#linuxcnc Logs

Oct 11 2020

01:53 AM Centurion-Dan2 is now known as Centurion_Dan
02:18 AM Deejay: moin
05:32 AM JT-Cave: morning
06:13 AM Tom_L: morning
06:14 AM XXCoder: heys
06:20 AM veek: what are these things called https://i.imgur.com/TM9gqxf.png
06:20 AM veek: (video that has emm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Az87Q0JedG4)
06:21 AM XXCoder: no idea
06:28 AM Tom_L: light poles
06:33 AM veek: Tom_L, ah yep - that does bring up similar images.. I tried 'flanged circular hollow sections' and got the spec brochure thingy though
07:44 AM JT-Cave: also used for traffic lights
08:30 AM flyback-: BMCC
08:30 AM * flyback- bites buzzmarshall
08:30 AM flyback-: eh?-hole!
08:30 AM buzzmarshall: lol
08:31 AM flyback-: damn canadians
08:32 AM buzzmarshall: yep were the worst
08:37 AM jymmmm: morning
08:38 AM buzzmarshall: morning
08:42 AM flyback-: morning
08:42 AM flyback-: CANUCK
09:57 AM _unreal_: ok at this point its all wired up. next phase is getting the software setup
09:57 AM _unreal_: and the 7i96 setup.
09:58 AM _unreal_: just did a power up test. and nothing burned so next phase is software
09:58 AM _unreal_: time to go clean the car
12:56 PM roycroft: hello, folks
12:56 PM roycroft: i am looking at my project pipeline, and have determined that it is finally time for me to complete the cnc conversion of my mill-drill, or build a cnc router
12:57 PM roycroft: a project i started years ago
12:57 PM roycroft: i'm kind of at the place where it stalled, still
12:58 PM roycroft: the problem is that i do not have a lot of space in my shop, so building a cnc router would have to find a place to live
12:58 PM roycroft: yet i need to be able to machine wood and wood composite materials upon occasion, and am not sure if that would work well on the mill-drill
01:05 PM roycroft: as well, i shall need to machine quite a number of parts out of 1/2"/12mm aluminium plate, and i'm not sure if that's feasible with a cnc router
01:05 PM roycroft: if anyone has any insights on using the mill-drill for machining wood (2d/2.5d) or using a cnc router for plate that thick i'd appreciate it
01:05 PM roycroft: and i apologise for the on-topic post :)
01:05 PM roycroft: i have most of the parts for the mill-drill conversion - the major components i'm lacking are the ball screws
01:05 PM roycroft: and i have ball screws that i could use for a cnc router
01:05 PM roycroft: but i could always sell those or save them for some future use
01:05 PM roycroft: i have no other linear motion components for a cnc router, so i'd have to come up with something for that
01:10 PM JavaBean: how dare you post something on topic roy croft... let us go back to just kinda blogging in here
01:12 PM roycroft: i like to mix it up
01:12 PM Rab: JavaBean, how is it on topic? For all we know roycroft is planning to use Mach4.
01:13 PM JavaBean: you aren't wrong, its something HE would do
01:13 PM Tom_L: naw, grbl on an arduino
01:13 PM roycroft: it will be lcnc
01:13 PM JavaBean: don't know that he would swoop THAT low
01:14 PM roycroft: and i bought some mesa boards for the project a long time ago
01:14 PM JavaBean: then i reiterate my scolding about posting things "on-topic"
01:15 PM roycroft: if the router idea is the only thing that makes sense, i may have a way to do that
01:15 PM roycroft: i'm pondering getting an 8'x10' metal shed
01:15 PM Tom_L: better 16 x 20
01:15 PM roycroft: i am at my legal max for outbuildings, but in this pandemic, code enforcement folks are not going out at all
01:16 PM roycroft: and i would erect it in a place where it's not visible off property
01:16 PM roycroft: so i'm pretty sure i could get away with it
01:16 PM Tom_L: they use drones for that now ya know
01:16 PM roycroft: if i did that i could move a bunch of stuff out of my welding shop into that shed, and clear up some floor space
01:16 PM JavaBean: they are using satalites for "code enforcement" these days
01:16 PM Rab: roycroft, how much machine work area would you need? That's a big factor between mill/router.
