#linuxcnc Logs

Nov 14 2019

#linuxcnc Calendar

01:00 AM miss0r: New cnc was just placed in front of the shop by the crane driver :D
01:05 AM miss0r: https://imgur.com/a/Gx6ImQn
01:05 AM miss0r: CaptHindsight: ^
01:06 AM SpeedEvil: In good shape?
01:08 AM miss0r: Excellent shape
01:08 AM miss0r: as in: The paint is not even gone in the chip tray
01:09 AM miss0r: 900 hours on the clock (main switch turned on) and all the ways has flawless scraping(oil recesses) marks
01:09 AM miss0r: I am happy as can be
01:09 AM SpeedEvil: :)
01:10 AM SpeedEvil: That is insane if it doesn't have major gotchas.
01:11 AM miss0r: also, I did some good measuring on it before getting it shipped to the shop(duh :D). X-Y squareness <0.005mm/500mm Y-Z squareness <0.005mm/350mm
01:11 AM miss0r: the spindle has 0.01mm runout though, but I will just regrind it and that should be good as well
01:11 AM SpeedEvil: $?
01:11 AM miss0r: now heres the kicker :D
01:12 AM miss0r: for starters I told them I would pay 4000eur if the machine was mint. They agreed. I went to boot it up and have a measuring campaign on it.
01:12 AM SpeedEvil: 4000eur is quite reasonable.
01:12 AM miss0r: But it wouldn't turn on, as it has been sitting idle for so long the memory battery ran out (Serious problem for these deckel maho machines)
01:13 AM miss0r: So I told them that we could do one of two things: a) Pay me to make it sale ready; should I like what I see I will pay half of my own hours, and you get the 4k. or b) I take a chance and pay 2k and deal with myself
01:13 AM miss0r: they went for b
01:14 AM SpeedEvil: :)
01:14 AM miss0r: :]
01:14 AM miss0r: so: happy as can be :D
01:14 AM SpeedEvil: What is usually involved if it's just the battery?
01:14 AM miss0r: replacing it, type in all the machine constants
01:14 AM miss0r: or.. type in the serial connection constants and send the rest from a PC
01:15 AM miss0r: it came with a USB key with all the machine parameters on them(luckily, as they are machine specific - measuring compensation, flex compensation ect.)
01:18 AM miss0r: The story of the machine: It was bought new by DTU(The danish equivalent of MIT) and placed in their proto typing lab(where only the machinist staff is allowed to run the machines). Then this furniture factory bought it, and realized that 5000rpm on the spindle was waaaay too little for what they had planned for it. Then I came along(only there to setup some fileshare system between their drawing dept. and their
01:18 AM miss0r: 5-axis routers) and saw the beauty sitting in a corner, where it had been sitting for the past two years.
01:19 AM miss0r: Better get back to moving it inside... I'm letting out all the heat :D
01:20 AM SpeedEvil: Congrats!
01:21 AM miss0r: Thanks! :D
01:21 AM miss0r: so.. now I need to see if I can sell the old one :D
01:21 AM miss0r: https://www.dba.dk/maho-500c-deckel-maho-bru/id-1061108798/
01:48 AM Deejay: moin
03:39 AM Centreline: miss0r, sounds great, I had similar with my edm, except all the parameters and compensation were stored on the custom boot floppy, which was destroyed. Fortunately someone had printed them off and left a print out inside the cabinet to be found.
04:57 AM Tom_L: morning
05:04 AM jthornton: morning
05:05 AM XXCoder: morning
05:14 AM SpeedEvil: Centreline: Is there a procedure to generate those cal data yourself, if it is lost?
05:16 AM Centreline: Not that I know of, and certainly not with the measurement equipment I have at my disposal.
05:18 AM Centreline: It has a very old estoric control on it (its a japanese only PC98 running bespoke sodick control gui, with a serial connection to a open frame computer with no displays or anything deeper inside)
05:20 AM Centreline: like, this giant card 2x the size of a full size motherboard is cpu0 card, that one is cpu1, the two next to it are memory0 and memory1 etc, all plugged into a open backplane.
05:20 AM Centreline: I really hope that bit never goes wrong, it does have some undocumented blinky leds though.
05:21 AM Centreline: if only linuxcnc covered edm...
05:40 AM ce9a: hi
05:42 AM jthornton: it does cover edm...
05:52 AM Centreline: jthornton, is that a recent-ish development? I heard about something which allowed the cutting point to reverse steps to accomodate wire in a experimental branch a while back but not current on what the state of play on that is.
05:53 AM jthornton: no clue, it's in plasmac using reverse run
05:58 AM Centreline: Oh wow, someone has done it and posted video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNn9Jv5_h64 reading google translated forum now...
06:04 AM Centreline: Im really out of date, reverse run on master in 2018. I shall read
06:07 AM methods_: https://xkcd.com/2228/
07:00 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by card.freenode.net
07:19 AM Deejay: bbl
07:20 AM miss0r: Centreline: Nice. :D
07:20 AM miss0r: my EDM is old enough that it does not have a floppy drive.
07:21 AM miss0r: I think it only has somewhere around 4 transistors in it :D
07:23 AM Centreline: This had a fire in the control cabinet + generator and was sold for scrap, so its been a voyage of discovery getting it running spanning quite a period. But if I wanted to add a A axis into the tank for turn and burn, there are no options for that.
07:25 AM miss0r: hehe. I am only pushing an old Charmilles with a P25 generator
07:25 AM miss0r: I had to replace a bunch of relay sockets in it to fit 'modern' relays, as the old ones were dead and no replacement was possible
07:35 AM miss0r: Centreline: What machine is it, if I might ask?
07:39 AM Centreline: this is a sodick bf275, so 4 axis but a dry tank machine
07:40 AM Centreline: or 5 axis I think they designate it
07:41 AM Centreline: just xy and a manual z, and uv on the top wire guide to do draft angles etc
07:43 AM Centreline: I started to make a stainless dividing spindle for in the worktank for it, and it'd be nice to add a waterproof stepper to that for more capability.
08:16 AM miss0r: Sounds like a nice machine
08:17 AM miss0r: By now it is all but too clear for me that I need to move alot of stuff around to make this mill fit properly in here... 8I have a very small shop for the equipment I run)
08:20 AM miss0r: like: Move my rawstock shelf system. Swap my drillpress with a closet(switching places) Setup a smaller rawstock shelf. Move a pedistal grinder.. ect. Good thing I didn't take in any jobs for tomorrow either. This will take alot of work to get settled in
08:23 AM miss0r: syyl: You around?
