Nov 24 2019
12:04 AM _unreal_: ok... I'm interested.... ish?
12:09 AM _unreal_: the dspic thing I've price it out and I could build them for $20 a board
12:23 AM _unreal_: sigh
12:24 AM _unreal_: 1am and I'm not even tired
02:43 AM Deejay: moin
02:48 AM BitEvil is now known as SpeedEvil
04:45 AM Gaston|Home: This is fascinating. First time ever I started LinuxCNC. I opened a simulation called axis_mm. And it would not home the axes?
04:46 AM Gaston|Home: I could move the axes by jogging
04:46 AM XXCoder: sounds like no switch setup like mine
04:46 AM XXCoder: you have to home it manually, by yourself.
04:46 AM XXCoder: by "HOME" radio buttons for which axis and "home button"
04:47 AM Gaston|Home: I'm ok, I goit it all running. I'm just amazed at how hard it was for a first time user
04:48 AM XXCoder: very steep curve yeah
04:48 AM XXCoder: expecially if never did cnc machining before
04:48 AM Gaston|Home: I would have thought the simulation would be easy for new users to try out
04:49 AM Gaston|Home: I have done CNC
04:49 AM Gaston|Home: I have even written a post processor.
04:50 AM Gaston|Home: I had to edit the .INI file to include NO_FORCE_HOMING
04:51 AM Gaston|Home: So by now I think 70% of the new user base will have given up
05:28 AM jthornton: Axis is a better sim, axis_mm might need some work
05:28 AM jthornton: morning
05:29 AM XXCoder: yo
05:29 AM jthornton: hmm axis_mm works fine for me
05:55 AM Gaston|Home: Ok, back at the keyboard now. I'll delete whatever I have and start over.
05:55 AM XXCoder: youre using real machine or just virtual?
05:55 AM XXCoder: if so, you might want rolfmill (2.7v) or axis_tutorial
05:56 AM XXCoder: *3axis_tutorial
05:58 AM Gaston|Home: Bear with me I'll type as I select here.
05:58 AM Gaston|Home: Open LinuxCNC, select Simple Configurations->Sim->Axis->axis_mm
05:59 AM Gaston|Home: select create Desktop Shortcut
05:59 AM Gaston|Home: press OK and Yes
05:59 AM jthornton: Sample Configurations maybe?
06:00 AM Gaston|Home: yes :)
06:01 AM XXCoder: check out vismach section, those have virtuakl machine. shows machine running your code
06:01 AM XXCoder: 3axis_tutorial or rolfmill is one made by me, it shows basic mill machine
06:02 AM XXCoder: theres bunch of other machines too
06:02 AM * Gaston|Home is afk on the phone
06:36 AM Tom_L: morning
06:39 AM XXCoder: yo
06:39 AM jthornton: hey
06:46 AM _unreal_: morning
06:52 AM Gaston|Home: Allright, new try
06:55 AM Gaston|Home: Axis_mm is now opened and I look at Axis Quick Reference to get an idea what to do
06:55 AM Gaston|Home: E.stop seems important so lets disable that and turn on the machine (How do new people figure this out?)
06:56 AM Gaston|Home: Nice let's try and move the axes a bit now
06:56 AM Tom_L: they come here and ask?
06:57 AM Gaston|Home: Cool, with the keys I moved the axes about 5mm in to the positive side on all axes
06:58 AM Gaston|Home: I try to push play, nothing happens "Can''t run a program when not homed"
06:58 AM * Tom_L thinks jthornton should hang a wind sock over his shop and label it area 51
06:58 AM Gaston|Home: ok, there's a button named home all, let's try that
06:58 AM Tom_L: Gaston|Home, you can't do anything until it's homed
06:59 AM Gaston|Home: "Cannot home while shared home switch is closed j=2"
06:59 AM Tom_L: sim or real hardware?
07:00 AM jthornton: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/gui/axis.html#_a_typical_session
07:00 AM jthornton: most people read the documents...
