#linuxcnc Logs
Nov 19 2021
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:01 AM roycroft: i was at a usenix in 2000 or so when miguel de icaza gave a talk about gnome
12:09 AM roycroft: it was kind of funny in a way, because he spent the whole talk trashing unix and how horribly it was designed, and said that gnome aims to "fix" the problems with unix and make it more like a microsoft operating system
12:09 AM roycroft: the funny part is that dennis ritchie was attending the talk
12:09 AM roycroft: dmr did not react, but the talk was not receieved well by the rest of the room
12:17 AM XXCoder: i just use xfce
12:19 AM CaptHindsight[m]: FinboySlick: is it winter up there yet?
12:19 AM CaptHindsight[m]: we are getting some flurries tonight
12:19 AM CaptHindsight[m]: maybe down to -6C
12:20 AM FinboySlick: Had our first snow today but rain washed it off.
12:21 AM XXCoder: eclipse should be starting now
12:21 AM XXCoder: impossible to see here, but maybe you guys can
12:22 AM CaptHindsight[m]: thanks for the reminder
12:22 AM CaptHindsight[m]: I'll peek outside in a bit, we are actually clear at times
12:23 AM FinboySlick: It's a lunar eclipse?
12:23 AM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.timeanddate.com/eclipse/map/2021-november-19
12:23 AM XXCoder: https://www.timeanddate.com/live/eclipse-lunar-2021-november-19
12:23 AM XXCoder: lol capt bit faster
12:24 AM XXCoder: fin yeah thats why half of world can see it
12:24 AM XXCoder: lunar clipse is actually rarer than solar, but solar eclipse is harder to catch
12:24 AM CaptHindsight[m]: max here in 2 hours
12:25 AM XXCoder: max 2 hours all over at once :)
12:25 AM CaptHindsight[m]: think I'll watch a movie and then take a look
12:29 AM FinboySlick: "Almost get the full thing but I'm in the partial zone.
12:52 AM roycroft: well the eclipse is starting, and there is 100% cloud cover and light rain
12:59 AM CaptHindsight[m]: i put that $8k rotary positioner on a $800 chinese cnc mill for a bit
12:59 AM CaptHindsight[m]: it just felt wrong
01:00 AM XXCoder: roy yep theres live video of it in least
01:00 AM XXCoder: starts at 16 min or so
01:00 AM CaptHindsight[m]: the positioner is accurate to microns and the table of the CNC is bumpy alu extrusions
01:00 AM CaptHindsight[m]: I wish they had a camera on the moon with a live feed
01:01 AM CaptHindsight[m]: come on get off your duffs Musk and Bezos
01:01 AM XXCoder: capt what we'd see would be earth eclipse lol
01:02 AM XXCoder: solar eclipse, but with earth
01:02 AM CaptHindsight[m]: yeah, how often do yah sees one of does?
01:02 AM XXCoder: does being in space station and orbiting into dark side count?
01:04 AM CaptHindsight[m]: fast moving thin clouds here, nothing exciting yet
01:04 AM CaptHindsight[m]: when are we gonnah git a moon station?
01:13 AM CaptHindsight[m]: Tonight's full moon will be the longest partial lunar eclipse in over 500 years
01:13 AM XXCoder: livestream starts in a minute
01:14 AM XXCoder: or now I guess lol
01:31 AM XXCoder: starting to get dark lol will be total in bit less than 2 hours
01:31 AM XXCoder: (max I mean, not total)
02:13 AM randy: morning
02:32 AM CaptHindsight[m]: clouds are all gone perfectly clear eclipse
02:33 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
02:51 AM XXCoder: here im getting quite heavy rain
02:51 AM XXCoder: so cant see it directly lol
02:51 AM CaptHindsight[m]: not a cloud in the sky right now
02:55 AM Deejay: moin
03:05 AM XXCoder: moons red now
03:28 AM CaptHindsight[m]: not used to the cold here yet
04:23 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
05:09 AM JT-Cave: morning
05:10 AM unterhausen: moin
05:11 AM unterhausen: when docker wants to install updates, I say okay and then it doesn't do it. Bugs me about it the next day
05:12 AM XXCoder: it docked your update ;)
05:20 AM unterhausen: everyone else complains about being forced to update, so I can't find an explanation on how to make it install
05:20 AM unterhausen: I suppose it's annoying that you are forced to update, but I would do it anyway
05:23 AM unterhausen: I think we need a new internet, the old one is full of garbage so it's hard to find the good stuff
