#linuxcnc Logs

Jun 12 2019

02:36 AM Loetmichel: maan, are the "political correct" ones in the US as bad as in germany? Coworker just asked how to get rid of car paint, so i answered "angle grinder and 'negerkeks' ('negro buiscuit')... had to google to show him a pic of that... first ten links i found was from people who ranted over that name, being political incorrect. Hillarious.
05:14 AM Tom_L: morning
05:41 AM jthornton: morning
07:12 AM Tom_L: bit of rain overnite
07:15 AM jthornton: nothing here
07:15 AM jthornton: building a kernel makes 110,432 files... make a few of those and your hard drive fills up lol
07:16 AM Tom_L: did you notice seb's buildbot debug directions he posted?
07:16 AM Tom_L: kinda got hidden in the buildbot messages
07:18 AM Tom_L: for ubuntu19?
07:18 AM jthornton: no, I missed that
07:37 AM Loetmichel: jthornton: remember the times when a kernel fitted on a floppy disk?
07:54 AM jthornton: I remember DOS...
07:55 AM Loetmichel: i meant a linux kernel
08:22 AM perry_j1987: morning
08:25 AM perry_j1987: everybody got their coffee yet?
09:17 AM miss0r2: bah... just got an axle back from getting splines cut... The machinist managed to cut the wrong splines
09:19 AM perry_j1987: ouch
09:27 AM Loetmichel: miss0r2: ouch
09:27 AM Loetmichel: and now?
09:27 AM Loetmichel: new axle?
09:27 AM miss0r2: yeah
09:27 AM miss0r2: I'll turn a new one tonight
09:27 AM miss0r2: then he will get it for cutting the external and internal splines & then send it to hardening again
09:27 AM miss0r2: after which it has to be ground
09:28 AM miss0r2: bah.
09:28 AM miss0r2: This will set me back three weeks
09:31 AM perry_j1987: i need a bit of a point in the right direction please. i have a whb04b-4 (which is 4axis version the -6 is 6 axis version of same thing far as i can tell) so i need to use this to get it going? what/where does this stuff go lolhttps://github.com/rubienr/machinekit/tree/feature-xhc-whb04b-6/src/hal/user_comps/xhc-whb04b-6
09:31 AM miss0r2: anyway. I should get started on dinner. see you around
09:39 AM cerna: I would be probably better to try it first within that repository code. (Then change it to support 4 axis device and then port it to LinuxCNC.)
10:06 AM perry_j1987: doesnt look like anybody has one of these working
10:13 AM Tom_L: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Using_A_XHC-HB04_Wireless_MPG_Pendant
10:14 AM Tom_L: older article
10:15 AM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/man/man1/xhc-hb04.1.html
10:19 AM perry_j1987: thats a different one
10:19 AM perry_j1987: this one has id 10ce eb93
10:19 AM perry_j1987: eb93 instead of eb70
10:19 AM Tom_L: may be a starting point though
10:20 AM perry_j1987: aye i've been pouring through it all morning
10:20 AM perry_j1987: next up is figuring out spindle control now
10:45 AM gloops: perry_j1987 did you sort the wiring out for the axis bob?
10:46 AM perry_j1987: getting there
10:46 AM perry_j1987: i got movement
10:46 AM perry_j1987: working on spindle stuff now
10:47 AM perry_j1987: the bob has pwm to analog converter 0-10v
10:47 AM perry_j1987: i got that hooked up to the vfd
10:48 AM gloops: yeah the pwm sends 0-10v to the vfd - where did the 12-24v supply go?
10:49 AM gloops: (just curious i might be needing that board one day)
11:32 AM Deejay: hi
11:50 AM perry_j1987: there we go got the spindle able to turn on and off with linuxcnc now :)
11:50 AM perry_j1987: its a bit chuggy though
11:50 AM perry_j1987: now to diagnose that
11:51 AM gloops: chuggy hmm, dodgy connection a good bet
11:55 AM perry_j1987: aand fixed
11:55 AM perry_j1987: pwm frequency was off
11:55 AM perry_j1987: heh
11:55 AM perry_j1987: the board takes pwm freq and has a pwm to analog voltage converter for the 0-10v
11:56 AM perry_j1987: got spindle working, got movement, got homing setup correctly
11:57 AM perry_j1987: need to verify steps per mm are dead on
11:57 AM perry_j1987: life would be much better if my mpg worked with linuxcnc
11:58 AM gloops: any pics of the machine perry_j1987?