01:17 PM roycroft: not much, actually
01:17 PM roycroft: a little bigger footprint than the mill table would be nice, but most of what i need to do i could do on the mill table
01:17 PM roycroft: i won't be making any finished parts out of wood at all
01:17 PM roycroft: just jigs/fixtures
01:17 PM roycroft: and if i need something larger than the mill table can handle i can make it in pieces and join them together
01:18 PM roycroft: i'm concerned about the 2500rpm speed of my spindle on the mill-drill
01:18 PM roycroft: i'd probably have to mount an ancillary spindle for routing
01:18 PM roycroft: so that's an issue
01:18 PM Rab: roycroft, yeah, I was gonna mention that.
01:18 PM roycroft: and it may be a balance/vibration issue if i mount it on the side of the mill head
01:19 PM roycroft: if i'm honest, my biggest concern is wood dust/metal shavings
01:19 PM Rab: I'd rather machine aluminum plate on a mill, but the stock max speed would be low for wood.
01:19 PM roycroft: and how messy it would be if a machine generated both
01:19 PM roycroft: the plate is thick enough that i have concerns about machining it on a router
01:19 PM roycroft: although it could be done with a lot of tiny passes
01:19 PM Tom_L: and coolant on aluminum and not on wood
01:19 PM roycroft: yeah
01:20 PM roycroft: mist coolant would probably be ok
01:20 PM Rab: roycroft, you would want dust extraction and way covers. I think you would need very good dust extraction for machining aluminum on a router.
01:20 PM roycroft: but even that is kind of messy with a router
01:20 PM JavaBean: ivan miranda did a 3d printed cnc that was able to due alu plate... i think it was 12mm and thicker he was cutting.
01:20 PM JavaBean: er, 3d printed, cnc router
01:20 PM roycroft: another option, that would get expensive, might be to not use the machine for wood at all
01:21 PM Rab: Because the router won't be heavy enough for deep passes. So lots of shallow cuts, fine chips accumulating over many passes and welding to the tool.
01:21 PM roycroft: and whenever i need a wooden jig/fixture that i can't easily make by hand, i would make an aluminium template and use the template to route the wooden thing
01:21 PM roycroft: yes, that's a big concern, rab
01:22 PM roycroft: and i had briefly thought about using ss instead of aluminium
01:22 PM roycroft: that would take care of the gummy problem
01:22 PM roycroft: but it would introduce an order of magnitude of other problems
01:22 PM roycroft: not to mention the parts would be way more expensive
01:23 PM roycroft: my sense that i really need to build two machines to do this properly is already being confirmed
01:23 PM Tom_L: aluminum is alot easier to machine than stainless
01:23 PM Tom_L: and less hard on tools
01:23 PM Rab: I don't know about SS taking care of gumminess.
01:23 PM roycroft: oh, it would not be gummy at all
01:23 PM roycroft: in a router, it would work harden immediately and shatter the tooling
01:23 PM roycroft: no time to gum up
01:24 PM Rab: Yeah, not gumminess per se, but it sure can grab the tool.
01:25 PM Rab: 1/2" SS plate is also bracingly expensive compared to humbler metals.
01:25 PM roycroft: a few years ago someone did a kickstarter for an open source vertically mounted cnc router
01:25 PM roycroft: maslow
01:25 PM roycroft: i wonder if that thing actually works
01:26 PM Rab: Yeah, I saw that.
01:26 PM roycroft: it could be a space saver
01:26 PM roycroft: the spindle is suspended on two wires
01:27 PM roycroft: and moves about like a ouiji board
01:27 PM Tom_L: delta cnc
01:27 PM roycroft: could lcnc handle that kind of movement?
01:27 PM roycroft: yeah
01:27 PM roycroft: i couldn't think of the name
01:27 PM roycroft: delta
01:27 PM Tom_L: of course it can
01:27 PM roycroft: so that may be an option
01:27 PM roycroft: so here's the other thing
01:27 PM roycroft: i have a nice roll-about 19" equipment cart
01:27 PM roycroft: it's from an old ibm mainframe
01:28 PM roycroft: i have a rack mount computer in it
01:28 PM roycroft: and i have a rack moutn 48v ps
01:28 PM Rab: If you really need a 4x8' router, and don't have money or space, I guess that would be something to try. I have to wonder though about failure modes. It's basically a palm router hanging from two cables. What happens if you hit a knot or whatever and the router wants to buck?