05:38 AM JT-Cave: firefox has become the most annoying software with constant popups about updates
05:38 AM XXCoder: sounds like you has malware of some kind
05:57 AM JT-Cave: no, it's the new norm for firefox to constantly want to update
05:58 AM XXCoder: thats unusual
05:58 AM XXCoder: i only get update once per couple weeks or so
06:01 AM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight[m]: hehe. i go to work in Tshirt and jeans every day. Coworker yesterday morning while out smoking: "are you not cold?" $me:"nah, according to my cars display its only -4°C. I dont put on a jacket before its at least in the two digits."... Him: *shudder*
06:05 AM JT-Cave: a couple of weeks is way to annoying for me
06:06 AM XXCoder: ah i was thinking youre getting in least daily
06:07 AM unterhausen: chrome just reproachfully changes the three dots at the upper right to a red circle
06:46 AM Tom_L: morning
06:46 AM JT-Cave: 26°F
06:47 AM Tom_L: 35F
06:56 AM Tom_L: may be burning firewood today
06:59 AM Tom_L: about as annoying as my phone updates
07:04 AM JT-Cave: ain't no maybe about burning firewood here today
10:22 AM roycroft: it is friday again
10:22 AM roycroft: it seems like that happens pretty frequently - like every week
10:39 AM perry_j1987: morning
10:39 AM perry_j1987: the fridays keep getting closer and closer together the older i get
10:45 AM t4nk_freenode: so are your chin and ankles, probably, for various reasons
10:46 AM t4nk_freenode: I've printed these drag chains, and now of course, the leads to my stepper is too short..
10:46 AM t4nk_freenode: I've seen with my own eyes how dodgy these dupont connectors are
10:47 AM t4nk_freenode: and I need some more length too I guess
10:47 AM t4nk_freenode: so I think I want to try using cat 5 wire to extend the leads... would that be a good idea?
10:48 AM t4nk_freenode: got nema 17 motors rated at 2A, 24v
10:48 AM t4nk_freenode: but driven by tmc2209s, so probably 1.7A, isch
10:49 AM roycroft: if you're talking about using the cat 5 wire to power stepper motors i would strongly recommend not doing that
10:49 AM roycroft: you should be using shielded cables to power your motors
10:49 AM t4nk_freenode: mmm
10:50 AM t4nk_freenode: well, the leads that are attached to it aren't shielded
10:50 AM t4nk_freenode: and they're 'pretty long', maybe a meter
10:50 AM roycroft: they should be shielded
10:50 AM roycroft: i'd replace the existing cable with a shielded one
10:50 AM roycroft: and i'd avoid splicing as well
10:51 AM roycroft: just do it propery
10:51 AM roycroft: properly
10:53 AM t4nk_freenode: I checked, the leads on the steppers seem to be fixed inside
10:56 AM t4nk_freenode: I think I'll use double strands of cat5, make a connector, seal it up... *sigh*
10:56 AM t4nk_freenode: it will still need to fit inside chain though, which is a punny 'drag'
10:57 AM t4nk_freenode: but only one stepper needs to be extended
10:57 AM t4nk_freenode: and it's only a short piece inside the chain
11:03 AM perry_j1987: the leads on stepper motors are there just so you have something to work with
11:04 AM perry_j1987: should be using shielded wire for your runs and also when possible getting steppers with the connector instead of the kind with wires soldered internally
11:05 AM perry_j1987: i've been known to disassemble stepeprs to solder diff wires onto the little circuit board inside
11:05 AM t4nk_freenode: yeah, that's a bit clumsy.. they're pretty fine steppers otherwise though
11:18 AM roycroft: those cables are very noisy, and when you stuff multiple cables next to each other in a chain you're going to get interference if you don't shield them
01:36 PM Tom_L: roycroft, is this pizza friday?
01:36 PM roycroft: it is
01:36 PM roycroft: as is almost every friday
01:55 PM bobbytables: t4nk_freenode: If you get a pre-terminated CAT5 patch cable the wire will be stranded and will bend easier in the chain than if you just use bulk cable which is generally solid core.
01:55 PM bobbytables: However, the standard crimp-on connectors won't work with stranded cable.
