Jul 24 2019
12:30 AM perry_j1987: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNt1YKkGBvA
02:38 AM Valen: If tool reps come visit you are probably getting overpriced tools ;-)
04:15 AM XXCoder: Valen: including box that just goes beep!
04:15 AM Valen: ;-)
04:17 AM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arCITMfxvEc
04:18 AM XXCoder: i misremembered sound effect (what a surpise)
04:19 AM Deejay: moin
05:09 AM Tom_L: morning
05:37 AM jthornton: morning
05:39 AM XXCoder: yo
05:42 AM jthornton: got started on the east kitchen siding and door yesterday... hope to get the new siding and door installed today
05:43 AM jthornton: 62°F this morning
05:44 AM XXCoder: looks like friday will be "fun"
05:44 AM XXCoder: 82f
07:50 AM gonzo_: quicky question for you chaps
07:51 AM gonzo_: just installed a pcie paraport card in a machine
07:51 AM gonzo_: it shows up in lspci, but with two io addresses
07:54 AM gonzo_: so not sure which to pick to add to the config
07:54 AM gonzo_: though looking at the config, I'm not sure where it needs to go anyway
07:54 AM gonzo_: (Using hostmot2 on a mesa 7i90)
07:56 AM gonzo_: I was assuming that I should have something like : ioaddr=0x378
07:56 AM gonzo_: in the loadrt, but don't see it.
07:57 AM jthornton: try each one
07:57 AM gonzo_: jthornton, thanks
07:57 AM gonzo_: wondered if I could shortcut that
07:59 AM gonzo_: in my previous PC I didn't have the ioaddr=0x378 type param. But it worked. Is that because it will assume the default if bo ioarrd is specified?
07:59 AM gonzo_: (I'm just building up a replacement PC here, as the last one blew up)
08:10 AM Elmo40: but what is 'default' ?
08:13 AM jthornton: I don't have a sample 7i90 configuration to check
08:20 AM gonzo_: the man page for the HM2_7I90 gives the 0x378 as default
08:20 AM gonzo_: I found some stuff to do with adding a 2nd port
08:20 AM gonzo_: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.4/html/examples_pci_parallel_port.html
08:21 AM gonzo_: but am I correct in assuming that all the info here is to do with directly driving things from the LPT port
08:21 AM gonzo_: and I can ignore all this for HM2 ?
08:28 AM pcw_home: If the plug-in card is recognized by linux as a parallel port, you can use 0,1,2 as the address (0 for first parallel port etc)
08:29 AM pcw_home: otherwise you need to find the LPT port address with lspci
09:07 AM gonzo_: pcw_home, by address 0,1,2 do you mean referring to hm2_7i90.0.xxx ?
09:08 AM gonzo_: just based on which lpt the 7i90 appears on?
10:00 AM pcw_home: If Linux recognizes the LPT port it can be selected based on and indec (0.1.2.3 etc) instead of an address
10:00 AM pcw_home: s/indec/index/
10:05 AM pcw_home: The default motherboard port address is usually 0x378 (and the driver uses thei as a default ) but PCI ports are usually above 0x1000
10:07 AM pcw_home: in any case, the driver needs to know the port address either via Linux's parallel port driver or supplied on the command line of the hm2_7i90 driver
10:31 AM gonzo_: ok, will have a play with the ioaddr
10:31 AM gonzo_: thanks
10:32 AM pcw_home: or just use the index (if the parallel port card is recognized by Linux)
10:35 AM gonzo_: I get dmsg of:
10:36 AM gonzo_: [ 9.584309] parport0: PC-style at 0xec00 (0xe880), irq 16 [PCSPP,TRISTATE]
10:36 AM gonzo_: so does that suggest the os has seen the lpt port?
10:49 AM pcw_home: yes
10:52 AM gonzo_: at the mo I have:
10:53 AM gonzo_: loadrt hm2_7i90 config="blah blah"
10:53 AM gonzo_: which worked with my previous mc with onboard lpt
10:54 AM gonzo_: if this pcie lpt card is being seen by linux, then shoyuld the above work?
10:57 AM gonzo_: used to have to set the old onboard lpt to epp
10:57 AM gonzo_: in bios. No idea what mode this card is in or how to set it
11:02 AM jthornton: https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/homemade-feeders-waterer.1320107/page-7#post-21593140
11:07 AM pcw_home: If the card has a Linux ( _NOT_ linuxCNC) driver you can use an index (0=first LPT port, 1= second LPT port etc) as the address
11:07 AM pcw_home: the card mode will be set by the hm2_7i90 driver (if its possible)
11:18 AM gonzo_: from what I've read, you should not install linux drivers, as linuxcnc uses it's own
11:24 AM gonzo_: is that just applicable to using lpt for direct stepper control?
