#linuxcnc Logs

Aug 04 2022

#linuxcnc Calendar

12:12 AM coredump[m]: Is there any diy touch probe or some cheap solution with good repeatability?
12:27 AM roycroft: yes
12:27 AM roycroft: but i don't recall what the project name is or where it's documented
12:32 AM jpa-: coredump[m]: i've been developing a retractable probe based on pcb & 3dprinted parts, but haven't got as far as to test repeatability yet https://jpa.kapsi.fi/stuff/pix/retractable_3dprobe.mp4 https://jpa.kapsi.fi/stuff/pix/retractable_3dprobe.jpg
12:33 AM jpa-: coredump[m]: this is interesting one also: https://hackaday.com/2022/01/05/a-simple-touch-probe-made-with-basic-tools/
12:34 AM jpa-: and https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:721620
01:17 AM CaptHindsight[m]: coredump: if god is +- 1mm then yes, if 10um, then NO
02:04 AM rmu: jpa-: you could use ball bearings as contact points, should be way more accurate/repeatable. solder/glue them onto the PCB.
02:06 AM XXCoder: or gage bars
02:06 AM rmu: IIRC there is also some trickery involved to minimise any "sparks" that could erode the contact points over time, but that probably only matters if you target <5ยต
02:06 AM XXCoder: add some centering adjustable stuff and its great
02:07 AM XXCoder: Tom_L: that you who designed a probe using rods?
02:07 AM rmu: XXCoder: flat bars are probably not that useful.
02:08 AM rmu: for this purpose
02:08 AM XXCoder: flat?
02:08 AM XXCoder: rods dont have flat spots besides ends;
02:08 AM XXCoder: design doesnt use ends
02:08 AM rmu: i interpreted "gage bars" as flat ;)
02:08 AM rmu: nevermind
02:08 AM XXCoder: i use blocks for flat ones :D (most of industry does I think)
02:09 AM rmu: not a native speaker
02:09 AM XXCoder: rods is standard for round gage actually I think
02:09 AM XXCoder: so its on me also
02:10 AM XXCoder: anyway the rods design is interesting
02:11 AM XXCoder: because you can get very precise with those, since you can buy say a reamer. its very long and quite precise
02:11 AM XXCoder: cut it into sections. would need 6 of em
02:17 AM rmu: I think PCBs from cheap prototyping service and ball bearings and a tripod from ground stock should also be quite precise, but it's not 100% DIY
02:18 AM XXCoder: you can print pretty precise probe
02:18 AM XXCoder: whats important is that it is adjustable
02:18 AM XXCoder: it wont perform to expensive probes level but yeah
02:21 AM miss0r: g'day
02:22 AM XXCoder: yo
02:22 AM XXCoder: hows you doing
02:22 AM miss0r: Pretty good - First week back from vacation with the family.. (I NEED WORK NOW!) You? :)
02:22 AM XXCoder: pretty much the same as before lol
02:23 AM miss0r: I'm realy busy customizing 12 new hyundai cnc lathes for the machine importer
02:24 AM XXCoder: nice
02:24 AM XXCoder: precision machine customizer, repairer or builder is a whole level above
02:25 AM miss0r: They make plastic parts right fast in a hurry, so to safe time, the spindle does not spin down when the bar loader pushes the rod further in for the next part. So the hydraulic system that was on there will not do. Therefore I've made a special pneumatic system whith air bearings'n such :)
02:25 AM miss0r: That took a while. But they are all mounted now
02:26 AM miss0r: automatic doors(hyundai does not make this on their small lathes, apparently) so that had to be custom made too
02:26 AM XXCoder: so it extrudes plastic rod without stopping spinning?
02:26 AM XXCoder: I can see that it would cut wear by so much
02:26 AM XXCoder: (spin down and ups)
02:27 AM XXCoder: time save too
02:27 AM miss0r: its not realy wear they are worried about. Its the spin down/spin up procedure. That takes around 1.25 seconds pr. cycle, and each plastic part takes 2 seconds to make
02:27 AM miss0r: so that is a significant improvement to the overall time
02:28 AM miss0r: We've had a test machine running it like that for the past year. We just did an otopsy(spell?) to see if it was viable. and there were no real wear to anything, so we started building 12 of them for the client
02:29 AM miss0r: anyway - that has been keeping me more busy than I care to admit :D
02:30 AM XXCoder: 1/3 of cycle time off? id say so.
02:30 AM miss0r: indeed
02:30 AM XXCoder: 12 sounds like a huge client
02:31 AM miss0r: they buy as much each year
02:34 AM miss0r: except for the past two years that is. They make ALOT of gasgets, washers & axle seals etc for the car industry. and that has been a bit slow lately
02:35 AM XXCoder: not surpised
02:35 AM XXCoder: chips thing may get much worse soonish
02:36 AM XXCoder: I want rpi4 but its very bad time for me to buy one so cant do much
02:36 AM miss0r: sucks
02:37 AM miss0r: I just got realy back into retro hardware again :D
02:37 AM XXCoder: pico is easy to get, and will be likely to stay such for while
02:37 AM miss0r: I've set up 4 Pentium 1 133mhz "gaming" rigs in the basement, and had friends over to play the good'ol stuff
02:37 AM XXCoder: fun :D
02:38 AM XXCoder: windows 4.11 or 95?
02:38 AM miss0r: 98 actualy
02:38 AM XXCoder: 3.11
02:38 AM XXCoder: ok lol
02:38 AM miss0r: its ALOT easier to utilize the single USB header on the motherboards when you have an operating system supporting it
02:38 AM miss0r: I didn't have 4 ps/2 mouses floating around :D
02:39 AM XXCoder: that ones bit hard to day nowdays
02:39 AM XXCoder: I have one, and other one so old its serial
02:39 AM miss0r: Nice. I don't have a serial mouse anymore
02:39 AM miss0r: But I am also building a beast of a (retro) server
02:40 AM XXCoder: i saw it at dump er I mean goodwill and grabbed it
02:40 AM XXCoder: its impossible to get nowdays
02:40 AM miss0r: Dual pentium pro 200mhz/512k with 512mb of ram
02:40 AM miss0r: haha
02:42 AM miss0r: one of the PCs has the old big round din connector for the keyboard
02:42 AM miss0r: that computer is an AT
02:42 AM XXCoder: sadly only antiques I have is aspire one. first one with linux and first to have ssd
02:42 AM miss0r: I only had one keyboard for that
02:42 AM XXCoder: and my last pc
02:42 AM miss0r: I can mail you an old laptop, if you want something to mock about with
02:42 AM XXCoder: wow. also have only one of that lol. one mini also
02:42 AM XXCoder: nah its fine
02:42 AM miss0r: I have a pentium 1 75mhz with 8mb of ram
02:43 AM miss0r: it was a bit on the slow side for the games we wanted to play on LAN (Red Alert 95, Diablo 1, Duke Nukem 3D ect)
02:43 AM XXCoder: thats barely newer than my first pc I built myself
02:43 AM miss0r: forgetting Age of Empires here :)
02:43 AM XXCoder: 386 sx 33 mhz, 5 mb ram
02:44 AM XXCoder: *5
02:44 AM XXCoder: 4$$!%$@!#$
02:44 AM XXCoder: ;)
02:44 AM miss0r: :D
02:44 AM XXCoder: anyway I shortly got that up to 8 mb. cost me another 200 usd
02:44 AM miss0r: I was reading over 4 times over and couldn't make sense of that edit
02:45 AM XXCoder: lol
02:45 AM XXCoder: talking about obselete hardware
02:45 AM miss0r: The first one I build I didn't realy build. It was a 486 running at 40 mhz. It was an all-on-one compaq with the crt build ontop of the computer case
02:45 AM XXCoder: seems someone figured how otyo thing connects so people can download games for dead 2012 console
02:45 AM XXCoder: wow all in one. heavy
02:46 AM miss0r: But it came with 4mb of ram, so I went to buy another 4, and the guy at the computer store fscked up and gave me a whole box of 8mb sticks instead. So I ended up having 32mb of ram in it
02:46 AM XXCoder: I mispelled name https://ouya.cweiske.de/
02:46 AM miss0r: but I only payed for 1 4mb stick
02:46 AM XXCoder: lol
02:47 AM miss0r: Just got a jump scare here! A rather desent size spider just fell on my head
02:47 AM XXCoder: ow lol
02:48 AM miss0r: But I would just like to point out that I was brave and only jumped around bashing my head for 10 seconds
02:48 AM XXCoder: you got courage indeed lol
02:48 AM miss0r: Indeed :D
02:48 AM miss0r: no squeeky noises though. I felt brave afterwards
02:49 AM * miss0r doesn't have alot of love for spiders
02:50 AM XXCoder: I have a lot... for spiders that eat so many bugs I dislike.. just keep away from me lol
02:50 AM miss0r: Sure. I can get on that boat :D
02:51 AM miss0r: Time to cut 24 din rails and screw them into the cabinets, then I will drive off to mount it up
02:51 AM XXCoder: have great day
02:51 AM miss0r: you too, Cya
04:30 AM Tom_L: morning
04:30 AM chris_99: Hi, i'm just looking at - https://www.cncest.com/products/4-axis-3040-cnc-router-engraver-400w-desktop-engraving-drilling-milling-machine-3d-wood-diy-artwork-cutter-usb-port?_pos=1&_sid=7f62cde5e&_ss=r would i be right in thinking to cut aluminum the 400W motor wouldn't be powerful enough?