01:28 PM roycroft: my thinking was i'd put a lcnc console on the top of it
01:28 PM roycroft: i don't need it that big
01:28 PM roycroft: and i was thinking i could build it such that it could drive two different machines, alternately
01:29 PM roycroft: not simultaneously
01:29 PM roycroft: does that make sense?
01:29 PM Rab: Or maybe they use chains, not cables.
01:29 PM Tom_L: just make 2 configs
01:29 PM roycroft: right
01:29 PM roycroft: i might not even need to recable
01:29 PM roycroft: i could just install drivers for each machine in the rack cabinet
01:29 PM roycroft: and have the lcnc config pick which ones to talk to
01:29 PM Rab: Holy cow: https://www.summet.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Fire2.jpg
01:30 PM roycroft: that blowed up real good
01:30 PM roycroft: what happened?
01:31 PM roycroft: that maslow thing could be built smaller, i'm sure
01:31 PM Rab: I don't know, it came from this review but I think it's not their machine: https://www.summet.com/blog/2018/06/12/maslow-cnc-hanging-router-review/
01:31 PM roycroft: and since i'd just be making fixtures/jigs with it, hitting knots and the like would be moot
01:31 PM roycroft: it would be used probably 100% for mdf
01:32 PM Rab: I also question the resolution and tolerances of the Maslow design.
01:32 PM roycroft: yes
01:32 PM roycroft: especially in a non-temperature controlled environment
01:32 PM Rab: https://maslowcnc.squarespace.com/updates?offset=1528931056993
01:33 PM roycroft: the cables would change length with changes in temperature
01:35 PM * roycroft is thinking more and more that he should just do the conversion on the mill-drill and see how that goes
01:35 PM Rab: "Lest you think our product is dangerous, here's a video of a Shapeoko consuming itself"
01:35 PM roycroft: if i end up making aluminium templates to make the wooden jigs/fixtures, i could use 1/4" aluminium, so it would not be all that expensive
01:36 PM roycroft: if i had an extra $2.5k to spare, that hand-operated cnc router would probably work fine
01:36 PM roycroft: but i can't cost justify that
01:36 PM Tom_L: you spent it all on your wood table !
01:36 PM roycroft: yes
01:37 PM Rab: Shaper Origin? Don't forget the special tape.
01:37 PM roycroft: and i may be buying a new band saw soon
01:37 PM roycroft: yes, and that tape is expensive
01:37 PM roycroft: and most folks seem to use an awful lot of it for every project
01:38 PM roycroft: the spindle in my mill-drill is a little sticky, and it's developed some runout, so i probably have bearings to replace in that
01:38 PM roycroft: getting that thing tightened up is probably the first step to doing any of this
01:54 PM roycroft: i still have 4 projects to complete before i can tackle the cnc conversion, but i'm trying to get a direction set for that now, so i can do research/planning/procurement during off hours, and have everything ready when the time comes to do the conversion
01:55 PM roycroft: i think all i need if i am going to convert the mill-drill are the ball screws, and then fabricating the mounts/brackets/whatever, but i should probably take inventory to be sure
01:58 PM _unreal_: roycroft, I'm getting excited because I finished all of my wiring today "" "" BUT saddly i have to leave soon to get my daughter so I wont be back till almost 9pm :(
01:58 PM _unreal_: I'm at a point now where I can just start setting up software
01:59 PM _unreal_: think I'm going to go jump into the pool though
01:59 PM _unreal_: been doing yard work and cleaning my van and other crap all day long
02:01 PM JavaBean: i want a pool, can't dig one though... might be able to gather enough sand to make a flat spot...
02:06 PM _unreal_: me being in south florida, its hard to find a property that does not already have one
02:07 PM JavaBean: desert, mountain"top" of far west texas
02:43 PM _unreal_: pcw_home, on the 7i96.. I'm planning on leaving axis driver step4 as just GPIO. I have 4 Fmd2740c motor controllers. Can the DIR or STEP pin of STEP4 drive the four enable pins on the motor controllers from one GPIO? or should I use a transistor as a buffer?
