing off wood, doing a dry run to see if it's stable
12:59 PM * roycroft offers travis_farmer a refreshing beverage, which can be as effective as, and lot more fun, than a therapy session
01:00 PM sensille: the X stepper is already at 56C though
01:00 PM roycroft: liquid nitrogen
01:01 PM sensille: when should i start to worry? 80C? 90C?
01:02 PM roycroft: well let it get up to at least 64, so you pasteurise any bugs that may be present
01:02 PM roycroft: then you can worry
01:02 PM sensille: ok, 4 to go
01:04 PM sensille: bugs, dress warmly
01:05 PM roycroft: the specs for your motor, if you have them, should tell you how hot it's safe to run it
01:06 PM sensille: temperature rise max 80c
01:06 PM roycroft: so it will be time to worry soon
01:06 PM roycroft: unless you slow it down
01:06 PM sensille: so 80c above room temp? 98c
01:07 PM roycroft: possibly
01:07 PM roycroft: to be safe i'd try to keep it at 80 or below
01:07 PM roycroft: unless you have some spare motors and want to see what it can do
01:08 PM roycroft: sometimes blowing things up to find out what it takes to blow them up is useful and fun
01:08 PM sensille: maybe tomorrow
01:09 PM sensille: 68c. i doubt it will reach 80
01:10 PM CaptHindsight[m]: sensille: which stepper drives are you using?
01:11 PM sensille: CL57T, the ones solarwind recommended
01:11 PM sensille: closed loop
01:14 PM CaptHindsight[m]: sensille: a matched set of motors and drives
01:14 PM CaptHindsight[m]: you haven't swapped the motors to something else?
01:16 PM sensille: no
01:16 PM sensille: the 2Nm set
01:17 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I haven't memorized the part numbers and the data sheets
01:18 PM CaptHindsight[m]: probably never will
01:18 PM sensille: https://www.omc-stepperonline.com/ts-series-2-0-nm-283-28oz-in-1-axis-closed-loop-stepper-cnc-kit-nema-23-motor-driver-w-2m-cable-1-cl57t-s20
01:18 PM sensille: so far i'm very happy with them
01:19 PM roycroft: at least your steppers are pasteurised now
01:19 PM roycroft: you may feel free to eat off of them when they are done doing their work
01:24 PM CaptHindsight[m]: yes, the specs are unclear, typical
01:25 PM CaptHindsight[m]: but the translation is good enough, you should just know
01:29 PM CaptHindsight[m]: 80 C is a typical max case temp for a stepper, which means 90-100C internal temp
01:36 PM JT-Cave: c101horse[m], I built a deb so it's easy for you, only 3 commands! https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/rpi4-11-emc.html
01:37 PM JT-Cave: hmm wait a moment
01:37 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.motiontech.com.au/supplier-products/aml-microelectronics/
01:38 PM JT-Cave: ok c101horse[m] typo fixed
01:39 PM c101horse[m]: https://tenor.com/view/vaniljpinne-lazyheroes-lazyverse-lazyvillains-gif-25501728
01:41 PM c101horse[m]: uhm
01:41 PM c101horse[m]: Cannot write to ‘linuxcnc-uspace_2.9.0.pre1_armhf.deb’ (No space left on device).
01:41 PM c101horse[m]: thats a dumb on my end im guessing
01:41 PM JT-Woodshop: delete the source directory
01:44 PM c101horse[m]: i cant move it to trash for some reason because its full i guess
01:44 PM c101horse[m]: source: Unable to create trash dir /home/koen/.local/share/Trash: No space left on device
01:44 PM c101horse[m]: well, crap
01:44 PM roycroft: you need to fix that :)
01:45 PM roycroft: don't delete the source from a gui
01:45 PM roycroft: use a shell
01:45 PM roycroft: rm -rf source
01:46 PM roycroft: wherever source lives and whatever it's named
01:46 PM c101horse[m]: do i type that in the terminal thingymajig?
01:46 PM JT-Woodshop: it's in ~/source
01:46 PM roycroft: yes, type it in a terminal window
01:46 PM roycroft: if you do it from the gui it will try to copy it to a trash folder, which you can empty later
01:46 PM roycroft: if you type rm -rf it will be deleted from the disk immediately
01:47 PM JT-Woodshop: roycroft, did you see the image of the bowl?
01:47 PM roycroft: but if you type rm -rf in the wrong place you get to start the whole process over
01:47 PM c101horse[m]: ah yes, now there's 2.2 gigs free, of the 14.something
01:47 PM roycroft: no
01:47 PM c101horse[m]: still a lot of space occupied
01:47 PM JT-Woodshop: can you scroll back to 12:02?
01:47 PM c101horse[m]: what else can i get rid of?
