#linuxcnc Logs

Jun 25 2021

#linuxcnc Calendar

02:04 AM Deejay: moin
04:08 AM Tom_L: morning
05:03 AM JT-Cave: morning
05:04 AM XXCoder: hryd
05:04 AM XXCoder: *heys
06:19 AM JT-Cave: yea it's friday
06:19 AM JT-Cave: it's already 79°F outside
06:20 AM XXCoder: ow
06:20 AM XXCoder: will be 81f. starting ramp up to hellish sunday and monday
07:01 AM mrec: linear rails are definitely better on cheap chinese mills. It seems to be very challenging for them to mill a correct x-table joint
08:25 AM JT-Shop: Tom_L, I don't think so
08:46 AM * JT-Shop hopes no one calls him today for work
08:56 AM * JavaBean sets the phone back down
09:06 AM * JT-Shop puts the phone in a drawer and covers it up with a towel
09:47 AM Spida: mrec: what is so hard on getting that joint right?
10:09 AM roycroft: holy moly - the revised forecast now calls for a high of 45 on sunday
10:09 AM roycroft: we've never reached 40 in june before, and 42 is the all-time recorded high, so we would blow that away if the forecast holds true
10:09 AM CloudEvil: A) That's a bit chilly. B) Ow.
10:18 AM roycroft: it might hit 40 in vancouver bc on sunday, and canadians don't even know how to count that high when they're counting temperature
12:51 PM roycroft: the ac in my shop might keep the temperature there down to 30 or so
12:52 PM roycroft: when it gets up in the 40s
12:52 PM roycroft: but that will still be so much better than having the door open
12:52 PM roycroft: my shop and my office are the only two spaces at my house that have ac, so you know where my priorities lie :)
01:01 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
01:08 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
01:08 PM Tom_L: heavy T-storms to hit ~4 PM
01:08 PM Tom_L: high winds, hail etc etc
01:08 PM Tom_L: we have been known to get hail: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/temp/hail/hail4.jpg
01:19 PM roycroft: it's already 27 here, and it's not even noon
01:52 PM Joe_Hildreth: has anyone here compiled LCNC 2.8 on Ubuntu 20.04?
02:14 PM Joe_Hildreth: I get this error: configure: error: boost::python is required to build LinuxCNC
02:19 PM Joe_Hildreth: when I install libboost-python-dev, I get a message that it is already at the latest version. Any suggestions?
02:21 PM Joe_Hildreth: system is Ubuntu 20.04 with 5.10.41-rt42 kernel
02:28 PM rs[m]: Joe_Hildreth: i think you need to use a newer branch that can deal with python3
02:42 PM Joe_Hildreth: I get the same result when I use master
02:44 PM Tom_L: taking the road less travelled ehh?
02:47 PM Joe_Hildreth: Just playing around. Thought I would try it out since I have not compiled a preempt-rt kernel and a lcnc source for a while.
02:47 PM Joe_Hildreth: That and I want to look at the hal .comp files
02:47 PM rs[m]: Joe_Hildreth: master is not python3 yet
02:48 PM Joe_Hildreth: Ahh, so I need to stick with slightly older Ubuntu? I know I have compiled on 18 in the past
02:48 PM rs[m]: Joe_Hildreth: look at https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/issues/820
02:49 PM rs[m]: Joe_Hildreth: this should be the branch https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/tree/master-gtk3
02:49 PM rs[m]: but that will not run on any older ubuntus
02:50 PM Joe_Hildreth: Thanks for the links. Let me check that branch out and try again. :-)
02:55 PM Joe_Hildreth: Looks like that is working so far .... thanks rs
02:58 PM rs[m]: no problem. i think i read on linuxcnc-devel that a transition to python3 on master is imminent
03:04 PM Joe_Hildreth: Well, seems to be working. Only "WEIRD" thing is the DRO displayed on Axis looks like little squares or something. Maybe missing a resource?
03:04 PM rs[m]: that is a font issue
03:05 PM rs[m]: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/issues/659
03:07 PM Joe_Hildreth: Awesome, thanks rs, you have been a big help. I appreciate it.
