#linuxcnc Logs

Aug 15 2020

12:00 AM infornography: We had to replace a bunch of flathead lugs in an electrical box, because he impacted them in lol
12:06 AM infornography: sheared the top off one by one
12:06 AM veegee: If it's a big company, doesn't matter, they can afford it
12:06 AM veegee: But if it's a local machine shop or something, beat his ass outside
12:06 AM veegee: with an all metal body air impact
12:06 AM veegee: Impact tools should have forward mode disabled when given to wrench monkeys
01:15 AM Deejay: moin
01:15 AM jymmmm: Deejay: gn9
01:16 AM Deejay: hey jymmm
05:00 AM JT-Cave: morning
06:13 AM Tom_L: morning
06:25 AM JT-Cave: morning
06:25 AM XXCoder: morning to you guys
06:30 AM Tom_L: spirit brought back ~900 layoffs
06:31 AM Tom_L: how's it lookin out west?
06:31 AM XXCoder: dunno but im still not rehired
07:44 AM pink_vampire: morning
08:34 AM _unreal_: OMG... its HOT and humid outside today here in south florida
08:34 AM _unreal_: OMG.
09:08 AM pink_vampire: _unreal_: do you have AC?
09:38 AM _unreal_: lol
09:38 AM _unreal_: yes
09:39 AM _unreal_: faaaaak its hot/humid
09:39 AM _unreal_: lawn has been mowed
09:39 AM _unreal_: only did half
09:39 AM _unreal_: front yard
09:56 AM _unreal_: good lord its been an HOUR since I mowed the lawn and I'm still recovering
09:57 AM _unreal_: farking hell its a hot muggy one
10:11 AM _unreal_: ok designing my holder for the LED RPM feed back for my new spindle motor
11:27 AM flyback: <flyback> hoy shit
11:27 AM flyback: <flyback> I scored for $8
11:27 AM flyback: <flyback> https://www.codewithartie.com/
12:15 PM _unreal_: SOOO AMAZING... I just got my RPM LCD panel mounted
12:15 PM _unreal_: looks amazing
12:16 PM _unreal_: very happy with the upgrades
12:18 PM _unreal_: My machine is now worth its weight in gold :)
12:23 PM Tom_L: what's it weigh?
12:23 PM roycroft: i think i have figured out how to run my bench top pieces through the thicknesser without having to move anything outside
12:23 PM roycroft: this is good, because it's getting hot already, and i've had the ac on in my garage shop since dawn
12:24 PM roycroft: it's comfortable in the shop, and if i open the door it will never be comfortable again today
12:28 PM _unreal_: prob 30 lbs?
12:28 PM _unreal_: ya... prob 30 lbs
12:32 PM _unreal_: now I just want to make some stuff for the hell of making it
12:32 PM _unreal_: just amazing the difference
01:13 PM Tom_L: _unreal_, did you finish the small cnc?
01:17 PM _unreal_: yes
01:17 PM _unreal_: thats what I've been talking about
01:19 PM Tom_L: the one for your kid
01:51 PM jymmmm: suppose to get up to 107F today
01:54 PM Tom_L: go sunbathing
01:54 PM _unreal_: ? NO my home machine
01:54 PM _unreal_: my daughters is non operational
01:54 PM _unreal_: just need the controller to be wired up
01:55 PM _unreal_: Ihave not gotten around to it and have had NO desire to deal with it the last few months with the fake virus bs and my duahghter being stuck at her mothers thanks to my living issue.
01:55 PM _unreal_: can NOT wait for my stocks to recover. when they do I'll have the cash to get out and buy a new house and be gone
01:56 PM _unreal_: SADDLY I'm still stuck to a degree regardless my father is schedualed for corrective surgery in the next 3-5 weeks
01:56 PM _unreal_: for his now cured stage 4 cancer
02:07 PM jymmmm: roycroft: Sticky skin and sawdust... good combination :D
02:16 PM t4nk_freenode: so your dad has actually been cured from cancer??
02:16 PM t4nk_freenode: that's euhh, quite something I'd say!
02:17 PM t4nk_freenode: it should easily make up for the fact that your stocks....
02:17 PM t4nk_freenode: will NEVER recover ;)
02:17 PM t4nk_freenode: never ever.
02:19 PM _unreal_: yes
02:19 PM _unreal_: yes he did
02:20 PM t4nk_freenode: that's really great news
02:22 PM _unreal_: well time to get my kid from her friends house
02:36 PM roycroft: wow
02:36 PM roycroft: i've finished running my bench top pieces through the thicknesser
02:37 PM roycroft: that was either the most difficult or second most difficult part of the entire project, because it's absolutely a two person operation that i had to do myself
02:37 PM roycroft: but it's done
02:42 PM jymmmm: roycroft: ISn't that what those jack stands are for?
02:58 PM roycroft: i have roller stands
02:58 PM roycroft: and i used them
02:59 PM roycroft: but the parts weigh 50-60kg each, and they are long and bulky, and i had to line them up perfectly when feeding them into the machine
03:00 PM roycroft: and to further complicate matters, the table moves to adjust the height on the thicknesser, so i could not line the rollers up perfectly with the table unless i wanted to take the time to adjust them after each pass
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: yeah you make do with one person on two man jobs
03:09 PM CaptHindsight: I have to put doors back on a car body that is freshly painted by myself
03:09 PM CaptHindsight: you figure out how to hold, line up and protect the parts from getting damaged and held in place while you fasten and adjust them
03:10 PM t4nk_freenode: as you will be able to tell with hindsight... let the paint dry first, fitting the doors will be substantially more easy!
03:10 PM CaptHindsight: yes Johnny Obvious
03:15 PM * jymmmm lol @ CaptObvious
03:16 PM jymmmm: roycroft: the blades dont move, but the table does?! wth
03:16 PM jymmmm: roycroft: Please tell me what brand, so I can avoid it
03:17 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: crap are you guys getting blackout again!?