01:48 PM roycroft: my scroll buffer is about 30 lines long
01:48 PM JT-Woodshop: https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/matrix.org/ojrBYPBwdEqySIivIPlRzrvd/20221230_120139.jpg
01:48 PM JT-Woodshop: after you install linuxcnc you can delete the deb
01:49 PM roycroft: that's going to look cool when it's done
01:49 PM roycroft: the chevrons will get kind of bendy
01:50 PM xxcoder8265[m]: jt thats awesome
01:52 PM JT-Woodshop: that's what I'm hoping for, last layer glued on just now
01:59 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
02:00 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (2422KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/OniuXoMhwXseeDztpSxMBKNW/IMG_20221230_205908.jpg >
02:00 PM c101horse[m]: Well, lcnc is on the pi, turned the latency test on, and then this happend
02:01 PM JT-Woodshop: what does uname -a say?
02:05 PM c101horse[m]: Linux raspberrypi 5.15.84-rt53-v7l+ #1 SMP PREEMPT_RT Fri Dec 30 14:11:46 CET 2022 armv7l GNU/Linux
02:05 PM JT-Woodshop: hmm I wonder what my latency is... but Axis has been running for an hour
02:06 PM JT-Woodshop: that's the correct kernel
02:06 PM c101horse[m]: starts out fine i think at 62000 ish for the base thread
02:07 PM c101horse[m]: Now it even hangs up and stops doing anything at all
02:09 PM JT-Cave: well you don't want to check the base thread so in a terminal do latency-histogram --nobase
02:10 PM travis_farmer[m]: got tired, tried to take a nap, room was way too hot due to website servers... said to heck with it and made a cup of coffee :-)
02:11 PM JT-Cave: my rpi4 is doing about +-50us
02:12 PM travis_farmer[m]: "* roycroft offers travis_farmer a refreshing beverage" thanks roycroft, this cup of coffee is on you ;-)
02:13 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (2221KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/cKEFWHmUYiJgxkiRoSCgfcQV/IMG_20221230_211256.jpg >
02:13 PM c101horse[m]: Not looking great is it?
02:14 PM c101horse[m]: Is there a way to see how much ram the pi has?
02:16 PM CaptHindsight[m]: c101horse🇳🇱: not sure what is installed on the rpi but try: top in the command line
02:16 PM JT-Cave: c101horse[m], that's fine for a Mesa card
02:16 PM CaptHindsight[m]: top
02:17 PM sensille: c101horse[m]: cat /proc/meminfo
02:18 PM CaptHindsight[m]: sensille: where is that in the application menu?
02:19 PM sensille: CaptHindsight[m]: application menu? just a way to find out how much RAM is installed should top not be installed. does it not work?
02:19 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (1468KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/eSOIrCssPSGQttPymMJCayHK/IMG_20221230_211857.jpg >
02:19 PM c101horse[m]: The MiB is the ram im guessing?
02:20 PM travis_farmer[m]: looks around a 4GB?
02:21 PM c101horse[m]: Then they did send me the right one
02:22 PM c101horse[m]: And cheap
02:24 PM c101horse[m]: what vallue on that pic should i be looking at
02:27 PM CaptHindsight[m]: c101horse🇳🇱: MiB Mem ..... total
02:28 PM CaptHindsight[m]: sensille: yes, it is much easier when you know
02:47 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (1691KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/MOdiziNNCQvgWujKWeWmwTms/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_62a927b1-e718-402a-83de-b82aab734f84.jpg >
02:47 PM c101horse[m]: Is this still looking good enough for a mesa?
03:03 PM travis_farmer[m]: c101horse🇳🇱: i can't say as i have seen latency so high (my opinion, may be wrong). what are you doing to that poor Rpi? watching 5 porn videos at once? ;-)
03:03 PM c101horse[m]: streaming multiple 8k porn vids yea
03:04 PM travis_farmer[m]: LMAO
03:04 PM c101horse[m]: honestly, 4glx gears running
03:05 PM travis_farmer[m]: there seems to be a latency issue black-hole where you are... this latency issue has plagued about everything computer you have tried for LCNC... very strange...
03:06 PM JT-Shop: we might have to add isolcpus=1,2,3 idle=poll to the boot parameters... let me see what that does for mine
03:07 PM JT-Shop: and is the screen saver turned off?
03:07 PM xxcoder8265[m]: my favorite video for testing latency is 8k HD fireplace 24 hours video
03:07 PM xxcoder8265[m]: it keeps entire screen constantly changing
03:08 PM xxcoder8265[m]: probably not doable in rpi, that actually
03:08 PM * JT-Shop never watches videos on the mill...
03:08 PM xxcoder8265[m]: jt yeah its for latency tests
03:08 PM xxcoder8265[m]: but on rpi i barely could watch videos so yeah
03:09 PM travis_farmer[m]: i can't watch videos on my LCNC computer, but it seems to run Gcode...
03:10 PM Tom_L: if you had a haas would you watch videos on it?