03:08 PM rs[m]: yw. this channel needs the occasional on-topic stuff ;)
03:14 PM tiwake[m]: shit
03:15 PM tiwake[m]: my work place... merf
03:15 PM tiwake[m]: they don't like people working on stuff after hours
03:15 PM tiwake[m]: at all
03:16 PM tiwake[m]: even with your own tools and shit
03:19 PM Tom_L: so do it during work hrs
03:24 PM JT-Shop: that's what they do in germany I hear
03:25 PM * Tom_L bets JT-Shop does things on company time all the time
03:25 PM JT-Shop: yep
03:25 PM Tom_L: warning of severe t-storms here
03:25 PM JT-Shop: I had something I was going to do when I got out here... can't remember
03:26 PM Tom_L: it will come to you when it's too late
03:28 PM Tom_L: may check the tramming on the mill now that it's been a while since the build
03:28 PM Tom_L: doesn't seem to bad but who knows
03:30 PM JT-Shop: oh I remember now
03:35 PM JT-Shop: wire stripper is working good, just need to make a couple more spacer plates
03:36 PM Joe_Hildreth: rs: the workaround by changing the axis.py source worked for me. Thanks again.
03:37 PM Tom_L: nice
04:05 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://youtu.be/AHUv9Zda_48 off the ML : "hat if the ball were 6" in diameter and made of hard steel?"
04:07 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Joe_Hildreth: any distro that has left Python2 in the dust will have issues building LCNC
04:07 PM CloudEvil: Look at the nasty diferential gearboxes needed in addition to that shiny gear.
04:08 PM CloudEvil: Wonder how the fuck you lubricate and support it so it doesn't wear.
04:08 PM CaptHindsight[m]: you let the lube drizzle down
04:09 PM CaptHindsight[m]: or you just replace the ball every 1,000 miles
04:10 PM CaptHindsight[m]: or you have a boot over the balls and gears and let in soak in tank of oil like a crankcase
04:11 PM CloudEvil: i was more meaning what does the ball run against
04:15 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://youtu.be/hhDdfiRCQS4?t=196 plain bearing
04:15 PM CaptHindsight[m]: also shown here https://youtu.be/hhDdfiRCQS4?t=95
04:17 PM CloudEvil: yes, I'm aware of how they've done it. I am deeply unconvinced that that will work for more than trivial loads.
04:17 PM CaptHindsight[m]: looks like it works for lighter loads when a slick polymer is used for the gears and bearing/holder
04:19 PM CaptHindsight[m]: the spherical gear could be made of bronze or you could make the holder of bronze and make the opposite of something harder, sacrifice one or the other
04:23 PM CaptHindsight[m]: any contamination harden than either would wear it out quickly
04:25 PM CaptHindsight[m]: maybe for a 5-axis dental mill or similar
04:26 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://www.axsysdental.com/Versamill5X200.html
04:28 PM Joe_Hildreth: CaptHindsight: So where does the software plan on going? Will 2.8 and older be Python 2 and lcnc 2.9, python 3? Does that mean there is no upgrade path for the 2.7, 2.8 users? What happens when all the distros move to python 3?
04:29 PM CaptHindsight[m]: I think the devs are all working to get LCNC up to Python3
04:29 PM Joe_Hildreth: Older distros can run python 3, correct?
04:29 PM CaptHindsight[m]: there was some back porting to get 2.8 out on Buster
04:30 PM Joe_Hildreth: I see. Thank you for taking the time to explain. I am a software NOOB
04:30 PM CaptHindsight[m]: you mean right out of the box with no porting? :)
04:31 PM CaptHindsight[m]: yes at some point LCNC will be 100% Python3
04:31 PM Joe_Hildreth: I mean, if I were running Ubuntu 16 with python2, could it be made to run python 3 and then compile the new LCNC software?
04:31 PM Joco[m]: CaptHindsight: has there been any specific comms yet from lcnc dev group in py3 plans?
04:32 PM CaptHindsight[m]: Joco: it's either on the forums or chat in the dev channel
04:32 PM Joco[m]: I know py3 work is in flight as I have a lcnc 2.9 version running under py3
04:32 PM Joco[m]: ok
04:34 PM Joe_Hildreth: Joco, I just compiled LCNC 2.9 pre (master-gtk3 branch, I think) .... With Ubuntu 20.04 and python 3.
04:34 PM CaptHindsight[m]: https://sourceforge.net/p/emc/mailman/message/37303177/
04:34 PM Joco[m]: CaptHindsight: given the end of life announcement for py2 someone in lcnc leadership group would ideally be putting up some comms on the website. Maybe they have but I don't recall seeing it.
