#linuxcnc Logs

Jan 27 2020

#linuxcnc Calendar

12:00 AM _unreal_: A: pics? B: I dont knwo what your talking about stil waiting on lead screws using machine slow
12:05 AM _unreal_: ?
12:05 AM _unreal_: dude your bouncing all around
12:05 AM rue_mohr: http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/projects/cnc/slide.htm
12:05 AM _unreal_: I dont have a clue what your talking about
12:05 AM rue_mohr: pardon, the first few images are REALLY horrid :)
12:05 AM _unreal_: thats an understatement
12:05 AM rue_mohr: hey it was 2002, web cameras were awefull
12:05 AM rue_mohr: http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/projects/cnc/p1100589.jpg <-- :) the spindle is a weed-eater motor with a feedback system
12:05 AM _unreal_: interesting design but I must say you took the HARD way around a lot of design steps
12:05 AM rue_mohr: it was only my 3rd machine
12:05 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, https://drive.google.com/open?id=1EzVANFGFA96IZYhtiRTWMElxfJVwtkb5
12:05 AM _unreal_: ignore the broken bearing. shit got into it and it was over tentioned. broke up in 10min on me
12:05 AM Elmo40: _unreal_, you too are taking the hard way!
12:05 AM rue_mohr: k
12:05 AM _unreal_: but its the only photo showing my bearing system witht he backside
12:05 AM _unreal_: Elmo40, hardly
12:05 AM rue_mohr: http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/projects/cnc4/slide.htm <-- build log of the newest one I finished
12:07 AM rue_mohr: its newer, the dremel died after a few months
12:07 AM _unreal_: Elmo40, yes my new machine is using stainless threaded rod
12:07 AM rue_mohr: the weed eater motor is only 20 years old
12:07 AM _unreal_: and my drive system for the Y axis is more or less finished.
12:07 AM rue_mohr: and its still working just fine
12:08 AM XXCoder: pink_vampire: https://imgur.com/a/byeVIgu
12:08 AM rue_mohr: http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/projects/cnc4/p1090553.jpg <-- the bin was a really important improvement
12:08 AM pink_vampire: XXCoder: this is soo COOL!!!
12:09 AM pink_vampire: love it!
12:09 AM rue_mohr: http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/projects/cnc6/p1130138.jpg <- _unreal_ this is my new one, slated for dc drive motors
12:09 AM XXCoder: its definitely cool
12:09 AM _unreal_: I just took a few photos of the current progress
12:09 AM XXCoder: the dots star is cut from other side. wasnt deep enough
12:10 AM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ilNVYlA6m7xGhCAn1lIo1JQiG3m_ZvSj
12:10 AM _unreal_: Elmo40, there is your threaded rod drive
12:10 AM _unreal_: and working wonderful
12:10 AM rue_mohr: wow
12:11 AM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1iklKpYIqOhs70yq-xktLj4IxJeOcpPkq
12:11 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, the white block is HDPE or STARBOARD
12:11 AM Elmo40: _unreal_, large pulley reduction?
12:11 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, easy to TAP and will hold its thread. its self luberacating etc...
12:11 AM _unreal_: Elmo40, will be yes
12:12 AM _unreal_: Elmo40, my servos are rated for something like 4krpm
12:12 AM Elmo40: with that fine thread pitch? not too overkill?
12:12 AM Elmo40: i see
12:12 AM _unreal_: fine thread WTF are you talking about
12:12 AM _unreal_: thats 1/2-13
12:12 AM rue_mohr: so, the motors I have slated for the project are going to be operated at up to 24V (30V supply) and up to 20A (not for too long)
12:13 AM rue_mohr: so I was interested in what your using for drivers
12:13 AM pink_vampire: _unreal_: look nice!!
12:13 AM rue_mohr: I think that gives me ~8krpm
12:13 AM rue_mohr: I can keep tabs on them w/100lpr encoders
12:13 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, if your using brushed servos. make sure your driver can take the encoder input
12:13 AM rue_mohr: brushed, yes
12:14 AM rue_mohr: the encoders are good for the freq
12:14 AM rue_mohr: and I'm using stm32, I know they can keep up
12:14 AM _unreal_: 100 lpr? ok so thats 400ppr
12:14 AM rue_mohr: so _unreal_ where is your z axis?