03:17 PM CaptHindsight: rolling power outages
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: lockdowns at home with no power, fun
03:20 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Not yet, 107F today, so HIGH fire season is upon us.
03:23 PM jymmmm: Hmmm, I wish there was an easy way to read the HVAC power
03:24 PM CaptHindsight: electrical power or cooling output?
03:24 PM CaptHindsight: or?
03:32 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Power, so I cna see if the gen can operate the AC alone
03:32 PM jymmmm: No lights, no internet, but got AC =)
03:32 PM jymmmm: ...priorities =)
03:33 PM Deejay: gn8 jymmmm and all others
03:33 PM jymmmm: Deejay: gn9 =)
03:33 PM Deejay: :)
03:41 PM CaptHindsight: I'd say AC is a priority when over 90F, especially when humid.
03:43 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: we found those camping mat sized air mattresses to come in handy. Smaller than twin size.
03:44 PM CaptHindsight: Fill with a few gallons of cold water and it is quite comfortable. Water is only <1/2 deep when flat and may still be carried by one person.
03:45 PM CaptHindsight: To re-cool, empty and refill or put a few frozen gel packs under for an hour.
03:46 PM _unreal_: I want to make something with my cnc and I dont know what I want to make
03:46 PM _unreal_: I dont have any realplan right now
03:46 PM _unreal_: hehe
03:56 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Oh, you didn't see my ghettoAC for the shop?
03:57 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: pump is in the bucket... https://i.imgur.com/wvZxBMO.jpg
03:59 PM roycroft: the cutterhead moves, of course
03:59 PM roycroft: but it is in a fixed position
03:59 PM roycroft: it's the height adjustment that is made with the tabe
04:00 PM roycroft: and it's how almost all thicknessers work, except for those portable models
04:00 PM _unreal_: jymmmm, lol looks nagarigged nice
04:01 PM _unreal_: its like 95f out here
04:02 PM roycroft: it's "only" 33 here so far, but it is supposed to get up to 40
04:04 PM t4nk_freenode: lol jymmmm ... I've been messing around with that too ;) thought of pumping through a tube too, but ended up just having a big bowl with a large chunk of ice.. on my desk, and blowing a fan through that
04:06 PM t4nk_freenode: I think a large chunk lasted over 5 hours
04:08 PM Centreline: Hi All, question, I'm about to replace a dual parallel port linuxcnc setup with a mesa 5i25 fpga card and reuse my chinese breakout boards. I saw someone mentioning the optocouplers are really slow and cause issues themselves in the chinese bob's, is this much of a concern?
04:09 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, do you have a working cnc yet?
04:10 PM _unreal_: Centreline, just look up what the boards MAX step rate is
04:10 PM _unreal_: even if it is china made
04:10 PM t4nk_freenode: no, _unreal_, and I'm very sad about it. I don't think I got the space in the house after all :|
04:10 PM _unreal_: for a mini machine
04:10 PM _unreal_: o,O
04:10 PM _unreal_: bs
04:10 PM t4nk_freenode: but I'm on the hot seat at the moment.. because I want at least a 3d printer I think
04:11 PM t4nk_freenode: I want to be able to fabricate some stuff
04:11 PM t4nk_freenode: which may help me to do some better construction
04:11 PM _unreal_: a dirt cheap 3d printer doesnt cost much
04:11 PM _unreal_: I mean hell you can get one that just WORKS for $150 USD
04:11 PM Centreline: hmm I dont think I actually ever got that info to start with... I seem to remember not even getting pinout diagrams etc at the time.
04:11 PM _unreal_: and use that to print parts to make a cnc machine
04:12 PM _unreal_: what board do you have Centreline
04:12 PM _unreal_: THERE ARE a billion kockoffs out there
04:12 PM _unreal_: my board in my home machine is a knock off
04:13 PM _unreal_: kockoff planetcnc board
04:13 PM Centreline: of the Mesa, or the bob's?
04:13 PM _unreal_: bobs
04:13 PM Centreline: these are generic chinese bob's, I dont even think they bothered to try and knock a brand off
04:13 PM _unreal_: it has to give a limit on the step rate
04:14 PM _unreal_: step rate os delay between steps
04:14 PM _unreal_: step rate and delay between step
04:14 PM t4nk_freenode: well, I'm open for suggestions from anyone... on what to buy, 150euro's don't sound like much, but I'd hope to have at least some decent quality. it would also be nice if the printer were rigid enough for me to sneak in some dremel tools after all, secretly ;)
04:14 PM _unreal_: the chances of it not giving that info is very small
04:14 PM Centreline: Id buy a 7i78 too, but its the wrong side of 200e by the time tax and shipping is added and I'm supposed to just be tidying this machine up
04:15 PM t4nk_freenode: so if anyone has an idea.. it would be very welcome. $150 is ok, 200 probably too, but I'd like to have sth under $250
04:16 PM Centreline: I dont think Ive ever seen a bob advertised where they specify max step rates
04:16 PM Centreline: I have to buy another one, so If I can find one with the specs I'll just get that and uses it for the axis io's.
