#linuxcnc Logs
Jul 03 2021
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:00 AM t4nk_fn: 33.18/25=1.3272... I may have miscounted though
12:07 AM t4nk_fn: rather tough, trying to measure this
12:07 AM captain_morgan: switch seems to be working... homing again
12:09 AM captain_morgan: my 2nd Y only has home, not limit
12:09 AM veegee: Will buy a shitty imperial analog micrometer for daily use
12:09 AM veegee: Metric ones are impossible to find
12:10 AM veegee: And wtf is the point of a micrometer that doesn't read tenths
12:10 AM veegee: If the best it can do is thousandths, calipers will do just fine
12:18 AM t4nk_fn: I think 1.25 should be about right, so with 8 microstep-microstepping.. it should come to 1280 steps/mm
12:18 AM t4nk_fn: I had my machine homing yesterday, and I generated a dowel program from within universal gcode platform
12:18 AM t4nk_fn: and it ran that
12:18 AM t4nk_fn: but now... I'm hitting alarms while homing
12:18 AM t4nk_fn: and when homing is supposed to have been ok... I'll run into the z-limit switch during a program
12:19 AM t4nk_fn: so I just downloaded an example gcode file, boomerangv4.ncc. let's hit start...
12:19 AM t4nk_fn: eh
12:20 AM t4nk_fn: ncc files might not be ok for ugs
12:28 AM _unreal_: gcode is just a txt document
12:28 AM _unreal_: its the contense that matters not the extension
12:29 AM t4nk_fn: contense - Queried term not found!
12:29 AM veegee: Hey!
12:29 AM veegee: I was just about to make fun of him for that
12:29 AM veegee: you took that away from me
12:29 AM t4nk_fn: lol
12:29 AM t4nk_fn: they can't take that away from me though :b
12:30 AM veegee: I wish I could help you, but best I can do is just sit here and troll while I have IRC on my second monitor
12:30 AM t4nk_fn: lol
12:30 AM veegee: and hunting for a metric analog micrometer with µm vernier scale on my main monitor
12:30 AM t4nk_fn: yeah, for once I'm on the other side of things
12:30 AM captain_morgan: huzzah! homing worked but I still have Joint: 0..3
12:30 AM t4nk_fn: can't say I like it ehehe
12:30 AM veegee: god damn americans
12:30 AM captain_morgan: veegee you'd probably be a hit on twitter
12:31 AM veegee: I stay away from social media bullshit
12:31 AM veegee: doesn't appeal to me, the concentration of idiots is too high
12:31 AM captain_morgan: you don't say
12:31 AM t4nk_fn: well, though that is true, and though I agree...
12:31 AM t4nk_fn: we must admit that irc is 'our' social platform
12:31 AM captain_morgan: anyhow... homing worked but I still get 0..3 and cannot job because home_sequence
12:48 AM t4nk_fn: so.....if I Home my machine and fire up a dowel example... it will fail and hit a z-limit
12:48 AM t4nk_fn: but I just set my machine to the center of all axes
12:48 AM t4nk_fn: and now the dowel program seems to be running fine
12:54 AM captain_morgan: might be investigating similar issue, trying to rn the linuxcnn example I'm getting 'linear movement on line 11 would exceed Z's positive limit'
12:54 AM XXCoder: tool length can cause that also
12:55 AM XXCoder: if moving up too far in order to clear tool over safety plane, it wpould cause that error
12:56 AM captain_morgan: yeah was just reading that
12:56 AM captain_morgan: whats the default tool....
12:57 AM captain_morgan: eh, tool 1 isn't much, 1/8in end mill. my Z MIN/MAX are -4/0.01
12:58 AM captain_morgan: oh! I got XYZ now
12:58 AM captain_morgan: I guess I had to home everything
01:01 AM t4nk_fn: I took an stm32f407 board and some stepper drivers and setup grbl
01:01 AM t4nk_fn: could I run linuxcnc with the same stuff?
