#linuxcnc Logs

Oct 16 2020

01:14 AM Loetmichel: mornin'
01:26 AM Deejay: moin
01:55 AM Loetmichel: Hehe, my eyes are not as bad as i thought. Coworker just came by: "i broke off our last 1.8mm drill bit... can you regrind that?" $me donns the magnifying glasses, gets the angle grinder and grinds it back into form, slightly shorter. Test drill: 1.8mm pin wits without wobble. "Good enough!" :)
04:11 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
05:03 AM Loetmichel: *hehe* bosses Wife (aka. CFO) just came down with a half inch pack of invoices and a list for me to sign... nice, i will get about 4k€ Expenses back for stuff i bought for the company in the last half year because i was to lazy to get the company credid card info and used mine instead... nice when you forget that you did lend the company money. ;)
05:03 AM XXCoder: nice
06:19 AM Loetmichel: *giggle* ... Just sat down on my cars hood while smoking outside... Car: *rolls back* ... i nearly dropped to the ground when the car got out from under me... i should REALLY learn to pull the ebrake or put it in gear when parking ;)
06:19 AM Tom_L: and i thought the flow of money went the other way at a job
06:21 AM Loetmichel: Tom_L: i am just to lazy to gets bosses credit card every time i order something for the company. its easier to use my paypal and get it back from accounting
06:27 AM sensille: just add bosses credit card to your paypal?
07:26 AM beachbumpete1: Morning
07:52 AM JT-Cave: morning
07:59 AM beachbumpete1: Glad its Friday hoping to work on my van this weekend if the weather is not shitty like its been lately
08:01 AM JT-Cave: Saturday will be clear and 70°F sounds like a motorcycle ride to me
08:02 AM * JavaBean wonders when the weather people will realize that we have 20+mph winds right now, not the 8-12mph forcasted
08:05 AM CaptHindsight: nah cause weather-people don't have wind speed measuring devices
08:06 AM Loetmichel: JavaBean: as long as it isnt 100mph everything is well
08:07 AM Loetmichel: i got used to 8+beaufort at the german navy...
08:07 AM Loetmichel: tie everything down, including yourself and all is well
08:07 AM JavaBean: only documented in "microbursts" at that speed. but gusts of Cat1 aren't uncommon
08:08 AM CaptHindsight: Loetmichel: did you ever have war games with the Austrian Navy?
08:08 AM Loetmichel: wind gets funny when you can lean 45° forward into it without falling over ;)
08:08 AM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight: i doubt they have one ;)
08:08 AM rs[m]: there is no real austrian navy since end of WW I
08:09 AM Loetmichel: we did have a combined exercise with an american carrier group though... and our subs managed to "kill" the whole carrier group without getting detected... american CO wasnt amused
08:10 AM CaptHindsight: rs[m]: we just make shit up here :), they have two riverboats currently but no official navy
08:11 AM rs[m]: CaptHindsight: with "they" you mean "the austrians"?
08:12 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.flickr.com/photos/ingopics/71321410
08:12 AM rs[m]: CaptHindsight: we have a bit more than 2 river boats, but risk of hostile nation invading via danube is pretty low methinks
08:13 AM rs[m]: CaptHindsight: they managed to nearly kill 2 girls on a demo day. boat capsized, 2 girls were trapped under water for 45 minutes
08:14 AM rs[m]: they were reanimated, but nothing about their status was communicated. 45 minutes probably means permanent vegetative state.
08:15 AM CaptHindsight: Austria Will Keep Border Controls with Slovenia to May 2021
08:16 AM JavaBean: reanimation after being "drowned" is weird. people have come back after an hour in cold waters
08:16 AM CaptHindsight: can you really trust the Slovenians?
08:17 AM rs[m]: JavaBean: there is a saying that you ain't dead until you are warm and dead or something the like...
08:17 AM JavaBean: yeah, drowning is weird like that
08:18 AM rs[m]: JavaBean: but 45 minutes is very long. chances of survival in avalanches, where there is usually more air than under water, and also cold environment, drops significantly after 15 minutes
08:19 AM JavaBean: iirc, it has something to do with the lungs being full of cold water. not a normal situation with avalanches
08:20 AM rs[m]: water probably cools you down faster / more efficiently. lower body temperature means lower rate of metabolism, so you could last longer with the oxygen that is available
08:21 AM JavaBean: can't really help, its been years since i was in a place with water... let alone cold water
08:21 AM CaptHindsight: and could easily fit in here, little brain required
08:21 AM rs[m]: nonetheless, that was a very stupid exercise. nobody thought to do a "head-count" after the accident
08:22 AM CaptHindsight: how did they discover them missing?
08:25 AM JavaBean: probably weren't at their stations and an occifer was pissed that they played "hooky" during an exercise... how people are discovered to be missing on military boats is oft rather "stupid" like that
08:34 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.thelocal.at/20161125/how-to-behave-in-an-austrian-sauna
08:49 AM rs[m]: CaptHindsight: army called the fire brigade, and they took inventory
09:29 AM Loetmichel: hehe, just had to explain the leidenfrost effect to a coworker.. put my (wet)hand into the soldering bath to fish out a part that fell in... Coworker was mortified. :)
09:56 AM unterhaus_: you're braver than I am, probably would have a dry patch
03:05 PM Deejay: gn8
03:37 PM CaptHindsight: late afternoon Friday everyone!
03:40 PM Tom_L: i blew the whistle early
03:45 PM roycroft: it's nigh on the weekend here
03:45 PM JT-Shop: someone needs to pull that chain on my work whistle
03:45 PM roycroft: anohter hour and 15 minutes
03:48 PM * JT-Shop is turning scrap into good parts for a change
04:12 PM _unreal_: hello
04:12 PM _unreal_: pcw_home, you live?
04:13 PM _unreal_: Tom_L, I always knew you were likely to be a whistle blower
04:13 PM roycroft: he likes choochoos
04:13 PM roycroft: nothing wrong with that
04:15 PM _unreal_: did an other infuse today on a boat
04:15 PM _unreal_: 6 layers 75 lbs of fiberglass
04:15 PM _unreal_: like 6x20'
04:15 PM _unreal_: upside down
04:19 PM _unreal: ok so just got the LCNC machine booted up. and connected to the card. need to get this thing working
04:20 PM _unreal: feed me :)
04:23 PM roycroft: does a motor rated at 50Hz generally run ok at 60Hz, other than running 20% faster?