02:43 PM _unreal_: or a quad buffer in general?
03:06 PM Deejay: gn8
03:20 PM Thorhian: So, I have a chinese Servo driver for my spindle motor, and it has a pinout for some controls and outputs, but it also has modbus. I'm not sure what I should go with, especially since I am unfamiliar with modbus and how to use it LCNC, even after trying to look at the docs.
03:32 PM Tom_L: _unreal_, just use them as they are
03:32 PM Tom_L: Thorhian, linuxcnc has a few modbus drivers
03:32 PM Tom_L: you might find one that works
03:32 PM Tom_L: you might have to mod one
03:34 PM Thorhian: Are you familiar with working LCNC's modbus drivers Tom_L?
03:34 PM Tom_L: nope
03:35 PM Tom_L: but i know there are several
03:35 PM jdh: I have modbus to my spindle. it was pretty trivial
03:35 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/man/man1/hy_gt_vfd.1.html
03:35 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/man/man1/hy_vfd.1.html
03:36 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/man/man1/mitsub_vfd.1.html
03:36 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/man/man1/vfdb_vfd.1.html
03:36 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/man/man1/wj200_vfd.1.html
03:36 PM Tom_L: one of those might get you close
03:45 PM Thorhian: I just don't want to break the servo driver lol, it's why I'm a bit hesitant to just try a driver for a different VFD, especially since the only mention of what model the servo driver is "KRS 30A".
03:47 PM jdh: https://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=33543.0;attach=44811
03:51 PM pcw_home: _unreal_ you can probably drive all four enables from one output, worst case you could use Step4 and Dir4 each driving 2
03:51 PM Thorhian: jdh: That seems to be a cleaner version of the paper manual that I got with the motor and drive lol.
04:39 PM JT-Shop: burning old files of machines you built can be fun... that guy was a royal PIA and that one was fun and I can't remember building that one
04:40 PM Tom_L: cleaning house ehh?
05:01 PM JT-Shop: yea
05:09 PM roycroft: jt-shop: i don't know if you're planning on getting holdfasts for your bench or not
05:09 PM roycroft: i always knew they were great, but before this bench i never had a bench that could handle them, so i'd never used them
05:10 PM roycroft: i just drilled holes in a leg yesterday for some, and i can say already that they're probably the biggest time-saving improvement to one's work flow that is possible
05:10 PM roycroft: i'm pretty good at installing/removing clamps quickly, but the holdfast is at least 5x faster than any other kind of clamp
05:11 PM roycroft: so if you've not planned on getting any, change your plans :)
05:11 PM roycroft: at least make sure your bench can handle them
05:12 PM roycroft: i thought the new leg vise was a huge improvement, but it pales in comparison to holdfasts
05:12 PM JT-Shop: which holdfast did you get?
05:13 PM JT-Shop: I'm always amazed watching Roy Underhill using holdfasts
05:13 PM roycroft: i got phil kootz style ones, from black bear forge
05:14 PM roycroft: https://www.etsy.com/listing/643603686/workbench-holdfast-with-leaf-finial-34
05:14 PM roycroft: and i got two of them
05:15 PM roycroft: phil koontz is an alaskan, btw
05:15 PM roycroft: he made those holdfasts for years and years, before he semi-retired
05:20 PM JT-Shop: interesting design
05:21 PM JT-Shop: I wonder if Peter Ross sells the ones he makes
05:21 PM roycroft: they look really cool
05:21 PM roycroft: and being hand-forged is a big bonus - the shafts are kind of rough, which makes them nice and grabby
05:29 PM JT-Shop: https://gnipsel.com/images/customers/Foxy/spoke-lathe-04.jpg
05:31 PM Tom_L: an ancient tool with a dose of modern :)
05:32 PM JT-Shop: yup
05:32 PM Tom_L: you just converting one?
05:33 PM JT-Shop: one at a time yea
05:34 PM Tom_L: how many does he have?