11:58 AM jthornton: sounds like your making progress
12:01 PM perry_j1987: ya
12:02 PM perry_j1987: when i bought this 6040 i made sure it had the "good" control box with real vfd instead of the open torroid and allinone controller/stepper driver board
12:02 PM perry_j1987: this one has individual stepper drivers -those black box with heatsink kind
12:02 PM perry_j1987: 24v psu, a vfd and now a parallel breakout board
12:02 PM gloops: best way
12:03 PM gloops: flexibility
12:03 PM perry_j1987: anyone want to buy this old wxhc mkx-iv usb controller? :P
12:04 PM jthornton: lol
12:05 PM perry_j1987: its shiny...
12:05 PM perry_j1987: heh
12:06 PM perry_j1987: so since i dont have a working mpg pendant now
12:06 PM perry_j1987: i need to learn that gui panel thing eh and add some jog buttons to the sidebar
12:06 PM jthornton: all the gui's should have jog buttons, which one did you pick?
12:07 PM perry_j1987: axis
12:07 PM perry_j1987: i see increment selectors but only way to jog is keyboard keys
12:07 PM perry_j1987: i dont know the keyboard key to jog the 4th axis
12:09 PM perry_j1987: wait
12:09 PM perry_j1987: im an idiot
12:09 PM perry_j1987: i just now spotted the - / + button
12:09 PM perry_j1987: haha
12:10 PM jthornton: it gets better all the time
12:12 PM perry_j1987: so apparently this vfd speaks serial
12:13 PM perry_j1987: i could hook it up and enable serial coms on it to get some feedback to linuxcnc
12:15 PM perry_j1987: at what point do i stop hooking up new things and start using the machine again haha
12:20 PM gloops: wondering if these are as crap as they look https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4pc-Mortice-Drill-Tool-Set-6-10-13-16mm-Chisels-In-Wood-Box-Woodworking-TE66/141343098641
12:23 PM gloops: (the woodworking quality on the rails in the box doesnt give me much confidence lol)
12:25 PM perry_j1987: heh
12:28 PM perry_j1987: so now that i've switched this mill to linuxcnc i've gained incresed rigidity and more z height and rainbows and unicorns in abundance eh? :P
12:32 PM gloops: no..you still have a formula 4 car, but at least youve got a formula 1 driver in it now
12:34 PM JT-Shop: gloops: you have to buy 3 and pick the best and throw away the rest
12:35 PM gloops: 3 might not be enough to get 1 good one lol
12:36 PM gloops: nah, ill sharpen my old ones up first, gone rusty unused for 5 years maybe
12:38 PM skunkworks: perry_j1987: yay!
01:05 PM perry_j1987: now to setup postprocessors
01:13 PM * jthornton almost went to the industrial park to do some work then realized the time and said screw it
01:16 PM perry_j1987: lol
01:16 PM jthornton: I have a sick hen so kinda watching her
01:21 PM miss0r2: 'evening
01:23 PM jthornton: yo
01:27 PM perry_j1987: so what is a good homing speed
01:28 PM gloops: search - slow, latch - v.slow
01:28 PM pcw_mesa: its proportional to how much you trust your home switches...
01:28 PM jthornton: and the design of your homing switches...
