#linuxcnc Logs
Jan 15 2021
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:14 AM XXCoder: oh man!
12:21 AM XXCoder: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4386034
12:21 AM XXCoder: forgot i had that in collection
12:29 AM XXCoder: https://youtu.be/tBr2tR5pjrE
12:29 AM XXCoder: baseball how its made
12:59 AM mrec: ok the handwheel is already supported
12:59 AM mrec: it just needs some configuration
12:59 AM XXCoder: nice
01:00 AM mrec: but it's skipping some input I'll check with the oscilloscope if that's an electrical or software issue.
01:34 AM Deejay: moin
04:17 AM mrec: hmm.. I have an A axis and the setup is a bit confusing
04:17 AM mrec: the motor is 200 steps per revolution
04:17 AM mrec: microstepping is set to 32
04:17 AM mrec: Pulley teeth? what should that be? it's 4:1
04:17 AM mrec: leadscrew pitch: degree / rev?
04:17 AM mrec: Pulley teeth 4:1 or 1:4?
04:18 AM mrec: motor = 4 Chuck = 1
04:19 AM mrec: ok seems like 1:4 (Motor:Leadscrew) .. it's confusing.
04:56 AM mrec: it works well now
05:02 AM JT-Cave: morning
05:03 AM XXCoder: yo
05:33 AM mrec: does anyone have experience about microstepping vs. belt reduction?
05:33 AM mrec: I read that one: https://www.cnczone.com/forums/linear-and-rotary-motion/118922-cnc.html
05:39 AM Tom_L: morning
06:04 AM JT-Cave: https://gnipsel.com/images/customers/BobG/target-sys-03.jpg
06:04 AM JT-Cave: https://gnipsel.com/images/customers/BobG/target-sys-04.jpg
07:29 AM JT-Cave: 148 pounds of enclosures are coming today...
07:29 AM JT-Cave: fedex freight
07:33 AM JT-Cave: https://www.amazon.com/Adams-Convenient-Vehicle-Mileage-Journal/dp/B019PXWWF8
07:33 AM JT-Cave: wow a $5 mileage book for $18 on amazon
07:35 AM JavaBean: you shouldn't be too surprised, amazon is often not the cheapest source... but it IS convienent
08:28 AM jymmmm: Morning folks
09:42 AM beachbumpete1: Morning
09:52 AM perry_j1987: everybody got their coffee?
09:55 AM perry_j1987: back at this conversion this morning
09:55 AM perry_j1987: got spindle turning last night :)
10:05 AM perry_j1987: which direction is 11oclock on the trimpots g320x
10:05 AM perry_j1987: what orientation are you suppose to look at them lol
10:54 AM perry_j1987: so
10:55 AM perry_j1987: the spindle encoder without 5v has 2.43v on phase a and phase b ....
10:55 AM perry_j1987: magic
10:57 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
10:57 AM perry_j1987: ugh
11:15 AM * JT-Cave waits for FedEx Freight to call...
11:19 AM perry_j1987: ok multimeter on the inputs from phase a and b on this encoder
11:20 AM perry_j1987: i can see voltage changes when i spin the chuck by hand
11:20 AM perry_j1987: stepconf i set the inputs correctly to phase a and b
11:20 AM perry_j1987: but axis hal meter shows no movement
11:46 AM unterhaus_: my 3d printer will be here on the 25th, that seems exceptionally slow for ups
11:46 AM unterhaus_: took them 2 days to pack it though
12:01 PM JT-Shop: 3 more com cables and I'm done with that PIA task
12:05 PM roycroft: ups have been slow lately
12:05 PM roycroft: there have been a lot of storms all across the country
12:06 PM roycroft: and with the in surrection, several of their distribution centers are a lot slower than usual because they have to inspect things more carefully
12:06 PM roycroft: insurrection, rather
12:06 PM roycroft: the dc sorting center for ups, usps, and fedex are all very slow right now
12:07 PM perry_j1987: well this BOB is bad
12:08 PM perry_j1987: has steady .2v on the 0-10 analog out
12:15 PM perry_j1987: shopping for another now lol
12:24 PM perry_j1987: there we go got another board enroute for sunday
12:26 PM JT-Shop: 1 more RJ11/12 to go...
12:38 PM perry_j1987: good news spindle encoder works on this other BOB
12:38 PM perry_j1987: so the Lathe is all functional
12:39 PM perry_j1987: just gotta wait for new BOB to get here with 0-10v and i should be good to go sunday
12:39 PM perry_j1987: the one i just tested with doesnt have analog 0-10v
12:46 PM Thorhian: Nice!
01:05 PM Tom_L: JT-Shop, quite a pile of junk you got there
01:17 PM perry_j1987: so i got some other stuff i can work on today i guess
01:18 PM perry_j1987: i'll need a riser block for my quick change tool post
01:24 PM Tom_L: my god i'm getting tired of this wind
01:25 PM Tom_L: been blowing 50mph gusts for the last 3 days
01:46 PM JT-Shop: just got more...
