#linuxcnc Logs
Mar 03 2019
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:00 AM pink_vampire: the hdd is ok?
12:04 AM XXCoder: gloops: buy 8 gb SSD
12:04 AM XXCoder: its maybe 10 bucks? and plenty of room for linuxcnc
12:04 AM gloops: well, thats the dilemna, i booted the drive on another PC - it ran and got to enter password stage - thats fine i thought and left it
12:04 AM gloops: but then about 30 minutes later i did try entering passowrd - it froze, wont boot at all now lol
12:04 AM pink_vampire: the hdd spin?
12:05 AM gloops: so, i got a spare drive on this 64 bit PC, i can download stretch iso and see if i can get linuxcnc working on it - i have got the configs backed up from the old one
12:05 AM pink_vampire: it will take clonezilla some time to go make if there is a problem with the disk
12:06 AM pink_vampire: so in that case, just go fresh
12:06 AM gloops: i think it would be worth it in the long run
12:06 AM XXCoder: probably
12:07 AM pink_vampire: but after all it is a cnc machine, not a gaming computer, so..
12:07 AM gloops: i think getting the config right last time traumatised me so much it put me off that aspect of things, it has been a year though lol, im ready again
12:08 AM pink_vampire: if you dont have more then 4gb of ram or 64bit cpu' 32 bit will be just fine
12:08 AM gloops: it did work fine on 32 bit
12:08 AM pink_vampire: the computer is 64 bit?
12:09 AM gloops: the original dead one was 32 bit
12:09 AM pink_vampire: the new one
12:09 AM gloops: are you using 64 bit for your cnc?
12:09 AM pink_vampire: no idea
12:10 AM gloops: oh, i havent bought i new one yet, - im going to see if i can get linuxcnc working on my home 64 bit pc first
12:11 AM gloops: i dont need the machine for a couple of weeks anyway
12:12 AM pink_vampire: rtai-686
12:12 AM pink_vampire: so i have 32 bit
12:14 AM gloops: yeah, well mine worked fine on that, ive looked around on ebay and such for old XP era PCs, not much atm
12:14 AM gloops: whereas loads of 64 bit newer ones going cheap
12:18 AM gloops: http://www.linuxcnc.org/testing-stretch-rtpreempt/
12:19 AM gloops: so whats the different between those isos?
12:19 AM pink_vampire: revision 12 or 13
12:19 AM XXCoder: im not 100% sure but my pc is 64 bit, but I sued 32 bit iso worked fine?
12:19 AM pink_vampire: 64bit and 32bit
12:20 AM pink_vampire: http://www.linuxcnc.org/testing-stretch-rtpreempt/linuxcnc-stretch-uspace-amd64-r13.iso
12:20 AM pink_vampire: revision 13 64bit
12:21 AM gloops: far as ive been told XXCoder, wheezy has problems with later hardware on 64 bit machines
12:21 AM XXCoder: hmm ok
12:21 AM gloops: oh i just thought of something else, newer PCs - no parport
12:21 AM gloops: lol
12:22 AM pink_vampire: time for mesa card lol
12:22 AM gloops: right thanks pink
12:22 AM XXCoder: can buy parallel port card if nesscary
12:22 AM gloops: mesa would take me 6 months to get running lol
12:23 AM XXCoder: my linuxcnc pc has added parallel port card
12:23 AM pink_vampire: same here
12:23 AM gloops: any old cheap parport card?
12:23 AM gloops: someone was saying you need a quality one
12:23 AM XXCoder: specific tpe is better, but its cheap anyway
12:23 AM pink_vampire: mmm maybe just use GRBL (joke)
12:24 AM gloops: hmm, decisions decisions
12:24 AM XXCoder: forgot what its called. google "whats good parallel card for linuxcnc"
12:24 AM pink_vampire: on the pc that i'm using i have 2 lpt cards from ebay the cheapest you can get
12:25 AM pink_vampire: it was a PAIN to make them work
12:25 AM XXCoder: "best" one would allow some stuff to work but I didnt need it but got it for in case heh
12:25 AM XXCoder: in order to get basic working Ithink nearly any would work
12:25 AM pink_vampire: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Adapter-Card-Parallel-Port-IEEE-Printer-PCI-Controller-Black-16-Byte-FIFO-EPP/192844595126?hash=item2ce66effb6:g:4RAAAOSwXlpcezpG:rk:5:pf:0
12:25 AM pink_vampire: those
12:26 AM XXCoder: think mine can support 2 parallel ports for more pins?
