#linuxcnc Logs

Nov 13 2020

01:29 AM Deejay: moin
05:03 AM JT-Cave: morning
05:04 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
05:05 AM alex_joni: morning JT
05:05 AM JT-Cave: morning Alex
05:06 AM JT-Cave: how's it going over there?
05:06 AM alex_joni: a bit slow today, but overall ok
05:06 AM alex_joni: at your end?
05:06 AM JT-Cave: not bad, can't wait to finish up a couple of jobs I'm working on and relax the rest of the year
05:08 AM JT-Cave: working on a sunrise/sunset led for the chickens
05:12 AM alex_joni: sounds good
05:58 AM Tom_L: morning
05:58 AM Tom_L: 25F hi 53
06:09 AM JT-Cave: I still have not burned a stick of wood in either shop or the garage
06:10 AM XXCoder: tom thats cool ;)
06:10 AM XXCoder: week is 47 to 50f, rain all days
06:11 AM JT-Cave: slight chance of rain saturday rest of the week clear
06:11 AM Tom_L: JT-Cave, that large log your cut up, did that come off your property?
06:11 AM Tom_L: decent size trees..
06:13 AM JT-Cave: no, it came from a buddies house in Fisk
06:14 AM JT-Cave: he has a lot more the same size around his house
06:25 AM Centurion-Dan2 is now known as Centurion_Dan
07:25 AM jymmmm: Morning
07:27 AM jymmmm: Tom_L: Oh joy
08:22 AM jymmmm: Huh, wood ash and a little water to clean the glass on the wood stove. Seemed to work well actually
08:27 AM tiwake: right, because ashes have lye in them
08:27 AM tiwake: thats how people early on extracted lye... dripping water through it
08:28 AM tiwake: to make soap with
08:35 AM jymmmm: In this case, I think the ash was just acting like a mild abrasive. Also can fill small potholes in your drive and dries as hard as concrete. So said the video I watched.
08:51 AM FinboySlick: jymmmm: I also read that it works best with hardwood ash.
08:51 AM FinboySlick: (as far as producing lye)
08:56 AM enleth: jymmmm: the inner pane in oven doors is often easy to remove and fits in a dishwsher, which can help soften up the burnt-in stains before manual scrubbing
08:58 AM jymmmm: FinboySlick: I'm burning almond, so we're good there.
08:58 AM jymmmm: enleth: No way am I gonna remove the glass if I don't have to, Don't want to deal with any gasket drama
09:00 AM enleth: not sure if that's the case where you live, but all ovens I've ever cleaned had the gasket for the inner pane on the body - the pane would be relatively loosely clipped into the door
09:03 AM jymmmm: enleth: It might be perfectly fine to R&R, but I'm just not willing to risk it during the winter time.
09:04 AM jymmmm: enleth: But I appreciate the feedback =)
09:12 AM classsic: Hi, is here the right place to ask about GRBL?
09:44 AM cradek: classsic: sorry no, this channel is about linuxcnc
09:52 AM roycroft: and chickens
10:00 AM enleth: in short, it's a channel about LinuxCNC *and* things that are definitely *not* LinuxCNC
10:03 AM classsic: ok, great
10:50 AM Tom_L: you can ask but you might not get the answer you're looking for
10:50 AM Tom_L: #reprap would be better suited if you can put up with them
11:00 AM Tom_L: actually GRBL would be more on topic than what has been discussed here lately
11:03 AM buzzmarshall: as a general question i am wondering what the proper way to go about starting a new distro strictly aimed at arm devices running a version of linuxcnc would be?
11:03 AM buzzmarshall: would it be best to start it under a new name or keep the existing name?
11:04 AM buzzmarshall: i have no interest in anything other then using it on a variety of arm based boards
11:04 AM buzzmarshall: so i could keep it under the current linuxcnc project just as a fork or start a new distro
11:05 AM buzzmarshall: i want to make sure i do it right without stepping on anyones toes
11:05 AM buzzmarshall: any thoughts would be appreciated
11:05 AM buzzmarshall: as well i have NO interest in the MachineKit project
11:07 AM buzzmarshall: rather then a full linux distro setup to run linuxcnc amongst other things what i want to do is tailor the linux specifically for a working linuxcnc and whatever else support software it needs that way linux can be tailored to the cnc needs without all the other stuff
11:07 AM buzzmarshall: kinda in a similar manner as some of the jeos setups you see for things like OE or LE
11:09 AM Eric__: the distros are usually considered a side project.