12:14 AM _unreal_: its not fabricated yet
12:15 AM rue_mohr: _unreal_, oh, hmm, not sure if that was the quadrature numbers or not
12:15 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, if your encoder has 100 lines
12:15 AM rue_mohr: oh I know
12:15 AM _unreal_: then its going to result in 400 pulses per rotation
12:15 AM Elmo40: _unreal_, photo didn't really show the thread that well. my mistake.
12:15 AM rue_mohr: is decoded quadrature
12:15 AM rue_mohr: I ran the numbers quite a while ago, their in a book
12:16 AM rue_mohr: I'm targeting low rez and large/higher speed
12:16 AM rue_mohr: prolly only about 0.1mm
12:16 AM rue_mohr: so the encoders give me about 0.01mm and I have room for feedback error
12:17 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, if you have HIGH motor RPM, then it would likely be wiser to reduce with gearing/pulleys
12:17 AM rue_mohr: yup, lots, cause I'm not using leadscrew drive
12:17 AM _unreal_: what is your drive then
12:17 AM rue_mohr: so I'm gonna have fun avoiding backlash
12:17 AM _unreal_: belt drive?
12:17 AM rue_mohr: probably
12:18 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, I have ZERO backlash
12:18 AM rue_mohr: indeed
12:18 AM rue_mohr: its going to be some work
12:18 AM rue_mohr: anyhow, are you using that same driver chip then?
12:18 AM _unreal_: ?
12:18 AM rue_mohr: http://ve7it.cowlug.org/dspic-servo-schematic.png
12:18 AM _unreal_: yes that is the schematic I'm designing from
12:19 AM rue_mohr: k
12:19 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, in fact ve7it hangs out in the chan typically 2pm EST to midnight EST
12:19 AM rue_mohr: I'm trying to keep my driver heat down to about 2w or less total
12:20 AM rue_mohr: its been sending me in circles for a few days
12:20 AM Elmo40: _unreal_, what will the motor pulley be? 30 tooth?
12:20 AM Elmo40: those rod pulleys look massive. 60 teeth?
12:20 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, https://www.crowdsupply.com/citrus-cnc/tarocco
12:20 AM Elmo40: 48 teeth?
12:20 AM _unreal_: 48
12:21 AM rue_mohr: oh I have written tonnes of closed loop controllers
12:21 AM rue_mohr: not worried about that
12:21 AM Elmo40: _unreal_, and motor?
12:21 AM rue_mohr: the 20A driver capability is beating me up
12:21 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, THAT drive is low heat producing
12:22 AM _unreal_: the one I'm building is going to turn the heat sink into an oven
12:22 AM rue_mohr: dont think it can do 20A 30V
12:22 AM _unreal_: Elmo40, ?
12:23 AM rue_mohr: yea, your into it for up to 64w/chip
12:23 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, part of the reason I'm going with the belt to lead screw setup
12:23 AM rue_mohr: yea that project is 10A
12:24 AM _unreal_: less pwoer required
12:24 AM _unreal_: I was toying with making the whole thing belt drive
12:24 AM XXCoder: excellllent
12:24 AM _unreal_: but it makes for a lot more power draw to maintain position
12:24 AM rue_mohr: I have some chineese drivers comming that aren't rated too high, but they dont have heatsinks either
12:25 AM Elmo40: _unreal_, number of teeth on the motor pulley
12:25 AM XXCoder: 150mm/m at 100% laser, 4 passes cuts though coggrated cardboard for sure,
12:25 AM XXCoder: leaving tiny spots can just snap off
12:26 AM rue_mohr: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000096081979.html <-- I got one of those to check out
12:26 AM rue_mohr: bit pricey for how much use I think it'll be, but I'll see
12:26 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, I have not made a final decision on pulley sizing yet
12:26 AM rue_mohr: the parts all seemed to check out spec wise
12:26 AM _unreal_: but the one pictured has 48 teeth
12:27 AM rue_mohr: y
12:27 AM rue_mohr: whats your target jog speed / motor rpm
12:27 AM _unreal_: 30"/min
12:28 AM _unreal_: err sorry 60"/min
12:28 AM _unreal_: the table work area is 30", if I did my math right. I should be able to run the full Y stroke in about 30 seconds
12:29 AM _unreal_: or less
12:29 AM _unreal_: My cordless brushless drill can drive the threaded rod nut from one end to the other in 15 seconds
12:30 AM rue_mohr: I grabbed the notebook...