04:24 PM roycroft: i know 60Hz motors usually work fine at 50Hz
04:25 PM _unreal: I would assume it should be fine
04:25 PM _unreal: if its just a standard AC motor. as long as its not running at a different voltage should just run faster
04:26 PM roycroft: i don't make assumptions, which is why i ask :)
04:26 PM roycroft: yes, it's a 3 phase ac motor
04:26 PM _unreal: OH 3 phase
04:26 PM _unreal: that i'm not sure
04:26 PM roycroft: i need a 3 phase motor to use with a vfd so i can vary the speed
04:26 PM _unreal: if your talking about a standard 220 single phase
04:26 PM roycroft: if i go this way
04:27 PM _unreal: o,O and a VFD then your changing other aspects as well. thats out of my relm
04:28 PM * JT-Shop stops to vacuum the floor of chips even though that means going into overtime to finish
04:28 PM JT-Shop: and there is no overtime here
04:28 PM roycroft: i could set the max frequency to 50Hz on the vfd
04:28 PM roycroft: so i guess it would not matter
04:29 PM roycroft: it's odd to find a us made motor that is spec'ed at 50Hz
04:30 PM roycroft: i'm still trying to decide what to do about a band saw
04:30 PM roycroft: and one thought is to just get a more powerful motor for the one i have
04:30 PM roycroft: build a new base for it
04:30 PM roycroft: and call it done
04:30 PM roycroft: motor + vfd should be around $400
04:31 PM roycroft: i should see what i have
04:32 PM roycroft: i might have a 2hp 3 phase motor in stock
04:32 PM roycroft: in which case all i'd need is a vfd
04:32 PM roycroft: i'd prefer 3hp, but i'm not sure if i would want to push my current saw with a 3hp motor
04:33 PM roycroft: i actually have a spare 3hp vfd
04:33 PM roycroft: but i want to always have a spare, in case one fails
04:33 PM roycroft: because things like that always fail right before the end of a job with a tight deadline
04:33 PM _unreal: ARG... I just want to get this freaking 7i96 setup and working
04:33 PM roycroft: it's one of the laws of physics that has never been proven, but still accepted as the law
04:36 PM XXCoder: isnt that murphys law
04:36 PM XXCoder: ;)
04:38 PM roycroft: and yes, i do have a spare 2hp 3 phase motor
04:38 PM * JT-Shop sees no one is looking and pops the top on his beer
04:39 PM roycroft: but it's 3450rpm, and i'd really like something in the 1600-1800rpm range
04:39 PM roycroft: otherwise i have a sheave issue
04:39 PM roycroft: too bad - it's a brand new motor, made by dayton in the usa
04:39 PM roycroft: it also has a weird frame
04:40 PM roycroft: no foot
04:40 PM roycroft: just flange bolt holes
04:40 PM roycroft: but i could figure out a mount for that
04:40 PM roycroft: or maybe i can ebay it and use the money to buy what i want
04:40 PM JT-Shop: 56C mount?
04:41 PM _unreal: I'm here btw I'm just switching the wires from the location for what I was originally thinking of doing to a different setup. I'm putting the stepper motor enable to I/O out 0
04:41 PM _unreal: I finished the last of my beer yesterday
04:41 PM _unreal: dont have cash till tue. :(
04:41 PM _unreal: just starting to $$$ recover
04:42 PM roycroft: yes, it's 56c
04:42 PM roycroft: not all that weird
04:42 PM roycroft: just not what i need for this
04:43 PM roycroft: _unreal: you haven't sent jt-shop any beer yet
04:43 PM roycroft: that's why you're not getting any help
04:45 PM roycroft: i don't really need the variable speed for this, but i thought it might be nice to be able to use it for metal once in a while
04:45 PM roycroft: using my 7x12 in vertical mode is not fun
04:48 PM _unreal: 7x12?
04:48 PM _unreal: I have a nice 92" upright bandsaw industrial
04:48 PM roycroft: band saw
04:49 PM roycroft: horizontal band saw, for metal
04:49 PM _unreal: ya I wish I had one of those. my father has one
04:49 PM roycroft: it's very nice for cutting things to length
04:49 PM roycroft: it's a pain in the butt to use vertically
04:50 PM _unreal: it sucks I have no audio on this lcnc setup
04:50 PM _unreal: and I dont know of any speakers that I still have ether :(
04:50 PM _unreal: and all I'm finding are videos for setting up the 7i96
04:51 PM roycroft: why would linuxcnc need audio?
04:51 PM _unreal: it doesnt
04:51 PM Tom_L: so he can hear it go vrrmmm vrrrmmm
04:51 PM _unreal: other then maybe an error/worning alarm
04:51 PM _unreal: spindle changing
04:51 PM _unreal: but I'm TRYING to get lcnc setup and working
04:51 PM roycroft: just watch for the magic smoke to escape
04:51 PM _unreal: @#$@#$# phone
04:51 PM roycroft: that will be sufficient warning
04:54 PM JT-Shop: yea 56C is usually a pump or fan or something like that
04:54 PM JT-Shop: or into a gear reducer
04:55 PM roycroft: sometimes they're footed, jt-shop, and sometimes they're not
04:55 PM roycroft: but they always have the flange mount
04:55 PM roycroft: it's too bad, because this motor is specifically rated for use with a vfd
04:57 PM * JT-Shop hits the big red button on the BP mill and calls it a day
04:57 PM roycroft: i'm done in 3 minutes
04:58 PM roycroft: i have my workbench top pretty flat
04:58 PM roycroft: i may sand it and put a coat of finish on it this weekend
04:59 PM JT-Shop: nice
04:59 PM roycroft: yeah
05:00 PM roycroft: i have to decide when is a good time to put some finish on it
05:00 PM Tom_L: grainger is sure expensive but they always have it
05:00 PM roycroft: this time of year i won't be able to use it for 3-4 days at least after i put the finish on
05:00 PM roycroft: so maybe sunday, at the end of the day
05:00 PM Tom_L: warm the shop up
05:00 PM roycroft: then it will be ready to use by the following weekend for sure
05:01 PM roycroft: that gets expensive
05:01 PM roycroft: and those days are coming soon enough as it is
05:01 PM Tom_L: it was a bit chilly this morning
05:02 PM roycroft: i probably pay $100/month to heat the garage shop just enough to keep tools from rusting easily during the winter
05:02 PM roycroft: which is still way too cold to comfortably work
05:03 PM _unreal_: JT-Shop, / Tom_L I think I may have missed something in setting up the 7i96 config tool
05:03 PM _unreal_: because the thing I made is failing
05:03 PM _unreal_: when I try to run lcnc with the config INI
05:03 PM _unreal_: crashing
05:03 PM Tom_L: post your config and i might look at it when i get back
05:04 PM roycroft: and it's the weekend!