11:10 AM Eric__: Andy may feel differently about it
11:17 AM Rab: buzzmarshall, what's your difference with Machinekit? (No opinion either way, just curious.)
11:23 AM pcw_home: Why would you not just contribute to LinuxCNC (to avoid becoming another MachineKit which seems to be pretty much dead...)
11:25 AM buzzmarshall: basically i am more interested in seeing narrower developement
11:25 AM buzzmarshall: mk is more about a wider variety of devices
11:25 AM buzzmarshall: which means to much clutter overall
11:25 AM buzzmarshall: linuxcnc is more pc oriented
11:25 AM buzzmarshall: nothing against any of them
11:26 AM buzzmarshall: just i am strictly interested in a few arm devices that i already have custom machines built around other setups that i am now consolodateing
11:26 AM gloops: im PC orientated
11:26 AM pcw_home: What in linuxCNC is PC oriented (it does run an various ARM platforms)
11:27 AM buzzmarshall: linux rt stuff is a pain and using the existin patches one needs to keep in mind they are written to maintain overall linux specs as its for every device out there
11:27 AM pcw_home: what RT system will you use?
11:28 AM FinboySlick: buzzmarshall: Have you looked at 'buildroot'? https://buildroot.org/
11:28 AM buzzmarshall: its easier to use a custom linux kernel specifically tailored for the devices which is what i have always done for years
11:28 AM buzzmarshall: ya ive used br and yocto but for me its just easier to create my own linux distro as i have done for years
11:29 AM buzzmarshall: nothing against any of those developments just they are basically setup to comply to a wide variety of devices
11:29 AM FinboySlick: buzzmarshall: I wouldn't know then. Buildroot is the approach I would take as a basis for board-specific distro.
11:30 AM buzzmarshall: i realize i am moving away from conventional thinking goin in a more proprieatary direction but its just easier as its hard to teach a old dog new tricks
11:31 AM buzzmarshall: buildroot and yocto are nice but by the time i create all the modules and learn all the ins and outs i can do it quicker otherways
11:31 AM buzzmarshall: if i was about 15 years younger and starting out again i would definately go that way
11:31 AM buzzmarshall: hell i still struggle with git as it was never around when i started on linux
11:31 AM buzzmarshall: lol
11:31 AM FinboySlick: buzzmarshall: I'm not sure it's quicker in the long term.
11:32 AM FinboySlick: Which, I assume is the end goal if you're planning to maintain your own distro.
11:33 AM buzzmarshall: for the devices i want to maintain its not that bad as its a narrow build that probably doesn't change all that much once done
11:34 AM buzzmarshall: and not having to worry about maintaining a full linux distro makes things much easier
11:35 AM buzzmarshall: i get linuxcnc on a pc as theres a ton of other things that can be done on the same system
11:35 AM buzzmarshall: but most of the smaller arm boards don't need a lot of that support
11:35 AM buzzmarshall: years ago it was the same with audio support and rt as people started trying to get better latency
11:35 AM FinboySlick: Sure. Just sharking my perspective. I wouldn't undertake an entire distro myself if all I'm really doing more than another suitable distro is maintain a couple kernel patches and a central bit of software (LinuxCNC), I'd definitely want to outsource all the rest to another project.
11:36 AM FinboySlick: :s/sharking/sharing/ (where is my mind today?)
11:36 AM buzzmarshall: eventually it split where some followed the open source rt patches while others went a more narrower direction and got better results
11:37 AM buzzmarshall: i do understand your point tho and normally if i was looking at a bigger picture would agree
11:39 AM buzzmarshall: the project is basically aimed around a couple of us old timers that have common hardware and have always had the typical public software
11:39 AM Eric__: If you're moving away from conventional thinking then you are going to have to do your own branch
11:39 AM buzzmarshall: things like customized grbl and then depending on a remote pc running a variety of cad software
11:40 AM buzzmarshall: yes it would be my own branch
11:40 AM Eric__: but there is so much development on linuxcnc even as a mature project, that's not an approach that I consider sustainable
11:40 AM buzzmarshall: currently i have forked and butcherd the linuxcnc git
11:40 AM buzzmarshall: so thats kinda why i am asking
11:40 AM Eric__: as you can see from the previous lcnc dead branches
11:40 AM Eric__: machinekit wasn't the first, won't be the last
11:41 AM buzzmarshall: i can either keep that fork and just make it a arm branch or rename the distro to something more specific
11:41 AM buzzmarshall: the intent is not to make something private as it would still be opensource up on our github
11:41 AM buzzmarshall: just a build much more narrower and specific to some arm devices
11:42 AM buzzmarshall: being new around here i wanted to just make sure i went about it the right way
11:42 AM buzzmarshall: after playing with lncnc on a pc i like what i see
11:43 AM buzzmarshall: just like the idea of making it less reliant in my case on a remote machine as i can move most of whats needed into the machine's controller
01:46 PM JavaBean: i wonder how many here this might affect https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxmmwWwW6TY
01:57 PM pcw_home: Wow, what a huge design flaw, Master should offer replacements that actually work
02:08 PM JavaBean: Master... actually work... something doesn't compute here, lockpickinglawyer isn't the only person who has made a serious community bashing master for how they "don't actually work"
02:11 PM FinboySlick: Aren't Master locks pretty much all notoriously terrible?
