#linuxcnc Logs

Sep 06 2022

#linuxcnc Calendar

12:44 AM CaptHindsight[m]: with CH382 PCIe LPT on 2.8 and RTAI the stepgen is outputting steps that I can see in halscope, but the motors aren't moving, will have to verify with an actual scope on the LPT pins
12:54 AM XXCoder: not enough current or what
12:55 AM CaptHindsight[m]: will find out soon enough
12:55 AM CaptHindsight[m]: Rab said it works on his system
12:56 AM CaptHindsight[m]: I can't reproduce it here yet
12:56 AM CaptHindsight[m]: will try LCNC 2.8 with preempt_rt next
12:57 AM CaptHindsight[m]: XXCoder: I'm using a buffered LPT BOB
12:57 AM CaptHindsight[m]: so it's not a driver current issue
12:57 AM XXCoder: ok but is enable line... well enabled
12:57 AM XXCoder: or connected
12:57 AM CaptHindsight[m]: yup
12:57 AM XXCoder: ok
12:58 AM CaptHindsight[m]: to the stepper driver, sure
12:58 AM CaptHindsight[m]: i can swap PC's with the cable and step like a madman
12:58 AM CaptHindsight[m]: enable is hardwired in the drive to always on
12:59 AM XXCoder: ok
12:59 AM XXCoder: well out of ideas
01:12 AM CaptHindsight[m]: 🖐️
01:12 AM XXCoder: high five!
01:12 AM XXCoder: ;) later
01:14 AM CaptHindsight[m]: nothing like the fun of installing at 1 am
01:23 AM CaptHindsight[m]: the live iso works!
01:23 AM XXCoder: :)
01:23 AM CaptHindsight[m]: the encoder signals make it to the GUI in LCNC 2.8 with preempt_rt and no signal 8 core dump
01:23 AM CaptHindsight[m]: so it's some RTAI issue with the encoder signals making it to the GUI
01:24 AM CaptHindsight[m]: BUT the ch385 step pulses are seen in halscope but no pulses make it to the stepper driver :(
01:24 AM CaptHindsight[m]: ch385/ch382
01:24 AM CaptHindsight[m]: so gettin closer
01:31 AM randy: morning
01:33 AM CaptHindsight[m]: Have I ever mentioned how I dislike software?
01:41 AM CaptHindsight[m]: it's like a ghost town outside this morning
01:42 AM XXCoder: good thing internet exists
01:42 AM XXCoder: or you'd think world ended and you missed it
01:42 AM XXCoder: ;)
01:43 AM CaptHindsight[m]: even last night around here was really quiet
01:44 AM CaptHindsight[m]: for some reason people around here like to be outside at night when it is: HOT, humid and lots of bugs
01:45 AM CaptHindsight[m]: when it's cool (60's F) with a breeze, low humidity and low on insects they all hide out somewhere
01:45 AM CaptHindsight[m]: what i call perfect weather
01:47 AM XXCoder: dunno
01:49 AM CaptHindsight[m]: if it weren't for the wild beats and police farce I'd sleep outside tonight
01:49 AM CaptHindsight[m]: beats/beasts
01:49 AM XXCoder: https://youtu.be/9IIbbFIQTKI
01:50 AM CaptHindsight[m]: XXCoder: was there any way to merge the two LCNC discord servers?
01:50 AM XXCoder: random google result
01:50 AM XXCoder: so far I know of, nope
01:50 AM XXCoder: no such thing
01:50 AM CaptHindsight[m]: reminds me of Run Lola Run
01:51 AM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWb1XVcN3iY
01:51 AM XXCoder: ow my brain and eyes
01:51 AM XXCoder: its way too fast on switching shots lol
01:52 AM CaptHindsight[m]: the trailer, sorry
01:52 AM CaptHindsight[m]: are you familiar?
01:52 AM CaptHindsight[m]: you might like the film
01:52 AM XXCoder: nah not familiar woith any music
01:53 AM XXCoder: oh its a movie apparently
01:53 AM CaptHindsight[m]: it's a movie, mostly visual
01:53 AM XXCoder: mh not really my favorite type movie
01:54 AM CaptHindsight[m]: yeah follows the same plot but with 3 or 4 variations
01:55 AM XXCoder: lol ok
01:59 AM CaptHindsight[m]: what is the user password for the live iso?