08:23 AM syyl: no
08:23 AM syyl: ;)
08:24 AM miss0r: syyl: look what arrived at the shop today: https://imgur.com/a/Gx6ImQn
08:24 AM syyl: you crazy
08:24 AM miss0r: well... yeah?
08:24 AM syyl: whats the "W" on a maho?
08:24 AM miss0r: I don't know what it translates to, but it is the high precision model
08:25 AM syyl: oh interesting
08:25 AM miss0r: So I removed the old maho 500c and put this in its place.
08:25 AM miss0r: plus it has what I have been hungering for a long time: Dripfeed :D
08:26 AM miss0r: (transfer a few lines of code at a time, so memory is not an issue)
08:26 AM syyl: it works?
08:26 AM miss0r: flawlessly
08:26 AM syyl: yay
08:26 AM miss0r: only 900 hours on the clock
08:26 AM syyl: congrats
08:26 AM miss0r: Thanks
08:26 AM syyl: whats the spindle speed on it?
08:26 AM syyl: 4000?
08:26 AM miss0r: 20-5000rpm
08:26 AM syyl: yay
08:26 AM syyl: very nice
08:27 AM miss0r: I will snap a photo of the ways soon, the scraping marks looks like it has never run
08:27 AM syyl: all dovetails except for Z?
08:27 AM miss0r: Now I just need to figure out who would be crazy enough to buy an old MH500C :D
08:28 AM miss0r: all dovetails except X, which is boxways
08:28 AM syyl: oh interesting
08:28 AM CaptHindsight: looks like it walked over to get out of the rain
08:29 AM miss0r: CaptHindsight: It has been rain free for almost a week. the MORNING ONLY I decide to move them around it starts to pour rain! :/
08:29 AM syyl: standard
08:29 AM miss0r: murphy's law at work
08:29 AM CaptHindsight: certainly , for me it's snow
08:30 AM CaptHindsight: if you want bad weather plan on moving something
08:30 AM miss0r: snow can be handled with a continous blast of compressed air over the machine.. rain needs more continous air than I can make :D
08:31 AM miss0r: now I just have a serious amount of stuff to move around.. My machines are installed with a "shoe horn"... and this one takes up slightly more space than the old one, which does not translate to a slight problem... unfortunatly, its rather serious
08:31 AM miss0r: syyl: Can you guess what I had to pay for it?
08:32 AM syyl: if you ask like that
08:32 AM syyl: you got it basicaly for free
08:32 AM miss0r: the condition taken into account that is plretty close to acurate
08:32 AM syyl: :D
08:32 AM syyl: i on the other hand lost all my marbles
08:33 AM syyl: and bought bobcam v32
08:33 AM syyl: ...
08:38 AM miss0r: ... :D
08:38 AM miss0r: (just had the kids in for a quick shop tour)
08:48 AM miss0r: I don't suppose any of you guys would like to purchase my old deckel maho mh500C ? Located in Denmark. aprox 2200kg
08:48 AM miss0r: :]
08:53 AM syyl: can you send it via DHL to me?
08:54 AM miss0r: sure haha
08:56 AM miss0r: You know, just for the pleasure of seeing my old mill on youtube, I will give you a realy nice price :D
08:57 AM syyl: :D
08:59 AM miss0r: I would hate to see it break those pretty floor tiles of yours
08:59 AM miss0r: :D
09:09 AM miss0r: syyl: Even if you wanted to; could you even fit a mill this size into your shop? let alone get it in there?
09:09 AM syyl: no
09:09 AM syyl: but i have other rooms
09:09 AM syyl: that would be suitable
09:09 AM syyl: but those stupid toolroom mills have an enormous footprint
09:10 AM miss0r: Lies!
09:10 AM miss0r: Work area vs footprint, this mill is far superior to most if not all production mills :)
09:11 AM syyl: uhm
09:11 AM syyl: datron ;)
09:11 AM miss0r: disregard datron...
09:11 AM syyl: lol
09:11 AM miss0r: that is a router anyway ;)
09:12 AM miss0r: I have effectively been running the mh500c on 2350x1900mm for years
09:12 AM miss0r: and the workarea is 500x 290y 350z
09:12 AM miss0r: with a workpiece capacity of 200kgs
09:13 AM * miss0r whispers to his old mill while petting it "Don't mind the bad man.. he does not know any better - you are perfect the way you are"
09:13 AM miss0r: :D
09:14 AM syyl: lol :D
09:21 AM syyl: ill better go in the shop
09:21 AM syyl: i have a ton of stones to grind
09:22 AM miss0r: orders picking up?
09:22 AM syyl: yes
09:22 AM syyl: all over europe
09:22 AM syyl: you happy with them?
09:22 AM miss0r: Very :)
09:25 AM syyl: <3
09:26 AM Loetmichel: *GNAAAAAHHH!* apprentice just came by and asked "hey, boss said to put this fritz isdn card into this dell 3020, but it doesent fit!". $me looks: no pci slot... MAAAAN sometimes i whis boss would think before he promieses something to the customers... :-(
09:39 AM Todd_Z: are there public logs of the Linuxcnc IRC?
09:42 AM gregcnc: miss0r 900 hours? where did it come from
09:43 AM miss0r: gregcnc: It was bought new by DTU(The danish MIT) and was placed in their prototype shop. There it was up until two years ago when a furniture factory bought it and discovered they could not use it to work on wood, so they just had it standing there.
09:44 AM gregcnc: ah yeah schools are about the only place where that happens
09:44 AM miss0r: and they had a team of very good machinists to run them - the students were not allowed to touch :D
09:44 AM miss0r: anyway. I have to get back to it. See you around (I will be back later on tonight)
09:50 AM JT-Shop: Todd_Z: log
10:05 AM Todd_Z: where?
10:06 AM gregcnc: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~tom-itx/irc/logs/%23linuxcnc/2019-11-14.html
10:07 AM Todd_Z: Thanks
10:46 AM jthornton: also you can say
12:12 PM jymmmm: Greetings !!!
12:50 PM jymmmm: Kinda interesting.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyMonPCxzog
12:53 PM syyl: its a large powerbank
12:53 PM syyl: ...
12:53 PM syyl: i wish they stoped calling it "generator".
12:54 PM Rab: haha
12:54 PM syyl: gives me the feeling that the presenter is not exactly an expert.
12:55 PM Rab: Please 👍 & SUBSCRIBE - // UPDATE I understand some of you disagree that this is sold as a "generator" because it is different than the textbook definition & you are correct // But what may surprise you is that this isn't a new thing or name for these - Visit Homedepot or Amazon & search on Battery "Generators" or just Generators & you will see dozens of these all clearly called generators.
12:55 PM jymmmm: It prodcues 120V.. It MUST be a "generator" =)
12:57 PM jesseg: It's an AC battery.