12:26 AM gloops: hmm, well ill keep my eye out for a decent 32 bit while playing with stretch install, i.e hold off buying a newer PC until i have to
12:26 AM pink_vampire: what cpu do you have?
12:27 AM gloops: and then go through the parport card hell
12:27 AM pink_vampire: and what ram?
12:27 AM pink_vampire: you just need a mother board?
12:27 AM gloops: pink_vampire - no idea, i bought this pc plugged it in and started chatting one night - let me see
12:28 AM gloops: intel i5 i think
12:28 AM pink_vampire: there is a service tag on it?
12:30 AM gloops: cant see anything about the chip (that i can read)
12:30 AM pink_vampire: on every dell computer there is a "service tag"
12:30 AM gloops: do i need to know to know which version of stretch to install?
12:32 AM pink_vampire: http://www.linuxcnc.org/testing-stretch-rtpreempt/linuxcnc-stretch-uspace-amd64-r13.iso
12:32 AM pink_vampire: the newest
12:33 AM pink_vampire: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Dell-Optiplex-380-Desktop-Motherboard-HN7XN-0HN7XN-Socket-775-System-Board/192629772429?epid=1408045495&hash=item2cd9a1108d:g:wugAAOSwzINb4VXY:rk:79:pf:0
12:33 AM gloops: intel (R) Core (TM) i5 3.47 GHz
12:34 AM pink_vampire: but it was in a dell computer
12:34 AM pink_vampire: so you need the dell motherboard
12:34 AM gloops: oh the OLD chip
12:35 AM pink_vampire: https://i1.wp.com/accatech.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Dell-Service-tag-for-optiplex-380.jpg?w=512&ssl=1
12:35 AM gloops: assuming its the motherboard thats gone, i thought of that
12:35 AM pink_vampire: do you have a sticker like that on the computer?
12:35 AM gloops: its dell 745
12:36 AM pink_vampire: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Dell-OptiPlex-745-0RF703-RF703-Sockel-775-M5127/272314987446?hash=item3f673cf3b6:g:Z2EAAOSwX~dWtKXW:rk:1:pf:0
12:38 AM pink_vampire: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Dell-OPTIPLEX-980-SFF-LGA-1156-DDR3-Motherboard-Systemboard-w-IO-Shield-C522T/332182521577?epid=127372753&hash=item4d579f06e9:g:340AAOSww3tY78PH:rk:1:pf:0
12:38 AM gloops: service tag 7KW1T2J
12:38 AM pink_vampire: gloops: are you sure is was Dell OPTIPLEX 745?
12:39 AM gloops: yes - well it says that on the top of the case anyway
12:42 AM pink_vampire: https://www.dell.com/support/home/us/en/04/product-support/servicetag/7kw1t2j/configuration
12:42 AM pink_vampire: dell show nothing about the parts
12:43 AM XXCoder: dell often changes parts for same model #
12:43 AM XXCoder: you'd have to look up serial to get specific details.
12:45 AM gloops: it is something to consider, id probably rather spend £30 on a running oldster though
12:46 AM pink_vampire: there is 4 types of Dell™ OptiPlex™ 745
12:46 AM gloops: ive got an emachine that can take 4 gig ram, 32 bit, but it has onboard graphics card
12:46 AM pink_vampire: https://downloads.dell.com/manuals/all-products/esuprt_desktop/esuprt_optiplex_desktop/optiplex-745_user%27s%20guide_en-us.pdf
12:46 AM pink_vampire: look at the top
12:47 AM pink_vampire: do you know what type it is?
12:47 AM XXCoder: just disable onboard gpu and add a card
12:47 AM XXCoder: older gaming card would do fine.
12:48 AM gloops: mine is the dell optiplex 745 mini tower
12:48 AM gloops: XXCoder disabling the onboard card not a big thing in wheezy?
