#linuxcnc Logs
Mar 11 2022
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:56 AM Deejay: moin
01:04 AM t4nk_freenode: 'lo
02:02 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
02:24 AM u0_a140: hi
02:25 AM yaqwsx6 is now known as yaqwsx
02:33 AM CaptHindsight[m]: howdy
03:03 AM enleth: solarwind: I'd solder that, faster, simpler, way less chance of screwup
04:26 AM JT-Cave: morning
04:50 AM Tom_L: morning
07:06 AM JT-Cave: looks like the rain and snow is not due till after 2pm... I might go to foxy this morning and finish up the 3rd copy lathe
08:10 AM snakedLX is now known as snaked
10:47 AM unterhaus_: forecast is for 1" of snow tomorrow instead of 4" of snow. I guess I'll take it
11:34 AM roycroft: 17 and sunny here today
11:34 AM roycroft: but it got down to freezing last night
11:35 AM roycroft: i am going to be doing some gardening work later on, when it warms up
11:51 AM roycroft: does anyone here who has a cnc router use hot glue to hold down workpieces on the bed?
11:52 AM roycroft: ryobi have a nice battery hot glue gun that i just ordered, because i found a milwaukee to ryobi battery adapter
11:52 AM roycroft: i bought it for other uses, but it seems it might work out well for holding down sheet goods on a cnc router
11:52 AM roycroft: or maybe that's a singularly scary idea?
11:53 AM roycroft: i'm thinking dabs along the edges, not big globs in the middle of the sheet goods
11:57 AM unterhaus_: I don't see much talk about hot glue, but there is a long history of using it in machining
11:58 AM unterhaus_: Most people make double sided tape out of painters tape and superglue
11:59 AM unterhaus_: thinner, I guess
12:01 PM unterhaus_: I'm pretty sure if you see one of those american flag carvings it had painters tape on the back
12:04 PM roycroft: i've used it to help fixture parts on jigs/templates for the table saw and the router table
12:04 PM roycroft: i think it would work ok for a cnc router
12:04 PM roycroft: but if it doesn't an attempt could result in a catastrophe
12:06 PM unterhaus_: it's not going to be that much of a catastrophe, unless a ruined workplace is a catastrophe
12:06 PM unterhaus_: workpiece
12:06 PM unterhaus_: but I would use the painter's tape idea, it's extremely popular and not that expensive
12:10 PM unterhaus_: https://www.google.com/search?q=blue+painter%27s+tape+and+superglue
12:10 PM unterhaus_: tormach had a tutorial at one time, but I didn't see it right off
12:18 PM roycroft: the painters tape + ca glue thing does work
12:18 PM unterhaus_: why is there a sparkly pi on google search but only if you use their calculator?
12:18 PM roycroft: and i did not buy the glue gun for that purpose
12:19 PM roycroft: so i don't feel any obligation to use it for that
12:23 PM * roycroft just hopes the battery adapter works, as he's not interested in investing in another battery system
12:25 PM unterhaus_: I used a battery adapter to go from dewalt to dewalt and the only tool it didn't work on was my recip saw
12:25 PM unterhaus_: but I had an off brand adapter, some other adapters might have worked
12:25 PM unterhaus_: it worked great on things like drills
12:27 PM roycroft: the one i ordered is coming from china
12:27 PM roycroft: but i'm not sure how much that matters, other than that it will take the better part of a month to arrive
12:28 PM roycroft: it should be a very simple, passive device
12:28 PM roycroft: as long as the important parts line up properly it should work fine
12:28 PM roycroft: and a glue gun should be a purely resistive load, so if the current gets to the tool it should work
12:28 PM unterhaus_: the thing I disliked about the dewalt converters is they all had a usb power supply in them
12:29 PM unterhaus_: so if you didn't disconnect your battery it would be run down
12:30 PM unterhaus_: as usual all the Chinese vendors decide on one feature set and stick with it even if it doesn't really make sense
12:30 PM roycroft: this one does too
12:30 PM roycroft: but i can probably disconnect that
12:30 PM roycroft: i'm not even sure why it's there
12:31 PM roycroft: i don't consider it a feature
12:31 PM unterhaus_: first guy did it, everyone copies
12:31 PM roycroft: do i need to charge my phone while i'm hot gluing?
