#linuxcnc Logs

Sep 18 2020

#linuxcnc Calendar

02:12 AM Loetmichel: mornin'
02:18 AM XXCoder: yo
04:33 AM Loetmichel: *GNAH* 54 screws and a broken "calibration void" seal on this tektronics Oscilloscope, just to get to the mainboard battery... couldnt they have made that simpler??? And why dont they change the battery when they take a couple k$ every second year calibrating it???
04:33 AM XXCoder: why when replacing that battery is another 1k or more? ;)
04:39 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: its a cr2032
04:39 AM Loetmichel: another $1000? that would be ursury
04:40 AM XXCoder: yeah but wouldnt broken seal void warranty or something? yeah but then thats how some companies work
04:41 AM Loetmichel: that oscar is 15 or so years old. no warranty. I has to be calibrated though because we do government certifying work with it.
04:41 AM XXCoder: interesting
04:42 AM XXCoder: i got call from company interested on talking with me
04:42 AM XXCoder: hope it means job soon
04:42 AM XXCoder: if it is indeed tje case it means ill work while dizzy. sucks
04:47 AM JT-Cave: morning
04:47 AM XXCoder: good morning sir jt
04:47 AM XXCoder: how goes the chicken at doctor box
05:30 AM JT-Cave: all the chickens are doing well
05:30 AM XXCoder: thats good
05:38 AM Loetmichel: grrr... i hate it when coworkers use the same circuit as my PC to test a repaired piece of tech... and i had not saved the cad model for a couple hours :-(
06:01 AM Tom_L: morning
06:02 AM XXCoder: yo
06:02 AM JT-Cave: yo
09:42 AM Jymmm: morning
09:50 AM Loetmichel: ouch... friction creates heat, the second... ground a 60*50*8mm alu block flat on thebelt sander... bare handed... HOTHOTHOT... *pffffft*
09:51 AM roycroft: ddtt
09:58 AM CaptHindsight: high of only 59F today (15C)
10:07 AM Tom_L: 60 high 79
10:07 AM roycroft: our air is nice and clean this morning, after last night's drama
10:07 AM roycroft: we had thunderstorms yesterday
10:07 AM roycroft: and late last night a severe thunderstorm with golf ball size hail pummeled the area by the big wildfire outside of town
10:08 AM roycroft: there was a lot of lightning last night as well - i would not be surprised if there were some new fires because of that
10:08 AM CaptHindsight: win some lose some
10:09 AM roycroft: the hail hit the fire camp, which i'm sure did not please firefighters
10:32 AM JT-Shop: damn the bandsaw coolant tank is nasty... looks like the mother in there
11:16 AM Tom_L: JT-Shop, does it recirculate?
11:25 AM Tom_L: tramp skimmer & filter system...
11:26 AM Tom_L: https://www.cnccookbook.com/filtering-coolant-find-cheaply-easily/
11:38 AM Tom_L: maybe not practical or necessary on a saw...
11:41 AM robotustra: Tom_L, do you have coolant system on your DIY machine?
11:45 AM robotustra: I watched yestarday about coolant system on HAAS and find out that there a lot of stuff can happen with it. Like cloging and bacteria
11:46 AM Tom_L: mist coolant
11:46 AM robotustra: and also I don't know if mist cooling is effective on lathes
11:46 AM robotustra: becaise flud cooling seems a bit complicated subsytem
11:46 AM robotustra: subsystem
11:46 AM Tom_L: my friend uses a bucket of oil and a paint brush on his lathe
11:47 AM Tom_L: (manual)
11:47 AM robotustra: you know it's not practical on cnc.
11:47 AM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Assembly/Final/Mister1.jpg
11:48 AM robotustra: but probably I have no choise and need to build at least primitive flud cooling
11:48 AM Tom_L: like $5 on ebay
11:48 AM robotustra: and 100$ for comressor and other arrangments
11:49 AM robotustra: and 100$ for the oil
11:49 AM Tom_L: had that already
11:49 AM Tom_L: $35 for a gal of coolant concentrate
11:49 AM robotustra: yeah, I name you canadian prices
11:49 AM Tom_L: sounds like you should move
11:50 AM robotustra: not ready yet
11:50 AM Tom_L: or start having stuff drop shipped and go pick it up
11:51 AM robotustra: rather trump join canada to us
11:51 AM robotustra: drop it where? we can't cross the border now
11:52 AM Tom_L: still closed?