03:10 PM travis_farmer[m]: i have "SERVO_PERIOD = 1100000"
03:10 PM travis_farmer[m]: maybe in between jobs, JT ;-)
03:11 PM travis_farmer[m]: sorry, Tom_L, i mean
03:12 PM Tom_L: i'm sure amongst all their pannel buttons they have one for 'yt videos'
03:13 PM travis_farmer[m]: lol
03:13 PM travis_farmer[m]: has the YT play button on it ;-)
03:14 PM joeyjoejoe[m]: I've got a 7i76e I'm looking to sell - taking a different direction for my CNC build. If anyone is interested let me know. (Only looking to recoup most of the costs, not scalping over msrp)
03:14 PM travis_farmer[m]: sorry it didn't work out for you joeyjoejoe
03:15 PM joeyjoejoe[m]: I grabbed it when they were impossible to get figuring a certain direction.. but I think it's more likely I will go Centroid (acorn).
03:15 PM joeyjoejoe[m]: The classic "do you want the tool or the project" dilemma.
03:16 PM c101horse[m]: havent seen a screensaver so far, screen just goes black
03:16 PM JT-Woodshop: joeyjoejoe[m], you might post that on the forum
03:16 PM travis_farmer[m]: hmmm, yeah, i have more of a project than a tool right now...
03:16 PM joeyjoejoe[m]: Yup, I did post it on the forum
03:16 PM travis_farmer[m]: screen blanking is a type of screensaver, c101horse🇳🇱
03:17 PM JT-Woodshop: should not last long :)
03:17 PM JT-Woodshop: wow you posted that on the 18th and you still have it?
03:17 PM joeyjoejoe[m]: Yup@
03:17 PM joeyjoejoe[m]: That one dude kind of vanished
03:18 PM joeyjoejoe[m]: Also I realized there's no PM's on the forum lol
03:18 PM JT-Woodshop: it's turned off
03:19 PM * travis_farmer[m] has PMs and live chat on his forum... :P
03:20 PM c101horse[m]: lets see how angry it gets when playing that
03:20 PM JT-Woodshop: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/27-driver-boards/46665-does-anyone-have-a-mesa-7i76e-for-sale?start=10#260573
03:21 PM xxcoder8265[m]: fuj
03:21 PM xxcoder8265[m]: *fun
03:22 PM JT-Woodshop: c101horse[m], what does cat /boot/cmdline.txt say
03:22 PM c101horse[m]: every damn pc, the pi is number 5 or 6 by now
03:22 PM roycroft: speaking of forums
03:23 PM c101horse[m]: where do i find that? terminal?
03:23 PM JT-Woodshop: yup
03:23 PM roycroft: i've discussed setting up some forum software for the fair's annual membership election, so members can ask questions of the various candidates, etc.
03:23 PM c101horse[m]: aight ill have a look
03:24 PM roycroft: we were talking about getting it set up and doing some beta testing this coming fall, and then officially deploying it the following year
03:24 PM travis_farmer[m]: roycroft: i use XenForo, though it is expensive every year
03:24 PM c101horse[m]: koen@raspberrypi:~ $ cat /boot/cmdline.txt
03:24 PM c101horse[m]: console=serial0,115200 console=tty1 root=PARTUUID=28b3b521-02 rootfstype=ext4 fsck.repair=yes rootwait quiet splash plymouth.ignore-serial-consoles
03:24 PM roycroft: with this recall petition having ben submitted, almost anything we do puts the organization at significant legal risk
03:24 PM roycroft: but hosting a forum is the least risky way we can get information to the members
03:25 PM roycroft: so i am scrambling to see if i can get something online in the next few days
03:25 PM roycroft: not two years, as it should take
03:25 PM JT-Woodshop: ok looks like mine, I'm going to try adding isolcpus in a bit
03:25 PM roycroft: i'm working with phpbb right now, travis_farmer
03:25 PM roycroft: it was pretty easy to install, and should get us through this current action, if i can get it configured the way i want quickly
03:25 PM JT-Woodshop: kunena is a pia
03:26 PM roycroft: the funny thing is, branding is the most important thing
03:26 PM travis_farmer[m]: XenForo is easy to configure, i think, but costs about $300+ per year
03:26 PM roycroft: in my mind, getting it functional is most important
03:26 PM roycroft: but i have to make the forum look as close to our website as possible or people will revolt
03:26 PM JT-Woodshop: lol
03:26 PM roycroft: so 80% of my energy will go into branding
03:26 PM roycroft: and 20% into making it functional
03:26 PM travis_farmer[m]: lol
03:27 PM roycroft: hippies are an odd lot to deal with
03:27 PM * JT-Woodshop wanders down to make some chicken crack
03:27 PM CaptHindsight[m]: roycroft: no negative waves man
03:27 PM roycroft: and i'm the odd hippie, for thinking i should focus on function over form
03:27 PM roycroft: don't get me wrong - branding is very important to me
03:28 PM roycroft: which is why it's taken me two years to get my logo for my woodworking businesses done
03:28 PM travis_farmer[m]: i run my forum, mostly like a blog, because for some reason nobody but russian hackers/spammers seem to join
03:28 PM roycroft: (that is almost done - i should have deliverables within days)
03:28 PM roycroft: i installed the software about 2 hours ago
03:29 PM roycroft: i'm actually rather surprised that the russian bots have not started hammering on it yet
03:29 PM roycroft: but the day is not over
03:29 PM travis_farmer[m]: want me to send them your way? ;-)
03:30 PM roycroft: no need
03:30 PM roycroft: they're pretty good at finding things themselves
03:30 PM JT-Cave: c101horse[m], I'm at +- 107 us now...