01:57 PM tiwake[m]: you can buy rolls of stranded core CAT cable
02:13 PM t4nk_freenode: mm.. this isn't solid core
02:13 PM t4nk_freenode: got fine strands
02:14 PM t4nk_freenode: I already ripped a cable apart, and I'm using it here and there
02:14 PM t4nk_freenode: I got some untouched cables too
02:18 PM t4nk_freenode: just cut 4 pairs of wires, gonna try and tin them, and see how it goes
03:36 PM JT-Shop: hmm I have some mesa cards on the way delivery is next friday!
03:36 PM XXCoder: nice
03:40 PM JT-Shop: trying to size a part that is 0.1875 x 0.750 x 0.6875 and it keeps moving while roughing it... time to try a different way to hold the part
03:41 PM roycroft: i laminated some mdf at lunch today for the stand for my new bandsaw
03:41 PM roycroft: that vacuum veneering bag i bought a few years ago is one of the best investments i've ever made
03:41 PM roycroft: i can't believe how much i use it, and how i ever got anything done without it
04:30 PM XXCoder: https://youtu.be/m1K3KtiwErY
04:30 PM XXCoder: pretty cool
04:30 PM XXCoder: he makes music box well updates it, using small lathe and mill
04:38 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Do you have time for a 5 minute Zoom conference to see if our product meets your needs?
04:38 PM CaptHindsight[m]: We will not answer your questions via email. Zoom conference only!
04:46 PM bobbytables: CaptHindsight[m]: Schedule 10 minutes and give them an hourly rate for more?
04:47 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Sound fair
04:48 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Do you think it's a red flag if they won't answer your written questions?
04:50 PM bobbytables: It's probably worth 10 minutes to feel them out? Maybe they aren't good at expaining concepts in text and I can see that especially when describing a physical object.
04:51 PM bobbytables: Drafting is a skill and an art and some people may not be able to do it clearly?
04:51 PM CaptHindsight[m]: nah, this is a HP and 3D Systems dealer
04:52 PM CaptHindsight[m]: and i made them all yes or no questions
05:07 PM JT-Shop: finally the parts are ready to weld together... tomorrow
05:13 PM _unreal_: hello
05:24 PM t4nk_freenode: howdy, stranger
05:25 PM _unreal_: I no strange on you....
05:26 PM t4nk_freenode: I sort of caved, and printed those drag chains after all, _unreal_
05:27 PM t4nk_freenode: let's see.. took me around... 20hours or so
05:27 PM t4nk_freenode: but I'm glad I did, I think
05:28 PM _unreal_: see I TOLD YOU.........
05:28 PM t4nk_freenode: probably better than having the wires dangling around
05:29 PM t4nk_freenode: just finished extending my stepper cables
05:29 PM t4nk_freenode: stuffed most of the other cables through
05:30 PM t4nk_freenode: now I need to push 4 more limit switches through
05:30 PM Tom_L: JT-Shop, how are you holding it?
05:30 PM Tom_L: or i guess you got it...
05:31 PM JT-Cave: I was holding the tiny part vertical and cutting the top but gave up on that and put the part flat against a stop and used the edge of the endmill to size it
05:32 PM Tom_L: more than one way to skin a part
05:32 PM _unreal_: I got a few sattilites at work I'm hopoing are going to be tossed. if they do I get my hands on them.
05:32 PM _unreal_: with luck they will have the finall parts I need for a new project I've been trying to do for ever.
05:32 PM _unreal_: hoping to have 4 BLDC motors with onboard encoders
05:32 PM * JT-Cave looks for his notes on copying a sd card
05:32 PM _unreal_: if I get them I will have what I( need
05:47 PM andypugh: Quiet night?
05:48 PM JT-Cave: chickens are all on the roost
05:48 PM XXCoder: hey andy
05:48 PM XXCoder: i had a question but its been so long i forgot
05:49 PM XXCoder: well hows things
05:50 PM andypugh: I have a free weekend, so I am thinking about looking at the Po4 docs translation work. Despite being a native english speaker I do think that this is important.
05:51 PM JT-Cave: what does Po4 do?
05:52 PM andypugh: And I am wondering now if we have any blind users? Though I guess that they would use native text-to-speech for the docs.
05:52 PM andypugh: But does anyone who is blind use CNC?
05:53 PM JT-Cave: hmm, pondering that question...
05:53 PM XXCoder: i can answer yes, under limited conditions
05:53 PM andypugh: I can’t imagine what a step that would be from where I am. But then that applies to nearly all parts of life.
05:53 PM XXCoder: lighthouse company, they hire partially or total blind people to run machines
05:54 PM andypugh: It’s going to be _really_ hard to monitor a running mill.