11:52 AM robotustra: I think yes, but I might be wrong
11:52 AM Tom_L: have someone toss it over the fence :)
11:53 AM robotustra: no, I don't like drive 180 km to and fro for small stuff, I'll spend more on fuel
11:55 AM robotustra: some progress https://i.imgur.com/8SSKqpe.jpg
11:55 AM robotustra: now have to do the same with front
11:57 AM roycroft: it was just announced minutes ago that the us has extended travel restrictions to/from mexico and canada through 21 october
11:57 AM robotustra: that's it
12:03 PM roycroft: and for only the second time ever, the national hurricane center has run out of names for hurricanes
12:04 PM roycroft: they will start using the greek alphabet to name them going forward this season, so the next named storm will be alpha
12:04 PM roycroft: and we're just reaching the peak of the season now
12:05 PM * roycroft wonders if there's a plan if they get to omega
12:05 PM Tom_L: hebrew
12:06 PM roycroft: so aleph
01:13 PM unterhaus_: fusion saves a solidworks file automatically
01:26 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Cross-Sliding-Table-Linear-Rail-Module-SFU1605-Ballscrew-Motion-Stage-US-Stock/164316362260 i was looking for positioners like these 10 years ago...
01:27 PM CaptHindsight: crap grade industrial/consumer grade mechanisms for low prices
01:27 PM CaptHindsight: and they are now here
01:29 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.ebay.com/itm/164316361990
01:30 PM CaptHindsight: and all in stock in the USA https://www.ebay.com/itm/CNC-Linear-Actuator-Stage-Lead-Screw-Slide-Rail-200-500mm-With-42-Stepper-Motor/193231220133
01:31 PM CaptHindsight: Accuracy: 0.1mm
01:32 PM robotustra: CaptHindsight, yeah, I think they bend like gymnasts under the load
01:33 PM CaptHindsight: robotustra: they are built around t-slot
01:34 PM CaptHindsight: if you are moving a few Kg around and you don't much precision they are great
01:34 PM CaptHindsight: take a few hours to build from scratch
01:35 PM CaptHindsight: use "real" positioners for the precision applications and the cheap stuff for things that don't really matter much
01:37 PM robotustra: CaptHindsight, chose two of three: fast-cheap-good
01:38 PM CaptHindsight: did you just fall off the pumpkin wagon?
01:38 PM robotustra: I am
01:38 PM robotustra: I don't know what is this :)
01:38 PM robotustra: pumpkin wagon
01:46 PM miss0r2: Damn postal service. Apparently they have managed not to drop off my package today because "they are busy". But its okay. I will just wait til MONDAY !
01:46 PM miss0r2: [/rant]
02:01 PM CaptHindsight: robotustra: https://images.fineartamerica.com/images/artworkimages/mediumlarge/1/the-pumpkin-wagon-tnbackroads-photography.jpg
02:08 PM robotustra: CaptHindsight, cool picture
02:09 PM CaptHindsight: do they have pumpkins up there?
02:11 PM robotustra: where?
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: did you forget where you are?
02:13 PM robotustra: I didn't saw any pumpkin wagon in montreal
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: map says up there
03:23 PM Deejay: gn8
03:54 PM roycroft: have any of you ever hand tapped small (3/8"-12) acme threads in mild steel?
03:54 PM roycroft: is it reasonably doable?
03:55 PM roycroft: and i'm talking single start
03:55 PM Tom_L: yes
03:56 PM Tom_L: not acme though
03:56 PM Tom_L: sry
03:56 PM roycroft: acme is the key :)
03:57 PM roycroft: unc/unf are easy
03:57 PM Tom_L: ask andypugh
03:57 PM roycroft: with the larger sizes there are usually multiple taps and multiple passes for acme threads
03:57 PM roycroft: but for the smaller ones it's done in a single pass
03:57 PM roycroft: i'm not so worried about being strong enough to turn the tap
03:58 PM roycroft: but i'm a bit concerned about breaking it because of the force needed to cut the threads
03:58 PM andypugh: roycroft: The taps can be rather hard to start, they don’t feed themselves quite as readily as normal ones.