04:31 AM Tom_L: right
04:31 AM Tom_L: it would be pretty limited
04:32 AM XXCoder: shallow cuts I guess
04:33 AM Tom_L: air cuts maybe :)
04:34 AM jpa-: chris_99: i have a very similar machine in 3020 size with 400W spindle; aluminum can be cut with 0.1 to 0.2 mm depth of cut, but it takes ages of course
04:34 AM XXCoder: jpa yeah that was that I was remembering vaguely
04:34 AM chris_99: ah cheers
04:34 AM jpa-: the spindle is the weakest part, i've been planning to upgrade some brushless motor based one, but the frame flexes a lot also
04:38 AM jpa-: http://essentialscrap.com/3dprinter/topplate.jpg 50 mm diameter, 3mm endmill, ~10kRPM, 0.25 mm depth of cut, 100mm/min feed, 2 hours machining time, not particularly good surface finish but usable
04:41 AM JT-Cave: morning
05:27 AM JT-Cave: <Tom_L> JT-Cave, i had to add one dependency to your list: libusb-1.0-0-dev
05:27 AM JT-Cave: <Tom_L> to make dpkg-checkdependencies happy
05:28 AM JT-Cave: Tom_L, for?
05:38 AM * djsftree5725[m] uploaded an image: (177KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/jauriarts.org/ilWxOKAyxnDBwoQeEKpRfsbW/unknown.png >
05:38 AM djsftree5725[m]: making ssome progress just figuring out how to reverse HALrotate.... jogging in the opp dir to intended.
06:49 AM Tom_L: JT-Cave, i think that was for the debian 11 install
06:50 AM Tom_L: in order to build linuxcnc
06:51 AM Tom_L: i would need to run thru it again to be positive
06:52 AM Tom_L: it _is_ in my notes for 11 under the linuxcnc build area so i'm pretty sure...
08:58 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
09:08 AM t4nk_fn: mannnnn! it seems my Norton account has been suspended
09:08 AM roycroft: that's because you did not renew your mcafee support
09:08 AM t4nk_fn: I wasn't aware I had one, but I received several mails about it
09:09 AM t4nk_fn: I hope I can correct the matter asap though ;)
09:10 AM roycroft: all you have to do is meet a guy in the wal*mart parking lot and hand him some home depot gift cards and you'll be good to go
09:11 AM t4nk_fn: ah, same way I buy my time shares
09:12 AM t4nk_fn: what a world man, honestly :|
09:13 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
09:29 AM FinboySlick: This kid is doing some pretty cool stuff: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOb4RdiEPUc I invited him here since he'd like to run LinuxCNC on it.
09:33 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Epoxy granite is really cool and one of the few ways to make a really solid home built machine. Still a ton of work but much more doable than cast iron at home ๐Ÿ™‚
09:35 AM perry_j1987: morning
09:40 AM FinboySlick: Yeah. I'd love to make one too so I'm certainly grateful for him sharing his experience.
09:49 AM * djsftree5725[m] uploaded an image: (679KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/jauriarts.org/SbafBRQzWJfQzEubRWiHBowB/pic-machine.jpg >
09:49 AM djsftree5725[m]: I have a granite bed machine half made ๐Ÿ™‚
09:50 AM roycroft: epoxy granite is fairly expensive, and can't be picked up at the scrap yard
09:50 AM roycroft: i think that's why it's not used more often for home-built machines
09:51 AM roycroft: when i finally get around to doing a cnc conversion of my mill-drill i plan on packing as much epoxy granite as possible inside the castings
10:07 AM FinboySlick: roycroft: Might be worth watching this bit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KjlyXKeo8c It's not machine related but lots of interesting info.
10:16 AM roycroft: that does look intereting - thanks
10:16 AM roycroft: i'll watch it when i have the time
10:21 AM unterhaus_: I got an inspection table from aerotech, they gave it to me. They had piles of epoxy granite they wanted to give away
10:21 AM unterhaus_: I guess otherwise it goes to the landfill
10:22 AM roycroft: sometimes it would be nice to live in the rust belt
10:23 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: For epoxy granite as used in machine bases there are some specific proportions for the different size aggregate used. You need a range of particle sizes from coarse gravel to nanometer size. The amount of epoxy is also critical. Too much or too little will impact the performance of the structure.
10:24 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: There was a thread on cnczone I was following for a few years that went into quite a bit of detail.
10:25 AM unterhaus_: I guess pittsburgh is the rust belt, but it's not very rusty nowadays. Doing pretty well
10:26 AM roycroft: yes, it is in the middle of the rust belt
10:26 AM roycroft: but you are correct, most of the rust moved to china a few decades ago
10:27 AM roycroft: i remember that thread, zincboy
10:47 AM perry_j1987: wow maritool is only supplier i can find making hexagon er collets
10:47 AM perry_j1987: https://www.maritool.com/p18777/ER32-Hex-Collet-7/16/product_info.html
10:48 AM perry_j1987: i really want to get a 5c chuck
10:49 AM JT-Cave: msc
10:50 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Yes, I have a bunch of oddball 5c collets for hex and square stock. Don't see too many ER like that as the chucks aren't usually open at the back
10:50 AM coredump[m]: I wonder if I can make a touch probe with a piezo disk. those things are sensitive
10:50 AM perry_j1987: JT-Cave dont see any hexagon on msc
10:50 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Yes, but you still need the kinematic mount for overtravel.
10:51 AM JT-Cave: I thought that's where I got mine...
10:51 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Also, you will need to signal condition the piezo to eliminate noise from axis motion.
10:51 AM coredump[m]: blergh, forgot about the axis move
10:51 AM perry_j1987: just went through the filters and boiled it down to 7 collets er32 in 7/16 range
10:52 AM JT-Cave: google says there are a bunch of hex 5c collets
10:52 AM perry_j1987: ya i want to switch to 5c some day
10:52 AM perry_j1987: er32 has gotten me far
10:53 AM perry_j1987: but it sure does move a lot when tightening
10:53 AM coredump[m]: I have some precision piezo boards that I used in the past for a 3d printer, maybe I can use that. Is there such a thing as a `analog` probe in linuxcnc? as in measuring a range of values instead of simply open/close
10:53 AM perry_j1987: end up having to do more on facing to bring it down etc
10:53 AM JT-Cave: https://www.mscdirect.com/browse/tnpla/69744571
10:53 AM JT-Cave: msc hex collet
10:55 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: No, but you could write a hal component to do the filtering.