07:00 AM Gaston|Home: Thanks Tom_L, welcome to my new user experience. I have already got it working so I don't need help at the moment
07:01 AM XXCoder: tom sounds like real
07:01 AM Gaston|Home: I'm trying to relay my first experience with LinuxCNC
07:01 AM * jthornton thinks it should be Area 66
07:06 AM Gaston|Home: jthornton, ok I did that. I still ended up having to modify the INI before I could get it running
07:07 AM Gaston|Home: So now I'm hitting a limit switch (or combined multiple)
07:07 AM jthornton: odd Axis works fine here in a sim
07:08 AM Gaston|Home: I'm using 2.8.0-pre1
07:08 AM jthornton: estop, power, home all, run
07:08 AM jthornton: I am as well
07:09 AM Gaston|Home: estop,power,move + on all axes, home all
07:10 AM jthornton: prob messes up the logic of the sim
07:10 AM Gaston|Home: could be
07:11 AM Gaston|Home: So I went to add "NO_FORCE_HOMING = 1" in the ini so let me do that now and restart
07:13 AM Gaston|Home: Now I'm back up. The machine still remember my last position ~5mm positive on all axes
07:14 AM Gaston|Home: I press estop, power on, home all
07:14 AM Gaston|Home: All workls fine
07:15 AM Gaston|Home: Let's see if I remember how I got in to trouble, lets press home all again
07:15 AM Gaston|Home: You sure, yes
07:16 AM Gaston|Home: "Cannot home while shared home switch is closed j=2" "Cannot home while shared home switch is closed j=0"
07:16 AM XXCoder: thats normal, you dont want it to move past home switch
07:18 AM XXCoder: also, shared means it cant move when any of axis switch is triggered
07:18 AM XXCoder: so you would need to set it to back off before homing next axis
07:22 AM Gaston|Home: I don't know, seems you guys are ok with this, so I guess I'm on a bit of a tangent trying to relay this new user experience. Now it's done anyway.
07:24 AM Gaston|Home: ( I can add that I did try to get the limit switch states up on screen before I ended up adding NO_FORCE_HOMING = 1)
07:26 AM jthornton: seems to be an issue with only axis_mm as you can jog all you want in axis then home all
07:30 AM Gaston|Home: That's good I guess
07:31 AM Gaston|Home: It feels like G53 should be set to positive numbers in the demo and homeing switches be separate to the axis limit switches.
07:32 AM Gaston|Home: I would like the axis limit switches to be in series with E-STOP
07:32 AM jthornton: if the machine origin is 0,0,0 the splash code will not run
08:24 AM _unreal_: Gaston|Home, limit switches and estop in series?
08:24 AM _unreal_: do you mean you want the wiring to be tied?
08:25 AM _unreal_: tied together?
08:25 AM Gaston|Home: yeah, I would probably want to trigger e-stop at least on the drive for the axis violating the switch
08:27 AM Gaston|Home: But I wouldn't mind it tripping the whole power supply section for all drives
08:28 AM Gaston|Home: But that's my ideas, I'm sure there are many views on this
08:29 AM _unreal_: no
08:29 AM _unreal_: thats a FOOLS idea
08:29 AM _unreal_: the ESTOP is a safety system
08:29 AM _unreal_: and conrol
08:30 AM Gaston|Home: Axis limit switches are a safety feature in my/fool view
08:30 AM _unreal_: if you want to tie ESTOP to anything its to the logic of your controlling computer OR to the estop of a MESA controller or HELL even to a main breaker to just kill power to the machine...
08:30 AM _unreal_: wrong
08:30 AM _unreal_: limit switches are a sensor of location
08:31 AM _unreal_: the machine is BLIND and DEAF with out limit switches
08:31 AM _unreal_: it has no idea where it is unless you tell it where it is
08:32 AM _unreal_: and then it only knows what you tell it. if you tell it the worng location then your off heh
08:32 AM jdh: limit switches are a last resort that says you don't know where you are.
08:32 AM jdh: not for location
08:34 AM Gaston|Home: As I said, I'm sure there are many views on this. mine/a fools and jdh seem to align on this
08:34 AM jdh: homing to a limit switch conflates the purpose. in this case, it is not acting as a limit switch at the time.
08:35 AM _unreal_: Machine homing gives a reference position of each axis, this position is used to allow for job fixtures, jigs, and automatic tool changers. Homing your machine requires movement of each axis towards a sensor. Once the sensor is tripped, the control software sets a zero position for that axis.
08:35 AM jdh: that's a home switch
08:35 AM _unreal_: which is a function of assignment
08:35 AM Gaston|Home: exactly my view jdh, but I think for monetary and simplicity reasons many want to limit the nuimber of compoinents
08:36 AM jdh: if you ever hit a limit switch, you are lost.
