#linuxcnc Logs
Jul 15 2020
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:24 AM roycroft: abom79 is really going big tonight
12:30 AM roycroft: he's running a bead with a 1000a welder and a 3/4" diameter rod
02:17 AM pink_vampire: I need a dro for my lathe
02:18 AM pink_vampire: what will be a good dro for it?
02:21 AM XXCoder: dunno but theres bunch on aliexpress
02:29 AM pink_vampire: but I don't want to get some junk
02:30 AM pink_vampire: also can someone identify this lathe? https://i.imgur.com/DSs297d.jpeg
02:32 AM roycroft: a glass scale dro would be the most durable and accurate type
02:32 AM roycroft: don't get a harbor freight digital caliper type
02:41 AM pink_vampire: what will be the fastest?
03:21 AM Centurion-Dan2 is now known as Centurion_Dan
04:31 AM andypugh: pink_vampire: It’s a lathe.
04:32 AM andypugh: (Or did you want more than that?)
04:32 AM XXCoder: hey andy
04:35 AM andypugh: I’m not here. :-)
04:35 AM andypugh: (Just swapped from work to home computer briefly)
04:37 AM XXCoder: wow for guy thats not here, youre very,,, here
04:37 AM XXCoder: ;)
05:13 AM pink_vampire: andypugh: yeah.. like what model it is
05:13 AM JT-Cave: morning
05:13 AM XXCoder: hry jt
05:13 AM pink_vampire: hi JT-Cave
05:13 AM XXCoder: apparently someone at work got covid so today I didnt work
05:13 AM XXCoder: shop was compleely empty wow
05:14 AM XXCoder: talked to boss and found that he told me that shop is closed for today
05:14 AM JT-Cave: wow
05:53 AM pink_vampire: I need to get some sleep, it is light outside!
06:01 AM XXCoder: oh no evil light is out
06:15 AM Tom_L: morning
06:29 AM Tom_L: XXCoder, they have to disinfect the whole shop
06:29 AM XXCoder: yep thats why it was closed today
06:30 AM Tom_L: technically they make all the workers get tested and quarantine 14 days before they can reopen
06:30 AM XXCoder: seems not the case
06:31 AM Tom_L: they _could_ just isolate his work area and have them tested
06:32 AM XXCoder: maybe i dont know who tested postive
06:32 AM Tom_L: possibly, they're not allowed to disclose that
06:32 AM Tom_L: hipa laws
06:32 AM XXCoder: yep know that
06:32 AM XXCoder: though i might be able to guess
06:33 AM XXCoder: unless its office guy who goes to back all time
06:33 AM Tom_L: they were very quiet about it at my kid's work
08:46 AM jymmmm: Not HIPPA, but disclosure'of knowledge of employee health data, which they are not allowed to have.
08:47 AM SpeedEvil: Tehre are typically exemptions for public safety.
08:47 AM jymmmm: Not employeers afaik
08:50 AM JavaBean: ^
09:01 AM jymmmm: Ok, it's under the ADA act... https://www.eeoc.gov/wysk/what-you-should-know-about-covid-19-and-ada-rehabilitation-act-and-other-eeo-laws
09:21 AM t4nk_freenode: CaptHindsight, ... mewmewcat Oscilloscope LCD Touching Screen Oscilloscope
09:26 AM Loetmichel: man, when will i ever learn? just started a print on the new SLA printer... display: "time to go: 2:30h"... worktime left today: 40min... :-(
09:59 AM flyback: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC64FbxoHfUWd5hykYk5_BvQ
10:01 AM jymmmm: Loetmichel: That's 2 Days, 30 hours
10:02 AM Loetmichel: Jymmm: nitpic
10:02 AM Loetmichel: i meant 2h 30 min of course
10:02 AM jymmmm: Loetmichel: So, now you have to stay until the print job is doen in three days
10:19 AM perry_j1987: morning guys
11:00 AM JT-Shop: yo
11:41 AM roycroft: so i have a taiwanese woodworking machine that was missing a bunch of fasteners, all metric
11:41 AM roycroft: i had most of them in stock, and was easily able to find the rest locally, except for one - there was a single m5-1.5 lht hex nut missing
11:42 AM roycroft: i chased all over town for that, and finally found one, for which i got to pay $9 for the single nit
11:42 AM roycroft: and it's m8-1.5, not m5-1.5
11:42 AM roycroft: except when i got home it wasn't m8-1.5
11:42 AM roycroft: it was actually 5/16-18 lht
11:42 AM roycroft: the m8 nut *almost* fit
11:43 AM roycroft: and had i measured more carefully i'd have known what it was up front, but since literally every other fastener on the machine was metric, it seemed safe to assume that it was also metric
11:43 AM * cpresser laughs in metric
11:43 AM roycroft: 5/16-18 lht nuts are fairly easy to find
11:44 AM t4nk_freenode: buy local!!!!
11:44 AM t4nk_freenode: (lol)
11:44 AM t4nk_freenode: (they need our support!!)
11:44 AM roycroft: unfortunately, the $9 one that i bought is from my least favorite local supplier, it's a long drive to get to them, and they charge a 20% restocking fee, with a minimum fee of $10
11:44 AM roycroft: it would cost me more to return it than what i paid for it
11:44 AM JT-Cave: what's fun on some older machines made in Taiwan is discovering they used Whitworth
11:45 AM roycroft: i guess some day i might need an m8-1.5 lht nut and i won't have to do this again
11:45 AM roycroft: whitworth hasn't been used in the west since wwii
11:45 AM roycroft: when we unified the british and us standards
11:46 AM roycroft: i guess all that whitworth tooling had to go somewhere
11:46 AM t4nk_freenode: heh, yeh, I first heard the term whitworth... from my grandparents ;)
11:48 AM roycroft: during the war we discovered that british and american fastners were almost interchangeable, but not quite, and since it would be so benificial to be able to pool/share resources, the unified standard came about
12:00 PM gregcnc: make the required nut?
12:03 PM gregcnc: would have been a lot more fun to make the metric and find out if was wrong.
12:19 PM CaptHindsight: I have to check every fastener I buy at the ACE or Home Depot since they are usually not it the correct bins and if bagged sometimes a different thread than marked
12:24 PM CaptHindsight: t4nk_freenode: "mewmewcat" I like that one
12:30 PM CaptHindsight: t4nk_freenode: https://www.amazon.ca/Nicknocks-Digital-Oscilloscope-Portable-Handheld/dp/B07SW461XV
12:33 PM t4nk_freenode: Nicknocks storefront
12:33 PM t4nk_freenode: 3 out of 5 stars53% positive in the last 12 months (64 ratings)
12:34 PM t4nk_freenode: 30 days Negative 100%
12:34 PM t4nk_freenode: ;)
12:37 PM CaptHindsight: ReeJekd
12:39 PM t4nk_freenode: wow, CaptHindsight ... some store you found there...