01:47 PM JT-Shop: gotta love Automation Direct me one of my enclosures came damaged, AD do I need to overnight the replacement?
01:49 PM perry_j1987: need to go to hardware store for some bolts for this
01:54 PM JT-Shop: snowing at moment
02:12 PM unterhaus_: it's typical of autodesk that their help on how to update is totally wrong
02:24 PM unterhaus_: I'm supposed to update fusion but it seems to work just fine
02:26 PM unterhaus_: is it likely that an autocad that runs on XP will not run on win 10?
02:26 PM unterhaus_: I guess there were 16 bit versions that won't run on 64 bit win 10
02:35 PM unterhaus_: I have always been happy with Automation direct. On of my bosses met the owner at a conference, IMTS maybe. The guy sent him a pallet full of returns, most of them totally functional
02:35 PM unterhaus_: Still have a pile of push to connect fittings from that
02:37 PM jdh: We have (had) one AD PLC. The ethernet interface was always flakey.
02:38 PM unterhaus_: I have always wanted to try one of their PLCs, but could never figure out why
02:47 PM jdh]: click's are almost free. buy one
02:59 PM roycroft: automation direct have received many orders from me over the years
03:00 PM unterhaus_: roycroft, don't you use autocad?
03:02 PM unterhaus_: buying a click to sequence the startup of my servo amps is an idea. i was going to use an arduino
03:04 PM roycroft: yes, i use autocad
03:06 PM JT-Shop: is it quitting time yet? I have to punch 72 22mm holes...
03:07 PM roycroft: were that it was quitting time
03:07 PM roycroft: it's been an insane day here
03:08 PM roycroft: every five minutes my boss sends me an email wanting me to work on some new task that is not at all time critical
03:08 PM JT-Shop: that's productive
03:08 PM roycroft: and every other five minutes he sends me an email asking the status of the critical tasks
03:08 PM JT-Shop: working on 9 target retrieval systems
03:09 PM roycroft: i'm trying to just ignore his emails and work on what is iportant
03:09 PM roycroft: important
03:09 PM roycroft: other than stroking his ego, which is all that is important to him
03:10 PM roycroft: think of a tall, grey-haired man with a long, dishevled beard who closely resembles a cheeto with a blonde wig
03:11 PM perry_j1987: so these BOBs use lm317 for the 0-10v
03:11 PM roycroft: i'm working on my new bandsaw stand in the shop, and favricating things out of mdf is not at all my idea of a good time, but i can't wait until it's 3:00 and i can head out to the shop
03:11 PM perry_j1987: any ideas what'd be causing a 0.2v on the 0-10v line when its suppose to be off
03:13 PM jdh]: floating ground?
03:13 PM perry_j1987: things should be pretty darn good grounded in here
03:14 PM Thorhian: Indeed.\
03:14 PM perry_j1987: i do have a new diff BOB inroute
03:14 PM perry_j1987: but curiosity drives me crazy lol
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: perry_j1987: skunkwroks has a video (or at least pcis) of the PWM from that BOB for the spindle
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: skunkworks even
03:17 PM CaptHindsight: I forget how it converts the PWM to analog 1-10V on that BOB
03:17 PM perry_j1987: uses a lm317
03:17 PM perry_j1987: rest of the stuff around it is too small for me to read
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/10-advanced-configuration/31885-pwm-configuration
03:20 PM CaptHindsight: "readings from 0.22 V up to 9.84 V"
03:20 PM CaptHindsight: same as you
03:22 PM perry_j1987: ya that sounds familiar
03:22 PM perry_j1987: just skimmed through that link
03:25 PM perry_j1987: didnt see any fix listed for the 0.22v though
03:27 PM CaptHindsight: use better 5V supply, use rs485 instead of 0-10V .....
03:30 PM perry_j1987: its dead on 5v supply
03:31 PM unterhaus_: how do you use a 317 as a pwm converter, it's an adjustable power regulator
03:31 PM perry_j1987: ya i could try rs485 but i've traditionally had zero luck with it
03:31 PM unterhaus_: zero is out of range
03:31 PM unterhaus_: unless they biased it somehow
03:31 PM CaptHindsight: I've never used the PWM on that BOB
03:32 PM CaptHindsight: can the VFD be configured for 0.22V as 0 rpm?
