#linuxcnc Logs

Dec 30 2019

12:00 AM _unreal_: OMG.... i want one
12:05 AM XXCoder: I havent entered walmart for years
12:05 AM _unreal_: but I'm not about to shell out 299-499 depending on on game/features
12:05 AM _unreal_: very nice though
12:05 AM XXCoder: rg-300 is best one out of bunch. x18 is good for higher end games like n64 and ps1
12:05 AM _unreal_: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Galaga-Arcade-Machine-with-Riser-Arcade1UP/862068428?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=0&adid=22222222227000000000&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=42423897272&wl4=aud-430887228898:pla-51320962143&wl5=9012012&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=8175035&wl11=online&wl12=862068428&veh=sem&gclid=CjwKCAiAuqHwBRAQEiwAD-zr3T4eDlL-XDLQLg2L169m9r3R_ogX_cdAxT8frMaAQjW9V2DYNF3nmRoCiBAQAvD_BwE
12:05 AM _unreal_: x18?
12:05 AM XXCoder: im playing remake of chip challenge on my rg-300 lately, and finished paper mario on x18
12:05 AM XXCoder: yeah powkiddy x18
12:05 AM _unreal_: no idea
12:05 AM XXCoder: dont really want to click walmart link but ok
12:05 AM XXCoder: uh
12:05 AM XXCoder: 300 bucks?
12:05 AM XXCoder: ah smaller than old console ones
12:05 AM XXCoder: but not a whole lot smaller. interesting
12:05 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.microcenter.com/site/content/retro-gaming.aspx
12:05 AM _unreal_: XXCoder, there are a bunch of them
12:05 AM CaptHindsight: are these popular?
12:05 AM _unreal_: mortal combat and tmnt the NES versions etc..
12:05 AM CaptHindsight: we worked on the real original ones
12:05 AM XXCoder: powkiddy x18? or those console ones? dunno on latter
12:05 AM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, I believe soooo
12:05 AM _unreal_: I've never heard of the ppowkiddy x18
12:05 AM XXCoder: cool just too big for my room lol
12:06 AM XXCoder: site on how to do stuff with it https://github.com/retrogamehandheld/powkiddyx18/wiki
12:07 AM _unreal_: XXCoder, baaa looking at the specs my tinkerboard is more powerful
12:07 AM XXCoder: I suppose but its android so you could play android games as well as emulate stuff
12:08 AM _unreal_: tinkboard can do android and linux
12:08 AM _unreal_: and retropi was built for tinkerbaord
12:08 AM XXCoder: rg300 https://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?trafficChannel=main&d=y&CatId=0&SearchText=rg-300&ltype=wholesale&SortType=price_asc&groupsort=1&page=1
12:09 AM XXCoder: many stores. I recommand ips, there is older and newer ips version. latter is smaller screen (2.8" vs 3") but much brighter and better colors
12:09 AM ve7it: _unreal_, got the resitor pack and the lines to the db25 to put on the schematic... I'll post what I have so far
12:10 AM XXCoder: buttboy dont buy it, its crap
12:11 AM _unreal_: wasnt planning to
12:11 AM XXCoder: good
12:11 AM ve7it: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1O_kSp8N4vt2R3FWCY6W7VSbVT9WVyCv-
12:11 AM XXCoder: you dont need a butt
12:11 AM _unreal_: I did buy my daughter one of those what? 8" tall micro gaming cabnets for $20 has mk1 on it :)
12:12 AM _unreal_: ve7it, not too much to go... got to link in the db25 breakout to the chips :)
12:13 AM ve7it: yup
12:13 AM ve7it: using the data sheet to check connections... most of it makes sense
12:13 AM XXCoder: https://s3.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/pictofact/7/6/2/717762_v2.jpg I love that law. usa should have it too
12:14 AM XXCoder: unreal I always wanetd real fullsize Asteroids one
12:14 AM XXCoder: but screens is getting impossible to get and I still dont have room
12:14 AM ve7it: it doesnt have to be prefect for us to use the boards as is... nice to have a real schematic if we want to make new boards
12:15 AM _unreal_: ve7it, any "serial" or is it just I/O the j1 connector?
12:16 AM ve7it: no serial.... no processor in the board
12:16 AM _unreal_: any analog feed back?
12:16 AM _unreal_: or just signal sending and thats it
12:17 AM ve7it: It looks like there is analog feedback that would allow one to check the dacs are working
12:17 AM _unreal_: or I should say OPEN loop control. "sensors" are the feed back?
12:18 AM _unreal_: I was wondering if maybe one of the TECH pins was used as a counter
12:18 AM ve7it: pin j1-13 can have the Dac0 output if addressed properly
12:19 AM ve7it: I am not sure what else can be selected
12:19 AM ve7it: possibly more buried traces to discover
12:20 AM _unreal_: I'm assuming any higher precision feed back would need a db25 adapter to tap the hall sensors
12:20 AM ve7it: there are 4 more inputs on the analog mux I havent found where they go yet
12:20 AM _unreal_: ve7it, as I said as time allows i'm going to grind away layers of the board and take photos
12:20 AM _unreal_: which pins?
12:26 AM _unreal_: mux? you mean u1?
12:26 AM ve7it: U7 pins 12,13,14,15
12:26 AM ve7it: this board doesnt use feedback other than the hall sensors to tell it how to drive the 3 phases, all positioning is done by microcontroller(s) connected directly to the rotary encoder and J1
12:28 AM _unreal_: pin 15 goes to db25 9 looks like
12:28 AM _unreal_: can you confirm?
12:31 AM _unreal_: pin12 seems to go to db25 pin3
12:31 AM ve7it: u7-14 to db25-8 === HALL V
12:32 AM _unreal_: err ya 8
12:32 AM _unreal_: not sure what that chip oes
12:32 AM _unreal_: does
12:33 AM ve7it: u7-15 to db-25-9 === HALL W
12:35 AM ve7it: u7-13 to db25-7 === HALL U
12:36 AM _unreal_: 789 those must be going to ONE motor controller?
12:37 AM ve7it: u7-12 to db25-3 === HALL U on another motor
12:39 AM _unreal_: still trying to wrap my head around the function of that mux
12:39 AM ve7it: not sure what you mean?
12:40 AM _unreal_: dont know what it does exactly
12:40 AM ve7it: those 4 pins can be monitored to see if the 2 of the motors have stalled
12:40 AM _unreal_: ahh..
12:40 AM ve7it: maybe for homing?
12:40 AM _unreal_: there are homing swtiches on the frames as I recall
12:41 AM _unreal_: the only a few though
12:41 AM ve7it: usually nice to reset encoder counter on the edge of a signal... hall switch is kind of like an index
12:42 AM ve7it: not really needed for our purpose, but I will add them to the schematic
12:43 AM _unreal_: not a great photo but you can see how the motors are setup https://drive.google.com/open?id=1dFY3pm4vfysS3BCXWL54f5nyL_M4Xa41
12:43 AM XXCoder: any tips on removing steel chip from finger?
12:43 AM XXCoder: i couldnt remove it for couple weeks so far
12:43 AM _unreal_: XXCoder, ahhh
12:43 AM _unreal_: nail clipper
12:44 AM _unreal_: smaller is better
12:44 AM XXCoder: no, its completely inside
12:44 AM _unreal_: take some "meat" with it
12:44 AM _unreal_: if its inside your only option is to lance OR clip and take excess
12:44 AM _unreal_: you have to expose the intruder
12:45 AM _unreal_: is it stainless or farus?
12:45 AM XXCoder: not sure lol
12:45 AM _unreal_: ?
12:45 AM XXCoder: i was running alum but chip isnt alum
12:46 AM _unreal_: a magnet is not likely to help EVEN if its iron... unless you expose it and even then likely
12:46 AM _unreal_: nail clippers are typically your best bet
12:46 AM XXCoder: yeah would need to be giantass magnet
12:46 AM _unreal_: XXCoder, or electro
12:47 AM _unreal_: though if you wave a mag. and it "hurts more"
12:47 AM _unreal_: I want details :)
12:47 AM XXCoder: lol well as well as try when im at work tomorrow
12:48 AM _unreal_: I still have an other week off
12:48 AM _unreal_: :)
12:48 AM _unreal_: paid
12:48 AM _unreal_: :P
12:48 AM XXCoder: this week on working monday and thurs
12:49 AM _unreal_: ve7it, I would assume one of those parallel port intercepter adapters where you can "jump out" wires would be useful. for tapping all of the hall signals to be fed back to a uC for closed loop.
12:49 AM _unreal_: or pass through?