03:31 PM roycroft: the forum software is on a new hostname
03:31 PM roycroft: it's not just a folder in an existing website
03:31 PM c101horse[m]: https://tenor.com/view/nervous-sweating-sweating-bullets-sweating-gif-17507069
03:31 PM roycroft: but that won't slow them down for long
03:32 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (1733KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/EGJoWSTtKghlaXKhebvEVXYe/IMG_20221230_223132.jpg >
03:33 PM travis_farmer[m]: that sent the latency up, c101horse🇳🇱 lol
03:33 PM c101horse[m]: yup
03:33 PM c101horse[m]: fuck
03:35 PM CaptHindsight[m]: c101horse🇳🇱: have you made any changes to the firmware settings for power management and clock speeds on your rpi4?
03:36 PM c101horse[m]: no, i dont even know where to do that
03:36 PM CaptHindsight[m]: the rpi4 firmware is pretty crappy
03:36 PM CaptHindsight[m]: c101horse🇳🇱: I'll look for that long forum post on settings, brb
03:44 PM JT-Cave: it seems to help here down around 55 https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/rpi4-11-emc.html
03:45 PM * JT-Cave wanders back to the warm shop
03:45 PM roycroft: the year is almost over
03:45 PM roycroft: another hour and a few minutes of work and then i'm done for the year
03:46 PM travis_farmer[m]: lol, roycroft . don't work too hard on your last day this year. they may expect more next year ;-)
03:48 PM roycroft: i've taken two phone calls today from people who are distraught
03:48 PM roycroft: each of them desperately wanted to pay their bill and get their service restored
03:48 PM roycroft: i had no idea who either of them was, nor what they were talking about
03:48 PM CaptHindsight[m]: roycroft: cry for help line
03:48 PM roycroft: but i got their information and passsed it on to my boss, who is on vacation this week
03:49 PM roycroft: he's always available to accept payments, though
03:50 PM CaptHindsight[m]: roycroft: does your boss usually answer the phones and take payments manually?
03:50 PM travis_farmer[m]: my domain is a ".net", normally reserved for network service providers... when i first setup, i had a bunch of people from india (by the sound) that wanted to setup service... had me confused for days.
03:51 PM roycroft: i don't know, capthindsight
03:51 PM roycroft: i don't work at the office
03:51 PM roycroft: my phone only ever rings when nobody picks up at the office after five rings
03:52 PM roycroft: so i cannot comment on office behaviors, as i'm never there to observe them
03:52 PM travis_farmer[m]: now i just get calls from people that want to do my website for me...
03:52 PM CaptHindsight[m]: travis_farmer: do get emails to rework your website as well?
03:52 PM roycroft: i still get calls from "microsoft" about fixing my "windows" regularly
03:53 PM travis_farmer[m]: CaptHindsight: yes
03:53 PM roycroft: do they mean this version of windows:
03:53 PM roycroft: Darwin Kernel Version 20.6.0: Wed Jan 12 22:22:42 PST 2022; root:xnu-7195.141.19~2/RELEASE_X86_64
03:54 PM roycroft: or this version
03:54 PM CaptHindsight[m]: travis_farmer: they must scan sites as well looking for errors or broken links, I had a site with intentional errors and when I fixed them the emails stopped offereing
03:54 PM roycroft: #1 SMP Debian 5.10.106-1 (2022-03-17)
03:54 PM travis_farmer[m]: CaptHindsight: Hmmm... interesting
03:54 PM roycroft: i'm really not sure which version my friends from "houston" are talking about
03:55 PM CaptHindsight[m]: travis_farmer: or might have been coincidence
03:55 PM travis_farmer[m]: could be
03:55 PM roycroft: i actually have the branding at least resembling the main site now
03:55 PM travis_farmer[m]: i use a template for my face page, and XenForo for the rest
03:56 PM CaptHindsight[m]: but when on for months, 2-3 emails a day offering to fix the website
03:56 PM travis_farmer[m]: and calls to both my cell phone, and "company" line
03:56 PM roycroft: the next big hurdle is getting it to relay outbound emails through google
03:56 PM roycroft: who are the mail provider for the organization
03:57 PM roycroft: the rest of the configuration should be easy after that
03:57 PM CaptHindsight[m]: travis_farmer: now it's more SEO offers
03:58 PM c101horse[m]: okay done, turned the latency test back on and turned the burning log yt vid on
03:58 PM JT-Woodshop: gmail is almost impossible any more
03:58 PM JT-Woodshop: I would not watch the video on the rpi
03:59 PM travis_farmer[m]: i host my own email, plus i have gmail... ;-)
03:59 PM CaptHindsight[m]: gmail to gmail works pretty well
04:01 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (2537KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/UjcEGwDZuwuiWMyTjnedPlgJ/IMG_20221230_230022.jpg >
04:01 PM c101horse[m]: Not as unhappy as before
04:01 PM roycroft: gmail is annoying as hell
04:01 PM roycroft: i'm considering relaying outbound mail through my own mail server
04:01 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I used to watch youtubes in FF on the Rpi4 and latency was around 120uS max
04:01 PM travis_farmer[m]: my domain is a noip.com domain, so my outgoing emails are usually blocked by most people's email service
04:03 PM CaptHindsight[m]: c101horse🇳🇱: I'm sorry i haven't read all your backlog but are you using the Rpi4 LinuxCNC image right now and/or did you make any kernel changes from the original install?