03:59 PM andypugh: You could consider single-pointing on your lathe.
03:59 PM roycroft: that's what i thought
03:59 PM roycroft: the hard to start part
03:59 PM andypugh: (This might involve buying a lathe, but that’s not something you would regret)
03:59 PM roycroft: i have a lathe
03:59 PM roycroft: i've never cut acme threads on a lathe before
03:59 PM andypugh: CNC?
04:00 PM roycroft: but this could be an opportunity
04:00 PM Tom_L: his was bigger than that but he recently did one
04:00 PM roycroft: i would need to fit the 4 jaw to it though, which i've not done yet
04:00 PM roycroft: and even then it might be a bit fiddly
04:00 PM roycroft: i need to tap some holes in the sides of some round bar
04:00 PM andypugh: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJyby8HsAhU
04:01 PM Tom_L: andypugh, how's the fallout from the release?
04:01 PM roycroft: which means it would be even harder to start a tap than usual
04:02 PM andypugh: If you have a lathe you could use that, with the threading feed set up right, to feed the tap at the exact pitch.
04:03 PM andypugh: I am taling about turning the part by hand, but using the leadscrew and the tap held in the toolholder to feed it.
04:03 PM andypugh: (CNC or manual, in this case)
04:05 PM andypugh: Tom_L: There is an issue with menus in Mate, the Pi image doesn’t set up the LinuxCNC repository in sources.list. But other than that I have not heard many complaints. But then I haven’t been on the forums much.
04:06 PM roycroft: what i usually do is drill the pilot hole, then countersink to clean up the edge, then mount the tap in the chuck with the part still mounted on the mill, and get it started that way
04:06 PM Tom_L: hopefully i can try it out soon
04:06 PM roycroft: by turning the chuck by hand
04:06 PM roycroft: so same technique as on the lathe, except i'm turning the tool by hand and not the part by hand
04:07 PM andypugh: Aye, I had it the other way round, but tap in the chuck might actually be easier.
04:08 PM robotustra: what is the angle of ACME thread?
04:08 PM roycroft: but i'm assuming that starting an acme tap is a lot harder than starting a unf/si/whitworth tap
04:09 PM roycroft: so even holding it in the chuck like that might not work out so well
04:09 PM roycroft: actually, i got one of those spring-loaded tap guides a while back
04:09 PM roycroft: most of my taps don't have a center hole, so i can't use it for them
04:10 PM roycroft: but that might work out ok if i get an acme tap with a center hole
04:10 PM roycroft: that way i could attach the tap handle when i start the tap
04:10 PM robotustra: andypugh, is your lathe controlled by linuxcnc?
04:11 PM roycroft: what i usually do is spin the tap down as much as i can until it starts slipping in the chuck, at which point it's usually started enough that it will stay in position when i unchuck it and attach a tap handle
04:11 PM andypugh: robotustra: Of course!
04:15 PM robotustra: I made my acme nut differently of two pieces becasue I don't have lathe yet :( https://i.imgur.com/R06SDdo.jpg
04:15 PM robotustra: got nut from mcmaster
04:17 PM robotustra: now I have to think how to attach end switches on my mirco mini lathe :)
04:27 PM skunkworks: andypugh: https://youtu.be/Q9zhi8Mc1fE
04:28 PM andypugh: skunkworks: I think I have seen that, unless you always put half a threaded hole in the face of your stock :-)
04:29 PM andypugh: You should definitely make a chuck key for the lathe on the lathe. I imagine that has been done infrequently.
04:29 PM robotustra: almost broaching
04:30 PM skunkworks: I always have a threaded hole in the stock.. ;)
04:30 PM robotustra: how does the screw of X axis fills about it?
04:31 PM andypugh: robotustra: it’s just doing its job
04:31 PM robotustra: isn't it a big stress for the thing?
