#linuxcnc Logs

Dec 23 2021

#linuxcnc Calendar

01:11 AM Deejay: moin
01:26 AM randy: morning
01:41 AM t4nk_freenode: 'ĺo
03:03 AM Loetmichel: *grmbl*. Clock says 7 hours work left for this year... 3d-printer says: "ETE 8:39h" :(
04:25 AM mrec: does anyone know a video application that allows to draw on the screen?
04:51 AM Tom_L: morning
05:38 AM JT-Cave: morning
07:17 AM Tom_L: mrec, http://psha.org.ru/b/camview-emc.html https://github.com/jieter/linuxcnc-config/blob/master/notes/camview.md
07:33 AM mrec: Tom_L: I don't want to get that one, I want to get the source of it
07:33 AM mrec: but the source is not available anymore
07:39 AM randy: at least OBS can do overlay with severeal stream sourcen
07:40 AM randy: mplayer should handle a overlay as well
07:52 AM mrec: obs?
08:05 AM randy: https://obsproject.com/download
08:28 AM CloudEvil: mplayer might accept subtitle input from a pipe
08:28 AM CloudEvil: As a hack, apart from any other functionality
08:29 AM mrec: I'm using mplayer now
08:30 AM CloudEvil: http://www.mplayerhq.hu/DOCS/tech/slave.txt
08:30 AM CloudEvil: 'add an overlay bitmap
08:30 AM mrec: I'll try CamPY later
11:52 AM JT-Shop: something is wonky on the machine shop windblows pc... tbird won't download messages and I can't connect to a plc
12:24 PM unterhaus: JT-Shop, maybe a firewall gone rogue
12:27 PM unterhaus: I threaded a flap sander onto my angle grinder and it turns out I should have used a spacer and now I can't get it off
12:28 PM JT-Shop: no firewall that I know of is on the pc
12:31 PM unterhaus: what version? They have had a firewall on winblows for quite some time
12:34 PM roycroft: jt-shop - you're using woocommerce now, aren't you?
12:34 PM unterhaus: you have to enable logging, it's very useful sometime
12:35 PM JT-Shop: roycroft, yes on my Mesa store
12:35 PM JT-Shop: enable logging for windblows?
12:35 PM unterhaus: enable logging for the windows firewall
12:35 PM JT-Shop: windblows 7
12:35 PM unterhaus: definitely has a firewall then
12:36 PM JT-Shop: would the firewall be between the usb port because I get a weird error when I try to connect to it
12:36 PM unterhaus: surprised you haven't run afoul of it before, it's set up pretty tight
12:36 PM unterhaus: I'm not sure
12:37 PM roycroft: there have been a number of security updates to woocommerce and many of the plugins that use woocommerce recently - if you're not keeping up with updates, you might check on that
12:37 PM unterhaus: ok, a quick google says that usb can be treated like its network
12:38 PM JT-Shop: roycroft, I keep woocommerce updated now
12:38 PM JT-Shop: thanks for the heads up
12:39 PM roycroft: woocommerce seems to be a big hacker target
12:39 PM roycroft: probably because you are one of the few people in the universe who keeps up on plugin updates
12:39 PM JT-Shop: I do now! After last time letting it get way out of date
12:40 PM roycroft: there is just so much wordpress in the world, and most of it completely unmaintained
12:40 PM roycroft: people pay to have a wordpress site set up, and then they do absolutely nothing to keep it up to date
12:41 PM roycroft: i just finished doing close to 800 plugin updates on the sites we host, most of them woocommerce related
12:41 PM roycroft: and i do this regulary
12:41 PM JT-Shop: dang
12:41 PM roycroft: in fact, today was a typical update day
12:41 PM roycroft: i spend the time doing all the updates
12:41 PM roycroft: and by the time i'm done there are dozen or so new updates that have come out
12:42 PM roycroft: i fortunately have tools to automate much of this
12:42 PM roycroft: including my favorite tool - wpcli
12:42 PM roycroft: cd $DocumentRoot
12:42 PM roycroft: wp plugin update --all
12:43 PM roycroft: wp theme update --all
12:43 PM roycroft: cd -
12:43 PM roycroft: but i still have to visit every site when it's done to rebuild the woocommerce database and make sure everything is ok
12:44 PM roycroft: and i still have to do a backup of the documentroot and database for every site right before updating, and nuke those backups after i verify the site is ok
12:44 PM roycroft: but that is all part of my scripts
12:59 PM roycroft: the kim potter verdict is about to be announced
01:08 PM * Tom_L knocks off early and starts the holiday
02:07 PM * JT-Shop waits for the guy to come buy his old dust collector
02:10 PM Rhine_Labs: Reflow.. https://www.stevenrhine.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/Novastar-1400-Series-Model-1000-1024x576.jpg
02:24 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Rhine_Labs: what do you use for pick and place?
