#linuxcnc Logs
Sep 25 2021
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:29 AM XXCoder: makes sense
01:00 AM mrec_: there are some very annoying bugs in the latest linuxcnc version :-(
01:01 AM mrec_: not sure how I went into that state but the UI hardly responds
01:01 AM mrec_: of course linuxcnc is not doing anything at that point.. something stalled in the background
01:22 AM mrec_: this limit check is for idiots...
01:23 AM mrec_: genius linuxcnc starts a project drills all holes and finally says oh x will exceed negative limit, yes I know it's going quite to the edge... but it should not even do the drilling then
01:26 AM roycroft: i would not immediately blame linuxcnc for that
01:49 AM mrec_: it's a topic that can be improved.
02:01 AM Deejay: moin
05:18 AM JT-Cave: morning
07:13 AM JT-Cave: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_cyx7ti1B4
07:42 AM JT-Cave: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9UPihp04xY
01:04 PM snakedLX is now known as snaked
01:36 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dl9rhG5BPrM
01:38 PM bjork: so I don't want to use cimco (it doesn't seem to like ubuntu), is there a better alternative?
01:39 PM bjork: ubuntu friendly alternative to cimco edit, ie.
01:46 PM CaptHindsight[m]: bjork: what issues come up when using with Ubuntu?
01:46 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Which Linux distro do they recommend?
01:47 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Ubuntu is similar to Linux in some ways :)
01:47 PM bjorkintosh: CaptHindsight[m], cimco is a windows program.
01:48 PM bjorkintosh: I thought there might be a good linux option to cimco edit.
01:48 PM bjorkintosh: talking about this: https://www.cimco.com/software/cimco-edit/overview/
01:49 PM CaptHindsight[m]: there is no all in one Linux app
01:49 PM CaptHindsight[m]: bunch of different tools
01:50 PM bjorkintosh: which one?
01:50 PM bjorkintosh: which ones, I mean.
01:50 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.scorchworks.com/index.html
01:53 PM CaptHindsight[m]: backplot, solid simulation, machine simulation and DNC may be performed in LinuxCNC
01:53 PM CaptHindsight[m]: file compare, Geany, Kate etc etc
01:57 PM bjorkintosh: yeah. I guess I'll just run linuxcnc in vbox
01:57 PM bjorkintosh: the only useful tool i've seen is yagv, and it's not very sophisticated.
02:01 PM t4nk_freenode: I drove my spindle into my clamps again :|
02:02 PM bjorkintosh: intentionally?
02:04 PM t4nk_freenode: yeah, I don't know what's wrong with me ;)
02:05 PM CaptHindsight[m]: "Does this bus stop at the ocean?" "Well if it doesn't there will be one hell of a splash"
02:06 PM bjorkintosh: hahaha
02:06 PM t4nk_freenode: though I will say, at least now, I will never switch on my machine and hit home without first homing, ever again.
02:07 PM bjorkintosh: sounds like a usability issue.
02:07 PM bjorkintosh: can it be scripted away with a large flashing message "HOME ME FIRST!"
02:08 PM bjorkintosh: or more poetically me, "HOME ME OUT HOMIE!"
02:08 PM t4nk_freenode: lol
02:08 PM t4nk_freenode: 'home me', ... I may cnc a little plate for that
02:09 PM bjorkintosh: a more feline alternative might read "HOMEOW"
03:28 PM * t4nk_freenode casually homes his contraption
04:25 PM * JT-Shop is surprised that Axis would move an axis to home before homing...
04:28 PM JT-Shop: t4nk_freenode, I can say the same thing about never again locking my phone and keys in the van at Menards
04:28 PM JT-Shop: roycroft, you around?
05:39 PM roycroft: i am
05:40 PM roycroft: likely not for too long though
05:40 PM JT-Shop: I do have a 7i96 in stock if you want it
05:41 PM roycroft: do you take paypal?
05:41 PM JT-Shop: you can use paypal at checkout, I just need to fix my inventory
05:42 PM roycroft: ok, tell me it's ready to go
05:42 PM JT-Shop: one moment
05:42 PM roycroft: tell me when, of course :)
05:43 PM * roycroft has a few minutes to hang out
05:44 PM JT-Shop: ok if you're going to mount it on din rail don't forget a few 3.7 din rail mounts
05:44 PM roycroft: i'm not sure how i'm going to mount it yet
05:44 PM JT-Shop: ok
05:44 PM XXCoder: if its cheap enough i'd get it so theres only one shipping fee
05:44 PM JT-Shop: it's good to go
05:44 PM roycroft: but i might as well get them now
05:45 PM JT-Shop: $3 each
05:45 PM JT-Shop: I think
05:45 PM roycroft: shipping for the rails will be as muc as the rails
05:45 PM roycroft: $4
05:45 PM roycroft: how many are needed for that card? 2?
05:45 PM JT-Shop: so much for my memory lol
05:45 PM JT-Shop: at least 2
05:46 PM roycroft: i'll get three
05:46 PM JT-Shop: that's the max for that card
05:46 PM JT-Shop: so it's fully supported
05:47 PM JT-Shop: do you have din rail?
05:47 PM roycroft: i think i do
05:47 PM roycroft: if not i'll be getting some more
05:47 PM roycroft: i don't need it right now
05:47 PM JT-Shop: let me know, if not I can put a piece in the box
05:48 PM roycroft: you must have purged your database - your system does not think i'm a returning customer, even though my password manager has account details for your site
05:48 PM JT-Shop: hmm I never purge the database
05:48 PM roycroft: your checkout page also has a notice that if i order between 19 july and 22 july you'll ship when you return
05:48 PM roycroft: you might want to fix that :)
05:48 PM JT-Shop: holy crap I forgot to remove that
05:50 PM roycroft: the message i got was that my email address was invalid
05:51 PM JT-Shop: we went to grandsons high school graduation in july
05:51 PM JT-Shop: from?