04:03 PM c101horse[m]: i've done what JT told me to do
04:03 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I'm sorry, I didn't see what he told you
04:04 PM CaptHindsight[m]: was it to change to a different kernel?
04:04 PM JT-Woodshop: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/rpi4-11.html
04:04 PM JT-Woodshop: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/rpi4-11-emc.html
04:04 PM c101horse[m]: to be honest i have no idea what he made me do, all i know its working, kinda
04:07 PM CaptHindsight[m]: JT-Woodshop: is that is what is supposed to work now with the Rpi4 with some caveats such as no FF no youtubes played and similar?
04:07 PM JT-Woodshop: yep no youtubes
04:08 PM JT-Woodshop: I was around 50 a while ago but haven't checked in a while
04:08 PM JT-Woodshop: FF?
04:09 PM travis_farmer[m]: i wonder if proper cooling of the Rpi CPU makes a difference on latency
04:09 PM CaptHindsight[m]: travis_farmer: yes, and firmware settings
04:09 PM CaptHindsight[m]: the firmware sucks
04:09 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (1506KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/iwDYusDUScfWFrkdzPyflUoY/IMG_20221230_230915.jpg >
04:09 PM JT-Woodshop: they fixed the cooling issue a long time ago
04:09 PM c101horse[m]: Sigh
04:10 PM CaptHindsight[m]: you have to have speed stepping OFF and it will still speed step IF it gets too warm
04:10 PM JT-Woodshop: cpu speed?
04:10 PM JT-Woodshop: I have a fan on mine
04:10 PM travis_farmer[m]: what does c101horse🇳🇱 have on his Rpi for cooling? i wonder?
04:11 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (556KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/HrllBcYeRgZgQENOufYYaWMF/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_fd8ab4ef-b5a6-4d75-be72-a378b3392c9c.jpg >
04:11 PM CaptHindsight[m]: two years ago: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/18-computer/36879-raspberry-pi-4?start=440#183157
04:11 PM travis_farmer[m]: ok, that should do
04:12 PM JT-Woodshop: Yes, on Raspberry Pi OS:
04:12 PM JT-Woodshop: For example, in /boot/config.txt
04:12 PM JT-Woodshop: Code: Select all
04:12 PM JT-Woodshop: arm_freq=1000
04:12 PM JT-Woodshop: arm_freq_min=1000
04:12 PM CaptHindsight[m]: also "Somebody also mentioned that force_turbo=1 does not actually keep the cores at max frequency when the core gets warmer. So it might still speed step/throttle cpu core speed even though we are asking for max speed at all times. Keeping the max core speed lower might keep it from throttling even though we told the cpu not to. "
04:13 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Overclocked to 2.1Ghz, isolcpus=1,2,3, idle=poll
04:13 PM CaptHindsight[m]: With video playback latency jumps to 102,000nS after a few seconds. Video is choppy.
04:13 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Turned off GPU accel and video4linux and with a 100,000nS servo thread latency is <25,000nS after several hours, but without playing a video.
04:13 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Kernel 4.19.71, the one that comes with the Rpi4 2.8 img on the LCNC website.
04:14 PM CaptHindsight[m]: isolcpus=1,2,3, idle=poll has lower latency than isolcpus=3, idle=poll... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/6c5e2f8707b5f76884368949b016fd404c9d088a>)
04:16 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/18-computer/36879-raspberry-pi-4?start=470#195750
04:17 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
04:20 PM JT-Woodshop: yeah I read his post
04:23 PM JT-Woodshop: #uncomment to overclock the arm. 700 MHz is the default.