01:29 PM perry_j1987: i have these on min/max of each axis https://www.newark.com/omron-industrial-automation/tl-w5mc1/inductive-proximity-sensor/dp/27M2898
01:29 PM pcw_mesa: and whatever vice/etc you have forgotten to removed from the table
01:30 PM perry_j1987: right now i can go get coffee while it homes heh
01:31 PM miss0r2: so; little or no trust in your swicthes :D
01:32 PM jdh: pricey switches
01:32 PM jthornton: pcw_mesa: 4.4.179-rt181 seems to have decent latency on the J1900 ~40us
01:33 PM perry_j1987: thats just with the default stepconf gave
01:34 PM pcw_mesa: Not bad, I did not mess too much with the J1900 once it was good enough for Ethernet/PCI
01:34 PM jthornton: lol built so many kernels I got tired and made a bash script to unpack and patch the kernel
01:35 PM perry_j1987: they came with the machine jdh
01:35 PM miss0r2: perry_j1987: Are you doing apreach or roll by with those switches?
01:35 PM jthornton: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/CMbJFgdcWm/
01:35 PM perry_j1987: right now i just have whatever teh default stepconf does
01:36 PM jthornton: if you run it as a source you end up in the patched directory
01:36 PM miss0r2: i mean: should the machine fail to read the switches; would it collide with them or would it just move past?
01:36 PM gloops: if you have physical stops on the end of the rails, a quicker search velocity wont hurt anything with a smaller stepper machine
01:37 PM gloops: so long as it finishes slow
01:38 PM pcw_mesa: I just cleaned up some older kernel build droppings, the 5.x kernels use more than 10 GB to build
01:38 PM perry_j1987: it would collide with them but the machine has nema23 steppers
01:38 PM perry_j1987: its just a 6040
01:38 PM miss0r2: you know - with those types of switches, you get higher accuracy aproaching from from the side(drive by)
01:39 PM perry_j1987: they were preinstalled on the 6040
01:39 PM miss0r2: never mind me then :)
01:43 PM gloops: well, easy enough to swap the switches if they dont turn out to be satisfactory, roller lever switches are cheap
01:52 PM perry_j1987: no issues with the switces
01:53 PM perry_j1987: just wondering what everybody else is using for search velocity
01:53 PM jdh: got pics of switch mounting?
01:54 PM jdh: I just jog my 6040 until the steppers whine then hit Home
01:57 PM perry_j1987: https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/OTkzWDgwMA==/z/bSoAAOSwonVc53Kl/$_10.JPG?set_id=880000500F
01:59 PM perry_j1987: like that
01:59 PM gloops: HOME_SEARCH_VEL = 30
01:59 PM gloops: HOME_LATCH_VEL = 1.500000
01:59 PM gloops: HOME_SEQUENCE = 3
02:00 PM gloops: i always remember to jog close to home before parking
02:00 PM gloops: sometimes
02:01 PM gloops: (as cant jog before homed again)
02:04 PM perry_j1987: ty
02:04 PM perry_j1987: ya 30 seems a nice speed
02:04 PM perry_j1987: 1.5 for search vel was excruciating haha
02:05 PM gloops: search is only to find the switch, it doesnt have any bearing on final home accuracy
02:06 PM gloops: so long as you arent thrashing straight the switch and off the end, or into something solid - small steppers will just miss steps if they do, should damage the machine
02:06 PM gloops: straight through
02:07 PM gloops: shouldnt damage the machine!
02:07 PM perry_j1987: aye
02:26 PM perry_j1987: there we go cut the demo gcode in some mdf heh
02:30 PM Tom_L: what's up gloops?
02:33 PM gloops: hi Tom_L - nothing much, been too busy to think about cnc but i am definitely finished work this week and getting straight back to it heh
02:33 PM Tom_L: figured you may have started another cnc build by now
02:34 PM perry_j1987: so far this bob seems good
02:38 PM gloops: well i promised the wife i wouldnt start anything else until the router was making money, im going to do a 4 axis wood lathe lathe and a 15 watt laser, it will make money
02:39 PM SpeedEvil: It's a shame it's gotten a lot harder to make money now that coins are less useful.
02:40 PM gloops: ive also been buying up old pewter ash trays from charity shops
02:40 PM SpeedEvil: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Retractable-Plastic-Holders-ClipSelizo-Keychain/dp/B07JQKQHJ5 - on a sort of related topic.