05:54 PM JT-Cave: I guess you can be legally blind and still see some shapes
05:55 PM XXCoder: i dont really know details, i never toured that place. i have wrong disability to be employed there anyway. my vision is fine, besides not tracking anything
05:58 PM JT-Cave: If you're legally blind, your vision is 20/200 or less in your better eye or your field of vision is less than 20 degrees. That means if an object is 200 feet away, you have to stand 20 feet from it in order to see it clearly. But a person with normal vision can stand 200 feet away and see that object perfectly.
05:58 PM JT-Cave: clearly could not drive but up close could see a machine
05:58 PM andypugh: I really do think that you could do manual wood turning with one hand for the chisel and one for feeling the shape. And that could be _really_ satisfying. Wood turning is great fun anyway, and given that there are fewer things that the blind can (currently) do I can imagine it being popular. But CNC takes away all of that.
05:59 PM JT-Cave: I'm the catch master on my wood lathe lol
06:01 PM andypugh: I am more interested here in more than “legally blind”
06:01 PM * JT-Cave doesn't understand why my youngest daughter would drive from Cypress Tx to Houston Hobby Airport (1.25h) putz around waiting for the flight fly to Memphis(1.5h) then putz around there getting baggage and renting a car then drive to Poplar Bluff(2.75h) it only saves one hour
06:03 PM JT-Cave: my grandfather was blind from child diabetes and was a Chevy mechanic, people would bring parts over to him and he would feel them and tell them what was wrong
06:03 PM JT-Cave: parts were much simpler back then...
06:04 PM JT-Cave: hmm my dd copy seems to have worked...
06:06 PM Tom_L: everything was simpler..
06:07 PM Tom_L: hi andy
06:08 PM CaptHindsight[m]: several years ago every bad things that happened would ave been blamed on last night eclipse, ah simpler times
06:09 PM CaptHindsight[m]: even my spelling
06:09 PM Tom_L: yeah, you were up watching it ehh?
06:09 PM Tom_L: there you go...
06:10 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I turned into a pumpkin
06:10 PM _unreal_: hey there plumpkin
06:15 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
06:26 PM robinsz: Doh, my forum login isnt working again
06:27 PM robinsz: I remember someone fixed it and said it wasn't banned, but it wasn't active and was in some weird state.
06:28 PM robinsz: I was told it had been fixed, but trying it just now, its still borked
06:32 PM andypugh: Hi Robin
06:32 PM andypugh: You do seem to live a charmed life
06:33 PM CaptHindsight[m]: andypugh: most of the action seems to be on the forums
06:34 PM CaptHindsight[m]: remora, orangecnc, S-curves, latency tester etc etc
06:35 PM andypugh: It’s not like I live here, in fact I am absent for weeks at a time, so seeing you twice in a row when I can wield my un-ban-stick seems… Actually suspicious. What passriene bird is your real name? :-)
06:43 PM andypugh: I am actually feeling a bit disappointed with myself now. I thought that I was being a bit clever as I thought that the European Robin (Erithacus rubecula) was a passerine bird, and the US “robin” (Turdus migratorius) was not. But actually they are bith passeeriformes so I am left here looking like a chump.
06:44 PM andypugh: Which I would probably have got away with had I not explained it in detail with latin references.
06:57 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I cry fowl
07:03 PM aaroncnc: is that a bird pun?
07:07 PM Tom_L: robinsz, i posted a couple links the other day for you
07:08 PM robinsz: Hi @andypugh
07:08 PM robinsz: Oddly, I used to have a pet crow, called Eric ...
07:09 PM Tom_L: andypugh, do you know if this is legal and will execute the subroutine on the hal-command: halui.mdi-command-XX halui.program.is-paused
07:10 PM Tom_L: or is the tp halted at that point?
07:10 PM robinsz: I'm thinking of having a play with HAL and my pressbrake ... basically it has two hydraulic rams, two absolute linear encoders and a pair of PWM controlled servo valves
07:10 PM robinsz: could be an interesting project
07:11 PM robinsz: that reminds me Andy, whats the current stat of your CNC lathe?
07:11 PM Tom_L: robinsz, i was thinking if that was legal that might work for your spindle thing
07:13 PM robinsz: andypugh, I have a need of a small bit of CNC work, a parabolic reflector microwaves ... a small diamter dish, 200 to 300mm tops
07:13 PM andypugh: Tom_L: No, it has to be G-code. Though it can be an M100+ that calls an executable.