03:33 PM JT-Shop: 72 22mm holes punched
03:33 PM unterhaus_: they probably got the circuit from the bad ideas section of horowitz and hill
03:33 PM JT-Shop: 25 minutes to punch 72 holes is not bad :)
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: I think skunkworks showed how non linear the PWM is on that BOB
03:34 PM perry_j1987: i got a new BOB the same one ive been using on my 6040 enroute sunday
03:35 PM CaptHindsight: your current BOB is very popular
03:35 PM CaptHindsight: so there must be a fix
03:37 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NF8EFoPlrk Remotely controlling the Huanyang VFD with LinuxCNC over RS485 Modbus
03:38 PM roycroft: usually it takes four days to play 72 holes
03:43 PM buzzmarshall: if the lm317 is not going all the way down to 0 then its not seeing enough - vcc into the adj pin for some reason, the 317 is a differential device and needs neg vcc on the adj pin to fully clamp down
03:43 PM buzzmarshall: depending on the circuit design theres different ways of doing it
03:43 PM buzzmarshall: without looking at anything tho i know thats how the 317's work
03:45 PM CaptHindsight: ignoring that the BOB's 0-10V is not linear, the 0-10V looks like it is actually about 0.2V - 9.8V
03:48 PM CaptHindsight: can the VFD be adjusted to match the 0.2-9.8V?
03:48 PM perry_j1987: https://www.precision-elec.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/lenze-ac-tech-scf-instruction-manual.pdf
03:48 PM perry_j1987: i havnt gotten to that part in the datasheet yet
03:48 PM perry_j1987: but that is an interesting option
03:48 PM CaptHindsight: or do you have to make the 0-10V actually 0-10V?
03:48 PM perry_j1987: oh the other issue on this BOB that made me get new one
03:49 PM perry_j1987: the spindle encoder wasnt registering at all
03:49 PM perry_j1987: i just plugged the encoder into this other BOB i got and it works as it should
03:49 PM perry_j1987: so i figured with inputs bad and 0-10 not working i'd return it
03:54 PM CaptHindsight: might be the schematic for the BOB https://www.electronics-lab.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Parallel-Port-Breakout-CNC-SCH.png
03:55 PM CaptHindsight: doesn't show the spindle relay or how PWM gets converted
03:57 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.ijohnsen.com/blog/linuxcnc-mach3-breakout-board/
03:58 PM CaptHindsight: i think archivist RE'd that BOB
04:02 PM perry_j1987: i'd recommend to everyone stay in the 20 dollar range and steer clear of the 10-ish dollar boards heh
04:03 PM CaptHindsight: works ok for Step and Dir
04:03 PM CaptHindsight: and general IO
04:04 PM CaptHindsight: been using it to control the airbrush
04:04 PM perry_j1987: the inputs dont work except for the top two on mine
04:04 PM CaptHindsight: QC issues
04:04 PM CaptHindsight: might be why 0.2-9.8V as well
04:41 PM perry_j1987: there we go finnished making the riser block for the quick change tool post
04:41 PM perry_j1987: looks good
05:13 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hj1lEnKOe-k
05:13 PM CaptHindsight: LinuxCNC PWM Spindle - Tweaking Speed
05:35 PM perry_j1987: ahh back home now
05:35 PM perry_j1987: in recliner
05:40 PM JT-Cave: long day here doing assembly line work all day
05:49 PM CaptHindsight: I thought that there would be more interest in the LinuxCNC on the Orange Pi's
05:50 PM CaptHindsight: it can do everything that they wanted with machinekit on the BBB
05:51 PM CaptHindsight: it just needs the ARISC stepgen sorted out and a clean u-boot branch
05:53 PM CaptHindsight: not sure why they started their own website vs work with linuxcnc.org
05:53 PM CaptHindsight: https://orangecnc.gitlab.io/
05:53 PM CaptHindsight: https://gitlab.com/orangecnc
05:55 PM JT-Cave: from the first link it looks like they are trying to sell something with all the fancy crap
05:57 PM CaptHindsight: they got pretty close to getting it all working, it just misses some steps since it doesn't keep the best track of position and time
05:58 PM JT-Cave: using LinuxCNC?
05:58 PM CaptHindsight: yes
05:58 PM JT-Cave: is it a latency issue with the fruit?
05:59 PM CaptHindsight: they didn't implement all the rule checking that is found in the other stepgens
05:59 PM JT-Cave: ah
05:59 PM CaptHindsight: no latency is not the issue, it has an integrated microcontroller
05:59 PM JT-Cave: they rolled their own stepgen?
06:00 PM CaptHindsight: yes
06:00 PM JT-Cave: why would they do that if they are using LinuxCNC?
06:00 PM CaptHindsight: Tom was working on sorting it out using the earlier working stepgen code
06:00 PM CaptHindsight: it does not use an FPGA for stepping or the ARM cores
06:01 PM CaptHindsight: steps are generated in an internal microcontroller up to near 500KHz
06:01 PM CaptHindsight: it is just the way the ARISC (microcontroller) driver works that causes the missed steps
06:02 PM JT-Cave: not good
06:02 PM JT-Cave: https://gnipsel.com/images/customers/BobG/
06:02 PM JT-Cave: more work on the target retrieval system
06:03 PM CaptHindsight: it's like the BBB with the 2 PRU's or tying a *duino to and ARM or x86 board over a fast bus that doesn't have much of an effect on latency
06:03 PM CaptHindsight: this is the hardware that machinekit should have used
06:04 PM JT-Cave: is machinekit still active?