12:31 PM roycroft: and won't the usb cable get in the way?
12:31 PM unterhaus_: well the name brand usb converters are $, so if you need it, then it's a deal
12:32 PM unterhaus_: $50 from dewalt, for example
12:32 PM unterhaus_: but I never used it and then I gave all the tools away
12:36 PM roycroft: i paid $15
12:37 PM roycroft: for the battery adapter, that is
12:37 PM roycroft: i don't have any use for usb in my shop
12:37 PM roycroft: but if i did, my craftsman tool chest upper cabinet has a power strip inside with a couple usb ports
12:37 PM roycroft: which is where i store my batteries and chargers anyway
12:50 PM * JT-MachineShop eats a pickled egg then starts some fires
12:52 PM XXCoder: spppppicy pickled egg ;)
12:57 PM unterhaus_: pickled egg sounds good, except I had lunch already
12:58 PM unterhaus_: I made the first step towards moving my mill. Moved the y axis back. The belt is buried inside the knee and likes to fall off the pulley
12:59 PM unterhaus_: spent 20 minutes on he basement floor trying to convince it to get back on the pulley
01:00 PM Loetmichel: Hmm, taskmanager says: Uptime: 269:13:21:58... I think i should reboot that windows here sometime soon ;) (so THATs why there are about 2 dozen "explorer.exe" idling about!)
01:09 PM unterhaus_: Loetmichel, surprised microsoft hasn't rebooted it for you
01:11 PM Loetmichel: unterhaus_: still win7
01:12 PM unterhaus_: I hope it's not on the interwebs then
01:12 PM Loetmichel: there is a "new" win10 gaming box sitting here idling for a year now... still not quite copied all the stuff over that i need... soon though and then i can retire this box.
01:12 PM Loetmichel: as i am typing with you on it....
01:12 PM unterhaus_: okay, well at least it hasn't been locked :)
01:13 PM Loetmichel: ... probably. wouldnt know until i reboot ;)
01:13 PM unterhaus_: they lock your files, don't you know that when you try to open one?
01:14 PM Loetmichel: IIRC it only "locks" you out after a reboot.
01:14 PM unterhaus_: I have some win 7 machines with their ethernet ports taped over
01:14 PM Loetmichel: but that said: i doubt i am careless enough to get that virus.
01:14 PM unterhaus_: the risk there is the IT guys will just come and take the computer when they find it on the network
01:14 PM Loetmichel: i am at home
01:14 PM Loetmichel: not like we dont still have some XP machines at work though
01:15 PM Loetmichel: and I am the (part time) admin there ;)
01:15 PM roycroft: i hates windows 10, i does
01:15 PM Loetmichel: well, Linux is still no option for a gaming box.
01:15 PM roycroft: even though it actually works better than any previous version of windows, for the most part
01:15 PM Loetmichel: soon though ;)
01:15 PM unterhaus_: I guess you get used to something and stick with it
01:16 PM unterhaus_: win 10 is one of the good ones. So win 11 is going to stink
01:16 PM Loetmichel: as i said: the new gaming box is already here with win10
01:16 PM Loetmichel: just still not gotten around to copy all files/programs over and configure it correctly
01:16 PM unterhaus_: they are slowly rolling it out
01:16 PM Loetmichel: or this box here would already be retired
01:18 PM roycroft: except windows 11 doesn't run on most hardware that's more than 47 minutes old
01:20 PM Loetmichel: roycroft: probably will not buy that anyways
01:20 PM roycroft: i don't think they're selling it
01:20 PM roycroft: i think they're trying to impose it on people
01:21 PM Loetmichel: here's hoping that before win10 is off support Linux will be a viable gaming alternative
01:21 PM roycroft: but fortunately for me, i like to use older technology
01:21 PM roycroft: so none of my machines are capable of running windows 11
01:22 PM Loetmichel: well, i still have a running Thinkpad 600E here. with a somewhat recent ubuntu on it.