05:51 PM roycroft: when i tried to log in
05:51 PM roycroft: that's ok - i put my info in again and told it to create an account for me
05:52 PM roycroft: hmm, it created an account and assigned me a username
05:52 PM JT-Shop: I don't ever look at accounts, not even sure where they are
05:52 PM roycroft: my password manager had my email address as the username
05:52 PM roycroft: it's been several years since i last ordered from you - perhaps your software changed in the meantime
05:53 PM roycroft: anyway, thanks
05:53 PM roycroft: i'd like to start testing with that board soon
05:53 PM roycroft: and i still get 5% cash back if i use paypal through the end of september, so it's great that i could order it before then
05:53 PM JT-Shop: yea a few years ago I switched to woocommerce
05:54 PM JT-Shop: I'll ship it Monday
05:54 PM roycroft: no hurry
05:54 PM roycroft: getting you paid before the end of the month is more important to me than getting it right away
05:54 PM JT-Shop: don't forget my configuration tool for the 7i96
05:54 PM roycroft: yeah, i know you have one for that
05:55 PM JT-Shop: time for me to fire up the pellet grill
05:55 PM roycroft: i'm actually pondering right now how i'm going to configure linuxcnc for the undertable router
05:55 PM JT-Shop: just wanted to let you know I had one 7i96
05:55 PM roycroft: it will be a 1 axis gantry
05:55 PM roycroft: which is going to be kind of weird
05:55 PM roycroft: 1 axis, 2 joints
05:55 PM JT-Shop: my plasma is a single stepper for the gantry with a jack shaft to the other side
05:56 PM JT-Shop: oh that's simple
05:56 PM roycroft: i may actually configure it as 2 axis
05:56 PM roycroft: actually, no, that would not work
05:56 PM JT-Shop: just select the same axis for each joint in my configuration tool
05:56 PM roycroft: at least not for what i was thinking
05:56 PM roycroft: the bigger issue is going to be how to generate the gcode i want for the undertable router
05:57 PM roycroft: i guess i could program the moves, and single step the program
05:57 PM JT-Shop: once you home the gantry it's a single axis not two joints
05:58 PM JT-Shop: anyway gotta start some chow
05:58 PM roycroft: and i need to head to market soon to get some food for dinner
05:58 PM roycroft: thanks
05:58 PM roycroft: and now you're out of stock again :)
06:40 PM t4nk_freenode: https://postimg.cc/Yh7Q6ygr I thought I'd drill a hole into this nut.. but it wasn't happening :|
06:41 PM _unreal_: track is the nut stainless or no?
06:41 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode,
06:41 PM XXCoder: cant you just use double nut lock
06:42 PM XXCoder: then use one of nut to extract
06:42 PM _unreal_: if its not stainles there is no reason you should not be able to drill a nice straight hole into iit
06:42 PM t4nk_freenode: look... I tried it with a normal 'metal drill'.. but I got the feeling that the drill bits are just rubbish
06:42 PM _unreal_: that is most likely
06:42 PM _unreal_: because drilling regular steel is not that hard. if it was stainless thats a whole different story
06:42 PM t4nk_freenode: euh... 'galvanized' I think it said
06:42 PM t4nk_freenode: no I don't think it
06:43 PM t4nk_freenode: s stainless
06:43 PM _unreal_: galvanized is just a coating
06:43 PM _unreal_: keep in mind if your going to make a hole in something use a punch to mark a center
06:43 PM _unreal_: so the bit does not run around on you
06:44 PM _unreal_: also it would be a wise idea to use a small pilot drill bit
06:44 PM _unreal_: then go for the larger hole
06:44 PM t4nk_freenode: yeah, nut wasn't completely perpendicular either
06:44 PM t4nk_freenode: and it ran out.. a whole lot too
06:44 PM _unreal_: when drilling its the center and the wings of a drill bits flute that are the points that will hinder the bit to cut if there are any issues with the quality of the edge
06:45 PM _unreal_: always use a set punch, a pilot and then the finish bit or walk the bits up in size
06:45 PM _unreal_: the normal rule of thumb is to DBL the size of the bit per step
06:46 PM _unreal_: so 1/8th=3m, 1/4 6mm
06:46 PM _unreal_: etchhh
06:46 PM _unreal_: etc...
06:46 PM t4nk_freenode: I also used one of those 'diamond coated'pointy bits.. well, it aint pointy nomore now ;)
06:46 PM _unreal_: dimond coated?
06:46 PM _unreal_: a cement bit?
06:47 PM t4nk_freenode: they probably work better as a callous scraper
06:47 PM _unreal_: not sure what kind of a dimond bit your refering to
06:47 PM _unreal_: anything with diamonds on it expects to be cutting something very hard
06:48 PM _unreal_: diamond TIP or diamond grit ?
06:48 PM t4nk_freenode: this type.. https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1.sTLeviSBuNkSnhJq6zDcpXa4/100pcs-Diamond-Drilling-Drill-Bit-For-Dremel-Accessories-0-8-1-0-1-2-1-5.jpg
06:49 PM _unreal_: dude those are for GLASS
06:49 PM _unreal_: and ceramics
06:49 PM _unreal_: and thats not a drill bit at all
06:49 PM _unreal_: that is for a dremel
06:50 PM _unreal_: for putting designs into GLASS like on a glass bowl, or light cover. or glass decorative things. those are not even really useful on a CNC unless you have a coolent
06:51 PM _unreal_: because they cut so slow
06:51 PM _unreal_: and ware fast
06:52 PM _unreal_: if you want to carve a design on a glass vase THEM'S yo tool
06:56 PM _unreal_: You could use those bits on your cnc machine on TILE if you wanted to make custom coasters or custom designs.
06:56 PM t4nk_freenode: https://postimg.cc/gallery/B1rsZj9 got those left I haven't tried
06:56 PM XXCoder: im not sure why you havent tried 2 nut method
06:56 PM t4nk_freenode: ah, and the 20degree v-carve bits, but I guess those won't do it either ;)
06:56 PM _unreal_: those are rotory rasps. got for many things NOT good for metal
06:56 PM _unreal_: and not great on wood
06:56 PM t4nk_freenode: ? are you talking to me XXCoder ?
06:57 PM _unreal_: got=good
06:57 PM XXCoder: yeah
06:57 PM t4nk_freenode: I didbn't understand what you meant so I thought it was for someone else
06:57 PM XXCoder: well its easy
06:57 PM XXCoder: put nut on, then another
06:57 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, two nut method means taking to non nylock nuts and tightening them on each other on the thread
06:57 PM XXCoder: lock nuts against each other
06:58 PM XXCoder: then use bottom nut to get broken bolt out
06:58 PM _unreal_: just done tighten to tight or you may break the thread
06:58 PM _unreal_: twist it right off
06:58 PM _unreal_: dont
07:00 PM t4nk_freenode: lol.. I still don't know what to make of it
07:00 PM _unreal_: ? what the two nut method
07:00 PM t4nk_freenode: I set out to drill a hole into that nut..
07:01 PM t4nk_freenode: am I supposed to put two nuts on... and twist them... so that.. a hole is left?