01:59 AM CaptHindsight[m]: screen saver kicked in
02:00 AM XXCoder: try nothing
02:00 AM XXCoder: just move mouse
02:07 AM CaptHindsight[m]: nope
02:07 AM CaptHindsight[m]: it's live
02:07 AM CaptHindsight[m]: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/38-general-linuxcnc-questions/32245-password-livecd-debian
02:07 AM CaptHindsight[m]: why is the screensaver even on by default?
02:07 AM CaptHindsight[m]: what is this power management obsession?
04:35 AM Tom_L: morning
05:08 AM JT-Cave: morning
06:54 AM perry_j1987: morning
06:55 AM perry_j1987: was running my gang lathe all fine all day and then randomly it did a move and snapped my reamer off lol
06:55 AM perry_j1987: ended my day short
07:23 AM JT-Cave: clearly I'm missing a crucial piece of the puzzle for using the Creality filament runout sensor
10:36 AM jdh: Isn't it just a cheesy through-beam?
10:37 AM JT-Cave: prob, but I think I found a conf error I had enabled #define FILAMENT_RUNOUT_DISTANCE_MM and that's for encoder types
10:38 AM jdh: Looks like they use a mech micro switch instead
10:38 AM JT-Cave: M119 correctly shows the filament runout state
10:43 AM * JT-Cave heads tov work
10:51 AM roguish[m]: well, got an updated forecast for today............. now today's forecast here is.............wait for it.............................. 119.............................no shit.
10:51 AM * roguish[m] uploaded an image: (159KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/dFZAkhEDoqXTbqkVlDWQZiPj/image.png >
10:59 AM roguish[m]: JT-Cave: which creality do you have?
12:46 PM CaptHindsight[m]: the Live ISO's still come in handy for debugging systems \0/
01:39 PM perry_j1987: hows it going today guys
01:50 PM perry_j1987: +1 when you find a spare tool in the shop you forgot you had bought
01:50 PM perry_j1987: now i dont have to wait till thursday to keep goin heh
02:07 PM XXCoder: fun video https://youtu.be/qFXWjv65JWg
02:08 PM XXCoder: engineering video. on corrision and metals to slow down it
02:12 PM JT-MachineShop: roguish[m], I have the Ender 3 but it's upgraded to the 4.2.7 main board, dual Z, CR Touch, filament runout, and HD springs
02:15 PM JT-MachineShop: dunno maybe roguish[m] melted...
02:29 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
03:16 PM roycroft: so the gst3d saga continues
03:16 PM roycroft: my original bulk purchase from them - the defective product - came to $139
03:16 PM roycroft: the second bulk order - the one they cancelled - was $119
03:17 PM roycroft: they disputed both my chargebacks, claiming that they delivered both orders
03:17 PM roycroft: now they are claiming that i underpaid them $20 on the second order, and are charging me that $20
03:18 PM XXCoder: jeez
03:20 PM roycroft: i was thinking they were jerks all along
03:20 PM roycroft: now i'm leaning towards incompetent morons
03:24 PM Tom_L: seem competent if they're gettting your money
03:25 PM JT-Shop: programming this P1AM-100 is getting interesting...