04:34 PM Joco[m]: Joe_Hildreth: yup. I did same on mint20
04:35 PM Joco[m]: in the process of checking some UI work I am doing against it and py3 version of pyqtvcp
04:37 PM Joe_Hildreth: The last time I tried was compiling preempt-rt on Ubuntu 18 and LCNC was 2.8 in master branch. Thought I would try again to explore some of the hal .comp stuff. Just trying to learn more about the software. :-)
06:05 PM roguish[m]: joco_nz[m]: the Master branch is in the process of being converted from Py2 to Py3
06:06 PM roguish[m]: rene-dev is working it.,
06:12 PM roguish[m]: joco_nz[m]: I suggest that you follow the emc-developers mail list.
06:16 PM XXCoder: awesome
07:37 PM Joco[m]: roguish[m]: yup - aware of rene's work
07:59 PM tiwake[m]: does anyone know of a good CNC mill kit?
07:59 PM XXCoder: mpcnc? lol
08:00 PM XXCoder: newest versions is pretty good for wood
08:00 PM XXCoder: BUt it has no nicies like rapid percent speed, and actual e-stop
08:02 PM tiwake[m]: nothing that I can plug into my own (linuxCNC) controller?
08:03 PM tiwake[m]: I don't have three-phase power and the power company is being assholes about installing such a thing
08:03 PM XXCoder: theres stuff you can use
08:04 PM XXCoder: depends on your usercase and budget
08:04 PM XXCoder: $1000-$1500 fine? or is it $50000
08:04 PM tiwake[m]: I was going to spend $2000 on a spindle
08:04 PM XXCoder: theres even budget for $200 one, but dont expect much on those
08:04 PM XXCoder: what materials to cut, and what vworkspace volume needs?
08:04 PM tiwake[m]: steel
08:05 PM tiwake[m]: lets say I want to spend about $7k
08:05 PM XXCoder: yeah that needs bit more work than just building nice alum frame machine
08:05 PM XXCoder: also outside my knowledge lol i know cheap range
08:05 PM tiwake[m]: neh, I want a real T-slot bed
08:05 PM XXCoder: workspace volume needs?
08:05 PM Tom_L: make one?
08:06 PM tiwake[m]: Tom_L: make one with what?
08:06 PM Tom_L: you can get the cast iron from china
08:06 PM tiwake[m]: I don't have access to any machines right now
08:07 PM Tom_L: i didn't either, just hand tools
08:07 PM tiwake[m]: even though I work in a machine shop
08:07 PM tiwake[m]: my work place pisses me off
08:07 PM tiwake[m]: shitheads
08:08 PM Tom_L: https://www.researchgate.net/figure/The-CNC-milling-machine-frame-after-seasoning-vibrating-and-machining_fig1_323753518
08:08 PM Tom_L: there are smaller ones, that's the first one i found
08:09 PM XXCoder: well ti theres couple ways with essentally no machining. epoxy grinate and welding
08:09 PM XXCoder: welding you could make frame work well enough to mill cast iron, then mill t slot table
08:10 PM XXCoder: tom build a mostly welded steel machine thats pretty amazing
08:10 PM Tom_L: Lcvette actually bought one with motors etc attached, no control
08:10 PM tiwake[m]: I only want about a 2' cube of work space
08:10 PM Tom_L: just takes a bit of time and patience
08:10 PM Tom_L: that's fairly large actually
08:11 PM tiwake[m]: that would be the smallest CNC machine I've ever used
08:11 PM XXCoder: yeah. most machiens you have 2' on x and z but y is like 12"
08:11 PM tiwake[m]: lul
08:11 PM XXCoder: in least in your budget range anyway
08:12 PM Tom_L: iirc mine is 17 x 13 x 7
08:12 PM Tom_L: i like odd numbers :)
08:12 PM tiwake[m]: if I could use the CNC mill at work then I wouldn't have any problems
08:12 PM tiwake[m]: just make whatever I want
08:12 PM Tom_L: then you wouldn't need one ehh?
08:12 PM XXCoder: your area may have cheap old machines
08:13 PM XXCoder: need repairs if youre skilled it can be good deals there
08:13 PM Tom_L: if i can't do it, i take it out to my bud's shop
08:13 PM tiwake[m]: XXCoder: I don't have three-phase power
08:13 PM Tom_L: what's the budget?