04:19 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, https://www.amazon.com/Comgrow-Ender-3-3D-Printer/dp/B07D18L9K6/ref=sr_1_29?dchild=1&keywords=3d+printer&qid=1597526331&s=industrial&sr=1-29
04:19 PM _unreal_: $200
04:22 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, https://www.amazon.com/gp/slredirect/picassoRedirect.html/ref=pa_sp_atf_next_industrial_sr_pg2_1?ie=UTF8&adId=A0462240JH5WW2JEXQJO&url=%2FANYCUBIC-Mega-Zero-Certified-220x220x250mm%2Fdp%2FB083XTSWYR%2Fref%3Dsr_1_26_sspa%3Fdchild%3D1%26keywords%3D3d%2Bprinter%26qid%3D1597526501%26s%3Dindustrial%26sr%3D1-26-spons%26psc%3D1&qualifier=1597526504&id=2966137100552241&widgetName=sp_atf_next
04:22 PM _unreal_: https://www.amazon.com/gp/slredirect/picassoRedirect.html/ref=pa_sp_btf_industrial_sr_pg2_1?ie=UTF8&adId=A10245583RIJ7B1DTNL5L&url=%2FKingroon-Assisted-Preloaded-Printable-180x180x180mm%2Fdp%2FB07WXRFQV5%2Fref%3Dsr_1_54_sspa%3Fdchild%3D1%26keywords%3D3d%2Bprinter%26qid%3D1597526501%26s%3Dindustrial%26sr%3D1-54-spons%26psc%3D1&qualifier=1597526504&id=2966137100552241&widgetName=sp_btf
04:22 PM _unreal_: there are 2 right there
04:22 PM _unreal_: dirt cheap
04:28 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, the chances of finding a 3d printer that you can also do milling with is not so high
04:28 PM t4nk_freenode: yeh, I'm lookign
04:28 PM _unreal_: especially cheap
04:28 PM _unreal_: now you could build a machine to do that SURE
04:29 PM _unreal_: reardless if you get a 3d printer that would let you then build custom parts and link parts together and be able to make a decent cnc machine
04:29 PM t4nk_freenode: that's one of the immediate goals... to be able to make things with a bit more precision, for again; I really stink at construction somehow... it's all so clear in my head.. but I'll always mess up and make crooked stuff
04:29 PM t4nk_freenode: can't work like that
04:31 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1L1O4iV255lWyKWPc14CdUmzafI8XcM6K/view?usp=sharing
04:31 PM _unreal_: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/717411349541683212/738917731151118376/15962420896107010412417595846703.jpg
04:31 PM _unreal_: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/717411349541683212/740024270285045821/20200803_215147.jpg
04:31 PM _unreal_: SWEET https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/717411349541683212/740024270285045821/20200803_215147.jpg
04:32 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, I made it in cad and broke down the parts and let my machine cut them
04:32 PM _unreal_: all I had to do was put in screws
04:32 PM _unreal_: TOO easy
04:32 PM _unreal_: now I did have to sand flat a bit the rail mount because it was not flat even thought it looked flat
04:32 PM _unreal_: that got rid of the tension areas
04:33 PM t4nk_freenode: so you were able to mill that aluminium and all?
04:35 PM _unreal_: yes
04:35 PM _unreal_: I milled all of the aluminum parts with my cnc machine and its original hardware. took for EVER FOR === EVER....... but once the parts where made I screwed them together
04:36 PM _unreal_: and then did the mounting task
04:36 PM _unreal_: and got everything setup
04:36 PM t4nk_freenode: and you used a lot of cooling liquid too I guess
04:36 PM _unreal_: big difference. my machine is much stiffer. I can mill about 1.5mm at 30mm/m easy
04:36 PM _unreal_: with a 1/8th bit
04:37 PM _unreal_: so now I can make aluminum parts easy
04:37 PM t4nk_freenode: btw, it's not only the room in the house which I don't reallllllly have.. but I figure it won't exactly be 'quiet' either
04:37 PM _unreal_: quiet is easy to fix
04:37 PM jymmmm: t4nk_freenode: You're idea doesn't realy work, already tried that. This would work MUCH better if I had copper tubing on the fan and tossed the ice in an icechest
04:38 PM t4nk_freenode: yes, metal tubing, with lots of windings
04:38 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, just build a box around the machine and use egg box foam
04:38 PM jymmmm: t4nk_freenode: wngs are a bit overkill for a GhettoAC imo
04:38 PM _unreal_: https://sc01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1YlKrOpXXXXXhaFXXq6xXFXXXJ.jpg
04:38 PM t4nk_freenode: a box would be nice to catch all the shavings and stuff too
04:39 PM _unreal_: then just use a web cam
04:39 PM jymmmm: t4nk_freenode: and the slower you pump the water, the colder the output
04:40 PM t4nk_freenode: watched some youtubes the other day, when I came across those electrical plates you can get from china now
04:40 PM t4nk_freenode: one side heats up, other cools
04:40 PM t4nk_freenode: I think it's a bit of a farce ;)
04:41 PM jymmmm: t4nk_freenode: No, they are legit, The catch is as cold as they get, the other side gets just as hot too
04:41 PM _unreal_: IF you have to have it totally quiet then enclose the entire thing and use a WEB cam so you can see what is going on when the machine is in operation
04:41 PM t4nk_freenode: been thinking along those lines, yes, _unreal_
04:42 PM jymmmm: t4nk_freenode: someone made a freezer using them and really works
04:42 PM _unreal_: those work but cost a LOT of power to run
04:42 PM _unreal_: Peltier's is what they are called
04:43 PM t4nk_freenode: I saw a vid of some kids once.. took the time to study the airflow in the house
04:43 PM t4nk_freenode: I think there's a lot to be had on that front
04:43 PM _unreal_: sure
04:43 PM _unreal_: but like I said I would prob suggest getting the 3d printer
04:43 PM t4nk_freenode: been running through the house the past days.. with a large wooden board.. to try and wave all the heat out of the house
04:44 PM t4nk_freenode: no chance ;)
04:45 PM jymmmm: t4nk_freenode: This is the frig, the freezer came after... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWUhwmmZa7A
04:46 PM t4nk_freenode: Hey.. isn't that the same guy who tried some active noise cancellation once
04:46 PM jymmmm: t4nk_freenode: the freezer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkSR4rTl2GY
04:47 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, as I said its cheaper to buy a machine then to build one https://www.amazon.com/gp/slredirect/picassoRedirect.html/ref=pa_sp_btf_aps_sr_pg1_1?ie=UTF8&adId=A080269239XZI2E1VLETI&url=%2FVEVOR-3018-PRO-Control-Offline-Controller%2Fdp%2FB08914S7Q6%2Fref%3Dsr_1_60_sspa%3Fdchild%3D1%26keywords%3DCNC%2BMachines%26qid%3D1597527927%26sr%3D8-60-spons%26psc%3D1&qualifier=1597527927&id=5074057794438340&widgetName=sp_btf
04:48 PM t4nk_freenode: yeh, I think I saw some reviews of that one, _unreal_ ... it's not that great I belive
04:49 PM _unreal_: they suck compaired to mine. BUT that one for example has a bit more work area then mine does
04:49 PM t4nk_freenode: but it can by no means cut metal :|
04:49 PM Centreline: if you want quiet(er), you can replace the crap fans everything comes with by some noctura units. Theyre expensive, but they will outlive the 3d printer itself and still not be horrible noisy singing things...