05:04 PM _unreal: I posted it the other day
05:04 PM JT-Shop: what is the exact error? https://dpaste.com/ works well
05:05 PM _unreal: https://paste.centos.org/view/882093e3
05:06 PM XXCoder: easy to remember url too. bonus lol
05:08 PM _unreal: I dont get it just checked everything apears to be correct
05:09 PM _unreal: I was thinking maybe I forgot to add the .xsessions file
05:09 PM _unreal: its there with the script
05:09 PM JT-Shop: Unknown parameter `coordinates=XYZ'
05:09 PM JT-Shop: LINUXCNC - 2.7.15
05:09 PM JT-Shop: 7i96 requires 2.8>
05:10 PM _unreal: ?
05:11 PM _unreal: ok so got a link to how to do the upgrade?
05:11 PM _unreal: or know how?
05:14 PM _unreal: ok I'm running debian stretch
05:14 PM _unreal: 4.9.0-12-rt-amd64
05:15 PM JT-Shop: the documents show how to upgrade
05:19 PM JT-Shop: just make sure your reading the 2.8 documents
05:21 PM _unreal: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/getting-started/updating-linuxcnc.html
05:27 PM _unreal: keep getting this error The repository 'cdrom://[Unofficial LinuxCNC 'Stretch' amd64 Live/Install 2018-10-27T16:56] stretch Release' does not have a Release file.
05:27 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: might be of interest https://www.groschopp.com/whats-your-frequency/ https://vfds.com/blog/motor-theory-101-adjusting-frequency https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/electrical-motor-frequency-speed-d_456.html
05:27 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.engineering.com/ElectronicsDesign/ElectronicsDesignArticles/ArticleID/8154/Changing-an-Induction-Motors-Power-Supply-Frequency-Between-50-and-60Hz.aspx
05:28 PM Tom_L: JT-Shop, i didn't know the 7i96 required 2.8
05:28 PM CaptHindsight: see the last link about smoke
05:28 PM _unreal: who the fuck do I upgrade.. I'm getting nothing but errors following the page
05:29 PM Tom_L: installing the iso might be easier
05:29 PM Tom_L: i dunno
05:29 PM Tom_L: just save your config somewhere if you do
05:30 PM CaptHindsight: hopes and prayers that it upgrades
05:34 PM _unreal: YA I WAS thinking that
05:34 PM _unreal: right now trying this http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/getting-started/getting-linuxcnc.html
05:35 PM JT-Shop: sounds like an error in your software sources... repository cdrom is a clue it should not be looking at the cdrom for the repository
05:37 PM * JT-Shop calls it a day
05:44 PM _unreal: I dont get it sudo add-apt-repository
05:44 PM _unreal: thats not available
05:46 PM JT-Cave: too many dashes not enough spaces
05:46 PM _unreal: ?
05:46 PM JT-Cave: I think
05:46 PM _unreal: its not even in the list of commands at all
05:46 PM * Tom_L boots his linux box
05:47 PM Tom_L: just add it thru the synaptic package manager
05:47 PM JT-Cave: where did you see that command?
05:48 PM JT-Cave: so much for memory it is sudo add-apt-repository "...
05:49 PM Tom_L: no
05:49 PM Tom_L: command not found
05:49 PM Tom_L: what repository is he wanting to add?
05:50 PM JT-Cave: john@d10cave:~$ sudo add-apt-repository
05:50 PM JT-Cave: [sudo] password for john:
05:50 PM JT-Cave: Error: need a repository as argument
05:50 PM Tom_L: are you on buster?
05:51 PM JT-Cave: john@d10cave:~$ cat /etc/os-release
05:51 PM JT-Cave: PRETTY_NAME="Debian GNU/Linux 10 (buster)"
05:51 PM JT-Cave: NAME="Debian GNU/Linux"
05:51 PM JT-Cave: VERSION_ID="10"
05:51 PM JT-Cave: VERSION="10 (buster)"
05:51 PM JT-Cave: VERSION_CODENAME=buster
05:51 PM JT-Cave: ID=debian
05:51 PM Tom_L: i get command not found
05:52 PM Tom_L: the version on mine was when 2.8 was still testing
05:58 PM _unreal: arg... freaking download is going to take a hour
05:58 PM Tom_L: the iso?
05:58 PM Tom_L: it'a big
05:58 PM _unreal: ya I get command not found as well
05:58 PM _unreal: there is no add-xxxx command
05:59 PM Tom_L: what repository were you wanting to add?
05:59 PM _unreal: the only command that I have that follows the ADD- string is add-shell
05:59 PM _unreal: 2.8
05:59 PM _unreal: I'm already downloading the new iso
06:00 PM _unreal: I've already deleted other repositories etc....
06:00 PM _unreal: I'm not going to even bother trying to fix anyhing I'm just downloading BUSTER
06:00 PM _unreal: not worth my brain pain, I have enough as it is
06:00 PM Tom_L: ok
06:01 PM _unreal: I JUST got a god damn call from my lawyer saying they want an other $1600
06:01 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: https://pastebin.pl/view/219f7650
06:01 PM _unreal: because they are taking there sweet ass time dealing with my case and keep adjusting shit....
06:01 PM Tom_L: that's how they run up the bill
06:02 PM _unreal: I dont have $1600 period. and I was planning PLANNNING on starting to recover my stocks next week because I'm finally making money again. MASSIVE MASSIVE loss of hours
06:02 PM _unreal: i was getting like 25-31 hours a week
06:02 PM _unreal: thanks to my @!#%@##$##@ father
06:03 PM * JT-Cave works on async
06:03 PM _unreal: async?
06:03 PM JT-Cave: python 3
06:03 PM Tom_L: mine won't do an upgrade either
06:04 PM _unreal: O...M...G..... 1.2 hours download left for buster
06:04 PM _unreal: ok so its not me
06:04 PM _unreal: then the scripting as I figured is broken
06:04 PM JT-Cave: maybe it's time to twitter for 2 hours
06:04 PM _unreal: I was like WTF I tried manually entering it in synaptic
06:04 PM _unreal: and it failed
06:04 PM Tom_L: they moved something and it's broke now
06:04 PM _unreal: ya
06:04 PM _unreal: m-f-er's
06:08 PM Tom_L: i'm not sure i got that iso when it was released..
06:10 PM _unreal: mmmmm enjoying some meed
06:11 PM Tom_L: looks like all i got was for rpi
06:11 PM _unreal: hum
06:11 PM _unreal: hehe all I have is the older rpi b+ or what ever it is
06:12 PM Tom_L: i might dig it out and finish it's install
06:12 PM _unreal: that system I'm planning on burnin into a laser etching station some day
06:12 PM _unreal: the asus tinkerboard is a dust collector at this point
06:12 PM Tom_L: i've got a few of those
06:12 PM _unreal: sucks becuase it has sooo much cpu power and features but it doesnt like to boot
06:12 PM _unreal: the tinkeboards?