08:36 AM _unreal_: jdh, he wants to connect his limit switches to his estop
08:36 AM jdh: so
08:37 AM jdh: if you ever hit a limit switch, you need to stop. you are lost.
08:37 AM jdh: or for you perhaps. You are LOST
08:38 AM jdh: if your configuration is CORRECT and you are HOMED, you CANNOT make it HIT a LIMIT switch.
08:38 AM _unreal_: Gaston|Home, I'm going to go wake my daughter and have breakfast, good luck to you. Lcnc is not designed around the direction your trying to go for. you are going to have a lot of conflicting issue. possible yes but your trying to ride a bicycle backwards and up hill <-- doesnt work well.
08:39 AM jdh: UNLESS you ARE LOST
08:39 AM Loetmichel: jdh: if you ever HIT one, you are right... had a couple of of problems with ghost triggers on some machines though, because of EMI from the VFD
08:40 AM Gaston|Home: _unreal_ and jdh, thanks for your inputs.
08:41 AM _unreal_: Loetmichel, thats why I'm a fan of tying limit signals to ground via 10k-100k resistor and using high sensor voltage 12+v
08:41 AM _unreal_: very hard to trip them with emi
08:42 AM _unreal_: in that configuration
08:42 AM Loetmichel: i like to use 100 ohms pullups... but right :-)
08:43 AM _unreal_: active low active high... you and your tomatoes, I like my tamato's
08:43 AM _unreal_: ;)
08:44 AM Loetmichel: ywes, i meant the 100 ohms vs 10k
09:12 AM Rab: Plenty of configurations, and commercial machines I've seen, use the limit switches for homing. I'm personally against it; limit switches can't be guaranteed to trip at the same point every time.
09:14 AM jdh: switch + z pulse
09:14 AM Rab: So you're only getting a crude, non-reproducible home. I prefer to park at my defined zero before power off, start there next time, and touch off to a known physical reference if that information is lost.
09:15 AM Rab: So in that usage, yeah, the limit switches only come into play if something goes terribly wrong...and they might as well be lumped under estop.
09:39 AM Elmo40: do what 'real' machines do. get the roller style limit switch and make a taper that gradually clicks the switch when you move over it. this way you reduce the play and the bounce from lever style limit switches.
09:41 AM Elmo40: https://5.imimg.com/data5/TH/YJ/MY-16570674/precision-limit-switch-500x500.png
09:41 AM Elmo40: something like this
09:42 AM Elmo40: or buy a real CNC limit switch assembly...
09:42 AM Elmo40: http://www.cnc-shopping.co.uk/euchner-sn05d12-502-precision-limit-switch-5-contacts-p-7545.html
09:42 AM Elmo40: but those are damn pricey
09:44 AM Rab: $109.61 USD for the Euchner N11K-M.
09:46 AM Javabean: the Railcore2 3dprinter uses these https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Omron-Electronics/D2F-01F?qs=0w99tykdtPLhoVh2lktm%252bQ%3D%3D because they are quite precise
09:46 AM Elmo40: gotta pay for accuracy
09:46 AM Rab: Can I pay for a touch probe instead?
09:47 AM Javabean: much more precise than those lever actuated toys
09:47 AM Elmo40: Javabean, it is exactly the same but with no lever.
09:48 AM Elmo40: so, rip off the levers of the 'toy' ones and you'll be just as accurate
09:48 AM Elmo40: you see on the back side of that switch, the little groove. that is where a lever would go if they installed it
09:49 AM Javabean: all things considered, replacing one of those lever toys with the one the railcore uses... my z stopped floating on home... no more +-.2mm
09:49 AM Elmo40: but yes, the lever causes play and the play brings horrible repeatability.
09:50 AM Rab: The different versions are in the datasheet, including travel characteristics for each one.
09:50 AM Javabean: now that printer can do "perfect" first layers... which IIRC is about .05mm
09:54 AM CaptHindsight: Gaston|Home: for someone who has never run a CNC before then I agree it's not very clear for a new user
09:55 AM CaptHindsight: but like most software, the docs are not written for the first time user
09:56 AM Rab: I'm not sure how to interpret the travel characteristics for that Omron switch, but it looks like "operating position" is +/-0.3mm = 0.012in...if that translates to reproducibility, it's actually pretty poor.