01:00 PM Rab: Tragically, they're not wrong: https://www.homedepot.com/p/308460871 https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B07S74MCQM
01:00 PM CaptHindsight: it generates heat
01:01 PM CaptHindsight: unclear or disingenuous advertising and marketing, I'm shocked!
01:02 PM syyl: and you cant even trust those bloody youtubers.
01:02 PM CaptHindsight: fanboys
01:02 PM CaptHindsight: paid shills
01:02 PM syyl: sign up for nord vpn!
01:03 PM syyl: buy a casper mattress!
01:03 PM CaptHindsight: ah the good ol days when people didn't lie to sell things
01:03 PM CaptHindsight: and they tarred and feathered you for trying to do so
01:03 PM syyl: "i would like to sell you a gallon of snake oil"
01:04 PM CaptHindsight: haven't had a squeaky snake around here, ever
01:04 PM syyl: :D
01:05 PM CaptHindsight: i think it's best when you just have consumers that are so dumb that they do and believe whatever you tell them
01:05 PM CaptHindsight: makes life simpler
01:06 PM syyl: but
01:06 PM CaptHindsight: don't believe your own eyes and ears, listen to what I say
01:06 PM syyl: dont those people wake up in the morning
01:06 PM CaptHindsight: define "wake up" :)
01:06 PM syyl: look in the mirror and get disgusted by themself?
01:06 PM CaptHindsight: nah
01:06 PM syyl: :(
01:06 PM CaptHindsight: they really don't
01:07 PM CaptHindsight: that is the sad part
01:09 PM CaptHindsight: Time Machine - Books (1960) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQ4lDJs8skg
01:09 PM CaptHindsight: based on the 1895 novella of the same name by H. G. Wells
01:10 PM jymmmm: Rab: HEY! I can plugin my ryobi battery charger into that and recharge my battery :)
01:13 PM CaptHindsight: The Invention of Lying (2009) brilliant film https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1058017/
01:16 PM jymmmm: Rab: Actually, that ryobi thing has 500 five star ratings, kinda impressive
01:17 PM jymmmm: CaptHindsight: "I'll die right now if..." (no spoilers)
01:22 PM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/pQbQdoAhfoA?t=78 Critical Literacy
01:33 PM CaptHindsight: wish i had more time for fabtech, today is the last day
01:34 PM CaptHindsight: came across https://www.flashcutcnc.com/
01:34 PM CaptHindsight: Windows PC based CNC controller for retrofits
01:35 PM CaptHindsight: they though it might be able to do rigid tapping
01:37 PM CaptHindsight: though/thought
01:38 PM Rab: I have an ooold FleshCut CNC controller + v1.4. It seems pretty good for '90s-era Windows-ware. No idea what their current products are like.
01:38 PM Rab: I recall zero rigid tapping capability.
01:40 PM CaptHindsight: heh
01:40 PM CaptHindsight: they didn't sound too sure
01:40 PM CaptHindsight: looked like windows GUI
01:41 PM CaptHindsight: somebody said they use a FPGA for real time, not sure of the software that runs on the FPGA
01:41 PM CaptHindsight: they don't count on the windows kernel on x86 for any real timr
01:41 PM Rab: My homies and I tried to r/e the serial protocol to the controller. We couldn't find recognizable ASCII...I think they're actually twiddling RS232 status lines to send steps + timing commands. The controller is based around an AVR.
01:41 PM CaptHindsight: timr/time
01:42 PM CaptHindsight: they are local to me but I have never heard of them until yesterday
01:43 PM Rab: Now maybe it's an FPGA. I believe Mach-compatible USB controllers function in a similar way: steps and timing commands are sent, the controller executes them in a deterministic way. Obviously no closed loop.
01:43 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.flashcutcnc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Lead-Senior-Software-Engineer-10-16-2018.docx
01:43 PM CaptHindsight: they have a servo controller
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: • 4+ years of C++ experience
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: • Experience developing multithreaded applications
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: • Experience developing complex algorithms
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: • Experience developing for Windows or Linux
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.flashcutcnc.com/products/cnc-controls/servo/
01:46 PM Rab: The driver box was based around L297/L298: http://reboots.g-cipher.net/fcdriver/
01:47 PM CaptHindsight: Radisys had a real time kernel for Windows back in the early 90's
01:47 PM CaptHindsight: hah, giant box
01:48 PM CaptHindsight: mostly power supply
01:49 PM CaptHindsight: typical, some giant vendors would offer us their "controller" in a giant box with some tiny cards inside
01:49 PM CaptHindsight: oh i also cam across the vendor that took over the lexmark TIJ printheads
01:52 PM CaptHindsight: https://www2.funai.co.jp/en/products/printer.html
01:54 PM CaptHindsight: pretty easy to control the cartridges, more nozzles than the reverse engineered HP cartridges
01:54 PM Centreline: flashcut's new engineer, first job, uplift that wp site to the latest version getting rid of all the xss'able jquery and other crap embedded in it...
01:57 PM Centreline: modern website design is always such a dumpster fire of embedded layers...
02:01 PM Centreline: and if their web presence is that bad, you want to trust their software to run a machine?
02:06 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.centroidcnc.com/cnc_retrofit.htm is the closed source retrofit company i see more often
02:07 PM Rab: Used to be a good rule of thumb for B2B companies that the cruder the website, the more established and legitimate the company.
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: didn't se them at fabtech
02:11 PM Rab: That blue GUI looks familiar. These people were talking up their control software without offering details, I guess it's Centroid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uz59-TK_A0
02:12 PM Centreline: Rab, its not so much crude, as just a wordpress template filled in, and a out of date vulnerable version at that.
02:12 PM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/mA41pUyONJM?t=480 Centroids GUI
02:14 PM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/0uz59-TK_A0?t=15 Vulcan GUI (for a whole 2 seconds)
02:14 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.vulcanmachineco.com/ better screen on their website
02:16 PM CaptHindsight: methods_: was interesting to compare the big laser cutters
02:17 PM CaptHindsight: Mitsubishi vs Trumpf vs Amada
02:27 PM methods_: yeah mits is insane
02:27 PM methods_: they were piercing 1" steel in less than 1sec
02:27 PM methods_: did you watch them cutting some thick material?
02:28 PM CaptHindsight: compared them all
02:28 PM CaptHindsight: was difficult to see inside the trumpf
02:28 PM methods_: has trumpf caught up to mits on piercing thicker mat?
02:28 PM CaptHindsight: they had stacks of different thickness steel
02:28 PM CaptHindsight: 1/4" to 1"
02:29 PM CaptHindsight: Mitsu looked the beefiest
02:29 PM CaptHindsight: you walk in and see the big 3 players...