02:26 PM Rhine_Labs: Hands and Eyes..
02:26 PM Rhine_Labs: Would like a pick and place machine.
02:30 PM JT-Shop: home made dust collector gone and he had the same planer I have so I sold him a set of new knives and gave him the old head with good knifes in it
04:46 PM JT-Shop: geez I worked 9 to 5 today
04:46 PM JT-Shop: gotta cut that out
04:56 PM Tom_L: no kidding
04:56 PM Tom_L: makes us all look bad
04:56 PM JT-Shop: got the frame for the whirlpool assembly machine ready to weld up I think... front and back are tacked and all the side pieces are in place with a zillion clamps
05:16 PM roycroft: well i'm all done with work until tuesday
05:16 PM roycroft: that's nice
05:27 PM Tom_L: JT-Shop, better keep the lift so you can change your shop lightbulbs
05:29 PM JT-Shop: it only goes 45 1/2" high lol... the shop lights are 12' up!
05:30 PM JT-Shop: https://semo.craigslist.org/tls/d/poplar-bluff-autoquip-series-35-scissor/7424338769.html
05:31 PM XXCoder: put ladder on 2 of em ;)
05:31 PM Tom_L: i pictured a powered one
05:31 PM XXCoder: kidding
05:31 PM JT-Shop: aye I know what you had in your mind a man lift
05:31 PM Tom_L: weighing 4k not lifting 4k
05:31 PM JT-Shop: this guy must be dreaming https://semo.craigslist.org/tls/d/buffalo-hd-cherry-picker-engine-hoist/7419762037.html
05:32 PM Tom_L: i'd say
05:33 PM XXCoder: how much for usual used?
05:33 PM JT-Shop: $50-$100
05:33 PM JT-Shop: for a rusty one like that and not a compact model either
05:34 PM Tom_L: is that an air pack on it?
05:34 PM XXCoder: interesting
05:34 PM Tom_L: or for a power pack
05:34 PM JT-Shop: looks like it
05:34 PM Tom_L: maybe a power pack
05:34 PM Tom_L: i gave one of those away
05:35 PM Tom_L: bud had it on his press and went electric instead so he gave it to me and it set on the shelf for several years
05:35 PM JT-Shop: time to call it a day... Mabel is almost done living
05:38 PM roycroft: i am convinced that some ebay tool postings are not tool postings at all
05:38 PM roycroft: they're ways for crime syndicates to send coded messages to each other
05:39 PM roycroft: that makes more sense than the prices on some of that stuff
05:40 PM roycroft: especially the ones with the insane prices that say "no lowball offers" at the end
06:57 PM XXCoder: weird. mtmwood have been silent for quite a while
06:57 PM XXCoder: and suddenly so many videos
07:56 PM roycroft: if i am going to use alignment pins to locate a part, should i ream the holes to -0.001" and +0.001" on the respective components, so there is a friction fit where the pin lives and a close fit on the mating part?
07:56 PM roycroft: or maybe -0.001" and the exact size bore on the mating part?