08:13 PM XXCoder: 7k
08:13 PM tiwake[m]: about $7k
08:13 PM Tom_L: you can do a nice one for that or less
08:14 PM tiwake[m]: I could get plenty of used CNC mills too, but no three-phase power :-/
08:14 PM XXCoder: tom isnt there 1 phase to 3 convertors?
08:14 PM XXCoder: no idea how much those would be
08:14 PM tiwake[m]: there is, but I still don't have enough power
08:14 PM Tom_L: phase inverters
08:14 PM Tom_L: jt uses one
08:14 PM tiwake[m]: and they cost like $7k
08:14 PM XXCoder: so its machine or convertpr
08:14 PM tiwake[m]: well, depending on the size
08:15 PM snakedGT is now known as snaked
08:15 PM tiwake[m]: converter is balls anyway, not enough to power a typical CNC mill (say like a haas VF2)
08:15 PM tiwake[m]: so it would be worthless anyway
08:16 PM tiwake[m]: should I just spend less and get an aluminum frame one?
08:16 PM XXCoder: i dont know on steel. you should be able to do alum
08:17 PM Tom_L: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000371288236.html
08:17 PM Tom_L: that's one i was looking for
08:17 PM XXCoder: that has strong framework for steel cutting id say?
08:18 PM tiwake[m]: oh cute
08:18 PM XXCoder: small work space
08:18 PM Tom_L: i did mine from steel scrap from the salvage
08:18 PM XXCoder: yeah i remember following your build. hows it so far ?
08:18 PM Tom_L: great
08:18 PM XXCoder: if i recall its been done couple years ago?
08:19 PM Tom_L: i'm gonna do some work on it soon
08:19 PM Tom_L: check things over
08:19 PM Tom_L: been running parts though
08:19 PM Tom_L: i'm in no rush
08:19 PM Tom_L: got the spindle working great
08:20 PM XXCoder: :)
08:20 PM XXCoder: might finally have space for cnc soonish
08:20 PM Tom_L: no more sherline motor with a cooling bucket :)
08:20 PM XXCoder: :)
08:20 PM tiwake[m]: this one has the linearbearings already
08:20 PM tiwake[m]: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002374251419.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000060.2.2643689bStHKX4&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.169870.0&scm_id=1007.13339.169870.0&scm-url=1007.13339.169870.0&pvid=0c39ae4c-5e50-4181-b2fa-ab7ad77b1caf&_t=gps-id:pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller,scm-url:1007.13339.169870.0,pvid:0c39ae4c-5e50-4181-b2fa-ab7ad77b1caf,tpp_buckets:668%230%23131923%230_668%230%23131923%230_668%23888%233325%2310_668%238
08:20 PM tiwake[m]: 88%233325%2310_668%232846%238116%232002_668%235811%2327185%2366_668%232717%237562%23438_668%231000022185%231000066059%230_668%233468%2315615%23699_668%232846%238116%232002_668%235811%2327185%2366_668%232717%237562%23438_668%233164%239976%23548_668%233468%2315615%23699
08:21 PM Tom_L: anything after the "?" you don't need
08:21 PM tiwake[m]: * this one has the linearbearings already https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002374251419.html
08:21 PM tiwake[m]: yeah, I was noticing
08:21 PM XXCoder: thats cheap
08:21 PM Tom_L: 5k shipping
08:21 PM XXCoder: i think anyway
08:21 PM XXCoder: ow yeah all that heavy metal
08:22 PM Tom_L: that would put you right at your budget with no motors or control
08:22 PM tiwake[m]: merf
08:22 PM Tom_L: i didn't read the content list
08:22 PM tiwake[m]: shit that would be nice though
08:22 PM XXCoder: "This machine is a customer-made machine!" lol
08:23 PM Tom_L: i'd get the bare one and populate it
08:23 PM XXCoder: 1000% chance you will need to rebuild everything
08:23 PM Tom_L: it may be cheaper in the end
08:23 PM Tom_L: more work
08:24 PM XXCoder: work time, price, and quality
08:24 PM XXCoder: always tradeoffs
08:25 PM Tom_L: just wanted to show you that option
08:28 PM tiwake[m]: if I start with a steel plate and start drilling, tapping, and mounting shit, how am I supposed to make sure everything is square? that the linear bearings are flat with themselves? that the ballscrews are not torquing at an angle different from the linear bearings
08:28 PM Tom_L: enginuity
08:29 PM Tom_L: i wouldn't use a plate though
08:29 PM Tom_L: some sort of structural steel
08:30 PM tiwake[m]: A36
08:30 PM Tom_L: like box tubing etc is what i meant
08:30 PM Tom_L: I beam etc
08:30 PM Tom_L: you'll learn as you go
08:30 PM Tom_L: i know i did
08:31 PM XXCoder: ti make it adjustable
08:36 PM tiwake[m]: I have a nice CNC lathe that needs a controller built for it
08:36 PM tiwake[m]: hardinge CHNC
08:36 PM tiwake[m]: arn't those normally 3-phase though?