02:29 PM methods_: yeah they build a solid machine
02:30 PM methods_: oh yeah its mits, amada and trumpf all the way
02:30 PM CaptHindsight: then 10-20 smaller co's with smaller machines
02:30 PM methods_: mazak tries to hang
02:30 PM methods_: but they suck so bad it's not even fair
02:30 PM CaptHindsight: same for metal folders, brakes etc
02:31 PM methods_: yeah trumpf pretty much owns the lighter brakes for chassis work
02:31 PM methods_: but bigger brakes the players kinda change
02:31 PM methods_: pacific and wyssong
02:32 PM methods_: you collect some good swag?
02:33 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WVHUtN3UHk they were making complete cabinets
02:33 PM CaptHindsight: but being Chicago you cvould not take them out of the show yourself
02:33 PM methods_: ah that's hazzy's right
02:33 PM CaptHindsight: it requires a union laborer at $85/hr
02:33 PM CaptHindsight: yeah
02:34 PM methods_: the tube lasers are my favorite
02:34 PM CaptHindsight: they had a pile/mountain of stuff
02:34 PM methods_: i could sit on that side watching them all day
02:34 PM CaptHindsight: they had trouble getting rid of it, but I always travel light
02:35 PM CaptHindsight: i left with a dozen business cards :)
02:36 PM methods_: i ended up with a bag of junk lots of grinding wheels lol
02:36 PM methods_: can't pass up free grinding wheels
02:36 PM CaptHindsight: i found some suppliers that solve many of my material problems
02:36 PM methods_: lots of pens
02:37 PM methods_: got a pen laser pointer with my name laser etched on it
02:38 PM CaptHindsight: odd at a Fab show but found my Nylon powder supplier, metal powder and a thermal inkjet vendor that took over the old industrial Lexmark line
02:39 PM CaptHindsight: pretty much the same automation component vendors, linear bearings, planetary gears etc
02:39 PM CaptHindsight: i would ask the high end cutting tool vendors for end mill samples :)
02:39 PM CaptHindsight: always gets a chuckle
02:40 PM CaptHindsight: sure , here's a $300 cutting tool, help yourself
02:40 PM CaptHindsight: Windows GUI's everywhere
02:41 PM CaptHindsight: after conversations with engineers you hear about Linux inside
02:42 PM CaptHindsight: looks like lots of machines just have magic inside they hope works
02:42 PM CaptHindsight: one vendor uses Wind River Linux
02:43 PM CaptHindsight: $1M license for their open source broken Linux
02:43 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.windriver.com/products/linux/
02:44 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.windriver.com/products/linux/tco-calculator/
02:44 PM CaptHindsight: Find the Hidden Costs in Your Embedded Linux Project
02:44 PM CaptHindsight: Ridiculous License Fee .... Priceless
02:44 PM XXCoder: capt I bet event is expenive to enter, but isnt there lot of coupons sent off to companies? i recall someone saying that
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: nope free
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: you have to try to pay for exhibits
02:45 PM XXCoder: pay for exhibits?
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: I once arrived without pre-registering and they handed me a free pass
02:45 PM XXCoder: ie pay before they show you anything?
02:46 PM CaptHindsight: the show is free is you register before the show
02:46 PM CaptHindsight: is/if
02:46 PM Rab: Do exhibitors have to pay?
02:46 PM CaptHindsight: heck yeah
02:47 PM CaptHindsight: a tiny booth will be several thousand
02:47 PM XXCoder: ah yes
02:48 PM CaptHindsight: 10 x 10 is likely $5k plus all the move in/out setup, labor, mob fees, garbage, flood and tiger insurance etc etc
02:48 PM XXCoder: woke up couple mins ago lol
02:50 PM CaptHindsight: ah ~$30/ square foot
02:51 PM CaptHindsight: plus all the expenses
02:51 PM XXCoder: i saw in video cnc machines running
02:51 PM XXCoder: I wonder what setupo would be like lol ignoring tuneup
02:55 PM CaptHindsight: i forgot to stop and see Tormach
02:56 PM XXCoder: doh
02:58 PM CaptHindsight: they must be doing OK since thy have a 800 sq ft booth
02:58 PM CaptHindsight: $24k in space alone
03:00 PM CaptHindsight: no decent hand held laser scanner for under 7-10K
03:00 PM CaptHindsight: they didn't understand why $30k is too pricey for high volume sales
03:02 PM XXCoder: 3d model scanner?
03:03 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.aniwaa.com/product/3d-scanners/creaform-goscan-spark/
03:03 PM XXCoder: thats 30k?
03:06 PM CaptHindsight: something open source or even closed but under $3k would be pretty disruptive
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: haven't checked but there must be some patent blocking lower cost competitors
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: something overly broad I assume
03:10 PM mozmck: CaptHindsight: mob fees - haha! Is that in Chicago?
03:11 PM CaptHindsight: mozmck: yes :p
03:13 PM CaptHindsight: around 10 years ago people started to complain about move out fees, you had to hire labor for anything more than a small shopping bag
03:13 PM mozmck: Yeah, I've heard that out there you have to pay a different union worker for everything. car unloader union, dock mover union, dock to booth mover union, booth setup union, electrician union to flip the switch for power, etc.
03:14 PM CaptHindsight: one vendor was carrying out left over marketing materials in the "show bag" to their car to save on >$50/hr charges
03:14 PM CaptHindsight: yes
03:14 PM CaptHindsight: hazzy said thay their 3-phase only had one phase on when they turned the power on
03:15 PM CaptHindsight: how do they even do that when breakers are all bonded across the 3 phases
03:15 PM CaptHindsight: big knife switches?
03:16 PM mozmck: Yeah, I know people that set up at shows and they were rather taken aback first time they went to California and Chicago. Can't blow your nose without paying the nose blowers union and the kleenex union and the trash pickup union.
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: and having a sneeze license
03:17 PM CaptHindsight: I once tried to help a vendor pack up after a show
03:17 PM CaptHindsight: they eventually gave me the presidents badge since he left early so i could come back in and help
03:17 PM CaptHindsight: president of the exhibitors co
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: but you can hand truck something small in for free
03:18 PM mozmck: well that's nice of them...
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: have to say it's a delivery
03:19 PM CaptHindsight: and you have to rent their carpeting
03:19 PM CaptHindsight: which they roll up and use for the next show
03:31 PM Tom_itx: surprised they don't charge a cleaning fee for the next use
03:32 PM * jymmmm is looking for a 1/0 quick disconnect
03:33 PM XXCoder: NaN quick disconnect eh
03:34 PM jymmmm: https://www.amazon.com/X-Haibei-Connect-Trailer-Battery-Disconnect/dp/B00OZDROEI
03:34 PM jymmmm: But only crimp :(
03:35 PM XXCoder: drat
03:35 PM XXCoder: cant you solder on crimp
03:35 PM jymmmm: You think solder would handle 175A ?