06:13 PM Tom_L: dust collectors
06:13 PM _unreal: oh
06:13 PM _unreal: heh
06:13 PM _unreal: I just wish they had not fucked up the PSU supply on the boards design...
06:13 PM _unreal: you have to unplug everything a times. its totally random. to get it to boot and not boot cycle endlessly
06:14 PM _unreal: 500 megs downloaded so far
06:14 PM _unreal: sigh
06:14 PM _unreal: ! I wonder if buster might support my usb netwrk card?
06:15 PM _unreal: Bus 002 Device 003: ID 0846:9011 NetGear, Inc. WNDA3100v2 802.11abgn [Broadcom BCM4323]
06:15 PM _unreal: stretch just does not want to support it
06:16 PM _unreal: when the iso downloads I think I'm gonig to do a multiburn, and add the PDF files for my 7i96 and motor controllers to it :)
06:22 PM _unreal: I dont get this it says its going at 500k a second download and it says its got 1.5 hours left to download and its now upto 600megs downloaded
06:23 PM _unreal: that does not add up
06:33 PM _unreal: god its been months since the last time I burned any kind of a disk.
06:34 PM _unreal: hehe from 1997-2k10 i was endlessly burning disks, CDs dvd's after that time divorce etc... WOW did my disk burning drop off
06:35 PM _unreal: everybudy go home?
06:39 PM Tom_L: yeah we left once you started working on it
06:39 PM _unreal: heh
06:39 PM _unreal: just blows me away, I was expecting next week to be able to start putting money into my stocks to recover them and start making money again
06:39 PM _unreal: NOPE
06:40 PM _unreal: screwed again
06:40 PM Tom_L: problem i have is every linux box in here is test and they change constantly
06:40 PM _unreal: ?
06:40 PM _unreal: hum
06:40 PM _unreal: sigh 25min left on the downlioad
06:40 PM _unreal: thinking I may make chicken tonight for the kid and i
06:40 PM Tom_L: you must have a slow link
06:41 PM _unreal: it says is going at 500k a second
06:41 PM _unreal: and it said 1.5 hours for ever
06:42 PM _unreal: bouncing between 130k and 800k
06:42 PM _unreal: killing me
06:42 PM _unreal: now its back to the 209 range
06:43 PM _unreal: I assume you where doing the same lots of disk burning in the late 90/ early 2k's and tapered off after that time frame
06:44 PM Tom_L: wow
06:44 PM roycroft: i just found an old (wwii-ish) spear & jackson saw at the goodwill for $2.99
06:45 PM Tom_L: 3.xx MB/sec
06:45 PM roycroft: minus my old person discount
06:45 PM Tom_L: must be livin right
06:45 PM roycroft: those saws go for about $100 in decent condition, and this one is in excellent condition
06:45 PM roycroft: it just needs to be jointed and sharpened
06:45 PM roycroft: and cleaned up a wee bit
06:45 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: did you round up to $4 or $5?
06:46 PM roycroft: i did not round up
06:46 PM roycroft: i always respectfully decline
06:46 PM roycroft: the money i spend at their store funds their program
06:46 PM _unreal: hay some low life could have used that pocket change
06:46 PM CaptHindsight: some countys you kin an sum yah cants
06:46 PM _unreal: heh
06:46 PM roycroft: and i give money to several charities without any exchange of goods
06:46 PM CaptHindsight: no pressure :)
06:46 PM Tom_L: you got em standing all over your street corners too?
06:47 PM roycroft: i don't give money to roadside beggars either
06:47 PM CaptHindsight: Hitler would have made them work or shot them all
06:47 PM roycroft: but i do give money to cahoots, who help the unhoused
06:47 PM CaptHindsight: similar for Stalin
06:47 PM Tom_L: i bet there was less 'unorganized' crime then
06:47 PM roycroft: most of them are physically and/or mentally disabled
06:48 PM CaptHindsight: you would also have been shot for disagreeing with his "master plan"
06:48 PM CaptHindsight: oh he shot them to
06:48 PM roycroft: a large number of them are vets who were thrown out on the streets and forgotten as reward for their service
06:49 PM Tom_L: happens alot
06:49 PM CaptHindsight: good thing we take care of out vets here......
06:49 PM roycroft: we love and protect the unborn and those serving our country
06:49 PM CaptHindsight: out/our
06:49 PM _unreal: GOD... and to think back in the dialup days 500k would be beyond amazing for a download speed
06:49 PM _unreal: you know I prob have used my phone to do the downloiad instead of using my internet provideer
06:49 PM _unreal: LOL
06:49 PM roycroft: yet once born or finishing their service, we leave them to fend for themselves
06:50 PM _unreal: I bet it would have downloaded even faster
06:50 PM Tom_L: _unreal, i still have a 300 baud modem in a pile somewhere here if you need one
06:50 PM CaptHindsight: oh lord jesus and his 12 carpenter friends, may his downloads succeed, amen
06:50 PM _unreal: heh
06:50 PM _unreal: I still have my 56k external modem somewhere
06:50 PM Tom_L: damn CaptHindsight that bumped my dl up to 6M/s :D
06:51 PM _unreal: I know I pumped at least 100gigs though that modem during its tenure
06:51 PM _unreal: be it gaming or ISO downloading
06:51 PM Tom_L: s/damn/golly
06:51 PM roycroft: back before the public internet, i used to take a full usenet feed + email over a uucp connection
06:51 PM _unreal: arg.. back to 200k
06:51 PM roycroft: and all in the middle of the night
06:52 PM roycroft: using my telebit trailblazer modem
06:52 PM _unreal: ya there was a BBS in my area back in maine
06:52 PM Tom_L: mine is nearly done
06:52 PM _unreal: I think they shut the BBS down in 2k1
06:52 PM roycroft: sprint had a service called 'telenet'
06:52 PM Tom_L: i had a friend that ran one
06:52 PM roycroft: basically, there were local indial numbers all over the country
06:53 PM roycroft: and during off hours (i think it was 9pm to 6am) one could dial in, and get dialtone in any of about 20 major cities in the us
06:53 PM roycroft: so i was living in northwest washington
06:53 PM _unreal: ya thats what I did for a short time. then got a normal dial provider. thats around the time online gaming really took off for comptuers anyways
06:53 PM roycroft: and my uucp feed was just outside chicago
06:53 PM roycroft: using the telenet service i was able to connect as though it were a local call
06:54 PM _unreal: god its raining endlessly here thats to to be messing with the internet
06:54 PM Tom_L: funny, cell service kinda did away with long distance calls
06:54 PM _unreal: ya...