03:25 PM JT-Shop: now if I can finger out the filament runout thingy
03:26 PM roycroft: i think that since they are demanding more that is not going to go well for their case
03:27 PM XXCoder: hope so
04:06 PM CaptHindsight[m]: weird stuff on the LPT ports, on some I can only get inputs but not outputs going
04:06 PM CaptHindsight[m]: have to look at how LCNC gets LPT port address and types from the kernel
04:08 PM CaptHindsight[m]: some LPT input signals make it into LCNC HAL: but don't make it to the GUI
04:10 PM XXCoder: capt some pins dp jabe definite direction limition, and some parallel cards have more limitions. thats why theres suggestions on more advanced models that have less limitions but its been so long
04:11 PM XXCoder: I had bought parallel card specifically suggested due to this. its still in my old linuxcnc pc
04:11 PM CaptHindsight[m]: XXCoder: nope, the same card that works fine with older LCNC and kernels has issues with newer versions
04:12 PM XXCoder: oh really that is indeed odd
04:12 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I know I wrote many of the LPT howtos :)
04:12 PM XXCoder: lol ok
04:12 PM CaptHindsight[m]: same for RTAI
04:13 PM CaptHindsight[m]: something broke since 4.19 kernels and since LCNC 2.8
04:14 PM CaptHindsight[m]: and I know somebody took out the feature from stepconf to manually enter LPT base addresses
04:14 PM CaptHindsight[m]: since they assumed that the kernel would find them all
04:14 PM XXCoder: I recall that
04:15 PM CaptHindsight[m]: too many assumptions and not enough testing
04:15 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I'm glad that nobody messes with the Mesa drivers
04:15 PM XXCoder: im considering selling some stuff I have
04:15 PM CaptHindsight[m]: what a nightmare that could be
04:15 PM XXCoder: like my cnc router
04:16 PM XXCoder: its electrics is crap but frame is stull good
04:16 PM XXCoder: I was planning on redoing electics but well theres upcoming issues for me
04:36 PM CaptHindsight[m]: and I'm testing 5 different LPT chipsets
04:37 PM CaptHindsight[m]: andypugh: ^^
04:38 PM CaptHindsight[m]: and on top of that the feature to enter LPT base address manually into stepconf was removed
04:40 PM andypugh: That’s all a bit concerning. Is this in 2.8 or 2.9 or both?
04:43 PM CaptHindsight[m]: 2.9
04:43 PM CaptHindsight[m]: but i am going back to 2.8 and testing with both preempt_rt and RTAI
04:44 PM CaptHindsight[m]: seems to also be funny business with how the kernel detects the LPT's and how this get handed off the LCNC for it's LPT driver
04:45 PM CaptHindsight[m]: handed off to LCNC
04:46 PM CaptHindsight[m]: also some boards that used to work now don't at all and others are working in 2.9 for some people that don't work here
04:46 PM justache is now known as justache_test
04:46 PM justache_test is now known as justache
04:47 PM CaptHindsight[m]: will try to sort this out when memleak/linuxntu gets back later
04:48 PM CaptHindsight[m]: andypugh: I tested this on LCNC 2.8 and I can see encoder signals in halscope but nothing in the Axis GUI spindle rpm display.
04:48 PM CaptHindsight[m]: so some issues are also in 2.8
04:50 PM andypugh: It is possible to get the quadrature signals but no spindle speed if the quadrature signals are not phased correctly, or the encoder scaling is wrong.
04:51 PM CaptHindsight[m]: well same config and different kernel or LCNC and it works
04:53 PM CaptHindsight[m]: the more I test the more odd problems I find
04:58 PM CaptHindsight[m]: andypugh: I don't know who is going to fix this besides memleak/ntulinux and he's pretty tired of all this anyway
04:59 PM CaptHindsight[m]: maybe we should consider dropping LPT support for good or leave it to "you're on your own if you use it"
05:00 PM CaptHindsight[m]: then again Jon Elson still uses them for his FPGA cards over LPT
05:00 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Jon writes his own drivers
05:01 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Peter is the only one that touches Mesa
05:01 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I don't know who keeps breaking LPT
05:01 PM travis_farmer[m]: personally, i think LPT support is a good intro to LinuxCNC, with a possible transition to Mesa when more experienced
05:01 PM CaptHindsight[m]: one the few magic cards that somehow still work
05:02 PM CaptHindsight[m]: one/on
05:03 PM CaptHindsight[m]: too many assumptions and not enough testing
05:03 PM andypugh: Once the signal is in HAL it really shouldn’t matter that the origin was the LPT card. So this looks like a deeper issue,
05:03 PM andypugh: And I am fairly sure that nobody has touched the software encoder or rtapi for quite a long time.
05:04 PM CaptHindsight[m]: skunkworks has closed loop going with LPT and steppers
05:05 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I have to ask him which magic card he found
05:05 PM andypugh: Can you make up a table of “is” / “is not” to help to analyse. I am currently very unclear which realtime systems and LinuxCNC versions you are seeign the problem on.