02:40 PM gloops: talking of making coins
02:40 PM SpeedEvil: I'm copying one of these, and replacing with two facing coins on the outside.
02:41 PM SpeedEvil: Trying to work out if I'm being more ambitious than just using lightly modded guts.
02:42 PM SpeedEvil: (i find it useful for a key+knife+tiny torch worn most of the time)
02:45 PM andypugh: gloops: And what do you intend to do with pewter ash-trays? And is it cheaper than buying pewter ingots?
02:46 PM gloops: andypugh i only recently discovered pewter would melt in an old iron pan on an electric cooker, i then thought - i can make aluminium molds for this on the router, although i havent really thought about molds for what yet
02:46 PM XXCoder: just be careful with lead in that alloy if its old alloy
02:47 PM XXCoder: dont use pans you cook food in
02:47 PM gloops: yes probably cheaper to buy pewter ingots, ashtrays go from 50pence to a couple of £s
02:49 PM gloops: XXCoder funny the variation in colours from what passes as pewter
02:49 PM andypugh: XXCoder: THere hasn’t been lead in pewter for a long time.
02:50 PM andypugh: (and I mean a UK version of “a long time” :-)
02:50 PM andypugh: gloops: Dod you see my pewtering video?
02:50 PM gloops: some of which could be oxidisation - been in different environments for ages etc
02:51 PM gloops: andypugh no i havent seen it, have you been doing some casting?
02:51 PM XXCoder: not sure how long usa made lead pewler illegal for new stuff
02:51 PM XXCoder: and how long before its legal again.
02:51 PM XXCoder: usa is regressing hard.
02:51 PM andypugh: gloops: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSOyh4JrluI
02:52 PM XXCoder: laters
02:58 PM gloops: haha - 'its not great for the carpet'
02:59 PM gloops: have to say that is very nice work andypugh, and really good narration
03:00 PM gloops: can remember you showing the 3d printed chuck jaws
03:04 PM Deejay: gn8
03:14 PM Tom_L: andypugh where do you get the glass?
03:15 PM andypugh: A local glass company who are very inaccurate with their water-jet
03:15 PM Tom_L: maybe i should watch it with sound
03:16 PM DaViruz: 2mm tolerance is ridiculous
03:16 PM DaViruz: maybe it's some old paper template following deal
03:20 PM Tom_L: do you have to preheat the mold when you pour it?
03:21 PM Tom_L: nm
03:25 PM DaViruz: that screw-actuated syringe squeezer was nice.
03:56 PM andypugh: DaViruz: Found it on Thingiverse
03:57 PM Tom_L: andypugh, nice video
04:52 PM skunkworks: andypugh: https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/gear-hobbing-servo-stepper-motor-365058/index4.html#post3370462
04:52 PM skunkworks: going to use a plc for more accuracy...
04:56 PM andypugh: It’s a fair comment about the roatary. I changed that to a harmonic drive (no videos of hobbing with that yet)
04:57 PM skunkworks: sure
04:57 PM andypugh: You might want to tell him that linuxCNC is working in double-precision floating-point throughout and that is almost certainly far more accurate than a PLC.
04:57 PM skunkworks: Thanks - I didn't have the terms to compare :)
05:02 PM skunkworks: andypugh: https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/gear-hobbing-servo-stepper-motor-365058/index4.html#post3370475
05:27 PM jthornton: usually a PLC max number is 32,767
05:28 PM jthornton: newer ones prob go a lot higher
05:29 PM perry_j1987: 10 pc endmills off amazon several of them came broken in sealed container lol
05:30 PM jthornton: yea I don't buy memory, off brand tools from amazon
05:30 PM jthornton: but a click plc does have a double word int-2,147,483,648 to 2,147,483,647
05:31 PM Tom_L: they're just pre'broken cause they just know you
05:31 PM jthornton: and a floating point -3.4028235E+38 to 3.4028235E+38
05:31 PM jthornton: lol
05:33 PM Tom_L: i waited on an ebay bid and missed it, didn't sell, reposted it and meant to make an offer and dammit! i forgot again
05:33 PM Tom_L: and now it's gone
05:34 PM perry_j1987: lol
05:34 PM perry_j1987: it did save me alot of time having them pre-broken
05:34 PM Tom_L: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Niagra-cutter-4-flute-radius-end-mill-14240-3-16-R/143279150285?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
05:34 PM Tom_L: that was a bargain
05:36 PM JT-Shop: Tom_L: guess what, it don't get better the older you get
05:36 PM Tom_L: good to know
05:37 PM Tom_L: i probably didn't need it that bad anyway
05:37 PM JT-Shop: memory?