05:34 PM Tom_L: i see what looks like another one
05:34 PM JT-Shop: he has 21 spoke lathes and a bunch of other equipment for woodworking
05:34 PM Tom_L: wow
05:35 PM JT-Shop: some of the spoke lathes have double spindles
05:36 PM Tom_L: #2 should be a bit easier
05:36 PM JT-Shop: time to wander up to the deck and start the barbi
05:36 PM JT-Shop: yea the second one is always a lot easier
05:37 PM Tom_L: do you try to make the parts somewhat universal for service later?
05:54 PM roycroft: speaking of roy underhill, btw
05:54 PM roycroft: has there ever been an episode of the woodwright's shop where roy did not draw blood at some point?
05:59 PM Tom_L: you don't know your limits until you spring a leak
06:00 PM roycroft: i guess roy finds his limits every day
06:00 PM roycroft: he's an edgy guy
06:15 PM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLmvAi06h4D5jNkMnAQSAPT_pual1AkNsm lol
06:15 PM XXCoder: battery operated lathe
06:16 PM XXCoder: which has ponental to be converted to cnbc
06:16 PM XXCoder: rpi4 linuxcnc, hard part would be huge mesa
06:58 PM Thorhian: Lol, or go sketchy with stepper motors driven by the RPi4's GPIO
06:58 PM XXCoder: why not it wont improve precsion
06:59 PM Thorhian: Or you could commit heresy and go with GRBL if it even supports Lathes?
06:59 PM Thorhian: LCNC on the pi would be better thoughg
06:59 PM XXCoder: you can run it on bus to somewhere ;)
06:59 PM XXCoder: perfect for emergacies as you ride you make parts needed for it lol
07:00 PM Thorhian: XD
07:00 PM XXCoder: honestly it seems to do good job
07:00 PM XXCoder: alum seems ok though can see marks
07:01 PM Thorhian: I mean, the fact it cuts aluminum is impressive enough.
07:02 PM XXCoder: oh most of video is early version
07:02 PM XXCoder: later one being better
07:44 PM skunkworks: http://electronicsam.com/images/greenmachine/Screenshot_2020-10-11_19-42-05.png
07:45 PM XXCoder: yo
08:21 PM _unreal_: arg... I need to get the wireless adapter working on the lcnc machine
08:33 PM roycroft: helloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, nurse!
08:33 PM roycroft: animaniacs are back on 20 november!
08:33 PM XXCoder: meh comic returns tend to make them more extreme and shallow
08:34 PM roycroft: we'll see
08:35 PM roycroft: pinky and the brain will be back too
08:39 PM roycroft: spielberg is directing the revival, so that's a good sign
08:40 PM roycroft: it looks like the first episode is a jurrasic park spoof
08:40 PM roycroft: which would be a play on the 22 year hiatus, i should think
08:40 PM XXCoder: nice
08:41 PM roycroft: the clip i just saw looks like classic animaniacs, but in high def and a little cleaner style
08:41 PM roycroft: yakko, wakko, and dot seem not to have changed at all
08:42 PM roycroft: this may be one of the better cartoon revivals
08:42 PM JavaBean: too soon to figure out how badly it has been neutered
08:43 PM roycroft: we'll know a lot better on 20 november
09:03 PM _unreal_: nurse?
09:07 PM linuxcnc: hello
09:07 PM linuxcnc is now known as _unreal
09:07 PM _unreal: hello
09:08 PM _unreal: so I have to use my tablet as an internet source hehe
09:08 PM _unreal: on this lcnc machine
09:08 PM _unreal: ok so I'm trying to get the 7i96 setup
09:08 PM _unreal: and trying to get the usb nic card I have working dont know why it is not working
09:09 PM _unreal: hello?
09:18 PM skunkworks: what livecd are you using?
09:24 PM _unreal: live cd ?
09:24 PM _unreal: this is an installed lcnc
09:24 PM _unreal: what ever the latest version is
09:24 PM _unreal: Linux lcnc 4.9.0-12-rt-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT RT Debian 4.9.210-1 (2020-01-20) x86_64 GNU/Linux
09:25 PM _unreal: right now I'm tying to get the 7i96 setup
09:25 PM _unreal: in 7i96 config
09:25 PM _unreal: there are a lot of settings I dont know what they are for yet
09:40 PM _unreal_: how is it
09:40 PM _unreal_: I come into the room and everyone stops talking lol
09:44 PM t4nk_freenode: ...