02:12 PM JavaBean: american lock was a good company. and many people/places thought masterlock hadn't fsck'd them... seems to not be the case now
02:13 PM FinboySlick: Some are so bad that you can put a bit of tension on the shackle and rap the side with a stick.
02:13 PM JavaBean: i mean, i haven't been paying THAT much attention to that community. but i can't say i have ever seen an american lock picked by him or many of the others
02:14 PM pcw_home: That seems like such a basic error that should have been be caught by any design review
02:14 PM FinboySlick: pcw_home: design rev... wah? What are those words you are using?
02:19 PM andypugh: JavaBean: I am not sure what you are saying. That American locks are not worth their trouble?
02:19 PM andypugh: (LPL was very impressed with a British padlock, it withstood many rounds of 50 BMG )
02:26 PM JavaBean: what i was saying, andy was that i hadn't seen American Lock locks picked by him or others i follow. i pay special attention for that brand, basically all the locks on this property/(all of the property owners properties) and all the padlocks/etc used by the bossman are all American Lock. i think its important to know of any issues with that companies locks as i deal with them daily
02:38 PM rs[m]: that kind of flaw can't really be fixed. look at lock bumping. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIfF4IWp0Xc
02:38 PM rs[m]: (without a major redesign of the lock that is)
02:38 PM rs[m]: any lock with this style of key can usually be picked in a matter of seconds
02:38 PM rs[m]: https://toool.nl/Toool
02:39 PM rs[m]: they used to come to CCC and dutch hacker camps and do workshops there
02:39 PM rs[m]: another very flawed lock from back in the day https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LahDQ2ZQ3e0
02:56 PM enleth: fun fact: most cheap strongboxes/safes, including almost all hotel safes, can be opened with a potato
02:57 PM enleth: (or a mallet, or any other bumping implement, even a bare fist if you don't mind it getting slightly sore, but a potato definitely makes for a good show)
02:58 PM JavaBean: should watch some more of LPL's videos, he does some "picks" with weird implements
03:01 PM enleth: the latch that prevents the deadbolts from moving in small safes is spring-loaded with a very weak spring (so that the small, battery-operated solenoid connected to the keypad can move it) and has enough mass that tapping the whole safe with a springy object can get it out of position momentarily
03:02 PM enleth: so if you grab a potato, start tapping the safe rhytmically and tugging the bolt release knob, it will open as soon as you get the phase shift between taps and tugs correctly
03:23 PM jymmmm: Actually have been a locksmith at one point in time, I like/have American brand locks, the man reason is they are renforced against brute forced attacks, and more so with "I" pins to help thwart against picking. But that exploit with the thinner rake picks is just slicker that snot. Guess I might as well sell my set of American (brand) locks and get a couple of Medico or ABBA locks instead, which are pick/bump proof.
03:35 PM jymmmm: And as far as enleth's potato safe hack... That is exactly why I dislike all digital locks and just stick with S&G group 2 combination locks. I knew a safesmith that had a gold mine, he put a vault door on the entrance, lots and lots of dents from being shot at, but no damage. But some skinny lil shit got in by crawling thru the air shaft. DOH
03:36 PM jymmmm: Oh and if the safe is't bolted down, you can usually just drop it on it's corner and will open up on it's own.
03:40 PM JavaBean: one of the rules of network/system security, make sure someone can't get in through the airvents
04:05 PM jymmmm: JavaBean: but that's usually a raised floor, so no real way to prevent that. Usually you install welded rebar cages along the way. And the golden rule still applies.... Anything man made, man can break.
