#linuxcnc Logs

Apr 16 2019

#linuxcnc Calendar

01:51 AM Deejay: moin
03:23 AM Loetmichel: Elmo40: i havent noticed any more soot buildup
03:43 AM tiwake: anyone use a chip compactor before?
03:52 AM syyl: i have seen them on tradeshows
03:52 AM syyl: guess that makes me an expert ;)
04:18 AM tiwake: syyl: heh... I have too
04:18 AM tiwake: https://www.ruf-briquetter.com/briquette-press
04:32 AM Loetmichel: any germans here that happen to know what happened to auracher lasertechnik? just wanted to inquire about a GP10050 Gantry mill: website is on sedoparking???
05:02 AM jthornton: morning
05:02 AM SpeedEvil: Loetmichel: you do know about archive.org?
05:11 AM Loetmichel: SpeedEvil: archive org dosent help with getting a qoute for a machine
05:11 AM SpeedEvil: ah
05:12 AM SpeedEvil: I read the original question as 'want to ask a question' - not of themanufacturer
05:12 AM Loetmichel: the GP10050 is a small gantry mill made from 8mm sheet steel
05:13 AM Loetmichel: not from alu ;)
05:13 AM Loetmichel: and the owner of that "auracher lasertechnik" company made desinged and made kits to built said gantry mill for a german CNC forum
05:13 AM Loetmichel: "peters CNC ecke"
05:14 AM Loetmichel: but the whole company seemed to have disappeared sadly
05:14 AM Loetmichel: thats why i asked
05:16 AM Loetmichel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1v-BJtBknM <- that thing may be a small gantry machine but its by no way "wobbly" like the usual chinese routers
05:16 AM Loetmichel: if you know what i mean ;)
05:17 AM Loetmichel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrsGiQa0VWw
05:25 AM Tom_L: morning
05:46 AM jthornton: morning
05:47 AM gregcnc: the birbs woke me up
10:27 AM Ralith is now known as Ralith_
11:29 AM Joe_Hildreth: Hello all.
11:37 AM Rab: Hi, Joe!
11:42 AM pink_vampire: hi
11:52 AM TurBoss: pong
11:52 AM lcvette99: im logged in on freenode
11:52 AM TurBoss: you may need to sen the identify command to nickserv
11:52 AM TurBoss: no
11:56 AM Lcvette: hello
11:56 AM Lcvette: :D
11:56 AM Lcvette: hurray!
12:18 PM skunkworks: ping
12:19 PM Deejay: pong
12:20 PM gregcnc: Shhhhh
12:21 PM pink_vampire: ????/
12:31 PM skunkworks: pink_vampire: did you see the rigid tapping?
12:31 PM pink_vampire: no
12:32 PM skunkworks: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5HIPuC52p4
12:32 PM skunkworks: sorry about the crappy video - it is about 2:40ish
12:33 PM pink_vampire: your spindle is much faster then mine
12:34 PM pink_vampire: look amazing!
12:34 PM skunkworks: it is a little 750watt 6800rpm motor with 2 pully ranges. 10krpm and 4400rpm irrc
12:34 PM skunkworks: iirc
12:35 PM skunkworks: that was 2000rpm in low range
12:36 PM pink_vampire: the motor here is 3500 rpm with 1:3 pully, so i can get more torque
12:36 PM pink_vampire: the lpt can't drive it faster then 100 rpm
12:36 PM skunkworks: how are you driving it?
12:36 PM pink_vampire: g320X
12:37 PM skunkworks: oh. step/dir?
12:37 PM pink_vampire: yes
12:38 PM Joe_Hildreth: When adding a PP card to a computer for use with LCNC ... doing a lspci and the card shows up as serial, does this mean that the card will not work with LCNC or are there other options to explore fro using the card?
12:39 PM skunkworks: I think it might show up as serial...
12:39 PM skunkworks: some cards do
12:39 PM Joe_Hildreth: I am guessing that the chipset is some sort of serial to parallel converter that is utilized by a driver?
12:39 PM Joe_Hildreth: LCNC requires the port to be a real parallel interface, correct?
12:39 PM Rab: Joe_Hildreth, correct.
12:40 PM Rab: Joe_Hildreth, what's under /dev for the card?