04:50 PM _unreal_: nope I take it back mine has more work area but just a little bit
04:50 PM _unreal_: it can cut metal
04:51 PM _unreal_: that one I just linked could cut aluminum. it would just take for ever because you would have to do prob 1/4 mm per pass at 25mm/min
04:51 PM _unreal_: and a finishing pass if you needed quality
04:51 PM t4nk_freenode: I may come to a decision next week, _unreal_ ... finally cut the knot, and buy a 3d printer, it will hopefully be a nice start
04:52 PM t4nk_freenode: I just don't want to end up printing spiderman's and leave it with that... I want to do some useful stuff
04:52 PM _unreal_: infact I believe the spindle motor on that one I linked is more poerful then what I have been using
04:53 PM t4nk_freenode: man, I was so impressed with the results when I slapped together that mini cnc from dvd drives.. it was able to drill and cut using a flexible shaft
04:53 PM _unreal_: OH t4nk_freenode that cnc machine I just posted can also do laser etching
04:53 PM _unreal_: look at the video
04:54 PM t4nk_freenode: laser cutting might be an option too
04:54 PM t4nk_freenode: would be kewl
04:54 PM t4nk_freenode: and less noisy I guess
04:55 PM _unreal_: no noise
04:55 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, look at the video
04:55 PM _unreal_: you could put a 3d printer head on it as well
04:55 PM _unreal_: no reason you couldnt. JUST swap parts
04:55 PM _unreal_: so that is the machine I would suggest
04:56 PM Centreline: ok generic replacement bob ordered. I'm just going to ignore the stepper latency through optocoupler comments and carry on as the only bob with it in the specs is nearly as expensive as buying a 7i76...
04:56 PM _unreal_: Centreline, if you where using a par port setup before the PAR port was likely slower then the opto's
04:56 PM _unreal_: FYI....
04:57 PM Centreline: Are you limited on space t4nk_freenode ? a generic k40 laser cutter is a pretty nice completement to a 3d printer later on. But it takes up more desk real estate...
04:58 PM Centreline: I got sick of fighting latency issues, so got the 5i75 superport. Its only for my bridgeport interact to give it a bit of a spruce up.
04:59 PM t4nk_freenode: I'll read up on it, Centreline
05:00 PM Centreline: and I wouldnt want to do laser cutting in a house without some kind of vent...
05:01 PM _unreal_: t4nk_freenode, I believe your better choice is to buy a small cheap cnc
05:01 PM Centreline: same for 3d printer really, but I never bothered with that personally as I started off using pla and only switched to abs later on when I fitted heated bed etc.
05:01 PM _unreal_: and just convert it to LASER or 3D printer
05:01 PM _unreal_: it would likely be cheaper then buying 3 different machines as well
05:01 PM _unreal_: especially the laser aspect
05:01 PM _unreal_: but dont forget laser etchers you need eye protetion PERIOD
05:02 PM _unreal_: protection
05:02 PM _unreal_: AND or a laser covering
05:02 PM _unreal_: 3d printing does not like dirt/DUST
05:02 PM _unreal_: so again I would suggest going with a cnc mill just purchase one like the cheap one I posted.
05:03 PM _unreal_: then convert it to what ever you want to convert it to. so you can do any kind of task
05:03 PM _unreal_: lasers make smoke as well FYI
05:03 PM _unreal_: 3d printers STICK depending on what you are milling
05:03 PM _unreal_: stink
05:03 PM t4nk_freenode: I'm thinking of buying that ender 3 or similar
05:03 PM Centreline: I'm so glad I have different machines and dont have to dick round changing things when I need to use a different aspect, but each to their own.
05:04 PM _unreal_: Centreline, I believe its more a question of $
05:04 PM Centreline: And I much prefer having a k40 than when I had a laser head on my printrbot...
05:04 PM _unreal_: my only laser etcher is a NEJE
05:04 PM _unreal_: crapy little work area
05:04 PM _unreal_: but at least it works
05:05 PM Centreline: this k40 was same, but I cut the insides away so the work area is larger...
05:05 PM t4nk_freenode: so my diy mini cnc is actually just a neje
05:06 PM Centreline: it cant engrave metal objects though, glass it can do though...
05:07 PM Centreline: I tried moly spray etc, and was disappointed with the results...
05:09 PM Centreline: the other thing was when I had the laser head on the printer, it was not very safe, laser glasses, couldnt let the kids near it etc. with the k40 its all in a box with a little window and a interlock.
05:14 PM Centreline: right time to head on back the shop, have fun all
05:34 PM roycroft: i just stepped outside to get the mail and it is absolutely miserable out there
05:34 PM roycroft: and we still have an hour and a half before the peak temperature of the day
05:36 PM Tom_L: at least you're not the one riding around in the mail truck
05:36 PM XXCoder: today 79f peak, tomorrow 90f peak, monday 82f peak, tues 75f peak
06:15 PM _unreal_: XXCoder, lol been like 96 here
06:15 PM Tom_L: 96 & 96 ?
06:16 PM _unreal_: hot hot today
06:18 PM andypugh: I was at a track day the last two days. Both says started too foggy for track use, with heavy condensation from the trees around the circuit adding to the problem. That’s _really_ unusual for August.