01:03 AM captain_morgan: maybe best course is setting up tool probe next
01:54 AM Deejay: moin
02:08 AM t4nk_fn: moin
02:08 AM t4nk_fn: and... I think my y1 and y2 axes were offset
02:08 AM t4nk_fn: perhaps that caused the homing problems
02:11 AM t4nk_fn: it now homes about right, but I'm still left with the dowel program triggering an alarm on z
02:11 AM t4nk_fn: my travel at the moment is x=272, y=303, z=71
02:12 AM t4nk_fn: after homing it reads x=-269, y= -300 and z=-68
02:13 AM t4nk_fn: then my program starts running, and I can see the z moving to 70... 71... 71.093 .. and that's the end of my axis of course
02:13 AM t4nk_fn: (ALARM:1) Hard limit has been triggered.
02:14 AM t4nk_fn: so... mmmm it seems to be moving in the wrong direction
02:16 AM t4nk_fn: it's not $3, that just makes my z home on the bottom
02:25 AM t4nk_fn: and changing $2 has no effect either
03:00 AM t4nk_fn: it's been learning the hard way :|
03:00 AM t4nk_fn: wasted so much time on those limit switches and homing
03:20 AM t4nk_fn: well... mpos and wpos still all read the same
03:21 AM t4nk_fn: I'm gonna g0 z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z now, guess the biggest problems are over
04:21 AM veegee: Deejay where are you located?
04:21 AM veegee: I forgot
04:22 AM veegee: I hate it when I see your "moin" because it means I ruined my sleep cycle again
05:15 AM JT-Cave: morning
05:15 AM XXCoder: heys
05:29 AM Deejay: veegee, germany
05:42 AM veroski: good day, i don't understand the difference between joint.0.neg-hard-limit and halui.joint.0.ont-hard-min-limit. someone know the difference?. is there an explanation in the manual of how they can be used and what are they for?
06:17 AM Tom_L: morning
06:17 AM XXCoder: yo
06:36 AM JT-Cave: veroski, I have no idea why the pin is duplicated in halui...
06:44 AM veroski: JT-Cave: me too. but if the developers created it there will be a reason..even if minimal
06:45 AM XXCoder: neg and ont hmm
06:45 AM JT-Cave: well if you don't load halui then you have the joint one
06:46 AM veroski: aside from this, there is a part of the manual that explains what they are used for and how do the halui pins or joints and others work?
06:46 AM JT-Cave: not that I know of
06:46 AM Tom_L: wouldn't joints be a lower 'layer' than halui?
06:47 AM veroski: halui is important for command in jog the axis, and other pins type halui.mode.auto or manual, program start or pause
06:48 AM veroski: Tom_L: what do you mean?
06:48 AM Tom_L: halui is the user interface, joint is the machine interface?
06:50 AM veroski: yes, i think
06:52 AM veroski: with joint you can controll home, but also with halui, in halui we have halu.joint.0.is-homed, in join joint.0.homed. is not the same thing?
06:55 AM veroski: if so why were two identical pins created?
06:56 AM JT-Cave: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc you would have to read through the commits to figure that out
06:58 AM veroski: ok, thank. other question. why i have joint pin if i have not load motmod component?
07:13 AM veegee: Deejay nice. Are there lots of German people there?
08:19 AM * voltagex[m] uploaded an image: (51KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/XODKrPIAipRjioLLFHwzFpkL/image.png >
08:19 AM voltagex[m]: hi there, does the Debian ISO work installing via USB? It "can't find my CD drive" then fails.
08:20 AM voltagex[m]: ah, right, seems like it needs to be written to the flash drive in dd mode. https://forum.linuxcnc.org/38-general-linuxcnc-questions/40688-not-possible-to-install-linuxcnc-2-8-from-usb-stick?start=20
08:28 AM voltagex[m]: nope, still no good
08:58 AM JT-Cave: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstall#Creating_a_Bootable_Debian_USB_Flashdrive
09:06 AM voltagex[m]: Apart from the information about ISO mode being out of date, that page doesn't solve my issue unfortunately.
09:10 AM voltagex[m]: Yep, just checked, Debian 10.10 installs fine when written via Rufus.
09:51 AM Tom_L: shocking
12:06 PM Tom_L: anyone ever have lcnc have the tool table stop updating values when you set tools?