04:23 PM JT-Woodshop: #arm_freq=800
04:23 PM JT-Woodshop: interesting in /boot/config.txt
04:24 PM JT-Woodshop: [pi4]
04:24 PM JT-Woodshop: # Run as fast as firmware / board allows
04:24 PM JT-Woodshop: arm_boost=1
04:24 PM CaptHindsight[m]: JT-Woodshop: yeah there were opposing features in their firmware with no clear explanation of which has priority
04:24 PM CaptHindsight[m]: we just tried things at the time
04:24 PM JT-Woodshop: sounds like most linux os's lol
04:25 PM JT-Woodshop: I'll try editing config.txt next
04:25 PM JT-Woodshop: just to see what I can get
04:25 PM CaptHindsight[m]: but they will never share specs so there can be a proper u-boot or similar open source firmware written for them
04:25 PM XXCoder: is orange one more open or same?
04:26 PM CaptHindsight[m]: JT-Woodshop: ok, see you in a few hours :)
04:26 PM CaptHindsight[m]: XXCoder: opis use u-boot!
04:26 PM XXCoder: interesting
04:26 PM CaptHindsight[m]: so you get mostly open
04:26 PM CaptHindsight[m]: it depends on the ARM SOC
04:26 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Allwinner violates GPL all the time
04:27 PM JT-Woodshop: CaptHindsight[m], I'm close to calling it a day lol
04:27 PM CaptHindsight[m]: mixes their blobs with open
04:28 PM CaptHindsight[m]: XXCoder: Opi5 should be u-boot, i have to check again
04:28 PM CaptHindsight[m]: the new Opi5 with rk3588
04:28 PM XXCoder: we really need more open source chipset factories
04:29 PM XXCoder: but its so expensive just to start
04:29 PM roycroft: we need more chip factories in this country, period
04:29 PM XXCoder: yup
04:29 PM roycroft: we need to keep tik tok out of our nuclear wessels
04:32 PM * JT-Woodshop relaxes watching chicken tv
04:33 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (2869KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/zNGtyAzFffMRejjuZfMvcjAZ/IMG_20221230_233229.jpg >
04:33 PM JT-Woodshop: that's usable for sure
04:38 PM JT-Woodshop: http://buildbot2.highlab.com/
04:38 PM JT-Woodshop: seb is moving along with buildbot2
04:39 PM CaptHindsight[m]: by using isolcpus=1,2,3 you sacrifice 3 cores for real time and lose lots of non-real time processing, if you change isolcpus=3 you'll have more latency jitter but i forget how much
04:39 PM JT-Woodshop: roguish[m], how did you find seb's secrete buildbot2?
04:43 PM solarwind: sensille I wouldn't worry about the temperature. That driver is matched to those motors. Its max current is not much above the rated current for those steppers
04:44 PM roycroft: an hour plus later, and gmail will still not let me submit emails from phpbb
04:44 PM solarwind: If you're worried, a small 40mm CPU fan on the steppers will cool them down to room temperature.
04:44 PM roycroft: 7.9 seconds after giving up on gmail, phpbb is submitting emails through my mail server just fine
04:45 PM JT-Woodshop: I told you gmail is a pia
04:47 PM JT-Woodshop: For What it's Worth...
04:47 PM roycroft: it really is
04:47 PM JT-Woodshop: Bufflo Springfield
04:47 PM roycroft: i don't know why anybody uses google services for anything
04:48 PM roycroft: all they want to do is take your money, steal your data, and deny you the ability to do what you need to do
04:48 PM JT-Woodshop: they suck
04:48 PM JT-Woodshop: google == they
04:48 PM roycroft: i just don't want our members seeing that emails are flowing through my mail server
04:48 PM JT-Woodshop: I'll start turning the bowl tomorrow
04:49 PM roycroft: which is why i spent a bunch of time trying to get gmail to work
04:49 PM JT-Woodshop: why?
04:49 PM roycroft: because they're a bunch of paranoid know-it-alls who know nothing
04:49 PM JT-Woodshop: LOL that makes sense
04:49 PM roycroft: they will think that i'm secretly altering or censoring their mails
04:50 PM roycroft: i'd rather they think that google are doing that
04:50 PM JT-Woodshop: that's crazy but I believe it
04:50 PM roycroft: we have customers who still believe to this day that the way we filter spam is to have a human read every message as it comes in and decide whether it's spam or not
04:51 PM roycroft: like yeah, i have enough staff to read 150k+ email messages/day
04:52 PM unterhaus: For years, penn state had a home grown spam filter. I swear it would have been better just to not filter
04:52 PM roycroft: we have customers who complain that their email does not work
04:52 PM roycroft: and they'll say "well i changed my password on my computer. i'm sure you saw that - why didn't you change it on your server?"
04:53 PM roycroft: we use proofpoint these days
04:53 PM roycroft: i like doing things in-house as much as possible
04:53 PM JT-Woodshop: Eminence Front
04:53 PM roycroft: but proofpoint, 98% of all inbound emails never reach our mail servers
04:53 PM roycroft: with proofpoint, rather
04:53 PM roycroft: in this case, a cloud-based filter service is very beneficial
05:03 PM JT-Cave: hmm the rpi4 is holding at +-56us so that's pretty good...