06:54 PM roycroft: this was in the '80s
06:54 PM _unreal: I think a lot of that had to do with the fact that people could use software to do all the same stuff
06:54 PM Tom_L: roycroft, i know, i was there too
06:55 PM roycroft: i was there when usenet hit 512 groups and broke bnews
06:55 PM _unreal: heh 80's I had an 8t88 or something like that
06:55 PM snakedGT is now known as snaked
06:55 PM roycroft: the entire net scrambled to install cnews
06:55 PM roycroft: and while it did not affect me, i got the morris worm on my xenix machine
06:56 PM _unreal: what did that one do"
06:56 PM roycroft: i was running xenix on a 286 at the time
06:56 PM _unreal: ?
06:56 PM roycroft: it was the first computer virus
06:56 PM roycroft: and it was basically an unintentional denial of service attack
06:57 PM _unreal: hum I remember having a 486 was my parents. and having to do a school project, they left me home over the weekend and went visiting to fam. I was doing what ever on the computer and it just shut down on me. got what ever virus that wiped out the HD boot sector.
06:57 PM roycroft: it used a sendmail exploit
06:57 PM _unreal: sigh.. 1.4gigs downloaded so far
06:57 PM roycroft: and btw, i still use sendmail on my mail servers
06:57 PM roycroft: it's gotten better :)
06:57 PM _unreal: o,O
06:58 PM Tom_L: ok it's all tucked away when i'm up to installing buster again
06:58 PM Tom_L: you're a little over halfway
06:59 PM _unreal: I still need to finish downloading SIGH
06:59 PM roycroft: i should go inspect my new saw and see if i can eek another 1/2" of height out of my garage door opening
06:59 PM _unreal: KEEPS dropping to 100k range
06:59 PM _unreal: ?
06:59 PM Tom_L: sure you can, just push it harder
06:59 PM _unreal: heh
07:00 PM _unreal: people at work have bandsaw envy over my nice industryal bandsaw
07:00 PM _unreal: I love that thing
07:00 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.vice.com/en/article/pky7km/usenet-archive-utzoo-online
07:00 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: ^^
07:00 PM CaptHindsight: search for your old posts :)
07:00 PM _unreal: roycroft, got a phone of said goodwill score yet?
07:01 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.usenetarchives.com/
07:02 PM _unreal: jesus now its down to 20k range
07:02 PM _unreal: wonder if its my connection or the server?
07:02 PM _unreal: again lighting storms all day today who knows
07:02 PM Tom_L: put more quarters in the slot
07:02 PM _unreal: cant I'm broke
07:04 PM Tom_L: it's not the server
07:04 PM Tom_L: i started mine when you were well into getting yours
07:05 PM _unreal: brb getting my phone see if I can download it faster just or the fuck of it
07:05 PM roycroft: well that saw is a bit newer than i thought - it's from about 1960, not wwii
07:06 PM roycroft: but that's ok - while disston were starting to go downhill by then, spear & jackson were still making high quality sawe in sheffield
07:06 PM Tom_L: a place i worked in a previous lifetime had ww2 50cal tooling in their tool room
07:06 PM roycroft: and the really good news it that it looks like it's never been sharpened
07:06 PM roycroft: it's a bit dull
07:06 PM roycroft: but nobody has messed up the teeth
07:07 PM roycroft: so i should be able to make it like new quite easily
07:07 PM _unreal: ok just started the download on my phone, already at 50megs
07:07 PM CaptHindsight: "Should we Shoot it?" at 8:00 followed by "Blowed Up Real Good" at 9
07:09 PM * Tom_L will check in tomorrow when _unreal's dl finishes
07:10 PM CaptHindsight: Triple Jesus, come on download!!!
07:10 PM _unreal: OMG my phone says 16min left on the download
07:10 PM Tom_L: you got a dvd burner on your phone?
07:10 PM _unreal: I can
07:11 PM JavaBean: why not just nextcloud/opencloud it to your pc?
07:11 PM _unreal: and tom its schedualed for sunday completion
07:11 PM _unreal: lol
07:11 PM Tom_L: just plug your phone in the usb and install it from there :)
07:12 PM _unreal: the lcnc machine is at 1.6gigs sofar
07:12 PM _unreal: 600megs on the phone
07:14 PM CaptHindsight: Mary Mary, why yah bugging, go download!
07:16 PM _unreal: phone 1.2 gigs
07:16 PM _unreal: puter 1.7
07:16 PM _unreal: phone says 13min left
07:16 PM JavaBean: must be having a nice 4g signal on your phone... i wish i could get that kind of reception on my 4g modem
07:16 PM _unreal: I think its pulling like 3-4m a sec
07:17 PM _unreal: I have 4 out of 5 bars
07:17 PM roycroft: the city where i work (when i go down there) has 3g in most of the city now
07:17 PM _unreal: heh
07:17 PM _unreal: is that an upgrade?
07:17 PM CaptHindsight: we interrupt this download for this short commercial message
07:17 PM roycroft: at&t have been doing some upgrading
07:17 PM roycroft: yes
07:17 PM roycroft: that is an upgrade
07:18 PM _unreal: LOL HAHAHAHAH
07:18 PM roycroft: where i live i have 4g
07:18 PM roycroft: in between where i live and where i work there are several dead zones with 0g
07:18 PM roycroft: about 2/3 of my commute is areas with no cell service
07:19 PM roycroft: this is the commute that i have not made on a regular basis in over 8 months
07:19 PM roycroft: although i did go down there today
07:19 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: no Verizon?
07:19 PM roycroft: my ipad is on at&t and my cell phone is on sprint
07:19 PM _unreal: when I drop my daughter off to her mothers I hit ONE area where I loose sevice
07:19 PM _unreal: for a few
07:19 PM roycroft: neither work in those areas
07:19 PM XXCoder: is andy master machinist?
07:20 PM roycroft: i rather enjoy being where the electronics don't work
07:20 PM XXCoder: i just watched him do really tricky milling a thread on really complex angle, recutting a existing thread
07:20 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: you mean his nik somewhere?
07:20 PM roycroft: i just found my saw in a 1961 s&j catalog
07:20 PM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PvBrDdwYTfw
07:20 PM _unreal: hum puter says 8-12min let phone says 6min
07:20 PM _unreal: hehe
07:20 PM roycroft: are you talking about andy pugh, xxcoder?
07:21 PM XXCoder: yeah
07:21 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: that is him speaking in English
07:21 PM roycroft: he knows how to do some stuff in a machine shop
07:21 PM roycroft: he's not an internet machinist
07:21 PM JavaBean: finding an exit is something you can do in a machine shop
07:22 PM roycroft: you'd be surprised, javabean
07:22 PM XXCoder: roy internet machinist?