11:34 AM jym: morning folks
11:38 AM pcw_home: You need Linux to recognize the LPT port to be able to use the index addressing scheme vs raw port addresses
11:57 AM gonzo_: ok, I'll see if I can find a driver
12:18 PM pcw_home: I dont think you need to if dmesg shows the port...
12:20 PM perry_j1987: whats the cheapest ATC spindle i could throw on this 6040 :P
12:23 PM gonzo_: ok. so hm2 uses the linux drivers?
12:23 PM gonzo_: just as well as I can't get the linux driver to compile!
12:25 PM jym: Transvestite clown zombies... GOTTA LOVE IT https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3816458/
12:27 PM gonzo_: a classic B movie?
12:28 PM gonzo_: pcw_home, put all the config back as it was. Where should I look for some meaningful error reports?
12:29 PM gonzo_: the popup box when running linuxcnc doesn't scream out any clues
12:32 PM jthornton: run your configuration from a terminal then check dmesg with sudo dmesg but first clear dmesg with sudo dmesg -c
12:45 PM gonzo_: jthornton, nothing meaningful
12:45 PM gonzo_: it just starts loading RTAI, then unloading it
12:52 PM Tom_L: jthornton, got your remodel done?
12:52 PM Tom_L: about halfway on mine
01:30 PM Deejay: gn8
01:40 PM jthornton: lol, no putzing around putting in a new kitchen door
01:41 PM * jthornton always wonders what "it" is...
02:05 PM * jthornton takes 5 and listens to Dave Brubeck
02:12 PM gonzo_: started playing about killing rtload entries in the hal file. Eventually just threw it an empty hal file. Same errors
02:13 PM gonzo_: something very wrong. An clues where to start?
02:13 PM * jthornton puts on his magic telepathy hat... but it's not working I can't read your mind or see the error
02:14 PM gonzo_: didn't want to spam the chan
02:23 PM JT-Shop2: that's what https://paste.ubuntu.com/ is for
02:24 PM gonzo_: still battling to edit a text file.....
02:27 PM gonzo_: that was very strange.....
02:27 PM gonzo_: ok:
02:27 PM gonzo_: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/Yrwt3Xhqbt/
02:32 PM jthornton: Can not find -sec RS274NGC -var PARAMETER_FILE -num 1
02:32 PM gonzo_: you're going to have to use baby words!
02:37 PM Loetmichel: re at home from Wien... 17.5h drive(3.5h of "acceptance check break" included), 1461km, 144.83 liters E10... and all that drive for nothing because Boss forgot to get an UL certificate so the customer dosent accept the PCs... :-(
02:37 PM esch: stepping back in time and doing some ladder programming in Cscape
02:39 PM Loetmichel: MAAN i am tired right now and my bones hurt... i am not getting younger... that seat in the BMW isnt that soft... ;)
02:52 PM gonzo_: jthornton, managed to find a backup from the previous working PC, the only files I copied to the new pc were the .ini and .hal
02:52 PM gonzo_: can find no reference to RS274 files at all
02:52 PM gonzo_: should they have been in the install?
03:09 PM jthornton: RS274NGC is a section in the INI file
03:09 PM jthornton: also the file has been saved in windblows
03:11 PM jthornton: you will need a .var, a .tbl and any files listed next to halfile =
03:12 PM * jthornton goes back to the kitchen door and drags out more tools as the deadbolt strike plate is bigger than the hole...
03:14 PM gonzo_: ok, I had the var file. Eventually found that rs274 is an entry in the ini file, I was looking fior a file with that name
03:14 PM gonzo_: big howler, was calling the application and passing the hal file, not the ini file
03:14 PM gonzo_: (told you I need baby words!)
03:15 PM gonzo_: now looks like it's doiung far more sensible things and reporting lpt issues
03:15 PM gonzo_: cheers jthornton
03:19 PM Loetmichel: jthornton: i never understood the need for a deadbolt in america
03:19 PM Loetmichel: until i learned that your normal door handles have no lock
03:19 PM Loetmichel: for a german thats a strange system
03:20 PM Loetmichel: all our door handles have internal locking mechanisms, the interior ones usually with a "form key" the outside ones with a more or less "lockpick proof" cylinder.
03:21 PM * jthornton has never seen a exterior door knob without a lock...