07:13 PM robinsz: andypugh, but more accurate than the crap sold for satellite TV, as this is at 122GHz
07:14 PM andypugh: robinsz: My CNC lathe’s current state is “needs a clean” why asketh thee?
07:15 PM robinsz: ^^ small microwave dish ...
07:15 PM andypugh: No problem, send material and drawing.
07:16 PM robinsz: needs +- 0.3mm accuracy on surface, is that doable?
07:17 PM andypugh: I really would hope so.
07:17 PM robinsz: its a bit like telescope mirrors, an RMS surface error of lambda/10 is good
07:17 PM robinsz: and 122GHz is ~3mm ish
07:17 PM Tom_L: robinsz, there is also this: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/config/moveoff.html
07:18 PM andypugh: I would take a bet on doing that on a wood lathe by hand :-)
07:18 PM robinsz: ob sailing, we mad it to the Scillies this year
07:18 PM robinsz: I suspect you may even succeed with a suitable check template
07:19 PM robinsz: andypugh: I'll mail you offlist re the dish if you fancy a stab at it
07:20 PM andypugh: Sounds like fun
07:20 PM robinsz: I did think about ballmilling it on the CNC router, but decide agaisnt it
07:21 PM robinsz: you dont have a use for any INT40 tool holders? I have surplus sitting in a box ...
07:22 PM robinsz: Tom_L let me check that link
07:22 PM andypugh: .3 with enough passes doesont sound so hard. But it would be hard to trust rhe sphere witout checking.
07:23 PM andypugh: No. In fact I also have a spare 40 taper holder looking for a home. I can’t remember the details but I got it from Cromwell for free.
07:25 PM Tom_L: andypugh, i was talking to robin the other day about during a paused program being able to retract the spindle, turn it off then resume to the paused point using G30
07:25 PM Tom_L: when he did his router, he said there was not a way to do that but that was several years back
07:25 PM Tom_L: i was thinking there may be a way now with all the changes made to linuxcnc
07:26 PM andypugh: There have been workarounds, but AFAIK nothing built-in,
07:27 PM Tom_L: that was where i came up with the idea of halui.mdi-command-XX <= halui.program.is-paused
07:27 PM robinsz: andypugh: ah pity, I have about a dozen, including some "speed multiplier" heads
07:28 PM robinsz: I think they came off some Beaver NC24's I had at one point
07:28 PM robinsz: or maybe the Haas, but, whatever, they don't fit anything i have now, thats for sure.
07:29 PM robinsz: its just that the big plastic box of them is annoyingly heavy to move across the floor
07:29 PM andypugh: I would like a speeder to play with, as my max spindle speed is 1000rpm,
07:30 PM andypugh: Making the taaper smaller is lathe work
07:30 PM robinsz: in that case, I shall put your name on one.
07:31 PM robinsz: my new toy
07:31 PM robinsz: https://tinyurl.com/jazek8er
07:32 PM Tom_L: nice one
07:32 PM Tom_L: you do alot of sheet work?
07:33 PM robinsz: no :)
07:33 PM Tom_L: heh
07:33 PM robinsz: I try to avoid work
07:33 PM robinsz: I use it for a few brackets, cases and front panels for our products
07:34 PM robinsz: I make audio amplifiers for PA and guitar stuff
07:34 PM Tom_L: nice
07:34 PM robinsz: we have a few small bands using them ...
07:34 PM Tom_L: any tube stuff or all solid state now?
07:35 PM robinsz: we basically do solid state amps for use with clever DSP boxes
07:35 PM robinsz: we only do the easy part
07:35 PM robinsz: I do a valve/soldistate head for the purists
07:35 PM Tom_L: a guy in another channel designs car audio amps i've known for years
07:36 PM Tom_L: cool
07:37 PM robinsz: I keep a CNC router, CNC punch and the press in house, because they don't cost a lot and its better than waiting on suppliers to mess you around
07:37 PM robinsz: I cut a lot of 6mm ally front panels on the router
07:37 PM Tom_L: quite a list of names there
07:38 PM robinsz: a few small bands ;)
07:39 PM roycroft: this may sound like a bizarre question, but it's worth a go, i think
07:39 PM roycroft: since you make pa amps
07:39 PM robinsz: mm hmm ...