06:04 PM CaptHindsight: could of had remote or local GUI @ HD res and 30fps
06:04 PM CaptHindsight: machinekit-hal is supposedly still active
06:05 PM JT-Cave: is that a fork?
06:05 PM CaptHindsight: https://github.com/machinekit/machinekit-hal
06:05 PM CaptHindsight: well if machinekit is dead and this is all machinekit plus some new stuff...
06:06 PM CaptHindsight: fork or not?
06:07 PM JT-Cave: Machinekit-HAL was created by separating the core functionality from now deprecated Machinekit repository into own repository.
06:07 PM CaptHindsight: In 2020, the original Machinekit repository was archived and development is fully continuing in the Machinekit-HAL repository.
06:07 PM JT-Cave: time to wander upstairs and check on the chicken soup...
06:07 PM JT-Cave: not any of my chickens I can assure you
06:08 PM CaptHindsight: cluck cluck cluck
07:00 PM veegee: Anyone here use FreeCAD?
07:00 PM XXCoder: i do but not expecially advanced. whats up
07:15 PM veegee: I want to invest my time learning an open source CAD because of principles
07:15 PM veegee: FreeCAD looks decent, but the layout is wonky on my 4k display on Windows
07:15 PM veegee: Going to try it on Mac OS
07:18 PM roycroft: i'm sick of freecad
07:18 PM veegee: roycroft why's that?
07:18 PM veegee: And what would you recommend?
07:18 PM roycroft: it was a royal pain in the butt to get it installed and wokring on my linux laptop
07:19 PM veegee: ok so not a real problem LOL
07:19 PM roycroft: i finally got it going, and then i went to use it last night and all the workbenches were gone
07:19 PM roycroft: if you're going to try it on macos, don't even install 0.18
07:19 PM veegee: Sounds like an OS level issue more than anything
07:19 PM roycroft: get the latest 0.19 dmg
07:19 PM roycroft: 0.18 is completely broken on mac os
07:20 PM roycroft: what i don't get is that it's developed on linux
07:20 PM roycroft: but i've had more trouble running it on linux than on mac os
07:20 PM roycroft: you might try openscad
07:21 PM roycroft: it's open source and it's really fast to build models with t once you get used to it
07:21 PM roycroft: but it's not click and drool
07:21 PM roycroft: which is why it's so fast
07:29 PM buzzmarshall: i find FreeCad ok but built it myself as the ubuntu/debian prebuilds sometimes arent the greatest
07:30 PM roycroft: i had to build it myself
07:30 PM buzzmarshall: never tried on winblows as i don't use it anymore but linux seems fine but sometimes ive found the prebuilt's act up
07:30 PM buzzmarshall: k
07:30 PM roycroft: i'm running debian 10 on the laptop
07:31 PM perry_j1987: veegee give fusion360 a go and worry about real issues :)
07:31 PM roycroft: the prebuilt versions i tried on the laptop were missing some critical workenches, and the mechanism to install third-party workbenches
07:31 PM buzzmarshall: ive not tried on a laptop but have it on about 6 ubuntu or debian pcs
07:31 PM roycroft: laptop vs. desktop should not matter
07:31 PM buzzmarshall: well not always
07:32 PM roycroft: it doesn't really matter at this piont
07:32 PM veegee: perry_j1987 I have fusion360
07:32 PM buzzmarshall: ive had cad software especially pcb cad stuff that was nothing but greif on laptops that worked fine on pc
07:32 PM roycroft: i should have a new macbook pro by the middle of next week
07:32 PM veegee: I don't want all my stuff uploaded to the "cloud"
07:32 PM veegee: and wait 10 minutes to export a step file
07:32 PM roycroft: i've hd this linux laptop for a couple months now, and have spent tens of hours configuring it
07:32 PM buzzmarshall: i quess it comes down to the particular laptop tho
07:32 PM roycroft: and it's about 70% usable
07:32 PM veegee: also Fusion360 looks like trash on 4k displays
07:32 PM perry_j1987: never takes me that long to get step files downloadeD?
07:32 PM veegee: It doesn't support display scaling which is pathetic in 2021
07:32 PM roycroft: the last 30% is going to be really difficult, though
07:33 PM veegee: perry_j1987 it takes their shitty cloud a long time to convert it
07:33 PM veegee: it should be a sub-millisecond operation locally
07:33 PM buzzmarshall: fusions downside is its online
07:33 PM veegee: yes
07:33 PM CaptHindsight: I'm fascinated by everyone trade-offs in open source and even between open and closed
07:33 PM roycroft: latency is not an issue if you're working disconnected from the internet
07:33 PM veegee: Then you can't export certain formats, roycroft
07:33 PM roycroft: right
07:33 PM veegee: I'm a huge fan of open source
07:34 PM roycroft: fusion 360 is crippleware to the point of being uselessware
07:34 PM buzzmarshall: not that its bad but i refuse to use apps i gotta log into on line to use
07:34 PM perry_j1987: open source for the sake of open source though?...