12:51 AM _unreal_: granted low resolution BUT better then nothing
12:52 AM _unreal_: besides if these bldc motors are geared down the resolution goes right back up
12:52 AM _unreal_: well almost 2am I'm going to take a quick shower and go to bed
12:53 AM _unreal_: NOT a bit tired
12:53 AM XXCoder: later
12:53 AM ve7it: not needed.... this board is like your fan driver board... speed and direction.... it needs some computer to tell it what to do and if it is a positioning servo, the computer needs to know the position so it can calculate a correction
12:53 AM _unreal_: but then again I did drink a light duty energy drink driving home after getting my daguther
12:54 AM ve7it: ttyl... still adding connections :}
12:54 AM _unreal_: ve7it, so as is
12:54 AM ve7it: thanks for your help
12:54 AM _unreal_: IF the motor is forced to miss a step. will it try to jump back?
12:54 AM _unreal_: on its own?
12:55 AM _unreal_: to the last hall sensor? or will it just "fail out" and shut down
12:55 AM ve7it: nice thing about servos if it gets out of position, it will try its hardest to get back on track
12:56 AM _unreal_: I could see these motors driving a really fast 3d printer :)
12:56 AM ve7it: if it gets too far out of position then the servo controller cpu usually faults with a "following error"
12:57 AM ve7it: they would be great on a 3d printer!
12:57 AM _unreal_: I dont see any "error" pins in the PDF
12:58 AM _unreal_: error/fault signal feed back pins
12:58 AM ve7it: this board doesnt know there is an error,... the controlling cpu decides when there is an error
12:58 AM _unreal_: :) so this board is stupid
12:59 AM ve7it: yess... very... its only job is to make the motors go around when its told to
01:00 AM _unreal_: GOD i wish I had 3 of the encoder version motors
01:00 AM ve7it: that would be nice... have to go visit some boats!
01:01 AM _unreal_: its when the boats leave I can " have them"
01:01 AM _unreal_: or if I find out from a boat crew member that they are tossing one
01:01 AM ve7it: the azimuth motors are even more powerful... need 3 dead seatels
01:01 AM _unreal_: never know when they are just doing service and reinstalling or replacing
01:01 AM _unreal_: azimuth?
01:02 AM ve7it: the big motor that spins the whole dish around in a circle
01:02 AM _unreal_: lol
01:03 AM _unreal_: da23gbb-13eu2c
01:04 AM ve7it: off to bed... I have a schematic to finish... tty tomorrow
01:05 AM _unreal_: https://www.electrocraft.com/files/ead_bldc.pdf
01:05 AM _unreal_: ve7it, check that
01:06 AM _unreal_: ve7it, oddly enough that PDF and the lable on the motor specs wise are very different
01:06 AM _unreal_: motor says, 24vdc 0.75A 850RPM 22oz-in
01:06 AM ve7it: I have that one... its a nice reference
01:08 AM _unreal_: the 13eu2c part is interesting
01:09 AM _unreal_: I do wonder if it is a custom motor?
01:09 AM _unreal_: well bed time for me as well after a quick shower
01:11 AM ve7it: yes the M201 winding is probably custom....
01:14 AM elmo40: http://rattlecad.com
01:17 AM XXCoder: allright!!
01:17 AM XXCoder: got partial refund on lousy board on cnc laser
01:19 AM jymmmm: XXCoder: how much?
01:19 AM XXCoder: 31
01:19 AM XXCoder: thats how much I paid for better board and cable
01:19 AM jymmmm: IS that enough to get the board/cables you need?
01:19 AM jymmmm: cool
01:19 AM XXCoder: yeah
01:20 AM jymmmm: XXCoder: Glad you got it all worked out
01:20 AM XXCoder: yah
01:28 AM _unreal_: ve7it, custom or common
01:28 AM _unreal_: I think the one's on the sats are custom?
01:30 AM ve7it: could be... maybe something as simple as water tight motor connections
01:30 AM ve7it: or the db-9 connectors
01:31 AM _unreal_: the working encoder motor I have has a totally different modle number
01:31 AM _unreal_: even the shell looks different
01:31 AM _unreal_: the one's I sent you are from the same company as the encdoder one I have sitting in front of me taken apart because the bearings are bad
01:32 AM _unreal_: these motors are no water tight thats for sure
01:33 AM _unreal_: I dont know if removing the motor core from the winding housing will hurt the magnets or not
01:34 AM _unreal_: ve7it, last thing before I hit the sack, I'm still not sure WHAT controlls the DC motor that is on the tunning antenna reciver
01:34 AM _unreal_: page 120
01:34 AM _unreal_: polang motor
01:35 AM _unreal_: it has a POT for a position encoder
01:35 AM _unreal_: its a nice gizmo. I'd have to send you a photo.
01:35 AM _unreal_: only capable of a full turn thanks to the POT
01:35 AM _unreal_: could be subbed for an opto encoder :)
01:36 AM ve7it: is it a brushless motor as well or a stepper?
01:36 AM _unreal_: brushed
01:37 AM ve7it: ok... it just rotates the feed to keep the polarization on track
01:37 AM _unreal_: page 73
01:38 AM ve7it: I noticed in the manual there were a lot of different feed horn options depending on where it was being used and with which satellites
01:38 AM _unreal_: I have a few different one's
01:39 AM _unreal_: the motor/gear setup is STUPID over powered
01:39 AM _unreal_: I took the pot off and put 1.5v dc and I couldnt stop the main gear for nothing by hand
01:39 AM ve7it: good to make an antenna rotator for small arrays
01:40 AM _unreal_: sadly its got a good deal of backlash
01:41 AM _unreal_: in both the gear head. and the main gears
01:42 AM _unreal_: OHHHH maybe its the 3 relays that drive the motor
01:42 AM _unreal_: I was looking for a motor controller
01:42 AM _unreal_: or H bridge of some kind
01:44 AM _unreal_: You'd love the bearings that come out of these units
01:44 AM _unreal_: ok with that Im goign to bed
01:44 AM _unreal_: later
01:44 AM ve7it: gnite
01:50 AM Deejay: moin
04:56 AM Tom_L: morning
04:56 AM XXCoder: yo
05:09 AM jthornton: morning
05:10 AM XXCoder: hey jt
05:10 AM XXCoder: they refunded $31
05:10 AM XXCoder: nice
05:11 AM jthornton: nice
05:12 AM XXCoder: yeah.
05:12 AM XXCoder: might make robot arm like you said
05:51 AM jthornton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okmARZTZ4dg&feature=youtu.be
05:51 AM miss0r: Just had a small land rover adventure last night
05:51 AM miss0r: On a 675km round trip in a series three
05:51 AM miss0r: Lets embark on a christmas tale, that ultimately resulted in a 400km long oil drip & a nasty cold :)
05:52 AM miss0r: well.. not much story anyway. apparently the gasket between the spin-on oil filter console and the engine block was not positioned right(I take full responsibility :)) so it dicided to come lose. well.. not lose per say, but it managed to punch a hole through the side and oil trickled down onto the forward cardan shaft which resulted in outside centrifugal lubrication of the entire underside of the car
05:52 AM miss0r: So, there I was, on the back on the cold tarmack in a random rest stop, fitting a new gasget roughly carved from the cardboard backing from a writing pad.. and sourcing the correct oil at one in the morning was not easy either... (yes ofc. I keep a spare amount in the car, but this was beyond what I had planned for :D)
05:52 AM miss0r: Anyway, I made it home again, with a new roofrack(short version for softtop) which was what the trip was all about. The end. :D
05:53 AM jthornton: that sounds like some of my adventures lol
05:53 AM miss0r: yeah... :)
05:53 AM miss0r: I also discovered the read crank shaft seal had gone bad.. which is nice
05:57 AM jdh: you couldn't re-use your existing poorly installed gasket?
06:00 AM miss0r: jdh: Nope. it had "ripped" a thin section apart that was close to the edge of the mating surfaces
06:00 AM miss0r: https://imgur.com/a/macncLW
06:01 AM jdh: don't see anything special in the pic.
06:01 AM jdh: I mean, it's a brit car with an oil puddle under it.
06:01 AM p0g0: miss0r, you have my sympathy- I once had a seal remain attached to the block when I changed oil filters on a tractor- the two seals won't work, and they failed at engine speed , tossing nigh all the oil in the engine out under pressure. I actually was looking at the thing when it failed, else I'd be out a diesel engine.
06:01 AM miss0r: hehe.. that puddle would make sense it it been there for 5 minuts.. but that was taking the sec I got out the car
06:02 AM p0g0: yeah, it's pumped out at 30+ PSI
06:02 AM miss0r: p0g0: Yeah
06:02 AM miss0r: this is ~70psi though
06:02 AM jdh: p0g0: I've done that once. noticed it when the filter wouldn't seat though
06:02 AM p0g0: that is a high pressure.