07:01 PM t4nk_freenode: ;)
07:01 PM _unreal_: What is your end goal
07:01 PM XXCoder: ok i thought you wanted to remove that bolt
07:01 PM _unreal_: I didnt log in till after you describe what ever it is you are doing
07:02 PM XXCoder: if its boring into bolt, then its best to use a lathe, its bit hard otherwise. maybe if you have a drill press with good vise
07:02 PM t4nk_freenode: yes you did. _unreal_ ... the pic was the first thing I posted about it
07:03 PM _unreal_: just re-read what you posted. I HAVE no clue what your end goal is
07:03 PM XXCoder: you wasnt too clear on what you wanted, I thought you was trying to drill broken bolt out or something
07:03 PM t4nk_freenode: I think the drill bits are also pretty useless.. I could just press down.. wring my machine all out of bounds... and still nothing happened
07:03 PM _unreal_: XXCoder, do you understand what his end goal is reading what he wrote?
07:04 PM _unreal_: ok so I'm not alone hehe
07:04 PM t4nk_freenode: "I thought I'd drill a hole into this nut.. but it wasn't happening :|"
07:04 PM _unreal_: use a drill bit
07:04 PM _unreal_: what you posted is NOT a drill bit at all
07:05 PM _unreal_: those are rotory tools
07:05 PM _unreal_: rotary
07:05 PM t4nk_freenode: I used drill bits
07:05 PM XXCoder: its probably stainless steel
07:05 PM _unreal_: then you should have no issues unless they are warn out and need to be sharpendd or replaced.
07:05 PM XXCoder: not easy to drill
07:05 PM XXCoder: it'd be better with drill press
07:05 PM _unreal_: XXCoder, lol I talked about stainless he said its galv
07:06 PM t4nk_freenode: I thought.... if I just went... Very slow... if you got a bit on metal.. it has to eat I'd have thought
07:06 PM _unreal_: those are NOT drillbits
07:06 PM t4nk_freenode: and then .05mm becomes .1mm
07:06 PM _unreal_: those are all rotary bits
07:06 PM t4nk_freenode: mate
07:06 PM _unreal_: they are desigend to scrape not cut
07:06 PM t4nk_freenode: I did say I used 'normal metal drills'
07:07 PM XXCoder: you need quite rigid hold on bolt and drill
07:07 PM XXCoder: which means handheld wont work well
07:07 PM _unreal_: and cutting oil
07:07 PM _unreal_: hell even water
07:07 PM t4nk_freenode: I put a bit of wd-40 on.. in my optimisitc mood ;)
07:07 PM t4nk_freenode: and glasses... to fend off the massive chips :|
07:08 PM t4nk_freenode: ;)
07:08 PM _unreal_: odd my BS radar just started alarming
07:10 PM t4nk_freenode: now I'm tempted to get a piece of softer metal to see if that will drill
07:10 PM _unreal_: dude I just said those bits the diamond GRIT and the rotary rasps are desigend for HARD materials.
07:10 PM _unreal_: metal is soft
07:10 PM _unreal_: unless its hardened or stainless
07:10 PM _unreal_: GLAV is soft period
07:11 PM XXCoder: if drill bit isnt lost its temper due to heat it should still work
07:11 PM t4nk_freenode: look, please stop the drama already... I just tried it with that diamond bit once
07:11 PM t4nk_freenode: aint got nothing left I can try I think
07:11 PM XXCoder: unreal? i put guy on ignore wuite a while ago lol
07:11 PM _unreal_: I think he will loose his temper firts LOL
07:12 PM _unreal_: ugh.. I'm doing cad work right now for a paying project
07:12 PM _unreal_: $50 for two small HIN plates
07:12 PM _unreal_: HIN= hull ID NUMBER
07:12 PM _unreal_: for boats
07:13 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, have you tried to make any money with your cnc yet?
07:14 PM t4nk_freenode: that is really not on my mind at all
07:15 PM t4nk_freenode: I'd much rather make a machine that can drill a friggin hole in a nut :|
07:15 PM _unreal_: O.O thats called a corded/cordless drill or drill press
07:16 PM t4nk_freenode: I think I need to get myself some decent bits first, and learn how it works in the first place
07:17 PM XXCoder: remember, rigid hold on bolt, drill press for good rigid hold on drill
07:17 PM XXCoder: harder the material, you need more rigidness
07:18 PM t4nk_freenode: I was thinking of bying 'c-beam' aluminium profile to base a frame on
07:18 PM _unreal_: what kind of a frame?
07:18 PM _unreal_: frame for what?
07:19 PM t4nk_freenode: a cnc machine of course, ... what I got right now simply won't do. it works really nice on wood,but that's it
07:19 PM _unreal_: well I told you that
07:19 PM _unreal_: and that sounds about right
07:19 PM _unreal_: I'm more amazed its working on wood
07:20 PM t4nk_freenode: I know, but lessons learnt on one's own accord are the best, I wanted to see for myself
07:21 PM _unreal_: every hand made machine is a learning curve
07:21 PM _unreal_: periodcx
07:21 PM _unreal_: every diy machine will have its own unique settings
07:22 PM _unreal_: tuning
07:22 PM _unreal_: quarks
07:27 PM roycroft: my main concern about the machine i'm designing now is that, in addition to being a cnc router, it will replace my current router table
07:27 PM roycroft: and i cannot be without a router table for very long
07:28 PM roycroft: i cannot build it first and then get rid of the router table, as i'm using many of the parts from the current router table on the new machine
07:28 PM XXCoder: expensive option would be build new one while keeping old one running
07:28 PM roycroft: see above :)
07:28 PM XXCoder: when complete, swap
07:29 PM XXCoder: yeah like I said, expensive lol
07:29 PM roycroft: my plan is to test all the motion control stuff before starting the mechanical build
07:29 PM XXCoder: good idea yeah
07:30 PM roycroft: so i'm really happy jt got a 7i96 in stock
07:30 PM roycroft: the power supplies for my motor have been in troutdale oregon for almost a week
07:30 PM roycroft: fedex still lists the delivery date as the 21st, with a not that delivery "may be delayed"
07:31 PM roycroft: so i have no idea when i'll get those
07:31 PM _unreal_: what kind of motors are you building with
07:31 PM XXCoder: 21st nice must be time travel
07:31 PM roycroft: i have some nema 23 stepper motors in stock
07:31 PM roycroft: that i bought for my mill cnc conversion
07:31 PM roycroft: i only have three motors, though, and i need four motors for the new machine
07:31 PM roycroft: but i can do the initial testing of the circuitry and linuxcnc configuration with 3 motors
07:32 PM XXCoder: yeah since one of em would be just 2 joints on one axis correct?