07:39 PM roycroft: i like to use fender style indicator lamps in the machines i build/modify
07:39 PM roycroft: with the jewel lenses
07:39 PM roycroft: my suppliers of lamp holders have all been out of them for a long time
07:39 PM robinsz: not something weve ever used
07:40 PM roycroft: oh, ok
07:40 PM roycroft: i did not assume you did
07:40 PM roycroft: but i thought it might be worth asking about
07:40 PM robinsz: I would think that eBay would find a replacement supplier
07:40 PM roycroft: because i'd really ike to find some :)
07:40 PM roycroft: well the problems are twofold:
07:40 PM Tom_L: https://www.amplifiedparts.com/products/jewel-fender-style-lamps-bulbs
07:40 PM roycroft: 1. any of those type of lamp holders are very rare since the pandemic started - i suspect there was only one or two manufacturers of them
07:41 PM robinsz: my PA stuff looks like this: http://matrixproaudio.com/mf-series.html
07:41 PM roycroft: and 2. i need 250v lampholders, the few that i can find are all rated at 125vac or 12vdc
07:41 PM roycroft: the jewels and the lamps are easy to find
07:41 PM roycroft: it's the lampholders that are difficult
07:41 PM robinsz: 250V?
07:41 PM robinsz: blimey ... I've not used anything other than low volt LED in decades
07:42 PM Tom_L: https://www.amazon.com/Pilot-Lamp-Holder-Replacement-Premium/dp/B003WUSOGM
07:42 PM roycroft: i use them to indicate that the mains are plugged in
07:42 PM Tom_L: like those?
07:43 PM roycroft: that's not what i normally use, but i could make that work
07:43 PM roycroft: IF it were rated for 250v
07:43 PM Tom_L: https://www.tubesandmore.com/products/dial-lamp-fender-style-premium-pilot-assembly
07:43 PM roycroft: i ended up buying a neon indicator for my mill, because i don't want to wait until i can find the proper lamp holders
07:44 PM roycroft: again, only rated at 125v
07:44 PM robinsz: I'd probably just indicate off the 28V AC or whatever the relay PSU was on
07:44 PM Tom_L: put a resistor ahead of it
07:44 PM robinsz: thats kinda the normal way
07:44 PM roycroft: i used to get them from this guy:
07:44 PM roycroft: https://westcoastpedalboard.com/product/indicator-lamp-holder/
07:45 PM roycroft: but he's been out of stock for a year and a half
07:46 PM roycroft: as are all the other vendors that i've found
07:46 PM robinsz: andypugh, I'll email you offlist re the turning thing and the speeder
07:47 PM andypugh: Great. And now time to sleep
07:47 PM Tom_L: roycroft, is this the same socket? https://www.ebay.com/itm/131691597521
07:48 PM roycroft: no
07:49 PM roycroft: the fender ones take a bayonet lamp
07:49 PM roycroft: and the jewel is 5/8-27 thread
07:53 PM roycroft: I even wrote a guy in Scotland who refurbs old Fender amps, and he told me he can't find them anymore either
07:54 PM Tom_L: call fender
07:54 PM robinsz: Just use a modern 220V machine indicator
07:55 PM Tom_L: made in mexico now :(
07:55 PM roycroft: i like the look of the fender jewel lamps
07:55 PM roycroft: the neon lamp i got for my mill is an ok alternative
07:56 PM roycroft: not ideal, but better than an ugly modern led
07:56 PM robinsz: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Indicator-Lights-Green-Yellow-Flush/dp/B07DH8PV3W/ref=sr_1_11?_encoding=UTF8&c=ts&keywords=Indicator+Lights&qid=1637372448&qsid=258-5258471-0554924&s=industrial&sr=1-11&sres=B097MGMV19%2CB08LDCW579%2CB082LZ13WQ%2CB07K3QKN49%2CB07D7ZRKG5%2CB07D9CW9GP%2CB09BQH15K5%2CB07DH8PV3W%2CB07D7Z8KYY%2CB07D7Z5X7F%2CB082S49SHR%2CB07D9DXHPS%2CB01BSEJ8EK%2CB09BQFB7DN%2CB082LWH4MN%2CB07D6K497L%2CB07DH9XNZW%2CB07CWR1N2G%2CB09BJ9DZSL%2CB000WL0ZMA&t
07:56 PM robinsz: s_id=10256320031
07:56 PM robinsz: oopsie
07:56 PM roycroft: yeah, i'm not going there :)
07:56 PM robinsz: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Indicator-Lights-Green-Yellow-Flush/dp/B07DH8PV3W
07:56 PM Tom_L: those look decent
07:57 PM robinsz: yeah, standard 22mm machine indicators, same as the low voltage ones and the various pushbuttons etc
07:57 PM robinsz: been standard since the 80s
07:57 PM roycroft: i hate those 22mm led indicators
07:57 PM robinsz: are you American?