12:07 PM Tom_L: zero'd G54 and set T8 to Z zero and watched the before and after of the file (closing and reopening it) and it didn't update
12:08 PM Tom_L: at first i thought it was the cad so i checked that and it was fine
12:08 PM Tom_L: restarted lcnc and it seems to be ok again
12:08 PM Tom_L: it was a costly uh oh though
01:07 PM JT-Shop: I've never seen that before
01:26 PM Tom_L: me either
01:38 PM captain_morgan: moin! (hehe)
01:39 PM captain_morgan: succeeded in getting my cnc switched over to dual motor/home switch gantry last night
01:39 PM captain_morgan: homing is a go
01:41 PM captain_morgan: turns out probe/z homing was a much bigger topic than expected, I ran into a lot of GUI customizations and multi point touch off scripts, etc
01:43 PM captain_morgan: so wonder, for z touch-off is a limit switch homing required? when I disabled all HOME_*, manually homed then tried to touch off I would get an error about the probing going off
04:39 PM captain_morgan: hrmph, pretty much anything I try to do Z axis related is met with some form of 'would exceed limits'
04:39 PM captain_morgan: including G38.x
04:41 PM captain_morgan: additionally, when I home (just the gui button, no physical switch) and touch off the Axis screen shows Z on top of the red box (work area, yeah?), which I think is the root of these issues
04:54 PM captain_morgan: welp, that was great progress but enough for the weekend
04:54 PM JT-Shop: try setting the z offset inside the bounding limits
05:19 PM captain_morgan: cool, will check that out when I'm back to it Mon or Tue. Time for so much needed `not in front of a computer` time
06:56 PM veegee: Moin
06:57 PM Tom_L: not so
06:57 PM veegee: My sleep cycle is so messed up
06:57 PM veegee: pounding headache too
07:15 PM _unreal_: so what collection systems do you guys have on your cnc's?
07:15 PM _unreal_: vacuums, dust collectors?
07:15 PM _unreal_: something custom
07:15 PM _unreal_: veegee, less alcohol more water
07:16 PM _unreal_: take advil
07:17 PM veegee: I take enough advil to kill a normal man
07:17 PM veegee: (because of my shoulder injury)
07:22 PM roycroft: i just finished printing a dust collector adapter for my new disc sander
07:23 PM roycroft: and then i used the disc sander to modify the dust collector adapter i'm going to use on my new table saw sled
07:24 PM roycroft: the disc sander will be hooked up to my festool extractor, but i'm going to hook the table saw sled up to a shop vac which has a bit more suction than the festool extractor
07:24 PM roycroft: you really can't use a dust collector effectively with a small port - there's just not enough velocity
07:24 PM veegee: actually...
07:25 PM veegee: velocity increases as the port size decreases
07:25 PM roycroft: the disc sander has a 2" port, and the table saw sled 2-1/2"
07:25 PM roycroft: until the extractor cannot suck any more air
07:25 PM veegee: Bernoulli's principle
07:25 PM roycroft: it really does not work that way
07:25 PM veegee: There's less airflow though and that's more important
07:26 PM roycroft: i can put my hand over the end of a 4" dust collector hose and feel the air moving past it
07:26 PM roycroft: i do the same with a 2" hose hooked to the 4" port and it's a lot slower
07:27 PM roycroft: the bernoulli effect only works when you can suck enough air in
07:27 PM veegee: With enough static pressure, yes
07:27 PM veegee: I can definitely feel it with my 5kW dust collector
07:27 PM roycroft: but yes, the dust collector moves a lot more volume, so there's no way i can use a shop vac with my thicknesser or table saw or jointer
07:28 PM roycroft: but the dust collector can handle those machines just fine
07:28 PM roycroft: if i hook the dust collector to my drill press with a reduction fitting and a 2" hose, it hardly works at all
07:28 PM roycroft: but my shop vac keeps up just fine with the chips
07:29 PM veegee: that's entirely due to lack of static pressure
07:29 PM roycroft: and when i do try using the dust collector for the drill press, when i'm done with the work, if i pull the 2" hose off of the 4" hose while it's still turned on, it sucks a bunch of chips back into the collector that were just sitting in the hose
07:30 PM veegee: With a known pressure, like my new empty "240 gallon" air tank, a very small pressure like 1 psi produces quite a bit of velocity through a 1" port
07:30 PM veegee: and that decreases as port size increases or decreases
07:30 PM veegee: ^ you know what I mean (headache)
07:31 PM veegee: but at the extremes, friction and other losses have a huge impact
07:32 PM CloudEvil: 1PSI is about 10KPa, or 7000J/Kg, or 120m/s, 240mph
07:32 PM veegee: at that point, static pressure can compensate for those losses, like your shop vac example. It has enough static pressure