09:57 AM CaptHindsight: lots of dev have a very difficult time putting themselves into the position of a new user and write up documentation
09:58 AM Rab: No doubt real-world reproducibility is better, especially early in lifetime, but it's not designed or rated for it. I wouldn't rely on that switch to zero me within .001" day to day, year to year.
10:00 AM Rab: I bet there are sealed optical or hall-effect switches which are better but still economical. I haven't looked into it though.
10:00 AM CaptHindsight: +-.2mmis 100X too much uncertainty for a precision CNC
10:00 AM * Javabean shrugs, quite happy with its ability to home his z axis in a perfect first layer repeatable manner... might not be remembering .05mm properly tho
10:00 AM CaptHindsight: +-.2mm is
10:01 AM CaptHindsight: good enough for a glue gun
10:01 AM CaptHindsight: thats about the diameter of the extruder nozzle
10:01 AM Javabean: which is why the railcore only uses them for x and y...
10:02 AM skunkworks: home to an index
10:03 AM Javabean: for z they use a BLTouch or the creator's marionette(spelling?) which he has opensource
10:03 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.designworldonline.com/achieving-precision-limit-switches/
10:04 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.baumer.com/us/en/product-overview/object-detection/precision-mechanical-switches/c/285/products
10:05 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/307/d5a_dsheet_csm591-22125.pdf
10:07 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.mouser.com/Omron/Electromechanical/Switches/Limit-Switches/D5A-Series/_/N-ap979?P=1yzsa7eZ1z0zl9e
10:09 AM CaptHindsight: good overview of sensor type and applications https://literature.rockwellautomation.com/idc/groups/literature/documents/br/sensor-br001_-en-p.pdf?event-category=Brochure&event-action=Download&event-label=SENSOR_FamilyBrochure_EN
10:10 AM Javabean: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3789436
10:21 AM CaptHindsight: :The pin and channel don't offer much clearance. If you're overextruding at all, it won't slide. Even when you're dead on the money you may have to sand a tiny bit to get smooth motion, but it should fall freely from gravity."
10:24 AM Javabean: point of posting that link, you don't need to spend lots of money for a decent "precision" switch
10:26 AM CaptHindsight: hmm why would a company like Haas not use that switch?
10:28 AM Javabean: dude only "recently" came up with the design... its soo simple it may not have been thought of by others
10:29 AM CaptHindsight: if I were to write up a white paper about the switch and present it for publication why would it be rejected?
10:31 AM CaptHindsight: if you don't study history (engineering in this case) then it might appear to be new
10:33 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL3D4EECEFAA99D9BE Mechanical - Design of Machine Elements, only 40 videos
10:36 AM CaptHindsight: Machine Design https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLm_MSClsnwm8K7HRzHYPd_ljW_vHFzxlF
10:36 AM flyback is now known as the-rock
10:36 AM the-rock is now known as flyback
10:37 AM CaptHindsight: https://sensing.honeywell.com/honeywell-sensing-basic-switches-general-technical-bulletin-001017-2-en2.pdf
10:37 AM SpeedEvil: Also see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RAQsdTQIcs
10:38 AM SpeedEvil: err - not that.
10:38 AM CaptHindsight: unicorns
10:38 AM SpeedEvil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMP_AfiNlX4
10:39 AM SpeedEvil: Building Prototypes Dan Gelbart part 1 of 18 Introduction
10:40 AM CaptHindsight: watch all 18 parts, then go back and have a discussion in oh say #reprap
10:40 AM SpeedEvil: Though some of it is a bit hardware rich
10:40 AM SpeedEvil: 'this is why you should make all your stuff this way' -> $50000 waterjet
10:40 AM CaptHindsight: but it provides perspective
10:41 AM SpeedEvil: Indeed, and a lot is transferrable.
10:41 AM SpeedEvil: And also spot welders are cheap
10:42 AM CaptHindsight: sometimes the "crash the axis into the end stops" is good enough for homing
10:43 AM SpeedEvil: Overextending 'truths' from one field to another is problematic.
10:44 AM SpeedEvil: Crash the end stops on many machines and you'll destroy them, others is just fine.
10:47 AM CaptHindsight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machinery%27s_Handbook
10:51 AM CaptHindsight: SpeedEvil: how we roll here https://youtu.be/IEe5b_KkACw?t=72
10:54 AM SpeedEvil: :)
11:09 AM jdh: is there some real reason 3d printers seem to all have the limit switches as crash-into vs. slide-by?