04:05 PM jymmmm: s/usually/unless/
04:06 PM * JavaBean shrugs, contemplates making another deposit at the porcelain bank
04:15 PM * Tom_L wonders if it's ever been robbed
04:18 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: Kinda... https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2018/12/31/man-stealing-toilet-parts-queens/
04:19 PM Tom_L: only in NY
04:19 PM Rab: Wonder if he turned the water off first, or just got in there and won.
04:20 PM roycroft: all our restaurants just closed, so that won't happen here
04:20 PM Tom_L: being closed hasn't stopped many thieves
04:20 PM Tom_L: thiefs
04:21 PM roycroft: thieves
04:21 PM roycroft: or thefts
04:21 PM Tom_L: robbers
04:21 PM roycroft: or burgles
04:21 PM Tom_L: :)
04:21 PM roycroft: i finally got a webcam working to monitor my 3d printer
04:21 PM roycroft: now it can move to the room where it is supposed to live and start working again
04:22 PM roycroft: i got tired of playing games and went to the goodwill and got an old, used logitec usb webcam
04:22 PM roycroft: and i got there minutes before it closed down for two weeks
04:23 PM roycroft: except it's not working quite right :(
04:24 PM Rab: roycroft, I've found cheese is a good no-nonsense Linux utility for webcam sanity checking, available for Debian.
04:25 PM roycroft: it's not the webcam per se, i think
04:25 PM roycroft: it's octoprint
04:26 PM roycroft: octoprint will display the webcam stream
04:26 PM Rab: I wonder if OpenCV can be programmed to detect fires. High-IR signature in the captured visible range?
04:26 PM roycroft: and if i hover over the image, i enter keyboard control, wehere i can control the printer with keyboard commands
04:26 PM roycroft: whenever i do that the stream stops
04:26 PM roycroft: if i reload the page the stream starts again
04:26 PM roycroft: i don't think it's supposed to work that way
04:27 PM roycroft: i did not get an ir camera
04:27 PM roycroft: i want one
04:27 PM roycroft: but i wanted to make sure things worked ok before i invested in one
04:27 PM roycroft: this camera cost me $5
04:27 PM roycroft: well, it cost me $4.50 after my old person discount
04:28 PM roycroft: the cheapest ir camera i've found that claims to work with linux is $50
04:29 PM Rab: Most cameras will show some kind of artifact for IR. Flames looking purple, etc.
04:30 PM Rab: Even without removing the IR filter.
04:30 PM roycroft: i just want to be able to turn the lights off while i'm doing a 3d print at night and still be able to monitor
04:31 PM Rab: Ahh, yeah
04:32 PM roycroft: it's a waste of electricity to keep the lights on, even though i have led lamps, so not much of a waste
04:33 PM roycroft: every little bit of conservation helps
04:33 PM roycroft: conservation is the cheapest and cleanest form of energy
04:34 PM jymmmm: Would you even use this after making it? Looks like a piece of art... https://youtu.be/CKgwcuAvM6E?t=610
04:35 PM roycroft: last reprap
04:37 PM jymmmm: Oh hey, it's Friday the 13th haha
04:38 PM roycroft: that it is
05:37 PM JT-Cave: that is a pretty amazing vise dunno what you might need it for
05:39 PM XXCoder: little bit clickbaity title. "in 10 minutes!" yeah 10 minutes of fast forwarded and edited videos hah
05:41 PM JT-Cave: yea the title is a bit misleading
05:41 PM XXCoder: cool tho just not something id find useful
05:42 PM JT-Cave: kinda cool how he built the wheel
05:43 PM XXCoder: he uses a lot of tools
05:43 PM JT-Cave: although he didn't show how he put the radius on the wood parts
05:45 PM pfred1: build the wheel
05:45 PM XXCoder: which radius?
05:45 PM JT-Cave: on the wheel
05:45 PM JT-Cave: the wood parts of the wheel
05:45 PM XXCoder: https://youtu.be/CKgwcuAvM6E?t=511
05:45 PM pfred1: break him on the wheel!