07:32 PM roycroft: i'm going to buy a pre-built z axis, and when i get that i'll mount my spindle on it and test the z with one of the nema 23 motors
07:32 PM roycroft: yes
07:32 PM roycroft: the y will be a gantry
07:33 PM roycroft: if that small motor cannot hold the spindle in place i'll get higher torque motor for the z, possibly moving up to a nema 34
07:33 PM roycroft: but i can test with what i have first
07:33 PM roycroft: my spindle is fairly heavy
07:34 PM XXCoder: counterbalance?
07:34 PM roycroft: if necessary
07:34 PM roycroft: the z will have a ball screw, so i'm pretty sure the small motor will be able to move it up and down reliably
07:34 PM roycroft: but it may not be able to hold it in place very well
07:34 PM _unreal_: got any build photos yet?
07:35 PM _unreal_: or have you gotten that far yet?
07:35 PM roycroft: this is one reason i'm getting the z axis first - so i can test it and figure out what i need to do to get it to stay in place
07:35 PM roycroft: i have not built anything at all yet
07:35 PM roycroft: i don't even have any finished cad drawings
07:35 PM _unreal_: o,O
07:35 PM roycroft: but i'll be sure to document as i go, and i'll post pics
07:35 PM _unreal_: What kind of drive are you using for the z
07:36 PM roycroft: i have some gecko 201x drives
07:36 PM _unreal_: as in lead screw, acme, threaded rod. ball screw?
07:36 PM roycroft: again, only three of them
07:36 PM roycroft: oh
07:36 PM roycroft: ball screw
07:36 PM _unreal_: ok so it Z going to be vertical?
07:36 PM _unreal_: your saying Y will be z
07:36 PM _unreal_: kind of have no concept of what it is your bilding lol
07:37 PM roycroft: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B082V3624V
07:37 PM _unreal_: from a structure or design idea
07:37 PM roycroft: that is the z axis i'm planning on getting
07:37 PM _unreal_: ok
07:37 PM _unreal_: is that going to be vertical
07:37 PM roycroft: _unreal_: the design is what i call an "over/under" cnc router with a gantry
07:37 PM roycroft: yes
07:37 PM roycroft: there will be two spindles
07:37 PM roycroft: one underneath the table, to use as a traditional router table
07:37 PM _unreal_: ya I remember you talking about that aspect
07:38 PM roycroft: and one overhead, to be used as a typical cnc router
07:38 PM _unreal_: are you going to use timing belts to drive the z?
07:38 PM _unreal_: I would
07:38 PM _unreal_: 4 to 1
07:38 PM _unreal_: 3 -1
07:38 PM _unreal_: something like that
07:38 PM roycroft: the y axis will be a gantry, and i'll have a detachable fence that i can connect to the front of the gantry when i used the underside router
07:38 PM roycroft: i haven't decided that yet
07:39 PM _unreal_: I would
07:39 PM roycroft: i'm going to test with direct coupling the motor first
07:39 PM _unreal_: you double your resolution
07:39 PM _unreal_: and your torque
07:39 PM roycroft: i need zero resolution on the z
07:39 PM _unreal_: and increase your max tooling speed
07:39 PM roycroft: it's a 2d router
07:39 PM _unreal_: but loose max joging speed
07:39 PM roycroft: i should not have to jog the z much
07:40 PM roycroft: it goes up a bit when it's not cutting
07:40 PM _unreal_: what I'm getting at is load
07:40 PM roycroft: and it goes down when it is cutting
07:40 PM roycroft: it will not move up or down while it is cutting
07:40 PM roycroft: i want to cut 2d images in sheet goods
07:40 PM roycroft: that's all
07:40 PM roycroft: no fancy carving and stuff
07:40 PM _unreal_: right but it will still produce a lot of UP force
07:41 PM _unreal_: or down force depending on what the machine is doing
07:41 PM roycroft: well i can test with the motor direct coupled first
07:41 PM _unreal_: and the type of bit
07:41 PM _unreal_: up cut down cut etc...
07:41 PM roycroft: and decide if i need to modify that after the testing
07:41 PM _unreal_: I suspect you'll be using a lot of down cut
07:41 PM roycroft: i mainly want to use this to make jigs and fixtures
07:42 PM roycroft: forms for vacuum veneering, etc.
07:42 PM _unreal_: hum
07:42 PM roycroft: not for finished products
07:42 PM roycroft: i'll be machining mdf and ply wood 99% of the time with the overhead spindle
07:43 PM roycroft: that is the current plan, anyway
07:43 PM roycroft: once it's built i may find other uses for it
07:43 PM roycroft: i really don't need a 200mm spindle for what i plan on doing, but i am getting that long of one just in case i decide to do more with the z later
07:44 PM roycroft: er, s/spindle/z axis/
07:44 PM _unreal_: 200mm?