11:10 AM skunkworks: If they are only on one end - they are not limit switches...
11:10 AM jdh: s/limit switches/end stops/
11:11 AM CaptHindsight: jdh: lack of understanding (real reason)
11:12 AM Elmo40: is there a way to use 2 switches to do the 'fast/slow' homing within lcnc?
11:12 AM Elmo40: they are simply there to tell the controller where the bed/carriage is.
11:13 AM CaptHindsight: also pretty small mass vs something that makes a loud noise/kill you
11:13 AM Elmo40: they use steppers. when you turn it off it has no idea where it is
11:13 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.amazon.com/Biaobiao-Optical-Switches-Endstop-Comparison/dp/B07JMDLD84
11:13 AM Elmo40: they don't need anything fancy like limit switches. it is all software limiting. the homing switch is just to give it a reference.
11:14 AM Elmo40: 0.002mm accuracy?
11:14 AM Elmo40: is that true?
11:14 AM CaptHindsight: chinese mm
11:14 AM Elmo40: ah. i see.
11:14 AM CaptHindsight: so figure 0.02mm
11:14 AM CaptHindsight: not bad for a few $$
11:14 AM jdh: Elmo40: regardless of their purpose, they seem to be oriented incorrectly.
11:14 AM Elmo40: that is close enough for any 3D printer
11:15 AM CaptHindsight: IF you can keep the parts clean
11:15 AM Elmo40: jdh, they are positioned for ease of assembly.
11:15 AM Elmo40: CaptHindsight, sure. hand them upside down.
11:15 AM Elmo40: *hang
11:15 AM CaptHindsight: sacrificial limit switches
11:15 AM Elmo40: at that price, indeed.
11:16 AM Elmo40: now, is there a way to use the dual switch technique to perform fast/slow homing with lcnc?
11:17 AM CaptHindsight: fast until the first switch is activated then slow for final position
11:18 AM CaptHindsight: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/config/ini-homing.html
11:19 AM CaptHindsight: one switch with fast and slow
11:20 AM Elmo40: thnx
11:20 AM Elmo40: who would have thought homing was this complicated
11:21 AM CaptHindsight: the more you know the less you know
11:21 AM Javabean: sage advice, truly sage advice
11:22 AM Elmo40: ~~~mind---blown~~~
11:24 AM CaptHindsight: Imagine a university with a similar motto
11:24 AM CaptHindsight: pay us to know less
11:25 AM jdh: happens to me everyday at work.
11:25 AM jdh: after talking to some people anyway
11:25 AM CaptHindsight: for me as well
11:25 AM Javabean: never underestimate a member of managements ability to make you feel stupid in a field he can't even spell
11:26 AM CaptHindsight: why i avoided working in those situations
11:28 AM CaptHindsight: so who here will be the first to try OpenCN?
11:29 AM jdh: I'm guessing.... you.
11:29 AM CaptHindsight: too busy
11:30 AM CaptHindsight: compare results on the same hardware
11:30 AM jdh: I stand by my guess.
11:31 AM CaptHindsight: too busy
11:32 AM CaptHindsight: I'll be packing all my stuff up soon as well
11:32 AM CaptHindsight: moving
12:18 PM jdh: nevermind... I'm changing my guess to 'nobody'
12:18 PM jdh: unless some random linuxcnc fan happens to have some of those drives laying around.
12:19 PM CaptHindsight: the ethercat
12:22 PM CaptHindsight: https://mecatronyx.gitlab.io/opencnc/doc/quick_start.html#cnc
12:23 PM CaptHindsight: oh man, just looked at the install
12:24 PM CaptHindsight: would be faster if they just posted a tarball of their file system
12:25 PM CaptHindsight: step 1: An Intel CPU with at least 4 cores
12:25 PM CaptHindsight: I'd be stuck there :)
12:43 PM Tom_L: sounds like they're using specific hardware
12:45 PM miss0r: goodevening
12:47 PM CaptHindsight: Tom_L: EtherCAT servo controllers and e1000e Ethernet controller
12:48 PM CaptHindsight: A GPU from either Intel or Nvidia (preferably external) makes them sound novice for Linux
01:54 PM jymmmm: Tom_L http://deepfriedneon.com/tesla_f_calchelix.html
02:17 PM Loetmichel: re at hom from my sisters place. Note to self: That BMW 525i GUZZLES fuel if you drive 230km with cruise control at 200kph. About 35liter E10. The way back with cruise control locked in at 130kph was WAY more economical... only about 20liters for the same distance ;)
02:20 PM SpeedEvil: V^2 matters.