07:22 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: when you study science and math you can figure stuff out like that
07:22 PM CaptHindsight: actual facts
07:23 PM XXCoder: capt im not sure what youre saying lol
07:23 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: he never prays for guidance
07:23 PM XXCoder: nether do I lol. im an atheist
07:24 PM CaptHindsight: just thinkin and reckonin
07:25 PM _unreal: going to be tight I dont know what one is going to win at this point, my puter or my phone
07:25 PM _unreal: puter may take it, finally picked back up 500k
07:26 PM CaptHindsight: the lord works in mysterious ways
07:26 PM _unreal: heh GOD THEY ARE neck in neck
07:26 PM CaptHindsight: it worked!
07:26 PM XXCoder: this lord? https://www.dictionary.com/e/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Lord-Farquaad-300x300.jpg
07:27 PM _unreal: cap?
07:27 PM CaptHindsight: Lord of the Dance
07:27 PM _unreal: phone says 55 seconds, puter says 5min again and its 99% done
07:28 PM CaptHindsight: I cast the download demons outttah!!
07:28 PM _unreal: I think the phone is going tot ake it
07:28 PM _unreal: 12 seconds left on phone
07:28 PM roycroft: i have that same ikea light on my mill
07:28 PM CaptHindsight: radio Jesus wins!
07:28 PM _unreal: phone done
07:29 PM _unreal: phone won
07:29 PM _unreal: sigh.. I'd transfer it but by the time I get the cable and transfer it the other download will bedone
07:29 PM _unreal: o,O maybe
07:30 PM CaptHindsight: patients are a virtue
07:31 PM JavaBean: you think you are pretty punny, huh.
07:32 PM CaptHindsight: just blessin the bits
07:32 PM JavaBean: i thought you were supposed to curse the bits, and bless the scsi chain
07:35 PM CaptHindsight: just wasted 2X the server bandwidth for that
07:35 PM CaptHindsight: the lord is not efficient
07:36 PM JavaBean: well, he now has 2 copies. whichever has the correct sha512 is the one to burn onto a disc
07:37 PM CaptHindsight: prolly shudah not broken the last install
07:37 PM CaptHindsight: not his bandwidth so not shits were given
07:37 PM JavaBean: it takes a bit of doing to break a linux install... its not like windows
07:38 PM CaptHindsight: have you met people?
07:38 PM JavaBean: i have dealt with plenty of (l)users
07:39 PM JavaBean: everytime i have dealt with them lately, i have pondered how it is they haven't nuked their windows yet
07:41 PM CaptHindsight: i could not work in tech support
07:41 PM _unreal: well time to go reboot/reinstall
07:41 PM JavaBean: i didn't last long
07:42 PM XXCoder: hell desk work is hell
07:42 PM _unreal: ok cnc HAL saved. rebooting installing buster
07:43 PM JavaBean: http://bofh.bjash.com/ nsfw(/me snerks)
07:43 PM XXCoder: new ones is still being written
07:43 PM CaptHindsight: one might argue that Debian comes pre broken, not nearly as much as Windows or ubuntu
07:44 PM JavaBean: considering how often i crash windows with ff... your argument is not valid
07:45 PM CaptHindsight: still have CAD on Win7
07:45 PM JavaBean: atleast win7 had a useful bsod
07:45 PM CaptHindsight: haven't made the jump to 10 yet
07:46 PM JavaBean: win10 proved to be less able to handle my normal use than win7 was
07:47 PM XXCoder: maybe https://www.pcerror-fix.com/windows-10-services-to-disable-for-gaming would help
07:47 PM XXCoder: many of gaming optizations would work for for cad also
07:47 PM JavaBean: i really don't get why people like win10 so much... extremely unstable for me
07:47 PM XXCoder: none of windows was unstable for me
07:47 PM XXCoder: closest thing is windows me
07:48 PM XXCoder: and i got maybe total of 4 bsod
07:48 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: someone here did similar, it worked for quite while before eventually catching some bug
07:48 PM XXCoder: not by "any windows" i mean up to 7. i moved to linux then
07:48 PM JavaBean: for me if i really used win10 like i use linux, i would get a bsod every few hours
07:48 PM CaptHindsight: was trying to figure out how many win10 installs we need per machine for all the apps
07:49 PM CaptHindsight: we get issues with DRM with all the license servers and keys etc
07:50 PM CaptHindsight: vs win10 on virtualbox
07:54 PM JavaBean: DRM is its own trashfire
08:00 PM _unreal: sup
08:00 PM _unreal: ok all upgraded to 2.8
08:00 PM _unreal: time to make din for the kind
08:00 PM _unreal: kid
08:01 PM JavaBean: thats awful kind of you, must be your kid
08:01 PM roycroft: i got another 3/8"
08:01 PM roycroft: i'm 1/8" short
08:01 PM roycroft: and i don't think i can get any more
08:03 PM XXCoder: ?
08:04 PM roycroft: i'm trying to get more height through my garage door so that i can roll a machine in and out at will
08:04 PM roycroft: i'm adjusting the limit switches on the opener
08:04 PM CaptHindsight: lower the floor?
08:04 PM roycroft: i need 77" for the machine in want to get
08:04 PM roycroft: i was at 70-1/2" yesterday
08:04 PM JavaBean: take the door off
08:04 PM roycroft: i'm at 76-7/8" now
08:05 PM roycroft: but i think i'm at the absolute limit
08:05 PM XXCoder: take door frame off
08:05 PM roycroft: this is not for moving the machine in
08:05 PM CaptHindsight: concrete grinder
08:05 PM roycroft: i can lay it down to do that
08:05 PM JavaBean: the rolling door would still be in the way, xxcoder
08:05 PM roycroft: it's for rolling it in and out whenever i want
08:05 PM roycroft: the problem is that it's not a rolling door
08:06 PM roycroft: it's a flat, single piece door
08:06 PM roycroft: i could replace the door and gain some more height
08:06 PM XXCoder: hmmm
08:06 PM roycroft: but that would cost me over $1k
08:06 PM roycroft: i don't want to do that
08:06 PM CaptHindsight: shave some off the door
08:06 PM roycroft: there is a lip on the bottom of the door
08:06 PM jdh: shave off some of the floor
08:06 PM roycroft: and i have considered cutting part of that out
08:07 PM CaptHindsight: can you make the machine shorter?
08:07 PM roycroft: possibly
08:07 PM roycroft: it's in the mix of things i'm considering
08:07 PM roycroft: getting the door to open as much as possible is the first step
08:07 PM roycroft: so i know what i'm working with
08:08 PM CaptHindsight: #50 grit on floor, slide it across a few times
08:08 PM JavaBean: just don't forget the height of whatever "moving mechanism" you are using
08:08 PM roycroft: it's the installed height, including the casters
08:08 PM roycroft: i already know that
08:08 PM CaptHindsight: smaller wheels
08:08 PM roycroft: no
08:08 PM roycroft: it would be too hard to move
08:08 PM * JavaBean has a good laugh, remembers what his friend managed to do before
08:09 PM XXCoder: is casters drop down type?