05:37 PM Tom_L: huh? what memory?
05:37 PM Tom_L: ... the cutter
05:37 PM perry_j1987: i figured he meant "many"
05:37 PM JT-Shop: and dammit! i forgot again
05:37 PM JT-Shop: <Tom_L> and now it's gone
05:38 PM perry_j1987: so do you guys have good success with the feeds and speeds fusion360 sets up
05:39 PM Tom_L: they're about eighty bux to buy
05:39 PM Tom_L: no, i don't use it
05:39 PM JT-Shop: don't use it
05:39 PM Tom_L: i've come up with my own for aluminum and steel for my cad cam
05:39 PM Tom_L: since i have limited spindle power
05:40 PM perry_j1987: lots of speed on this 2.2kw spindle but no low speed torque available
05:41 PM skunkworks: perry_j1987: what is your mill?
05:41 PM perry_j1987: its a 6040
05:42 PM perry_j1987: its on the nicer end of the chinese 6040s though
05:42 PM skunkworks: solder ratio?
05:42 PM skunkworks: ;)
05:43 PM skunkworks: In my many dreams - I wanted to by 20 of those machines and create a 'cnc' class where people bought them and I tought them..
05:43 PM skunkworks: To get people into cnc..
05:43 PM Tom_L: like ich
05:43 PM perry_j1987: its a nice size
05:44 PM skunkworks: sure :)
05:44 PM perry_j1987: have a spoilboard in one part, rotary axis down one side and 3in milling vise in one corner
05:44 PM skunkworks: What is the work are?
05:44 PM skunkworks: area?
05:44 PM perry_j1987: 6040
05:44 PM perry_j1987: 600mm x 400mm
05:44 PM skunkworks: heh - I think 6040 as the aluminum extrusion...
05:48 PM perry_j1987: if your doing a boring op with endmills
05:48 PM perry_j1987: that the shank is same size as the flutes.
05:48 PM perry_j1987: if you add pecking to clear chips do you need an endmill with loc equal to the depth your going
05:49 PM Tom_L: it's a good idea
05:49 PM perry_j1987: its hard to find ones with 20mm flutes and 1/8 shank
05:49 PM perry_j1987: want to put some holes in this 20mm thick plate
05:50 PM Tom_L: why not use a drill?
05:50 PM jthornton: yea drills are for holes not end mills
05:50 PM Tom_L: oh you have one of those bazillion rpm spindles...
05:50 PM Tom_L: may just melt the drill
05:50 PM perry_j1987: i dont have a tool changer and i cant go slow enough for drills
05:51 PM Tom_L: with that said, i always buy centercuting endmills
05:53 PM jthornton: better use carbide tools if your sfm is too high for hss
05:53 PM skunkworks: smaller mills and helical usually works better...
05:54 PM skunkworks: better chip control
05:54 PM perry_j1987: ya i've been doing helical boring with fusion360
05:56 PM skunkworks: (plus you can adjust the size..
05:56 PM skunkworks: )
06:01 PM perry_j1987: i need to do some tests see if it can return to a point after homing repeatably now
06:02 PM _unreal_: where is pink vampire?
06:02 PM _unreal_: have not seen her in some time
06:03 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.amerimoldexpo.com/ had lots of tooling vendors
06:06 PM perry_j1987: that looks fun CaptHindsight
06:28 PM * jthornton is building kernels via ssh
06:28 PM jthornton: or so I thought it just errored out
06:30 PM * SpeedEvil is having bad ideas about gearboxes.