02:21 PM jymmmm: So SpeedEvil kills
02:22 PM jymmmm: ?
02:22 PM jymmmm: Loetmichel: Now, try cruise control going in reverse, and see how long it take your fuel tank to fill up :)
02:34 PM _unreal_: interesting I have two of these on hand https://www.microdaq.com/monarch-instrument-remote-optical-sensor.php?gclid=CjwKCAiA8ejuBRAaEiwAn-iJ3t3Ridz2h4coBlgrXmSSop6QgBKbkhdKuHIpp8oBXpn3eK0gZpSL6xoCI1UQAvD_BwE
02:40 PM _unreal_: no one around?
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: jymmmm: storing Henry's?
03:08 PM jdh: Loetmichel: that is us$9.00 in gas, take the hit
03:09 PM CaptHindsight: how much gas used at 450kph?
03:11 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: Working on a wood pellet stove idea
03:13 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1G1p3B5cDgY
03:13 PM CaptHindsight: 320 km/h (200 mph) on German Autobahn
03:14 PM CaptHindsight: and people there just pull out in front of you
03:21 PM Loetmichel: jdh: ahem. the liter E10 here in germany is 1.46Eur today.
03:22 PM Loetmichel: so that was an $95 trip to my sister and back
03:22 PM Loetmichel: not that i am complaining
03:22 PM Loetmichel: about the money
03:22 PM Loetmichel: just noticed that i should reighn in my lead foot ;)
03:23 PM Loetmichel: reign in
03:24 PM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight: the old (2001) BMW 525i only has 175HP. IT maxes out at about 230 to 240kph
03:25 PM jdh: 0.54Eur/l today
03:29 PM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight: that vid with the hayabusa overtaken by a station wagon at 300kph is a LOT more funny ;)
03:29 PM Loetmichel: (and less idiotic driving. the aventador pilot was close to getting charged with criminal neglect a few times when he tailgated THAT close)
03:30 PM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight: found it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wps_wPs8ZbE
03:55 PM Deejay: gn8
04:19 PM Tom_L: Loetmichel that's getting to be a habbit with you
04:20 PM Tom_L: how many points are you allowed?
04:22 PM Loetmichel: points?
04:22 PM Loetmichel: 8
04:23 PM Tom_L: then they take your license?
04:23 PM Loetmichel: yes
04:23 PM Tom_L: 8 per year or 8
04:23 PM Loetmichel: 8 ever
04:23 PM Tom_L: damn
04:23 PM Loetmichel: they delete a few after 3 years IIRC
04:24 PM Tom_L: you better get a moped
04:24 PM Loetmichel: iE: 3 years after you gained a point it will be deleted, up to 3 a year or so, cant remember
04:24 PM Loetmichel: but why should i get a moped?
04:24 PM Loetmichel: i didnt do anything illegal today
04:25 PM Tom_L: <Loetmichel> just noticed that i should reighn in my lead foot ;)
04:25 PM Loetmichel: driving 200++kph on german autohahns is perfectly legal on more than 50% of the highway network
04:25 PM Loetmichel: ah, you didnt get the original post?
04:25 PM Loetmichel: [21:10] <Loetmichel> re at hom from my sisters place. Note to self: That BMW 525i GUZZLES fuel if you drive 230km with cruise control at 200kph. About 35liter E10. The way back with cruise control locked in at 130kph was WAY more economical... only about 20liters for the same distance ;)
04:25 PM Tom_L: no, just catching up
04:26 PM Tom_L: so fuel cost not speed
04:26 PM Loetmichel: reigh in that lead foor because it makes a hole in my wallet ;)
04:26 PM Loetmichel: foot
04:26 PM Loetmichel: reign
04:27 PM Loetmichel: yes, fuel is expensive here
04:27 PM Tom_L: probably 2x here at least i bet
04:28 PM Loetmichel: just filled the BMW with 72 liters of the good E10... 106 eur
04:28 PM Loetmichel: more like 5 times
04:33 PM Tom_L: maybe you should put a wood block under the 'go' pedal
04:46 PM jymmmm: ...or chop off that LEAD foot :)
04:50 PM jymmmm: I hope this is NEVER Loetmichel... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUgoNSq8Ybg
04:55 PM _unreal_: I think its time for beer
04:55 PM _unreal_: who's with me
04:56 PM _unreal_: ?