05:07 PM * roycroft is finished with work for the year, and only has 30 hours or so of work for the fair to finish for the year
05:08 PM * JT-Cave tucks the hens in and reads them a bed time story
05:09 PM roycroft: yeah, it is bed time for chickens back east
05:09 PM roycroft: our chickens got an extra 41 seconds of daylight today!
05:12 PM JT-Cave: what to do with all that extra daylight
05:13 PM XXCoder: solar panels
05:13 PM roycroft: stay up late and partay, of course
05:14 PM JT-Cave: c1
05:15 PM JT-Cave: c101horse[m], editing /boot/config.txt and latency out of the gate is < 20us
05:15 PM JT-Cave: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/rpi4-11-emc.html
05:18 PM JT-Cave: I'll let the latency-histogram run all night then install Tom_L armf mesact deb and test with a Mesa Ethernet card
05:19 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (968KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/kUQmHmFvnqHUajDCZIXizAzI/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_4c40773c-ca43-4cea-b3a6-948dd3442ccc.jpg >
05:19 PM c101horse[m]: Like that?
05:19 PM JT-Cave: yup
05:20 PM JT-Cave: I did comment out a couple of things like camera
05:20 PM JT-Cave: #dtparam=audio=on
05:21 PM JT-Cave: #camera_auto_detect=1
05:23 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (2102KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/LxuNThOywjyrGdiYMwWabfEG/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_8a9dafda-6ee2-41d5-bf0c-53f28402b012.jpg >
05:24 PM c101horse[m]: that looks to have had an adverse effect
05:24 PM JT-Cave: odd, did you reboot?
05:24 PM c101horse[m]: yes
05:24 PM JT-Cave: mine is still at < 19us
05:24 PM c101horse[m]: ill go dig for the other things you commented out, maybe that makes a difference if i do the same
05:25 PM JT-Cave: that is totally usable but when you can make it better...
05:25 PM JT-Cave: I updated the webpage
05:26 PM JT-Cave: I'm not running any glxgears...
05:27 PM JT-Cave: cnc is not about video lol
05:30 PM JT-Cave: do you have to manually upload to debian when you make changes?
05:30 PM c101horse[m]: what do you mean when making changes?
05:31 PM JT-Cave: sorry wrong channel
05:31 PM c101horse[m]: also i commented out the things you commented out, that looks like it helped
05:31 PM JT-Cave: interesting
05:31 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (2514KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/jQlnRHTiEUdmgUZAPoiqXjDw/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_b0f8644a-c847-402d-aa28-ed880e5f0994.jpg >
05:31 PM c101horse[m]: Started at like 15
05:32 PM JT-Cave: wow there you go
05:32 PM c101horse[m]: now im curious which one of the uncommented things did it
05:33 PM JT-Cave: and your running glxgears!
05:33 PM JT-Cave: you test, I'm tired
05:33 PM JT-Cave: lol
05:33 PM JT-Cave: my guess is audio
05:33 PM JT-Cave: I'm still < 20us
05:34 PM c101horse[m]: turned the audio back on, rebooting now
05:34 PM JT-Cave: k
05:36 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (2378KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/rdmAAAooTawqhGFGYMqRFcHD/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_060daebc-7f98-48d8-a736-3f77205a0cea.jpg >
05:36 PM c101horse[m]: Audio puts it up to 44 from the bat without gears
05:36 PM JT-Cave: interesting, somewhat what I expected
05:37 PM JT-Cave: if you're not playing rock and roll on the machine leave it off\
05:38 PM JT-Cave: say goodnight Gracie
05:39 PM c101horse[m]: Aaahw damn
05:40 PM * c101horse[m] uploaded an image: (2326KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/jauriarts.org/YERaXQwJCPkSLCMqPvLbCyIq/rn_image_picker_lib_temp_aafea6fb-57cc-4818-892d-b0b563630437.jpg >
05:40 PM c101horse[m]: Camera auto detect started at 6, jumped to 15 without gears, with 4 gears running stayed at 20.5 for a bit them jumped to this
05:42 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
05:44 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
05:55 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
07:34 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
07:47 PM _unreal_: any suggestions on the best 3d printer?
07:47 PM _unreal_: filiment
08:02 PM roycroft: i've always been happy with atomic filament
08:02 PM _unreal_: I'm talking about 3d printers
08:02 PM roycroft: i've had mixed results at best with anything else
08:02 PM _unreal_: I dont want to build one currently.