08:40 PM Tom_L: also how much space do you have for a cnc
08:41 PM Tom_L: i had very little
08:41 PM tiwake[m]: I have enough space for 2-3 haas VF 2
08:41 PM Tom_L: well there you go
08:41 PM Tom_L: they take cash
08:41 PM tiwake[m]: no power delivery though
08:42 PM Tom_L: alot of cncs don't like running from phase inverters either
08:42 PM tiwake[m]: the VF2 uses 35amps at 480v (max power draw)
08:42 PM tiwake[m]: shit tons of power
08:42 PM Tom_L: yeah
08:42 PM Tom_L: mine runs off 110v house current :)
08:43 PM tiwake[m]: XXCoder: what about aluminum-frame builds?
08:45 PM Tom_L: i'm sure they're ok
08:46 PM Tom_L: i think alum would flex more than steel but you can get thicker aluminum
08:46 PM tiwake[m]: I mean, got a link for a good one?
08:46 PM Tom_L: no
08:46 PM Tom_L: all the kits seem to be gantrys
08:47 PM Tom_L: i didn't want a gantry
08:53 PM snakedGT is now known as snaked
09:23 PM roycroft: it is "only" 35 degrees right now, and two of my servers have shut down due to overheating
09:24 PM roycroft: if it really gets up to 46 on sunday, as predicted, my entire rack may melt down
09:25 PM Tom_L: 75 now, cool front moved in along with T-storms
09:25 PM * roycroft cannot fathom a forecast of 46 degrees
09:25 PM Tom_L: right on the edge of it though
09:26 PM roycroft: 42 is the hottest it's ever gotten here, since such things have been tracked, which is well over 100 years
09:27 PM Tom_L: i recall a few summers in the teens
09:28 PM roycroft: 42 is more like death valley than western oregon
09:28 PM roycroft: even the desert in eastern oregon does not get that hot often
09:29 PM Tom_L: it ws 49.4 in the 30's
09:29 PM Tom_L: here
09:30 PM roycroft: i'm really not a fan of hot weather
09:30 PM roycroft: given the choice, i'd take extreme cold over extreme heat
09:31 PM Tom_L: never used to bother me but i'm not that fond of it anymore
09:31 PM roycroft: i can only take so many clothes off
09:31 PM roycroft: but i can add them almost without limit
09:32 PM roycroft: but there's some positive news today
09:33 PM roycroft: i was able to pick some basil from my garden to put on my pizza tonight for the first time this year
09:33 PM roycroft: i planted less this year than last year, because i had too much last year, but it's already producing more than last year
09:34 PM roycroft: basil really likes hot weather, as do most mediterranean herbs
09:39 PM roycroft: the thing about this heat is that most folks in the nortwet don't have air conditioning, because it's really not needed for more than a few days per year
09:39 PM roycroft: and it's a pretty significant expense for as seldom as it's needed
09:39 PM roycroft: climate change i'm sure is causing many to rethink that
09:43 PM tiwake[m]: luls
10:05 PM Tom_L: good day to be a HVAC guy in the NW
10:28 PM XXCoder: tiwake[m]: most easy to get kits alum frame is router type
10:29 PM XXCoder: tiwake[m]: https://www.harborfreight.com/vertical-milling-machine-40939.html
10:30 PM XXCoder: 2 axis 2', but y is 12 inch i think or maybe 10 inch
10:30 PM XXCoder: not a cnc, but you probably can upgrade it to be one
11:58 PM XXCoder: im glad I live at west wa https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/602938910947016730/858205721085345802/RDT_20210625_2242424343373072949818027.jpg?width=969&height=664