07:32 PM veegee: CloudEvil it is insanely fast testing it directly from the tank without a hose adding to losses
07:32 PM veegee: I turned the compressor flywheel by hand
07:33 PM veegee: I could barely get a reading from the pressure gauge but feel a lot of air through the output port
07:43 PM CloudEvil: The above is about 500 air-watts
08:36 PM roycroft: these drawer pulls are really consuming a lot of time and money to jig up
08:36 PM roycroft: i needed to mount some hold down clamps on one of the jigs, and i needed some mounting plates to do that
08:37 PM roycroft: with the mill/drill down, i had to dash to woodcraft to get some
08:37 PM roycroft: i rolled in 2 minutes before they closed until tuesday, and they only had one (i needed two), so i had to frantically redesign the hold downs
08:37 PM roycroft: $50 later, i have what i need
08:45 PM veegee: https://www.amazon.ca/American-Carbide-Tool-Carbide-Tipped-C6/dp/B00365FEIY
08:45 PM veegee: Having excellent success with these American Carbide Tool brazed carbide cutters
08:45 PM veegee: Damn, I just love a well-made tool
08:46 PM veegee: Unlike the sum-ting-wong set, the carbide has a known grade, works as expected, excellent tool life, very high quality build
08:46 PM veegee: Also doesn't look like they let a retard with a can of spray paint loose on it
08:47 PM veegee: The brazed joint looks flawless, like the filler anchored the carbide perfectly. They also weren't stingy with the carbide insert size. Sharpens great on my silicon carbide wheel. Need to get a tool and cutter grinder with a diamond cup badly so I can match their surface finish
08:49 PM veegee: Edge geometry is great and the edge is sharper than any carbide insert I've ever used. Positive rake with sharp edge slices through mild steel beautifully
08:50 PM veegee: No silly coatings means I don't have to run at high feeds and speeds. A gem of a tool
08:51 PM CloudEvil: :)
08:55 PM veegee: And the "dash size" like hydraulic fittings almost makes me forget that the units are in 16th of an inch
08:55 PM veegee: Much more tolerable than some ridiculous number like 67/128"
09:00 PM Tom_L: boy you pulled that one outta yer arse
09:00 PM Tom_L: that is ridiculous
09:01 PM veegee: Tom_L lol! You disagree about the coatings bit eh?
09:02 PM Tom_L: the fraction you picked to disclaim a wonderful measuring system :)
09:02 PM veegee: oh
09:02 PM veegee: well you know how I feel about units of measurement
09:02 PM veegee: metric or die
09:02 PM Tom_L: nnoooo.. do tell
09:03 PM Tom_L: metric thinkers are too narrow minded
09:04 PM veegee: When I place my metal stock order that sells metal in inch/foot sizes, I specify everything in metric
09:05 PM Tom_L: programmed, setup and ran a pile of these today: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/rue/Can_Holder/A9_New/final/A9_cutout1.jpg
09:05 PM veegee: I tell them I need 2m of 4cm 12L14. The lady who gives me my quote knows me well enough and tells me the closest they have is 38.1mm stock
09:06 PM veegee: I tell them that's fine. They give me a great price
09:08 PM Tom_L: veegee, what sort of things do you make?
09:09 PM veegee: Since I've been lucky enough to do this as a hobby, I've been able to amass a huge amount of knowledge and experience (through testing) that a production machinist doesn't have the time to do. Along the way, made parts fort my motorcycle, custom parts for my car mostly
09:10 PM veegee: Lots of experimentation with different stock material and cutter materials
09:11 PM veegee: And parts for my machine tools, like slide way locks for the lathe, carriage stops, mounting brackets for driving the lead screw with a servo
09:11 PM veegee: Aviation parts soon for my friend's airplane
09:13 PM veegee: Good quality versions of cheap plastic stuff, like the stand for my microscope
09:14 PM veegee: I have this: https://www.amazon.ca/Celestron-Handheld-Digital-Microscope-Pro/dp/B00CMJ1I08
09:14 PM veegee: I made a rigid solid metal stand for it with a servo motor for autofocus :)
09:14 PM roycroft: there is no inherent superiority of a decimal based system of measurement vs. a fractional based one
09:14 PM roycroft: anyone who claims there is is either a troll or an idiot
09:14 PM roycroft: or both
09:15 PM roycroft: which i think is the case here
09:15 PM veegee: LOL
09:15 PM roycroft: adding in a bit of bigotry
09:15 PM roycroft: i advocate for metrification in the usa not because it's better, but because virtually the entire rest of the world uses si units
09:15 PM roycroft: it's a kind of standardization that makes sense for everyone
09:15 PM veegee: It's better. It just is better
09:16 PM veegee: 12 inches per foot?