03:36 PM jymmmm: longevity wise
03:37 PM Rab: There is no way I would solder 1/0 @ 175A.
03:37 PM Tom_itx: screws
03:37 PM jymmmm: I was thinking screws too
03:37 PM XXCoder: ah thats lot amps nm dunno on high current stuff
03:38 PM jymmmm: It's 12VDC@175A, but still
03:39 PM jymmmm: Who might have the proper crimper for that?
03:40 PM Tom_itx: if the wire is rated correct, it shouldn't get warm so solder shouldn't melt. i wouldn't solder though i'd find some that use screws or crimp on
03:40 PM Tom_itx: Jymmm probably the ppl that sell the connector
03:41 PM jymmmm: amazon? lol
03:41 PM Tom_itx: https://www.harborfreight.com/hydraulic-wire-crimping-tool-66150.html
03:42 PM Rab: Wire gauge isn't the only issue. If the connector corrodes, or isn't properly inserted, a high-resistance connection could produce enough heat to melt the solder.
03:42 PM Tom_itx: https://www.amazon.com/Amzdeal-Crimper-Crimping-Ratchet-Cutting/dp/B079NCMNK5
03:43 PM jymmmm: Rab: Yeah, I would be VERY leary of solder with that kind of amperage
03:43 PM Tom_itx: plier style or hammer crimper
03:43 PM jymmmm: Tom_itx: NICE find and HF has a nice return policy
03:44 PM Rab: Good reviews for a HF product.
03:45 PM jymmmm: Rab: They do have some good things once in a while.
03:46 PM Rab: HF does a good job of presenting reviews honestly, that I've seen. Some of their crappier products have like 1.5 stars and scathing reviews, right on the website.
03:46 PM jymmmm: BTW, this is for a toyota preius to use as a 2000W inverter
03:46 PM Tom_itx: you can get plier style for ~25
03:46 PM Tom_itx: or the hammer style
03:47 PM jymmmm: You leave the dongle in the car, and it will automatically start the car and charge up the battery, then turn itself off as needed.
03:48 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
03:53 PM _unreal_: sup
03:53 PM Rab: I've seen battery lugs crimped with a metal dowel pin and a hammer in a pinch, turned out pretty well.
03:53 PM Tom_L: Jymmm yeah leaving the dongle in the car shouldn't be a problem... nobody's gonna steal a prius
03:53 PM jymmmm: Rab: Only thing, is they have to fit back into the shell after crimping so can't be too deformed :)
03:53 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: lol
03:53 PM Rab: jymmmm, good point.
03:53 PM jymmmm: Rab: I have that issue when I make 30A power pole cables.
03:54 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: I'm actually kinda looking for a hybrid , a friend had this setup with a 2KW/4KW HF inverter and it ran a dual electric burner and didn't even warm the cables
04:03 PM Deejay: gn8
04:04 PM jymmmm: gn9 De
04:04 PM jymmmm: Deejay: gn9
04:04 PM Deejay: :)
05:23 PM jthornton: Tom_L, I just gave up on stack overflow and deleted the question and my account
05:24 PM Tom_L: :(
05:26 PM Tom_L: did you figure anything out on it?
05:26 PM jthornton: I figured out I was using the wrong tool, qt for python forum is much nicer and more helpful
05:57 PM Tom_L: jthornton, seen this? https://doc.qt.io/qtforpython/contents.html
05:58 PM jthornton: no, thanks for the link
06:00 PM Tom_L: i thought w3 schools might have something but i didn't find anything on qt there
06:05 PM _unreal_: sigh
06:05 PM Tom_L: sore?
06:05 PM _unreal_: me very
06:05 PM _unreal_: child no cavities
06:05 PM _unreal_: just got back from the dentist
06:06 PM Tom_L: did they give her candy on the way out the door?
06:06 PM _unreal_: no
06:06 PM _unreal_: just a grab bag with the typical
07:12 PM _unreal_: oh crap where did I put it
07:17 PM _unreal_: so who's live?
07:18 PM _unreal_: bunch o dead beats in here :)
07:18 PM _unreal_: yall are killing me :)
07:19 PM Javabean: not yet, let me see about getting up... then maybe i will find the energy to do this properly
07:19 PM _unreal_: ?
07:19 PM _unreal_: huh
07:20 PM Javabean: killing you... well if you want me to kill you, i gotta get up from my pc...then find the energy to do a proper job of it
07:20 PM _unreal_: oook...
07:20 PM _unreal_: oh these motor controllers are driving me crazy
07:20 PM _unreal_: a3936sed
07:21 PM Javabean: nice password, thanks
07:23 PM _unreal_: That would be a motor controller chip for a bldc sir..
07:26 PM Javabean: ...so these companies use random generators in order to pick the "names"/"product ids" of there stuff... good to know
07:34 PM _unreal_: amazon has 30min to deliver.
07:34 PM _unreal_: arriving tonight by 9... well wee
07:34 PM _unreal_: see
08:22 PM jymmmm: Actually, "a3936sed" would be a pretty poor password
08:24 PM _unreal_: I'd love it if I could turn these into working bldc motor controllers
08:24 PM _unreal_: the PCB design that they are sitting on is smple
08:24 PM _unreal_: its just converting them into closed loop servo
08:24 PM _unreal_: is what I'm interested in
08:25 PM _unreal_: I'm good and electronics just not so hot at circuit design.
08:25 PM _unreal_: and=at
08:25 PM _unreal_: pcb design. damn good
08:28 PM _unreal_: I "could" I believe looking at the schematics treat them like steppers and use the "hal" input pins as the step sequences control. BUT
08:29 PM _unreal_: I'm just not sure how the damn things work
08:52 PM Tom_L: breadboard it
09:42 PM SpeedEvil: Sit on top of a mountain naked meditating on the problem.
09:43 PM SpeedEvil: _unreal_: well, did it arrive?
09:46 PM Tom_L: we still don't know what _it_ is
09:47 PM Tom_L: did stmbl ever get the new parts/boards ironed out?
09:54 PM Tom_L: what's the latest hostmot2 driver version?
09:57 PM _unreal_: nope
09:57 PM _unreal_: didnt arrive
09:57 PM _unreal_: would have been cool if it had
09:57 PM _unreal_: oh well
09:57 PM _unreal_: tomorrow
09:58 PM _unreal_: I mounted a bunch of hangers on my daughters cnc machine
09:58 PM _unreal_: and pre ran phone cord for the limit switches. NOW if I could just find those FUCKING limit switches that I purchased an entire bag of like 50 of.