04:32 PM andypugh: Not really, it’s just rather a lot of cycles.
04:32 PM robotustra: manual oiling on a cnc mill
04:33 PM robotustra: how do you sync chuck with x axis?
04:33 PM andypugh: LinuxCNC :-)
04:34 PM robotustra: encoler -> evaluate X
04:34 PM robotustra: encoder
04:34 PM robotustra: or you do A axis on spindle
04:35 PM robotustra: I think it's possible not only on linux cnc
04:37 PM andypugh: Indeed not, the comments on the video mention doing it on a Mazak last century.
04:39 PM robotustra: as I told, it reminds me a shaper
04:42 PM skunkworks: I like the description of playing cards in the bike spokes
04:42 PM skunkworks: I can just hear it
04:43 PM skunkworks: I have not really seen it done this way - I have seen it done with live tooling.. Like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uS3D0VPnDSY
04:44 PM skunkworks: well - I take that back.. I did find someone that was doing it with g33 on fanuc - but if you were interested you needed to pay them to give you the solution
04:47 PM robotustra: is it constant speed rotation, or not?
04:47 PM skunkworks: like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLoavsbtD2k&t=1s
04:50 PM skunkworks: wow - mine looks better :) https://youtu.be/uLoavsbtD2k?t=316
04:53 PM robotustra: you do it slower and your machine may be more rigid&
04:53 PM robotustra: ?
04:54 PM skunkworks: heh - no. It is a little emco compact5 lathe..
05:02 PM skunkworks: robotustra: https://youtu.be/GrzJKXBsXvM
05:28 PM robotustra: cool
05:51 PM Tom_L: skunkworks, that wiring looks as neat as mine!
06:05 PM skunkworks: Tom_L: yes - I out did myself...
06:11 PM roycroft: glue is drying on a benchtop piece, and then i have one more part to glue on and the bench assembly will be essentially finished.
06:11 PM roycroft: i'll glue that piece on tonight, and then i can start with the final planing/sanding tomorrow
06:11 PM roycroft: i may even have some time this weekend to make a list of all the things i haven't been getting done over the past two months that i need to catch up on
06:20 PM JT-Cave: roycroft, any updated photos?
06:26 PM JT-Cave: wow 71°F for a high today... 50% humidity feels so nice outside
06:29 PM Tom_L: nice day here as well
06:29 PM roycroft: no, i haven't taken any photos lately
06:29 PM roycroft: not much visible progress lately
06:33 PM roycroft: my dovetails did not turn out as well as i'd have liked
06:33 PM roycroft: i'm not going to take any pictures of them right now
06:34 PM roycroft: not until i've fixed them up :)
06:34 PM JT-Cave: I can't even imagine how you would make them
06:34 PM Tom_L: we like to see boo boos too so we can learn
06:39 PM roycroft: part of the problem i'm having now is that the rails that have the dovetails are fit very precisely to the end cap, which has the pins and sockets
06:39 PM roycroft: i fit the rails to the end cap last week
06:39 PM roycroft: since then it's gotten rainy
06:39 PM roycroft: the humidity is much much higher
06:40 PM roycroft: and everything has moved
06:40 PM roycroft: i was hoping to get these pieces assembled before the weather changed - that's a big reason i set a deadline of 15 september to complete it
06:40 PM JT-Cave: so once assembled the humidity won't be an issue?