06:03 AM miss0r: so that 6� oil resevoir will train fast
06:03 AM p0g0: jdh, I'd never changed the filter on that machine before, but it certainly was my mistake.
06:03 AM miss0r: p0g0: Yeah it is around 5PSI above factory... But that alone did not cause the fail
06:04 AM p0g0: miss0r, right. If that's design P, the filter should seal just fine.
06:04 AM miss0r: my ignorance did... I must've managed to tighten it down unevenly
06:04 AM jdh: mine too. also had it happen with spin-on Racor fuel filters on boats
06:04 AM miss0r: p0g0: It wasn't even the filter. The filter sealed fine. It was the filter mount console that failed in relation the engine block
06:05 AM jdh: no idea what that is.
06:05 AM p0g0: miss0r, but you are right, if that flaw showed you the incipient rear oil seal failure, you are coming out ahead...
06:05 AM p0g0: oh, the bolted on thing that the filter spins on to?
06:05 AM miss0r: yeah
06:06 AM miss0r: https://imgur.com/a/u0MeCQN
06:06 AM miss0r: There you can see the face that the console bolts to
06:06 AM miss0r: in this photo the oil filter console is not bolted on yet
06:06 AM miss0r: (the circular one)
06:09 AM miss0r: Anyway. now I need to start preparations for our new years party tomorrow (Bringing the house up to speed is not an easy task with two kids age 1 and age 4) See you around
06:10 AM jthornton: have fun
06:10 AM p0g0: Sobriety is overated... sometimes.
06:12 AM jthornton: I think I'll get the cannon out and shoot it tomorrow
07:42 AM jymmmm: Good morning folks!
07:52 AM Loetmichel: hihi, i just had (paper) mail from the german KBA(= US DMV)... with a return adress from BMW on the envelope... *WTF*??? opened it: a recall for all E39 BMW, driver airbag can rust under certain conditions and then be a frag grenade when deployed. Nice that they will replace that free of charge for an 18 year old car, but gave me quite the heart attack first ;)
07:55 AM jymmmm: Loetmichel: Your too fuddy duddy to drive anymore, your license is suspended forever, have a nice day.
07:55 AM Loetmichel: Jymmm: yeah, something like that
08:16 AM elmo40: ... suspended for going too SLOW on the autobahn
08:17 AM Loetmichel: elmo40: probably not
08:18 AM Loetmichel: i drive 200++kph wherever allowed and the speed limit wherever its not
08:19 AM Loetmichel: my concern was that somehow the KBA retestet the cars emissions and issued a "revoke license plate" for all cars of that model as a result. or something in that ballpark
08:19 AM elmo40: but that wouldn't come from BMW
08:20 AM Loetmichel: true
08:21 AM Loetmichel: still that was my first thought when i read "KBA" on the envelope
08:34 AM elmo40: my Jetta has a recall. something about it thinking it is in Park when it might not be and allow the car to 'wander off' on its own...
08:39 AM CaptHindsight: had the oil pressure line to the gauge come loose a few miles from home, it painted a trail on the road ~1 inch wide (2.5cm) the whole way back
08:42 AM CaptHindsight: elmo40: had the clutch cable on a jetta break several miles from once, but it would start in gear
08:43 AM CaptHindsight: fun timing all the traffic lights and traffic to avoid having to completely stop
08:43 AM elmo40: that is lovely
08:43 AM CaptHindsight: the synchros did a good job
08:44 AM elmo40: i bet
08:45 AM elmo40: my Ford Transit 250 also has a recal. something about trailer wiring harness catching fire due to being UNDER A FUCKING FLOOR MAT!!
08:46 AM elmo40: didn't Ford engraneers watch the videos in elementary school about placing extension chords under a carpet?
08:46 AM CaptHindsight: that rule applies to homes :)
08:49 AM CaptHindsight: didn't just about every Japanese car made in the past 25 years get an air bag recall?
08:49 AM gregcnc: the takata airbrag recall is old news. I just took my BMW in, but it had been out of service for 5 years, I was getting notices by mail weekly at one point.
08:50 AM gregcnc: some cars had the recall airbag recalled
08:50 AM CaptHindsight: nice
08:50 AM Loetmichel: gregcnc: they say in the letter its "possible" that my car has the airbag in question if it had a refit, not if it has the original steering wheel
08:51 AM Loetmichel: so i am not THAT concerned
08:51 AM gregcnc: less than a year to take your chances?
08:51 AM Loetmichel: hmm?
08:52 AM CaptHindsight: I try not to deploy them
08:52 AM gregcnc: you said the car won't pass next inspection
08:52 AM Loetmichel: yes
08:52 AM Loetmichel: but next TÜV is in 02/2021
08:52 AM elmo40: CaptHindsight, doesn't everyone try not to?
08:53 AM CaptHindsight: elmo40: not from what i see
08:53 AM elmo40: true enough...
08:53 AM * Loetmichel is more concerned that the BMW dealer wouldnt give me my car back before he mounted a new windshield on MY cost should i go there now
08:53 AM Loetmichel: it has a big fat crack in it
08:53 AM Loetmichel: and yes, they can do that in germany
08:54 AM Loetmichel: they even have to if the car isnt "street legal" any more
08:54 AM gregcnc: TUV mandates winter tires in Germany?
08:55 AM CaptHindsight: a big problem here is bald tires
08:55 AM Loetmichel: gregcnc: no
08:55 AM CaptHindsight: they seem to only get replaced when they go flat
08:55 AM Loetmichel: police does
08:55 AM gregcnc: how many cars have winter tires?
08:56 AM Loetmichel: bald tyres would be a problem though
08:56 AM Loetmichel: i would say 90% have winter tyres
08:56 AM Loetmichel: in winter
08:56 AM Loetmichel: the rest pretty much all season
08:56 AM CaptHindsight: might be 9% here
08:56 AM Loetmichel: i doubt there are many cars here on the streets in winter with summer tyres
08:56 AM CaptHindsight: all season bald is most common
08:56 AM Loetmichel: if you get caught thats a pretty hefty fine
08:57 AM Loetmichel: even if you dont crash and lose your insurance because of it
08:57 AM gregcnc: blizzak has a nation wide shortage right now in many sizes
08:57 AM CaptHindsight: I had a rental last month with near bald tires
08:57 AM elmo40: EU mandates max 6-year old tires, correct?
08:58 AM CaptHindsight: also had a rental with expired plates
08:59 AM CaptHindsight: you have to really check rental cars these days
08:59 AM elmo40: maybe in the USA
09:03 AM jymmmm: Loetmichel: They may HAVE to do the repair, but if you didn't aithroize it, you shouldn't have to pay for the repair.
09:03 AM jymmmm: authorize*
09:03 AM gregcnc: heh, that only works in america
09:03 AM Loetmichel: Jymmm: IIRC they can actually take the car hostage until you authorize the repair
09:03 AM jymmmm: gregcnc: For good reason.
09:03 AM Loetmichel: in germany
09:04 AM jymmmm: Loetmichel: lol
09:04 AM Loetmichel: or repair it otherwise
09:04 AM _unreal_: jymmmm, you still have not told me was the projector a good buy or no?
09:04 AM jymmmm: _unreal_: Yes
09:05 AM _unreal_: coo
09:05 AM CaptHindsight: trade offs, safety inspections for cars vs no inspections, mouth off on which is better or worse
09:06 AM _unreal_: I was thinking would make a REALLY cool arcade projector
09:07 AM CaptHindsight: mandatory driving classes vs you didn't get a moving violation on your license exam
09:07 AM gregcnc: we could easily wipe 20-30% of drivers off the road if we were strict
09:07 AM gregcnc: but america IS cars
09:08 AM CaptHindsight: when you have driven in the USA vs China, Germany and Mexico
09:08 AM _unreal_: heh gregcnc 20% of the drivers in florida not only dont have lisences they are illegal aliens as well
09:08 AM CaptHindsight: alien invasion
09:09 AM CaptHindsight: I don't mind aliens
09:09 AM CaptHindsight: willfully ignorant are more of a nuisance
09:10 AM elmo40: Loetmichel, they can't take your car hostage in Ontario, Canada.
09:10 AM Loetmichel: elmo40: funnily: they cant for unpaid bills
09:10 AM elmo40: they can let you know the car is unfit... and then call the Ministry on your sorry ass.
09:11 AM Loetmichel: but they CAN if they deem the car "unsafe for driving"
09:11 AM elmo40: not here
09:11 AM elmo40: only the Ministry has the authority to pull off the road
09:12 AM elmo40: a garage is not the gov't
09:12 AM Loetmichel: same here
09:12 AM Loetmichel: they cant destroy the license stickers
09:12 AM elmo40: and the gov't is who makes the laws.