12:39 PM t4nk_freenode: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33021370646.html
12:39 PM t4nk_freenode: twice as expensive as ali
12:40 PM t4nk_freenode: ali has free ae shipping, nicknocks just uses cainiao hehe
12:41 PM t4nk_freenode: plus.. all the amazon victims will be unpleasantly surprised by customs fees
12:41 PM t4nk_freenode: though on the other hand: not many ppl actually seem to have received their package at all
12:41 PM CaptHindsight: shipping surprise vs surprise shipping
12:42 PM t4nk_freenode: hehe
12:42 PM CaptHindsight: 3 weeks from China via SpeedPak was my latest
12:43 PM CaptHindsight: sent USPS priority to Germany and it's 2+ months already
12:44 PM t4nk_freenode: isn't that quite the expensive of shipping options? must be quite expensive
12:44 PM CaptHindsight: small box ~16oz
12:45 PM t4nk_freenode: I orders from 2 ali stores last week, today I got a mail that the packages have arrived 'in my country'
12:45 PM CaptHindsight: .5kg
12:46 PM Tom_L: i laugh at companies that make shipper labels to make you think their junk has shipped then wait a few days to actually kick it out the door
12:48 PM t4nk_freenode: I detest that
12:48 PM t4nk_freenode: bah
12:49 PM CaptHindsight: I paid for 2 day shipping why did it take a week?
12:49 PM CaptHindsight: Because it shipped on day 5
12:49 PM t4nk_freenode: I ordered some rosin, paid a bit more because they promised trackable, faster aliexpress shipping...
12:49 PM t4nk_freenode: bastard sent the package through cainiao
12:49 PM CaptHindsight: ooops
12:50 PM t4nk_freenode: 16 Apr 2020 19:50 Accepted by carrier
12:50 PM CaptHindsight: sorry do you want to return?
12:50 PM t4nk_freenode: 23 May 2020 17:23 Arrive at destination country
12:50 PM t4nk_freenode: Days in transit 89
12:50 PM veegee: CaptHindsight one of my forklifts has 6" forks and the other has 4" forks. I'm getting extensions. It's ok to get the wider ones that fit the 6" forks and use them on the smaller 4" forks right?
12:50 PM Tom_L: sneeze in the box and send it back to em
12:50 PM t4nk_freenode: I don't really think the package will ever come... already got my refund through a dispute
12:51 PM t4nk_freenode: yeh, exactly CaptHindsight ... 'oops'
12:51 PM t4nk_freenode: really, so low ;)
12:51 PM CaptHindsight: veegee: if you can keep them from sliding around
12:51 PM veegee: I guess I can make some padding for the 4" forks
12:52 PM CaptHindsight: veegee: you don't want a load coming loose
12:52 PM veegee: That's what she said
12:52 PM veegee: (sorry)
12:52 PM veegee: https://www.mrdockplate.ca/product/forklift-extensions/
12:53 PM veegee: They're cheap enough, not worth the hassle, I can just get a dedicated pair for each forklift
12:54 PM Tom_L: don't get em so long they tip the forklift over
12:54 PM veegee: Hmm, 6, 7, or 8 ft?
12:54 PM veegee: 8 ft super useful for getting things out of a trailer
12:54 PM Tom_L: better get some counterweights too
12:54 PM CaptHindsight: center of mass
12:54 PM veegee: I'm not lifting anywhere near that much on a regular basis
12:54 PM Tom_L: just takes once
12:54 PM CaptHindsight: derate load capacity
12:55 PM veegee: Usually less than 1,000 lbs
12:55 PM veegee: like 500lb loads
12:55 PM veegee: Biggest downside of long forks is can't go up against a wall
12:55 PM Tom_L: and you say this is a hobby?
12:55 PM veegee: indeed
12:56 PM veegee: I balance my life, 6 hours of work at the office, rest of day at workshop
12:56 PM Tom_L: i'm gonna start a go fund me just for you
12:56 PM veegee: People blow $200 on stupid shit like clothes
12:56 PM veegee: Forklift extensions can be sold and will last forever
12:57 PM veegee: I almost always buy used items too for 20% of original cost. That's how I'm able to do all this
12:57 PM veegee: 'And my monthly rent is $1,500, less than what my employees pay for their apartments
12:57 PM veegee: not nearly as expensive as what people think
12:57 PM veegee: I bought the forklift for $4,000. People blow that on a TV
12:57 PM Tom_L: not this ppl
12:57 PM CaptHindsight: please no rants today :)
12:58 PM Tom_L: awwwww
12:58 PM veegee: Not a rant, just saying
12:58 PM Tom_L: i'm all for it
12:58 PM Tom_L: if you can pull it off
12:58 PM CaptHindsight: no coffee yet today
12:59 PM veegee: I guess I'll start with the 8ft extensions. Great for lifting 4x8 plywood
01:00 PM jymmmm: You know what really annoys me.... Peeople that whine about rants yet haven't had their coffee yet?! Like, WTH, you know what the problem is, so.... GIT ER DONE and quit whining about ranting you ranting whiner!
01:00 PM veegee: Ok off to get the extensions. I love you all <3
01:01 PM Loetmichel: Jymmm: did so: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=17904&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
01:01 PM Loetmichel: :-)
01:01 PM Tom_L: jymmmm, i'm not even a coffee drinker so wtf am i supposed to do???
01:02 PM Loetmichel: it was indeed the exposure that was wrong. black resin needs more than 8 secs (14) and less than 0.1mm layer height (0.05mm)
01:02 PM jymmmm: Loetmichel: refresh my memory
01:02 PM Loetmichel: aaaand it works after three failues
01:02 PM t4nk_freenode: CaptHindsight, .... for 50euro's.. that oscilloscope doesn't seem too bad, does it?
01:02 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: drugs? weed? peote? adrelalin? tea?
01:03 PM Loetmichel: the result of me doing overtime because i dont learn to NOT start a print short of end of work for the day
01:03 PM Loetmichel: (is there an english word for "feierabend"?)
01:03 PM CaptHindsight: Dear Sirs, (and Jym) 3rd party whining about rants about whining are no longer acceptable unless spoken with a strong accent. Please rephrase and uncheck spelling. Sincerely, The management.
01:03 PM jymmmm: Loetmichel: Ah, you using a rPi?
01:03 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: yo momma!
01:03 PM Tom_L: Loetmichel, end of work day
01:04 PM Loetmichel: no, its a Elegoo Mars resin 3dprinter. it doesent have a usb serial port
01:04 PM Loetmichel: so an octopi would be useless
01:05 PM Loetmichel: i simply carried the file per usb drive
01:05 PM Tom_L: put a camera on it and go home
01:05 PM jymmmm: Loetmichel: Oh, um, maybe attach a tiny clock to the printer and a sticker that says "Quitting time?"