03:21 PM XXCoder: me either
03:23 PM gonzo_: in uk, it used to be typical to have only a lock, no handle
03:24 PM gonzo_: though more recently poeople have fitted upvc type doors with lockwork and those may have handles
03:25 PM gonzo_: bit the lock in the centre of the handle, only ever seen in hotel room doors
03:56 PM jthornton: door is installed except for the casing... time to pick up a zillion tools and put them back
04:04 PM gonzo_: pcw_home, I've just read something about the rtload for hm2 having params like:
04:04 PM gonzo_: config="firmware=svst4_4.bit"
04:04 PM gonzo_: where as my entry is:
04:05 PM gonzo_: config="num_encoders=3 num_pwmgens=1 num_stepgens=3"
04:05 PM gonzo_: has this changed recently? as I've probably got a far later install on this new pc
04:06 PM gonzo_: I loaded the 7i90 card using a dos utill, long ago, when that was all that was avail;
04:21 PM _unreal_: ya just got my package with my resistor networks in
04:21 PM _unreal_: going to toss one onto the controller board
04:21 PM _unreal_: get it soldered on and finish programming it
04:22 PM _unreal_: That should give me two working boards
04:29 PM * t4nk_freenode rubs _unreal_ into a decent layer of conductive heat-paste
04:31 PM _unreal_: ok shower time
04:31 PM _unreal_: just got home. just soldered that part on
04:40 PM gonzo_: looks like my lpt board is known to not support epp
04:40 PM gonzo_: christ I really hate computers
04:49 PM SpeedEvil: https://imgur.com/gallery/YCaDFD5 on 'toolholders'
04:49 PM SpeedEvil: Naval Artillery Breech from 1889
04:55 PM CaptHindsight: back when they made everything from gold
05:14 PM perry_j1987: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Wa3EDUuP5I
05:19 PM gonzo_: can anyone recommend a pcie parallel card, with real working epp, to interface to a mesa 7i90 card?
05:19 PM gonzo_: the forum doesn't seem to have anything conclusive
05:20 PM gonzo_: every discussion seems to be polluted with recommendations based on pin wiggling type builds
05:22 PM CaptHindsight: gonzo_: the $10 PCIe LPT card on the wiki doesn't work?
05:23 PM gonzo_: which one, to avoid it
05:24 PM CaptHindsight: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?WCH
05:24 PM CaptHindsight: i just got a fresh one in
05:24 PM CaptHindsight: they used to work fine with EPP
05:25 PM gonzo_: yep, I have a wch one
05:26 PM CaptHindsight: what is the problem?
05:26 PM gonzo_: the wch won't appear in the lspci
05:26 PM CaptHindsight: they backported the driver ti include that card a couple of years ago
05:26 PM CaptHindsight: ti/to
05:26 PM gonzo_: and a moschip 9912 appears but gives epp timeout errors
05:26 PM CaptHindsight: then your kernel is too old
05:27 PM CaptHindsight: gonzo_: what kernel are you using?
05:27 PM gonzo_: 2.7.14
05:27 PM CaptHindsight: Debian also back ported this to earlier kernels since it is working with Kernel 4.9
05:27 PM CaptHindsight: why are you using an old kernel?
05:28 PM gonzo_: no idea
05:28 PM CaptHindsight: use the Stretch ISO, pretty sure that is a much newer kernel
05:29 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.linuxcnc.org/testing-stretch-rtpreempt/
05:29 PM gonzo_: the dvd is dated a few weeks ago. But no idea where I got the iso from.
05:30 PM gonzo_: two weeks is too long for my memory these days
05:30 PM CaptHindsight: the 4.9 kernel supports the WCH LPT cards posted ^^
05:30 PM gonzo_: nope, it ways 2.7.14 is latest
05:31 PM gonzo_: says
05:31 PM CaptHindsight: yes, the stretch ISO has a 4.9 preempt_rt kernel
05:31 PM jthornton: gonzo_, https://mesaus.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=73&product_id=117
05:31 PM jthornton: that one is supposed to work in epp
05:32 PM jthornton: I can go look at the box if you need me to
05:32 PM CaptHindsight: gonzo_: you can install the http://www.linuxcnc.org/testing-stretch-rtpreempt/ ISO and be running in anhour with the WCH card
05:32 PM CaptHindsight: anhour/an hour
05:35 PM CaptHindsight: jthornton: does the old wheezy kernel support that LPT card?