12:40 PM Rab: And what's the exact info from lspci?
12:41 PM Joe_Hildreth: I ask because I need to do a followup on a tutorial I made about the parallel port. I ASS/U/MEd that a PP card was a PP card. It wasn't until I started getting feedback from users that this isn't the case.
12:42 PM Rab: Yeah, there are some inferior PP cards that I guess are just a USB-to-LPT bridge on a card.
12:42 PM Joe_Hildreth: Sorry Rab, I cannot answer those questions as all the PP add on cards I have show up as a Parallel port when I lspci.
12:43 PM Rab: Joe_Hildreth, I see.
12:44 PM Joe_Hildreth: I feel like I need to clarify the issue with another tutorial. I googled quite a while, and it looks like the chipset that the system identifies as serial controller instead of a parallel port are all an issue for LCNC. I just wanted to verify before I stuck my foot in my mouth or something.
12:45 PM Rab: The ExpressCard bus in laptops presents a similar problem. ExpressCard exposes both PCI Express and USB buses, and many (or most) EC printer port cards just use the USB side.
12:45 PM miss0r: 'evening
12:45 PM Joe_Hildreth: I cannot find evidence to prove my theory, but I am thinking these cards contain a serial to parallel converter and the driver (if using windows) shifts the data out serially to the card for the card to shift it back to parallel.
12:45 PM Rab: It seems very unusual for such an adapter to identify itself as a serial controller. Have you asked your users for more information?
12:46 PM Joe_Hildreth: Yes, let me see if I still have the related emails. brb
12:47 PM pink_vampire: skunkworks: did you saw that? https://imgur.com/a/P3GxRAO
12:48 PM Joe_Hildreth: ok, chipset was a WCH CH382L, lspci output as follows ...
12:48 PM Joe_Hildreth: 03:00.0 Serial controller: Device 1c00:3250 (rev 10) (prog-if 05 [16850]) Subsystem: Device 1c00:3250 Control: I/O+ Mem+ BusMaster- SpecCycle- MemWINV- VGASnoop- ParErr- Stepping- SERR- FastB2B- DisINTx- Status: Cap+ 66MHz- UDF- FastB2B- ParErr- DEVSEL=fast >TAbort- <TAbort- <MAbort- >SERR- <PERR- INTx- Interrupt: pin A routed to IRQ 19 Region 0: I/O ports at cc00 [size=256] Region 1: Memory at fdbf8000
12:48 PM Joe_Hildreth: Sorry, should formatted the a little bit
12:48 PM Joe_Hildreth: 03:00.0 Serial controller: Device 1c00:3250 (rev 10) (prog-if 05 [16850])
12:48 PM Rab: http://www.sybausa.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=869
12:49 PM Rab: weird
12:49 PM Rab: lsusb might provide another piece of the picture.
12:50 PM Rab: Joe_Hildreth, have you seen this page? http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?WCH
12:50 PM pink_vampire: lspci - v
12:51 PM pink_vampire: for mor info you can add one more "v"
12:51 PM pink_vampire: lspci -vv
12:52 PM pink_vampire: Joe_Hildreth: ^
12:52 PM Rab: It does seem like it provides a true parallel port, but it might be challenging to use under Linux.
12:52 PM Joe_Hildreth: Rab, it might but this was correspondence from July and the user purchased a different card.
12:53 PM Joe_Hildreth: I saw that oage a while back while helping the user.
12:54 PM Joe_Hildreth: So is there a definitive list of PP cards (chipsets) that work, or is it a potential crap shoot when some one finds a card to use in their computer.
12:54 PM pink_vampire: Joe_Hildreth: I'm using the cheapest one from ebay
12:54 PM pink_vampire: i have 2 PP port
12:55 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, when you lspci it shows as a parallel port, correct? No serial nonsense?
12:55 PM Joe_Hildreth: I have 4 addon cards, but they are all startech
12:56 PM pink_vampire: i'm also see it as serial
12:56 PM Rab: Looks like a lot of the chips include both parallel and serial interfaces.