12:48 AM XXCoder: its bios thing not os thing
12:48 AM gloops: k that is one option then
12:49 AM gloops: i could have that running today maybe
12:49 AM pink_vampire: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Dell-Optiplex-745-SFF-Motherboard-WK833-WF810-GX297-CY944-KY238-TY565-/272636992465
12:49 AM pink_vampire: this one?
12:49 AM XXCoder: both my main pc and linuxcnc pc has onboard and both has it disabled and have much better gpu card installed.
12:49 AM Wolf__: just throw a geforce 2080 in it
12:50 AM gloops: looks very similar pink_vampire
12:51 AM gloops: ive got half a dozen old cards i can fit
12:51 AM pink_vampire: are you sure is was have i5?
12:52 AM gloops: no the dell wasnt i5
12:52 AM gloops: my home pc 64 bit is i5, i thought thats what you were asking originally
12:52 AM pink_vampire: do you know what cpu / socket the dell was?
12:53 AM gloops: no idea on that
12:53 AM gloops: someone did suggest re-seating the cpu - as a common fix
12:53 AM gloops: not sure what that would do
12:54 AM pink_vampire: sound like something that is very easy to do
12:54 AM pink_vampire: just take the cpu off the socket, clean and put it back with fresh thermal paste
12:55 AM gloops: i might try it, i didnt spend too much time on it last night
12:55 AM pink_vampire: "brand new" dell optiplex 745 sff cost 50$
12:55 AM XXCoder: might need some ipa love if its dirty'
12:55 AM XXCoder: canned air cleanup then some ipa if needed
12:55 AM gloops: ive gt 4 old PCs - time passes plugging in, starting up, switching down, swapping bits, try again lol
12:56 AM gloops: XXCoder that was immediate thought - dust, but its looks very clean inside, to say its been at side of router
12:56 AM XXCoder: have smoker been using it?
12:56 AM XXCoder: also was there alum dust?
12:57 AM gloops: the air intake is completely housed to the cpu heat sink - even that looks clean
12:57 AM XXCoder: should be ok
12:57 AM pink_vampire: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dell-Optiplex-745-SFF-Core-2-Duo-Processor-Windows-7-Home-Premium-160GB-HDD/233144882054?hash=item3648849386:g:sjUAAOSwWUBcRZHi:rk:1:pf:1
12:57 AM gloops: ahh, there has been welding smoke
12:57 AM XXCoder: i dont know if the weld smoke is conductive
12:58 AM gloops: i am watching that already pink_vampire lol
12:58 AM pink_vampire: lol!
12:58 AM XXCoder: normal dust is not, smoker dust and "dust" are, so are alum dust
12:58 AM XXCoder: never smoke by your pc, pc gets "cancer" of conductive dust and sticky stuff thats also conductive
12:59 AM gloops: wasnt sure if that dell on ebay was 64 bit
12:59 AM pink_vampire: gloops: link?
12:59 AM XXCoder: heh i still remember telling one guy i helped that sorry pc died by smoke
12:59 AM gloops: the one you just posted pink_vampire
01:00 AM XXCoder: inside was... messy. it was also glitching and I managed to get files off it before it died
01:01 AM pink_vampire: it is 775 socket, so yeah it is 64 bit,
01:01 AM pink_vampire: same socket that i have
01:02 AM pink_vampire: you can put a Q cpu there
01:02 AM gloops: and you are running wheezy on that?
01:02 AM pink_vampire: correct
01:04 AM gloops: well theres 9 hours to go with that pc, so if no solution by then, ill buy it
01:04 AM pink_vampire: get any Core 2 Quad and it will run much faster
01:05 AM gloops: in the meantime i think ill have an hour playing with this e-machine see what its up for
01:12 AM pink_vampire: did you had some special configurations on it?
01:14 AM pink_vampire: I'm sure it is not that bad
01:14 AM gloops: attempting re-seating of chip on original computer, the old thermal paste looks dry and sketchy, but its clean all round
01:15 AM pink_vampire: what cpu is that?
01:30 AM gloops: oh wow....