05:35 PM jthornton: gonzo_, also jon has a page here http://pico-systems.com/parports.html
05:36 PM jthornton: looks like it works with < 2.7.8 for some reason
05:39 PM gonzo_: I have seen that pico-systems page, but it sounded like it wasnt hm2
05:40 PM gonzo_: my linux knowledge is not much more than putting a dvd in a tray and repeatedly clicking 'yep, whatever'
05:41 PM gonzo_: so I assumed the latest iso was the latest
05:42 PM jthornton: no it's not hm2 but jon does know a lot about the pci(e) parallel port cards
05:46 PM gonzo_: the mesaus one I'd just buy to get the pain over with. but need to find out what dhipping will be
05:46 PM gonzo_: shipping
05:49 PM * Tom_L checks the baseboard off his todo list
05:56 PM * gonzo_ adds slitting wrists to his!
06:02 PM gonzo_: woooo, a pcie card from us..... 58$ shipping, or 280 using fedex!
06:04 PM jthornton: I can ship first class something that light
06:04 PM jthornton: to countries that report back tracking like the UK
06:04 PM jthornton: Tom_L, getting the basement in order?
06:05 PM jthornton: I finally got the kitchen door installed still need to seal it and install the casing on the inside
06:11 PM gonzo_: cheers, may well take you up on that
06:12 PM jthornton: yea you need to coordinate that with me as normally I have first class turned off because I don't ship first class to eastern europe or russia or a lot of other places lol
06:14 PM jthornton: hmm I do have a 7i90HD in stock... I might want to test that with the parallel port card
06:18 PM gonzo_: ah, is mesaus you?
06:18 PM jthornton: aye
06:18 PM gonzo_: ok, didn't realise
06:19 PM gonzo_: for the next project, will prob go for a 7i80
06:20 PM jthornton: have you seen the 7i92?
06:20 PM gonzo_: I got the 7i90 when it was new, then discovered that there was no easy support for it
06:20 PM jthornton: bleeding edge time?
06:22 PM gonzo_: yep. But I really need it simple
06:23 PM jthornton: for steppers?
06:23 PM gonzo_: luckilly (!) my mill trunrd out to completely shagged, so by the time it was fixed, a couple of years had gone by
06:23 PM jthornton: be back in a bit time for the cricket rodeo with the chickens
06:23 PM gonzo_: yep, steppers and pwm for spindle control
06:27 PM jthornton: you might want to look at the 7i96 then
06:27 PM gonzo_: 7i92 looks interesting. Fully supported?!
06:27 PM jthornton: yea
06:28 PM jthornton: https://jethornton.github.io/7i96/
06:28 PM jthornton: I wrote a configuration tool for the 7i96 and 7i76e and working on one for the 7i92 and other ethernet cards
06:30 PM gonzo_: is that to flash the connections into the device, rather than having fixed i/o pins ?
06:32 PM gonzo_: at the mo, I have 50way idc to terminal breakouts on the fpga and daughter cards. so I can patch around
06:32 PM jthornton: what daughter cards do you have?
06:33 PM jthornton: the configuration tool can flash the card as well but the main thing it does is create your configuration files and it's a bit smart as it reads in the ini file if you use it again so changes are not lost
06:34 PM gonzo_: 37 and a 47
06:35 PM gonzo_: not really ideal, as I was learning as I went
06:35 PM jthornton: are you using the 7i47 to drive your steppers?
06:35 PM jthornton: I understand, I started at square -1 with linuxcnc
06:36 PM jthornton: https://mesaus.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=63&product_id=119
06:36 PM gonzo_: yep, the 422's are just being used as drivers. As I could tweak the logic sense in hw. Befory I realised you can go that in the hal
06:37 PM jthornton: that's the ethernet card with 2 50 pin connectors
06:38 PM gonzo_: probably a better way to go
06:39 PM gonzo_: poss compatable with what I have
06:40 PM jthornton: that's what I'm thinking, I need to see if there is firmware for a 7i37 and a 7i47
06:41 PM gonzo_: with the breakouts, I can patch the 50ways as much as I like
06:42 PM jthornton: hmm I need Peter to chime in if he is around pcw_home?
06:42 PM gonzo_: but I really need to just get the existing machine running, rather than changing it in any major way
06:42 PM gonzo_: currently running 7i90_epp_svst4_8_ado
06:42 PM jthornton: I hear that
06:43 PM gonzo_: once you start down this path, it becomes a full rebuild
06:43 PM jthornton: I see a 7i93_svst2_4_7i47d.bit firmware but not sure what it is
06:43 PM gonzo_: have just taught my daughter that. She wanted to redecorate her room. Thought it would be like the tv makeover programs. Now she sleeps in rubble.