09:12 AM Loetmichel: thats only done by the city/KBA
09:12 AM elmo40: but yeah, garages believe they have that power, but they don't
09:12 AM CaptHindsight: what i find is how different countries get some things better or worse than others, what is better or worse is just a different combo
09:12 AM Loetmichel: but they CAN hold the car and dont give you back the keys until its repaired one way or the other
09:12 AM Loetmichel: IIRC they are even forced to
09:13 AM elmo40: Loetmichel, i dont understand
09:13 AM elmo40: how can they detain your vehicle?
09:13 AM Loetmichel: close the door to the shop for example
09:14 AM Loetmichel: so even if you have a reserve key it would be trespassing to get your car out
09:14 AM gregcnc: is this somethign you agree when you register the car?
09:14 AM elmo40: interesting. so germany garages are 'acting representatives' of the gov't and can detain an unfit vehicle?
09:16 AM Loetmichel: elmo40: IIRC(!) they HAVE to try to prevent you from driving an "unsafe" car on the streets, but cant do anything other than "parking it in" or "closing the door", they are NOT allowed to destroy the tags.
09:16 AM Loetmichel: if you find a way to get it off their property they are powerless
09:17 AM Loetmichel: they cant even object if you get a tow service to bring it to a different garage and HAVE to hand you the keys in that case
09:17 AM Loetmichel: they just have to prevent you from driving it in an unsafe state
09:17 AM Loetmichel: as i said above: "IIIRC"
09:19 AM elmo40: for sure they shouldn't be able to prevent you from towing it.
09:20 AM Loetmichel: yes
09:20 AM elmo40: as i said. some mechanic monkeys believe they are allowed to detain the vehicle until it is deemed 'fit' again... which they are not (in Ontario).
09:20 AM Loetmichel: as i said: they are obligated to prevent you from driving an unsafe car
09:21 AM Loetmichel: not hold it hostage, that was my fault
09:22 AM elmo40: but if Allemange is allowed to detain vehicles then i think that is a slippery slope of bias by the mechanics. (it could pass but we need a sale on tires... FAIL)
09:22 AM Loetmichel: anyways, i wont arrive at BMW with a cracked windshield. the BMW approved dealers take about 10 times the money to swap the windshield than the free "car glass" like shops
09:23 AM elmo40: indeed
09:24 AM CaptHindsight: elmo40: I once had a driver in Canada honk at me, you think they were an alien?
09:24 AM Loetmichel: elmo40: the tyre problem is easily solved: just get the summer/winter tyres if the other ones are blank
09:24 AM Loetmichel: they cant deem it "unsafe" then ;)
09:25 AM elmo40: CaptHindsight, most of us are alien! baby trudey allows ANYONE to enter...
09:41 AM CaptHindsight: that baby can't hold a candle to the one over here
09:56 AM gregcnc: capthindsight, i'm sure he was just pointing you to the tim hortons
10:06 AM beachbumpete1: Hey folks
10:06 AM beachbumpete1: well my free draftsight license is going bye bye as of the 31st...
10:06 AM beachbumpete1: trying to decide if I want to ante up for their yearly contract now
10:07 AM beachbumpete1: is there any other good free autocad clone options out there that are deent I am not aware of?
10:08 AM beachbumpete1: their professional license is $200 a year
10:08 AM beachbumpete1: I know not very expensive
10:08 AM beachbumpete1: but we have autocad at work and I only use this at home in my personal stuff
10:08 AM beachbumpete1: what 2d drafting softwares are you guys usiing?
10:16 AM Tom_L: is it worth $200 to learn something new or keep using what you use and know?
10:17 AM Tom_L: if it will pay for itself in that time i'd say keep it
10:27 AM beachbumpete1: Tom_L: I hear ya man
10:30 AM Tom_L: and if you're making money with it you should be able to use it as a deduction
10:30 AM beachbumpete1: just that after Christmas and whatnot is not the best time to be buying things
10:31 AM beachbumpete1: sure
10:31 AM beachbumpete1: I probably sound like a real cheapass here LOL
10:31 AM Tom_L: no
10:31 AM beachbumpete1: just knowing I have it for free at work
10:31 AM beachbumpete1: kinda sucks to be buying it just for my personal use
10:31 AM Tom_L: talk them into a site license :)
10:32 AM beachbumpete1: they have a standard license that is 100
10:32 AM beachbumpete1: but it does not have pdf import and a bunch of other things.
10:32 AM Tom_L: and you need pdf import?
10:32 AM beachbumpete1: the pro has power trim and a good bit of other tools
10:32 AM beachbumpete1: yeah man I use it all the time
10:32 AM beachbumpete1: at least at work here
10:33 AM Tom_L: ?
10:33 AM Tom_L: and they don't own it?
10:33 AM beachbumpete1: customers send us drawings in pdf format
10:33 AM Tom_L: so you convert it at home?
10:33 AM beachbumpete1: what
10:33 AM beachbumpete1: no we have full blown autocad licenses here
10:33 AM beachbumpete1: they have pdf import
10:33 AM Tom_L: you just said they have a standard license
10:33 AM beachbumpete1: no I meant that dassault systems sells a standard license for 100
10:33 AM Tom_L: or are you talking about acad
10:34 AM beachbumpete1: I am using a free license currently at home
10:34 AM beachbumpete1: at work we have autocad
10:34 AM Tom_L: draftsight is dassault?
10:34 AM beachbumpete1: Iyeah
10:34 AM beachbumpete1: yeah it is
10:34 AM Tom_L: oh
10:34 AM beachbumpete1: draftsight is quite good I think
10:34 AM Tom_L: i wasn't aware of that.. i don't use it
10:34 AM Tom_L: i use sw and catia
10:34 AM beachbumpete1: I actually like it better than autocad for most things
10:35 AM skunkworks: FinboySlick: Yes - we have the kearney and trecker 3B
10:35 AM beachbumpete1: for 2d?
10:35 AM Tom_L: for anything
10:35 AM beachbumpete1: I have played with using fusion360 for my 2d drawings
10:35 AM Tom_L: i don't like f360
10:35 AM skunkworks: FinboySlick: delivered to a local manufacture in 68'
10:36 AM Tom_L: they got a long ways to go
10:36 AM skunkworks: we got it from the junk yard in the mid 80's
10:36 AM beachbumpete1: it works but it lacks a lot of features that the draftsmen I deal with want in the drawings
10:36 AM beachbumpete1: personally I love fusion360
10:36 AM beachbumpete1: use it at home and at work
10:36 AM Tom_L: if i did, i might like it
10:36 AM beachbumpete1: made tons of parts with it
10:37 AM Tom_L: certainly don't like freecad
10:37 AM beachbumpete1: cut shit tons of plywood sheets with it, machined hardwoods on our CNC flatbed routers
10:37 AM beachbumpete1: ran bunches of parts with it on our HAAS VF4
10:37 AM beachbumpete1: I have few complaints especailly when you consider the cost
10:38 AM Tom_L: still making scope mounts?
10:39 AM skunkworks: I still haven't played with fusion as much as I would like/
10:40 AM Tom_L: i'm just not that motivated to since i've got a working cad cam solution
10:46 AM beachbumpete1: yeah I was until I tried to replace the spindle bearings in my machine
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: having issues with that and I am kinda tapped out now after CHristmas
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: my daughter had a kinda scary medical emergency that put her in the hospital for almost a month
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: they transferred from hospital to hospital ending up at a childrens specialist hospital
10:51 AM Tom_L: that sucks
10:51 AM Tom_L: hope things are ok
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: yeah and while she is fine now it cost us a lot of money
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: my wife was out of work for over a month
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: I was out for over a week
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: and driving back and forth and copays and doctors visits
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: ate us a great deal of money
10:51 AM beachbumpete1: the hospital was in Miami
11:18 AM _unreal_: beachbumpete1, I know that feeling
11:18 AM _unreal_: 5 years ago my daughter came down with appendicitis
11:19 AM _unreal_: she was so small they had to operate from the oposite side. making her stay in the hospital for a week rather then a day
11:22 AM beachbumpete1: yeah man it was scary
11:23 AM beachbumpete1: sorry I am at work right now
11:23 AM beachbumpete1: gotta keep busy
11:23 AM beachbumpete1: she started having these mild seizures all of a sudden out of the blue
11:23 AM beachbumpete1: and they got much worse as time went on
11:24 AM beachbumpete1: CAT scans, MRI's EEG,s from multiple hospitals and they could not figure it out.
11:35 AM elmo40: beachbumpete1, hey.
11:35 AM elmo40: how did the second printed speaker box go?