10:57 AM perry_j1987: took a little spill on my moped yesterday
10:57 AM perry_j1987: got some nasty road rash lol having trouble finding comfortable way to rest my arm
11:01 AM JT-Cave: ouch
11:01 AM perry_j1987: it had rained on my way to the shop and going back home i made the mistake of touching the front brakes on gravel lol
11:01 AM perry_j1987: was the worlds slowest crash
11:02 AM perry_j1987: front wheel locked up and i went over the handlebars it was probably very comical looking
11:02 AM perry_j1987: the funniest part... was when i was mid crash and noticed my helmet flying over me and landing on the ground infront of me it was sitting in the basket in back haha
11:04 AM JT-Cave: bet you don't do that again...
11:04 AM perry_j1987: hopefully not lol
11:05 AM perry_j1987: i have an 84 yamaha qt50 that is very fun to zip around on
11:05 AM CaptHindsight[m]: epoxy granite is pretty easy to work with once you get the hang of it like most other skills, the mixes are not that complicated once you look into it, just avoid the hobby/maker howto sites
11:05 AM perry_j1987: CaptHindsight[m] you see that epoxy granite lathe with air bearings on youtube
11:06 AM JT-Cave: I learned to not use the front brake on gravel road on my Schwinn stingray a very long time ago
11:06 AM perry_j1987: think it was a british guy who made it
11:07 AM CaptHindsight[m]: possibly, I make my own bases
11:10 AM CaptHindsight[m]: the most foolproof epoxy granite base video I saw was the one with the aluminum frame encased in it for dampening
11:11 AM CaptHindsight[m]: it still requires the frame to be made square before it's covered in epoxy granite
11:11 AM CaptHindsight[m]: so it's outside the ability of many people that might try
11:13 AM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.adambender.info/post/2017/03/25/epoxy-granite-machine-frame-how-to
11:15 AM CaptHindsight[m]: that many years long thread on cnczone goes in too many circles
11:18 AM CaptHindsight[m]: I'm near Shars warehouse so I can get pretty good sized granite surface plates for cheap to use as machine bases
11:22 AM CaptHindsight[m]: Enco used to have better deals, you could wait for a sale and also get free truck shipping, they used be next day by truck
11:22 AM FinboySlick: perry_j1987: If the one you're referring to is made by Dan Gelbart, I think that's just plain granite.
11:23 AM perry_j1987: was it?
11:23 AM perry_j1987: ah
11:23 AM perry_j1987: i've seen lots where they encase steel strips that protrude out of the casting and then they machine them to mount linear rails on
11:23 AM FinboySlick: Technically, he might have used epoxy to stick the granite straight-edges together but my understanding is that it's all granite, yeah.
11:23 AM CaptHindsight[m]: you can find pretty good deals on air bearing spindles on ebay, if you want to make your own
11:25 AM roycroft: it's too bad shars are a slimey company
11:26 AM roycroft: they have good prices for decent quality goods
11:26 AM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.ebay.com/itm/203632683782
11:33 AM CaptHindsight[m]: Shars owners were born and raised in China, just a typical Chinese uhmerican business
11:33 AM CaptHindsight[m]: also the type that spends money on status symbol cars
11:34 AM perry_j1987: i had never heard anything about shars company
11:34 AM perry_j1987: about who they were i mean
11:34 AM FinboySlick: CaptHindsight[m]: Hey now! I resemble that remark with my 2010 Ford Fusion ;)
11:35 AM * FinboySlick symbolizes all his status with it.
11:35 AM roycroft: i did not know that before now, capthindsight, but it does not surprise me
11:35 AM CaptHindsight[m]: it's about a dozen people in the office, and 6 or so in the US warehouse
11:35 AM roycroft: the person i dealt with there is not chinese
11:35 AM roycroft: she is very much from the us
11:35 AM roycroft: very much from chicago, based on her accent
11:36 AM perry_j1987: shars based in chicago?
11:36 AM CaptHindsight[m]: yes, they have a few uhmerican salespeople
11:36 AM roycroft: near chicago
11:36 AM CaptHindsight[m]: yeah, west of Chicago about 40 miles
11:36 AM roycroft: i was dealing with the so-called customer service person
11:36 AM perry_j1987: ah ya
11:36 AM roycroft: that's still close enough to have that horrible flat chicago accent
11:37 AM roycroft: and the lady sounded like she was from the south side
11:37 AM roycroft: she probably lives in the city or grew up there
11:37 AM CaptHindsight[m]: the owner comes out of his lair and barks at the warehouse workers
11:37 AM roycroft: and escaped to the 'burbs
11:38 AM solarwind: If I cut too much off a chuck backplate seat, I can just tig braze aluminum bronze around it and machine it down to size again, right?
11:38 AM CaptHindsight[m]: their tools are pretty meh
11:38 AM roycroft: their tools are better than harbor freight
11:38 AM CaptHindsight[m]: vises and surface plates are ok and they carry Kurt now
11:38 AM roycroft: not as good as fowler
11:38 AM roycroft: but they are pretty cheap
11:38 AM CaptHindsight[m]: most of the tooling is not worth buying
11:39 AM FinboySlick: solarwind: I'd say so but if you care about precision, you should plan to re-machine all the important surfaces because the might warp.
11:39 AM CaptHindsight[m]: same drive for me to a few really good tool makers,
11:40 AM perry_j1987: CaptHindsight[m] you have any spare VFD's looking to sell? you and I are fairly close by heh
11:41 AM CaptHindsight[m]: he's going to grind it bask better than new
11:42 AM CaptHindsight[m]: perry_j1987: no spare VFD's, Wolf Automation carries name brand and are close
11:42 AM perry_j1987: thinking picking up a huanyang off amazon then
11:42 AM perry_j1987: get this 9x20 lathe back up and running
11:42 AM CaptHindsight[m]: Automation Technologies carries ChinaCo VFD's
11:43 AM CaptHindsight[m]: also nearby
11:44 AM CaptHindsight[m]: the owner of Automation Technologies has PhD from U of I in Mechanical Engineering and he still write up his docs in Chinglish
11:45 AM CaptHindsight[m]: I also can't make sense of several part descriptions on his website
11:47 AM CaptHindsight[m]: perry_j1987: https://www.wolfautomation.com/products/ac-drives/
11:47 AM Tom_L: JT-Cave, you get my note?
11:47 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: I like to use the AutomationDirect VFDs. They are at least supported well here. Otherwise DrivesWarehouse is my other go-to.
11:48 AM perry_j1987: those huanyang vfds are well supported too?
11:48 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: In software yes. Hardware wise no.
11:49 AM CaptHindsight[m]: lots of huanyang clones
11:49 AM CaptHindsight[m]: with mystery features
11:49 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: I have had very bad luck with those cheap amazon/aliexpress VDFs.
11:49 AM CaptHindsight[m]: yes ^^^
11:49 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Fire, explosions. smoke. All things I didn't want in a drive ๐Ÿ™‚
11:50 AM CaptHindsight[m]: spend the extra $50 on a better VFD
11:50 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: The name brand drives are so close in price is is really not worth the risk
11:50 AM CaptHindsight[m]: and the docs will match the features
11:51 AM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: And the docs will be readable and not poor translations.
11:53 AM CaptHindsight[m]: I'm working on a conveyor system that used a mystery white Chinese VFD
11:55 AM JT-Cave: Tom_L, no
11:55 AM Tom_L: right after you died
11:55 AM CaptHindsight[m]: line cord to AC, and even a crappier line cord to motor, no fuses
11:56 AM Tom_L: 6:49a
11:57 AM Tom_L: in response to 5:27
11:58 AM JT-Cave: ok, I see it but debian 11 does not have to add any dependencies
11:58 AM JT-Cave: unless you mean installing linuxcnc in debian 11
11:58 AM Tom_L: yes
11:58 AM Tom_L: installing linuxcnc
11:58 AM JT-Cave: ok, I'll check in a bit... nap time here
11:59 AM Tom_L: i've installed linuxcnc on 10 11 & 12 now
11:59 AM Tom_L: with mesaflash and mesact
11:59 AM perry_j1987: whats a good affordable vfd in your guys opinion then.
11:59 AM perry_j1987: i had an AC Tech in there that exploded one day when i flipped the power onto the lathe lol
12:00 PM JT-Cave: I'm working on debian 13 but the rain this morning had internet shut down till 9:25
12:01 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Do you want just a basic V/hz drive or something with sensorless vector control?