10:01 PM Tom_L: you might want them shielded
10:01 PM drdoc: USB-2 cable
10:01 PM drdoc: :-)
10:02 PM _unreal_: why?
10:02 PM Tom_L: noise
10:02 PM _unreal_: not likely
10:02 PM Tom_L: mkay
10:02 PM drdoc: lol
10:02 PM _unreal_: 12v signal with 100k pull down
10:02 PM drdoc: I already went down that road
10:03 PM drdoc: sleeved all the wiring all nice and neat and comapct
10:03 PM _unreal_: there is no way in hell they will have any issues
10:03 PM Tom_L: mkay
10:03 PM _unreal_: regardless the "phone cable" is shielded
10:03 PM drdoc: and then couldn't get the thing to home at-all
10:04 PM _unreal_: I dont use low voltage for limit switches. thats just asking for problems
10:04 PM drdoc: _unreal_: that's one of the reasons I now have a spare Arduino
10:04 PM _unreal_: 12v signal with pull downs. its not possible to get a faulse read..
10:05 PM drdoc: hey Tom?
10:05 PM _unreal_: unless you have REALLY high voltage or coils wrapped around the limit switch wires.
10:05 PM _unreal_: hehe
10:05 PM _unreal_: just cant happen
10:05 PM drdoc: is there a realtime-capable SPI driver?
10:06 PM drdoc: that's not tied to a Mesa board?
10:06 PM _unreal_: What other boards are there that use spi and do cnc control?
10:07 PM Tom_L: 7i90
10:07 PM _unreal_: !!!! OMG OMG OMG soo happy I just found a back up of a project I was working on. its outdated and missing shit but at least its there
10:08 PM drdoc: there's a *driver* - DRV8711 - that uses SPI at power-up to tell it how to be
10:08 PM _unreal_: Tom_L, I'm still torn on how I want to this cnc machine I'm building
10:09 PM _unreal_: dual par port or go with a :P mesa
10:10 PM CaptHindsight: somebody was working on a RTAI SPI driver a few years ago
10:12 PM drdoc: CaptHindsight: that chip claims to do 4A sustained without a heatsink
10:12 PM Tom_L: i thought jepler had it working in a limited way
10:12 PM _unreal_: I wish there was a working dispay driver for my 7" lcd.. armbian still does not support the @#$%@#$ thing
10:12 PM drdoc: 8-52V
10:12 PM _unreal_: drdoc, what chip?
10:13 PM drdoc: DRV8711
10:13 PM CaptHindsight: if only Rpi would build for Gentoo
10:13 PM Tom_L: what would cause a hm2 driver to unload right after it loads?
10:13 PM Tom_L: i've had this config working with ethernet but i've re'installed everything and trying to iron things out
10:14 PM drdoc: Pololu makes a breakout with Arduino support, but as far as I can tell it's kind of a dedicated GRBL thing
10:15 PM _unreal_: drdoc, I'd love to find a good cheap closed loop servo controller
10:15 PM Tom_L: it's a working config, the only difference between this test setup and the real machine is the mesa board is a 7i80 instead of a 7i90
10:15 PM Tom_L: and the bit file of course is compiled for the right board
10:15 PM drdoc: _unreal_: I don't know anything about servo setup
10:16 PM CaptHindsight: servo controller or servo drive?
10:16 PM drdoc: gah
10:16 PM Tom_L: the 2 mesa boards are the same save the interface
10:16 PM _unreal_: brushed servo
10:16 PM drdoc: my mouth tastes like a friggin nail salon
10:17 PM _unreal_: I have one :( left nice dc brushed servo motor
10:17 PM CaptHindsight: tile floor?
10:17 PM _unreal_: I think i want to use it on my home machine
10:17 PM drdoc: denture repair
10:17 PM _unreal_: ?
10:17 PM drdoc: heh
10:17 PM _unreal_: random
10:17 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.xdimax.com/pciex/dmx10.html
10:18 PM CaptHindsight: DMX-10
10:18 PM CaptHindsight: Low Cost PCIEx I2C/SPI/GPIO Interface Adapter
10:18 PM _unreal_: looking at this https://www.ebay.com/itm/HBS57-Closed-Loop-Servo-Motor-Driver-Hybrid-Step-Servo-Driver-CNC-ControlleE7O4/174095547229?hash=item2888e73b5d:g:YL8AAOSw1B5dzLxc
10:18 PM drdoc: _unreal_: CaptHindsight was asking if the solvent taste was from laying tile
10:18 PM drdoc: I think...
10:19 PM CaptHindsight: what does a nail salon taste like?
10:19 PM CaptHindsight: depends on where you taste
10:19 PM drdoc: same way it smells, I imagine
10:19 PM drdoc: lol
10:20 PM _unreal_: yum yum
10:20 PM drdoc: I don't know how those ladies walk at the end of a day
10:20 PM _unreal_: aint you ever heard of "swagger"
10:20 PM CaptHindsight: what kind of servo motor?
10:20 PM _unreal_: rhymes with stagger
10:20 PM _unreal_: brushed dc
10:21 PM CaptHindsight: I tried to use some Keiling stepper drivers earlier, nothing but problems
10:21 PM drdoc: CaptHindsight: is there a HAL for that card?
10:21 PM _unreal_: I'm not sure if that controller is a servo, a bipolar a waht
10:21 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/digital-stepper-motor-driver/digital-stepper-driver-kl-4042d-heat-sink-is-included/ noisy as hell
10:22 PM CaptHindsight: missed steps
10:25 PM elmo40: CaptHindsight, that driver has problems?
10:25 PM _unreal_: this is bugging me I dont know if this is a brushed servo control a bipolr driver what? HBS57
10:25 PM _unreal_: nothing says
10:25 PM _unreal_: I think its bipolar
10:26 PM drdoc: title says "hybrid step servo"
10:26 PM drdoc: which sounds like the seller doesn't know either
10:26 PM CaptHindsight: but they are to stupid to clearly write up what the drive actually is
10:27 PM elmo40: copy&paste with no knowledge of the item...
10:27 PM CaptHindsight: Step Dir inputs with encoders and stepper motor out from the pics
10:27 PM drdoc: _unreal_: if you haven't already found docs online for that, hard pass
10:27 PM CaptHindsight: but who knows, move on don't waste our time
10:28 PM CaptHindsight: ships from China as well
10:28 PM CaptHindsight: so if you like pain, order it :)
10:29 PM drdoc: I wish I could spend the cash I saved today
10:29 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.damencnc.com/userdata/file/2134_HBS57.pdf
10:29 PM CaptHindsight: if it is from Leadshone it "MIGHT" be OK
10:29 PM elmo40: CaptHindsight, why not get a real driver?