08:19 PM * roycroft is thinking the latter would be best, especially considering these parts should be mated for life once assembled
08:47 PM XXCoder: well can always test
08:49 PM roycroft: i'd rather get it right the first time
08:50 PM roycroft: the collective wisdom of the channel is as good as a test
08:50 PM roycroft: better, since i'll get the right answer and won't have to perform the experiment
09:18 PM enleth: roycroft: the process used to locate, drill and ream the holes is more important than the specific tolerances anyway
09:20 PM enleth: whether you create the holes in situ, with the parts mated, or as a machining step of each individual part, for starters
09:22 PM enleth: oh, and try not to make the holes blind if you can help it and there is even the most remote chance of someone fumbling the disassembly so much they snap a pin
09:22 PM roycroft: i cannot locate them in situ
09:22 PM roycroft: and they will be blind
09:23 PM roycroft: but the pins will be large enough that they would be difficult to snap
09:25 PM roycroft: but upon reflection, the pins will not be the mechanisms for the final alignment of the assembled parts, so perhaps a slip fit would be best for one of the componets
09:25 PM enleth: well then making sure they end up in correct places relative to each other is a much bigger concern than how to ream them,
09:25 PM enleth: oh, in this case it would
09:26 PM roycroft: i'll be mounting a bracket on a backing plate
09:26 PM roycroft: and that backing plate will in turn mount on another plate, and all adjustments will be made between the two plates
09:27 PM roycroft: in the event that the bracket ever needs to be removed, which is unlikely, i'd just have to redo the alignment procedure between the two plates after
09:27 PM roycroft: i just want to use the pins to locate the bracket more repeatably than the bolt holes would offer
09:28 PM enleth: yeah, press fit and slip fit
09:29 PM roycroft: which, of course, presents me with an opportunity to justify the purchase of an over/under reamer set
09:29 PM enleth: -0.02mm and +0.04mm to +0.06mm would be my choice
09:29 PM Tom_L: i personally would never put an alignment pin in a blind hole
09:31 PM Tom_L: the clearance also is a factor of the pin diameter but generally speaking enleth is right
09:32 PM roycroft: the pins will be 1/4"/~6mm
09:32 PM Tom_L: the fit on a .125" won't be the same as the fit on a 1" pin
09:33 PM Tom_L: don't rely on trying to align the hole separate. they should be mating when you ream the hole
09:34 PM enleth: I assumed a 6-12mm range for pin diameter, that accomodates everything I've ever had first-hand experience with other than an offset printing press held togerher with 30mm pins
09:34 PM Tom_L: most will be in that range yes
09:35 PM enleth: Tom_L: yeah, at least one hole not being blind makes the process almost easy
09:36 PM Tom_L: if you don't, you're just introducing chances for more error
09:36 PM roycroft: the collective wisdom of the channel is suggesting i might not want to bother with the alignment pins at all
09:36 PM enleth: pre-drill undersize, mate and align, gang drill to reaming size, gang ream to press fit, separate parts, ream one to slip fit
09:37 PM roycroft: your method would have the best chance of working out, especially on a small machine like mine
09:38 PM roycroft: and if i decided to do it that way, i can make the bracket the slip fit part, which i already anticipated doing
09:38 PM roycroft: and i could ream the slip fit hole immediately after the interference fit hole, before moving the mill table
09:39 PM enleth: roycroft: if the bracket is loaded in shear and the load is substantial, pins are also a good way to take some weight off of fasteners
09:39 PM Tom_L: those precision holes my friend had to do were honed to size
09:39 PM roycroft: i don't need any of this to be high precision
09:39 PM Tom_L: -0.0000 +0.0001
09:40 PM roycroft: and the load will not be that great such that the pins would be useful to relieve the shear load
09:40 PM Tom_L: and the idiots he did them for checked them with calipers the first time
09:40 PM roycroft: i'm just mounting a 4kg spindle in a bracket that weighs about 1.5kg
09:40 PM Tom_L: i know
09:40 PM roycroft: and mounting the bracket vertically on a backing plate
09:40 PM roycroft: i really am not concerned about the shear load on the mounting bolts
09:41 PM Tom_L: when you are done though you will want to find the limits of your mill
09:42 PM Tom_L: one reason i did those cutter tests i posted
09:44 PM roycroft: i had to pad an amazon order the other day, btw
09:44 PM Tom_L: cotton?