05:46 PM XXCoder: easy to miss, its like 2 seconds
05:46 PM JT-Cave: maybe 1/4 second all I saw was facing the wheel
05:46 PM XXCoder: my link goes to just before it
05:47 PM XXCoder: very easy to miss
05:48 PM pfred1: I use tiny vises more than big vises
05:48 PM JT-Cave: hmm I need to cover the finished compost bin in the morning before the rain starts
05:49 PM JT-Cave: hmm better cover it now looks like rain tonight
05:49 PM pfred1: too late is rained the past two days here
05:49 PM XXCoder: jt basically he uses sander to add radius
05:50 PM pfred1: machinists know butkus about woodworking
05:50 PM XXCoder: its not even a second, shows right after lathe and video just shows one edge being radius added
05:51 PM pfred1: Paul Sellers show him how to do it all with hand tools
05:53 PM jymmmm: This is a $65 HF hydraulic crimper, do you think it's worth it? Alternatives? https://youtu.be/xifvW70HeLU?t=148
05:55 PM XXCoder: "worth it?" is very subjective. "can it do the job?" is better question
05:55 PM jymmmm: JT I think he waterjet the wood pieces
05:55 PM XXCoder: waterjet cant add radius
05:55 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: Well, I mena make good solid crimps
05:55 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: Eh, I saw him sand them too, so who knows in "10 minutes" ;)
05:56 PM pfred1: jymmmm a big hammer can crimp
05:56 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: maybe not "pretty" crimps, but good.
05:56 PM jymmmm: pfred1: Eh, not always
05:56 PM pfred1: it can if you use a big enough one
05:56 PM pfred1: I just got a new sledgehammer
05:57 PM XXCoder: well video show it seems able to do it
05:57 PM pfred1: got one of them new fangles plastic handles
05:57 PM jymmmm: pfred1: I know there is a hammer crimper, makes a "indent" into the lug
05:57 PM pfred1: I know what I do to wooden handles in sledgehammers
05:58 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: I wasn't expecting the "wings" on the finished crimp though, not sure if that takes anything away
05:58 PM pfred1: yeah I've seen dies for making crimps in ignition wires
05:58 PM pfred1: never worked too good for me
05:58 PM XXCoder: me either
05:58 PM pfred1: I got a ratcheting crimper
05:59 PM XXCoder: i once saw huge crimper heh
05:59 PM jymmmm: pfred1: for 8ga? 1ga?
05:59 PM XXCoder: its for wires few inches thick
05:59 PM pfred1: I don't know offhand it's pretty big
05:59 PM XXCoder: and i also saw cutouts of those. wire and end is one peice now
05:59 PM XXCoder: fused by huge pressure
05:59 PM pfred1: yeah a good crimp fuses the copper
05:59 PM XXCoder: machine is over 100 years old. it was just under 100 when i toured
06:00 PM XXCoder: jymmmm: you can do a test then cut it in half and see?
06:00 PM pfred1: I seen people make nice connectors out of copper pipe
06:00 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: Well, it usually takes weeks/months for the mech weld to fully develope as I understand it, but yeah
06:01 PM jymmmm: pfred1: Yeah, I saw that too
06:01 PM pfred1: for what connectors can cost it's probably worth the trouble
06:01 PM jymmmm: I might try making bus bars out of 1/2 copper pipe using that crimper as I dont have a press.
06:02 PM XXCoder: jy you can make one
06:02 PM pfred1: even little connectors can be a quarter a pop
06:02 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: a press to flatten copper pipe?
06:02 PM XXCoder: i saw on yt someone making few thousand pounds strength press using 4 big bolts
06:03 PM pfred1: hydraulic jacks are cheap
06:03 PM XXCoder: pf yeah but needs precision thick rods
06:03 PM XXCoder: 4 bolts way dont.
06:03 PM JT-Cave: you can actually make more pressure with a bunch of small bolts around a big one
06:04 PM jymmmm: I'm hoping 1/2 copper pipe should EASILY handle 150A @ 12VDC, but nt sure
06:04 PM pfred1: the amount of force threads exert is astonishing
06:04 PM XXCoder: found it. https://toolguyd.com/diy-mechanical-press/
06:04 PM pfred1: jymmmm shouldn't be a problem
06:05 PM XXCoder: 100 ton using 4 bolts
06:05 PM XXCoder: far more than i remembered
06:05 PM pfred1: that fireball guy did some thread testing
06:05 PM JT-Cave: seems to be a bit over stated
06:06 PM pfred1: I think when he was making his big vise?
06:07 PM XXCoder: 15 usd each one of those screws
06:09 PM XXCoder: or just one if orginal is large enough i guess
06:11 PM jymmmm: pfred1: Yeah, I'll look up the area of copper pipe as see what mm2 I get.