01:22 PM Loetmichel: youtube is a slideshow though ;)
01:23 PM unterhaus_: I don't mind more secure hardware, but apparently the security stuff that win11 requires is better for rights management
01:24 PM Loetmichel: unterhaus_: s/rights management/user rights dispossession
01:25 PM unterhaus_: I saw something on the lcnc forum where someone said they got something to work even though the computer has a uefi bios
01:25 PM XXCoder: interesting. design of jerrycan https://youtu.be/XwUkbGHFAhs
01:25 PM unterhaus_: I forget when winders stopped allowing users with admin rights to do some actions from guis
01:37 PM XXCoder: seems you can buy NEW jerrycan from harborfright
01:37 PM XXCoder: https://youtu.be/0DBK6pXRZzo
01:54 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
02:33 PM roycroft: traditional jerrycans are illegal to sell in many states
02:34 PM roycroft: the hf ones are not traditional, though
02:35 PM roycroft: the traditional ones may be illegal nationally now - i'm not sure
02:35 PM roycroft: when california banned them they started disappearing everywhere
02:36 PM roycroft: at least in the west
02:37 PM * roycroft thinks it's time to cut the grass and do some gardening work
02:37 PM XXCoder: why was it banned?
03:06 PM roycroft: ventilation and flame guard problems with the lids
03:07 PM roycroft: the old style had no way to capture fumes, which is both a safety and environmental problem
03:27 PM XXCoder: interesting. ok
03:35 PM roycroft: specifically, the old style had an open pour spout without integrated vent, so it also had a vent cap
03:36 PM roycroft: people would install the pour spout, remove the vent cap, pour their fuel, and just leave the can sitting that way
03:36 PM roycroft: usually inside a shed or garage
03:36 PM roycroft: the can would vent fumes, which caused quite a number of explosions/fires
03:36 PM XXCoder: new one has a vent in tube
03:37 PM roycroft: the new style has the vent built into the pour spout, and an auto-shut off mechanism so that when you're not actively pouring the can is sealed
03:37 PM roycroft: the old ones were perfectly safe, if people used them properly
03:37 PM XXCoder: yeah thats the harborfright one. it has auto shut off too
03:37 PM roycroft: but people are both lazy and stupid
03:41 PM XXCoder: some are yeah
03:41 PM roycroft: yes
03:41 PM roycroft: enough that we have to pass regulations protecting them from themselves
03:41 PM roycroft: and in this case, protecting their neighbors from them, since garage/shed fires often spread to other properties
04:16 PM CaptHindsight[m]: it's another lesson in trying to idiot proof something vs building fewer idiots
04:21 PM roycroft: the irony is that it's the idiots who always complain when things have to be idiot proofed
04:47 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
04:55 PM sinned69151 is now known as sinned6915
05:33 PM roycroft: we go on summer time this weekend
05:33 PM roycroft: i wish that would stop
05:34 PM roguish[m]: I agree. DST is dumb
05:35 PM JT-Shop: yep it's just stupid IMHO
05:35 PM roycroft: all three states on the west coast made a pact where if they all passed bills to stay on dst year-rould they would all do so
05:35 PM roycroft: california initiated it
05:35 PM roycroft: but did not pass the bill
05:35 PM JT-Shop: I did figure out how to add translations to my configuration tools
05:35 PM roycroft: washington and oregon did
05:35 PM roycroft: then cali said they would
05:36 PM roycroft: but instead we got bills staying on standard time year-round
05:36 PM roycroft: if we all went on dst year-round all we would need is our state laws
05:36 PM roycroft: but to stay on standard time year-round requires an act of congress in addition to the state laws
05:36 PM JT-Shop: standard time is fine
05:36 PM roycroft: so that's not going to happen
05:36 PM JT-Shop: really, why
05:36 PM roycroft: i don't care which it is, as long as it does not change
05:37 PM roycroft: weird laws
05:37 PM JT-Shop: exactly it's just a stupid number
05:37 PM roycroft: your chickens don't care what time it is
05:37 PM roycroft: they care when it's light and they care when it's dark
05:37 PM roycroft: why should we be any different?