06:30 PM SpeedEvil: involving a belt being pressed onto either of two driving gears and precisely controlled motor speed.
06:37 PM sync: wut
06:57 PM SpeedEvil: I need to draw it out properly.
08:34 PM elmo40: is anything in linuxcnc using python 2.7?
08:35 PM elmo40: every update gives me a message about it being unsupported after Jan 2020
08:37 PM CaptHindsight: elmo40: all of it :)
08:55 PM skunkworks: andypugh: oh well... https://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/gear-hobbing-servo-stepper-motor-365058/index4.html#post3370512
09:08 PM Tom_L: you weren't gonna change anybody's mind
09:31 PM skunkworks: nope
09:32 PM skunkworks: Practial machinist in general looks down on pc based controls.
09:33 PM skunkworks: If you can't afford a 'real' control - you are doing something wrong.
09:33 PM Tom_L: what _do_ they typically use?
09:33 PM tiwake: what?
09:33 PM Tom_L: manual or other?
09:33 PM skunkworks: fanuc, simons.. the big guys
09:33 PM tiwake: Tom_L: mechanical CNC machine
09:34 PM Tom_L: not really hobyists then
09:34 PM Tom_L: sp
09:34 PM tiwake: skunkworks: which are all regular computers these days
09:34 PM skunkworks: don't tell them that..
09:35 PM skunkworks: I think mach3 put a really bad taste in peoples mouths... (for pc based controls)
09:35 PM Tom_L: my bud had one (he didn't keep long) that had a windows interface on the control
09:35 PM Tom_L: i don't remember what kind it was
09:35 PM Tom_L: 'too hard to set up' is hogwash
09:36 PM Tom_L: they're just being lazy
09:36 PM skunkworks: we have a couple centroid machines at work.. Hardware based motion + windows interface.
09:36 PM skunkworks: Like the acorn.
09:37 PM skunkworks: and we have a early 90's based fanuc.. all hardware based :)
09:38 PM skunkworks: they think pc based and think - it is going to crash.
09:38 PM Tom_L: stereotype
09:38 PM skunkworks: (I don't think I have ever had linuxcnc crash except for a hd failure.. watchdog tripped and the machine e-stopped...
09:39 PM Tom_L: i was gonna say... mine has never done anything i didn't tell it to do
09:39 PM Tom_L: there have been a couple operator errors though
09:43 PM Tom_L: industrial controls probably use industrial rated electronics which you may not get on your average pc board
09:43 PM Tom_L: higher temp rating etc
09:51 PM skunkworks: sure
09:51 PM skunkworks: And sure - I have made some bad mistakes.. :)
10:05 PM _unreal_: My cnc machine is working
10:05 PM _unreal_: have not cut anything with it but I'm doing a number of dry runs
10:12 PM Tom_L: pics
10:14 PM _unreal_: uploading photos and a quick video now
10:16 PM _unreal_: This is an original photo when I was first bilding it https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipN0PJNIhsdLWV0suLwifby3I7DUetpdpmPybMvaWq6HqrDBZEGqSNDdCal_4F3BjA?key=NHdNaE52MDJwQWVvaWlXREJ3bkg5MUxYMm1rNmh3
10:17 PM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=15tjhpzQkalWp29tSFoDaeWcDHsDJvknt
10:17 PM _unreal_: https://drive.google.com/open?id=15tK5I1T_QqM3vimRwk99PR2kqfb2yVuv
10:17 PM _unreal_: ?
10:19 PM CaptHindsight: hose with hose clamps for motor couplings
10:20 PM _unreal_: yep
10:20 PM _unreal_: its high pressure hose
10:21 PM _unreal_: I've noticed I getting better steps when the motors have heated up for a while. that hose does not flex well
10:21 PM _unreal_: but it does do a good job for taking the slight off sets
10:34 PM _unreal_: ?
10:40 PM _unreal_: finally it uploaded https://drive.google.com/open?id=16BwqsGQD6SHrqEYF13xzd6wHt-vgPZhW