09:16 PM veegee: how many feet in a mile?
09:16 PM roycroft: but if the entire world adopted american customary units i'd be fine with that
09:16 PM veegee: Really? You'd be fine converting a mile to inches?
09:16 PM veegee: I can tell you instantly how many millimeters in kilometer
09:16 PM roycroft: just because you can't do anything but remedial math doesn't make your system better
09:16 PM roycroft: i'm not going to argue this
09:17 PM veegee: That quote is going in my forum signature haha
09:17 PM roycroft: i want to know why other people get called out for minor infractions of channel protocol, and jackasses like veegee can spout their hate and bigotry with impunity
09:18 PM veegee: it's not racist, sexist, or similar
09:18 PM veegee: It's just criticizing a ridiculous measurement system
09:19 PM veegee: You make me sound like a civil war era southerner lol
09:19 PM roycroft: no, there is deep-seated hatred and condescension there
09:19 PM roycroft: you're really no better than one
09:19 PM roycroft: you're superior to everyone
09:19 PM roycroft: you make fun of everyone
09:19 PM veegee: Who uses imperial
09:19 PM roycroft: no, just everyone
09:19 PM roycroft: you use racist terms to decribe chinese things
09:20 PM roycroft: which are made using your precious units
09:20 PM roycroft: you're such an asshole you don't even realise how much of one you are
09:20 PM XXCoder: 5,180 feet in mile or so
09:20 PM XXCoder: fun number!
09:20 PM veegee: orrrrrrr maybe you just need a nice warm cup of hot chocolate
09:21 PM roycroft: i try to just ingore your shit, but sometimes it spews out in such quantity that i have to say something
09:21 PM roycroft: but i'll be done now
09:21 PM veegee: I still love you
09:22 PM veegee: I'd give you a big hug if I could
09:23 PM roycroft: fuck off
09:23 PM Tom_L: veegee, 5280
09:23 PM veegee: Tom_L XXCoder disagrees
09:23 PM veegee: roycroft rude!!
09:24 PM veegee: But I know that's only a cry for help and what you really need is a big bear hug right about now. Everything's going to be ok
09:24 PM XXCoder: guess is not precision answer
09:25 PM XXCoder: thanks tom
09:25 PM Tom_L: simmer down. it's a holiday :)
09:25 PM veegee: Not yet, still a couple of hours to go
09:25 PM roycroft: i already said i'm done
09:26 PM roycroft: asshat is going to try to push my buttons all night, but that's ok
09:26 PM roycroft: i really would like to know why he is tolerated, though
09:26 PM XXCoder: /ignore veegee save some stress :)
09:26 PM roycroft: i'm not stressing
09:26 PM Tom_L: seem to be
09:26 PM roycroft: but i am calling out desplicable behavior
09:27 PM roycroft: or was
09:27 PM Tom_L: with name calling?
09:27 PM roycroft: i really am done :)
09:27 PM roycroft: so using racist terms to describe an entire nation is ok, but calling an individual jackass the jackass that he is is not ok?
09:27 PM Tom_L: let's all sit around the campfire and sing kumbaya
09:27 PM * roycroft doesn't get that at all
09:28 PM XXCoder: now I gonna sing out? ugh
09:28 PM XXCoder: ;)
09:28 PM * roycroft is making dinner, and not singing
09:28 PM Tom_L: no pizza tonight?
09:28 PM Tom_L: wait.. that's friday isn't it?