01:30 AM gloops: its on haha
01:30 AM pink_vampire: copy the files first!
01:31 AM gloops: i dont believe that, took chip out, took ram out, re-fitted all, its running
01:31 AM gloops: it was dead!
01:31 AM gloops: no hard drive connected
01:31 AM XXCoder: might be minor corrosion and you cleaned it by reseating
01:31 AM pink_vampire: or chips
01:31 AM XXCoder: and yeah copy all crap off it now
01:31 AM Wolf__: higher level of turn it off and back on again
01:31 AM gloops: someone suggested doing that yesterday i just didnt see the point
01:32 AM XXCoder: or maybe its very fine alum powder. same thing killed my nook simple touch. thats why my kindle paperwhite 2 is in dustproof and waterproof case
01:33 AM pink_vampire: Wolf__: LOL
01:33 AM XXCoder: 4 years no problems (besides case itself rubber trim getting rotten by corrosive chemicals at work)
01:33 AM gloops: possible, i have been drilling alu, maybe some grinding
01:33 AM XXCoder: maybe canned air would help clear it more
01:34 AM XXCoder: there is special high air flow filters you should use. we use em on all intakes for all cnc machines.
01:34 AM XXCoder: looks like huge blue tipped white hair mat
01:34 AM XXCoder: 2 inches thick
01:34 AM pink_vampire: XXCoder: filters added to my list
01:35 AM Wolf__: my pos car broke down just from water leaking in the sunroof and leaving mineral deposits on one of the under dash connectors, all connections are a possible fail point
01:35 AM gloops: yes i need to relocate the computer relative to the machine too, it is kinda sucking it straight in lol, although as i said - no noteable dust inside
01:35 AM Wolf__: have had a dirty connector take down my plasma machine as well, just unplugged everything and plugged it all back in and working again
01:36 AM XXCoder: 006 Dinou Cadillacs and Dinosaurs
01:36 AM XXCoder: paste fail
01:36 AM XXCoder: http://viewer.zmags.com/publication/249750e2#/249750e2/1
01:36 AM gloops: ill try the linuxcnc drive after this tea
01:36 AM XXCoder: see blue rolls on leftmost? thats what im talking about
01:36 AM XXCoder: you cut em to fit
01:37 AM XXCoder: you ad vecro square around vent it'll stick to it (hooks side not loops end)
01:37 AM XXCoder: im sure theres cheaper ones you dont have to buy entire roll.
01:38 AM Wolf__: could just diy a positive pressure box for the electronics with a hepa filter on the intake
01:38 AM XXCoder: 75 bucks for 90 feet lol way too much. https://www.airfilterhub.com/products/90-roll-1-thick-polyester-filter-media-blue-white-environet-hvac-furnace-blue-white
01:39 AM XXCoder: Wolf__: thats what a61 at work use. still has those filters in input, no reason to stress inside hepa filters.
01:39 AM Wolf__: cheap way would be using a vacuum cleaner filter
01:40 AM Wolf__: small panel filter would do
01:42 AM XXCoder: ehh probably though that limits air flow
01:42 AM XXCoder: those is quite high flow
01:42 AM XXCoder: im sure can find smaller amounts somewhere lol
01:44 AM Wolf__: not like you are trying to inflate the box, just need little bit of positive pressure
01:45 AM XXCoder: most of machines at work dont use postive pressure
01:46 AM XXCoder: just normal air inlet fans etc
01:46 AM XXCoder: so those sheets is pretty important. they change sheets once a year or faster
01:46 AM Wolf__: in to a semi sealed box?
01:46 AM XXCoder: a61 is only postive air pressure system that has entire computer including montior in case
01:47 AM XXCoder: it also has massive power system to stay on for hours even after blackout.
01:50 AM XXCoder: https://www.amazon.com/inTank-Aquarium-Pond-Value-600-square-inches/dp/B00B50UPE0/ 13 bucks for 600 sqrt in
01:52 AM CaptHindsight: keep fish out of the PC case
01:52 AM XXCoder: lol
01:54 AM gloops: linuxcnc drive not being found..hmm
01:54 AM gloops: theres a good chance i killed the drive post removing from the computer, where it was still probably working, which is unfortunate
01:54 AM XXCoder: did yiu clean connectors?