12:01 PM Tom_L: i noticed
12:01 PM CaptHindsight[m]: perry_j1987: how many phase input and voltage, how much power out?
12:01 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: beat me to it ๐Ÿ™‚
12:02 PM CaptHindsight[m]: perry_j1987: check the wolf link I posted
12:02 PM CaptHindsight[m]: check the options you need
12:04 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: I have bought from: https://www.driveswarehouse.com/ and been happy with the price and quality. The wolfautomation drives also look fine.
12:04 PM CaptHindsight[m]: AutomationDirect is 2-3 days by ground for around here
12:05 PM roycroft: they're a week from here
12:05 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: They are fast even to Canada which is one of the reasons I use them
12:05 PM roycroft: but i'm used to vendors being a week away
12:05 PM CaptHindsight[m]: in the break away province of Texas
12:05 PM roycroft: mcmaster are 2 days, usually
12:05 PM roycroft: and some northern california vendors are 2 days
12:06 PM perry_j1987: i run everything 110
12:06 PM roycroft: but for the most part, i expect to wait a week for stuff
12:06 PM perry_j1987: its that techno isel 9x20 lathe its going on
12:06 PM * roycroft runs things on 240v whenever possible, to save money on wiring
12:06 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I'm not familiar with that lathe
12:07 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Zincboy runs things on 600v whenever possible to save even more money on wiring ๐Ÿ™‚
12:07 PM perry_j1987: has some baldor spindle motor in it
12:07 PM CaptHindsight[m]: 1-2hp?
12:08 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I do have a spare 2HP 3ph motor
12:09 PM perry_j1987: think i read max about 800 watts on my meter running the whole lathe
12:10 PM perry_j1987: their site says its ยพ HP AC brushless
12:10 PM perry_j1987: https://www.techno-isel.com/education1/ed_metallathe.htm
12:20 PM CaptHindsight[m]: techno-isel figured out a way to sell more automation parts by making some complete machones
12:22 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: "AC brushless" can mean a few things. The main one is that a cheapo v/hz drive is not going to work well in this application. Most of the higher end drives with sesorless vector or field oriented control can drive this type of motor.
12:23 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: It is likely a BLDC motor and they had a custom drive for it.
12:26 PM perry_j1987: it has an ac tech vfd in it
12:26 PM perry_j1987: bit baldor motor
12:26 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Something like: https://www.driveswarehouse.com/ode-3-120043-1f1a should do it.
12:28 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: That doesn't really tell us much though. The nameplate info from the motor would be needed to be sure of the drive requirements.
12:29 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: They are using the drive to vary the speed of the spindle on the lathe and you can't do that with v/hz control. Not without losing all your torque at the low end.
12:29 PM perry_j1987: heres the exact one in the lathe now https://www.wolfautomation.com/vfd-1hp-120-230v-single-phase-ip20-modbus-pa/?gclid=CjwKCAjw3K2XBhAzEiwAmmgrArelu3OYP06zodE9cOvcnOzMwpf4f6cuyKQGPgDHOh0Xre5aiz9t2xoCaCoQAvD_BwE
12:37 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Looks like that version is a v/hz which I am surprised at. That lathe is going to have no torque at lower RPM and the 0-2000 rpm spec is laughable. Might get down to 200rpm with very little torque. To drive a lathe spindle like that a sensorless vector drive is highly recommended.
12:38 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: The motor nameplate data is still needed to be sure of the correct drive however.
12:39 PM perry_j1987: thats a real tough thing to get to
12:39 PM perry_j1987: i still havnt seen sight of the name plate to this day its crammed back of the enclosure
12:40 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Well, you can take a gamble but you will still need that info to program the drive.
12:40 PM perry_j1987: i'll take a look better today when i get out there maybe do some trickery with cell phone camera or something to get sight of it
12:40 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: I usually stick my phone in blind and just take pictures until I get it.
12:40 PM perry_j1987: the ac tech one thats in there basically popped when i hit the power button to turn the lathe on once
12:41 PM perry_j1987: took the plastic shroud off and some slight discoloration on the plastic next to one of the legs of the caps
12:41 PM perry_j1987: no damage on the boards
12:41 PM perry_j1987: the program interface still responds and you can edit values etc but no life out of the motor
12:42 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Probably the DC link caps went. They have a limited lifespan and should be replaced on defined intervals. Though no-one does ๐Ÿ™‚
12:42 PM perry_j1987: its a 2004 or something model i think
12:42 PM perry_j1987: its lasted quite a number of years
12:43 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: When the caps went the IGBT module also probably got taken out.
12:43 PM perry_j1987: i "may" have caused it myself
12:43 PM perry_j1987: had the lathes enclosure open and not to far away i decided to grind a piece of hss on the grinder
12:43 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: I have drives from the 80s that are still kicking.
12:43 PM perry_j1987: it was after that the incident happend lol
12:44 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Grinding dust and electronics do not mix ๐Ÿ™‚
12:44 PM perry_j1987: ya
12:44 PM perry_j1987: thats al i can think of that may have caused it any how
12:44 PM jpa-: ZincBoy[CAON][m]: many V/Hz drives allow increasing the voltage at low end; it gets pretty ok torque, just heats the motor more
12:44 PM roycroft: they mix very well, actually
12:44 PM perry_j1987: didnt see / feel any residue in the cabinet though
12:44 PM roycroft: but they make an unpleasant slop when they do
12:45 PM roycroft: and there's often a release of the magic blue smoke when they are mixed
12:47 PM roycroft: followed by a chant of "habemus fatum"
12:47 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: To an extent, yes but in my experience you need to be very careful to avoid burning the windings if you are using it for prolonged periods. Much safer to just use a sensorless vector. The cost increase for the drive is not significant in most cases.
12:47 PM perry_j1987: https://www.amazon.com/Variable-Frequency-Inverter-Converter-HUANYANG/dp/B0775F4G47/ref=sr_1_6?crid=1KBUEP1O1RCWB&keywords=vfd%2B110v&qid=1659631272&refinements=p_85%3A2470955011&rnid=2470954011&rps=1&sprefix=vfd%2B110v%2Caps%2C144&sr=8-6&th=1 was looking at one of these
12:48 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: No
12:48 PM jpa-: ZincBoy[CAON][m]: yeah, i agree that they are superior, but i find the cost increase quite significant in many cases :)
12:49 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Use something like this: https://www.driveswarehouse.com/wj200-007sf
12:49 PM perry_j1987: what am i getting for 100 bucks more
12:49 PM roycroft: one of the most fiddly parts of my belt grinder build was adding a filter to the air inlet below my vfd
12:50 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: or https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/shopping/catalog/drives_-a-_soft_starters/ac_variable_frequency_drives_(vfd)/micro/GS11N-11P0
12:50 PM roycroft: but i felt it an important feature to add
12:51 PM perry_j1987: ah 2 year warranty on that one looks nice
12:51 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: A drive that won't burn your house down? I find a lack of fire to be a valuable feature in a drive.
12:52 PM jpa-: surprisingly cheap for vector control
12:52 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: I have used the durapulse drives a fair bit and have not had any issues with them. The one I linked has sensorless vector control mode for pretty much the same price as the amazon one.
12:53 PM perry_j1987: ya thats looking pretty good
12:53 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Vector control is cheap these days in my experience. It is just if you try to go with AB or the like that they jack the price. The HW is all the same, just a different program in the DSP.
12:54 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Country Of Origin: INDIA, TAIWAN
12:56 PM perry_j1987: going through the page so far it seems like it matches what i'd need
12:57 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: They have a 240v version as well. That is where the motor nameplate data is so important.
12:57 PM perry_j1987: i dont have 220 at my shop
12:57 PM perry_j1987: in fact i have terrible 110 there
12:57 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: If you have a 240v motor, you will need the 240v drive.
12:57 PM perry_j1987: i run a bank of golf cart batteries in there
12:58 PM roycroft: sounds like a challenging way to do machining
12:58 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Were you running the drive off an inverter?