04:56 PM _unreal_: bunch of water drinkers
04:57 PM Loetmichel: Jymmm: nope. for one: i dont drive faster than i can brake in my line of sight, so 320kph would be very seldom because of most german autobahns are not that straight
04:58 PM JT-Shop: YEA the last group of parts is in the VMC... time for my beer!
04:58 PM Loetmichel: secondly i dont have the money for such a car ;)
05:04 PM _unreal_: Loetmichel, heh sounds like "maine"
05:05 PM _unreal_: back up in new england area very hilly very mountainous
05:06 PM _unreal_: so the roads do not drive very straight. and roads that are straight and "fast" have huge areas carved into rock to remove the " hills"
05:16 PM Loetmichel: _unreal_: germany is hills on top of hills mostly
05:16 PM Loetmichel: one end is the baltic sea, other end is the alps
05:16 PM Loetmichel: and in between there are maaaany hills
05:16 PM Loetmichel: so our streets are usually not THAT flat
05:17 PM Loetmichel: or straight
05:17 PM Loetmichel: and considering that we have our share of idiot drivers, too its good practice to limit your speed to the distance you can see
05:18 PM Loetmichel: so that you can do an emergency brake if someone does something stupid
05:40 PM _unreal_: Loetmichel, you'd love florida then
05:40 PM _unreal_: dead nuts flat dead nuts straight
05:40 PM _unreal_: most of the roads MOST of them are 0 90
05:40 PM _unreal_: north east south west. litteraly
05:41 PM _unreal_: and every one is a pre madana
05:41 PM _unreal_: then you have all the illegals sneaking around on the roads, hit and runs ever where
05:45 PM XXCoder: for a min I thought you was talking about that moron florida man
05:46 PM _unreal_: ?
05:48 PM XXCoder: more like morons apparently lol
05:48 PM XXCoder: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_Man
06:05 PM jthornton: now if I can just figure out why this program won't run...
06:06 PM Tom_L: jt what you makin parts for?
06:06 PM jthornton: mesa card din rail mounts
06:06 PM jthornton: made 120 of them
06:06 PM Tom_L: ahh
06:06 PM Tom_L: :)
06:07 PM XXCoder: 120? I know why, program is just tucked out! ;)
06:07 PM jthornton: finally redneck engineered a way to dip the form tap in some tap magic
06:08 PM jthornton: no this is a simple program to figure out pip install from github but it fails for some reason...
06:08 PM XXCoder: :)
06:09 PM jthornton: it's weird everything is installed but it can't find the lib...
06:10 PM XXCoder: different version required?
06:11 PM jthornton: no something screwed with setup.py I think, it runs from the work directory but when I install it it errors out
06:11 PM _unreal_: jthornton, linking?
06:12 PM jthornton: https://github.com/jethornton/ptest
06:12 PM jthornton: python
06:12 PM _unreal_: no I ment in the py, do you suspect its a linking issue? directing to the a non location?
06:12 PM _unreal_: wtf there is something tinking every time I type. and I cant locate it
06:13 PM jthornton: no I think my setup.py is missing something
06:19 PM jthornton: oh well I'll putz with that in the morning
08:28 PM _unreal_: What a pain in the ass, just got one drive working on my fedora
08:29 PM _unreal_: and now its syncing
08:29 PM _unreal_: sigh
08:51 PM _unreal_: well that took a lot longer then I thought it was going to take
08:51 PM _unreal_: I'm now ready to mill my damn part
08:59 PM norias: mill that part!
09:00 PM _unreal_: to late fam is asleep
09:00 PM norias: bah
09:00 PM _unreal_: fusion360 is pissing me off as normal
09:02 PM norias: lol
09:02 PM norias: what don't you like about it?
09:03 PM _unreal_: many things
09:03 PM _unreal_: the gcode design is very flawed
09:03 PM _unreal_: I've contactded autodesk many times
09:04 PM _unreal_: I always get the same answer on its still a young program
09:04 PM _unreal_: KISS MY ASS
09:06 PM norias: what is wrong with the gcode?