10:29 PM elmo40: https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/gecko-drivers/gecko-driver-g203v/
10:29 PM drdoc: lol
10:30 PM CaptHindsight: elmo40: I have real drivers as well
10:30 PM drdoc: elmo40: some of us spend our machine time repeating The Mantra
10:30 PM CaptHindsight: was just trying the Keiling to see IF it would work
10:30 PM drdoc: "It's a toy not a tool."
10:30 PM elmo40: why did that one have missed steps, and be noisy?
10:31 PM elmo40: drdoc, big boy toys!
10:31 PM drdoc: yes, but budgeting for toys is very different from budgeting for tools
10:33 PM CaptHindsight: elmo40: using https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/shopping/catalog/motion_control/stepper_systems/stepper_drives/stp-drv-6575
10:34 PM drdoc: OK, I'm gonna go wash the plaster out of my ears
10:34 PM drdoc: later gents
10:34 PM _unreal_: ears
10:34 PM _unreal_: ?
10:37 PM CaptHindsight: elmo40: I'd have to get the scope out to see what the hell it was doing
10:37 PM CaptHindsight: not really interested in spending the time to save $30
10:37 PM elmo40: understandable
10:38 PM elmo40: this is why i listen to channels like this and read forums. watch vids.
10:38 PM elmo40: you do not get time back. no sense wasting it on shitty products and get shitty results!
10:38 PM CaptHindsight: Keiling (automation technology) is nearby
10:39 PM CaptHindsight: I used them before, and had a few in my stock
10:39 PM elmo40: i was taught a long time ago: You will never live long enough to learn from all the mistakes in the world. Learn from others.
10:39 PM CaptHindsight: they probably liked being driven by a Mesa card
10:40 PM CaptHindsight: yes, why i was passing the info along
10:40 PM _unreal_: still mad at my self for giving up the sister motor I had because the encoder was broken...
10:40 PM _unreal_: then again that was before I moved down here and I was very broke
10:40 PM CaptHindsight: automation technology is a popular source for parts in this channel
10:40 PM CaptHindsight: for the US anyway
10:44 PM CaptHindsight: _unreal_: what motor are you trying to drive in closed loop?
10:46 PM _unreal_: this is the very motor I have on hand I want to drive https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/6SMAAOSwRgJXjOGA/s-l1600.jpg
10:48 PM CaptHindsight: _unreal_: brushed DC motor?
10:48 PM pcw_home: Carriage motor from a DecWriter...
10:48 PM _unreal_: brushed
10:48 PM _unreal_: pcw_home, could be
10:49 PM _unreal_: digital 70-15388
10:51 PM CaptHindsight: pcw_home: how do I test out the XY2-100 driver? I have the .bit and .vhd from August?
10:51 PM CaptHindsight: I'll have time soon
10:52 PM pcw_home: it should be the latest, what hardware do you have?
10:52 PM CaptHindsight: found new material suppliers, so SLS using galvos looks good again
10:52 PM pcw_home: ( I'll cobble up a bitfile to suit )
10:53 PM CaptHindsight: pretty sure we have 6i25's and...
10:53 PM CaptHindsight: checking the boxes
10:56 PM _unreal_: Interesting
10:56 PM CaptHindsight: 7i92's
10:56 PM _unreal_: acording to the label in the photo. its only 30oz in
10:56 PM _unreal_: https://www.ebay.com/c/1733179732
10:57 PM _unreal_: yet in my tests you put 24V to the thing and its going to turn
10:57 PM CaptHindsight: pcw_home: ends up they are price fixing SLS powders
10:57 PM pcw_home: Not terribly surprising...
10:58 PM CaptHindsight: $2/lb raw, $100/lb as powder
10:58 PM CaptHindsight: yes the powder coatings suppliers are ~$10/lb
10:58 PM CaptHindsight: artificial shortages
10:59 PM pcw_home: Do you have any daughtercards with differential outputs?
10:59 PM CaptHindsight: digital diff?
10:59 PM pcw_home: yeah
10:59 PM CaptHindsight: 7i77 and 7i76's for sure in stock
10:59 PM CaptHindsight: let me see....
10:59 PM pcw_home: XY2-100 galvanometer seem to all use differential signaling
11:00 PM pcw_home: a 7I76 should work
11:00 PM CaptHindsight: and 7i47's right now
11:00 PM pcw_home: 7I47 will work also for a 50 pin FPGA card
11:02 PM pcw_home: just tell me what hardware you want to use and I'll make a test bitfile ( tomorrow, getting sleeepppyy )
11:03 PM CaptHindsight: 7i76 with 6i25
11:03 PM CaptHindsight: have those for sure
11:03 PM pcw_home: ok Ill make one up tomorrow
11:04 PM CaptHindsight: if you have time, or next week
11:04 PM pcw_home: Ill steal the last two step/dir channels for Clk, Xdata,Ydata,Sync
11:05 PM CaptHindsight: pencil sketch for pins is fine
11:05 PM pcw_home: OK, bbl
11:06 PM CaptHindsight: 11pm here, sleep soon
11:08 PM _unreal_: same
11:08 PM _unreal_: as I recall that motor is VERY strong
11:09 PM _unreal_: I was also looking at this motor controller
11:09 PM _unreal_: https://www.open-electronics.org/tarocco-open-source-closed-loop-motor-controller/
11:11 PM CaptHindsight: that motor is only 32 oz in
11:12 PM CaptHindsight: oh 30 oz in
11:12 PM CaptHindsight: what is it going to drive/move?
11:14 PM _unreal_: small cnc
11:14 PM CaptHindsight: really small
11:14 PM _unreal_: I dont know how many lines the enoder has but I'm going to assume 500-1000
11:14 PM _unreal_: that motor is like 8" long
11:15 PM CaptHindsight: 33W
11:15 PM _unreal_: I find it hard to believe that my tiny stepper motors are as strong as that dcmotor
11:16 PM _unreal_: I know I can not stall that motor by hand
11:16 PM CaptHindsight: nema17's can be much higher than that
11:16 PM _unreal_: its nema23
11:17 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/nema-17/
11:17 PM ve7it: steppers have torque at low rpm... servo has same torque all the way to max rpm and thus, much more power is available
11:17 PM CaptHindsight: i have nema23's with >10X the power
11:18 PM _unreal_: regardless I'm looking at using this dc motor for my home cnc machine to drive Y
11:18 PM _unreal_: it will be pully reduced as well
11:18 PM CaptHindsight: what is it turning? a ballscrew? with what load?