12:58 PM perry_j1987: it is
12:58 PM perry_j1987: ya
12:58 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: If so I think I found out why your old drive died and your new drive is not long for this world.
12:58 PM perry_j1987: i called some vfd shops and they said i should not experience any issues running on a modified inverter
01:00 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Eh, I wouldn't go that far. Modified sine puts a ton of stress on the input rectifier diodes.
01:01 PM perry_j1987: plan on getting a pure sine at some point
01:01 PM perry_j1987: what i'd really like is a shop with regular power though haha
01:02 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Modified sine is a square wave as far as the diodes are concerned and go from 0 to peak voltage much faster than true sine. Peak currents in the diodes will be much higher. You can mitigate this with an input line reactor to slow down the di/dt.
01:04 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Ripple currents on the DC link caps will also be much higher than the design values and will lead to premature failure.
01:04 PM perry_j1987: if i could just ramp up the battery voltage to feed directly into the dc bus of the inverters...
01:05 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: That is actually the best way to do it.
01:08 PM perry_j1987: i didnt see any options at the time to do that though
01:09 PM perry_j1987: 12v to whatever dc it was i forgot what the dc bus needed on these vfds now
01:09 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Though be aware that fuses and switches have very different ratings for DC vs AC. DC link voltage for a 240Vac system is 340Vdc so you will need fuses and switches rated for at least 400Vdc. 600V is a common value.
01:10 PM ZincBoy[CAON][m]: Your inverter does that internally. But I wouldn't go poking around in there unless you know what you are doing.
01:12 PM Tom_L: aww c'mnon...
01:12 PM Tom_L: another guy in here plays with rail guns :)
01:13 PM perry_j1987: lol
01:42 PM JT-Shop: damn that was a long nap
01:50 PM Tom_L: must have needed it
01:52 PM mrec: rigid tapping is so nice...
02:06 PM CaptHindsight[m]: heh, I thought the real men formed threads
02:07 PM mrec: after M2 I'm doing M3 I was concerned that the 2.5mm hole is too small however it went through it like butter
02:07 PM roycroft: i've never formed threads
02:07 PM roycroft: i'm best at forming opinions
02:07 PM travis_farmer[m]: lol
02:08 PM mrec: I have a tapping tool holder which is spring loaded, this time I locked the spring and it's no problem (even better than before)
02:11 PM CaptHindsight[m]: perry_j1987: ever been the makerspace in Milwaukee?
02:11 PM CaptHindsight[m]: they have two locations
02:11 PM CaptHindsight[m]: and a Tormach
02:12 PM perry_j1987: i havnt
02:12 PM perry_j1987: im not a half hour away from tormah though
02:12 PM perry_j1987: it would be fun to go see their showroom
02:18 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I hear that Madison has a nice makerspace
02:30 PM JT-Shop: my wood slicers came in today
02:38 PM roycroft: awesome
02:38 PM roycroft: i think that product alone keeps highland woodworking in business
02:44 PM JT-Shop: I cut a bunch of wood on the old blade and it's not tracking well so time to replace
02:50 PM roycroft: i did a dry fit on my cabinet top counter trim and it wasn't perfectly square to the counter top
02:50 PM roycroft: i'd been pondering how to fix that, and concluded that my domino slots in the trim were not perfectly square
02:50 PM roycroft: i'm actually working on a jig design that will help make square slots on narrow pieces like that, but the jig isn't going to be done for a while
02:51 PM roycroft: i ended up filling all the slots with epoxy at lunch today
02:51 PM roycroft: i'll try again on saturday cutting the slots, and hope they're more square
02:51 PM roycroft: i've had this problem with biscuits before - it's the exact same problem
02:51 PM roycroft: a very small reference surface to index the tool against
03:16 PM roguish[m]: get a big hammer
03:22 PM XXCoder: rou wouldnt wood glue with wood powder mixed in better filling for miscut slots?
03:28 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
03:33 PM roycroft: epoxy will be fine
03:33 PM roycroft: i'm not going to glue the dominos in
03:33 PM roycroft: they're just for alignment
03:34 PM roycroft: if used wood glue i would have to fill the slots in multiple lifts or it would never dry
03:34 PM roycroft: the slots are 12mm deep
04:02 PM CaptHindsight[m]: MSC has a big sale going on, just got 70% off and only $12 for next day air
04:03 PM roycroft: so they are finally matching the old enco prices
04:03 PM CaptHindsight[m]: ends tomorrow
04:04 PM roycroft: which they promised me they would do when they borged and shut down enco, but never did
04:07 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I gave up on them
04:07 PM CaptHindsight[m]: it just happened that they had something in stock that I needed
04:22 PM perry_j1987: that was fun
04:22 PM JT-Shop: damn state adds a $1.75 transaction fee when renewing plates online
04:22 PM perry_j1987: rode 10 or so miles with 40sum pounds of bolts on the back of the moped haha
04:23 PM JT-Shop: back in the saddle I see
04:23 PM JT-Shop: I would have done that on my E-Bike
04:23 PM perry_j1987: yup heh
04:23 PM perry_j1987: 1400 bolts
04:25 PM JT-Shop: depending on the size that could be a huge load
04:27 PM JT-Shop: the E-Bike will go 40 miles on a chargs
04:27 PM JT-Shop: charge
04:28 PM perry_j1987: aye
04:28 PM perry_j1987: i use to have an ebike it was fun
04:28 PM perry_j1987: this qt50 yamahopper is a riot to zip around on though heh
04:28 PM JT-Shop: my buddy has a honda 50 the yellow ones with low frame
04:29 PM XXCoder: roycroft: ok
04:29 PM XXCoder: yeah makes sense
04:36 PM perry_j1987: so now on my little gang tool lathe
04:36 PM perry_j1987: i made a sub plate that has locating pins
04:36 PM perry_j1987: im going to use this other chunk of alum same size as my main gang tool block
04:37 PM perry_j1987: and make another block that bolts onto the lathe and it will have some threaded holes in the front face of it so i can bolt fixture plates on there
04:37 PM perry_j1987: and run steel parts on the lathe as a simple mill heh
04:37 PM * JT-Shop needs to pay himself
04:39 PM Tom_L: monopoly money?
04:40 PM JT-Shop: Bengies
04:40 PM Tom_L: is there a way to list installed packages?
04:41 PM perry_j1987: Tom_L you could use bullet points :)
04:41 PM Tom_L: did that come with a drum roll?
04:41 PM perry_j1987: yes... yes it did haha
04:43 PM Tom_L: sudo apt list --installed
04:43 PM JT-Shop: makes sense
04:43 PM Tom_L: it makes a list :)
04:43 PM Tom_L: i was looking for that usb lib
04:44 PM Tom_L: forgot what it was called now though
04:45 PM Tom_L: jt was it libusb-1.0-0-dev?
04:45 PM JT-Shop: let me look
04:45 PM Tom_L: it's installed on bookworm so i must have installed it on 11
04:46 PM Tom_L: just happened to have the bookworm ssd plugged in..
04:46 PM JT-Shop: JT-Cave, i had to add one dependency to your list: libusb-1.0-0-dev
04:46 PM Tom_L: not sure why but i did
04:46 PM Tom_L: it _was_ for the linuxcnc install
04:48 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
04:48 PM Tom_dev: libusb-0.1-4/testing,now 2:0.1.12-32 amd64 [installed,auto-removable]
04:48 PM Tom_dev: libusb-1.0-0-dev/testing,now 2:1.0.26-1 amd64 [installed]
04:48 PM Tom_dev: libusb-1.0-0/testing,now 2:1.0.26-1 amd64 [installed,automatic]
04:48 PM Tom_dev: libusb-1.0-doc/testing,now 2:1.0.26-1 all [installed,automatic]
04:49 PM Tom_L: seems like alot of usb libs for something that doesn't use usb
04:56 PM roycroft: we need to detect all the usb device we'll not be using so we'll know what we're missing out on
04:57 PM roycroft: or know what we're smugly rejecting, depending on our attitude
04:59 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I vote "just because"
04:59 PM Tom_L: it's for all the noobs that are bent on trying linuxcnc over usb
05:05 PM CaptHindsight[m]: USB latency test
05:12 PM CaptHindsight[m]: i forget the Mesa pinout for db25 vs 50 headers
05:13 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I have some 6i25's and want to get a 7i47S working
05:14 PM Tom_dev: i use the 7i47s on the mill
05:15 PM Tom_dev: https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1199331/Mesa-5i25.html?page=9
05:16 PM JT-Shop: get a 7i80HD-25 for your 7i47S
05:16 PM Tom_dev: that's what i'd do
05:16 PM Tom_dev: i've got the 7i90 on a parport right now but the 7i80 is the same thing in ethernet version
05:17 PM Tom_dev: 72 io
05:17 PM CaptHindsight[m]: but I already have 6i25's and 7i47s
05:18 PM Tom_dev: you won't get full use of it
05:18 PM Tom_dev: find the pins you need...