06:41 PM roycroft: no
06:41 PM roycroft: the parts that need to fit closely will be glued together
06:41 PM roycroft: and the other ends of those parts will be able to move
06:41 PM JT-Cave: ah ok
06:41 PM * JT-Cave keeps his shop at 45% humidity or less
06:42 PM roycroft: the two bench top pieces, for example, are glued to the legs and so the outsides of the pieces cannot move at all
06:42 PM JT-Cave: keeps stuff from rusting
06:42 PM roycroft: but the insides are attached to some stretchers with 1/2" bolts
06:42 PM roycroft: and i made some slots in the stretchers so the bolts can moe with the bench top
06:42 PM roycroft: same with the end cap
06:42 PM JT-Cave: sounds well though out for sure
06:43 PM roycroft: it has slots like that as well, because it won't move in th same direction as the bench top pieces to which it's bolted
06:43 PM roycroft: it's glued to the bench top on the ends, where the bench top is fixed
06:44 PM roycroft: and has some floating tenons that are not glued in the middle
06:45 PM roycroft: anyway, that part of the bench is not going to fit up as cleanly as i'd like due to the wood movement
06:45 PM roycroft: but i can compensate for most of it
06:45 PM * roycroft has tricks up his sleeve to fix bad looking joinery
06:50 PM gloops: dovetails are the kind of thing where a few irregularities are almost expected, if theyre too precise they look machine made
06:50 PM gloops: if you want a hand made look
06:51 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: RBG passed away
06:54 PM robotustra: hm, don't understand where the X zero position for the lathe
06:55 PM robotustra: trying to understand chinise logic
06:57 PM robotustra: if I have rear toolpost coordinate system, then zero position should be the axis of the spindle
06:57 PM JT-Cave: X zero is the center of the spindle
06:57 PM robotustra: always?
06:58 PM JT-Cave: yes
06:58 PM JT-Cave: which way is + depends on the tool location
06:58 PM robotustra: rear toolpost
06:59 PM JT-Cave: + goes to the rear
06:59 PM robotustra: I'm curious why does controller needs this zero input signal
06:59 PM JT-Cave: signal?
07:00 PM JT-Cave: you find X0 by turning a part and measuring then setting the offset
07:00 PM robotustra: yes, I have a cnc lathe controller and it has "zero axis" signal
07:00 PM robotustra: which should come from their driver
07:01 PM robotustra: may be I don't need it
07:01 PM JT-Cave: no clue what that is
07:01 PM robotustra: me either
07:03 PM JT-Cave: is that for soft limits perhaps
07:03 PM robotustra: probably I need a crimper to wire the lathe
07:04 PM robotustra: possibly, there are other inputs like home input, on both axii, limit input etc
07:04 PM robotustra: and as I see all inpits a diffirential
07:06 PM JT-Cave: time for some chicken soup... not my chickens
07:06 PM Guest63567 is now known as _unreal_
07:06 PM _unreal_: milling more parts for my daughters cnc machine
07:09 PM robotustra: I finished the wooden mount for the lathe in first approximation and started to think about limit switches, covers, cable channels, wiring, plumbing, etc
07:13 PM CaptHindsight: skunkworks: do you recall how fast you could software step the Rpi4?
07:13 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKjNOVHhHio
07:14 PM CaptHindsight: 10khz?
07:24 PM skunkworks: CaptHindsight: I think 10khz
07:24 PM skunkworks: yes
07:26 PM skunkworks: that was with forceturbo and idle=poll, isolcpus=1,2,3
07:26 PM skunkworks: I don't know if I was over clocking it at that time.. But would have been runing at 1500mhz alteast
07:42 PM CaptHindsight: skunkworks: thanks, way fast enough for DLP/LCD printing
07:45 PM _unreal_: lcd printing?
07:49 PM skunkworks: CaptHindsight: why the heck are you playing with the pi? ;)
07:50 PM _unreal_: because its like warm apple pie
07:50 PM _unreal_: >:)
07:52 PM CaptHindsight: skunkworks: it's cheap enough to retrofit into toy printers and run LCNC
07:52 PM skunkworks: heh
07:52 PM CaptHindsight: some actually already have a Rpi in them
07:52 PM CaptHindsight: they just run crappy software
07:54 PM CaptHindsight: needs no external hardware except maybe some IO buffers for 3V--5V level shifting
07:55 PM skunkworks: there is a guy that does stupid youtube engineering things - one was a backboard for a basket ball hoop that would see the trajectory of the ball and adjust to make a basket
07:55 PM skunkworks: he made some comment about how hard it was with all the unknown delays in the windows os.
07:55 PM skunkworks: I thought - why?
07:55 PM CaptHindsight: sounds familiar
07:56 PM CaptHindsight: we ran Windows with an RT kernel back in the mid 90's
07:56 PM skunkworks: that is what emc ran on when it was with nist
07:56 PM CaptHindsight: forget the name but it was written by some ex-Intel engineers
07:57 PM CaptHindsight: this was in the 95-98 period
07:57 PM skunkworks: I bet expensive?