07:58 PM Tom_L: heh
07:58 PM Tom_L: thru and thru
07:58 PM robinsz: I visted NYC once, it was like taking an electrical timewarp
07:58 PM robinsz: still lots of 1930's vintage stuff
07:59 PM roycroft: yes
08:00 PM robinsz: its an odd place for sure
08:01 PM robinsz: in some ways its quite modern ... but other segments are 50 years behind .. most strange
08:03 PM roycroft: https://roycroft.us/Panel.jpeg
08:03 PM roycroft: that's the panel i made for my mill, with the neon indicator
08:03 PM robinsz: one of the pressbrake groups has Americans asking for advice on old mechanical brakes, the sort with a big flywheel and a fixed stroke ... we just haven't seen any of those in use in Europe for decades ...
08:03 PM robinsz: but they seem common over there.
08:03 PM robinsz: when I was looking for a press for the USA operation, it was amazing some of the antiques we got offered
08:05 PM robinsz: nice enough
08:05 PM Tom_L: i worked at a place years back that had a couple
08:06 PM robinsz: Tom_L, we havent seen that sort of brake in decades, everything is pretty much hydraulic and usually CNC here
08:06 PM Tom_L: yes
08:06 PM robinsz: you would have trouble selling a non CNC press for much more than a few thousand
08:06 PM Tom_L: some of the machines i ran were WWII vintage
08:06 PM Tom_L: screw machines
08:07 PM robinsz: ah yes, specilist lathes
08:07 PM Tom_L: 6 & 8 spindle
08:07 PM robinsz: yeah, they tend to hang around
08:07 PM Tom_L: all cams and gears
08:07 PM robinsz: I know one firm that has some "plugboard CNC"
08:08 PM robinsz: ubt they are a bit odd
08:09 PM robinsz: Wickman lathes?
08:09 PM * roycroft thinks it's time to go toss some pizza dough
08:11 PM robinsz: I think its bedtime ...
08:11 PM robinsz: night guys ...
08:12 PM Tom_L: the ones i ran were new brittan
08:14 PM Tom_L: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WH12VtsIVs
08:25 PM roycroft: pizza in the oven
08:25 PM roycroft: life is good
08:25 PM XXCoder: a turret
08:25 PM XXCoder: roycroft: must share. its the internet law
08:25 PM roycroft: if you can be here in 10 minutes, i'd be happy to share
08:26 PM XXCoder: ok let me chank up my teleporter.
08:26 PM roycroft: just have scotty beam you over
08:26 PM XXCoder: no thats silly. huge energy expense
08:27 PM XXCoder: finally could get a trip to costco
08:27 PM roycroft: i haven't been to costco in years
08:27 PM XXCoder: my cars been at very low gas level for over a month
08:27 PM roycroft: i just can't justify the membership
08:27 PM roycroft: i don't have a big family
08:28 PM XXCoder: me either
08:28 PM roycroft: i can't buy olive oil by the gallon, or 20kg of chicken
08:28 PM roycroft: the last couple years i was a member, the only thing i bought there was blue shop towels
08:28 PM roycroft: and only a couple packages of 12 per yer
08:28 PM XXCoder: i buy some stuff i love thats unique to that store. walmart might have em too, but im not going there anytime years
08:28 PM roycroft: that does not justify a $50 membership
08:29 PM roycroft: i have never been to wal*mart
08:29 PM XXCoder: thats good
08:29 PM roycroft: it's a matter of pride :)
08:29 PM XXCoder: im trying to cut off amazon
08:29 PM XXCoder: bit hard to
08:29 PM roycroft: yes, and it's getting harder and harder all the time
08:30 PM roycroft: every time i buy something i try to get it locally first, then online at not amazon, and then finally i check amazon
08:30 PM roycroft: i currently have four orders at amazon that are in process
08:30 PM roycroft: i should have zero
08:31 PM XXCoder: im just glad its fairly easy to drive to for me
08:31 PM roycroft: but local falls through too much
08:31 PM roycroft: and not amazon falls through too much
08:31 PM XXCoder: basically all rights on way there, return is all easy light lefts
08:31 PM XXCoder: only one merge on way back to home
08:31 PM roycroft: i have six outstanding orders at not amazon, so at least amazon are not in the majority regarding my purchases
08:32 PM XXCoder: nice
08:32 PM XXCoder: i only have one order waiting, from ebay
08:32 PM XXCoder: im at low budget management