07:34 PM CaptHindsight: even between using the Rpi's vs OrangePi's with LinuxCNC
07:34 PM veegee: Because it's working for the realm, not for greedy 3rd party companies
07:34 PM roycroft: i'm a huge fan of the tools that work the best to get the job done
07:34 PM veegee: perry_j1987 almost, yeah, unless it's total trash. But FreeCAD is far from trash
07:34 PM veegee: roycroft yeah I agree with that, unless they're insanely expensive
07:34 PM roycroft: and the choices seem to be these:
07:34 PM veegee: $2,000/year for autocad? no thanks
07:34 PM veegee: I can pirate it, but just on principle, I don't
07:35 PM roycroft: well-designed software that requires one to sell one's soul to use
07:35 PM buzzmarshall: hack and try... lord no's theres tons of hacked cad crap for all platforms
07:35 PM buzzmarshall: lol specially autodesk stuff
07:35 PM veegee: and especially when autodesk doesn't care about high resolution displays
07:35 PM roycroft: well-intentioned software that causes a much frustration
07:36 PM roycroft: to be on topic for once, linuxcnc is that rare gem that is open source and actually works really well
07:36 PM roycroft: freecad seriously, seriously pisses me off
07:36 PM buzzmarshall: i would agree with you sofar
07:36 PM roycroft: because it's so close to working well
07:36 PM buzzmarshall: regarding the linuxcnc
07:36 PM roycroft: but so far from working well at the same time
07:37 PM veegee: roycroft it is, but it's not rare. Ubuntu is full of open source software that works very well
07:37 PM roycroft: it's like "come on, folks, you've been doing this for two edecades now, and it's been 90% of the way there for years"
07:37 PM buzzmarshall: i found i had the best luck with freecad and blender if i put it on machines that i don't do alot of other things on
07:37 PM buzzmarshall: specially if your dev stuff and playing with libs and code
07:37 PM roycroft: i spin up virtual machines when i do dev stuff
07:38 PM buzzmarshall: that used to be my biggest source of my installed freecad/blender issues
07:38 PM buzzmarshall: k... ya i never use virtual
07:38 PM roycroft: i can build a virtual machine from scratch in 20 minutes
07:38 PM buzzmarshall: ive got piles of boxes so i just use real systems all the time
07:38 PM roycroft: i do it all the time
07:39 PM roycroft: and even my production machines, on the server side, are all vms
07:39 PM veegee: Yeah VMs are the way to go
07:39 PM roycroft: because it's just so easy to take a snapshot of the vm right before doing something scary
07:39 PM roycroft: and roll back if you blow it up
07:39 PM roycroft: i never bothered with docker
07:39 PM roycroft: because vms are so fast and easy to spin up
07:40 PM veegee: I have two EPYC Rome 7542, total of 64 cores
07:40 PM veegee: 2 TB of RAM
07:41 PM veegee: love that 225W TDP x 2, very high all core sustained boost
07:41 PM perry_j1987: but does it run crysis lol
07:41 PM veegee: It'll run 64 instances of Crysis in VMs
07:42 PM veegee: Custom water cooling in a 2U rack mount chassis, super quiet
07:42 PM veegee: lets you use it as a workstation
07:42 PM veegee: The PCIe 4.0 throughput is insane
07:43 PM veegee: I have it hooked up to my other servers via multiple infiniband FDR
07:43 PM veegee: I want to upgrade to EDR, but the equipment is still too expensive compared to FDR
07:44 PM perry_j1987: 640k ram is all anybody ever needs on a computer
07:44 PM veegee: Running iSCSI over that as well to 48 x 8TB hard drives
07:44 PM veegee: and direct attached to 8 x 4TB U.2 high endurance enterprise NVMe drives
07:46 PM veegee: perry_j1987 I don't think anyone ever actually said that
07:46 PM veegee: It's one of those pop culture things
07:47 PM perry_j1987: doesnt mean you didnt get the reference lol
07:47 PM roycroft: i'm not sure that any one individual said those exact words that succinctly
07:48 PM roycroft: but obviously that was the mindset when the ibm pc and ms-dos were developed
07:48 PM veegee: yeah
07:48 PM roycroft: but that was back in the days when personal computers typically had 4k or 8k of ram
07:49 PM roycroft: 64k was a big memory upgrade
07:49 PM roycroft: speaking of ms-dos
07:49 PM roycroft: bill gates now owns more farmland than any other person
07:50 PM roycroft: he and melinda own a quarter million square miles of farmland, scattered across the us
07:53 PM buzzmarshall: CaptHindsight: i find the bbb actually works well with linuxcnc as next to a fpga for pulse/clk gen the pru's work great
07:53 PM buzzmarshall: but i found to make it work this well meant getting off the normally available images