01:05 PM Loetmichel: resin doesent like to sit in the vat all night
01:05 PM Loetmichel: @ Tom_L
01:06 PM CaptHindsight: thinking about making an aeropress from cast iron
01:06 PM jymmmm: Loetmichel: they look decent for being printed
01:06 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: like a comPRESSer ?
01:06 PM t4nk_freenode: Loetmichel, I think you were quite close with 'end of work', 'end of shift', perhaps 'head home for the evening' might also work
01:06 PM jymmmm: <rim shot in an indian accent>
01:07 PM CaptHindsight: Loetmichel: what happened to the resin over night?
01:08 PM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight: nothing, but it MIGHT harden if you let it sit in a company that has flourescent lights on the ceiling all night
01:08 PM Loetmichel: nothing yet
01:08 PM CaptHindsight: Loetmichel: doesn't it have wifi?
01:08 PM Loetmichel: i simply didnt want to risk it
01:09 PM CaptHindsight: yeah, throw a dark blanket over it
01:09 PM Loetmichel: nope, the elegoo mars has no wifi and no usb device (only host for flash drives) and no rj45 either
01:09 PM Loetmichel: its an $200 UV resin printer...
01:10 PM CaptHindsight: yeah there are many versions of that printer
01:10 PM CaptHindsight: I posted the link the the controllers the other day
01:10 PM Loetmichel: standard NEW elgoo mars.
01:10 PM Loetmichel: i already looked inside.
01:10 PM Loetmichel: it has the new board
01:10 PM Loetmichel: no more rj45 ;)
01:11 PM CaptHindsight: featuring closed source software, so you can't share files
01:12 PM CaptHindsight: someone sent us one a few years ago before they launched to test resins
01:13 PM Loetmichel: i am not complaining
01:13 PM Loetmichel: to test out the "UV resin printing" waters its cheap enough
01:13 PM Loetmichel: if it works reasonably well for us we may get a couple bigger ones with wifi and so on.
01:13 PM CaptHindsight: can always convert to LCNC
01:14 PM Loetmichel: that wouldnt make sense for an UV printer with LCD
01:14 PM Loetmichel: it isnt laser based
01:14 PM Loetmichel: it has exactly ONE stepper motor
01:14 PM CaptHindsight: no, just LCD with 405nm-ish leds behind it
01:15 PM Loetmichel: indeed
01:15 PM Loetmichel: ONE led
01:15 PM Loetmichel: but a 10W one ;)
01:15 PM CaptHindsight: nobel.1 was laser https://ibin.co/2pHv3dRFYeNM.jpg
01:15 PM Loetmichel: or even more, it gets pretty hot
01:18 PM CaptHindsight: https://imgur.com/zvxoHUT 500W led powered
01:20 PM CaptHindsight: the formlabs are also laser and galvo
01:20 PM CaptHindsight: everyone else is LCD bottom up
01:24 PM jymmmm: How would YOU connect these together? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKxGZiNDlho
01:24 PM jymmmm: I'm not too concerned about galvonic whatchamacallit
01:25 PM Loetmichel: eihter spotwelding a copper/nickel tab on or pressing it between two copper strips that "grip" the alu with small teeth and are screwed on
01:26 PM Loetmichel: i wouldnt cut out any of the alredy small tab thats still there
01:26 PM jymmmm: spot welding doesn't seem to work, or is weak, many tried
01:28 PM Loetmichel: then get some 15*3 copper bar, mill 90° teeth on one side, a series of holes on the other for small screws, use the screws to press the remaining alu tab into a "zigzag" shape with two of those bars
01:28 PM Loetmichel: then use one or more of the screws to connect approbiatly thick copper wire
01:29 PM Loetmichel: s/side/half of the 15mm width
01:29 PM jymmmm: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOdtoflZDpk
01:29 PM Loetmichel: at least thats what i would do
01:30 PM Loetmichel: a) he uses WAY not enough screws
01:30 PM Loetmichel: b) dont grab the foil pack, just the tab
01:31 PM Loetmichel: c) use teeth on the connecting bar on BOTH sides so the alu oxide on top is cut by bending
01:31 PM Loetmichel: d) his upper "lid" is WAY to thin
01:32 PM Loetmichel: <- can be a bit pedantic sometimes ;)
01:32 PM jymmmm: I was thinking 1/16" thick 1/2" wide alum bars, slightly bowed in the middle liek thise (sideways) ---> )( so when bolted together x2, it will sandwich the middle of the tabs
01:33 PM Loetmichel: yeah, still would use about 5 screws o those packs
01:34 PM Loetmichel: and some "teeth" on the bars so that they "bite" into the tab
01:34 PM Loetmichel: also make the bars wide enough that the screws are NOT inside the tab but above it
01:34 PM Loetmichel: so that the "toothed" part of the bars is without any holes that weaken the already weak tab even more
01:35 PM Loetmichel: just so you know my reasoning
01:36 PM jymmmm: Eh, I don't really want modify the tabs with more holes
01:36 PM Loetmichel: yes, exactly
01:36 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: do you have a a clear pic of your battery tabs?
01:37 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0284/0946/2862/products/DSC_0457_71905da9-be7f-4cc0-9cf0-0a4ab7ac8892_500x.jpg?v=1592243777
01:38 PM CaptHindsight: yeah clamp
01:38 PM CaptHindsight: there are notches to clear the fasteners
01:39 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIwMFgxNTk5/z/MuYAAOSwDkVaakSh/$_57.JPG?set_id=8800005007
01:39 PM CaptHindsight: does each cell come with a $20?
01:40 PM jymmmm: $20 pesos
01:40 PM CaptHindsight: those might be good in Mexico, maybe
01:41 PM jymmmm: I'm not sure how to parallel like 10 cells though
01:42 PM CaptHindsight: stack 10, like a deck of cards?
01:42 PM jymmmm: yeah
01:42 PM jymmmm: threaded rod ?
01:43 PM CaptHindsight: what is the thickness of each cell?
01:43 PM gregcnc: why did you opt for this instead of the mega stack of 18650?
01:43 PM jymmmm: it's the spacers that I'd rather buy off the shelf if possible.
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: are we trying to manage the temp of the cell sandwich?
01:44 PM jymmmm: Capt 9mm I believe
01:44 PM jymmmm: gregcnc: energy desent per AH, pure weight factor
01:44 PM gregcnc: any real tests of these out there?
01:45 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Nope, just per "pack"
01:45 PM jymmmm: gregcnc: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_sM0ggQhE0 and
01:45 PM jymmmm: gregcnc: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQjXCL0rId0
01:46 PM jymmmm: gregcnc: https://youtu.be/KKxGZiNDlho
01:46 PM gregcnc: how many cycles are they good for?