12:56 PM pink_vampire: cat /proc/ioports
12:57 PM Joe_Hildreth: Your card shows up as serial? Does you card enumerate a port? /dev/parport# or /dev/lp#
12:57 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire ^^
12:57 PM pink_vampire: let me see
12:58 PM pink_vampire: yes
12:58 PM pink_vampire: i have parpor0 ans parport1
12:58 PM pink_vampire: and*
12:59 PM skunkworks: pink_vampire: Nice - homing working?
12:59 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, when you run lspci -v, does it also show the parallel port in addition to serial, or does it only identify it as serial?
12:59 PM Rab: Joe_Hildreth, see PCI and PCIe Parallel Port Cards (perhaps you already have): http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?LinuxCNC_Supported_Hardware
12:59 PM pink_vampire: skunkworks: 99% of the times,
12:59 PM pink_vampire: only identifay as serial
01:01 PM Joe_Hildreth: Thanks Rab, I have seen this page, but only a few PP cards are listed.
01:01 PM pink_vampire: what pp card do you have?
01:01 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, interesting.
01:02 PM pink_vampire: but the card is lpt / serial combo
01:02 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, my machine uses a startech card. I have never had issues with them.
01:02 PM Rab: Joe_Hildreth, welcome to Linux hardware compatibility. There's a lot of crap hardware out there.
01:03 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, what OS, Wheezy or something different on your box?
01:03 PM Rab: It used to be you had a choice of, like, two sound cards. The situation is somewhat better these days.
01:03 PM Joe_Hildreth: Rab, I want to put out an addendum to this video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6B3X6XIcU0&list=PLaamliiI72ntlrHKIFjh2VjmehRGgZpjm&index=11&t=0s
01:03 PM skunkworks: pink_vampire: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYzwPdAdqyk
01:04 PM Joe_Hildreth: I just don't want to mislead anyone, and yes you are correct Rab, there is a lot of junk out there.
01:05 PM pink_vampire: Joe_Hildreth: this is the card i have, there is a pci version and there is a pci-e version, I'm not sure what i got there https://www.ebay.com/itm/323778482581
01:06 PM pink_vampire: skunkworks: very nice, I just made mine for the initial homing, my true reference is the datum on the table.
01:07 PM pink_vampire: Joe_Hildreth: I'm using debian wheezy (7??)
01:10 PM gregcnc: pink you probe teh table?
01:10 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, thanks for the information. So it appears that a card may show up as a serial card if it is a multi-port card (serial/parallel) but the system will enumerate it. The card the user bought was a single PP card with chipset WCH CH382L showed up as serial but did not enumerate.
01:11 PM pink_vampire: I think so, yeah
01:11 PM Joe_Hildreth: I guess I will give them some information on how to use lspci, and warn them that not all pp adapters are the same.
01:12 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, one more question. When you set your machine up to use your card, did you use stepconf? And if so, did you use the enumerated port or the port address?
01:12 PM pink_vampire: all you need to care is about the address in cat /proc/ioports | grep -i par
01:12 PM pink_vampire: not sure it was in 2014
01:13 PM pink_vampire: i think it was stepconf but with the address from cat / proc...
01:14 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, I agree, but the card he used did not enumerate and did not show in /proc/ioports. It was like the system only saw the card as a serial port. Thank is what made me think that there was some bit shifting being controlled by the driver or something. Where Linux only sees a true parallel port.
01:15 PM pink_vampire: https://youtu.be/r6B3X6XIcU0?list=PLaamliiI72ntlrHKIFjh2VjmehRGgZpjm&t=1014
01:15 PM pink_vampire: it is show
01:17 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, I am confused. What are you telling me with the video link?
01:34 PM pink_vampire: Joe_Hildreth: it is show how to find the ports numbers
01:36 PM Joe_Hildreth: pink_vampire, that is my video. :-)
01:36 PM pink_vampire: oh, ok
01:37 PM pink_vampire: so, what is your question?
01:40 PM gregcnc: she was trying to help you by giving a link to a video, not knowing it was yours
01:41 PM gregcnc: pink what does referencing the table mean?
01:48 PM pink_vampire: the ruby datum on the tool setter is the point that i take to get the x y z zero to locate stuff on the table, this way i can probe it each time, and just save those numbers, I'm not counting on the limit swithes to be with very good repeatability
01:49 PM gregcnc: no index on your encoders?