09:44 PM roycroft: and i added one of those $20 spoil board cutters that was suggested
09:44 PM Tom_L: popcorn?
09:44 PM Tom_L: :)
09:44 PM roycroft: a 5% off coupon popped up, so that was nice
09:45 PM roycroft: i figured i would try that before getting the $150 amana cutter with the $30 inserts
09:45 PM Tom_L: shell mill?
09:45 PM Tom_L: i wish i could find a shell mill for the sherline spindle head
09:46 PM Tom_L: all they have is that single insert thing
09:47 PM roycroft: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07VCZVKL7
09:47 PM roycroft: that
09:47 PM Tom_L: for wood
09:47 PM roycroft: vs. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B077HWY1DS
09:47 PM roycroft: yes
09:48 PM Tom_L: is that 2" to the insert tips or the OD?
09:49 PM roycroft: it says 2-1/2" od
09:49 PM roycroft: so i'd say 2" to the insert tips
09:49 PM roycroft: it gets great reviews
09:49 PM Tom_L: i didn't read it all
09:49 PM roycroft: and i don't mind that $150 up front cost
09:49 PM roycroft: but inserts are $30 each, so it's $90 every time they need to be replaced
09:50 PM roycroft: i can buy a lot of $20 cutters for the cost of maintaining that one
09:50 PM roycroft: if the inserts were $10 each or less it would make more sense
09:51 PM Tom_L: i would want a small radius on the inserts
09:51 PM Tom_L: those look sharp tipped
09:51 PM roycroft: no they actually have small flats
09:51 PM Tom_L: well, the replacements anyway
09:51 PM Bleepshop: Who's awake that runs a Huangyang 2.2kW VFD ?
09:52 PM roycroft: which for a spoil board cutter i think is fine
09:52 PM Tom_L: who want's to know?
09:52 PM roycroft: i am awake
09:52 PM roycroft: and i have multiple huanyang 2.2kw vfds
09:52 PM * Bleepshop is conplenplating something between voodoo and black magic...
09:52 PM roycroft: all the small ones are the hy series, though
09:53 PM Tom_L: Bleepshop, there is blue smoke in that box too so be careful
09:53 PM roycroft: please provide your precise latitude and longitude, so i can set up the telescope to observe the blue smoke
09:53 PM Bleepshop: Can i tell the VFD to sequence/interlock the outputs inputs ?
09:55 PM Bleepshop: Ive got a pump with a SSR controlling it and a 'is the pump running?' feedback signal from the return line to the tank. Can I tell the VFD to fire the pump and then if it gets the 'Pump OK' fire the spindle ?
09:56 PM roycroft: i'm not sure
09:56 PM roycroft: i can tell you that if you contact huanyang, they're very responsive
09:57 PM Bleepshop: The pump needs to run for 10-15 seconds to activate the OK switch and if it fails it drops out in <5 seconds.
09:57 PM Bleepshop: I figure that should be quick enough to not fry the spindle.
09:58 PM roycroft: is this an 80mm 400Hz spindle?
09:58 PM Tom_L: coolant pump or spindle coolant pump?
09:58 PM Bleepshop: roycroft: Yeah, Full kit from Huangyang.
09:58 PM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPzccsEked8 pretty cool. making star on lathe
09:58 PM roycroft: if it's just the coolant pump you're probably ok
09:59 PM Bleepshop: Spindle coolant pump. I've got air/mist coolant rigged already.