07:54 PM buzzmarshall: specially when it comes to things like the usb subsystem
07:54 PM buzzmarshall: seems like all the kernels floating around have the usb locked to pio mode
07:55 PM buzzmarshall: why i am not sure tho
07:55 PM buzzmarshall: the orange pi tho does look interesting just could never find a h3 locally to pickup and checkout
07:57 PM roycroft: i finally got some more hour meters today
07:57 PM CaptHindsight: buzzmarshall: the OrangePi can do everything that the BBB did AND also support a 60fps GUI at HD res
07:58 PM roycroft: just in time, as i'm in the midst of building the new stand for my band saw, and will be doing a motor upgrade to it
07:58 PM CaptHindsight: I'm not sure why it is not the focus of LCNC with fast stepping without an FPGA
08:00 PM CaptHindsight: and why the majority still lean towards the Rpi from Broadcom
08:00 PM CaptHindsight: and needs an FPGA
08:01 PM CaptHindsight: Rpi, Broadcom, closed firmware and needs FPGA = good
08:01 PM buzzmarshall: cant say for the orange but i think the bbb's is more of pricepoint thing and only 512 don't help as the competition has more
08:01 PM buzzmarshall: rasperries are ok but for this most of there benifits are kinda moot
08:01 PM buzzmarshall: crippled gpu's basically as they all propriatary
08:01 PM CaptHindsight: OrangePi uses open source firmware, needs no FPGA but is from China is bad
08:02 PM perry_j1987: lots of boards out there
08:02 PM CaptHindsight: OrangePi uses Mali so not a crippled GPU
08:02 PM buzzmarshall: ive looked at them and if i would have found one local i'd buy it as sofar the allwinners are about the only soc ive not messed with
08:03 PM perry_j1987: https://pine64.com/product/pine-a64-1gb-board/?v=0446c16e2e66
08:03 PM buzzmarshall: mali's getting better with the lima and panfrost stuff but theres still issues
08:03 PM perry_j1987: 20 bucks
08:03 PM CaptHindsight: OrangePi have up to 2GB RAM
08:03 PM buzzmarshall: specially with efficiency's
08:03 PM buzzmarshall: ya the rams nice for sure
08:04 PM buzzmarshall: same as cost is good
08:04 PM perry_j1987: https://pine64.com/product/rock64-4gb-single-board-computer/?v=0446c16e2e66
08:04 PM buzzmarshall: ya ive had the pine boards since they came out
08:04 PM CaptHindsight: rock64 also has an integrated microcontroller but no work has been started on a driver that works with LCNC
08:04 PM buzzmarshall: there not bad but unless you want to spend alot of time deving good gpio control its a pain
08:05 PM buzzmarshall: it will run lncnc as as the N2's but take alot of work
08:05 PM buzzmarshall: ones rk and the other is aml
08:06 PM CaptHindsight: OrangePi Allwinner just needs the proper implementation of the stepgens
08:06 PM buzzmarshall: there really meant for the media box market and most of the development is in that direction
08:06 PM buzzmarshall: fpga's are cheap and maybe in its case it should go down that road
08:07 PM perry_j1987: then there's all the nanopi boards
08:07 PM buzzmarshall: i was heading that way till i came across ti's pru's
08:07 PM CaptHindsight: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/18-computer/39037-linuxcnc-orange-pi?start=80#193356
08:08 PM CaptHindsight: buzzmarshall: but TI won't release GPU driver source, so no real time GUI
08:08 PM buzzmarshall: the other thing thats kinda a downer in the bbb's is all the crap trying to turn it into a ardunio
08:09 PM CaptHindsight: orangePi just needs the driver fix
08:09 PM buzzmarshall: sometime if i ever get one i will definately take alook at it
08:10 PM roycroft: it's not the only orange thing that needs a fix
08:10 PM CaptHindsight: i get the attraction to the PRU's but what good are they if you don't have a GUI?
08:10 PM buzzmarshall: i just don't now how hard it is to hack my way around in the allwinners
08:10 PM buzzmarshall: step gen
08:11 PM buzzmarshall: just write in assembly and have one of the pru's run it
08:11 PM CaptHindsight: I know that machinekit was going to work on remote GUI's, but never finished it
08:11 PM buzzmarshall: thats why i looked at them
08:11 PM CaptHindsight: 7-8 years later
08:11 PM buzzmarshall: ya i looked at mk but its to mainstream for what i wanted to do
08:12 PM CaptHindsight: now it's machinekit-hal
08:12 PM buzzmarshall: and being it was just a fork from here
08:12 PM buzzmarshall: i forked this and then kinda went my own way
08:13 PM buzzmarshall: most of the issues ive found sofar are moreso from the general firmware builds available for the bbb
08:13 PM CaptHindsight: on the other hand..... why bother with RTAI or any low cost CNC controllers?