06:44 PM jthornton: lol
06:45 PM gonzo_: the usual 'wish we'd never started this', life lesson
06:45 PM jthornton: yea, my curse is being handy and inventive and never having any free time because I know how to do a lot of stuff
06:46 PM jthornton: just don't ask me what color goes with... well anything I think in black and white
06:46 PM gonzo_: I have planned a mk2 controller. But that will be a replacement, built in tandem. So will do an eternet board for that.
06:47 PM gonzo_: I know that. Was stripping someones car seats out this morning
06:47 PM Centurion_Dan: whats the latency and jitter like with ethernet?
06:48 PM gonzo_: luckilly I am now pretty much pc illiterate. So those requests for help have gone away
06:48 PM jthornton: it depends on the motherboard
06:48 PM gonzo_: (a difficult juggling act, for a software engineer!)
06:48 PM jthornton: Centurion_Dan, you only need to test the servo thread for uspace
06:49 PM * jthornton checks the ##chickens channel
06:52 PM gonzo_: catch you all tomorrow.
06:52 PM jthornton: night
06:53 PM Centurion_Dan: jthornton: I'm toying with developing a usb3 based servo driver and quadrature encoder board
06:54 PM jthornton: sounds like a time sink, AFAIK usb can not be reliable real time but dunno
06:54 PM Centurion_Dan: usb3 should be good for 30 micro sec latency...
06:55 PM Centurion_Dan: usb2 is limited by 125usec latency and the roothub but usb3 doesn't have either of those constraints.
06:55 PM jthornton: usb3 does not have the timeout issues of 2?
07:00 PM Centurion_Dan: I'm not sure... but... https://www.diffen.com/difference/USB_2.0_vs_USB_3.0 implies the ability for asynchronous and duplex comms
07:02 PM Tom_L: jthornton, yeah... just finished caulking all the nail holes etc
07:03 PM jthornton: chow time...
07:17 PM _unreal_: OMG that is the cuetest little thing https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32445471313.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000013.13.1f6857f6B89qos&gps-id=pcDetailBottomMoreThisSeller&scm=1007.13339.128551.0&scm_id=1007.13339.128551.0&scm-url=1007.13339.128551.0&pvid=03b111e1-c9d7-4a03-ab64-2812788c354f
07:28 PM _unreal_: wish I had a 3d printer
07:28 PM _unreal_: https://www.stlfinder.com/model/cnc-30406040-flipup-dust-shoe/4869836
07:29 PM flyback: https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/rutger-hauer-dead-blade-runner
07:41 PM _unreal_: ?
07:41 PM _unreal_: so quiet
07:41 PM _unreal_: time for more beer
07:41 PM perry_j1987: that sounds good right about now
07:42 PM _unreal_: perry_j1987, sup
07:42 PM perry_j1987: waiting for them to do this thing https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqUSRBJPYUE
07:42 PM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1D35kqiMnAK0GH_AaEDkLZkmSJAxKPVKH
07:43 PM perry_j1987: is that that melamine hardboard?
07:44 PM t4nk_freenode: _unreal_, ... both standby engine and port engine are off!
07:45 PM _unreal_: thats fuel selector for 2 fuel tanks
07:45 PM _unreal_: perry_j1987, yes
07:45 PM flyback: IT WENT POO POO ON THE LAUNCHPAD
07:45 PM flyback: oh noes
07:45 PM perry_j1987: how do you plan to seal it from humidity
07:47 PM perry_j1987: they had a screen overlay with some info but now its gone hmm
07:48 PM perry_j1987: ah test aborted
07:49 PM t4nk_freenode: there's an oil leak I see ;)
07:50 PM perry_j1987: isnt there something where they have to keep filling right up till they are ready to launch
07:52 PM t4nk_freenode: I presume you mean tranquilizer pills, since it's private and all
08:29 PM perry_j1987: so these adjustable dies
08:29 PM perry_j1987: i've never had one before
08:30 PM perry_j1987: i want to make some threads that are real snug
10:10 PM roycroft: if you want tight, acccurate threads use a single point tool, not a die
10:11 PM roycroft: dies are generally better for thread chasing than thread cutting
10:20 PM Elmo40: some dies are adjustable (oh so slightly)
10:20 PM Elmo40: depending on the holder
10:21 PM Elmo40: a pointed set screw will sit in the slit of a die and expand it a few thou. this will give an overall larger diameter to the thread.
10:22 PM Elmo40: for much better control you should be using a single point tool (triangle cutter)
10:22 PM Elmo40: that way you have full control over all aspects. maj dia. min dia. pitch.... etc