08:09 PM roycroft: i've often thought about getting rid of the overhead garage door completely and replacing it with a pair of accordian style doors
08:09 PM XXCoder: ie once moved you hit lever and it deps down to land
08:09 PM roycroft: with a person door in one of them
08:09 PM roycroft: but that's probably more like $2k
08:10 PM roycroft: although if i did that i would not need the full width to open
08:10 PM XXCoder: could use old style baorn doors? ie it just opens outward
08:10 PM XXCoder: very cheap
08:10 PM roycroft: and could frame in part of the garage front to get some more usable floor space
08:10 PM roycroft: the casters don't drop down
08:10 PM _unreal: sand down the wheels roycroft
08:10 PM XXCoder: would need open mode lockdown though
08:10 PM roycroft: 1/8" is something i can probably figure out how to deal with
08:10 PM XXCoder: so wind dont slam door on you
08:11 PM roycroft: but framing in the door opening might be the best bet
08:11 PM roycroft: and i really would not need huge doors - 48" would be plenty wide for anything in need to move in or out
08:11 PM roycroft: and would give me a lot of extra interior wall space
08:11 PM XXCoder: yeah i did say framing earlier :)
08:11 PM CaptHindsight: 50 grit on top of machine and pull hard
08:11 PM roycroft: i'm going to go do one more thing to try to get that 1/8"
08:12 PM roycroft: then it's time to make dinner
08:12 PM XXCoder: how wide is it on top anyway? can always add a notch where you can make into temp removable and return when done
08:12 PM roycroft: the lip on the bottom of the door is made of rolled sheet metal
08:13 PM CaptHindsight: screw jacks on both sides of door
08:13 PM roycroft: i could certainly cut a notch out of it as wide as the machine opening needs to be and weld some flat bar in to reinforce it
08:13 PM roycroft: the lip is about 1-1/2" wide
08:13 PM CaptHindsight: should be easy
08:13 PM roycroft: so cutting 1/8" out would not be a problem
08:13 PM roycroft: it has a rolled lip to stiffen it, and i'd have to cut that lip off
08:13 PM roycroft: but as i said, i could weld some flat bar in as a "header" to strengthen it
08:14 PM XXCoder: yeah. you could add bolt on sheet to cover the notch when you dont need it
08:14 PM CaptHindsight: attached garage?
08:14 PM roycroft: yes
08:14 PM roycroft: and i would not need a filler
08:14 PM jdh: obviously time for a new, bigger, taller, better shop building
08:14 PM roycroft: the lip that i would cut into is parallel with the floor when the door is closed
08:15 PM roycroft: so it would not be visible from the outside
08:15 PM roycroft: i was almost better off before i started making adjustments
08:15 PM roycroft: being 6-1/2" short is one thing
08:15 PM roycroft: but to get within 1/8" and lose is quite another
08:16 PM XXCoder: sounds workable
08:17 PM CaptHindsight: cut the slab, lift, scoop out 1/2", replace slab
08:19 PM CaptHindsight: or https://youtu.be/m9hRkRGUBSw?t=63
08:24 PM skunkworks: toyota is back on the road. again.
08:26 PM XXCoder: yay. again
08:27 PM skunkworks: it got hit in the drivers side front fender.. again
08:27 PM skunkworks: primer red but runs
08:29 PM _unreal: smells sooo good.
08:29 PM _unreal: food almost done cooking
08:30 PM roycroft: life is good
08:30 PM roycroft: i just bent that lip up a bit
08:30 PM roycroft: and got my 1/8"
08:31 PM roycroft: of course, unless/until i get the machine and mount it on the casters i won't know what i really need
08:31 PM roycroft: because the manufacturer's specs might lie
08:31 PM XXCoder: roy even better!
08:31 PM roycroft: but at least i got what i think i need
08:31 PM XXCoder: can get more?
08:31 PM roycroft: i'm really leaning towards not buying a new bandsaw anyway
08:31 PM roycroft: only the tiniest bit
08:31 PM CaptHindsight: skunkworks: new old fender or did you pound it back in to shape?
08:33 PM roycroft: if i build a new base for my current band saw, install the 2hp motor i have as a spare, get a vfd for it, and get a decent aftermarket fence i may have something i'm happy with for a long time, at very little cost
08:34 PM roycroft: $150 for the vfd, $150 for the fence, and $50 for materials for the new base
08:34 PM roycroft: maybe another $50 for some sheaves and a belt
08:34 PM _unreal: ARG.. installing software again
08:34 PM _unreal: 7z, hexchat, other software
08:34 PM _unreal: ARG.
08:35 PM roycroft: and i think have a 1-1/2hp single phase motor laying around as well
08:35 PM roycroft: which might do the job
08:35 PM roycroft: i'm not planning on doing wide resawing all the time
08:35 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/24/close-to-100-accuracy-airport-enlists-sniffer-dogs-to-test-for-covid-19
08:36 PM veegee: My workshop has a water line which supplies water to the fire sprinklers up top. That pipe has a valve and would be very easy to add a take off point because it's near the back door
08:36 PM veegee: Is it legal to do that? Or is there something that if water flow is detected in that line, it would alert the fire department?
08:36 PM Tom_L: no
08:37 PM veegee: No it's not legal?
08:37 PM CaptHindsight: your country may vary
08:37 PM Tom_L: they'll come running all lit up
08:37 PM veegee: Yeah better not mess with it I guess
08:37 PM skunkworks: CaptHindsight: you can get a brand new fender for like $70 Needed a new bumper cover too - about the same price=
08:37 PM roycroft: it's not legal anywhere i know of
08:37 PM CaptHindsight: but if it's after the flow sensor it should trigger the fire brigade
08:37 PM veegee: Looks like I'll have to run a pex tube from the incoming water line
08:38 PM XXCoder: even if its before it might cause underflow
08:38 PM skunkworks: it lined up suprisingly well
08:38 PM roycroft: the local fire brigade will not automatically dispatch if you do that
08:38 PM skunkworks: for a 2006
08:38 PM skunkworks: 230k miles with the origonal clutch
08:38 PM veegee: It's going to be for a pressure washer. Not sure what PEX inner diameter tube I should use
08:38 PM roycroft: but it is a code violation everywhere in the universe where the building code is designed to actually make buildings safer
08:38 PM veegee: yeah makes sense
08:39 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: my water supply is connected upstream from his :)
08:39 PM XXCoder: ok?
08:39 PM CaptHindsight: skunkworks: 4runner?
08:39 PM skunkworks: corolla
08:39 PM skunkworks: corrola?