12:30 AM _unreal_: its no speed demon, but it doesnt need to be when there are few materials aside from foam that you can cut at much over 400mm/min
12:31 AM rue_mohr: so, target max is 1.2m/sec
12:31 AM _unreal_: 1.2 meters?
12:32 AM rue_mohr: which puts the motors at 8000rpm?...
12:32 AM rue_mohr: yes, 4' iirc
12:32 AM rue_mohr: zippo:/files/programming/c/tests# units 4feet m
12:32 AM rue_mohr: * 1.2192
12:32 AM rue_mohr: / 0.82020997
12:32 AM rue_mohr: heh
12:32 AM rue_mohr: sanity check...
12:33 AM rue_mohr: uh
12:33 AM _unreal_: making a machine move crazy fast isnt reasonable
12:33 AM * rue_mohr looks at the numbers
12:33 AM XXCoder: pink_vampire: https://imgur.com/a/oTLZOUd new picture
12:34 AM rue_mohr: well, thats probably where the 600w goes
12:34 AM rue_mohr: 1200, cause two motors...
12:34 AM rue_mohr: hmmm
12:34 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, I mean really making a cnc move super fast is not reasonable
12:34 AM rue_mohr: I really wonder where /sec came from...
12:34 AM rue_mohr: wait, a second is a long time
12:34 AM rue_mohr: and thats peak speed
12:35 AM rue_mohr: and its gonna do a 4' jog trapazoidal
12:35 AM rue_mohr: so, maybe 4' in 1 sec peak isn't that crazy
12:35 AM _unreal_: 4' in one second is
12:35 AM rue_mohr: during normal operation, you never get out of the ramp, and your velocity limiting anyhow
12:35 AM _unreal_: think about the weight yourmoving
12:36 AM rue_mohr: I have two 600w motors
12:36 AM rue_mohr: if I hit an endstop unexpectedly, its gonna be a show
12:36 AM rue_mohr: but
12:36 AM _unreal_: hence my POINT
12:36 AM _unreal_: super high speed is not reasonable
12:36 AM rue_mohr: 4'/sec isn't too insane I think
12:37 AM _unreal_: its VERY
12:37 AM rue_mohr: its jog, not for cutting
12:37 AM _unreal_: no one makes a machine move that fast
12:37 AM rue_mohr: unless your jogging the gantry out of your way
12:37 AM rue_mohr: its a 4'x8' machine
12:37 AM _unreal_: 2 seconds to move 8'
12:37 AM _unreal_: BS
12:38 AM rue_mohr: meaning probably a 4 second+ wait to move 8'
12:38 AM rue_mohr: no, ramp time
12:38 AM _unreal_: thats a good way to get someone hurt
12:38 AM rue_mohr: besides, you can instantly spin up a motor to 8k
12:38 AM rue_mohr: I'll see how it plays out, I have to work out a lash-free reduction anyhow
12:39 AM rue_mohr: I cant spin rod at 8k
12:39 AM _unreal_: no you cant
12:39 AM _unreal_: you A: would need a ball screw because no other screw system will survive
12:39 AM _unreal_: acme, threaded what have you
12:40 AM rue_mohr: I ahve a spin-the-nut design, that carries the motor
12:40 AM rue_mohr: but its not part of the plan for this one
12:40 AM _unreal_: MOVING a machine at that speed is not reasonable. one stupid coding error and the machine really fucks up or hurts someone
12:41 AM _unreal_: spin the nut spin the rod. doesnt matter
12:41 AM rue_mohr: so far, all my machine are too slow
12:41 AM rue_mohr: it makes quite a difference
12:41 AM rue_mohr: the rod will start flailing if you spin it too fast
12:41 AM _unreal_: My current machine can do rapids of 700mm/min
12:41 AM _unreal_: and thats plenty fast enough
12:41 AM rue_mohr: ok 0.01m/sec
12:41 AM _unreal_: I DO wish it was a bit faster but its an open loop stepper driven small cnc