07:44 PM roycroft: a 100mm z would be more than enough
07:44 PM roycroft: 200mm travel on the z
07:44 PM _unreal_: oh travel
07:44 PM roycroft: which is ridiculous for just routing sheet goods
07:44 PM _unreal_: not really
07:44 PM roycroft: but it doesn't cost much to get that much travel
07:44 PM roycroft: it would cost a lot more to add more travel in the future
07:45 PM _unreal_: wait till you decide to put someting taller on the table
07:45 PM _unreal_: you'll love having the extra overhead
07:45 PM roycroft: which i'm not planning on doing
07:45 PM roycroft: but i'm planning for anyway
07:46 PM roycroft: i already know this will likely not be my last cnc router
07:46 PM roycroft: and even if it is, in five years it probably won't resemble how it was built any more
07:46 PM roycroft: but one has to start somewhere
07:46 PM XXCoder: change is only constant
07:47 PM roycroft: it should be pretty decent
07:47 PM roycroft: i'll use proper linear rails for the gantry and x axes
07:47 PM _unreal_: well my cnc is 8 years old
07:47 PM roycroft: and i've decided on rack and pinion gearing to drive the y
07:47 PM roycroft: i haven't decided on how to drive the x yet
07:48 PM roycroft: it will either be rack and pinion or ball screw
07:48 PM _unreal_: I'd suggest ball for x and z
07:48 PM roycroft: well z is going to be ball screw for sure
07:49 PM roycroft: i need 1250mm of travel for the y
07:49 PM roycroft: so rack and pinion is the only reasonable option there
07:49 PM _unreal_: rack/pinion is prone to ware
07:49 PM roycroft: i was looking at belt drive for the y at first, but decided against that
07:49 PM _unreal_: DONT GET the straight thread
07:49 PM roycroft: it's to long for a ball screw
07:50 PM roycroft: but i'll only need 635mm of travel on the x
07:50 PM roycroft: that's still in ball screw range
07:50 PM roycroft: i'm actually thinking of straight rack and pinion, but with an anti-backlash mechanism
07:50 PM roycroft: helical is way more expensive
07:51 PM _unreal_: you want a helical style
07:51 PM roycroft: if i do that and it wears out too quickly, then i get to rethink the y, and perhaps go with helical gearing
07:51 PM roycroft: perhaps i do
07:51 PM _unreal_: if you use STRAIGHT you WILL GET COGGING
07:52 PM roycroft: but i do not have budget for that right now
07:52 PM _unreal_: which will show in the tooling
07:52 PM roycroft: a lot of commercial cnc routers use straight rack and pinion drive
07:52 PM roycroft: if there's a good anti-backlash mechanism it should run pretty smoothly
07:52 PM _unreal_: the offset angle helicals are 100% always engaged with multi teeth at any given moment
07:53 PM _unreal_: they are a drop in choice
07:53 PM roycroft: well again, no budget for that
07:53 PM _unreal_: ahhh the price difference is little
07:53 PM roycroft: if i *had* to use helical gearing, i'd just not build the thing
07:54 PM roycroft: perhaps i've not done enough research then, because what i found so far is that helical is about 3x as much as straight
07:54 PM roycroft: i'll look into it more
07:54 PM roycroft: and if you have any recommendations for helical gearing products, i'd appreciate it
07:55 PM _unreal_: your looking at using spur gears or helical
07:55 PM _unreal_: helical is the way to go period
07:55 PM roycroft: spur gears
07:55 PM _unreal_: and its just a choice of how its cut
07:55 PM roycroft: and keep in mind as well that i'll probably use the cnc router a couple horus/week or so
07:55 PM roycroft: the underside spindle will get 10x as much use as the overhead one
07:55 PM _unreal_: a few hours a week does not make any difference...
07:55 PM roycroft: a cnc router does not replace a traditional router table at all
07:56 PM roycroft: they do completely different things
07:56 PM roycroft: anyway, i need to go work on dinner
07:56 PM _unreal_: its simply a matter of tooth engagement and what you will enjoy as a finish
07:56 PM _unreal_: different things BS
07:56 PM XXCoder: dont forget to make one for me too
07:56 PM roycroft: if you have a source for inexpensive helical drive gears let me know
07:56 PM _unreal_: thspur and helical are identical
07:57 PM _unreal_: expect for how the tooth is cut and how they function
07:57 PM roycroft: again, that's not what my research has showne me
07:57 PM _unreal_: straight cut or spur. you will get the TICK TICK TICKING of the teeth
07:57 PM _unreal_: as it goes which WILL show up in the tooling depending on what your doing
07:57 PM roycroft: i'm looking at 3x as much for helical vs. straight
07:57 PM roycroft: which will easily add $1k to the cost of the machine
07:58 PM roycroft: which is not in the budget
07:58 PM roycroft: amd that's just for the y
07:58 PM _unreal_: aliexpress
07:58 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
07:58 PM roycroft: i'm going to be doing some design work later this evening
07:58 PM roycroft: i'll spend some more time looking at healical gearing
07:58 PM _unreal_: are you going with metal or poly gears?
07:58 PM roycroft: metal
07:59 PM roycroft: but again, i'll have an anti-backlash mechanism, which should make it run more smoothly than a single pinion gear would
07:59 PM roycroft: and again, many commercial cnc routers that sell for thousands of dollars use straight rack and pinion gearing to drive the gantry, and they do not get a lot of customer complaints about it
08:00 PM _unreal_: thats part of whyI asked if your going metal or poly
08:00 PM roycroft: i see what you're saying
08:00 PM roycroft: i'm just not sure it's as big a problem as you are claiming it is
08:00 PM _unreal_: the helical dont ware as fast as the spar do and the cogging grows as the wear on the teeth grows
08:00 PM _unreal_: it is and it isnt
08:00 PM roycroft: and with the limited use that it will get, that wear will take a long time
08:01 PM roycroft: you're making two claims here
08:01 PM roycroft: about straight vs. helical
08:01 PM roycroft: 1. straight wears faster than helical
08:01 PM _unreal_: A use case will give different results
08:01 PM t4nk_freenode: https://postimg.cc/gallery/hDHQFPh can't even judge the drills... that 3mm one looks bad
08:01 PM _unreal_: machine design/load
08:01 PM _unreal_: everything factors
08:01 PM roycroft: i don't know if i agree or disagree, but i don't care
08:01 PM roycroft: it doesn't matter to me
08:01 PM roycroft: 2. straight will provide a rougher finish than helical
08:01 PM _unreal_: all in all you will be happier with helical in the long run
08:02 PM _unreal_: that is for sure
08:02 PM XXCoder: definitely need resharping, those drills
08:02 PM _unreal_: XXCoder, hammer ;)
08:02 PM roycroft: and that does matter, at least somewhat, to me, but i have a hard time believing that the finish with a straight gear will be horrible, given how many large, expensive commercial routers use straight helical gears