08:02 PM roycroft: oh, you said filament after
08:03 PM _unreal_: I'm looking at the $200 range
08:03 PM roycroft: i thought you were qualifying the first line
08:03 PM _unreal_: I said filiment as in to suggest what TYPE of 3d printer
08:03 PM roycroft: if you can look at $300 i'd go for an ender 5
08:03 PM roycroft: or maybe an ender 3, for a little less
08:03 PM _unreal_: dont have the money currently
08:03 PM roycroft: they work decently, and are pretty turnkey
08:03 PM roycroft: and take about an hour to assemble and put online
08:03 PM _unreal_: I have a lot of money locked up in this stock market fraud
08:04 PM _unreal_: I should have made a massive amount of money and now I'm locked up with about 100k people
08:04 PM roycroft: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07BR3F9N6
08:04 PM roycroft: there you go
08:04 PM _unreal_: twitter #finrafraud #mmtlp
08:05 PM roycroft: $186, with free shipping
08:05 PM _unreal_: I'm looking at that one and the v2 version thats $230 range
08:05 PM _unreal_: I dont know the difference between them yet. have not really done any research yet
08:06 PM roycroft: the v2 has an auto bed levelling probe, and the silent main board
08:06 PM roycroft: both of which you can add to the v1
08:06 PM _unreal_: auto bed leveling..... that is a positive
08:06 PM _unreal_: not interested in doing moding currently
08:07 PM roycroft: i don't have an ender 3, but i do have an ender 5, and i don't have an auto bed leveler
08:07 PM _unreal_: I just want to escape this @#@#$ house. just so pissed off. I should have made so much money on this play and finally been able to escape.
08:07 PM roycroft: i've pushed over $2k worth of filament through it in the past couple years, and i've rarely had to adjust the bed
08:08 PM roycroft: the silent main board would be nice, though, if the machine will be in a room that is occupied regularly
08:08 PM _unreal_: will be
08:08 PM roycroft: then stretch your budget and get the v2 if you possibly can
08:08 PM _unreal_: :/ My current printer is fine just the work bed is too damn small
08:09 PM roycroft: oh, the v2 has a glass build plate
08:10 PM roycroft: that's definitely a feature
08:10 PM roycroft: i do not by any means consider myself a 3d printer expert, but based on what experience i do have, i would recommend the ender 3 v2
08:16 PM Loetmichel: Yeah, Ender3 is my recommendation for "newbie", too. IMHO the least pricey FDM model that works out of the box and doesent need much fine tuning
08:20 PM _unreal_: I'm hardly a newbie its just money crunch issues.
08:24 PM roycroft: "newbie" entails turnkey as well as skill level
08:25 PM roycroft: if it's a money crunch thing then turnkey is a definite advantage
08:25 PM roycroft: you open the box, set it up, and start printing
08:25 PM roycroft: vs. futzing around with something and buying parts for it right away
09:43 PM Thorhian[m]: Prusa printers are more of the turnkey printer for noobs who just want it to work IMO.
09:43 PM roycroft: prusa are a lot more expensive
09:43 PM roycroft: as in 2x or more than the entry level enders
09:43 PM roycroft: _unreal_ is working with a budget
09:43 PM Thorhian[m]: Yes, but there is a reason for that. If all you can afford is an ender 3 then you will have to just deal with it.
09:43 PM Thorhian[m]: Like me :D
09:43 PM roycroft: i bought an ender 5, having never used a 3d printer before
09:45 PM XXCoder1: 2013 or so?
09:46 PM Thorhian[m]: I got it at the beginning of 2014, but yeah, that’s around when that model came out.
09:47 PM XXCoder1: yeah figured from some stuff like no e3d hotend
09:47 PM XXCoder1: no extrusions too
09:48 PM Thorhian[m]: Ubis hotend. Printrbot. I hear they might come back. The business owner ditched California apparently.
09:49 PM Thorhian[m]: I was sad when I heard Brook was closing shop. I didn’t live too far away from them back then.
09:50 PM Thorhian[m]: Looks like we both left California.
10:01 PM roycroft: i have left california many times
10:01 PM roycroft: but i've never been from there
10:01 PM roycroft: it's a good place to visit, and a good place to leave
10:05 PM roycroft: babwa wawa has left the building
10:55 PM Bleep-CNC: Re-installed the whole shebang and I get the same results. Barfs if I try from the console and runs jut fine via ssh. Even using ssh from teh local co0nsole to login to a remote machine and then ssh back it runs.
10:56 PM Bleep-CNC: But straight from the console I ge the same error in the same place as before the re-intall.
10:57 PM Bleep-CNC: Oh Great Gurus I beseach thee, Take pity on my clueless ass... LOL
11:01 PM XXCoder1: lol honestly no idea why remote works
11:02 PM roycroft: a host is a host, from coast to coast
11:02 PM roycroft: and noone will talk to a host that's close
11:02 PM roycroft: unless the host that isn't close
11:02 PM roycroft: is busy, hung, or dead
11:09 PM pere: Bleepshop: any difference in output from 'env' when it work and not work?
11:35 PM Bleepshop: pere: I can't even get it to stay connected ot the network this time. Nuked and rebuilding.
11:47 PM * Bleepshop frequently gets annoyed and nukes machines with a re-install iso.
11:52 PM pere: :)