01:50 PM pink_vampire: i have index
01:50 PM gregcnc: you can use that for precise homing
01:51 PM pink_vampire: how?
01:51 PM gregcnc: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/config/ini-homing.html#_home_use_index
01:52 PM gregcnc: first it finds the limit switch, the you can tell it which direction to look for the first index signal
01:52 PM pink_vampire: so i need to useit with the limit switch?
01:53 PM pink_vampire: interesting!
01:55 PM gregcnc: this is a normal setup for a machine were you want to use repeatable work/tool offsets and be able to shut down
01:56 PM pink_vampire: how do i take the signal from the AMT-102 and connect it in to the c10?
01:57 PM gregcnc: c10?
01:57 PM pink_vampire: the BOB
01:57 PM gregcnc: i think wire is best?
01:57 PM gregcnc: what do you mean?
01:57 PM pink_vampire: ol yeah, but i have only one wire for the index and the C10 need 2
01:58 PM gregcnc: probably ground as well.
01:58 PM pink_vampire: the 5V for the encoder come from the 72V
01:58 PM gregcnc: you may need to pay attention there
01:58 PM pink_vampire: yeah..
01:58 PM gregcnc: I did it on mesa
01:59 PM pink_vampire: it is on my list...
01:59 PM pink_vampire: also the bipod..
01:59 PM gregcnc: i saw a maslo on CL locally
01:59 PM pink_vampire: CL?
01:59 PM gregcnc: craigslist
01:59 PM pink_vampire: link?
02:00 PM gregcnc: still up https://indianapolis.craigslist.org/tls/d/carmel-maslow-cnc-machine-axis-motor/6842961354.html
02:00 PM gregcnc: i guess it's within 200 miles of me, not so local
02:02 PM gregcnc: so many lathes and mills on CL, spring cleaning time
02:02 PM pink_vampire: I'm in NY
02:02 PM pink_vampire: nothing here
02:07 PM Tom_L: ?
02:07 PM Tom_L: surel NY has something
02:07 PM pink_vampire: I need tool holders
02:07 PM gregcnc: ebay for tool holders
02:07 PM Tom_L: maybe your buddies in NJ have some
02:08 PM gregcnc: probably illegal in NY
02:08 PM Tom_L: no that's CA
02:08 PM Tom_L: unless it's drugs
02:08 PM gregcnc: NY is not far behind and we are close in IL
02:09 PM Tom_L: i was behind a vehicle today that was doubling their travel distance going down the road
02:10 PM Tom_L: drove on the rumble strips on the side for quite a while
02:11 PM Tom_L: then went over to check out the ones on the other side
02:13 PM gregcnc: here everyone is on their phone
02:14 PM Tom_L: pretty sure this was drug induced
02:16 PM * SpeedEvil wonders what pressure you need to spray good cheddar at room temperature.
02:17 PM gregcnc: sounds like a good YT video
02:18 PM toxx: hi there
02:18 PM toxx: i have a quiet odd 20 year old stepper driver
02:18 PM toxx: its driven by parallel port
02:18 PM toxx: for 3 axess
02:19 PM toxx: but it has only one pin directions
02:19 PM toxx: it's used for all 3 axes
02:20 PM pink_vampire: what is the model of it?
02:20 PM toxx: i wonder if i can drive it with linuxcnc?
02:20 PM pink_vampire: and pictures? data?
02:20 PM gregcnc: for what stepper drivers cost today most would just replace it
02:20 PM pink_vampire: maybe it is step up/ step down
02:21 PM toxx: its german based HSE 0001, lm297/298 2A
02:21 PM Rab: A classic combo. I'm sure it would work.
02:22 PM Rab: toxx, does it have CW/CCW inputs?
02:22 PM pink_vampire: trace pin 17 and 18 on the L297
02:22 PM toxx: thats what i mean, there is only one pin dedicated to cw/ccw
02:22 PM pink_vampire: https://i.stack.imgur.com/aKyKm.jpg
02:23 PM Rab: toxx, one pin each?
02:23 PM pink_vampire: yes, this is how it is done
02:23 PM toxx: the electronic chart schows a connection from this pin to all 3 lm297 dir pins
02:23 PM pink_vampire: maybe there is chip select
02:24 PM pink_vampire: pin 10 on the l297 is enable
02:24 PM toxx: it was used by a certan dos based software, pcdreh
02:24 PM pink_vampire: trace where pin 10 on the L297 go
02:25 PM toxx: maybe its time related
02:25 PM gregcnc: was it capable of moving more than one axis at a time?