08:02 PM roycroft: and as to the third point
08:02 PM roycroft: that i would be happer in the long run with helical, that may be true
08:02 PM roycroft: i won't dispute it
08:03 PM roycroft: but i don't have the budget for it, based on the pricing i've found so far
08:03 PM _unreal_: as I said check aliexpress
08:03 PM roycroft: but as i said some moments ago, i'll do more research on that
08:03 PM _unreal_: alibaba
08:03 PM _unreal_: they take for ever to get here
08:03 PM roycroft: and for the design work i'm doing right now it doesn't really matter
08:04 PM _unreal_: roycroft, just keep in mine
08:04 PM roycroft: if i design for straight and end up getting helical or vice versa, that won't alter the design much
08:04 PM roycroft: so i don't have to make that decision and set it in stone right now
08:04 PM _unreal_: a lot of the "expensive" stuff that can be purchased here in the usa. IS still cheap chines dog shit just up charged and prob CLEANED
08:04 PM roycroft: i'm actually more concerned about the z axis than the gantry drive
08:04 PM roycroft: which is why i'm buying the z axis first
08:05 PM _unreal_: My Z for the new cnc that is still not finished is STUPID rigid
08:05 PM _unreal_: kills me its sitting idle :(
08:05 PM roycroft: i'm not a made in usa bigot in the sense of thinking everything made in this country is superior to everything made in china
08:05 PM roycroft: only a complete moron would believe that
08:05 PM _unreal_: roycroft, just a suggestion though in your designb
08:05 PM _unreal_: design
08:05 PM _unreal_: regarding the z
08:05 PM XXCoder: i dont know why you bother to debate with unreal
08:05 PM roycroft: the chinese can make really high quality machines and tooling
08:05 PM _unreal_: that Z has rods
08:06 PM roycroft: but they can also make really crappy stuff, when the customer demands low price and does not care about quality
08:06 PM roycroft: yes it does
08:06 PM _unreal_: I would suggest designing for your spindle to be near the bottom of the z travel when mounting your material on the work bed
08:07 PM roycroft: i'm keeping it as low as possible
08:07 PM _unreal_: high loads if the z is in the middle of the travel will have the greatest amount of deflection risk
08:07 PM roycroft: anyway, i need to go make dinner
08:07 PM roycroft: thanks for the input
08:07 PM _unreal_: I had pork not to long ago :)
08:07 PM _unreal_: roasted.... with many cloves
08:08 PM _unreal_: they are still there..... poking at my insides
08:09 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, holy crap lay that pilot bit to rest. or at least get a re-sharpening kit for drillbits
08:11 PM _unreal_: I have a drill doctor at work
08:12 PM _unreal_: works great
08:41 PM t4nk_freenode: printing a sharpening jig now... I'll see if I can sharpen up that drill tomorrow
08:42 PM roycroft: when i started taking machining classes, the very first day in the shop we were taught how to grind drills by hand, without a jig
08:43 PM roycroft: and while we were not graded directly on that, the first parts we made that *were* graded needed those drills
08:44 PM roycroft: and i should not say "by hand"
08:44 PM roycroft: we used a grinder
08:44 PM roycroft: i should have said "freehand"
08:45 PM t4nk_freenode: the one I'm printing is on a 118degree angle, isn't that a bit hard to do freehand?
08:46 PM t4nk_freenode: I remember my granddad used to sharpen drills for people btw
08:46 PM _unreal_: free hand is very possible I do it now and then
08:46 PM t4nk_freenode: and I _think_ he used to just hold them against some kind of grinding stone
08:46 PM _unreal_: but its always going to be off compaired to using a mounting jig to grind a new end
08:47 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, are you printing a dremel mounting JIG for sharpening drill bits?
08:47 PM t4nk_freenode: ...
08:47 PM _unreal_: depending on the design. you COULD use those diamond bits but you really need FINE grit or a stone bit
08:47 PM _unreal_: what print design are you using
08:48 PM _unreal_: ?
08:48 PM t4nk_freenode: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1024834 the mini 118
08:48 PM t4nk_freenode: I got some dremel supplies... discs, stones..
08:49 PM t4nk_freenode: though that dremel chuck is a crima against humanity
08:49 PM t4nk_freenode: crime.
08:52 PM roycroft: dremels are fine if you never need to use one
08:53 PM _unreal_: roy?
08:53 PM roycroft: otherwise they're really expensive
08:53 PM _unreal_: I dont follow
08:53 PM _unreal_: and I use dremels endlessly at work
08:53 PM t4nk_freenode: sounds about right
08:53 PM roycroft: they burn up almost immediately
08:53 PM _unreal_: BS
08:54 PM _unreal_: I'm still using a craftsman from 1989
08:54 PM roycroft: i invested hundreds of dollars in dremels before i finally bot a proper flex shaft tool, which cost me over $300, but has lasted over a decade so far
08:54 PM _unreal_: a tool only fails when its used poorly or for the wrong job. which is the same thing more or less
08:55 PM roycroft: or if it's made poorly
08:55 PM enleth: roycroft: that's funny, I've had 3 genuine dremel-brand dremels burn up, but a cheap no-name knockoff I got when I was 11 is still working, and not for lack of use and abuse
08:55 PM _unreal_: I will admit I've had issues with dremels that are newer
08:55 PM roycroft: not all tool failures are operator error
08:55 PM _unreal_: older dremals are very hardy
08:55 PM roycroft: i said "dremel", enleth, not "rotary tool"
08:55 PM _unreal_: I've never had a dremel burn up
08:55 PM roycroft: i was being brand-specific there
08:55 PM _unreal_: I have had bearing issues
08:56 PM roycroft: but my foredom flex shaft tool is awesome
08:56 PM _unreal_: a dremel bit that does burn up on me a lot though are the 90 degree adapters for dremel
08:56 PM roycroft: i wanted to buy one a long, long time ago, but thought they were too expensive
08:56 PM roycroft: then i started adding up what i'd invested in dremels over the years, and it seemed like a bargain
08:56 PM _unreal_: the onlything that fails on them every time is the square drive shaft snaps off
08:57 PM enleth: _unreal_: they burn up very fast as soon as they start having commutation problems and lock up
08:57 PM roycroft: the proxxon rotary tool is supposed to be a lot better than dremel, and really doesn't cost that much more
08:57 PM _unreal_: enleth, I've never had that issue
08:57 PM _unreal_: I mainly use dremels for gelcoat work on boats
08:57 PM enleth: maybe what they sell here is different from what you get
08:58 PM roycroft: i'm in the usa
08:58 PM _unreal_: I use 1/8th rotory rasps to cut fiberglass for cutting out holes for guages
08:58 PM roycroft: although about as far away from _unreal_ as one can get and still be in the lower 48
08:58 PM enleth: perhaps their 230VAC motor designs are shit?