06:19 PM XXCoder: wonder if more people staying at homes caused that lol
06:19 PM XXCoder: doubt it
06:20 PM Tom_L: andypugh, you riding too?
06:20 PM XXCoder: i finally got and tested my ultrasonic cleaner
06:20 PM Tom_L: wasn't sure you still rode
06:20 PM XXCoder: damn its awesome. my glasses is *very* clean with just water. my nylon watch band are very clean too
06:20 PM Tom_L: XXCoder, yeah they're nice to have around
06:21 PM Tom_L: what size?
06:21 PM XXCoder: small one, can fit glasses with small clearance
06:21 PM XXCoder: its usually $100 but i got lucky and got one for $44 shipped
06:21 PM XXCoder: its not battery type
06:22 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/misc_stuff/ultrasonic2.jpg
06:22 PM Tom_L: quart iirc
06:22 PM Tom_L: maybe 2
06:22 PM XXCoder: very nice. clean parts eh
06:22 PM Tom_L: i've had that one a very long time
06:23 PM Tom_L: used to clean small engine parts with it
06:23 PM XXCoder: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Digital-Ultrasonic-Cleaner-Timer-Stainless-Jewelry-glasses-Denture-Clean-Tank-US/143669019981
06:24 PM andypugh: Tom_L: Oh, yes, very much so. https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=10157146089481116&set=ms.c.eJwzNDA0NTc0MTOwsDSxMDQ0NNMzhItYWJiaoYkYGaKJmFlYgkQAAdcOTg~-~-.bps.t.1547662471
06:24 PM Tom_L: not available
06:24 PM XXCoder: not public
06:24 PM andypugh: Ah, never mind then
06:24 PM Tom_L: hope you got some riding in once the fog lifted
06:25 PM andypugh: Oh, yes. As much as I wanted.
06:26 PM andypugh: (I ended up not really in the mood and loaned my R1 to a friend’s daughter whose own SV650 had a problem.
06:26 PM andypugh: But it was great to do _something_ this year.
06:27 PM Tom_L: yeah no kidding
06:29 PM Tom_L: any luck with the 2.8 packaging?
06:29 PM Tom_L: still giving you grief?
06:30 PM andypugh: Yes.
06:30 PM jymmmm: try duct tape packaging ;)
06:30 PM jymmmm: I thought alex did the packaging?
06:31 PM andypugh: And other things: http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/grid
06:31 PM jymmmm: Where is alex anyway? anyone seen him?
06:31 PM Tom_L: i think it's up to whomever takes the challenge
06:31 PM CaptHindsight: I'm trying to get down to the root of why some think that LCNC should move real time to a microcontroller
06:31 PM andypugh: Green good, orange OK, red bad.
06:31 PM CaptHindsight: not sure if they even know
06:32 PM andypugh: CaptHindsight: Because they don’t understand the raison d’etre of LinuxCNC.
06:32 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: embedded, yes, uC no
06:32 PM CaptHindsight: andypugh: nice links BTW for the stm32 blue pill missing links
06:32 PM jymmmm: Couldn't all the RT stuff fit into a FPGA/mesa card?
06:33 PM andypugh: LinixCNC is a CNC controller that runs under Linux. The clue is in the name. If you want to do something else, them LinuxCNC is a terrible starting point.
06:33 PM CaptHindsight: yup
06:33 PM andypugh: Tom_L: So, my problem is, why did those three bottom packages fail?
06:34 PM jymmmm: The front end can still be linux, I'm taking the RT / engine
06:34 PM CaptHindsight: I'm stil trying to make the point that an Orange Pi is an ARM with an integrated microcontroller
06:34 PM CaptHindsight: so you can have your cake and eat it to
06:35 PM CaptHindsight: ARM PC with microcontroller right inside
06:35 PM Tom_L: andypugh, is it just about documentation errors?
06:35 PM jymmmm: Wouldn't havng the RT on a FPGA be better?
06:35 PM CaptHindsight: and I don't think they have an idea of how much work it is to create all the GUI's
06:36 PM andypugh: I think that the confusion is based on the fact that Mach were happy to make Mach into a glorified DNC for Smoothstepper as there was money in it. But nobody is willing to make LinuxCNC into a glorified DNC because it’s a technically stupid idea.
06:36 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: it's still expensive to have it all in the FPGA
06:36 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: mesa card?
06:36 PM CaptHindsight: integrated ARM cpu's in FPGA's still cost a bit
06:37 PM CaptHindsight: one could put an ARM SOC for $5 with 4 cores on a card with an FPGA
06:37 PM jymmmm: Still have PC, it loads the FPGA, then hands off the RT/Enginw to the fpga
06:37 PM CaptHindsight: well $3-6 for the ARM + DDR4 cost
06:38 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: what are most of the 3d printers using, a uC?
06:38 PM CaptHindsight: they seem to be leading towards having a smaller control box for the CNC controller and drives
06:39 PM jymmmm: Basically, getting rid of a dedicated PC all together?
06:39 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: they use a *duino, SAM5 or stm32, poopieboards use LPC17xx
06:40 PM CaptHindsight: yes, but you still need a PC to slice
06:40 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: but that's pre-processing, no?
06:40 PM CaptHindsight: x86 or ARM PC or smartphone
06:40 PM CaptHindsight: 3d printer CAM
06:40 PM jymmmm: which isn't and NC device,
06:41 PM jymmmm: any*
06:41 PM jymmmm: you design cad/cam elsewhere, then load to the NC device
06:44 PM jymmmm: andypugh: Realize, I've been saying this for over 10 years in regards to LCN, nothing new at all.