01:46 PM jymmmm: Rated at 2000
01:47 PM jymmmm: Even if at 80%, that's still 6.4AH
01:47 PM gregcnc: they are cheap enough
01:47 PM jymmmm: .67 lbs each
01:48 PM jymmmm: 4S9P gives 1209WH and that's derated by 80%
01:49 PM jymmmm: Sorry, that's at the full 8AH, at 6.4AH (80%) thats 968WH
01:50 PM gregcnc: nobody has come up with an assembly method other than solder?
01:50 PM jymmmm: not even solder, just nuts and bolts or grommets
01:51 PM jymmmm: Now, you want a REAL cell (zero cycles) 60AH https://batteryhookup.com/products/new-lg-chem-n2-1-3-7v-120ah-cell-module?variant=31947081154692
01:51 PM jymmmm: BUT, they sell out very quickly
01:52 PM CaptHindsight: I'd make an aluminum rack for the bodies and a copper bus for the tabs
01:53 PM CaptHindsight: monitor the temp of the center cells during peak charge and discharge
01:54 PM CaptHindsight: adjust the thickness of each shelf to conduct heat to a spreader
01:56 PM CaptHindsight: my design would work, but nobody makes this, yet
01:57 PM CaptHindsight: if max density is not a concern then you could have air space between cells
01:58 PM CaptHindsight: or have them radially spread
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: https://static3.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2016/6/3/1580111-1465012444835555_origin.jpg
02:00 PM CaptHindsight: Tesla uses my idea :)
02:02 PM CaptHindsight: is tesla hiring?
02:03 PM CaptHindsight: https://electrek.co/2017/01/24/tesla-teardown-100-kwh-battery-pack/ or liquid cooling
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: same is true for lipo packs or cylindrical cells
02:04 PM gregcnc: https://batteryhookup.com/products/spim08hp-3-7v-8ah-200a-lithium-ion-w-cell-holder
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: they generate heat, so you have to manage their temp as well as connect the tabs
02:05 PM jymmmm: Spacers https://www.ebay.com/itm/4-pc-1-4-X-1-4-X-12-long-new-6061-T6-solid-aluminum-plate-flat-stock-bar-block/233463815234
02:06 PM CaptHindsight: air cooled
02:06 PM jymmmm: Well, I might do 5P packs instead, then wire them together
02:09 PM jymmmm: They are rated at 200A, I'm barely gonna do 1C
02:10 PM jymmmm: Don't they make 1/4" OD alum sq tubing?
02:15 PM CaptHindsight: https://seekingalpha.com/article/3537486-game-over-tesla-wins I thought that their battery design was more unique
02:15 PM CaptHindsight: it's not very
02:17 PM CaptHindsight: but you can see what trade-off they made between density, repair-ability, thermal management and reliability etc
02:19 PM roycroft: hey folks
02:19 PM roycroft: i have an air compressor with a bit of a problem
02:19 PM roycroft: more an annoyance
02:20 PM roycroft: it has a 5hp motor, and it's on a 20a circuit, which is fine most of the time
02:20 PM roycroft: but sometimes the startup current pops the breaker
02:20 PM roycroft: it's neither feasible to increase the capacity of the circiut nor do i want to - i'd like it to still trip on a 20a load most of the time
02:21 PM roycroft: could this be solved by putting a capacitor inline to store some extra current for startup?
02:21 PM roycroft: safely and reasonably
02:22 PM jymmmm: roycroft: voltage?
02:23 PM CaptHindsight: No
02:23 PM roycroft: 240vac
02:23 PM roycroft: i thought probably not, capthindsight
02:24 PM jymmmm: roycroft: $225 https://www.briskheat.com/single-phase-soft-starter.html
02:24 PM CaptHindsight: maybe a clutch
02:25 PM CaptHindsight: no load when starting then the clutch slides to engage
02:25 PM roycroft: the circuit should handle a 5hp motor just fine - 240vac@20a~=6.25hp
02:25 PM CaptHindsight: the breaker could be old
02:25 PM roycroft: it's just on startup
02:25 PM CaptHindsight: a new breaker might just solve this
02:25 PM CaptHindsight: they have limited life
02:26 PM roycroft: i can run the motor for a long time without tripping it
02:26 PM roycroft: yes, i know they have limited life
02:26 PM jymmmm: inrush
02:26 PM roycroft: and this one has tripped many times over the years
02:26 PM roycroft: probably hundreds
02:26 PM roycroft: but it was like this when i first installed it
02:26 PM gregcnc: Is the wiring spec different for installing a longer starting current breaker as used on A/C compresors
02:26 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: WHAT?! YOu mean my screw in 120V fuses won't last forever?
02:26 PM roycroft: i'll look into that soft starter
02:26 PM gregcnc: i forget the classification? D or siomethisn?
02:27 PM roycroft: the issue isn't really so much the compressor
02:27 PM roycroft: it's that i took a feed off that circuit to my belt grinder, which is in a different shop
02:27 PM jymmmm: roycroft: Look around, that was a 1st search result. I do know they use them on RV AC units to be able to run on smaller generators
02:27 PM CaptHindsight: check all the connections and tighten
02:27 PM roycroft: i never use air and the belt grinder at the same time - the compressor has never run at the same time as the belt grinder
02:27 PM CaptHindsight: use thicker wire for lower voltage drop
02:28 PM roycroft: but the breaker is about 1m away from the compressor, which is why i never bothered to fix this in the past
02:28 PM roycroft: it was no big deal
02:28 PM roycroft: but the belt grinder is in a different shop
02:28 PM CaptHindsight: might be a bunch of little things adding up
02:28 PM roycroft: and when i go out there to use it and there's no power i have to go back to the main shop to reset the breaker
02:28 PM jymmmm: roycroft: what gauge wire to the compressor now?
02:28 PM roycroft: which annoys me
02:28 PM roycroft: 10ga, i think
02:28 PM roycroft: actually, it's 6ga to the subpanel
02:29 PM roycroft: and 10 or 12ga to the compressor
02:29 PM gregcnc: unloader valve is present and working?
02:29 PM roycroft: i forget which
02:29 PM roycroft: probably 12ga
02:29 PM roycroft: the unloader is working
02:29 PM jymmmm: double it? parallel the 10ga to the compressor maybe?