01:55 AM gloops: yeah i just cleaned them, it did seem to be working on a different pc yesterday
01:55 AM gloops: ill keep playing
02:34 AM Deejay: moin
03:35 AM _abc_: Beep. Hello, I am looking at the usual Chinese engravers which run for $400-1200 online. Some come with a pendant some are PC connected. Do these use the same cable? Can the pendant cable be connected to a parallel port? I have access to a pendant-only one and am interested in the pinout etc, to convert it to PC, sometimes it is useful to use it with a proper PC setup.
03:41 AM _abc_: [related] is there any info on .cn engraver connection to linuxcnc on the linuxcnc site? In the wiki etc?
03:41 AM XXCoder: hey
03:41 AM XXCoder: not too sure though common is usb I think
03:42 AM XXCoder: you'd have to make sure it is parallel type, though for fairly cheap you can convert it to MESA and throw junk drivers etc included in it.
03:42 AM XXCoder: jthornton id man to ask if youre interested.
03:42 AM XXCoder: think he'll be in in 30 minutes maybe or a hour
03:44 AM XXCoder: its fairly large upgrade for bit over hundred bucks i think would be well worth it if youre looking to make production machine.
04:04 AM _abc_: I said "parallel or pendant". Pendants are equipped with a paralell-like looking cable where the connector is non standard vs D-SUB parallel and also have power from the machine routed to them. Probably a Centronics like pinout, this is what I want to find out.
04:05 AM _abc_: I am not making anything a machine exists it has a pendant it will "grow" a pc connection connected where the pendant is connected now, hopefully.
04:05 AM _abc_: Thanks for the input XXCoder
04:05 AM jthornton: morning
04:06 AM XXCoder: no plm
04:06 AM XXCoder: hey jt youre here :)
04:06 AM XXCoder: ya cqan use another parallel card for more pins
04:07 AM XXCoder: though mesa exposes many pons likely enough
04:07 AM XXCoder: jthornton: ya know more heh
04:07 AM _abc_: What are you on about XXCoder I explained what I am after? Not talking to me?
04:08 AM XXCoder: yeah using nonstandard connector you cant tpo reverse engineer or buy for
04:08 AM XXCoder: er can to
04:08 AM XXCoder: bleh cant type
04:08 AM _abc_: Yes so is there info on this cable pinout on chinese engravers? Is it Centronics like as I assumed? Is there a vague standard everyone copies?
04:10 AM XXCoder: good question, chinese stuff can be strange
04:10 AM XXCoder: it could be "almost" that standard
04:10 AM _abc_: I know. But I am asking from people who actually know?...
04:11 AM jthornton: yea you can have a second parallel port on a pci or pcie
04:11 AM _abc_: Are you people talking to me or not please?
04:11 AM XXCoder: i am jt definitely are
04:12 AM _abc_: So what second parallel port?! I never said anything about that.
04:12 AM XXCoder: jthornton: i kinda misunderstood his question, hes trying to see if he could use pendants come with china machines
04:12 AM XXCoder: _abc_: my fault
04:12 AM jthornton: oh
04:12 AM _abc_: jthornton: XXCoder said you are more expert than he is in.
04:12 AM _abc_: And you misunderstood twice over. There's a .cn engraver with a pendant which I would like to occasionally connect to a pc instead of the pendant
04:13 AM _abc_: The cable to the pendant looks centronics like with non standard non SUB-D connector.
04:13 AM _abc_: Is it correct to assume that as a starting point for a reversing of the cable?
04:13 AM _abc_: Is there any info on such cables online perhaps in the linuxcnc wiki? Or forum posts?
04:13 AM _abc_: I was unable to find something like that so far
04:14 AM XXCoder: it might be unique
04:14 AM XXCoder: which is unfortuate
04:14 AM jthornton: I'm not familiar with that cable
04:14 AM _abc_: Well nobody is, but they're "the" cable these things use.
04:14 AM jthornton: you might have to ring it out to see what is connected where
04:14 AM jthornton: got a link to it?