07:57 PM CaptHindsight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTX_(operating_system)
07:58 PM CaptHindsight: don't recall any pricing but we made small cards and a backplane
07:59 PM CaptHindsight: 386 on about a 3x5 in. card
07:59 PM CaptHindsight: had maybe 8 slots for IO
07:59 PM CaptHindsight: and I fit 4 modems onto one card
08:00 PM CaptHindsight: a few years ago at manufacturing week I ran into a college research project that was doing micromachining
08:01 PM CaptHindsight: they said they had some real time windows things since they wanted <5us latency for their application..
08:01 PM CaptHindsight: they had never heard of LinuxCNC
08:02 PM roycroft: and the last piece is glued on!
08:02 PM roycroft: assembly is essentially complete
08:02 PM CaptHindsight: \0/
08:02 PM roycroft: that doesn't mean i'm done, or close to done
08:03 PM roycroft: but it's a pretty major milestone
08:11 PM _unreal_: toy printer?
08:13 PM _unreal_: ARG.. 15min left on this aluminum part
08:23 PM roycroft: oh shit
08:24 PM roycroft: justice ginsburg has died
08:24 PM XXCoder: yeah. yay for new puppet justice :(
08:25 PM XXCoder: mitch held position open for almost a year. I bet you he wont this time. not even when its 2 months left
08:26 PM roycroft: he said that even if biden wins in november and if the senate flips to the dems, if there's an opening before the end of the year he'll get a new justice confirmed
08:27 PM roycroft: but if he does, that may cost him his seat, the republicans the senate, and the president his job
08:28 PM roycroft: and also would make it possible for the new democratic congress to add a couple or four justices to the bench
08:28 PM roycroft: if he keeps it open until the next president is sworn in the court will remain with 9 justices
08:28 PM roycroft: but it could easily be 11 or 13 if he does what he's promised to do
08:29 PM roycroft: and while i'm not in favor of court packing, and think it was wrong for fdr to do what he tried to do, in this case i'd be all for it
08:29 PM roycroft: because of mcconnell's behavior
08:30 PM XXCoder: i dont know if i support or opposte justice increasing numbers
08:31 PM XXCoder: i do, however belive we need to grow senate a bit, since current its very unfair to some states
08:31 PM XXCoder: like calfornia voter power vs one of vital states
08:31 PM roycroft: bu the politics of this aside
08:31 PM roycroft: we lost one of the great jurors of all time tonight
08:32 PM XXCoder: indeed
08:32 PM XXCoder: she sure puts the justice word the justice
08:33 PM roycroft: and her close friendship with justice scalia was a great affirmation that people can hold opposing views and still get along
08:33 PM XXCoder: newest member i wouldnt trust to do small cases let alone his current position
08:33 PM XXCoder: teary justice
08:40 PM _unreal_: XXCoder, always appose
08:41 PM _unreal_: RBG is best known for being masivly raciest. she NEVER had a black person on her staff ever....
08:45 PM roycroft: it will be interesting to see how mcconnell plays this
08:45 PM roycroft: the senate is already in jeopardy
08:45 PM XXCoder: yeah
08:45 PM roycroft: if he rams through a trump nominee right before the election that could easily cost the senate and the white house
08:45 PM XXCoder: if mitch isnt removed this election then trump removal dont matter as much
08:46 PM XXCoder: mitch would just act as wall
08:46 PM roycroft: but if he holds off until after the election that might get some undecided voters who are socially conservative to vote republican
08:47 PM roycroft: on the other hand, if trump is going to contest the election if he loses (which he 100% will do), having another of his nominees on the court might help his cause
08:47 PM roycroft: probably the smart thing would be to wait until the day after the election to nominate a new justice
08:47 PM roycroft: and ram it through that same week
08:48 PM unterhaus_: installing freecad
08:48 PM roycroft: in time to seat the justice before the election crap hits scotus
08:48 PM XXCoder: unterhaus_: nice
08:48 PM XXCoder: it takes bit of learning but its pretty good
08:48 PM roycroft: what os are you using, unterhaus_?