02:25 PM toxx: ok, one moment
02:26 PM toxx: pin 10 is set to VCC
02:27 PM pink_vampire: do you have 3 pairs of l297/l298?
02:28 PM toxx: yes
02:29 PM pink_vampire: there is other chips on the board?
02:29 PM toxx: just some schmitt trigger
02:30 PM pink_vampire: do you have a schematic of the board?
02:30 PM toxx: and vref is somehow triggerd by clock
02:31 PM toxx: i do have the schematics, but cant take a picture right now
02:31 PM pink_vampire: ok, that can help
02:32 PM toxx: give me some minutes
02:37 PM gregcnc: https://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php?topic=5750.0
02:46 PM toxx: sorry, can't take a picture of the schematics
02:47 PM gregcnc: who made the controller ?
02:47 PM pink_vampire: according to the pdf in the post that gregcnc, you need to hack it abit
02:48 PM toxx: which pdf?
02:48 PM pink_vampire: https://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=1lu0m7jkb4th3970ido9slt6g2&action=dlattach;topic=5750.0;attach=4415
02:49 PM toxx: exactly, i have this document
02:49 PM gregcnc: is it optimum?
02:49 PM toxx: no, wabeco from 1999
02:50 PM pink_vampire: if i was you, i was just cut some traces and get some wires out, and make it normal step/dir controller similar to that https://i.stack.imgur.com/aKyKm.jpg
02:52 PM toxx: yes, i thougt about it
02:53 PM toxx: but some old folks are related to the DOS software :)
02:53 PM miss0r: ... When every part of your project goes as planned.. and as you are standing there afterwards looking at the product, you realize you ground a 50degree included angle for a 55degree thread form... !
02:54 PM toxx: anyhow, could it be done by sequential driving the axes, with some us of delay to each other?
02:54 PM pink_vampire: hope for you the part is not scrap
02:55 PM miss0r: pink_vampire: Luckily its for myself (four shouldered screws for mounting my engine to an engine stand).. Tomorrow I will know
02:57 PM toxx: it depends of how linuxcnc pushes the signals, but this maybe could be controlled by HAL?
02:58 PM gregcnc: you'd have to know what the controller is expecting
03:00 PM toxx: you mean in timing manner?
03:03 PM pink_vampire: you need to know what "protocol" it is use
03:03 PM toxx: my question is: is it possible to send step pulses of the 3 axes in sequenz?
03:04 PM miss0r: hmm.. living in a metric contry I think it will be hard to get a 3/8-24 allthread bar tomorrow...
03:04 PM toxx: then to each step pulse a direction pulse has to be send
03:04 PM gregcnc: that's what I mean. you have to know how to talk to it
03:05 PM pink_vampire: you need to make sure the board support 3 axis simultaneous
03:05 PM gregcnc: looking at pcdreh it does
03:06 PM toxx: think about 3 times lm287, one after another
03:08 PM toxx: i just don't know, if linuxcnc sends signals 100% in parallel or one after another
03:09 PM pink_vampire: I think in linux cnc the signals are parallel
03:09 PM toxx: could I delay them somehow by hal?
03:11 PM pink_vampire: http://www.mobasi.com/software/download.php
03:12 PM pink_vampire: maybe you just need to install pcdreh and watch the signals
03:13 PM toxx: yes, i just thought, maybe it's somehow a known problem
03:15 PM Rab: toxx, it would be preferable to rewire your controller to receive all signals in parallel.
03:16 PM toxx: you are right, that's the way to go
03:17 PM toxx: thanks, bye
03:42 PM SpeedEvil: Is anyone aware of any DIY float-glass attempts?
03:42 PM SpeedEvil: And yes, I'm aware this is a silly idea.
03:45 PM pink_vampire: https://youtu.be/ig4G5WbOMLc look abit above hobby level stuff
03:45 PM SpeedEvil: :)
04:02 PM Deejay: gn8
04:31 PM Lcvette: logs
04:48 PM Jin^eLD is now known as Jin|away