06:45 PM CaptHindsight: https://usa.banggood.com/BIGTREETECH-SKR-V1_3-Control-Board-32-Bit-ARM-CPU-32bit-Mainboard-Smoothieboard-For-3D-Printer-Parts-Reprap-p-1476462.html
06:45 PM CaptHindsight: $20
06:45 PM CaptHindsight: they should have just given the design to the Chinese years agp
06:45 PM CaptHindsight: ago
06:46 PM jymmmm: 384 4.9 star reviews?!
06:46 PM jymmmm: that's impressive, especially for a import thing
06:47 PM CaptHindsight: well they copied the poopie and made it better
06:47 PM jymmmm: not a bad thing
06:48 PM CaptHindsight: this is closer to what some are asking for but somehow with linuxCNC
06:48 PM jymmmm: I think andypugh is the only one that does FPGA programming, isn't he?
06:49 PM CaptHindsight: more than a few here can/do
06:49 PM jymmmm: ah
06:49 PM andypugh: No, not even me. PCW is the FPGA programmer.
06:49 PM jymmmm: andypugh: OH ok, I thought you did some work for him a ways back
06:50 PM andypugh: I did the LinuxCNC side, all in C.
06:50 PM jymmmm: ah
06:50 PM jymmmm: my bad
06:51 PM jymmmm: There are linux distros for ARM?
06:51 PM * jymmmm knows NOTHING about ARM
06:51 PM Tom_L: i've looked at verilog and vhdl but am not a programmer
06:52 PM _unreal_: jymmmm, I have a tinkerboard with linux on it and linuxcnc compiled for it
06:52 PM _unreal_: not using it but it has the ablity
06:52 PM jymmmm: tinkerboard uses an ARM cpu?
06:53 PM jymmmm: or a uC?
06:53 PM Tom_L: arm
06:53 PM jymmmm: Is ARM a uC or CPU?
06:54 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: the cores are available as microcontrollers and as processors
06:54 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: what defines that? The code or the model#?
06:55 PM Tom_L: the way they're wired inside
06:55 PM CaptHindsight: some ARM soc's like the Allwinners on the Orange Pi have both ARM cpu cores and microcontrollers, allwinner chose an ARISC vs ARM for the micro
06:55 PM jymmmm: I mena is it a hardware thing or a software thing?
06:55 PM CaptHindsight: well it used to be if it had a MMU or not
06:56 PM CaptHindsight: with MMU then it's a CPU, no MMU it is a microcontroller
06:56 PM jymmmm: ok, so just model dependant
06:56 PM CaptHindsight: microcontrollers typically have no external memory bus
06:56 PM CaptHindsight: so RAM and ROM are on chip and limited by what they fab
06:57 PM jymmmm: k
06:57 PM CaptHindsight: so they tend to have small amounts of either
06:57 PM Tom_L: some avrs do
06:57 PM Tom_L: at least ras cas
06:57 PM CaptHindsight: a CPU has a memory and/or IO bus, sometimes shared but rarely
06:58 PM CaptHindsight: type of memory supported varies on microcontrollers
06:58 PM jymmmm: How much ram does LCNC need?
06:58 PM Tom_L: what kind of graphics?
06:58 PM jymmmm: nominally
06:59 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: What, it's the screen that's taking all the resources?
06:59 PM CaptHindsight: the backplots in a GUI take up lots of memory
06:59 PM jymmmm: There used to be keystick pre AXIS
07:00 PM CaptHindsight: a GPU requires memory to store data for frames as well as full frames
07:00 PM jymmmm: So AXIS is the hog in all this?
07:00 PM CaptHindsight: the display controller needs enough space for every pixel x color depth
07:00 PM Tom_L: axis gmoccapy gscreen.....
07:00 PM CaptHindsight: IF you run the backplot
07:01 PM Tom_L: hard to say what qtpyvcp needs
07:01 PM jymmmm: And there is the AXIS equiv in 3d printers?
07:02 PM jymmmm: the backplots etc
07:02 PM Tom_L: that's doubtful
07:02 PM Tom_L: not on the glueguns anyway
07:02 PM jymmmm: and what about $500K cnc centers?
07:02 PM CaptHindsight: a 4k screen has 8294400
07:02 PM CaptHindsight: pixels
07:02 PM CaptHindsight: so lets round down to 8M pixels
07:02 PM Tom_L: jymmmm, typically they don't have backplots
07:03 PM Tom_L: at least the ones i've been around
07:03 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: just gcode scrolling like crazy?
07:03 PM Tom_L: we had 1 windows control but i wasn't around it enough to know
07:03 PM Tom_L: pretty much yes
07:03 PM Tom_L: and informational screens
07:03 PM CaptHindsight: i forget how little ram a PC can have to run linux and LCNC smoothly
07:04 PM Tom_L: he got rid of that machine about as quick as he got it
07:04 PM jymmmm: Ok, so offload the motion stuff to ext hardware, and just use the PC for the graphical stuff?
07:04 PM CaptHindsight: 8 years ago i think we had only 256MB or 512MB on the ARM boards
07:04 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: that is what they seem to be talking about
07:04 PM CaptHindsight: but don'
07:05 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: "they"?
07:05 PM Tom_L: jymmmm, the data still has to flow back and forth for the graphic to be accurate
07:05 PM CaptHindsight: bu don't have the skills or funding to do it
07:05 PM CaptHindsight: just the armchair quarterback skills
07:05 PM * Tom_L resembles that
07:05 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: the people that keep bringing this up
07:05 PM jymmmm: ah
07:06 PM CaptHindsight: https://sourceforge.net/p/emc/mailman/emc-users/ just back 24 hours
07:07 PM CaptHindsight: Re: [Emc-users] Machmaker USB -> Parallel this thread
07:09 PM jymmmm: well, paraport are becoming extinct now.
07:09 PM CaptHindsight: intel first mentioned dropping them just over 20 years ago
07:09 PM jymmmm: and as I understand it, even with a mesa card, you STILL have to be concered with mobo latency to a degree
07:09 PM CaptHindsight: LPT cards will be around for at least another 10
07:10 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: for Mesa ethernet is has to be better than 500.000 uS IIRC
07:10 PM jymmmm: but will PCI slots?