08:13 PM buzzmarshall: there done that way for a reason i guess
08:13 PM CaptHindsight: you get no support and mostly freeloaders
08:13 PM buzzmarshall: ive approached the realtime from a different direction then the current patches
08:14 PM buzzmarshall: but i can only use my code on a arm via u-boot
08:14 PM CaptHindsight: RTAI is for the cheapskates that only want steppers off a LPT port
08:14 PM buzzmarshall: won't work on a normal pc
08:15 PM CaptHindsight: u-boot on the OrangePi vs closed crap on the Rpi's
08:16 PM CaptHindsight: looks like low cost wins over open source yet again
08:16 PM buzzmarshall: well if i had a board id bet i can get it
08:16 PM buzzmarshall: lol
08:16 PM buzzmarshall: no ones stumped me yet in the aml/rk market
08:16 PM CaptHindsight: people don't seem to mind BLOB's if the boards are low cost enough
08:20 PM buzzmarshall: i am not a big fan of broadcom but for some that have been around long enough theres enough info floatin around that still actually helps
08:20 PM buzzmarshall: like most big companies they build ontop of old even going forward to reduce r&d and money always invested
08:22 PM buzzmarshall: broadom chipsets and mcu's been around for along time when certian materials were easier to find
08:23 PM buzzmarshall: personally i was really hoping when the rpi4 came out they would move to another maker
08:25 PM buzzmarshall: i had someone that was gonna send me a orange but then this covid thing got worse and ive not seen put his server back up for awhile
08:30 PM CaptHindsight: I bet you can get funded to make a closed cloud based CNC mill for hobby and small business
08:30 PM XXCoder: isnt orange pi better for lcnc or what
08:31 PM CaptHindsight: https://glowforge.com/ like this laser cutter
08:31 PM CaptHindsight: cutter/engraver
08:32 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: the OrangePi needs a driver fix so that the stepgens don't lose steps
08:32 PM XXCoder: ohh bad
08:33 PM CaptHindsight: for some reason rather than follow a working example they did it their own way
08:35 PM XXCoder: not invented here syndome
08:35 PM CaptHindsight: maybe
08:36 PM CaptHindsight: when I bring up LCNC to people at Makerspaces they bring up Machinekit
08:37 PM CaptHindsight: like LCNC is obsolete and Machinekit is the way forward
08:37 PM CaptHindsight: they also don't seem to like having FPGA involved
08:38 PM CaptHindsight: I don't understand their preferences other than low cost always seems to be the most attractive solution
08:38 PM XXCoder: reprap model I guess
08:40 PM CaptHindsight: low cost is better than open source
08:40 PM perry_j1987: i havnt heard of machinekit what is it?
08:40 PM roycroft: i've never heard of machinekit
08:41 PM roycroft: i just did a search on it and tried to connect to the website
08:41 PM roycroft: and got disconnected immediately
08:41 PM roycroft: so my first impression is not the best
08:41 PM perry_j1987: is it a fork of linuxcnc?
08:42 PM CaptHindsight: yes, it's machineket-hal now and only on https://github.com/machinekit/machinekit-hal
08:42 PM CaptHindsight: perry_j1987: "In 2014, Machinekit was forked from LinuxCNC to facilitate deeper changes in low level functionality. In 2020, the original Machinekit repository was archived and development is fully continuing in the Machinekit-HAL repository."
08:43 PM perry_j1987: theres machinekit-hal and machinekit-cnc
08:44 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: http://www.machinekit.io/
08:49 PM CaptHindsight: ha ha https://github.com/machinekit/Machineface
08:50 PM XXCoder: no flipping e-stop
08:50 PM XXCoder: repraps.
08:51 PM XXCoder: its also very washed out. yeah you want confusing colors on your cnc machine interface
08:52 PM roycroft: machinekit.io is the website that dumped me the instant i connected
08:52 PM unterhaus: so really machinekit is in two parts now
08:52 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: https://imgur.com/oCiFCe7 :)
08:53 PM XXCoder: that is more useful
08:54 PM perry_j1987: looks like pronterface embedded in axis lol
08:54 PM XXCoder: yeah looks exactly same
08:54 PM CaptHindsight: perry_j1987: yeah that is the joke
08:54 PM perry_j1987: i havnt seen a "nice" looking interface yet to date
08:55 PM CaptHindsight: perry_j1987: https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=Y4OaXS05ZMQ
08:56 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.qtpyvcp.com/showcase/mill_vcps.html
08:56 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.qtpyvcp.com/showcase/lathe_vcps.html
08:57 PM perry_j1987: now why isnt that the default instead of axis lol
08:59 PM CaptHindsight: well it was a lot of work for Andy just to get 2.8 out with all the fixes
09:00 PM perry_j1987: how big is the team behind linuxcnc?