08:49 PM unterhaus_: this is on win10
08:49 PM roycroft: o
08:49 PM roycroft: i have no idea what versions of freecad run on windows 10
08:49 PM roycroft: so i have nothing to say about that :)
08:49 PM unterhaus_: I d/l from them, so ?
08:50 PM unterhaus_: .18
08:50 PM unterhaus_: I like people that recognize they aren't yet at version 1
08:50 PM roycroft: and mcconnell reitered today, minutes after she died, that her replacement nominee will get a vote this fall
08:51 PM unterhaus_: apparently she has been dying for 4 days
08:51 PM unterhaus_: so they knew. They even got Trump to say something appropriate
08:52 PM unterhaus_: does freecad use sketches?
08:53 PM roycroft: yes
08:53 PM unterhaus_: guess I'm going to have to look it up on utube
08:53 PM roycroft: there are a couple sketch workbenches
08:53 PM unterhaus_: no obvious sketch button
08:54 PM roycroft: freecad is a bunch of "workbenches"
08:54 PM roycroft: you have to load the workbench you want to use
08:54 PM XXCoder: constrant based sketches
08:54 PM skunkworks: I have successfully drawn a few things in freecad.
08:54 PM skunkworks: but it has been a while
08:56 PM unterhaus_: I might be able to get it to work
08:57 PM unterhaus_: okay, utube
09:15 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: tried to tell you RBG passed but you were workin on dovetails
09:17 PM CaptHindsight: pretty crazy year 2020, and it's not over yet!
09:18 PM roycroft: so not only have we run out of names for atlantic storms, we're on storm beta already
09:18 PM roycroft: we have both alpha and beta active
09:19 PM roycroft: and it's only mid september
09:19 PM roycroft: it is definitely possible to have a storm omega before the season is over
09:22 PM veegee: How do these air powered hydraulic jacks work? https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00026Z3HC
09:23 PM veegee: That is, is it a pneumatic vane motor driving a piston?
09:23 PM veegee: Or is it more like an air hammer where the air directly pushes a piston
09:23 PM skunkworks: air hammer
09:23 PM skunkworks: piston pump
09:24 PM skunkworks: air over hydraulic
09:24 PM veegee: Ok got it. I need to make a modular mechanism that I can easily clamp onto any generic bottle jack
09:25 PM veegee: Also going to start playing with those "porta power" manual hydraulic systems and hook it up to my forklift fork spreaders to see why it's jamming randomly
09:25 PM veegee: Hopefully the quick connect fittings are all the same
09:37 PM CaptHindsight: veegee: low on hydraulic fluid?
09:38 PM CaptHindsight: veegee: need more grease on the plain bearings?
09:38 PM veegee: CaptHindsight you know the noise it makes when you fully extend the ram? That is, the pressure relief valve?
09:38 PM veegee: It feels like the fork spreader gets stuck randomly and the pressure relief valve opens
09:38 PM veegee: But wiggling the valve back and forth sometimes unsticks it
09:38 PM veegee: also fully opening the valve almost always "jams" it
09:39 PM CaptHindsight: if it's not low fluid then make sure the ways are lubed
09:39 PM veegee: but gently opening it slowly sometimes allows the ram to fully extend
09:39 PM veegee: I did, I greased them thoroughly
09:39 PM CaptHindsight: are they jamming since they are worn?
09:39 PM veegee: I highly doubt it
09:39 PM CaptHindsight: do they get cocked?
09:39 PM veegee: because if I partially open the valve very gently, sometimes they open/close very smoothly
09:39 PM CaptHindsight: maybe the valve releases too early
09:40 PM veegee: also closing the forks together always works
09:40 PM veegee: opening them (spreading apart) is what works 50% of the time
09:40 PM veegee: I can't understand it because when it gets "Stuck", wiggling the lever does cause the hydraulic hoses to jerk
09:40 PM CaptHindsight: premature overpressure relief
09:40 PM veegee: but there's absolutely no jerk in the fork
09:41 PM veegee: like it feels like that flow isn't even reaching the ram if you know what I mean
09:41 PM veegee: as if there's something blocking right after the hydraulic hose and before the cylinder
09:41 PM CaptHindsight: maybe
09:41 PM CaptHindsight: loose seal in there
09:41 PM veegee: it's only this one mechanism that's wonky. The rest of it works perfectly. Forks raise/lower and tilt forward/back is flawless
09:42 PM veegee: But closing the forks together never sticks
09:42 PM CaptHindsight: only when spreading the forks?