05:37 PM JT-Shop: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permanent_time_observation_in_the_United_States
05:38 PM JT-Shop: they care about sunrise and sunset but not what number we say it is
05:38 PM roycroft: ok, so i was wrong
05:38 PM roycroft: cali did not pass the wrong legislation
05:38 PM roycroft: they just went wishy-washy
05:38 PM roycroft: but the bottom line is this:
05:39 PM roycroft: both the washington and oregon laws do not take effect unless and until california also passes the same law
05:39 PM roycroft: so we've done our part
05:40 PM JT-Shop: it's probably illegal in cali...
05:40 PM roguish[m]: is that to stay on regular time, or stay on DST ???
05:40 PM roycroft: i just read that wikipedia page
05:40 PM JT-Shop: The law requires states to change clocks biannually between standard time and DST on federally mandated dates, and it permits states to opt out of DST observation altogether and remain on permanent standard time. It does not permit observation of permanent DST.
05:40 PM roycroft: it's actually not exactly as i described
05:41 PM roycroft: remaining on standard time year-round is what does not require an act of congress
05:41 PM roycroft: remaining on dst year round does
05:41 PM roguish[m]: who opts out? I think Hawaii and Arizona
05:41 PM roycroft: but the law passed in washington an oregon calls for remaining on dst year-round, or moving to mst
05:42 PM XXCoder: wa state passed sticking to either
05:42 PM roycroft: there is one small section of oregon that is in mst, and it remains on standard time year-round
05:42 PM roycroft: parts of indiana are in cst and parts are in est
05:42 PM XXCoder: not decided on either direction
05:42 PM roycroft: and parts of indiana remain on standard time year-round
05:42 PM roycroft: and parts go on dst
05:42 PM roycroft: indiana is the really messed up time state
05:43 PM roycroft: but indiana is also one of two states that attempted to legislate the value of pi as exactly 3
05:43 PM roycroft: so i think that state is mathematically challenged to begin with
05:43 PM * Tom_L sets his clock 10 min off
05:43 PM JT-Shop: looks like Missouri is working on pst
05:44 PM Tom_L: pi day is monday
05:44 PM roycroft: i have not lived back east since 1980
05:44 PM Tom_L: swamp time
05:44 PM roycroft: i don't remember exactly how the indiana mess works out
05:44 PM Tom_L: probably still a mess
05:45 PM roycroft: i am from chicago (actually born in indiana), and i do recall that northwestern indiana is in cst, as it's essentially an extension of the chicacgo suburbs
05:45 PM roycroft: eastern and souther indiana are in est
05:45 PM roycroft: paducha kentucky is in both time zones
05:45 PM roycroft: paduchah
05:45 PM roycroft: or however they spell it
05:45 PM Tom_L: after tomorrow's low of 18 we will be on a warming trend
05:45 PM Tom_L: i hope
05:46 PM roycroft: and i think it's some of the indiana suburbs of that city that are in est that don't go on dst
05:46 PM Tom_L: 75 by wed
05:46 PM roycroft: 19 today
05:46 PM roycroft: that is the curren temperature here
05:46 PM roycroft: i got the front lawn mowed, and i started cleaning up garden beds, but the soil is really really wet still
05:47 PM roycroft: it's a bit too early to do gardening, i'm afraid
05:47 PM JT-Shop: hmm my book is in the mailbox...
05:47 PM roycroft: my glue gun is in the mail
05:47 PM JT-Shop: I have some tomato starts
05:47 PM roycroft: the battery adapter is not, and it is coming from china, so it will be the end of the month before i get it
05:47 PM roycroft: i was looking for some parsley starts today, and nobody has them yet
05:48 PM roguish[m]: I have planted onions and garlic in big pots on the front porch. they're doing fine.
05:48 PM roycroft: there's virtually nothing for veggie/herb starts at the nurseries yet
05:48 PM roycroft: which is odd, because usually they start stocking mid-february
05:48 PM roycroft: alliums can be planted in the fall
05:48 PM roycroft: or very early spring
05:49 PM JT-Shop: have you seen a ringmaster?