09:28 PM XXCoder: i almost cant get full on pizza
09:28 PM roycroft: that was last night :)
09:28 PM XXCoder: thats why i rarely have pizza
09:29 PM * roycroft has leftover pizza
09:29 PM XXCoder: today I had smoothie. i am very full now
09:29 PM roycroft: i know how to stop
09:29 PM Tom_L: so do i but i don't always
09:29 PM roycroft: i made a margherita last night, since my basil is growing like crazy
09:29 PM XXCoder: knowing how to stop and not getting full is not same thing
09:30 PM roycroft: and the neighbors behind me are shooting off illegal fireworks already
09:31 PM Tom_L: well that's a given
09:31 PM Tom_L: my animals hate it
09:31 PM roycroft: i think this year the cops will actually respond, because fireworks are banned in 2/3 of the city due to the drought, and the police have put extra cops on patrol just to bust the fireworks offenders
09:31 PM XXCoder: nothing like celibrating by breaking laws
09:31 PM XXCoder: extreme fire risk here
09:31 PM roycroft: my neighbors shoot bottle rockets into my yard and onto my roof
09:32 PM XXCoder: expecially after last weekend that killed 500 people
09:32 PM roycroft: i don't like fireworks, but i could tolerate them better if they were just legal ones
09:32 PM XXCoder: land is VERY dry
09:32 PM roycroft: but the illegal ones directly threaten my property
09:32 PM veegee: Send some molotovs into their yard!
09:33 PM Tom_L: is that fighting fire with fire/
09:33 PM Tom_L: ?
09:33 PM veegee: Well you're being nice by gifting them alcohol
09:33 PM veegee: I don't know why anyone would be upset
09:33 PM XXCoder: I look "forward" to smokey season coming soon :(
09:33 PM XXCoder: it probably will be far worse than last year, and last eyar was bad enough
09:33 PM Tom_L: my sprinklers might just go haywire and spray all over the place
09:34 PM veegee: You have yard sprinklers that respond to fire?
09:34 PM Tom_L: just saying
09:34 PM XXCoder: nah just timer error
09:34 PM Tom_L: they could...
09:34 PM XXCoder: heat from fire screwed with timer
09:34 PM XXCoder: or noises from fireworks
09:35 PM Tom_L: commercial hose & nozzle can shoot ~100ft or so
09:35 PM veegee: metric_bot: 100ft = 30.48m
09:38 PM Tom_L: now if JT would roll his cannon out in the yard, that _would_ be a treat
09:38 PM roycroft: i did make my arc jig for my drawer pulls today, and did not have to make a 13+ foot long circle jig to make it
09:38 PM roycroft: it turned out as close to perfect as i could wish for
09:38 PM veegee: Tom_L what kind of cannon?
09:39 PM Tom_L: https://gnipsel.com/cannon/cannon.xhtml
09:39 PM roycroft: i thought his cannon was non-functional
09:39 PM Tom_L: he shoots blanks
09:40 PM veegee: Oh like literally field artillery
09:40 PM roycroft: i'm not sure that's something that needs to be shared here :)
09:40 PM XXCoder: talking about old things, i kickstarted mini gutenberg press!
09:40 PM XXCoder: can't wait to get it,.
09:40 PM veegee: What were the barrels made of?
09:41 PM Tom_L: you'd have to ask him
09:42 PM Tom_L: https://gnipsel.com/cannon/videos/cannon04.mov
09:44 PM veegee: how do you bore long, narrow holes?
09:44 PM veegee: Like for a rifle
09:45 PM Tom_L: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfA7Wzmaq4k
09:45 PM veegee: well there you have it
09:47 PM Tom_L: https://unisig.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/gundrilling-tooling-detail-300x180.jpg
09:48 PM Tom_L: you're into tool geometry....
09:48 PM veegee: Yeah I was wondering if it's essentially a long boring bar
09:51 PM Tom_L: i used alot of single flute half round on long brass parts
09:51 PM Tom_L: barb fittings etc
09:52 PM veegee: Speaking of pipe fittings, I have to run a hard air line in my workshop
09:53 PM veegee: I'm thinking single line 2" schedule 40 pipe. The unions are insanely expensive
09:54 PM veegee: Might be a good opportunity to machine my own pipe unions
09:55 PM veegee: Time to order some more 12L14 stock
10:00 PM Tom_L: https://images.globalindustrial.com/images/275x275/PG95723.jpg
10:00 PM Tom_L: like those
10:04 PM veegee: Yeah that makes sense
11:37 PM veegee: XXCoder but can you get it gutentite?