06:12 PM pfred1: jymmmm copper pipe can handle a lot of current
06:12 PM pfred1: it's what they wire MRI machines with
06:13 PM pfred1: that's due to the frequency but they still run a lot of power
06:13 PM pfred1: skin effect and all
06:14 PM pfred1: any conductor in the middle is wasted metal
06:14 PM jymmmm: pfred1: I'm sure it will, and if it ever glows, I'm phuked anyway, lmao
06:15 PM pfred1: let's see if the google knows the ampacity of copper pipe
06:15 PM jymmmm: I just want my home made bus bars to at least look half way nice =)
06:16 PM pfred1: google says 1/2" pip is only good up to 120 amps
06:16 PM pfred1: well about
06:17 PM pfred1: they gave it a ~120
06:17 PM pfred1: but you're only using the crimp so it's not like you're transmitting power
06:17 PM jymmmm: Interesting, but 120A is fine as the BMS is rated for 120A, and I'll be adding a 150A breaker.
06:17 PM pfred1: distance matters
06:24 PM jymmmm: the bus bar is only 4", the cables are only 3ft
06:24 PM pfred1: cabinet rating is different than conduit
06:24 PM JT-Cave: working as an electrician we would add temporary lights to a circuit until the breaker tripped then take one off
06:24 PM jymmmm: this is all DC
06:24 PM pfred1: power factor confuses me
06:24 PM jymmmm: and if needed, I can double up the bus bars
06:24 PM jymmmm: JT Was that just to size it up?
06:24 PM jymmmm: or a safety test thing?
06:24 PM jymmmm: pfred1: isn't PF related to the ac side of current lagging voltage?
06:24 PM jymmmm: ...by 90 degrees
06:24 PM pfred1: jymmmm AC and DC are just different
06:25 PM pfred1: everything starts out simple it just gets complicated
06:26 PM JavaBean: pfred1: you think 1/2" copper pipe would do good for 120amps @ 48vNdc?? though i might double or triple up if this system gets complex
06:27 PM pfred1: JavaBean that's what https://diysolarforum.com says
06:27 PM pfred1: https://diysolarforum.com/threads/copper-pipe-1-2-inch-what-is-max-current-capacity.11405/
06:27 PM * JavaBean has been trying to track too many websites for too many different reasons for too long
06:28 PM roycroft: so it appears that the widescreen plugin for octoprint is the culprit
06:28 PM roycroft: disabling that keeps the webcam streaming fine
06:28 PM roycroft: and the webcam window is bigger without the widescreen plugin running anyway
06:29 PM pfred1: I used this patch called octocrete once it said it hardens 8 times faster than regular patch did and they weren't kidding
06:29 PM pfred1: the first batched kicked off in the bucket while we were mixing it!
06:29 PM pfred1: so I don't like octo anything now
06:29 PM roycroft: spoken too soon
06:30 PM roycroft: it just timed out
06:30 PM roycroft: it just takes longer to time out
06:32 PM * JavaBean looks around a bit and finds a cookie he can give to pfred1 as thanks
06:33 PM pfred1: JavaBean yeah the discussion is pretty in depth these people are putting a lot of thought into it
06:33 PM pfred1: 400 MCM cable is the size of copper pipe
06:34 PM pfred1: but it's solid
06:34 PM pfred1: well it's big strands if it was solid you'd never bend it
06:38 PM roycroft: there's a big difference between big strands and solid, though
06:38 PM JavaBean: have you ever bent 250mcm??? there is a hand tool to do it with... but i had to add some pipe to it for better leverage
06:39 PM roycroft: a much greater surface area, and thus more current carrying ability
06:39 PM JavaBean: BAH, missremembered. it was 500mcm
06:39 PM pfred1: I've bent 400 MCM
06:40 PM jymmmm: gregcnc: The rule I'm going by is 4A per mm2
06:40 PM pfred1: had to stuff 3 of them down a weatherhead along with a ground
06:40 PM jymmmm: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_wire_gauge#Tables_of_AWG_wire_sizes
06:41 PM jymmmm: brb, grabbing firewood from the stack
06:42 PM JavaBean: yeah, running those heavy "wires" isn't as much fun as routing and getting them attached at the ends
06:44 PM gregcnc: roycroft https://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm
06:58 PM jymmmm: gregcnc: See, that link you gave is for AC, things seem to be different for DC
06:59 PM jymmmm: gregcnc: I'm either going by marine ratings, and/or 4A/mm2 - which is what I read in a solar controller manual and seems like a good refernce point.