08:40 PM Tom_L: corroda
08:40 PM skunkworks: the kid were so happy that it is running again. my 8yo daughter says the smell of the car makes her happy.
08:41 PM skunkworks: Think I need a batery.. I don't think it is keeping a charge
08:42 PM Tom_L: better get it before winter
08:42 PM skunkworks: sure
08:42 PM Tom_L: that's when they die
08:42 PM skunkworks: I think it went dead while it was sitting...
08:43 PM skunkworks: hooked it up to a charger and it took a while before it started taking current
09:01 PM skunkworks: http://electronicsam.com/images/greenmachine/IMG_20201016_205753.jpg
09:02 PM _unreal: ok dinner is over and back to getting software installed, just starting the 7i96 setup install
09:02 PM Tom_L: why do you need that now? you got a config to work with
09:04 PM skunkworks: 2nd time i needed to repace the headlight assemply on that side
09:07 PM _unreal: I'm installing it so that incase I have an issue I can just open it and edit it
09:07 PM _unreal: easy
09:08 PM _unreal: and quick
09:08 PM _unreal: OMG... everyhing is downloading slow tonight
09:09 PM Tom_L: once you edit the file, the config tool is useless
09:35 PM _unreal_: still getting the same error
09:35 PM _unreal_: to late at this point to continu on
09:35 PM _unreal_: to tired as far as the cnc machine/puter goes
09:35 PM _unreal_: tomorow going to try again
09:36 PM _unreal_: but at least the software is updated
09:45 PM roycroft: note to the universe: "CNCing" is not a word in the english language family, because there is no such verb "to CNC"
09:45 PM * roycroft is becoming annoyed at the verbiage some folks use in forum posts
09:47 PM CaptHindsight: me emebraces the evolution of English
09:48 PM roycroft: i am old, and have lived through a lot of changes in language during my life
09:48 PM Tom_L: or the butchery of it
09:48 PM roycroft: many of them are good
09:48 PM roycroft: some not so much
09:48 PM CaptHindsight: keeps changin
09:48 PM roycroft: "CNCing" falls in the latter category
09:49 PM CaptHindsight: I only get worked up over important stuff
09:49 PM roycroft: i'm not worked up
09:49 PM Tom_L: you sayin CNCing isn't important@!
09:49 PM roycroft: i'm just making a statement
09:49 PM roycroft: i'll let you know when i'm worked up about something :)
09:49 PM Tom_L: yeah we know :)
09:50 PM CaptHindsight: was watching British TV earlier
09:50 PM CaptHindsight: commas vs decimal points
09:50 PM CaptHindsight: barbarians!
09:51 PM CaptHindsight: had to suffer with rap and hiphop since the 80's, like a joke that never died
09:52 PM roycroft: beethoven is 200 years old this year
09:52 PM CaptHindsight: nope I think he is still dead
09:52 PM roycroft: kwax are playing every note he ever wrote over the course of the year
09:52 PM roycroft: so i've been listening to a lot of him lately
09:53 PM roycroft: i don't think if he were alive today he'd be much into rap or hip-hop
09:53 PM roycroft: mozart, on the other hand, would probably love it
09:54 PM roycroft: er, beethoven is 250, not 200
09:54 PM CaptHindsight: two of my favorite dead composers
09:55 PM roycroft: i like both of them
09:55 PM roycroft: i like a lot of more contemporary composers as well
09:55 PM CaptHindsight: copeland
09:56 PM roycroft: debussy, shostakovich, bernstein, stravinsky
09:56 PM roycroft: yes, copeland was also a great composer
09:56 PM CaptHindsight: never forget https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlWpPQWdqFk
09:57 PM roycroft: oh, i'll not forget that
09:58 PM roycroft: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrCxIb34Hs4
09:58 PM roycroft: but there's also that
10:00 PM CaptHindsight: Shoo fly Pie And Apple Pan Dowdy - Dinah Shore vs Bing Crosby
10:00 PM CaptHindsight: or the Perry Como version
10:02 PM roycroft: he's so relaxed
10:04 PM CaptHindsight: don't forget mahler
10:04 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: 10,000 Japanese performance https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6s6YKlTpfw
10:09 PM CaptHindsight: or those crazy punk days https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Af7ayYIJ9w
10:17 PM CaptHindsight: ancient melodies that progressed into classical
10:18 PM CaptHindsight: folk music from around the world
10:19 PM CaptHindsight: Jazz, Swing, Rock and then whatever the hell pop is now
10:22 PM CaptHindsight: music for 13 year old girls seems to be played everywhere
10:23 PM roycroft: there has always been bad music
10:23 PM roycroft: over time it is forgotten
10:23 PM roycroft: the good stuff endures
10:23 PM roycroft: 100 years from now people will remember the good music from this era
10:25 PM renesis: jazz swing and rock were pop
10:25 PM CaptHindsight: yes
10:26 PM CaptHindsight: and are art
10:26 PM renesis: most pop is still formulaic rock
10:26 PM renesis: what and hip hop and electronic music arent or something?
10:27 PM CaptHindsight: quite a business
10:27 PM renesis: but jazz swing and rock werent/arent?
10:28 PM CaptHindsight: sure, was taken over by business
10:28 PM renesis: also a lot of electronic music doesnt make shit for the producers, hard to argue its just business when they make the little money they do off live performances
10:30 PM renesis: also damn near all art is business, most well known art was made by artists who were socially capable enough to sling their work to the rich fucks
10:30 PM roycroft: and this is nothing new
10:30 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMSucLLmPwU performance art crossovers
10:30 PM roycroft: it goes back millennia
10:30 PM CaptHindsight: remixing
10:31 PM renesis: ew is almost all disco beat house :( :( :(
10:32 PM renesis: some mumbatone, neat i guess
10:32 PM roycroft: teh disco was fine
10:32 PM roycroft: teh leisure suits, not so much
10:33 PM CaptHindsight: it was the video projected than the music
10:35 PM CaptHindsight: artists in their later stages yes tend to be a business, even more after they are gone
10:36 PM renesis: okay but they dont gotta be doing it with slow ass house beats
10:38 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgCZN1rU5co just for fun
10:39 PM renesis: this is okay
10:39 PM CaptHindsight: late 70's English Ska
10:39 PM renesis: i saw them like 6 years ago, randomly playing by the hotel on a business trip
10:40 PM renesis: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Dnm_GwlnIU
10:40 PM CaptHindsight: it was interesting
10:40 PM CaptHindsight: like japanese punk or rock-n-roll
10:40 PM renesis: ^ arguably from the same jamaican dancehall culture
10:41 PM CaptHindsight: their culture overlaid on another genera
10:41 PM renesis: brits steal good culture and do things with it
10:45 PM CaptHindsight: heh genre
10:46 PM CaptHindsight: I'm done took 8 tries to spell that