07:11 PM CaptHindsight: PCIe is going to be around for a while
07:11 PM CaptHindsight: PCI is getting harder to find
07:11 PM jymmmm: USB3 is up to par now
07:12 PM CaptHindsight: but still a horrible bus
07:12 PM jymmmm: SATA?
07:12 PM jymmmm: eSATA?
07:13 PM CaptHindsight: PCIe is not on the list for obsolescence yet
07:13 PM CaptHindsight: it's how graphics cards connect to the CPU and RAM
07:13 PM jymmmm: PCIe/thunderbolt is still kinda rare
07:15 PM CaptHindsight: PCIe 6.0 first draft was released earlier this year
07:15 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: the 500,000uS.... is that the old or new latency test numbers? It use to be no greater than 15,000 iirc
07:15 PM CaptHindsight: 64 GT/s data transfer rate (raw bit rate), up to 252 GB/s is possible in x16 configuration.
07:16 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: i think you are confusing latency jitter max for LPT and BOB's vs Mesa FPGA
07:16 PM jymmmm: maybe,
07:17 PM CaptHindsight: 15,000 uS would make for a pretty good software stepping LPT PC
07:18 PM CaptHindsight: >100,000 uS jitter would be pretty slow
07:18 PM CaptHindsight: but adequate for a slow moving stepper in a resin printers Z-axis
07:18 PM CaptHindsight: some printers move Z really slowly
07:19 PM jymmmm: I'm not talking printers at all
07:19 PM CaptHindsight: and it's only synchronized to an image on a display
07:19 PM CaptHindsight: sure, I'm just mentioning an application where slow stepping still works
07:19 PM jymmmm: k
07:21 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Different topic... you know that dc dc converter we've been taking about, what would make it good? differnet design? QC? components?
07:22 PM CaptHindsight: bigger heat sink and or good fans
07:22 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: that's it? you wouldn't change anything else about it if you had a choice?
07:23 PM CaptHindsight: same for all the ones on alibaba, bangreat, alisupress etc
07:23 PM CaptHindsight: better quality caps
07:23 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: No no I mean your dream converter, not what's available cheap
07:24 PM CaptHindsight: heh, not really a power supply fanatic
07:24 PM jymmmm: and still cost around $30 for 1500W or less
07:24 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: I'm asking because I can't finding anything and getting to the point of making my own
07:25 PM CaptHindsight: just derate by >50%
07:25 PM jymmmm: or taking something existing and imporving it
07:25 PM CaptHindsight: when they say 1500w they mean 700W
07:25 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Sadly, I am derating them
07:25 PM CaptHindsight: that is the main problem, overselling
07:26 PM CaptHindsight: maybe 505 isn't enough now, maybe it's 75%
07:26 PM CaptHindsight: 505 / 50%
07:26 PM jymmmm: I noticed there are two models of that converter, the differcne I see is the inductor
07:26 PM jymmmm: it's twice as tall
07:26 PM CaptHindsight: are the wires thicker?
07:26 PM jymmmm: Doubtfully,
07:26 PM jymmmm: maybe a few more coils
07:27 PM CaptHindsight: also the inductor core, one might saturate before the other
07:28 PM CaptHindsight: the number, size and voltage rating of the output caps
07:29 PM jymmmm: https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1xll4eeGSBuNjSspbq6AiipXaB.jpg
07:29 PM jymmmm: that's the tall one
07:30 PM jymmmm: short one https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB14oneXLWG3KVjSZPcq6zkbXXas/CC-CV-Boost-Converter-DC-DC-Step-Up-1200W-22A-DC-DC-Booster-Adapter-Power-Supply.jpg
07:30 PM CaptHindsight: I have those
07:31 PM jymmmm: short or tall?
07:31 PM CaptHindsight: like said in the beginning, just derate and use more heat spreader and fans
07:31 PM Tom_L: jymmmm, count the turns
07:32 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: So it's a GOOD design, just shitty components?
07:32 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: not turns, twice as tall (more wire on the windings)
07:32 PM CaptHindsight: I have both on my bench currently
07:33 PM Tom_L: what are the 3 adjustment pots for?
07:33 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: can you take pics of your bigger heatsinks?
07:33 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: CC, CV, and cutoff once battery is charged
07:34 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/psu/heatsink_bulk.jpg
07:34 PM jymmmm: I want to see EXACTLY what CaptHindsight is using/doing in his setup
07:34 PM CaptHindsight: look for heatsinks with 4x the area of the current one
07:34 PM Tom_L: go peek in his window
07:35 PM CaptHindsight: stop peeking
07:35 PM CaptHindsight: ok peek
07:35 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: I'm trying but he hasn't posted pics yet
07:35 PM CaptHindsight: I haven't modified these, i was just letting you know what to do
07:36 PM CaptHindsight: based on typical engineering practice
07:36 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Can you give me the PN of the lil chip on it?
07:36 PM CaptHindsight: it's across the room
07:36 PM CaptHindsight: i can't tell from here
07:36 PM Tom_L: ass magnet has kicked in
07:36 PM CaptHindsight: I'll have to get glasses and magnifier a lamp and also get up
07:37 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: There's ice cold beere siting right next to it and yummy food
07:37 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: ice cold beer and good food == anti-ass-magnet
07:38 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: I'll put fan on it, maybe even two, but bigger heatsink not a bad thing, fans fail
07:38 PM CaptHindsight: the bigger one has a heatsink glued to the top of the PWM controller
07:38 PM jymmmm: boo
07:38 PM CaptHindsight: smaller on has all part numbers scrapped off
07:39 PM CaptHindsight: on/one
07:39 PM CaptHindsight: now I have to get back up and put them back
07:39 PM jymmmm: bastards
07:39 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: have you used/played with the last trimpot?