09:59 PM roycroft: but i can tell you that those spindles belch out the blue smoke if you even look at them funny
09:59 PM roycroft: you have to master stoic observation when you use one
10:00 PM Bleepshop: roycroft: I heard rumors about that which is why I dropped the extra $45 on the 4 year replacement plan. It'll last or Amazoink will go broke. LMAO
10:01 PM roycroft: the one i'm using in my router table is at least 4 years old
10:01 PM roycroft: but i programmed its vfd properly
10:02 PM roycroft: and i'm sure to always exude confidence when i an using it
10:07 PM roycroft: tom_l: those inserts below the cutter listing are not for that cutter
10:07 PM roycroft: https://www.amazon.com/Amana-Tool-RCK-457-DLC-Cutting-Diamond-Like/dp/B07WMXTFC6
10:07 PM roycroft: those are the ones for it
10:07 PM roycroft: note the flats
10:07 PM Tom_L: once again i wasn't looking that closely...
10:07 PM roycroft: yes
10:08 PM Tom_L: those are probably good for wood
10:08 PM roycroft: and since you're not shopping for them, you're not expected to be looking closely
10:09 PM roycroft: i think they would probably be great for wood at $7.50 each
10:10 PM roycroft: but at $29.74 each they're not good for anything but amana's bottom line
10:10 PM roycroft: or so i suspect
10:10 PM Tom_L: i'd look for another brand with that geometry
10:11 PM Tom_L: they're likely not numbered the same as metal
10:11 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/inserts/Carbide_inserts.html
10:11 PM Tom_L: i saved that from a site because i knew i'd never remember the site
10:12 PM roycroft: right now i have no way to use any spoil board cutter
10:12 PM roycroft: or any reason to use one
10:12 PM roycroft: but when that day comes, i'll be trying the $20 one
10:13 PM Bleepshop: I was actually amazed at how well the $20, 4-flute, 2" Binstak spoilboard cutter held up. It took me finding a #10x1.25 screw on a 0.125" hogging cut to hurt it. And I've got the 1/2 a screw [lengthwise] that it missed shredding. LOL
10:13 PM Tom_L: i have a fly cutter i have used on my sacrificial plate
10:14 PM Bleepshop: Tom_L: How are you holding the flies down? Clamps or a vacuum plate? ;D
10:14 PM Tom_L: grubs
10:14 PM Bleepshop: Oh! Grug screws. LOL
10:14 PM roycroft: that's the one i ordered, bleepshop
10:14 PM roycroft: i believe per your recommendation
10:17 PM Bleepshop: I was hogging white oak endgrain at 12k RPM, 0.25" cut, 45% stepover, 300 IPM and throwing chips all over hell for days before that screw turned up.
10:18 PM roycroft: i'll probably get an insert cutter at some point
10:18 PM roycroft: likely not the amana
10:18 PM roycroft: but the binstak will certainly be fine to get me going
10:19 PM roycroft: and maybe it will work so well i'll not bother with an insert cutter
10:21 PM Bleepshop: 4" at 6k was burning the surface and I have 2 more of the 2" and a 3" with replacable inserts on order which should be arriving next week. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08T7K84WN/
10:22 PM roycroft: i don't anticipate i'll need it often
10:23 PM roycroft: but as i've zero experience with a cnc router, i really don't know
10:24 PM Bleepshop: I'm using them to surface cut slabs in a commercial shop. Funny thing was the boss was all gung-ho to ship the 2" off to the sharpener till I pointed out they'd want $30 to sharpen a $20 cutter. LOL
10:25 PM roycroft: i just need to make my spoil board flat
10:26 PM Tom_L: how will you mount it?
10:26 PM Bleepshop: I'm takeing dried, sawmill cut slabs and surfacing them down to ~0.002 from totally flat. Couple of passes though the sander to smooth out the tool marks and it's a tabletop.
10:26 PM roycroft: my intent is to use the cnc router to make jigs and fixtures out of mdf and plywood
10:27 PM roycroft: jigs, fixtured, and templates
10:27 PM Bleepshop: roycroft: Bootstrap into a stressed member table?
10:27 PM roycroft: pretty simple needs
10:27 PM roycroft: and i'm building the cnc router on top of my current router table
10:27 PM roycroft: which i may modify somewhat to accomodate the cnc router addition