05:18 PM CaptHindsight[m]: 50 pin headers "all even pins are grounded."
05:18 PM Tom_dev: uh huh
05:18 PM Tom_dev: except maybe 1 power pin... you might check that
05:18 PM Tom_dev: i forget which row it's on
05:19 PM CaptHindsight[m]: need a couple encoder in's
05:20 PM Tom_dev: i did some resistor dividers for single ended input on some instead of duplex or whatever it's called
05:20 PM CaptHindsight[m]: oh i have some 7i76's as well
05:20 PM Tom_dev: on hte 7i47s card
05:21 PM CaptHindsight[m]: they have some encoder in for closed loop stepping
05:22 PM Tom_dev: you need the analog out?
05:22 PM Tom_dev: P2-22 to 24 for that
05:23 PM CaptHindsight[m]: don't think I need an analog out
05:23 PM CaptHindsight[m]: but I do need closed loop Step and Dir
05:23 PM Tom_dev: i did a custom bitfile on mine
05:25 PM CaptHindsight[m]: yes, might do similar
05:25 PM Tom_dev: i think i used every pin on it
05:25 PM CaptHindsight[m]: handling glass the drive wheels often slip
05:26 PM CaptHindsight[m]: not by much but enough to mess up whatever work you are doing
05:31 PM Tom_L: P49 is power
05:32 PM Tom_L: so not on the GND row
05:38 PM travis_farmer[m]: finally received the material i ordered for my CNC shed's platform... pressure-treated sure has taken a jump! what i thought was going to be $1000 in material came to $1700! but at least it looks like good material. non-twisted, good quality joists. ๐Ÿ™‚
06:06 PM CaptHindsight[m]: opening up old boxes with surprises inside
06:07 PM CaptHindsight[m]: 1920 x 1280 monitor without HDMI, only VGA and DVI
06:08 PM CaptHindsight[m]: and that is where all the PC case accessories are, drive drawers, adapters, rails etc
06:20 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, are you around?
06:21 PM t4nk_fn: does the Pope Poop in his hat?
06:24 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, he's old likely YES
06:25 PM _unreal_: are you there? I think I just lost my internet
06:27 PM acer: wtf my internet just went oput
06:27 PM acer: out
06:30 PM acer is now known as _unreal_
06:30 PM t4nk_fn: another problem solved ;)
06:30 PM _unreal_: I dont know what that was all about
06:31 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, https://www.mountainside-medical.com/products/commode-specimen-collector-hats-800cc
06:31 PM roycroft: um, excuse me
06:31 PM _unreal_: see he likely craps in a hat
06:31 PM roycroft: but you are not describing "old monitors"
06:32 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, regardless
06:32 PM _unreal_: https://github.com/grblHAL/ESP32 I'm trying to solve what I need to edit
06:32 PM roycroft: old monitors have cga connectors, and are typically 640x200 resolution or less
06:32 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, Go into the ESP32 directory and modify settings in grbl/config.h and CMakeLists.txt as needed. Pin assignments and board specific config is in *_map.h files for each individual board.
06:33 PM _unreal_: that is what I'm trying to solve...
06:33 PM _unreal_: My board is the the is the "ESP32 D1 R32"
06:33 PM t4nk_fn: I know, it's exactly the same as with the stm32. with only one alteration, but that's explained in the README
06:33 PM roycroft: and i just went to get a sheet of 15mm baltic birch plywood
06:34 PM roycroft: the price had come down a bit, but the place that has the best prices in town don't have any 15mm in stock, and the price for 12mm 1525x1525 was $249 today
06:34 PM roycroft: you know, the stuff that was $44 last year
06:35 PM * roycroft will probably be using solid wood for today's jig
06:35 PM roycroft: i can build it out of walnut for less than the cost of plywood
06:35 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, I'm just trying to figure out what I need to edit.
06:35 PM roycroft: walnut, one of the hardwoods that has more than doubled in price of late
06:35 PM roycroft: is still cheaper than plywood
06:35 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, https://github.com/grblHAL/ESP32/blob/master/main/espduino-32_wemos_d1_r32_uno_map.h is the map file for my board
06:36 PM t4nk_fn: 25+ years experience building cmc masheens, and an impeccable sense for reading, how could I ever hope to have anything to add man
06:37 PM _unreal_: oh t4nk_fn there are two cmakelist.txt files
06:40 PM CaptHindsight[m]: roycroft: nnaaaahhh, old monitors have VHF tuners in them and a pair of screw terminals for the signal input
06:41 PM XXCoder: roycroft: wow lot
06:41 PM XXCoder: you'd be able to buy 5 on old price.
06:41 PM roycroft: yeah, i think it's about time i start making my own plywood
06:41 PM CaptHindsight[m]: with a round crt, just ask Tom
06:42 PM roycroft: i'm glad just built that outfeed fence for my bandsaw
06:42 PM roycroft: i can slice wide, wafa-thin plies with that setup
06:42 PM XXCoder: how is it made anyway, from home shop side
06:42 PM CaptHindsight[m]: t4nk_fn: I like masheens
06:42 PM roycroft: slice the plies
06:42 PM t4nk_fn: I like money though..
06:42 PM roycroft: edge glue them if they're not wide enough
06:43 PM roycroft: run through a drum sander or wide belt sander to make them a consistent thickness
06:43 PM CaptHindsight[m]: t4nk_fn: ๐Ÿ‘€ U 2
06:43 PM t4nk_fn: (that spelling always reminds me of the movie)
06:43 PM roycroft: and then just glue up the layers, rotating the grain orientation 90 degrees with each layer
06:43 PM t4nk_fn: lol
06:44 PM roycroft: shove it all in a big vacuum bag with a thick platen on the top and bottom of the stack
06:44 PM roycroft: suck out all the air, and wait
06:44 PM XXCoder: interesting. isnt it fairly lossy due to saw width
06:44 PM roycroft: not with a good bandsaw blade and setup
06:44 PM XXCoder: if saw is say 1 mm wide, making 2 mm slices, wouldnt that be 1/3 loss
06:45 PM t4nk_fn: I saw an old x-files ep today, with Joe Bauer in it
06:45 PM roycroft: the blades i get cut a 0.022" kerf
06:46 PM roycroft: if i have things set up well i can cut veneers about 0.090" thick, and sand them down to 0.060" thick, if i want both sides to be smooth
06:46 PM XXCoder: wow pretty thin allright
06:46 PM roycroft: so i'm really only losing about 0.050" per cut if i'm careful and am set up well
06:47 PM roycroft: that's about 50% loss if i'm cutting really thin veneers
06:47 PM XXCoder: overall still lot cheaper than buying laminated
06:47 PM roycroft: but still not bad
06:47 PM roycroft: and i don't have to use good wood for the inner plies
06:47 PM roycroft: it has to be straight and knot-free
06:47 PM roycroft: but alder would work fine
06:47 PM roycroft: and alder is relatively cheap around here - i can get rough alder for <$3/bf
06:49 PM roycroft: a sheet of that $249 plywood is 12.5 board feet, so $19.92/bf
06:49 PM roycroft: now it takes a fair amount of glue to make a sheet of plywood that big
06:49 PM roycroft: i'd probably spend $12 on glue
06:49 PM roycroft: maybe $18 on glue
06:49 PM roycroft: but i'd still be able to make it for well under $100/sheet
06:50 PM XXCoder: not bad. it'd be expensive if you count your own minium wage probably
06:50 PM roycroft: yes, it would take some time
06:50 PM roycroft: but for shop fixtures/jigs i tend not to value my time greatly
06:51 PM roycroft: for actual products i would sell, i'd only make my own plywood when i need superior quality that i can't get elsewhere
06:51 PM CaptHindsight[m]: t4nk_fn: is that where they got the name from?