12:42 AM rue_mohr: I'm still designing, so I'll take it all into account
12:42 AM rue_mohr: I dont want to have to wait a minute for the machine to traverse 8' tho
12:42 AM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1Epi_HnCUA83Bbr7-sbDEt4EFKLzObQoM
12:43 AM _unreal_: I'm not going to argue that point
12:43 AM rue_mohr: on the other design here I'm using 20ipm
12:43 AM _unreal_: BUT there is a limit where speed and safty/reasonable become seperated
12:44 AM rue_mohr: agreed
12:44 AM rue_mohr: I know armyofevilrobots had some inncodents with his machine
12:44 AM _unreal_: my new machine "SHOULD" do upto 60" ipm
12:44 AM _unreal_: and for rapids thats not bad
12:45 AM rue_mohr: 0.025m/sec
12:45 AM _unreal_: thats multi times faster then my current machine
12:45 AM rue_mohr: huh, I cant play that video
12:45 AM _unreal_: ?
12:46 AM rue_mohr: browsers, bleck
12:46 AM _unreal_: are you in USA?
12:46 AM _unreal_: bleck?
12:46 AM rue_mohr: canada
12:46 AM _unreal_: AHH... ya they block content
12:46 AM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1EfNv_J2UQjn2qWICo-6dBa0aEeP82RDu
12:47 AM rue_mohr: ok, well, thankyou for sharing what your doing with your drivers then
12:47 AM _unreal_: >:) https://drive.google.com/open?id=1d5Krkpzcgrggd4nSSI3S2tEpju_H94dD
12:48 AM _unreal_: I picked that today
12:49 AM _unreal_: ?
12:49 AM rue_mohr: I think tom has us beat so far
12:49 AM _unreal_: ?
12:50 AM * rue_mohr looks over at Tom_L
12:50 AM _unreal_: I dont know what your refering to
12:50 AM rue_mohr: for building cnc machines
12:51 AM rue_mohr: I keep needing a larger machine, that why I'm going to 4'x8'
12:51 AM XXCoder: yeah tom machine is all kinds awesome
12:51 AM XXCoder: rue_mohr: make sure its 5'x9'
12:51 AM rue_mohr: :) yep, its a bit over
12:51 AM XXCoder: that way you can add extensions like tool changer toolholder row
12:51 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, I'm building 3 machines
12:51 AM rue_mohr: XXCoder, did you seE?
12:51 AM XXCoder: also tool measuring station etc
12:52 AM XXCoder: your box router cnc? yeah
12:52 AM rue_mohr: no the big one
12:52 AM _unreal_: I'm building this white one for my daughter https://drive.google.com/open?id=1cZ_rTRuKh85aVzAOJW3WQTf6sAHK0dZi
12:52 AM XXCoder: must have missed your link
12:52 AM rue_mohr: http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/projects/cnc6/p1130138.jpg
12:53 AM XXCoder: ahh nice. stand up or just propping while build?
12:53 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, https://drive.google.com/open?id=1n8QM01eo2tG-qUacvH3c_0KZn2RtR0VM
12:53 AM _unreal_: that is the base for the really big cnc machine I'm bilding
12:53 AM rue_mohr: ah ok
12:53 AM rue_mohr: XXCoder, stand up, I dont have enough room for flat
12:53 AM rue_mohr: and so far, I cant see if has any drawbacks
12:54 AM XXCoder: not much besides making sure parts dont fall off and get dinged by tool
12:54 AM rue_mohr: less needing to lift the Y axis
12:54 AM _unreal_: rue_mohr, counter balance
12:54 AM rue_mohr: well, and you shouldn't have bits comming loose from the material anyhow
12:54 AM rue_mohr: yup
12:54 AM XXCoder: yeah
12:54 AM rue_mohr: but then 2x inertia, and acceleration...