04:15 AM XXCoder: reverse engineering fun
04:15 AM _abc_: No link and it is an older generation one, no pics online of that.
04:15 AM _abc_: Just the usual desktop engraver with pendant control.
04:15 AM XXCoder: you already have machine you own? or considering to buy>?
04:16 AM _abc_: XXCoder: at this point, I am going to point you at the backlog. Seriously.
04:16 AM XXCoder: you said you were looking at online machines which tend to have pictures
04:16 AM XXCoder: then you said its older one thats not pictured
04:16 AM XXCoder: *ones on sale online
04:17 AM Wolf__: wtf is a .cn engraver
04:19 AM jthornton: yikes I better plug the water heater back in it's going to be 13°F tonight... can't have frozen chicken nipples
04:19 AM XXCoder: lol
04:20 AM XXCoder: _abc_: honestly your best bet probably is try find more standard ones, or just reverse engineer it.
04:20 AM XXCoder: it depends on your skills. im pretty sure youre good
04:21 AM _abc_: Wolf__: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DANIU-Mini-CNC-2418-Engraving-Machine-3axis-Pcb-Milling-Machine-Metal-Wood-Carving-Machine-Cnc-Router/32866093514.html
04:21 AM _abc_: not that particular model
04:21 AM _abc_: (which seems to be missing a bracket on the X motor in that pic?!)
04:21 AM jthornton: http://gnipsel.com/images/chickens/waterer/water-stand02.jpg
04:21 AM XXCoder: not seeing any pendant?
04:22 AM _abc_: Which part of "not that particular model" did you not see? Also it was for Wolf__ since he asked which mill.
04:23 AM _abc_: https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.pinterest.com/cncidea/cnc-controller-mpg/&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwi-mZ-X3-XgAhWj3OAKHWeSB8c4KBDBbgg1MBA&usg=AOvVaw2gX8AnlZCkI4C0h7zFogJo this is close, I can't open pinterest links , it is blacklisted here due to intrusive logging / tracking.
04:23 AM _abc_: https://www.pinterest.com/cncidea/cnc-controller-mpg ?
04:23 AM _abc_: Note the thick non USB cable
04:23 AM pink_vampire: _abc_: any mill is better then no mill, but that piece of junk that you send is not even close to be a mill
04:24 AM _abc_: I did not ask for comments on the mill.
04:24 AM XXCoder: p[ininterest hates direct link to one picture lemme rip one picture and upload it elsewhere
04:24 AM Wolf__: like 16 pendants on that page
04:24 AM * jthornton hates pinterest
04:24 AM pink_vampire: lol yeah
04:24 AM pink_vampire: i hate it also
04:25 AM * _abc_ boycotts all pinterest links including in search results, manually for now.
04:25 AM _abc_: Also it is blacklisted and raises a tracking/redirect flag when I try to open a link on it.
04:25 AM XXCoder: https://pasteboard.co/I3H1aFg.jpg ?
04:25 AM jthornton: yea when I google search I add -pinterest.com
04:26 AM jthornton: pink_vampire: https://imagebin.ca/v/4Yu8X09iLNky
04:26 AM _abc_: you can use imgbb.co it is hassle free for now and works well from phones
04:26 AM XXCoder: eh first picture paste site i found heh
04:26 AM _abc_: XXCoder: yes that is more or less "it" but the pendant side connector is not a D-SUB on mine.
04:26 AM XXCoder: anyway ot it correct one? closest match to your discription
04:27 AM _abc_: And it is not my mill so I need info and not do excessive surgery on it.
04:27 AM _abc_: Yes close match.
04:27 AM _abc_: The controlled of this is in a proper metal cabinet, not a bare board.
04:27 AM Wolf__: is it just a interface or full control
04:27 AM _abc_: Full control, PC less
04:28 AM _abc_: There's a USB port on the pendant, one connects it to PC to upload gcode
04:28 AM XXCoder: Wolf__: if its that small machine with similiar board, it'd be similiar board as 3d printer, it usually has firmware like say Martin or something
04:28 AM _abc_: So this is the "old generation" of PC-less mill control pendants.