06:52 PM roycroft: but i'm more likely to get cabinet grade plywood and veneer it with shoop-cut veneer than make the plywood from scratch
06:52 PM roycroft: maybe if i needed totally waterproof plywood i'd make it myself and use epoxy as the adhesive
06:53 PM t4nk_fn: CaptHindsight[m], argh.. I just typed it from memory, but he was actually called Bauers
06:53 PM CaptHindsight[m]: t4nk_fn: related to no particular individual
06:53 PM roycroft: oh, time to start another batch of boxes
06:54 PM CaptHindsight[m]: anyone seen my box of encoder wheels?
06:54 PM XXCoder: yeah its behind you
06:55 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I'll have to masheen some
06:55 PM CaptHindsight[m]: O-rings for grip
06:55 PM t4nk_fn: CaptHindsight[m], 'Bad Blood', s05e12, you just can't watch that and not be reminded of Bauers
06:56 PM CaptHindsight[m]: heh, I'll look for it
06:58 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, now I'm confused I believe the link I posted does not have laser support but this one does https://github.com/markniu/PandaZHU/tree/main/Grbl_Esp32-main
07:02 PM t4nk_fn: _unreal_, there's a README in the spindle subdir.
07:02 PM t4nk_fn: :b
07:23 PM Tom_L: roycroft, you're paying retail for glue too and not buying it by the barrel
07:33 PM CaptHindsight[m]: found the encoder wheels!
07:34 PM CaptHindsight[m]: box was marked "inkjet stuff"
07:34 PM Tom_L: not so fine cpr then
07:35 PM CaptHindsight[m]: from 1000-2400 ppr
07:35 PM Tom_L: that's not so bad
07:36 PM CaptHindsight[m]: inkjet marking for packages is typically 150-300 DPI
07:37 PM CaptHindsight[m]: and an encoder count will = 1 dot
07:37 PM CaptHindsight[m]: they don't do any scaling
07:37 PM CaptHindsight[m]: so you match the encoders count + wheel circumference = DPI
07:40 PM CaptHindsight[m]: ฯ€ * diameter / encoder counts = dots per unit
07:59 PM perry_j1987: evenin
08:30 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, looks like I'm compiling
08:32 PM _unreal_: and it failed. I hate coding and compiling with all of my heart
08:35 PM t4nk_fn: I don't really understand why it has to fail if everything is setup already man
08:36 PM t4nk_fn: unless you're trying impossible configurations
08:37 PM t4nk_fn: in which case it will most probably point out the error of your ways
08:44 PM t4nk_fn: perhaps you're trying too much at once... just start by selecting the right board and compile for that
08:46 PM t4nk_fn: and I don't know if you extirpated to that other repo already, just because it mentions lasers on the front page
08:46 PM t4nk_fn: but I'm telling you.. you'll end up at exactly the same point again
08:59 PM _unreal_: I'm just following the instructions as printed and its failing
08:59 PM _unreal_: brb
09:00 PM acer: cant seem to get SSHD working
09:00 PM acer: sigh
09:01 PM acer is now known as _unreal_
09:01 PM _unreal_: if I could get ssh working and log in to that laptop from this computer I would be 10x better off
09:02 PM _unreal_: right now I'm havinig shell command issues in the IDF.PY
09:02 PM _unreal_: I followed it as instructed and its giving me link issues
09:02 PM _unreal_: linking issues
09:03 PM _unreal_: change directory call command. command fails CMlist.txt not there. go to that folder run the same command. starts going. can not compile from this folder and fails WTF
09:11 PM t4nk_fn: "The choice was made to use the Arduino IDE over the ESP-IDF to make the code a little more accessible to novices trying to compile the code." ... maybe you'll have better luck with the other repo
09:33 PM t4nk_fn: esp-idf should work on windows too btw, so you don't even need the laptop
10:06 PM XXCoder: bah
10:06 PM XXCoder: I hate how mowing almpst kills me
10:06 PM _unreal_: XXCoder, ditto
10:06 PM _unreal_: plus florida heat
10:07 PM XXCoder: its nice and cool here
10:07 PM XXCoder: my vision not tracking makes my brain very tired
10:07 PM XXCoder: and weak due to lack of exercise (due to above) makes me very weak
10:07 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: Hi everyone, I am new in linuxcnc (or in CNC). I wonder is there a way for linuxcnc to do simulation like in ROS and Gazebo. Maybe connected to ROS or some methods else? What kind of Keywords should I type into Google?
10:08 PM _unreal_: t4nk_fn, check msg
10:09 PM XXCoder: BUUUbuuu[m]: aka run a virtual cnc model?
10:10 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: Yeah, just like in Gazebo or Unity3D. Or is there a way to connect to Gazebo or Unity3D. BTW, can I use "reply" in Discord to reply u?
10:11 PM XXCoder: check out VISMACH
10:11 PM XXCoder: its part of linuxcnc. you can use one of prefines, or read 3axis_tutorial and design your own vismach
10:12 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], so your just trying to do a 3d model of the cnc machine?
10:13 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: My actual demand is to make a laser cuttig CNC machine. maybe just need 2 axis
10:13 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: a laser cutting (sry
10:13 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: thank you XXCoder
10:13 PM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTdDBzkMwVQ
10:14 PM XXCoder: one I designed. that file has a lot of comments in vismach file
10:14 PM XXCoder: (it says rolfmill but thats old name)
10:16 PM XXCoder: it hardly covers every possibility. you can import stls as part of machine body for example
10:19 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: xxcoder, thanks for the video!
10:19 PM XXCoder: no problem
10:25 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], what software are you planning to use to generate your laser etching gcode?
10:28 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: @unreal , Actually I am new, I only know maybe the design from my tutor is to use CAM to generate G code from CAD
10:29 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: so now i am learning the way to realize it.....
10:30 PM XXCoder: wow just found this. very interesting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CW92xddvhE
10:30 PM XXCoder: (I dont need one, but interesting design nevertheless)
10:30 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], do you have a laser etcher or are planning on building buying?
10:32 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], ?
10:34 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: @_unreal_, I didn't have one yet. Maybe I need to make it run in the simulation first then plan to buy one
10:35 PM _unreal_: palm to face
10:35 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], s/wear_levelling C:/Espressif/frameworks/esp-idf-v4.4/components/wifi_provisioning C:/Espressif/frameworks/esp-idf-v4.4/components/wpa_supplicant C:/Espressif/frameworks/esp-idf-v4.4/components/xtensa
10:35 PM _unreal_: -- Configuring done
10:35 PM _unreal_: -- Generating done
10:35 PM _unreal_: -- Build files have been written to: C:/Users/berin/Documents/GitHub/ESP32/build
10:35 PM _unreal_: ninja: error: unknown target 'CMakeLists.txt', did you mean '../CMakeLists.txt'?
10:35 PM _unreal_: command "./CMakeLists.txt" is not known to idf.py and is not a Ninja target
10:35 PM _unreal_: PS C:\Users\berin\Documents\GitHub\ESP32>
10:35 PM _unreal_: gaaa? wtf
10:35 PM XXCoder: paste fail
10:35 PM _unreal_: no kidding
10:35 PM _unreal_: https://photos.app.goo.gl/1ejmwQjHGskbBvob9
10:35 PM _unreal_: dont know where that came from
10:35 PM t4nk_fn: yeah, I'm not up for msgs, _unreal_
10:36 PM XXCoder: still better than my paste of entire very long wiki page once
10:36 PM XXCoder: I had to close client to stop spam
10:36 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], look at that link
10:39 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], you can do a cg version of laser etching but that really does not make a lot of sense. BUUUbuuu[m] there is plenty of laser etching software that will generate the laser etching gcode. and do the simulations as well
10:39 PM _unreal_: so trying to build a simulator etc.... is kind of a waste of time
10:41 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], look at lasergrbl software for strters its free. lightburn is not free but very good. and there are plenty of other softwares out there.