09:46 PM * JavaBean decides to post a link that completely silenced a discord server
09:46 PM JavaBean: https://tenor.com/view/yandere-knife-cute-anime-gif-14593966
09:46 PM * infornography ....
09:46 PM infornography: WHat have a clicked?
09:47 PM infornography: *I
09:47 PM JavaBean: its an almost perfect loop too
09:49 PM _unreal_: hum
09:51 PM _unreal_: so as I was saying I'm trying to figureout the settings
09:51 PM _unreal_: I need to get the 7i96 setup
09:51 PM Tom_L: jt wrote a config script for it
09:52 PM _unreal: ?
09:54 PM Tom_L: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/7i96/index.html
09:54 PM Tom_L: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/7i96/install.html
09:55 PM Tom_L: i haven't tried it but it might get you off to a good start
09:56 PM _unreal: is that the 7i96 config tool?
09:56 PM _unreal: I believe I have that installed already
09:56 PM _unreal: I dont know about the upgrade though?
09:56 PM _unreal: current installed version is 0.1.3
09:57 PM Tom_L: can't help with it i just knew he wrote one
09:59 PM _unreal: ok upgraded to 0.1.5
10:00 PM Tom_L: should get you a decent config to work with
10:01 PM _unreal: what is 5 step gens 4 step gens
10:01 PM _unreal: under firmware
10:03 PM Tom_L: i haven't used it sir
10:03 PM Tom_L: you have pwm gens and step gens
10:03 PM Tom_L: step gens are for steppers
10:04 PM Tom_L: aparently the card supports 5?
10:04 PM _unreal: 7i96 does yes
10:04 PM _unreal: 0,1,2,3,4
10:05 PM Tom_L: well you only need 3
10:05 PM _unreal: it only gives two choices
10:05 PM _unreal: 4 and 5
10:06 PM _unreal: 5 step gen no pwm, 4 step gen pwm
10:06 PM _unreal: I dont really know what the difference is
10:06 PM _unreal: I'm looking at adding a two axis rotory when I get the machine up and running as well so that will be nice
10:07 PM Tom_L: stepgen is for steppers pwmgen is for servos
10:07 PM Tom_L: iirc
10:07 PM _unreal: ok then I want he 5
10:07 PM _unreal: says no pwm
10:08 PM Tom_L: you don't have any do you?
10:08 PM _unreal: wish pcw_home was on line
10:08 PM _unreal: I pulled the servos, but they took quadrature input regardless
10:08 PM _unreal: I cant get them working and I have to get the machine I'm building out of the house anyways
10:09 PM _unreal: so I'm fast tracking and getting the machine working with the jumbo steppers I have that were for an other project
10:09 PM _unreal: sucks but what ever
10:09 PM Tom_L: i realize you switched to steppers so use stepgens
10:13 PM _unreal: arg... so many arguments to set that I have no idea how they affect the drivers
10:13 PM _unreal: sigh
10:14 PM _unreal_: Fmd2740c
10:14 PM Tom_L: get a basic template config and we can help tune it
10:15 PM _unreal_: just need to set it up for that driver
10:18 PM Tom_L: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Stepper_Drive_Timing
10:21 PM Tom_L: https://kenswu.zzvps.com/Function/Manual/DS_FMD2740C_EN.pdf
10:21 PM Tom_L: page 7
10:22 PM Tom_L: 150khz max min 5us pulse
10:24 PM _unreal_: hum
10:24 PM _unreal_: arg... 11:30 I have to head to bed
10:25 PM _unreal_: got to work inthe morning :(
11:15 PM jesseg: Ahh I think I got teamviewer 15 installed on Slackware. Who can let me test it on them? LOL :P (J/K)
11:30 PM CaptHindsight: wasted a few hours trying the Orange Pi installs
11:30 PM CaptHindsight: IRQ and USB Phy issues in dmesg
11:31 PM jesseg: howdy CaptHindsight
11:56 PM flyback- is now known as flyback