05:05 PM CaptHindsight[m]: yeah i have to since it's gotten so confusing
05:05 PM CaptHindsight[m]: 5 cards and so mnay versions of LCNC and kernels
05:06 PM CaptHindsight[m]: plus the problems change with kernel or LCNC version, like whack a mole
05:13 PM CaptHindsight[m]: skunkworks: which LPT card, kernel and version of LCNC are you using with your closed loop steppers?
06:18 PM roguish[m]: well that sucks. supposed to get to 117 today. topped out at 109.9..................... I'm disappointed.
06:20 PM Tom_L: after it reaches a point, a little more isn't that bad
06:33 PM XXCoder: CaptHindsight[m]: is lpt support worth it still?
06:33 PM Tom_L: on low end systems
06:51 PM roycroft: when they are available, a rpi4 + flash card + mesa ethernet card don't cost much more than a standard system board + lpt board + memory + processor + ssd
06:52 PM XXCoder: roy you know anyone who might be interested on cnc router? 6040 type
06:52 PM XXCoder: electrics is meh, id replace most of it, leaving spindle
06:54 PM XXCoder: vortually looks like this https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/4axis-6040-2200w-Mini-Mach3-CNC-2.jpg
06:55 PM XXCoder: spindle isnt that fancy, and no electrics box on right
06:56 PM roycroft: i don't
06:56 PM XXCoder: drat well if you know if someone let me know lol
06:56 PM XXCoder: I need to get rid of a lot of stuff
06:56 PM roycroft: it looks rather small to me
06:56 PM roycroft: and i really can't use one like that anway
06:57 PM XXCoder: it is pretty small yeah thats why I wasnt thinking of selling to you :)
06:57 PM roycroft: too bad - i have good electronics but no motion control stuff
06:57 PM roycroft: but i absolutely need to do the over-under thing or else i won't be able to have a cnc router at all
06:57 PM XXCoder: steppers on mine is too weak, would need swapping to cut metal
06:58 PM roycroft: unless i buy some property with a larger shop and move
06:58 PM roycroft: and that's a bit too
06:58 PM roycroft: much to pay for a cnc router
06:58 PM XXCoder: yeah lol
07:00 PM jdh: mine has a slightly different case logo. otherwise 100%
07:01 PM XXCoder: that design has been cloned million times
07:01 PM XXCoder: mine is from 2015
07:02 PM jdh: https://photos.app.goo.gl/CFrKKoGM6Ex4HgKXA
07:04 PM roycroft: i really need to get back to working on my design
07:04 PM roycroft: and then i need to see if jt has the time to make a few parts for me
07:07 PM XXCoder: nice
08:38 PM CaptHindsight[m]: XXCoder: they are local to me if I ever need a chinese cnc kit
08:39 PM CaptHindsight[m]: XXCoder: maybe CL and offer some customization since you know LCNC
08:41 PM CaptHindsight[m]: we need to forget about the Rpi4 and just choose an available ARM board
08:42 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://pine64.com/product/quartz64-model-b-4gb-single-board-computer/
08:56 PM roycroft: s/rpi4/arm64/
08:56 PM roycroft: i use "rpi4" not as a brand thing, but as a generic term
08:56 PM roycroft: kind of like using "kleenex" for "tissue"
09:14 PM CaptHindsight[m]: ah I think of Rpi like shit paper vs Charmin
09:15 PM CloudEvil: either the compute module, or the pi zero without soldered on 0.1" is best for that
09:19 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://pine64.com/product/soquartz-4gb-compute-module-w/
09:28 PM CaptHindsight[m]: the RK3566 has an integrated microcontroller, so if that is used for stepping no other boards are required other than some IO protection and buffering/level translation
09:29 PM CloudEvil: You can also lock off a core of the Pi in the same way
09:31 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I think we are comparing apples with opranges
09:31 PM CaptHindsight[m]: none of the ARM64 Rpis have an integrated microcontroller
09:31 PM CaptHindsight[m]: most of the Rockchip ARM63 devices do
09:32 PM CaptHindsight[m]: what's an opranges, it's just oranges spelled wrong
09:32 PM CloudEvil: You can use a standard core as a micro if you stop it being used for linux and only operate out of L1 cache
09:33 PM CaptHindsight[m]: have a working example?
09:33 PM CaptHindsight[m]: but we can't buy Rpi's anyway