12:00 PM beachbumpete1: elmo40: I got one speaker encloser printed but working on the other one now
12:03 PM _unreal_: trying to figure out what to do with these
12:03 PM _unreal_: getting link one sec
12:03 PM _unreal_: I have two of these https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/shopping/catalog/retired_products/hmi_(human_machine_interface)/ea7-t6cl
12:03 PM _unreal_: one with a broken LCD
12:10 PM _unreal_: err not broken screen broken touch panel lcd is ok
12:10 PM _unreal_: thankfully
12:14 PM elmo40: so... they are a tiny computer with screen?
12:14 PM elmo40: it has a NIC and CPU
12:14 PM elmo40: beachbumpete1, did you try different settings for the second one? decrease the print time a little?
12:16 PM _unreal_: elmo40, I have two of them
12:17 PM elmo40: 'they are...' is what i wrote. meaning plural.
12:17 PM _unreal_: elmo40, infact I have an entire set of PLC controller hardware with lots of modulus as well.
12:17 PM elmo40: gonna make a factory?
12:17 PM elmo40: or setup street lights?
12:17 PM _unreal_: who knows likely $$$ collect ;)
12:17 PM beachbumpete1: Oh hell yeah man I cut like 10 hours off it
12:17 PM _unreal_: elmo40, this is kthe kind of stuff i get from the yachts now and then
12:18 PM beachbumpete1: 24 down from 35
12:18 PM _unreal_: they just throw this stuff away brand new
12:18 PM _unreal_: I have lots nad lots of adapters
12:18 PM _unreal_: ethernet to rs232 etc... adapters
12:18 PM _unreal_: lots of sensor stuff
12:19 PM _unreal_: I typically just collect then sell them all
12:21 PM _unreal_: for example I just got a set of these https://jtechdigital.com/product/jtech-wex-200m4k-r-0309/
12:21 PM _unreal_: pulled them from the dumpster
12:25 PM FinboySlick: _unreal_: You got those in 10Gbps ethernet? ;)
12:29 PM _unreal_: FinboySlick, ?
12:31 PM FinboySlick: _unreal_: the HDMI extenders.
12:31 PM _unreal_: FinboySlick, HDMI video is not compressed those adapters have hardware compression to allow for the wireless transmission
12:32 PM CaptHindsight: like the cable co's
12:32 PM FinboySlick: I know. I think you can do 1080p 'raw' on 10Gbps though.
12:32 PM _unreal_: FinboySlick, and the same with digital over air TV...
12:33 PM _unreal_: that is compressed
12:33 PM FinboySlick: Yes, I'm aware.
12:33 PM FinboySlick: Hence my asking if you had a 10Gbps version of those.
12:33 PM CaptHindsight: FinboySlick: how are you aliens doing?
12:33 PM FinboySlick: CaptHindsight: .... Refresh my memory ;)
12:34 PM _unreal_: I'm using the one's I have
12:34 PM _unreal_: I did get a really cool everything to HDMI adapter last week or so
12:34 PM _unreal_: some composit, component, coax etc.... and other formats to HDMI
12:35 PM _unreal_: I'll prob put that on the LCD projector I have
12:35 PM FinboySlick: I have a stacking ethernet switch here that uses hdmi cables the stacking backplane.
12:35 PM _unreal_: for the main trunk?
12:36 PM FinboySlick: I can see the Taiwanese engineers: "We need a multi-Gbps cable that won't cost more than the whole switch."
12:36 PM _unreal_: where to get such a thing :) think think think
12:36 PM FinboySlick: _unreal_: Well, the inter-switch backplane, yes. The fabric itself has the whole 24Gbps backplane internally. They do about 5Gbps on HDMI.
12:37 PM _unreal_: I have a few ethernet switchs I really dont need
12:37 PM _unreal_: but as I find them i still cant help my self and pull them from the dumpsters
12:37 PM _unreal_: god I love the luxury yachts :)
12:38 PM _unreal_: last year I got a miele expresso machine worth $3k
12:38 PM _unreal_: they "got a new one" because it had a touch screen
12:38 PM CaptHindsight: Monty Python - Raymond Luxury Yacht
12:38 PM _unreal_: I saw the mate walking it to the dumpster. he set it down next to it. i was like what cha doing. drove up with the golf car. and he told me
12:38 PM FinboySlick: CaptHindsight: You have me worried now. Were the aliens successful at abducting me and I don't remember?
12:39 PM _unreal_: they got a new one with a tuch screen. I was like whats wrong with this one. and they said IT DOESNT have a touch screen.
12:39 PM CaptHindsight: FinboySlick: not sure but one may have honked their horn at me while driving
12:39 PM _unreal_: so I was like OHHHHH.
12:39 PM _unreal_: MINE
12:39 PM _unreal_: FinboySlick, YES
12:43 PM FinboySlick: CaptHindsight: Heh. Alright. I thought we might have had a conversation about aliens or somesuch and I didn't remember it at all.
12:46 PM CaptHindsight: FinboySlick: must have been an alien since native Canadians are too polite for that
12:47 PM CaptHindsight: my UPS driver just tapped on the door with gloves on, guess he was trying to not wake me
12:47 PM FinboySlick: "Excuse me, there's too much snow in the driveway, I can't kick the box all the way to your door efficiently enough so I just ran it over."
12:47 PM elmo40: whatcha get??
12:51 PM CaptHindsight: elmo40: boxes, taped shut, have to find that video...
12:52 PM elmo40: ??
12:52 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGlyBA8TgjE
12:53 PM CaptHindsight: I used to just shake them in the hopes that something would fall out, that knife trick thing is like magic :)
12:59 PM FinboySlick: I also like that he has a box on his shirt too. A man and his passion.
01:01 PM FinboySlick: CaptHindsight: Alternatively: https://youtu.be/BYLS8OZ98Z8?t=27
01:03 PM elmo40: now that is a real man's way!
01:03 PM elmo40: gotta love AvE!
01:03 PM elmo40: Good ol' canukistan...
01:04 PM FinboySlick: Indeed. I like when the chainsaw fails and he resorts to using an axe.
01:04 PM elmo40: his mini chainsaw ones are even better
01:04 PM elmo40: LoL
01:04 PM gregcnc: he used to be amusing
01:06 PM elmo40: the generator one was interesting
01:07 PM gregcnc: I haven't watched the second one. pan was off and they didn't bother checking things? lets run it for YT maybe it will throw a rod on video....
01:12 PM elmo40: they knew what was wrong. besides. it is a commercial diesel. they knock FOREVER before they throw a rod
01:15 PM FinboySlick: I still like his stuff.
01:16 PM gregcnc: could be entertaining at least three beers deep
01:17 PM FinboySlick: I mean not all Youtubers can be as professional and entertaining as Stefan Goetswinter.
01:17 PM FinboySlick: ;)
01:25 PM syyl: dont trust that gotteswinter guy
01:26 PM syyl: he is just a guy in his basement
01:26 PM Tom_L: basement dwellers can't be trusted?
01:26 PM syyl: never ;)
01:26 PM syyl: at least not me
01:26 PM FinboySlick: Just realized I mispelled that :P Let's pretend I meant another Stefan.
01:28 PM FinboySlick: Oh. I had an actual linuxcnc question for once too!
01:29 PM FinboySlick: Say I have a helical path (essentially interpolated boring), is there a setting to adjust stock to leave without re-writing the whole file?
01:29 PM FinboySlick: Basically, I need an interpolated boring head.
01:30 PM FinboySlick: (what I really need is a lathe that can hold a 8" pulley but all I have is a cnc mill and a 20k RPM spindle).
01:32 PM Tom_L: make sure the pulley is balanced before you chuck that in the spindle :)
01:32 PM FinboySlick: It might stretch to 8.5 inches ;)
01:34 PM FinboySlick: Anyway. I was asking because I think some fancy cnc mills have that where they essentially adjust the toolpath on the fly to leave more stock, etc.
01:34 PM FinboySlick: And I was wondering if there's such a thing with linuxcnc.
01:34 PM FinboySlick: I guess I could write my own little python generator too but why re-invent the wheel.
01:39 PM jdh: cutter radius compensation with a slightly bogus radius?
01:40 PM FinboySlick: Yeah, something like that.
01:40 PM FinboySlick: For lack of lathe, I need to bore a 3/4" hole up to about 7/8, press fit a plug, and re-bore to 3/4"
01:41 PM jdh: the obvious solution would be to buy a lathe
01:41 PM jdh: c'mon, you needed a reason
01:41 PM FinboySlick: Yes, or even borrow one.
01:41 PM CaptHindsight: I have a Rpi4 running the display at 4K only 20C above ambient for 2 days
01:41 PM gregcnc: radius comp allows just that, but usually a very small value.