05:50 PM roycroft: i have never visited mordor, sorry
05:50 PM JT-Shop: https://ringmasterlathe.com/build-my-ringmaster/
05:50 PM XXCoder: one does not simply walk to mordor
05:51 PM roycroft: i haven't seen that, but i've seen other jigs to cut rings like that
05:52 PM JT-Shop: looks like a simple jig to me
05:52 PM JT-Shop: photos are fuzzy lol
05:52 PM roycroft: yes
05:52 PM roycroft: and i don't remember the details of what i've seen, as it's not something i've been interested in doing, but iirc they were pretty striaghtforward
05:52 PM XXCoder: interesting
05:53 PM JT-Shop: I just thought it was a bit interesting
05:53 PM roycroft: besides my cnc router, my current interest in in rose engines and linear engraving engines
05:54 PM roycroft: i'd like to figure out how to do some of that kind of engraving without having to spend tens of thousands of dollars for a fancy victorian era design machine
05:58 PM * JT-Shop wanders inside for the night
05:58 PM JT-Shop: but waits for Nickel Creek to finish
06:00 PM roycroft: i heard they were getting back together, but i've not seen any new music or tours
06:00 PM roycroft: but i heard that right before the pandemi
06:00 PM roycroft: c
06:01 PM roycroft: so perhaps that has something to do with it
06:01 PM roycroft: back in the day, i saw them every year when they came to eugene
06:02 PM roycroft: and about ten years ago, i went to the prairie home companion show (at a lovely outdoor venue)
06:02 PM roycroft: that was when sara watkins was part of the troupe
06:02 PM roycroft: and before garrison keillor was outed as a prevert
06:06 PM roycroft: oh, they did reunite and released an album in 2014
06:07 PM roycroft: groovy
06:07 PM roycroft: i'll have to find it
06:43 PM XXCoder: nice myfordboy video. (second for day)
06:49 PM CaptHindsight[m]: sundown should be as late as possible, early risers get up before the sun anyway
06:51 PM CaptHindsight[m]: nothing good happens before Noon anyway
06:52 PM CaptHindsight[m]: why armies always invade early
06:53 PM CaptHindsight[m]: you never hear "synchronize your watches, the battle begins at 17:00"
06:53 PM XXCoder: so, 5 pm?
06:53 PM silopolis[m]: Hi guys
06:53 PM silopolis[m]: What crimping tool should I favor for my nc electrical cabinet, 4 or 6 jaws?
06:53 PM XXCoder: ah early lol
06:54 PM CaptHindsight[m]: yes, the military version :)
06:54 PM silopolis[m]: For those nice little round ferrules?
06:54 PM CaptHindsight[m]: silopolis: I have both based on size of the connector
06:55 PM CaptHindsight[m]: my smaller one is a 6
06:55 PM CaptHindsight[m]: RG and BNC also tend to be 6 sided
06:56 PM silopolis[m]: OK so 6 seem the good choice as I can't imagine bigger wires than 6mm in such application
06:57 PM enleth: silopolis[m]: ideally both if you expect using wires thick enough to be at the very capacity of screw terminals you'll be wiring - square-crimped ferrules fit better into square-shaped screw terminals (DIN-mounted breakers, most of the green Phoenix Contact PCB terminals, etc.), hexagonal crimp fits into round hole terminals better (brass busbars, for example)
06:58 PM enleth: both fit anything if the wire is smaller than the terminal's maximum size but it's pretty damn hard to force a 6mm^2 square into a hole made for a 6mm^2 circle
06:59 PM enleth: other than that, above 10mm^2 hex is just easier to operate, less displacement needed so it takes less force
07:00 PM silopolis[m]: Excellent, all I needed to know, will get both then!
07:00 PM silopolis[m]: Thank you guys 👍
07:02 PM enleth: 10 years ago those crimpers used to be expensive, but now they're so cheap you can get a set of four (1-6mmsq, 4-16mmsq, both in square and hex) for the price of one from back then
07:02 PM CaptHindsight[m]: how much longer until everyone moves away from buying from China?