08:36 PM roycroft: i recently sold a domain name for a buttload of money, and am investing about 10% of the profit in fleshing out my shop so that i can start making money with the woodworking stuff
08:36 PM XXCoder: nice :)
08:36 PM XXCoder: i was wondering about selling signs or something
08:36 PM roycroft: yeah, it was kind of unexpected
08:36 PM XXCoder: but i really need room to
08:37 PM roycroft: but it's nice because some things that i thought would take another year i can do right now
08:37 PM XXCoder: indeed
08:37 PM roycroft: when the pandemic started i was hoping my job would hold out through 2020
08:37 PM roycroft: it did
08:37 PM roycroft: and my boss got a bunch of ppp money
08:38 PM roycroft: then i was hoping it would hold out through the first half of 2021
08:38 PM roycroft: it did, but things were more tight
08:38 PM roycroft: then i was hoping it would hold out through the rest of 2021, and that seems likely
08:39 PM XXCoder: hope so :)
08:39 PM roycroft: i'd still like to keep my job through at least the first half of next year, but by the end of this year, if push came to shove, i could probably just focus on my new business, and not have to find another job to pay the bills
08:39 PM XXCoder: UI would help you for while too
08:40 PM roycroft: yes, it would help
08:40 PM roycroft: having a cnc router would help even more
08:42 PM roycroft: i just hired a graphics designer to design a logo for me and some other branding/imaging stuff
08:42 PM XXCoder: nice
08:43 PM roycroft: he's familiar with my design inspirations, and has suggested some other possible products that i might do well with
08:44 PM roycroft: and i agree with his suggestions, but executing those kinds of designs would be hard to do profitably without a large number of jigs and fixtures, all of which can be made much much more efficiently and accurately with a cnc router than i could ever hope to do manually
08:44 PM XXCoder: MTM guy have 2 setups on his cnc router
08:45 PM XXCoder: perment corner where he uses screws to out handles on opposite site and tighten then screw though handle
08:45 PM XXCoder: and other one where he simply bolts wood to table, route it, then cut off excess
08:46 PM roycroft: i may use a vacuum clamping system on the cnc router
08:47 PM roycroft: the problem with that is that most of my jigs will be made out of mdf, which is porous
08:47 PM roycroft: i'd need to seal the underside for a vacuum clamp to work
08:47 PM XXCoder: quick epoxy coating?
08:47 PM roycroft: or maybe just packing tape
08:48 PM XXCoder: for underside, top is packing tape since you would need to face off top anyway
08:48 PM roycroft: i would not need to seal the top
08:48 PM roycroft: only the underside
08:57 PM roycroft: shellac would probably seal the underside well enough for a vacuum clamp
08:57 PM roycroft: and shellac dries in minutes, if not seconds
08:58 PM XXCoder: lol yeah
09:04 PM roycroft: anyway, i have a vacuum pump that i built for laminations/veneering, and it should work fine for a cnc router holddown
09:04 PM XXCoder: hope so. i used vaccum hold and there was "air blackouts"
09:05 PM roycroft: https://roycroft.us/Vacuum_Pump.jpeg
09:05 PM XXCoder: parts flew off since machine was running but it ran out of pressured air to use on venari pump
09:05 PM roycroft: as long as my air compressor does not fail i should be fine
09:05 PM XXCoder: just be sure you have plenty of air in tank before starting
09:05 PM XXCoder: add ups to add couple minutes so you can shut it off
09:05 PM roycroft: and perhaps i can put a sensor on the compressor circuit so that if it does fail, the router will shut down
09:06 PM XXCoder: good idea. with minimal setup you can even just restart
09:06 PM roycroft: yup
09:06 PM XXCoder: *setup of hold
09:07 PM roycroft: and since it will be for jigs and fixtures, and not for production work, it's not a big deal if a part is spoiled anyway
09:08 PM XXCoder: yeah
09:10 PM roycroft: if i ever put a piece of ebony or cobolo or something like that on the cnc router i'll make sure it's clamped down well in a manner that cannot fail
09:11 PM roycroft: cocobolo, rather
09:11 PM roycroft: but i probably won't ever do that