01:42 PM gregcnc: depending on entry moves and helix radius, it may err with large Rcomp values
01:42 PM CaptHindsight: u-boot for the rpi4 is still not there
01:42 PM FinboySlick: very small values would be fine. Basically, I'll program the right size or a few thou under, then tweak as needed.
01:43 PM gregcnc: that's how you normally use it
01:44 PM jdh: easier if you generated the toolpath to use cutter compensation in the first place.
01:44 PM jdh: or use a slightly undersized tool
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: maybe Gentoo and preempt_rt will be usable with a Mesa FPGA
01:45 PM gregcnc: doesn't matter, you just change teh value of the radius
01:45 PM gregcnc: the only issue with the program is the lead in to (de)activate G41/2
01:45 PM CaptHindsight: but I'm not really saving much on a BOM using a Rpi4 vs x86
01:45 PM FinboySlick: CaptHindsight: Let me know if you ever run into Gentoo problems. I've been a daily user since it came out.
01:46 PM CaptHindsight: FinboySlick: I have an in house Gentoo and RTAI dev here :)
01:46 PM gregcnc: ie, whether you tool radius or wear value in comp
01:46 PM FinboySlick: Oh memleak is involved in gentoo?
01:47 PM CaptHindsight: oh yeah
01:47 PM jdh: I'd like a little rpi box for my 6040
01:47 PM FinboySlick: I ran into him there a couple times. Glad to see he's still at it.
01:47 PM _unreal_: jdh, https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipNjUL9VJW4BIh58ZOHM6jOWS10l43lfzL_nr7FMD-YXm_o6hG63BfTN2Rv6ch6C_Q?key=OVV0UTBXUmF0NXNSR2NKVzdoaFhxQzVTbDI5V3JB
01:48 PM CaptHindsight: he's been working on real time kernels with Gentoo to replace a $1,000.000 VXworks Linux license
01:49 PM CaptHindsight: sorry meant Wind River, they also make VXworks
01:49 PM _unreal_: jdh, ?
01:50 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.windriver.com/products/linux/
01:50 PM CaptHindsight: it's a Linux turd
01:50 PM jdh: yeah. not so much looking for the box part. but BOM & directions for setting it up
01:54 PM CaptHindsight: jdh: I think Skunkworks has had a pi4 running LCNC for several weeks...
01:54 PM CaptHindsight: has some issues with latency at times
01:55 PM jdh: with mesa/ethernet?
01:55 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qS7fy4qBC-g yes
01:57 PM CaptHindsight: not ready for anything I'd sell and have to support yet
01:57 PM jdh: I can wait.
01:58 PM CaptHindsight: OH Yeah https://youtu.be/qS7fy4qBC-g?t=98
01:58 PM CaptHindsight: 2D accell is not done currently in hardware
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: thats why he had issues when he moved the GUI around the screen
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: 3D is hardware accell
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: we just noticed it after getting it to stay cool
02:00 PM CaptHindsight: not sure why the "Raspbian" devs don't have 2D accel working yet
02:10 PM CaptHindsight: according to the video there is a HAL patch/trick to deal with lost packets from the Rpi to mesa fpga
02:10 PM CaptHindsight: but 2D HW accell should be the real fix
02:11 PM _unreal_: heh
02:11 PM jdh: what is the mesa transport? raw ethernet?
02:11 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, thats just kind of funny
02:11 PM _unreal_: got 3d hardware working 2d not working
02:11 PM _unreal_: thats like SOO backward :)
02:11 PM _unreal_: heh
02:11 PM CaptHindsight: UDP packets
02:11 PM CaptHindsight: yeah, will now see why
02:12 PM _unreal_: well I'm happy, I just got the Y to X bridge frame mounted to the Y bearings and I'm content with the motion
02:12 PM _unreal_: no more binding
02:12 PM _unreal_: and what little resistance there is I'll live with
02:13 PM _unreal_: I am fearful there will be some flex because of the agressive setup i'm going with
02:13 PM _unreal_: but it CANT be any more then my current machine has
02:15 PM CaptHindsight: Raspbian Buster with desktop and recommended software Version: September 2019
02:15 PM CaptHindsight: at least no 2D hardware accell with the above
02:17 PM CaptHindsight: " I guess the Raspbian developers disabled hardware acceleration after finding a bug,"
02:18 PM CaptHindsight: have to see what the Raspbian dev mail list might say about it
02:21 PM _unreal_: wonder if its a hardware bug that can be firmware patched in anyway?
02:21 PM _unreal_: or software work around
02:22 PM CaptHindsight: reading other posts I'm not sure what is up
02:22 PM CaptHindsight: too many people on the list that flip yes,no, up,down, on,off around
02:28 PM _unreal_: ?
02:28 PM _unreal_: hum
02:28 PM _unreal_: OMG make it stop.....
02:28 PM _unreal_: very pissed off btw...
02:28 PM _unreal_: yet again I cant be an adult
02:29 PM _unreal_: because my Xwife CANT be a parent
02:29 PM _unreal_: she is suposed to take are daughter for school vacataions
02:29 PM _unreal_: she took her for 4 days total. and two times
02:30 PM _unreal_: so now I'm trying to get this machine done and I have though adorable, my daughter motor mouthing endlessly
02:30 PM _unreal_: ARG..
02:31 PM _unreal_: I STILL cant find my damn mouse
02:31 PM _unreal_: the mouse i'm using is just not working at all. something is really messed up with it so I cant do my cad work right now. I have a few extras but ever since that @#$@#%$!#@ major water leak in my room.
02:32 PM _unreal_: I have yet to find a bunch of things because I had to shuffle so many things as fast as I could
02:32 PM CaptHindsight: _unreal_: I went through 18 years of that, now my kids are near 30
02:34 PM CaptHindsight: you have to think long term, well worked for me, mostly
02:34 PM _unreal_: I cant WAIT to be free of my POS xwife.
02:34 PM _unreal_: I have no child support or anything like that infact I WON the court battle. but saddly the bit....ch still has partial custody
02:35 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, heh now my Xwife has an other divorce on her reccord AND a bastard child with an illegal alien who has been deported
02:35 PM gloops: lol
02:36 PM _unreal_: she's been trying to suggest to are daughter that she should go to live with her mother and go to school by her.. I'm like ahhh A.B.C.D........ETC... oh btw she wants you for a baby sitter
02:38 PM _unreal_: omg.... its following me.... "my daughter"
02:40 PM _unreal_: ok so the next thing I need to do is get the upper support mounted
02:40 PM _unreal_: opinion
02:40 PM _unreal_: I'm trying to decide how I should mount my extrusion so I can mount the rails
02:40 PM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1fCGveW9ftNgEdcqa857odj_Deort-nNB
02:41 PM _unreal_: the Z is going to be mounted between the top bridge brackets
02:41 PM _unreal_: would you guys mount the extrusion 4020 on the top sides? or on the very top?
02:42 PM CaptHindsight: _unreal_: https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/celebrities-marriages-divorces.html/
02:42 PM gloops: this is looking a lot better than the last one _unreal_
02:42 PM _unreal_: gloops, whaaaaa
02:43 PM _unreal_: I should snap a new photo but
02:43 PM gloops: wheres the z going though?
02:43 PM _unreal_: between the top two cross bars
02:43 PM _unreal_: Z will be dead center
02:43 PM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1f5RpuuAvbcSQXCfoSPNeKWsTfQSwsbzo
02:43 PM _unreal_: just an other view showing the extrusion
02:44 PM _unreal_: I'm looking at mounting it on the sides as pictured? OR sitting on the very top
02:44 PM _unreal_: I'm sure it doesnt matter to much
02:44 PM gloops: fair old drop there
02:44 PM _unreal_: regardless the Z/X carrage is going to be over the very top. the idea being to spread the load as much as I can
02:45 PM _unreal_: gloops, the working tool should go no higher then the bottom of the 45's
02:46 PM gloops: its going to be putting some leverage on the top beams though
02:46 PM _unreal_: gloops, thats what I'm looking at
02:46 PM _unreal_: those beams are hardened aluminum
02:46 PM _unreal_: AND
02:46 PM _unreal_: I'm going to mount the extrusion 90 degrees to it
02:47 PM _unreal_: if I mount the extrusion on the fwd/aft sides I can lower the rail mount point by almost 2"
02:47 PM gloops: wheres the linear rails go?