07:02 PM enleth: and to be honest, I've never noticed a quality difference between the cheapest ones and brand name models
07:03 PM enleth: durability might be different, but they crimp just as well
07:03 PM CaptHindsight[m]: yeah durability of the jaws
07:03 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I have jaws from the 70's the still work
07:03 PM CaptHindsight[m]: my cheap ChinaCo crimpers will be long worn out in 10 years
07:04 PM CaptHindsight[m]: s/the/that/
07:04 PM enleth: if you use them daily, absolutely
07:06 PM enleth: as for buying chinese - I sure hope whatever good comes out of the current shitshow includes "the West" getting the final wakeup call to actually go back to being able to manufacture all the crap we need
07:07 PM enleth: I don't mean "all of it en masse", but definitely "all the different kinds of it, with the ability to scale up if absolutely necessary"
07:10 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I agree, I hope there is a wake up
07:10 PM enleth: "service economy" sounds nice and all, but loses a bit of its appeal when you realize you still need *stuff* and you no longer know how to make it, so you need to buy from people you'd rather not associate with and fund them
07:10 PM silopolis[m]: <enleth> "10 years ago those crimpers used..." <- Oh?! Have to look for such a set then
07:11 PM enleth: silopolis[m]: well, I don't mean a "set" literally, just that it's not a huge deal to get a full range of sizes in both shapes
07:11 PM silopolis[m]: Oh ok lol
07:12 PM enleth: BTW, the regular small ones are normally rated up to 6mm^2, but they will physically fit a 12mm^2 ferrule, just barely, and do a useful crimp on them
07:12 PM enleth: it's quite the workout for your hands, though
07:13 PM silopolis[m]: Will start with a couple of quad and hex 6mm pliers, and expand if need be
07:14 PM enleth: I've had to do a whole bunch of daisy-chained 6mm^2 wiring using those double size ferrules with a widened plastic skirt, got a 4-16mm crimper *very* fast
07:14 PM enleth: the 16mm will fit a 20mm and 25mm ferrule too, same deal
07:15 PM enleth: above that, you'll want a different kind of tool
07:16 PM silopolis[m]: Project is to build a small lcnc learn/doc/dev rig so hope small ones should be enough
07:17 PM enleth: yeah, 6mm^2 of copper should be well above anything you need there
07:17 PM silopolis[m]: 220v single phase powered
07:18 PM enleth: you're probably not even going to need anything more than 2.5mm
07:18 PM silopolis[m]: Thinking of using a 2 post open frame 12U 19" rack for structure
07:19 PM silopolis[m]: Electronics on one side on DIN rails with wire ducts
07:20 PM silopolis[m]: Axis and other stuff on the other side
07:24 PM silopolis[m]: Is there somewhere I can find docs for a state of the art main power stage design? I mean from wall outlet to DC PSUs, with breakers, contactors, estop, filters, etc?
07:26 PM {HD}_ is now known as {HD}
07:42 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qV7l_8NHyXc
07:42 PM CaptHindsight[m]: over 10 parts ^^
07:44 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1spLdOKVg94
08:56 PM XXCoder: andypugh: yo
08:56 PM XXCoder: just saw your video. interesting but wouldnt rounded edges make chain stronger?
09:09 PM roycroft: pizza is almost ready
09:10 PM roycroft: and not a moment too soon - all that yard work has worked up an appetite in me
09:12 PM roycroft: i've discovered that i haven't kept up my exercise well enough over the winter
09:12 PM roycroft: i'm in worse shape than i thought, so i guess it's time to work on that
09:12 PM Tom_L: by eating pizza?
09:13 PM Tom_L: what flavor are we having tonight?
09:17 PM roycroft: the eating of the pizza is not part of the workout program
09:17 PM roycroft: it's the weekly indulgence
09:18 PM roycroft: and tonight it's a rosemary crust with red sauce, anchovies, lion's mane mushrooms, roasted red peppers, black olives, and mozzarella and fontina cheese
11:45 PM snakedGT is now known as snaked