07:40 PM jymmmm: the one that's suppose to "cutoff" once charged?
07:40 PM Tom_L: jymmmm, try PMP20660
07:40 PM Tom_L: LM5175 maybe
07:41 PM Tom_L: UC3844
07:41 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: where are you getting these PN's from?
07:41 PM Tom_L: my arse
07:41 PM Tom_L: https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=cc+cv+boost+converter+chip
07:43 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: ah, I was trying to find the PN for THAT converter board, see what the REAL not chinese specs are for it
07:44 PM Tom_L: they're likely similar
07:44 PM CaptHindsight: https://imgur.com/y8z6Sf7
07:44 PM CaptHindsight: the two i have
07:44 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: of the firtst two you gave, one has a high limit of 5V the other 50V
07:45 PM Tom_L: scratch those then
07:45 PM Tom_L: wonder why they heatsink the chip
07:45 PM Tom_L: the heat would come from other components on that i'd think
07:47 PM jymmmm: UV = Under Voltage is the 3rd trimpot
07:47 PM jymmmm: But, I don't know if it just lights the LED, or shorts it off too
07:47 PM jymmmm: or shuts down the converter too
07:48 PM jymmmm: I need a "Hey, the battery is full, so I'm shutting off now"
07:49 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: thank you for the pic
07:50 PM Tom_L: it'll cost ya a beer
07:51 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: that's fine
07:51 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: Enablepin. For EN/UVLO< 0.4 V, the LM5175is in a low currentshutdownmode.For 0.7 V <EN/UVLO< 1.23V, the controlleroperatesin standbymodein whichthe VCCregulatoris enabledbutthe PWMcontrolleris not switching.For EN/UVLO> 1.23V, the PWMfunctionis enabled,providedVCCexceedsthe VCCUV threshold.
07:52 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: ^^^ the 3rd trimpot
07:52 PM jymmmm: Ok, so it DOES a mostly shutdown, that works
07:54 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: CaptHindsight I just can't see paying $200+ for a high power charger
07:54 PM jymmmm: when it's really got nothing in the box, just overly inflated price
07:55 PM CaptHindsight: cheap chinese vs guaranteed to work for 2 years under load
07:55 PM CaptHindsight: uchoose
07:56 PM jymmmm: 90day
07:56 PM CaptHindsight: a power supply from a name brand co usually picks out parts they can warranty for 1-2 years
07:57 PM jymmmm: still too high priced
07:57 PM CaptHindsight: they know what corners they are or are not cutting
07:59 PM jymmmm: I already ordered some HP 700W PS, just need the CC/CV and cutoff
07:59 PM jymmmm: 12VDC@68A
08:00 PM CaptHindsight: right now it is a CV supply
08:00 PM flyback: jym,
08:00 PM jymmmm: and then use that converter to get CC/CV and the stepup
08:00 PM flyback: you know you can get that from server psu's
08:00 PM flyback: I dunn oif they are constant current though
08:01 PM flyback: but many of them are straight 12vdc out mabye a +5 or +3.3 vsb line also
08:01 PM jymmmm: flyback: I know, they are not, they are already being shipped to me
08:01 PM flyback: plus i2c bus with moitoring and control
08:01 PM CaptHindsight: a constant current supply will vary the output voltage to keep the current constant
08:03 PM jymmmm: yep
08:04 PM jymmmm: Wanna see soemthign cool?
08:04 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5Pl_23Uf94
08:04 PM jymmmm: this is cool https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUjaSYpyF6k
08:05 PM CaptHindsight: trump commercial?
08:06 PM CaptHindsight: oh after
08:07 PM XXCoder: noscript stops yt ad from working. considering apparent trump commerical im glad heh
08:07 PM jymmmm: Oh, sorry, I use ABP I see ZERO ads
08:07 PM XXCoder: ad got nothing to do with you why be sorry :)
08:07 PM CaptHindsight: is there a no need to see all your browser stuff version of ABP?
08:08 PM jymmmm: sorry that you guys had to see douchebag
08:08 PM CaptHindsight: now ABP is the spy
08:09 PM CaptHindsight: have to go, WI liquor closes in 50 minutes
08:09 PM CaptHindsight: must cross state line
08:09 PM jymmmm: see ya
08:11 PM Rab: I think uBlock Origin is preferred over ABP these days.
08:11 PM jymmmm: Eh, it's installed and working. If I change I'll try ublok sometime
08:12 PM t4nk_freenode: I think that has been the case for years now, at least for me
08:13 PM t4nk_freenode: though I hardly touch origin, it's mostly matrix for me
10:51 PM veegee: Hmmm
10:51 PM veegee: What's a good way to measure the "equivalent" torque that my impact wrench puts on a bolt in the forward direction?
10:51 PM veegee: mechanical impulse (m•v) isn't equal to force
10:53 PM veegee: Sorry impulse is N•s or kg•m/s, I meant to say momentum (m•v)
10:54 PM veegee: So how does the energy of the impact translate into how far you can tighten the bolt? There are a lot of factors at play such as being able to overcome the coefficient of static friction whereas a static torque may not be able to
10:55 PM jymmmm: crazy glue your hand to the output, and see how many times it twists your arm before you let go of the trigger, divide that by the gravitational force of 1.2GW
10:57 PM veegee: No u first lolol
10:57 PM veegee: also it's one point twenty one jigawatts you miserable failure
10:58 PM veegee: I'm trying to figure out the fundamental operating principle of an impact wrench in terms of classical mechanics
10:59 PM veegee: It fundamentally delivers energy, but there's more to it than that because obviously the peak force (torque) and time are important, so the impulse is a factor
11:03 PM veegee: Also just realized impulse ad momentum have the same units
11:22 PM unterhaus_: for quite a while, the military was trying to hire people to model impact. It's not super-simple
11:42 PM veegee: You mean in Hitler's concentration camps?
11:48 PM XXCoder: veee wat