02:47 PM _unreal_: just going to be a major pain in the ass
02:47 PM _unreal_: let me mock it up
02:47 PM _unreal_: give me a few to setup and snap a picture
02:47 PM gloops: ill keep watching
02:47 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=249382
02:48 PM CaptHindsight: Bootable 64-bit Gentoo image for the RPi4 released (Xfce4 desktop)
02:50 PM CaptHindsight: https://github.com/sakaki-/gentoo-on-rpi-64bit
02:52 PM _unreal_: so tired of this endless rain
02:52 PM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1fIqe3327sgzJ5FCUP2U10PzIGguJ715H
02:53 PM _unreal_: gloops, those are the two options
02:53 PM _unreal_: gloops, I'm also looking at making a 5 axis setup with this system
02:53 PM _unreal_: ?
02:54 PM * _unreal_ is debaiting alcohol
02:54 PM _unreal_: ve7it, sup
02:54 PM _unreal_: gloops, thoughts? CaptHindsight thoughts?
02:55 PM _unreal_: on where I should mount my rail that is :)
02:55 PM gloops: so the z is gonna run between those 2 rails
02:55 PM _unreal_: yes
02:55 PM _unreal_: I said that a few times hehe
02:55 PM gloops: yeah i kinda knew what you meant...but
02:55 PM _unreal_: I'm going to put a 45 on the silver rail as well just like the blue one
02:55 PM gloops: i wouldnt lol
02:56 PM _unreal_: I would and WILL
02:56 PM gloops: this is going to be complicated
02:56 PM ve7it: _unreal_, https://drive.google.com/open?id=1O_kSp8N4vt2R3FWCY6W7VSbVT9WVyCv- just the outputs to do (and the sip resistor)
02:56 PM gloops: its maximising the leverage on the bearings
02:56 PM gloops: thats as far from the cut as they can be
02:57 PM gloops: ive seen routers like that before though
02:57 PM _unreal_: ve7it, hehe I'm waiting for the Starwars phantom menace where "child" anakin sitting in the pod racer goes "ITS WORKING, ITS WORKING....."
02:57 PM _unreal_: FROM YOU
02:57 PM _unreal_: gloops, whats going to be complicated?
02:58 PM gloops: why not go for a conventional build, something nice and boring with the rails mounted on the vertical plane
02:58 PM CaptHindsight: heh, asking my advice on alcohol :)
02:59 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, I already have my answer thank you captin.. morgan
02:59 PM _unreal_: gloops, because I got these parts free
02:59 PM CaptHindsight: I have too much driving left to do today so I can't start yet
02:59 PM _unreal_: and this frame is stronger
03:00 PM gloops: well, the parts look great and the steel looks up to the job
03:00 PM _unreal_: gloops, the top X to Z carriage is going to be something like 8+ " wide
03:00 PM gloops: but the way theyre placed is very important
03:01 PM _unreal_: because it reaches like 4" over the Y rail
03:01 PM _unreal_: hell the carriage may end up being even wider have to mount the motor as well on center
03:01 PM gloops: whats the z going to be attached to?
03:01 PM _unreal_: so it will spread the load a lot
03:02 PM _unreal_: gloops, THAT is a good question
03:02 PM CaptHindsight: what is this machine supposed to do?
03:02 PM _unreal_: I have more of that smaller extrusion
03:02 PM _unreal_: but I dont know for sure if I want to use it
03:02 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, mill
03:02 PM _unreal_: I dont know if I want to use that extrusion for the Z vertical plain parts? or if I want to get square tubing?
03:03 PM _unreal_: I also dont know how I want to mount the spindle
03:03 PM _unreal_: if I use the extrusion parts I could mount Z dead center between 4 beams
03:03 PM CaptHindsight: what is the width of the gantry (outside dimm)
03:03 PM CaptHindsight: ?
03:03 PM _unreal_: and laser switch to a two axis Z
03:04 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, over all width?
03:04 PM _unreal_: work working area
03:04 PM _unreal_: tooling area
03:04 PM _unreal_: ?
03:04 PM CaptHindsight: either, just looking for a reference
03:04 PM _unreal_: the overall is 24"x34"
03:05 PM _unreal_: the bottom of the 45 support Id have to check that brb
03:06 PM _unreal_: the bottom of the 45's are 12" from the bed
03:06 PM _unreal_: the TOP of the X bridge bars is 16.5"
03:07 PM _unreal_: I dont plan on the Z working height being any more then 10-12"
03:07 PM _unreal_: and there is no waste board in place
03:07 PM _unreal_: tooling area depends on the spindle
03:08 PM _unreal_: if I could make a nice goose neck spindle setup. then I could have 18" by 30" work area EASY
03:09 PM _unreal_: I would LOVE to build one of those quadcopter motor spindles
03:09 PM _unreal_: I just dont have a lathe :/
03:10 PM _unreal_: so any thoughs on where to mount the X rails?
03:10 PM _unreal_: on the sides on the tops?
03:10 PM _unreal_: I'm leaning for sides heavly
03:11 PM gloops: hmm, there was one built like yours on youtube ages ago but cant find it now
03:11 PM _unreal_: The goal being to get them low
03:12 PM _unreal_: I will likely go with a STEEL plate for the X/Z carriage
03:14 PM gloops: id grind those 2 45s off and mount the extrusions/rails there
03:15 PM gloops: maybe weld the 45s back on the inside
03:25 PM _unreal_: the extrusions are not being touched
03:25 PM _unreal_: err 45s
03:26 PM _unreal_: @$%Q#$^#$T%R god I cant think.... very pissed off that my Xwife cant be a parent
03:30 PM _unreal_: gloops, I'm not sure what your obsestion with removing the supports is.. regardless I dont need 16" of Z
03:30 PM _unreal_: 10 is likely more then enough
03:32 PM Deejay: gn8
03:33 PM gloops: why 10 inch?
03:36 PM jimmyhorns: Hi, just a quick question. I am considering linuxcnc as a way of initially performing DRO tasks (so only reading position rather than having actuators move my lathe / mill). This is with a view to later moving on to actual cnc use. Is this a reasonable proposition?
03:37 PM Jymmm: Sure, if you have a spare screen and PC laying around, then of course the scale or whatever you plan on using
03:40 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: not sure how far into reading about LCNC you are but...
03:40 PM CaptHindsight: what will you be using for encoders? and how will you input them to LCNC?
03:41 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, likely the standard way anyone uses LCNC and encoders
03:41 PM _unreal_: jimmyhorns, though if your just trying to go for a DRO
03:41 PM _unreal_: you would be better off going with any of the open source arduino setups that just use an arduino and an i2c lcd
03:42 PM jimmyhorns: I have been reading a modest amount. For encoders I am toying with the idea of rotary encoders on a rack and (split) pinion or belt system, the encoders read by an arduino type board (actually an STM32 as can offer better resolution without risk of missing steps).
03:42 PM _unreal_: if your JUST looking for dro
03:42 PM _unreal_: jimmyhorns, there are hardware quadrature encoders that use i2c
03:43 PM _unreal_: if your worried about missing steps
03:43 PM jimmyhorns: I can go straight from the STM32 board to a SVGA display, but wanted something more scalable and ideally so that when I do start to drive the axes I am familiar with the software / method.
03:43 PM _unreal_: but if your pushing a machine by HAND or even using a power feed. you are NOT likely to exceed the read rate and miss steps
03:43 PM jimmyhorns: For me this is partly about the journey, rather than just the end result
03:43 PM _unreal_: jimmyhorns, then your kind of going backwards FYI
03:44 PM jimmyhorns: how so?
03:44 PM _unreal_: heh
03:44 PM _unreal_: the idea is to get the motors working and work your way up
03:44 PM _unreal_: are you planning on using stepper motors?
03:44 PM _unreal_: servos? brushed/brushless
03:44 PM _unreal_: steppers with encoders?
03:45 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: will or do you have quadrature encoders?
03:45 PM _unreal_: jimmyhorns, your going to find that lcnc is deigned around driving motors more so then being a dumb dro
03:45 PM jimmyhorns: when the powered axes come in to play, is very likely to be step-servos
03:46 PM _unreal_: is this a lathe or a mill? or one of those semi hybrids?
03:46 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: you can use a Mesa FPGA board with encoder inputs to just read positions in LCNC, setup would be in the minutes after an install and all wiring complete
03:46 PM jimmyhorns: CaptHindsight yes, current plan is to use omron rotary quad encoders
03:47 PM jimmyhorns: _unreal_ - they are separate machines. A lathe, a mill, a 'mpcnc' and a micro cnc mill (3018)
03:48 PM jimmyhorns: so up to 4 machines in total
03:48 PM _unreal_: jimmyhorns, I'd still suggest making the motorized plunge rather then start with the last step first
03:49 PM jimmyhorns: from a cost perspective, the motorized plunge is likely to be a little way off
03:49 PM jimmyhorns: and it is only the mill that I would absolutely want to have cnc'd
03:49 PM jimmyhorns: the lathe I just want DRO
03:49 PM _unreal_: then I'd suggest going with arduino/stm
03:49 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: it's not a problem to do what you ask, not sure why he's so argumentative today
03:49 PM _unreal_: for the lathe
03:49 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, I'm grumpy :)
03:50 PM CaptHindsight: 7I34 http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/parallel/7i34man.pdf
03:51 PM CaptHindsight: Eight Channel RS-422/485 interface
03:51 PM _unreal_: freudian slip ment to say " :( "
03:51 PM _unreal_: hehehe
03:51 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.mesanet.com/aiodaughter.html
03:51 PM jimmyhorns: rough idea of cost for going the Mesa way ?...