12:54 AM rue_mohr: so, I'll see
12:55 AM _unreal_: then more wasted power moving shit
12:55 AM _unreal_: speed and weight, cant have both
12:55 AM _unreal_: ok supid late going to bed
12:55 AM rue_mohr: I need motor drivers "next"
12:55 AM rue_mohr: gnight
12:57 AM pink_vampire: I need a name for my 3d printer - any idea?
12:57 AM XXCoder: did you see new picture?
12:57 AM XXCoder: spirl fun
12:58 AM XXCoder: hmmmm printer name
12:58 AM XXCoder: the pink plastic layer
12:59 AM pink_vampire: XXCoder: yes, with the spiral
01:50 AM Loetmichel: *gnah* no access to the mail server/3dprinters at the company any more. I have the suspicion that the Provider has updated the policies on *his* cable modem and now rejects everything coming from "outside"... any ide how to verify that suspicion? Setup is fiber->Docsis-converter->Providers cable modem(no access)-> our router
01:50 AM XXCoder: doh
01:50 AM XXCoder: setup a vpn
01:51 AM Loetmichel: to complicated for our boss that wants to read his email with his Ipad
01:52 AM XXCoder: fun
01:52 AM XXCoder: you dont want it suddenly added to your duty list either
01:54 AM Loetmichel: its already on my duty list, thats the problem ;)
01:54 AM Loetmichel: the "IT admin" hat i mean
01:55 AM XXCoder: lol
02:18 AM Deejay: moin
02:21 AM Jymmm: Morning Deejay
04:48 AM Tom_L: morning
04:48 AM XXCoder: yo
04:48 AM XXCoder: https://imgur.com/a/byeVIgu https://imgur.com/a/oTLZOUd
04:48 AM XXCoder: check em out
04:49 AM Tom_L: nice
04:49 AM Tom_L: just don't set your place on fire
04:49 AM XXCoder: lol
04:49 AM Tom_L: not shitting you. someone here did
04:50 AM XXCoder: yah though i keep eye on it constant;y
04:52 AM XXCoder: tom my next steps is figuring how to use sslicing addin for openscad
04:53 AM XXCoder: then export bunch of svg files to make something
04:53 AM XXCoder: man I love make it extreme. 22 min https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spZtQK37xKw
05:25 AM Deejay: hi
06:34 AM nvz: _unreal_: not yet, I got two small 12v blower motors I was going to use, and probably some 80mm fans for exhaust.. the two 36v psus have fans on them
06:35 AM nvz: _unreal_: I was thinking I'd use the little blower motors to blow across the heatsinks on the drivers
08:55 AM nvz: _unreal_: I'm not real sure what I'm gonna do yet with that back panel.. I may put it on a hinge, or make a slot for it to slide into.. idk yet
10:09 AM unterhaus: I finally got trolled into responding to that email thread
10:14 AM al_ is now known as Guest34403
11:03 AM CaptHindsight: unterhaus: yes, he's a troll but I'm happy the thread got started so next time it comes up we can just point the to this thread on the mail list
11:12 AM alSMT: when I launch linuxcnc in mint it doesn't expand to the desktop shows up on the taskbar. anyway to get it to expand to the desktop when launched? RIP (sorry if it got reposted)
11:50 AM alSMT: Is this normal for RIP and not installed? ^^^
11:50 AM pcw_home: not sure but I suspect that is window manager related
11:51 AM alSMT: seems like the only window that does it
11:55 AM pcw_home: All the mint installations I have done behave that way (maybe a Mate/Cinnamon vs Axis issue)
11:56 AM alSMT: ok just looking for a fix if anyone has found one
12:20 PM net|: https://github.com/tecan/Luna/blob/master/media/main.pys << almost have a card game ready
12:40 PM veegee: Why are rotary broach tools so expensive?
12:43 PM Elmo40: 'cuz
12:44 PM Elmo40: same reason why fuel is so expensive (in relation to the price of a barrel.)
12:48 PM gregcnc: low volume
01:02 PM unterhaus: is everyone that is using mint using Mate?