08:58 PM _unreal_: enleth, that would not suprise me
08:58 PM roycroft: but i doubt that west coast dremels are different to east coast dremels
08:59 PM _unreal_: higher voltage running on brushes :S
08:59 PM roycroft: enleth: the festool kapex chop saw is notorious for failing prematurely
08:59 PM roycroft: except it's not
08:59 PM roycroft: the festool community are pretty split on it
08:59 PM roycroft: the english-speaking community hate it
08:59 PM roycroft: the non-english speaking community love it
08:59 PM _unreal_: the only festool I have is the power orbital sander
08:59 PM _unreal_: I have the CTMINI system
09:00 PM roycroft: and that is because the european kapexes are 240vac
09:00 PM roycroft: the british and north american ones are 120vac
09:00 PM roycroft: i have a half dozen festool sanders
09:00 PM roycroft: and i have a festool track saw
09:00 PM _unreal_: I have this badboy with https://www.amazon.com/Festool-CT-Mini-Gallon-Extractor/dp/B002UJZNC4
09:01 PM roycroft: i have a midi extractor
09:01 PM roycroft: and btw
09:01 PM roycroft: we've had discussions about ventilation/respirators before
09:01 PM roycroft: i finally get a supplied air respirator, and i love it
09:01 PM enleth: as for proxxon, good tools, but some of their designs look like they pulled engineers out of some alternate history timeline
09:01 PM roycroft: i wear it even when i'm sanding now
09:01 PM enleth: so weird and unlike anything else
09:02 PM roycroft: even though i'm not concerned about the tiny amount of dust that does not get extracted
09:02 PM roycroft: the supplied air respirator is almost more comfortable than not wearing one at all
09:02 PM roycroft: the air is cooled slightly, which makes it really nice
09:03 PM roycroft: so we don't have to have the respirator discussion every again
09:03 PM roycroft: proxxon stuff does look rather weird, but it's made well
09:04 PM _unreal_: and the RO 150
09:04 PM roycroft: _unreal_: i built a cart for my extractor, with an overhead boom on the cart
09:04 PM roycroft: so my extractor hose is overhead
09:04 PM enleth: roycroft: I've heard some excellent opinions about the combo respirator/welding helmet devices, but the prices are horrendous. I'm still tempted to try one though
09:04 PM roycroft: the ro150 is the only sander i don't have that i want
09:05 PM roycroft: enleth: https://www.turbineproducts.com/breathe-cool-ii-supplied-air-respirator-w-auto-darkening-welding-helmet/
09:05 PM roycroft: <$US 500
09:06 PM _unreal_: roycroft, so you listened to me LOL
09:06 PM roycroft: i always listen to you
09:06 PM roycroft: i don't always agree with you
09:06 PM _unreal_: I have ?? 3 of the 150's
09:06 PM enleth: I'm already using a weld cap instead of a helmet for better sealing of stray light when working indoors under overhead lighting
09:06 PM _unreal_: I believe
09:06 PM roycroft: i buy all my festool gear from the festool refurb store
09:07 PM enleth: adding a hood to it to seal it up, well, seals it up
09:07 PM roycroft: it's refurbushed to like new condition, with occasional cosmetic blemishes, and comes with a 1 year guarantee
09:07 PM _unreal_: more or less I use the older rotax systems for heavy beat the shit out of it work
09:07 PM roycroft: for 30% off list
09:07 PM enleth: and it gets very hot very fast
09:07 PM _unreal_: and the newer one's for fine work light duty
09:07 PM roycroft: the ro 150 is just about the rarest machine that comes up for sale there, though
09:08 PM _unreal_: roycroft, they are a wworking BRICK
09:08 PM roycroft: the only thing that is more rare is the dominos
09:08 PM _unreal_: they dont fail easy
09:08 PM roycroft: i have a ro 90
09:08 PM roycroft: which is a great little sander
09:08 PM roycroft: it comes with a delta pad as well as a rotary pad
09:08 PM roycroft: so good for corners
09:08 PM _unreal_: roycroft, the company I work for uses the 150's for bottom paint sanding on boats
09:08 PM _unreal_: THAT stuff is hard
09:09 PM _unreal_: the only way to take it off clean with out digging the boat is with those machine in power drive orbital mode
09:09 PM _unreal_: with 24 grit paper
09:09 PM _unreal_: anything that is rotary just digs and scallops the hull bottoms too easy
09:10 PM roycroft: and i have an ets 125, with the new edge jig, and ets-ec 150, an ls 130 (the linear sander), and the ras 115 (rotary sander)
09:10 PM _unreal_: when it comes to fine finish work though
09:10 PM roycroft: the nice thing about the rotex is they can work in rotary mode and random orbital mode
09:10 PM _unreal_: I will take my air powered DA over the festools period
09:11 PM _unreal_: with a liber air fitting joint
09:11 PM roycroft: the ro 150 is the only other one i really want
09:11 PM _unreal_: I can flip it around so easy
09:11 PM roycroft: if i ever start doing a lot of casework again, i might get one of the big pad sanders
09:11 PM _unreal_: my expensive air DA can do 2000 orbits a min
09:11 PM roycroft: but i don't anticipate going that direction
09:11 PM roycroft: i worked at a boat factory back in the '80s
09:11 PM _unreal_: its so well balanced its scary
09:12 PM roycroft: i'm fairly familiar with that kind of work
09:12 PM roycroft: i did not do much fiberglass work though
09:12 PM _unreal_: so rounding an edge is so easy
09:12 PM _unreal_: I do it all
09:12 PM _unreal_: I'm one of the best in south florida
09:12 PM roycroft: for what i do, the festools do great
09:12 PM roycroft: i *may* get an ets ec-125
09:12 PM _unreal_: hell 2019 I was on a reality TV show on boats
09:12 PM _unreal_: which I still have NOT #Q$TW#E%$#$%TR seen
09:13 PM _unreal_: had camera crews following us for about 4 months
09:13 PM roycroft: i've thought about that, because i like having an 125mm sander for a lot of things, and it's kind of a pain to put the edge guide on and off the ets 125
09:13 PM roycroft: so getting another 125 would let me leave the edge guide on all the time
09:13 PM _unreal_: roycroft, ya I have a lot of mirror tools for different fixture setups
09:14 PM roycroft: i have like 10 routers now
09:14 PM roycroft: because i like to leave cutters set up all the time
09:14 PM _unreal_: My fav though now :( dead is a craftmen router
09:14 PM _unreal_: the built in collet died
09:14 PM _unreal_: err no
09:14 PM _unreal_: the collet holder died
09:15 PM _unreal_: the holder nut
09:15 PM _unreal_: the router is from the 80's
09:15 PM _unreal_: pains me its dead
09:15 PM _unreal_: I built my cnc machine using it
09:15 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
09:23 PM _unreal_: considering my machine was built with G10 material
09:23 PM _unreal_: I used a 1/4" rotary rasp to do all of the straight cuts using an edge guide