02:29 PM roycroft: i have replaced it in the past
02:29 PM roycroft: it's less than a meter from the breaker to the compressor switch
02:29 PM roycroft: the wire gauge is not the problem
02:30 PM jymmmm: It won't hurt anything, especially if it's 12ga now
02:30 PM roycroft: the one time a long time ago that i thought it might be an unloader issue i replaced it, and nothing changed
02:30 PM jymmmm: cheap enough too
02:31 PM roycroft: it's totally not necssary over that short a run
02:31 PM roycroft: but i might verify that the wires are making good contact to the switch
02:31 PM jymmmm: roycroft: do you have a clamp in amp meter?
02:31 PM roycroft: and to the breaker
02:31 PM roycroft: yes
02:32 PM jymmmm: does it have a peak hold? Maybe measure the inrush at startup
02:32 PM roycroft: i'll go measure it some time when the compressor starts up
02:32 PM roycroft: i don't think it has a peak hold, but i'm not sure
02:32 PM roycroft: i'd also have to find somewhere to clamp it on
02:32 PM roycroft: the wires are thhn, running in flex metal conduit
02:32 PM roycroft: i'm not sure i'd get a good reading from that
02:32 PM jymmmm: tinside the sub panel?
02:32 PM roycroft: not much room there
02:32 PM jymmmm: ah
02:33 PM roycroft: it's not a standard subpanel
02:33 PM jymmmm: gotcha
02:33 PM roycroft: it's a hot tub panel
02:33 PM jymmmm: roycroft: Do you have 10Ga laying around?
02:33 PM roycroft: there's a 60a gfci breaker, a 20a 240vac breaker, and a couple 20a 120vac breakers
02:33 PM roycroft: yes, i have plenty
02:33 PM roycroft: but 12ga is rated at 30a for short runs
02:33 PM roycroft: er
02:33 PM roycroft: 20a
02:33 PM roycroft: which is what i have
02:34 PM roycroft: so over a 1m run it should be just fine
02:34 PM gregcnc: 1meter between breaker and compressor?
02:34 PM roycroft: it should handle 30m with no appreciable voltage loss
02:34 PM roycroft: yes
02:34 PM jymmmm: Right, but if the inrush is 40 or 60A, you might get some loss
02:34 PM roycroft: but i'll measure voltage at the compressor switch
02:35 PM gregcnc: and why hasn't the wire and outlet been upgraded?
02:35 PM roycroft: if the existing wires are 12ga i'lll replace them wiht 10ga
02:35 PM roycroft: there is not an outlet
02:35 PM roycroft: it's hard-wired to the breaker box
02:35 PM roycroft: and there should be no need to "ugprade"
02:35 PM jymmmm: roycroft: I'm just saying that replacing the wire is a cheaper attempt than a new break, and wont hurt anything, and you can leave in a little extra to be able to clamp on your meter
02:36 PM gregcnc: but it has never worked correctly?
02:36 PM roycroft: the motor is rated at 16a
02:36 PM roycroft: the breaker is 20a
02:36 PM gregcnc: inrush current is a real thing
02:36 PM CaptHindsight: if it's belt drive you can also change the pulleys
02:37 PM roycroft: that would be outrageously expensive
02:37 PM roycroft: the motor sheaves are already tiny - i'd not want to make them any smaller
02:37 PM roycroft: and the pump sheaves are about 16" in diameter already
02:38 PM roycroft: jymmm: i'll check to see if it's 12ga or 10ga
02:38 PM roycroft: you're correct, that would not be that big a deal
02:38 PM gregcnc: how long from switching on until the breaker trips?
02:38 PM roycroft: it would take me 20 minutes
02:38 PM roycroft: well
02:38 PM roycroft: i'm *never* around when it happens
02:38 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Siemens-Circuit-Breaker-21A-3RV1021-1AA15-/161703399510
02:38 PM roycroft: but i assume almost immediately
02:38 PM jymmmm: roycroft: and give you room to use your clamp meter too
02:39 PM roycroft: yes
02:39 PM roycroft: sometimes the compressor will go for days on end without tripping the breaker
02:39 PM roycroft: sometimes it will happen multiple times/day
02:39 PM gregcnc: what is panel supply voltage?
02:39 PM CaptHindsight: more often on warmer days by chance?
02:40 PM roycroft: it may be that when the pump stops while in a compression stroke it trips the next time it turns on
02:40 PM jymmmm: I just bought a Klein CL800, reads AC AND DC amperage up to 600A, and even measures caps, and temp
02:40 PM roycroft: the panel supply is 240vac
02:40 PM gregcnc: measured?
02:40 PM roycroft: and i'm feeding 60a to the panel
02:40 PM roycroft: a long time ago
02:40 PM CaptHindsight: is the voltage lower on those days?
02:40 PM roycroft: when i first installed it
02:40 PM roycroft: it seems to happen at night mostly
02:41 PM roycroft: and during the summer that would tend not to be a low voltage time
02:41 PM roycroft: but i've not measured
02:41 PM jymmmm: roycroft: around 6 to 8 pm?
02:41 PM roycroft: no
02:41 PM roycroft: like the middle of the night
02:41 PM roycroft: i usually leave the compressor on all the time except when i'm doing maintenance on it
02:41 PM roycroft: i don't turn it off and drain it every day
02:41 PM roycroft: i drain it every couple weeks or so
02:41 PM roycroft: and don't get much water
02:42 PM roycroft: it's out of the way enough that it's a hassle to turn it on and off all the time, so i just leave it on
02:42 PM roycroft: i should put a mark on the pump sheeves so i can note the location when it's tripped
02:43 PM roycroft: if the mark is in the same location every time that would indicate that it's stopped on a compression stroke
02:43 PM roycroft: and that might indicate that, even though i've swapped the unloader in the past, it might be a problem with the unloader
02:43 PM CaptHindsight: I'd swap 20A breakers and see if it goes away
02:43 PM roycroft: i might have a spare 20a breaker
02:44 PM roycroft: if so that's the easiest thing to do
02:44 PM roycroft: easy and free
02:44 PM roycroft: swapping the wires for 10ga if they're currently 12ga is almost as easy
02:44 PM roycroft: and is still free
02:44 PM roycroft: as in no out-of-pocket, since i have wire in stock
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: sounds like a plan
02:45 PM roycroft: i do hear the unloader vent whenever the pump stops
02:45 PM roycroft: so that's another reason i don't suspect it
02:45 PM roycroft: but putting a mark on the sheave is very cheap and very easy
02:46 PM roycroft: i've never once had it trip immediately after resetting it
02:47 PM jymmmm: roycroft: FWIW.... I just replaced the fan motor on my HVAC unit. It's rated at 1.8A, but I JUST measured the inrush current 2 minutes ago at it was, 4.76A, 2.5x greater than it's rating.