01:03 PM alSMT: cinnamon here
01:05 PM pcw_home: Yeah, I prefer cinnamon
01:36 PM jthornton: I haven't tried cinnamon in a long time, been using debian with mate
01:44 PM unterhaus: okay, after I asked I realized I have a mint iso with mate. But it looks like it's not much bother to switch
02:25 PM unterhaus: anyone have a favorite mini-itx case that takes pci cards?
03:46 PM Deejay: gn8
03:47 PM Tom_L: buy
04:27 PM SpeedEvil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRP0k0Hiyxg
04:29 PM SpeedEvil: - Moving spacex tank prior to explody testing. Contains gratuitous shot of heavy equipment mover at 8 minutes.
04:31 PM SpeedEvil: Also - their tanks are looking a hell of a lot less scrappy
05:11 PM JT-Shop: looks like I get to learn how to program a 6 axis Epson robot
05:11 PM Tom_L: nice challenge
05:12 PM Tom_L: does it have a pendant?
05:13 PM JT-Shop: not sure, they have not purchased it yet
05:13 PM Tom_L: what language?
05:13 PM JT-Shop: the one I'm looking at now I think you just plug your laptop in and use their software to program it
05:13 PM SpeedEvil: :)
05:14 PM Tom_L: got one of my verilog programs sorted out i'd been messin with for a week
05:14 PM JT-Shop: Epson VT6L
05:14 PM JT-Shop: cool, what was the issue?
05:14 PM Tom_L: what it was triggering off of
05:14 PM jdh: I have an epson scara. it runs like a top.
05:15 PM Tom_L: just a binary counter but when the digits overflow, i wanted the leds to count up binary the overflow times
05:16 PM Tom_L: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVRRtBdOOvg
05:16 PM Tom_L: i have it triggered off the one's place there just to test it
05:18 PM JT-Shop: cool
05:19 PM Tom_L: 5 lines of code
05:19 PM Tom_L: but getting the right 5 is the trick
05:38 PM jthornton: I bet
05:40 PM jthornton: got me a SS fraud fishing voice mail to day...
05:42 PM acer_ is now known as _unreal_
06:00 PM * jthornton will see if ubuntu for rpi plays nice with qmultimedia or not
06:00 PM jthornton: still don't know why it worked on the cnc test rpi
06:02 PM * jthornton has 3 GB of extra data to burn
06:04 PM * Tom_L starts a fire
06:07 PM Tom_L: at a 1 sec interval it will take about 1 yr 23 days for all digits to roll over
06:07 PM jthornton: all the digits in the universe?
06:07 PM Tom_L: no, just on this board :)
06:08 PM Tom_L: i don't plan to test the math
06:23 PM Tom_L: what was that stripped down one?
06:23 PM Tom_L: lbuntu?
06:24 PM jthornton: hmm, wonder if they have a rpi version
06:24 PM Tom_L: good q
06:25 PM Tom_L: https://wiki.debian.org/RaspberryPi
06:25 PM jthornton: well hell they have a rpi but it's for 2
06:25 PM Tom_L: there's that
06:27 PM Tom_L: no redhad i can see
06:38 PM jthornton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1E0QwdyVzo
06:40 PM Tom_L: making one for the chicken coup?
06:40 PM jthornton: sorta
06:41 PM jthornton: that bandsaw blade sure has a lot of run out
06:42 PM jthornton: https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/16-x-12-coop.1223140/page-14#post-22143842
06:43 PM Tom_L: when do they start paying rent in their new place?
06:44 PM jthornton: at about 4 months old, the Cinnamon Queens are over achievers
06:45 PM jthornton: chow time here, see you in the AM
06:46 PM Tom_L: bye
09:16 PM Elmo40: what is wrong with raspbian?
09:31 PM skunkworks: 32bit. (seems to run just fine)
10:57 PM flyback: https://scenestream.net/demovibes/streams/
11:32 PM nvz:
11:32 PM nvz:
11:33 PM nvz: o.O
11:33 PM nvz: well updated this with the latest pics of the progress http://nvz.farted.net/cnc/