11:18 PM CaptHindsight: run the numbers
11:18 PM CaptHindsight: math works for me and many others :)
11:19 PM _unreal_: I'm building a new cnc at home. I have not purchased anything for driving the machine yet
11:19 PM ve7it: pulleys are your friend... easy to change if you decide you need more torque or higher speeds
11:19 PM _unreal_: not till I get the main board plained
11:19 PM _unreal_: driving me @$%Q#W$^!Q#W$Er crazy. its rained NON stop the entire week
11:19 PM CaptHindsight: it's just math, not "a small cnc machine" or "cat catcher" or "toilet paper rewinder"
11:19 PM _unreal_: likely threaded rod
11:20 PM _unreal_: gear reduction of 12/1
11:20 PM _unreal_: aprox
11:20 PM _unreal_: twin threaded rod
11:20 PM _unreal_: tied via belt
11:20 PM CaptHindsight: so stepper motor speed
11:20 PM CaptHindsight: after reduction
11:20 PM _unreal_: this DC motor can do much higher speed
11:21 PM CaptHindsight: just put together a spread sheet
11:21 PM ve7it: typical small stepper 2V,2A/coil at best its only 8w motor
11:21 PM _unreal_: ve7it, https://www.ebay.com/c/1733179732
11:21 PM _unreal_: That is the very motor I have
11:22 PM _unreal_: its rated 24v 2.2a
11:22 PM _unreal_: nema23
11:22 PM ve7it: I have a couple of those... they are very nice motors http://ve7it.cowlug.org/dspic-servo.html motor and servo drive I built
11:23 PM _unreal_: no way
11:23 PM CaptHindsight: 40 video lecture https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzWMdZZaHwI&list=PL3D4EECEFAA99D9BE
11:23 PM _unreal_: ya I had a few but this one LAST one I have was the only one that didnt have a broken encoder
11:24 PM CaptHindsight: Lecture Series on Design Of Machine Elements
11:24 PM elmo40: are nema23 'slower' or 'less responsive' than nema17 motors? simply due to inertia?
11:24 PM _unreal_: I gave up the others before I moved to florida number of years ago
11:24 PM _unreal_: elmo40, not like
11:25 PM _unreal_: elmo40, not a big difference in size and steppers cant hit high RPM and not loose steps in open loop with dynamic changes
11:25 PM elmo40: if you look at it, the space to 'travel' 1.8deg is longer than in nema17 simply due to diameter increase.
11:25 PM elmo40: so it might take more time to get there and more energy to stop it there
11:26 PM CaptHindsight: you might be better off asking in #reprap
11:26 PM elmo40: but, if a 2A nema17 and 2A nema23 are on the table, the nema23 will have more torque simply due to diameter. so, question is will it be less responsive to change of direction?
11:26 PM CaptHindsight: they like to avoid math and just cobble things together
11:26 PM _unreal_: ve7it, you live?
11:27 PM ve7it: yup
11:27 PM elmo40: CaptHindsight, that is a full week's worth of 8hr day watching videos!!
11:27 PM elmo40: maybe try at 1.5x
11:28 PM _unreal_: did you use that setup/motor on a cnc?
11:29 PM _unreal_: ve7it, do you know what the encoder line count is?
11:29 PM CaptHindsight: _unreal_: https://www.motioncontrolonline.org/content-detail.cfm/Motion-Control-Technical-Features/How-to-Size-a-Motor/content_id/2236
11:29 PM CaptHindsight: elmo40: but just imagine how much more sensible the questions would become after watching
11:30 PM ve7it: my current cnc has steppers, but I have done a bunch of work on servos... the video on my web page shows a friends machine running 3 of the servo amps
11:30 PM _unreal_: hum
11:30 PM ve7it: I dont remember the line count.... probably 1000lines or 4000counts/rev
11:30 PM elmo40: not to knock it(and to be a little clueless, actually)... but what great feats of engineering do they demonstrate in real world?
11:30 PM _unreal_: I'm guessing 1000
11:30 PM _unreal_: I just put the cap back on mine
11:31 PM _unreal_: ve7it, do you think I'd have any issues with torque using this motor. on a 12 to 1 geared down ratio driving threaded rods?
11:31 PM _unreal_: small desktop cnc
11:31 PM ve7it: if you ever saw the decwriter head flying back and forth, you know that is a good servo motor
11:32 PM _unreal_: ya the 30 oz in seems interesting considering the size of the motor
11:32 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.orientalmotor.com/technology/motor-sizing-calculations.html
11:32 PM ve7it: my friends cnc used 3 or 4 to 1 reduction onto threaded rod
11:32 PM CaptHindsight: unfortunately they used math ^^
11:33 PM ve7it: 15 tooth on motor, 60 tooth on drive rod
11:34 PM _unreal_: ve7it, ok
11:34 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.orientalmotor.com/motor-sizing/ballLeadScrew-sizing.html# math is used but they just have you fill in the boxes
11:35 PM _unreal_: ve7it, and he gets plenty of torque and high speed movements
11:35 PM ve7it: if 120 oz-in wont turn a threded rod, something is wrong.... and servos have a reserve torque about 3 times for short periods (like during acceleration)
11:35 PM _unreal_: I assume
11:36 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.kennametal.com/en/resources/engineering-calculators/turning-calculators/cutting-forces.html
11:36 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.kennametal.com/en/resources/engineering-calculators/end-milling-calculators/force-torque-and-power.html
11:36 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, hehe that servo is stronger then any stepper motor I have on my current machine
11:36 PM ve7it: he mills aluminum mostly... not a real high speed machine... 50ipm or something like that
11:36 PM CaptHindsight: this should give you an idea of the cutting forces you'll be seeing
11:37 PM CaptHindsight: ve7it: again it's just math, don't fear the calculations
11:37 PM ve7it: yup
11:37 PM _unreal_: ve7it, I'm torn
11:38 PM _unreal_: dspic controller http://ve7it.cowlug.org/dspic-servo.html or https://www.open-electronics.org/tarocco-open-source-closed-loop-motor-controller/
11:38 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.mmsonline.com/articles/a-new-milling-101-milling-forces-and-formulas
11:38 PM _unreal_: I'm leaning taroco
11:38 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, I'm building a new etching machine
11:39 PM CaptHindsight: sorry i only understand, loads, velocity, friction, massetc
11:39 PM CaptHindsight: mass etc
11:39 PM ve7it: easy solution... they look promising and because they are open source, you always have the option of doing custom things in the drive
11:41 PM ve7it: (like: I hate step/dir signals, much prefer to send quadrature signals to the drive as there are no issues with setup and hold times.)
11:45 PM _unreal_: never messed with quadrature signals
11:49 PM _unreal_: NOOOOO come back
11:49 PM _unreal_: sigh
11:49 PM _unreal_: well time to get ready for bed