02:51 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.ecmweb.com/design/article/20897071/motor-calculations-part-1-motors-and-branchcircuit-conductors
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.mikeholt.com/mojonewsarchive/NEC-HTML/HTML/Article-430-Motors-Motor-Circuits-and-Controllers~20031126.htm
02:54 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: By that first link, a 16A motor should be on a 24A circuit (125%)
02:54 PM gregcnc: ? 16x1.25=20
02:56 PM jymmmm: gregcnc: oh, duh, my bad =)
02:56 PM jymmmm: fat fingers =)
02:59 PM CaptHindsight: yes 20A is the MINIMUM overcurrent protection device required
03:00 PM Tom_L: jymmmm, you just wanted to play with your new meter
03:00 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: Um, maybeeeeee
03:01 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: I already OL starting the car =)
03:01 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: I was thinking about getting the CL900, 1200A, but then you lose other features
03:01 PM roycroft: i've considered getting a bigger subpanel and putting the compressor on its own 30a circuit, while keeping the remote belt grinder on a 20a circuit
03:02 PM roycroft: but that would cost a couple hundred dollars or so
03:02 PM roycroft: i still may go that route
03:02 PM roycroft: it would probably be less expensive than that soft starter
03:02 PM roycroft: although it would be more work
03:02 PM roycroft: especially if i could use my existing breakers it would be less expensive
03:03 PM CaptHindsight: wait 5hp motor?
03:04 PM jymmmm: 7ft of 10ga seems to be the cheapest first solution attempt, then a new breaker, then maybe soft start, or new sub panel, Lastly, get 200 neighborhood squirrels, and an espress machine
03:04 PM Tom_L: i wired 10ga to mine, never had any issues
03:04 PM gregcnc: 16A FLA "5HP" motor
03:05 PM jymmmm: SQUIRREL POWER FTW!!!
03:05 PM Tom_L: be one damn big squirrel
03:05 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: Nah, 200 normal sized
03:06 PM jymmmm: Like 20 Mule Team, but 2000 Squirrel team
03:06 PM CaptHindsight: 5hp 230V should be 28A
03:07 PM jymmmm: the espresso machine is to keep them pumped up
03:07 PM CaptHindsight: for single phase motor ^^
03:07 PM roycroft: i think your maths are off
03:07 PM CaptHindsight: for 3 phase 230V 5hp motor 15.2A
03:07 PM roycroft: 1hp = ~750w
03:07 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/elctrical-motor-full-load-current-d_1499.html
03:08 PM jymmmm: This 1/4HP 1ph 220V motor I just replaced is 1.8A
03:08 PM roycroft: this motor is a us-made leeson
03:08 PM Tom_L: uphill or down?
03:08 PM roycroft: it does not use foreign watts
03:08 PM roycroft: it uses real, american watts
03:09 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.jcalc.net/motor-current-calculator
03:09 PM roycroft: > 750*5
03:09 PM roycroft: => 3750
03:09 PM roycroft: so yes, 3.75kw
03:10 PM roycroft: similar to the 3.5kw on that website
03:10 PM roycroft: > 3750.0/240
03:10 PM roycroft: => 15.625
03:10 PM CaptHindsight: plus efficiency and power factor
03:10 PM roycroft: at 240vac thats 15 1/2a
03:10 PM roycroft: correct
03:10 PM roycroft: but for a decent us-made motor that's not 50% loss
03:10 PM CaptHindsight: go by the name plate
03:11 PM roycroft: i'd have to go look
03:11 PM roycroft: but i believe that the current draw listed on the nameplate is total current, including efficiencey and power factor loss
03:11 PM roycroft: so it's really not going to deliver 5 full hp
03:11 PM roycroft: it's going to draw 5hp worth of power
03:12 PM roycroft: and deliver 5hp - efficiency and power factor loss
03:12 PM CaptHindsight: 5hp 230V should be 28A Full-Load Current
03:12 PM roycroft: i thank that the underwriters' laboratory would have issues with a device that states that it draws 16a at full load but really draws almost 2x as much
03:13 PM gregcnc: https://www.baldor.com/catalog/L1410T#tab=%22performance%22
03:13 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.elliottelectric.com/StaticPages/ElectricalReferences/ElectricalTables/Amperes_Single_Phase_Alternate.aspx
03:15 PM gregcnc: the 3HP motor. https://www.baldor.com/catalog/CL1408TM#tab=%22performance%22
03:15 PM gregcnc: marketing results in input vs ouput power
03:15 PM CaptHindsight: Use the motor full load current rating (see Tables 430.147, 430.148, or 430.150) when determining conductor ampacity
03:16 PM gregcnc: So in this case is a type B breaker a solution?
03:17 PM gregcnc: it's probably a startup current vs. duraiton thing
03:17 PM roycroft: hmm, it actually doesn't say what the rated current draw is on the motor itself
03:17 PM roycroft: power factor is 95 and efficiency is 82.5%
03:18 PM gregcnc: says 5HP though?
03:18 PM roycroft: yes
03:18 PM roycroft: and it is continuous duty
03:18 PM roycroft: i forgot that i bought a continuous duty motor
03:19 PM roycroft: this compressor was originally a 5hp husky brand that i bought at home depot
03:19 PM roycroft: after the chinese pump blew up i bought a really nice us-mae pump
03:19 PM roycroft: after the chinese motor died i bought a good us-made motor
03:19 PM gregcnc: I'll go with t he breaker is too small, for $200
03:19 PM roycroft: both the pump and the motor died within the first couple years
03:19 PM roycroft: their replacements have been working for close to 20 years
03:20 PM roycroft: the 60 gallon tank that is the only part of the compressor that is still original (although i've painted it) is in great shape
03:21 PM roycroft: actually, after the chinese pump blew up i replaced it with another chinese pump from harbor freight
03:21 PM roycroft: then when that one blew up i bought a real one, and paid way more than what i originally paid for the whole unit
03:21 PM roycroft: to upgrade the breaker means a new subpanel
03:21 PM roycroft: doable but not my first choice
03:43 PM Centurion-Dan2 is now known as Centurion_Dan
03:46 PM miss0r2: Installation of solar panels complete: https://imgur.com/a/bnO4u1V
03:47 PM gregcnc: what kind of panels?
03:47 PM miss0r2: Some flexible monocrystal ones
03:47 PM miss0r2: 120watt each
03:48 PM gregcnc: glued?
03:48 PM gregcnc: just curious if that installtion is going to last
03:48 PM miss0r2: will be. At the moment they are just held in place with 6 4mm screws each. But those screws are just ment to "catch" them if the glue fails
03:49 PM miss0r2: I need more room above the car before I glue it up :D
03:49 PM miss0r2: They need to be glued. Otherwise they will vibrate to peices with the wind blowing across right fast in a hurry
03:50 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: silicone, then you can use a plastic scraper to remove them
03:50 PM gregcnc: right
03:51 PM miss0r2: Makes sense. But silicone doesn't hold as well as proper elastic glue.