09:00 PM CaptHindsight: Python worked its way into LCNC
09:01 PM CaptHindsight: and Python actually lets its older versions become obsolete
09:02 PM CaptHindsight: so that took some work to get older Python code updated or newer libs back ported
09:03 PM CaptHindsight: perry_j1987: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/graphs/contributors
09:05 PM perry_j1987: i mean shot callers vs contributors
09:05 PM perry_j1987: sry
09:06 PM CaptHindsight: Andy pushed out 2.8 mostly by himself
09:06 PM XXCoder: yeah team we need more people
09:06 PM XXCoder: problem is its not "sexy" enough
09:06 PM CaptHindsight: there is usually one that takes the lead with being the release manager
09:06 PM CaptHindsight: but he had a long list of helpers
09:07 PM CaptHindsight: perry_j1987: #linuxcnc-devel if you want to take a peek
09:07 PM perry_j1987: ya i'll lurk a bit
09:08 PM CaptHindsight: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~tom-itx/irc/logs/%23linuxcnc-devel/
09:09 PM CaptHindsight: perry_j1987: the main bits of LCNC were written 10+ years ago going back to the 90's
09:09 PM CaptHindsight: since then it's been adding more features and fixes
09:10 PM CaptHindsight: some are their own projects https://www.qtpyvcp.com/
09:10 PM perry_j1987: ya i was going to ask more about that im real interested
09:11 PM CaptHindsight: those devs are not even on IRC currently, the bridge from the matrix and discord broke
09:11 PM perry_j1987: https://www.qtpyvcp.com/showcase/lathe_vcps.html this says included by default?
09:12 PM CaptHindsight: bbl
09:23 PM perry_j1987: wb
09:24 PM perry_j1987: found one of those plastic pieces in the servo shaft couplers missing two teeth
09:24 PM perry_j1987: so cadded them up and going to 3d print some new ones in PLA and PETG to test
09:24 PM perry_j1987: could do ABS as well
09:24 PM perry_j1987: actually going to look up wich one does best with coolant or oils
09:29 PM roycroft: nylon would probably be best
09:31 PM perry_j1987: i need to get a spool of that still
09:32 PM roycroft: atomic filament just got 500g spools back in stock
09:35 PM perry_j1987: of the 3 i have which one do you think will fair the best
09:38 PM perry_j1987: pLA smells way too good
09:38 PM perry_j1987: i probably shouldnt be sniffing it so much when i check on the print
09:45 PM infoproxy is now known as infornography
09:49 PM roycroft: i've not printed with abs
09:50 PM roycroft: petg would probably do better than pla for that particular application
09:50 PM roycroft: if the part is small, print one with each filament and test
09:50 PM perry_j1987: aye i may
09:50 PM perry_j1987: first one in PLA finnished
09:50 PM perry_j1987: looks and feels good
09:50 PM perry_j1987: 100% infill
09:52 PM perry_j1987: i'll go test it out before printing more make sure on the fit
09:56 PM perry_j1987: ok i gotta figure out these g320x drivers
09:56 PM perry_j1987: the instructions are not clear on which orientation your suppose to look at it when "turn the pots to 11 oclock position"
10:12 PM CaptHindsight: <perry_j1987> https://www.qtpyvcp.com/showcase/lathe_vcps.html this says included by default?
10:13 PM CaptHindsight: included when you install qtpyvcp development version
10:13 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.qtpyvcp.com/install/index.html
10:14 PM perry_j1987: would be nice to have a shiny new interface with this new lathe!
10:16 PM CaptHindsight: Jul 28, 2017 LinuxCNC 2.7
10:16 PM CaptHindsight: Sep 8, 2020 — LinuxCNC 2.8. 0 released
10:17 PM CaptHindsight: maybe in 2.9, there was a big gap in time between 2.7 and 2.8
10:17 PM CaptHindsight: Sep 6, 2015 LinuxCNC 2.7. 0 Released! Feb 21, 2015 LinuxCNC 2.6.
10:19 PM CaptHindsight: http://linuxcnc.org/news/
10:20 PM perry_j1987: i just remembered about mpg handwheels, i want to incorporate some in this lathe so i can do some manual ops too
10:36 PM Tom_itx: machinekit was a fork of linuxcnc that came about after the wichita fest several years back
10:38 PM Tom_itx: 2009?
10:44 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
11:03 PM JavaBean: that is a little longer than the generally accepted "several years back"
11:05 PM perry_j1987: these mpg handwheels just use A,B or does linuxcnc need the -A -B as well
11:28 PM perry_j1987: what has my life become...
11:28 PM perry_j1987: doritos and cranbery and vodka
11:28 PM perry_j1987: im not mad though lol
11:28 PM perry_j1987: its tasty
11:35 PM roycroft: i made a delicious anchovy pizza for dinner tonight
11:36 PM * JavaBean shudders
11:36 PM JavaBean: dangnabbit roy, i respected you
11:38 PM roycroft: and anchovies change the equation?
11:44 PM JavaBean: of course
11:44 PM perry_j1987: you know i've never had anchovies on a pizza
11:44 PM perry_j1987: use to work at a pizza hut as a kid and made plenty of em heh
11:44 PM perry_j1987: it was always a "joke" order heh
11:47 PM JavaBean: found out at potlucks as a kid that anchovies ruin food... took years to figure out why this one family's food at the potluck tasted so horribly, they were adding anchovies/anchovy-paste to their foods