03:52 PM _unreal_: jimmyhorns, $50-200
03:52 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: price sheet is on their website
03:52 PM CaptHindsight: if you are planning on analog servos then there is a 4 channel servo card with encoder inputs as well
03:52 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/motion/7i33man.pdf
03:53 PM _unreal_: screw it I'm going with mounting the rails on the sides
03:55 PM _unreal_: arg... I hate to do it but I'm looking at doing a flip jig. and milling half of the motor/linear rails mounts at a time then flipping and screwing down
03:55 PM _unreal_: on my small mill with 3/8th aluminum plate
03:55 PM _unreal_: this should be inteesting
03:55 PM _unreal_: err 5/16
03:55 PM jimmyhorns: thanks, this is definitely food for thought
03:55 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: http://mesaus.com/pci-and-pcie-solutions/
03:56 PM _unreal_: jimmyhorns, there are a lot of options out there. I would suggest using the same for all your machines
03:56 PM CaptHindsight: or ethernet based http://mesaus.com/ethernet-cnc-solutions/
03:56 PM _unreal_: time for some alcohol
03:56 PM _unreal_: hay its just shy of 5 oclock somewhere :)
03:58 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: https://mesaus.com/product/7i93/
03:59 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: the Mesa FPGA cards are available with 50 pin headers or DB25 connectors to a daughter card
04:00 PM CaptHindsight: pick your desired interface (ethernet, PCIe) and then your daughter cards based on IDC or DB25
04:07 PM CaptHindsight: jimmyhorns: but if just want cheap and quick DRO readings maybe https://www.electro-tech-online.com/threads/arduino-quadrature-decoder-digital-readout.156159/
04:10 PM CaptHindsight: or https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2V4NwInBpFz39mANUqPGBg
04:14 PM CaptHindsight: have Gentoo running on the pi4 now
04:47 PM _unreal_: Ok I now have the upper silver rail mounted
04:48 PM _unreal_: just got a call from my father. hay can you come to the hospital I need to fill you will blaa blaa blaa.... I'm like sorry sick kid. RESPONSE STAY AWAY.....
04:48 PM _unreal_: @#$%@#$ again FUCKING pos xwife
04:48 PM _unreal_: any one know of any good sources for timing belts?
04:49 PM _unreal_: I need to get a closed loop timing belt at a certain size
04:50 PM Tom_L: sdp-si
04:50 PM CaptHindsight: yeah ^^
04:50 PM CaptHindsight: or Mcmaster carr
04:51 PM _unreal_: hum
04:51 PM _unreal_: thats the other thing I need to get this damn cad file drawn for this new cnc so I can figure out the size
05:23 PM _unreal_: habaa habaaa
05:23 PM _unreal_: https://www.khadas.com/shop-vim3
05:36 PM ve7it: _unreal_, https://drive.google.com/open?id=1O_kSp8N4vt2R3FWCY6W7VSbVT9WVyCv- that should be good to go... all parts accounted for and it seems to make sense
05:40 PM _unreal_: i'm still waiting for your pod racer moment, "ITS WORKING.... ITS WORKING....."
05:41 PM _unreal_: ve7it, the Y rail is finished
05:42 PM _unreal_: now i'm working on my X
05:42 PM _unreal_: progress has slowed horribly as expected not being free of my daughter for even a few days
05:43 PM ve7it: ok... will see what I can do :}
05:43 PM _unreal_: in a little bit I'm running to the hardware store to get some m4 screws
05:43 PM _unreal_: so I can mount the extrusion
05:43 PM ve7it: M4 in murica??? cant be true
05:44 PM _unreal_: heh
05:44 PM _unreal_: its the extrusion
05:44 PM _unreal_: not me honist
05:44 PM ve7it: we are metric here and I still never see it in the hardware store
05:44 PM _unreal_: ve7it, what are you thinking in the overall scheme of things as a primary controller for these driver boards?
05:45 PM _unreal_: arduino, stm... other?
05:46 PM ve7it: stm probably... it will load an stm heavily with 3 encoders, three command inputs and 3 servo loops
05:47 PM _unreal_: encoder loops are you refering to the hall or quadrature? or both?
05:48 PM ve7it: I have some stm32f411 boards here that I have used before... servo loop runs in 6us (or 12us when moving) so there is lots of cpu time if it can handle the barage of interrupts
05:48 PM ve7it: hall sensors dont go anywhere near the controller cpu.... only used by the driver board
05:49 PM _unreal_: I mean if you were to tap into the hall's or not
05:51 PM ve7it: the halls are only used by the motor driver to know what motor phases to energize.. the servo controller get position information from the 3 rotary encoders
05:51 PM _unreal_: so your going to add encoders to them then
06:01 PM _unreal_: so on hand I have stm32f4 discovery, bunch of uno's, and a set of these https://www.silabs.com/documents/public/schematic-files/WSTK-Main-BRD4001A-A01-schematic.pdf
06:02 PM _unreal_: https://www.silabs.com/products/development-tools/wireless/mesh-networking/mighty-gecko-starter-kit
06:03 PM _unreal_: my father gave me a box with 2 sets in it never used
06:06 PM _unreal_: anything else I'd have to buy
06:12 PM _unreal_: my stm32f4 board s the stm32f407
06:13 PM ve7it: I will see if the stm can handle driving 3 motors... its a lot of I/O.. the other option is to use 1 processor for each motor, but then there is an issue driving the motor board. An arduino is definately too slow. It only supports 2 interrupts and no hardware floating point available for the servo calculations.
06:15 PM ve7it: the motors could be made to spin with an arduino, but not run with encoders in a position loop
06:25 PM _unreal_: hum
06:25 PM _unreal_: ve7it, what about those hardware encoder chips I linked you to a few days ago?
06:25 PM _unreal_: as I recall they where i2c or spi?
06:25 PM ve7it: too expensive
06:25 PM _unreal_: !
06:27 PM ve7it: I am trying to avoid making any PCBs
06:27 PM _unreal_: My stm will do 168mhz
06:28 PM _unreal_: I think i'm going to go standard threaded rod on this new cnc
06:28 PM _unreal_: I dont want to spend the money for ball screws
06:29 PM _unreal_: and even then have to pay someone to then mill to spec for my machine
06:29 PM _unreal_: ARG.. I need a lathe
06:41 PM _unreal_: ARG.... wish i could find a mini lathe for LESS then $600
06:57 PM _unreal_: bbiab running to the hardware store to get some screws that I need
08:37 PM _unreal_: yep never fails small child totally fucked me up... got the wrong size screws
08:38 PM _unreal_: my production night is over as far as the CNC goes. all my next steps depended on the screws
08:39 PM _unreal_: so ve7it any motion yet?
08:40 PM _unreal_: so I'm trying to figure out how I'm going to align my rails
08:41 PM _unreal_: I'm thinking about taking a bit of wood cutting it to a specific length then resting/clamping the rail to it and then doing the same to the other end. then walking the screws across
08:42 PM _unreal_: I also discovered its going to be fun trying to get the screws inside the axis bridge. I'm going to have to drill a larger insertion hold for feeding/tightening
08:42 PM * _unreal_ is thinking strong magnets for getting the screws into place
09:12 PM _unreal_: Loetmichel, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlR-9Uiab60
09:32 PM Rab: That's...quite something
09:40 PM Wolf__: _unreal_: them cheap projectors dont see too bad for the $$
09:43 PM Wolf__: finally got over to lowes and picked mine up
09:45 PM _unreal_: thats what I was saing
09:46 PM _unreal_: they are not a "home theater quality" nativly but they are not to bad
09:46 PM Wolf__: I’ll probably end up using one for a cnc display in the garage
09:46 PM _unreal_: heh
09:46 PM _unreal_: nice
09:46 PM _unreal_: LARGE? or small
09:47 PM Wolf__: probably have to set it up small b/c the shop is bright
09:47 PM _unreal_: as long as its on a white surface its rather bright
10:39 PM fjungclaus1 is now known as fjungclaus
11:35 PM elmo40: _unreal_, how are your moving the gantry? belt?