03:51 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: I have never seen silicone fail
03:51 PM miss0r2: And it goes to reason I would only remove them if they fail, and would not be too worried about damaging them
03:51 PM miss0r2: hmm
03:52 PM roycroft: i hope you never plan on painting anywhere near those panels if you use silicone adhesives
03:52 PM CaptHindsight: miss0r2: the tent will also block the light :p
03:52 PM miss0r2: I wonder if I should get some proper "acid free" silicone to make sure it does not damage the panels
03:52 PM miss0r2: CaptHindsight: Naturaly I will 'try' to park the car facing south
03:52 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: aquarium grade silicne?
03:52 PM jymmmm: dont forget to park on an angle too =)
03:53 PM CaptHindsight: they make silicones for solar cells
03:53 PM miss0r2: Jymmm: I'm not sure what particular ones are not acid..
03:53 PM miss0r2: yeah yeah yeah... :D
03:53 PM roycroft: acute or obtuse angle?
03:53 PM CaptHindsight: I have some here
03:53 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: I think anything made for an aquarium with be safe once cured
03:53 PM jymmmm: but that is just a guess
03:54 PM miss0r2: Jymmm: hmmm. Perhaps some of that silicone CaptHindsight speaks off, made particular for solar panels. It would make sense that should not harm it
03:54 PM CaptHindsight: it's made to encapsulate the cells so it passes 99% of the light through it
03:54 PM miss0r2: I already have double the solar capacity I *should* need, so i think a bit of shade once in a while will be okay - even if the angles are less than desireable
03:54 PM jymmmm: We used to use dry cleaning solvent to remove silicone
03:54 PM CaptHindsight: the name is like Silguard
03:55 PM miss0r2: CaptHindsight: well, that just sounds like throwing money away for this particular use
03:55 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.dow.com/en-us/pdp.sylgard-184-silicone-elastomer-kit.01064291z.html
03:56 PM CaptHindsight: look through the sdelector, they have acid free neutral ph stuff
03:56 PM miss0r2: CaptHindsight: I think I will just call the local kemical supply and ask them for something
03:56 PM miss0r2: Seems a bit more straight forward.
03:56 PM CaptHindsight: yeah, it will likely be similar
03:56 PM miss0r2: yeah
03:57 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: Easssy solution.... https://www.idealsealants.com/acetoxy-vs-neutral-cure-silicone-i30
03:57 PM jymmmm: vinegar = acid, no odor = alcohol
03:57 PM miss0r2: Anyway. My birthday tomorrow, and I promised my kids that I would make pancakes for breakfast... and it is not 22:47 (me planning to make the "dough" tonight). So I better call it a night
03:57 PM miss0r2: not=now
03:57 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: Wait, it's YOUR bday, and YOU are making ancakes, not the kids?
03:57 PM miss0r2: See you around. I will be back to pick your brain about what breakers to get, Jymmm.
03:58 PM CaptHindsight: happy B-day
03:58 PM miss0r2: yeah
03:58 PM miss0r2: kids 1.5 and 4
03:58 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: lol, HAPPY BRTHDAY!!!!
03:58 PM miss0r2: I'd rather do it myself :D
03:58 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: Oh get the 4yo, on video doing it, that should be funny
03:58 PM miss0r2: knowing I will have less of a mess to deal with afterwards doing it myself, I think that will be the solution
03:59 PM jymmmm: garden hose?
03:59 PM jymmmm: lol
03:59 PM miss0r2: yeah.. well..
03:59 PM CaptHindsight: fun ages
03:59 PM CaptHindsight: sleep through the night
03:59 PM miss0r2: The "big" kid did something simular... and our flooring does not like that much
03:59 PM CaptHindsight: everything is magic
03:59 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: 40yo bbq pancakes (outside)
04:00 PM * miss0r2 looks like death in the morning before his quadro coffee
04:00 PM miss0r2: anyway. Better go mix up some pancakes.. See you around
04:00 PM jymmmm: miss0r2: What's different in the afternoon? ;)
04:00 PM miss0r2: Jymmm: I just keep it flowing ;)
04:00 PM CaptHindsight: breaking science news: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/14/science/hotdog-eating-contests.html?surface=home-discovery-vi-prg&fellback=false&req_id=219976613&algo=identity&imp_id=45276774
04:00 PM * miss0r2 is out
04:00 PM jymmmm: Ah, flowing death, gotcha
04:04 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: these between cells.... https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32988540632.html
04:10 PM XXCoder: making of die filer https://youtu.be/MP5CXuURGV8 interesting
04:10 PM XXCoder: tiny one, for clockmaking
04:13 PM Tom_L: XXCoder, you got too much time on your hands now
04:14 PM XXCoder: nah getting ready to go to work now
04:14 PM Tom_L: no testing ehh?
04:18 PM XXCoder: looks like no though they removed "can unmask when alone"
04:18 PM XXCoder: so everyone must constantly wear masks
04:18 PM XXCoder: im definitely serlizing everuthing before i begin work
04:19 PM XXCoder: and touch nothing unrelated to my work
04:20 PM XXCoder: well laters
04:21 PM Tom_L: they had a mask rule at my kid's work for quite a while then lifted it
04:21 PM Tom_L: then someone got sick and now it's back to masks full time
04:22 PM roycroft: a new order went into effect in oregon today
04:22 PM roycroft: masks are now required outdoors where social distancing is not possible
04:24 PM roycroft: the sooner people get used to masking and the sooner we get a government that actually cares about testing and tracing the sooner we'll be able to open the economy up fully
04:24 PM roycroft: it's ironic that the people who want most to open things up are the very ones who are preventing it
04:31 PM roycroft: what is really sad is that young teachers all over the country are writing wills this month
04:31 PM roycroft: older teachers too, them that don't already have one
04:32 PM roycroft: but if you're a teacher in your 20s you should not have to worry about writing a will before you go back to work
04:32 PM Tom_L: you're more apt to be texting on your way to work at that age
04:33 PM Tom_L: not much difference in the end really
04:35 PM roycroft: i should hope not many are texting on their way to work
04:35 PM roycroft: but if they are, and something happens, it's their own doing
04:35 PM Tom_L: and anyone else that happens in their way
04:35 PM roycroft: being forced to work in unsafe conditions to stroke the ego of the president is an entirely different matter
04:36 PM Tom_L: taking the political route here ehh?
04:36 PM * Tom_L is done
04:36 PM roycroft: there is no legitimate argument against acting safely except a political one
04:36 PM roycroft: and that's not a legitimate argument
04:36 PM roycroft: it's the only argument against being safe
04:37 PM roycroft: teachers want to go back to work
04:37 PM roycroft: they do not want to be ordered to pack their classrooms and not have anyone wear masks
04:38 PM roycroft: but i'll accept that any political element is not wanted as part of a discussion, and so will not press on with the topic
04:39 PM * roycroft will just remain sad
06:01 PM transhumanist1: Hi! sorry for the repeat, but I have spoken to a few people in this group. I thought one had told me the reason the Z axis is always so short compaired to the X and Y axis on CNC machines. I thought it had to do with flexure, is this correct?