09:42 PM veegee: I should take a video to explain better
09:42 PM CaptHindsight: at random location
09:42 PM veegee: Yes only spreading the forks works 50% of the time at random location
09:42 PM veegee: and always sticks if I push the lever fully
09:42 PM veegee: have to gently open the valve partially to do it slow and then it works
09:43 PM CaptHindsight: do the forks hang on one linear guide/bearing?
09:43 PM veegee: sometimes also have to wiggle the lever fully back and forth as if to "unstick", then gently push it forward partially to open the forks
09:43 PM CaptHindsight: or are there two guides, one above and one below?
09:44 PM veegee: CaptHindsight almost exactly the same mechanism: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtzXxnYGtr4
09:44 PM CaptHindsight: does it happen when there is a heavy pallet on the forks? or just when unloaded?
09:44 PM veegee: Loaded or unloaded, same behviouar
09:44 PM veegee: load doesn't seem* to affect it
09:45 PM CaptHindsight: screw driven or cylinder?
09:45 PM veegee: Hydraulic cylinder
09:45 PM veegee: Looks almost exactly like the one in the video
09:46 PM CaptHindsight: you could place a gauge on the line right at the cylinder
09:46 PM CaptHindsight: see if the pressure goes up or down when it sticks
09:46 PM veegee: oh right that's true,
09:46 PM veegee: I'll get one tomorrow and do that
09:46 PM veegee: I think they're hydraulic quick couplers thankfully
09:47 PM CaptHindsight: blow some fluid through in case there is some crap in the line
09:47 PM CaptHindsight: that should tell you
09:49 PM veegee: That's true. I should probably do a full hydraulic fluid replacement and flush everything
09:49 PM veegee: https://cebria.es/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/posicionador-con-horquillas-extensibles-galeria.jpg
09:50 PM veegee: The mechanism looks very very close to this. I'll take a full video tomorrow in daylight
09:50 PM veegee: On the plus side, carburetor cleaned up nicely and engine works like new
09:50 PM veegee: Now the hydraulics need some love
09:51 PM veegee: I made it run nice and lean. Going to convert it to electronic port fuel injection over the winter and possibly deactivate 2 cylinders to improve efficiency. This thing is overpowered
09:52 PM veegee: Went around and asked all the neighbours. No one owns that abandoned forklift, so it's mine now :D
09:52 PM CaptHindsight: finders keepers
09:52 PM veegee: Time to salvage its parts. It has everything except a propane tank.
09:52 PM CaptHindsight: does it run?
09:52 PM veegee: No idea, but the keys have been on the seat even
09:53 PM CaptHindsight: wow
09:53 PM veegee: oh yeah missing battery and forks
09:53 PM CaptHindsight: somebody gave up
09:53 PM veegee: But I have a spare battery and spare propane tank. GOing to see what's up
09:53 PM veegee: The alley cats love to sit on the seat
09:54 PM veegee: Right now I'm using it just because it's 10,000 lbs and I can easily tilt the rear of my forklift up by attempting to lift it so I can put it on jack stands for maintenance
09:55 PM veegee: this allis chalmers machine is a beast, doesn't even show the slightest sign of struggle
09:55 PM veegee: deserves a nice big 5,000 lb counterweight addon
09:57 PM veegee: CaptHindsight is it worth converting the hydraulics to closed center and use a variable displacement pump?
09:57 PM veegee: That is, is there any efficiency or handling advantage to closed center?
10:09 PM CaptHindsight: up to you, if it werks don't fix it
10:33 PM veegee: CaptHindsight it's more a question of does closed center provide improved control and handling in any way
10:33 PM veegee: The whole thing is a learning process so I totally don't mind replacing it even if it works