07:01 PM jymmmm: Got firewood in the nick of time as now the rain has picked up
07:01 PM jymmmm: brb, rebooting
07:03 PM jymmmm: I'm back
07:18 PM jymmmm: Son of a bitch, lol.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpkf1Zldf0s
07:23 PM Tom_L: reassuring ehh?
07:24 PM XXCoder: crazy
07:26 PM XXCoder: doing that way recudes problem space to 10
07:26 PM XXCoder: thats it. out of 9999 possible space
07:28 PM roycroft: life is returning to some semblence of normalcy
07:29 PM roycroft: teh prevailing youtube ads are no longer caustic political ads - they're back to annoying liberty mutual ads
07:29 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: technically 10,000
07:29 PM XXCoder: it'll be while more for me. plus plague is still out
07:29 PM pfred1: bring out your dead
07:29 PM XXCoder: ah yes 10,000 including 0000
07:29 PM roycroft: living with sars-cov-2 is the new normal
07:30 PM roycroft: i'm hoping there is a new new normal in a few months that does not include that
07:30 PM roycroft: but the new new normal will not be the old normal
07:30 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: even at 5 dial, that's 100,000 combinations, but pretty useless in that scenario,
07:30 PM XXCoder: it'll be a while
07:30 PM pfred1: Joe Biden's Chinese handlers have given him the cure
07:31 PM XXCoder: yeah 5 digits or 100, its still problem space of 10 with that exploit lol
07:31 PM XXCoder: pf what the fuck are you talking about
07:31 PM XXCoder: vaccine is not found in china
07:32 PM pfred1: XXCoder why not? They make everything else
07:32 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: Yeah, that's why I like simplex locks, but they don't make a padlock that I'm aware of
07:32 PM XXCoder: yeh we found god
07:32 PM XXCoder: its china
07:32 PM roycroft: a vaccine is not a cure anyway
07:32 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: simplex locks.... 5 button = 3million combinations
07:33 PM XXCoder: not quite correct as you cant press same button twice
07:33 PM roycroft: and president-elect biden had nothing to do with developing any of the vaccines
07:33 PM XXCoder: nor did trump
07:33 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: but you CAN press multiple buttons together at the exact same time
07:33 PM XXCoder: 5 buttons is 5!
07:34 PM pfred1: jymmmm my keyboard does that too n-key rollover
07:34 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: 24,3,51 is different from 24.35.1
07:35 PM XXCoder: can you send picture of one? may be different lock than im picturiong
07:35 PM jymmmm: which is different from 243,5,1
07:36 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: just google SIMPLEX lock
07:36 PM jymmmm: hmmm, nw it's REALLY raining
07:36 PM XXCoder: fine
07:37 PM XXCoder: how do you get 243 on those locks?
07:37 PM XXCoder: 243 (enter) 5 (enter) 1 (enter)?
07:40 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: press 2 and 4 at the exact same time, then press 3
07:41 PM jymmmm: XXCoder: press 2 and 4 at the exact same time, release, then press 3, release, then turn lever.
07:41 PM XXCoder: interesting. whats upper bound on single group of diogits?
07:41 PM jymmmm: all 5 buttons?
07:42 PM XXCoder: i dont know how to do stats since none of number can have repeating digits but pretty large space yeah
07:42 PM Tom_L: locksmith school tonight?
07:43 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: Yeah, Friday the 13th special
07:43 PM Tom_L: awesome
07:46 PM roycroft: this is just so sad
07:46 PM roycroft: https://www.ksl.com/article/50047970/conspiracy-theorists-try-to-get-into-utah-valley-hospital-icu
07:46 PM roycroft: wingnuts trying to break into a hospital to film patients in an icu
07:46 PM roycroft: in an attempt to prove that the icus are not maxed out
07:49 PM roycroft: there is having total trust in our government
07:49 PM roycroft: and there is bat shit crazy
07:49 PM roycroft: the truth lies in between those two
07:49 PM roycroft: it's not binary
07:49 PM jymmmm: JT wanted to thank you for the hairdryer trick, has worked very well
07:50 PM roycroft: especially since there are diametrically opposed types of bat shit crazy :)
09:15 PM cradek: those folks are so lucky to not know anyone who's dead from this thing yet. the rest of us should be so lucky.