06:06 PM transhumanist1: Hi! I thought the reason for the limited z axis height in cheap CNC machines is mainly due to flexure increases with increased height. where for some reason this donesnt affect x and y axis. Is this correct? thanks
06:13 PM perry_j1987: the x/y is always milling over the supported area
06:13 PM perry_j1987: the z on the otherhand is more flexible cause of its length
06:17 PM transhumanist1: ah I understand
06:17 PM transhumanist1: thanks
07:05 PM andypugh: transhumanist1: On a lathe the Z is almost always much longer than the X
07:06 PM andypugh: But I think that the logic with a mill is that you would always arrange the workpiece, where you had a choice, so that the Z dimension is smallest asa that goves the tool the best access to more of the work and at a lower reach.
07:07 PM gregcnc: he's talking about chinaco routers. it's because they are routers
07:07 PM andypugh: I am sure that there have been some mills made that are a perfect cube. And I think that on my mill the Y axis is actually the shortest.
07:07 PM andypugh: Well, yes, routers are meant for 5x4 boards in the main….
07:42 PM transhumanist1: thanks for the input guys!
08:02 PM jymmmm: Who would have thought about looking in SPORTS section for chargers --> Sports & Outdoors › Outdoor Recreation › Skates, Skateboards & Scooters ›
08:02 PM jymmmm: Scooters & Equipment › Components & Parts › Batteries & Battery Chargers
08:02 PM jymmmm: on amazon
08:03 PM andypugh: Yes, I would ezpect to find chargers under “equestrian”
08:03 PM jymmmm: lol
08:17 PM * jymmmm just had to set the Garage AC on low... https://i.imgur.com/uU5Jfto.jpg
08:21 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: you forgot to seal the jar on the whitespace
08:21 PM CaptHindsight: it must have spilled in here
08:26 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Nah, sealed, that's just condensation
08:26 PM jymmmm: I only have one shallow white condensation catcher
09:28 PM veegee: Fuel economy gets chopped in half on my jeep wrangler JK if I'm towing a 1,500 lb trailer
09:29 PM veegee: It's a manual and I can easily do 10-11 L/100km on the highway unloaded
09:29 PM veegee: But as soon as I attach a trailer, that shoots up to 16-20 L/100km
09:30 PM veegee: In other news, some ass broke into my friend's car and stole the very expensive dewalt 6Ah batteries and fast chargers and planer I lent him
09:30 PM veegee: BUT I just brought home a brand new jointer :D
09:31 PM CaptHindsight: was his car in the USA or canada?
09:31 PM veegee: Very long and rigid cast iron table, 8" capacity
09:31 PM veegee: Canada, on his driveway
09:31 PM CaptHindsight: huh, I thought you guys banned crime there years ago
09:31 PM veegee: I'm going to install security cameras in the workshop. I must have like $100k+ worth of tools
09:31 PM veegee: This is the first time in my 29 years of being alive I've experienced theft
09:32 PM Tom_L: it's a thing now
09:32 PM CaptHindsight: maybe they are immigrants?
09:32 PM Tom_L: more drug raids than ever here due to ppl snitching for the reward money
09:33 PM veegee: At this point, I'd prefer to buy used/dead flexvolt battery packs and rebuild them
09:33 PM veegee: Pricing on these is outrageous: https://www.amazon.ca/DeWalt-DCB609-2-batteries-Flexvolt-max/dp/B06WP6GJ4M
09:33 PM veegee: So easy and so much cheaper to just spot weld the 18650s. I even have the nickel strips
09:34 PM CaptHindsight: yes, i was looking for new batteries for an older drill
09:35 PM veegee: It's hard to find used flexvolt batteries though, since they're relatively new. Can't even find knockoffs
09:35 PM veegee: Bulk pricing on 18650 power cells is excellent
09:36 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Arduino spot welder
09:36 PM veegee: Like I'd even use LG HG2 cells
09:36 PM veegee: jymmmm this one is a good one: https://www.keenlab.de/index.php/portfolio-item/kweld/
09:36 PM veegee: It welds using specified energy
09:36 PM veegee: has a calibration feature to compensate for resistance losses
09:37 PM CaptHindsight: 60,000 btu of cooling in here now
09:37 PM veegee: that's only 5 tons D:
09:37 PM CaptHindsight: I got a bunch of mini-splits on ebay a couple of years ago for real cheap
09:38 PM veegee: Going to hook up the 10 tons worth of cooling very soon, as soon as the duct material arrives
09:38 PM CaptHindsight: keeps the area <6ft <73F up to about 95F outside
09:38 PM CaptHindsight: 24ft ceilings here
09:39 PM veegee: hmmm you must have good insulation
09:39 PM veegee: I have decent insulation too. Somehow the inside is hotter than the outside at night
09:39 PM veegee: nothing powered on except LED lights
09:40 PM veegee: I even turned the water heater off
09:40 PM CaptHindsight: thick concrete walls
09:41 PM veegee: I need to order a maintenance manual for the hyster s50xl. I poured a random mix of 5w-20 and 10w-30 temporarily
09:41 PM CaptHindsight: 5ft dia fan keeps the air circulating low
09:41 PM veegee: no idea where the oil sight glass is. I just added a bunch of oil
09:41 PM veegee: and pushes the hot air down!
09:42 PM CaptHindsight: no it's horizontal
09:42 PM veegee: oh right
09:42 PM veegee: my motorcycle chain wax makes an excellent extremely thick grease coating for the mast chain
09:42 PM veegee: super smooth now
09:43 PM veegee: I have those fifteen 1.5kW blowers to set up for air circulation any way I want it
09:45 PM CaptHindsight: https://imgur.com/gallery/o0ljMov
09:47 PM veegee: Yeah that's nothing, I see it all the time
09:48 PM veegee: I don't wear those idiotic surgical masks
09:48 PM veegee: P100 respirators only for me
09:48 PM veegee: I have spare organic vapour cartridges too, but I don't think I need to go that far
09:49 PM veegee: the best part is, everyone is so fucking stupid that I haven't been stopped by anyone because I'm not wearing the kind of mask they want me to
09:49 PM veegee: that is, the kind that "filters" exhaled air
09:56 PM CaptHindsight: carbon filters are good for about 8 hours
09:56 PM CaptHindsight: after opening
09:58 PM CaptHindsight: i wear a mask made of human lung lining so all the ACE2 receptors are right out front like a magnet