09:23 PM _unreal_: man that made a lot of itchy dust
09:23 PM roycroft: enleth: the supplied air respirator i linked to, which is the same company who make the one i got, is not noash approved, but it is made to noash specs
09:23 PM roycroft: like many such things, approval costs huge amounts of money
09:23 PM roycroft: i would not ask an employee to use one, because of liability concerns
09:23 PM roycroft: but i feel perfectly fine using it
09:23 PM _unreal_: OH I think I'm wrong I believe I have the festool RO 180
09:23 PM roycroft: the one i got is a half mask model, but i can buy the welding hood or blasting hood or full face shield if i want for it
09:23 PM roycroft: there is no ro 180
09:23 PM roycroft: ro 90, ro 125, and ro 150
09:23 PM enleth: most of what I do would not be approved by any safety regulator, I suppose
09:23 PM enleth: so I could not care less
09:23 PM roycroft: i'm not sure if there's a 240v version of that
09:23 PM roycroft: nor what shipping overseas would be
09:23 PM roycroft: but i'm more than happy with mine
09:23 PM roycroft: and it's about 1/3 the cost of the noash-approved models
09:24 PM XXCoder: sounds yummy. probably quite a lot of carbs sadly
09:25 PM roycroft: not too many
09:25 PM roycroft: there was a little flour in the cheese sauce
09:25 PM XXCoder: yeah compared to many, but im on very tight control on carbs unfortunately
09:25 PM XXCoder: 10-15 grams a day
09:26 PM roycroft: i'm watching carbs, but i am not at a point where i need to be fanatical about it
09:26 PM XXCoder: yeah normally id not worry too much if i was dieting
09:26 PM XXCoder: im at 3 weeks sober roughly now
09:26 PM roycroft: the main thing i really need to worry about is salt, and it's taking a fair amount of creativity to make food that doesn't taste bland while not adding salt
09:27 PM XXCoder: i got idea ffor you
09:27 PM XXCoder: no-salt
09:27 PM XXCoder: its possesium salt
09:27 PM roycroft: i use a lot of herbs and spices
09:27 PM XXCoder: 0 gram sodium
09:27 PM roycroft: potassium salt is actually better than just not using table salt
09:28 PM roycroft: it's not the amount of salt that's the problem
09:28 PM roycroft: it's the sodium-potassium balance that's the problem
09:28 PM roycroft: so increasing potassium intake is usually better than just reducing sodium
09:29 PM XXCoder: yup
09:29 PM XXCoder: dont forget other one in tringle
09:29 PM XXCoder: MG
09:29 PM XXCoder: my grandfather had tri-salt which had all of em in perfect balance
09:29 PM XXCoder: but its impossible to find now
09:31 PM _unreal_: I have not had tofu in for ever
09:33 PM roycroft: i have not had tofu in days :)
09:33 PM XXCoder: i dont have it very often, but then its great when youre tired of meat
09:34 PM roycroft: it's great or crappy - depending on how you prepare it
09:35 PM roycroft: by itself, tofu is fairly flavorless, but like eggplant, it readily absorbs flavors
09:36 PM XXCoder: yep
09:38 PM roycroft: so abom just did something i've never seen, but makes total sense
09:38 PM roycroft: he needed to drill a center on a shaft to help hold it in place while doing some work on the shaft
09:39 PM roycroft: and to get the center hole almost perfectly concentric, he drilled it in, then advanced the x about a thousandth, and held it there for a few seconds
09:40 PM roycroft: center drills usually are pretty accurate when the end has been faced properly, but his method really dials it in
09:41 PM _unreal_: there cad work done
09:46 PM XXCoder: what is X in lathe? cant remember
09:46 PM XXCoder: or did you mean on mill?
09:46 PM _unreal_: XXCoder, are ou talking about roycroft ?
09:48 PM roycroft: lathe
09:48 PM roycroft: x is the cross feed
09:48 PM roycroft: z is the carriage
09:49 PM _unreal_: holy hell martin short is 71?
09:49 PM XXCoder: ok its in/out to cylinder
09:49 PM roycroft: y is the toolholder height adjuster :)
09:49 PM XXCoder: while z is along the cylinder
09:49 PM XXCoder: ok
09:49 PM roycroft: it's just like a mill
09:49 PM roycroft: except on a lathe the spindle is usually horizontal
09:50 PM _unreal_: just saw an add for steve martin and martin short
09:50 PM _unreal_: show? movie someting?
09:50 PM roycroft: i saw them on colbert a couple weeks ago
09:50 PM roycroft: along with serena gomez
09:50 PM roycroft: i really want to watch their show
09:50 PM roycroft: murders in the building
09:50 PM roycroft: only murders in the building, rather
09:51 PM roycroft: i saw steve martin here in eugene a few years ago, with the steep canyon rangers
09:51 PM roycroft: it was mostly bluegrass music, of course, but he did a few comedy bits
09:51 PM roycroft: and at the very end he performed king tut, which was a requirement
09:51 PM roycroft: he would not have been allowed to leave the buiding without doing so
09:53 PM roycroft: steve and martin have a comedy special on netflix, i believe
09:56 PM _unreal_: hum
09:56 PM _unreal_: people still think I'm in my 20s
09:56 PM _unreal_: :/
10:09 PM roycroft: i got carded well into my 30s
10:09 PM roycroft: i think even once when i was in my 40s
10:38 PM t4nk_freenode: https://postimg.cc/gallery/8PF8fyc think I may have messed it up
10:39 PM t4nk_freenode: maybe it was the wrong angle
10:42 PM t4nk_freenode: the untouched one is more pointy
10:50 PM XXCoder: dunno
10:52 PM t4nk_freenode: I need to get some groceries tomorrow, I'll drop by the hardware store and get a few to try out
10:52 PM t4nk_freenode: but I just don't trust them.. the ones here are almost dollar-store level
10:53 PM t4nk_freenode: hardware store will have their own brand
10:53 PM _unreal_: the cut does look a little ruff
10:53 PM _unreal_: but the key to sharpening the BIT is hitting the correct angle of attack
10:53 PM _unreal_: bed time
10:54 PM XXCoder: really cheap ones, they dont even bother to heat treat em
11:03 PM roycroft: the harbor freight drills are made of pot metal with some sheetrock powder mixed in
11:03 PM roycroft: they are ok for drilling through carrots
11:03 PM roycroft: sometimes
11:05 PM bjorkintosh: do you often have to drill through carrots?
11:05 PM roycroft: when preparing fancy meals i may need to do that
11:06 PM roycroft: i've been pretty happy with drill hog drills
11:06 PM roycroft: they're made in usa, reasonably priced, and high quality
11:07 PM XXCoder: https://www.wikihow.com/Make-a-Carrot-Recorder
11:07 PM roycroft: they can be had on ebay and other online sources
11:07 PM roycroft: what?
11:08 PM roycroft: that page uses a concrete drill for carrots
11:08 PM roycroft: i promise, a concrete drill is not required for that
11:08 PM XXCoder: it might be food safe thing dunno
11:08 PM roycroft: a standard twist drill is fine