09:06 PM _unreal_: its the tool path generation that is REALLY flawed
09:07 PM _unreal_: Most of what I need to do is NOT possible according to autodesk
09:07 PM _unreal_: norias, do you use fusion?
09:08 PM norias: i have
09:08 PM _unreal_: you hav e or you do?
09:08 PM norias: i started with hsmworks before autodesk bought it
09:08 PM norias: used fusion for a while
09:08 PM norias: i'm on camworks / solidworks cam now
09:08 PM _unreal_: heh
09:09 PM norias: not my choice
09:09 PM _unreal_: of all the cad software NOTHING IMO touches design spark
09:09 PM _unreal_: BUT
09:09 PM _unreal_: it has little cam support
09:09 PM _unreal_: the CAD how ever is very very easy to generate very complex designs in short order
09:10 PM _unreal_: and adjust in any way desired
09:11 PM norias: cool
09:11 PM _unreal_: AND its totally 100% free
09:11 PM _unreal_: more often then not I'll use designspark
09:11 PM norias: neat
09:11 PM norias: never tried it
09:12 PM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1cZ_rTRuKh85aVzAOJW3WQTf6sAHK0dZi
09:12 PM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1fNUz8yQsjeJA0Uxd1_SwFodAyful3OVN
09:13 PM _unreal_: norias, STL https://drive.google.com/open?id=1hwpQkvDz8Is0VM2x1CVzT2GD9hms17B4
09:16 PM _unreal_: norias, ?
09:18 PM norias: you showed me those before
09:19 PM _unreal_: then you get the idea
09:20 PM _unreal_: so....
09:21 PM norias: is your argument that fusion can't do that?
09:21 PM _unreal_: no
09:21 PM _unreal_: my argument is that designspark is much faster and easy to generate dxf files
09:22 PM _unreal_: and complex designs
09:22 PM _unreal_: compaired to fusion
09:22 PM _unreal_: on the other hand fusion does a nice job genereating nice 3D tooling paths
09:22 PM _unreal_: but it fucks up bad on simple tooling paths
09:23 PM norias: what does it fuck up?
09:24 PM _unreal_: the simplest designs it can NOT process and generate gcode with out adding lots of code ares to mill
09:24 PM _unreal_: I kid you not
09:24 PM _unreal_: draw a 1x1x1" box
09:24 PM _unreal_: put a 1/2" hole in the middle TOP all the way to the bottom
09:25 PM norias: and?
09:26 PM _unreal_: and try to do a single DRILL cycle with a 1/8th bit, and do a profile cut out. ramp cut out. it cant do it with out doing a RAMP cut no matter what settings you do to the inside hole. that you dont want to ramp cut but to do a single drill cycle.
09:26 PM _unreal_: if you try to futz with the settings it will add all kinds of ghost toolpath lines
09:26 PM _unreal_: in the part out away/around the part
09:27 PM _unreal_: btw found a nice online gcode viewer
09:27 PM _unreal_: nraynaud.github.io/webgcode/
09:27 PM _unreal_: drag/drop gcode of any kind
09:27 PM norias: yeah, i've seen that one
09:28 PM _unreal_: so I have to generate the gocode then delete all the phantom code
09:29 PM norias: got an example you can send?
09:30 PM veek: what are these buckles called - technical name? used in bags and such https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/H5ae692a600fa4ff5b05300e1767ae660i/Adult-Games-BDSM-Bondage-Anklet-Restraints-Sex-Handcuffs-with-Buckle-Foot-Hand-Cuff-Slave-Games-Adult.jpg_220x220xz.jpg
09:31 PM * flyback looks at veek
09:31 PM norias: lol
09:31 PM norias: sex handcuffs?
09:32 PM veek: heh
09:32 PM flyback: YOU STUPID IT'S-MISSTRESS-MARY-SLAVE-LICK-MY-BOOT-NUCK
09:32 PM veek: snap fit buckle apparently
09:32 PM flyback: s&m canadian
09:34 PM norias: i know that one brand name is fastex
09:34 PM norias: fastex buckle should work for a google search
09:35 PM _unreal_: norias, example?
09:36 PM norias: _unreal_: a model file, in step ap203 if you can, and the resultant gcode
09:42 PM _unreal_: if I had time
09:42 PM _unreal_: sigh