10:43 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: ahh thank you a lot @_unreal_, I wonder is there great difference between laser cutting with laser etcher? "LaserGRBL and Lightburn", Nice! Thanks!!
10:43 PM XXCoder: cutter tend to be more powerful than etcher
10:43 PM XXCoder: etcher is enough to etch stuff usually
10:44 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: Can LaserGRBL of Lightburn do the job of laser cutting? It seems they do the job of generating G Code
10:45 PM XXCoder: lasergrbl meh. its cam is not great at all
10:45 PM XXCoder: I like that inkscape addin to generate gcode from svg file
10:45 PM XXCoder: https://all3dp.com/2/inkscape-laser-plugin-tutorial/
10:46 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: Well, maybe just let me have to study these. First time i've seen these things, Really appreciate for spending time helping me !
10:47 PM _unreal_: lasergrbl and lighburn are just software
10:48 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], I think you first need to decide what you are looking for what is your goal
10:48 PM _unreal_: are you looking to just etch, what materials are you looking to etch. are you looking to cut. what materails, what thickness etc....
10:48 PM _unreal_: and on and on
10:48 PM _unreal_: what is your $ budget etc...
10:48 PM _unreal_: do you plan to buy to build
10:48 PM _unreal_: I build that laser etcher in the link I posted
10:48 PM _unreal_: its one of my laser etchers
10:49 PM _unreal_: so what you have solved what you want to do with your goal. following those suggestions I just mentioned, then you have an idea of how to progress.
10:50 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], do you have any background in cad, cam cnc machine of any kind? or computer based graphic design. like using inkscape for example
10:50 PM _unreal_: photo shop, coreldraw
10:51 PM _unreal_: those are a lot of the kinds of tools these guys use depending on what there goal is.
10:51 PM _unreal_: are you planning on dealing with raster art. are you planning on dealing with vector art?
10:51 PM _unreal_: there is a HUGE difference
10:51 PM _unreal_: especiall when it comes to laser use
10:53 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: My work is the project of my professor. He want to make a smart manufacturing system. And the CNC machine is Laser cutter. And the laser cutter is controlled by the linuxcnc, and linuxcnc is controlled by ROS (Robot Operating System) to cooperate with other robots to deliver workpiece and other things. And they are connected with some high performance server to compute.....( Well very complicated.....
10:53 PM XXCoder: fancy
10:54 PM _unreal_: ok so your in collage, university
10:54 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: The laser cutter looks like just operating in 2 Axis, and performs in a high speed( 2/3 M per second)
10:55 PM XXCoder: if youre smart id suggest adjustable z. not nessicarily by stepper and such but by hand
10:55 PM XXCoder: rigid means you have to adjust material to it. which may be much harder to
10:56 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: oh i see...
10:58 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], lasers typically have 3 methods, lens focus, laser movement to a set height for focus, or combos. the other is the work bed can be setup as a Z so the work bed raises and lowers
11:00 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: Z axis for different materials, right?
11:00 PM XXCoder: heights of materials
11:00 PM _unreal_: ether you move the laser up and down or the work bed up and down
11:00 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: I see.
11:00 PM _unreal_: https://photos.app.goo.gl/1ejmwQjHGskbBvob9
11:00 PM XXCoder: I dont know if theres such thing as automated z adjust for laser but you want to be able to change z for focus
11:00 PM _unreal_: on mine, the laser is a working z axis
11:01 PM _unreal_: with a probe. so I can set the focus and probe and always get to the right height
11:01 PM _unreal_: my laser etcher runs on grbl
11:02 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: @unreal, have you used linuxcnc for laser etcher? or just LaserGRBL and lightburn
11:04 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: I think my final goal is to control the process through certain API and visualise them so the system can be expandable.
11:06 PM _unreal_: I use lightburn and lasergrbl
11:06 PM _unreal_: ether will control my laser etcher
11:07 PM _unreal_: linxucnc does not support GRBL
11:07 PM fierycombat[m]: Is Debain the normal base for ? i feel like a boomer not knowing my own OS
11:07 PM _unreal_: fierycombat[m], STOCK lcnc is debian based yes
11:07 PM _unreal_: you can also do uname -al
11:08 PM fierycombat[m]: fair point
11:08 PM _unreal_: lcnc can be compiled for most flavors of linux
11:08 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: fierycombat (@_discord_647318843504721951:jauriarts.org) you can use the command of "cat /proc/version" or some other command in google which is used to check ur version
11:08 PM _unreal_: I've run it on armbian
11:09 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], fyi you can also use IRC like hexchat to be in this server
11:09 PM fierycombat[m]: being honest im not sure how to add features like probing to lcnc
11:09 PM _unreal_: not just discord
11:09 PM fierycombat[m]: and thats my current pain point
11:09 PM fierycombat[m]: hexchat?
11:09 PM _unreal_: your talking on IRC internet relay chat
11:10 PM _unreal_: its bridges between libera.chat an irc server and discord XXCoder could explain it better then I as to the discord side
11:11 PM XXCoder: bridge is irc - matrix - discord
11:11 PM XXCoder: im in discord and irc but not matri
11:11 PM xxcoder[m]: hi self heh
11:12 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: I don't really know how to use IRC.......(The first chatting I use IM) but i can learn how to do so
11:12 PM fierycombat[m]: that is interesting
11:12 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5a50ob8ovQ&t=45s
11:12 PM XXCoder: buu honestly whatever works
11:12 PM XXCoder: im on two because im admin there and op here
11:12 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], all the services have there features
11:13 PM _unreal_: discord is more eye candy
11:13 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: @unreal, I wonder how can he do that, because in the video have few content on the software
11:14 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: I think IRC is great as simple
11:14 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: Discord consumes performance
11:16 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], any controller and software can control a laser system. its more of a gcode requirement. so long as the gcode is setup to function as a laser expects. then it will work just fine.
11:17 PM _unreal_: but its in my opinion, its better to use a software FOR laser etching.
11:17 PM _unreal_: like lightburn, lasergrbl or any other software
11:18 PM _unreal_: grbl in my opinion is a better choice for laser etchers because its a portable setup.
11:19 PM _unreal_: you can switch between different software platforms to control the same machine, like opening different doors in a house.
11:23 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: I see. So if the requirement is cutting a certain things in 2D. All the CNC machine needed is my G Code. For Laser cutting of Laser Etcher, can I use certain programs to generate from my picture (png or dfx) to G Code for laser cutting?
11:24 PM XXCoder: id suggest use vector graphics for laser but basically
11:24 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: Maybe I keep asking dumb questions lmao.
11:25 PM _unreal_: software that is designed for laser use works better
11:25 PM _unreal_: BUUUbuuu[m], in general laser is just 2d
11:26 PM _unreal_: you "can" do 3d but that has to do with having enough laser watt power. and PWM and so on
11:26 PM _unreal_: there are also 5 axis laser etchers but your not likely to get into that
11:26 PM _unreal_: yet
11:32 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: I see. it looks the z axis is just for compensation
11:33 PM _unreal_: On my machine z height is so I can get it to focus fast
11:34 PM _unreal_: also so I can have a constant focus as I'm laser etching. so as I cut deeper in the materals with multi passes it goes deeper
11:34 PM _unreal_: if I want to etch the inside of a bowl it can track
11:35 PM _unreal_: after making a height map with probing
11:40 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: I think that is important to focus on specific laser cutting software but not general CNC program
11:40 PM _unreal_: I would agree
11:40 PM _unreal_: with enough experience then it can work just fine. but one ofthe big differences is how it writes the gcode
11:41 PM _unreal_: you dont want pauses when laser etching/cutting
11:41 PM _unreal_: lot of cuts are done with G01 commands
11:44 PM BUUUbuuu[m]: I see. Thanks for precious advice, again