04:28 AM XXCoder: *like that machine
04:28 AM _abc_: Martin? What is Martin?
04:28 AM XXCoder: but im likely wrong
04:29 AM XXCoder: its related to mill not pendant
04:29 AM _abc_: XXCoder: the machine is not as small as the one pictured but the same class.
04:29 AM Wolf__: https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Argedo-3-4-5-Axis-DSP-Manual-CNC-Controller-Pendant-Offline-Motion-Control-System-125-KHz/402081_32869590602.html?channel=pinterest
04:29 AM XXCoder: ya
04:29 AM _abc_: XXCoder: there is no cpu in the controller. The brains are in the pendant.
04:29 AM _abc_: So what is "Martin" you referred to just now?
04:30 AM XXCoder: oh its controller firmware for 3d printer usualluy and current (not older) cheap cnc routers tend to use those
04:30 AM _abc_: Wolf__: your link is good but it shows a machine with a serial looking link to the pendant which clearly has a controller cpu in the black box.
04:30 AM Wolf__: that one I linked sounds more like it
04:30 AM _abc_: Wolf__: see above.
04:30 AM _abc_: Different variant.
04:30 AM XXCoder: thats why earlier when I misunderstood you, I suggested you to get MESA and rip those out. :) sorry
04:30 AM _abc_: XXCoder: so do you have a link to a "Martin" description/data on it?
04:31 AM XXCoder: sure a sec though nothing directly related to your question
04:31 AM Wolf__: marlin would be a arduino based thing kinda like GBRL controller
04:31 AM XXCoder: http://marlinfw.org/
04:31 AM pink_vampire: trick for align non critical stuff on a waste board: jog to the edge of the material you want to locate, drill hole, jog only the X or Y axis, drill one ore hole, use those holes as a guide for cup screws, now the cap screws act as a straight path that is dead on the axis you jog.
04:31 AM _abc_: Oh MARLIN. Ok, no that is not it.
04:31 AM _abc_: pink_vampire: old.
04:32 AM XXCoder: ohh dragon is docking now
04:32 AM _abc_: pink_vampire: one also needs location in the other axis, one more hole.
04:32 AM _abc_: pink_vampire: triangle
04:33 AM pink_vampire: yeah' i love it for foam pvc stuff
04:33 AM Wolf__: anyways, if there are actual stepper drivers in the box for the router you could break them out w/ a parallel bob and run it with linux cnc
04:33 AM _abc_: So, no data on the "standard" old style parallel cables used on these things? No info in the #linuxcnc hive mind? These mini engravers were the entry point for a lot of people into cnc.
04:34 AM XXCoder: most people here isnt hobbist cnc machinists
04:34 AM _abc_: Wolf__: I want to reverse the cable, the driver box contains a control board with optical separation and then servo drives, psu's, spindle VFD, cooling etc.
04:34 AM XXCoder: im at odd place of being both proffesional machinist and hobbyist lol im crazy.
04:34 AM _abc_: Wolf__: I assume the cable is pretty close to Centronics with some mods. I'm trying to find a pinout or someone who did this possibly here before.
04:35 AM Wolf__: usually these sorta things have no standards lol
04:36 AM _abc_: search for "aliexpress pendant offline motion control" brings up several links
04:37 AM _abc_: https://www.aliexpress.com/i/2036764231.html okay this is very close. Note the funny connector on the pendant.
04:37 AM _abc_: It's a MDX or such I forget what it is called
04:38 AM Wolf__: servo drive throws a whole new aspect of not simple parallel port in to the mix as well
04:38 AM pink_vampire: why do need a pendant for such a tiny machine??
04:38 AM _abc_: They're stepper servos Wolf__ dir and step input with enable, standard ones.
04:38 AM _abc_: pink_vampire: it came that way and it is used offline for simple engraving jobs so does not clog up a pc
04:38 AM Wolf__: then its not servo drive =D
04:38 AM _abc_: I just used the wrong words :)
04:39 AM _abc_: That link of mine shows a non optically sepaarted board imo. The one used in the real machine is separated.
04:39 AM XXCoder: ah thats printer port man old kind
04:40 AM _abc_: Dude. Look at the connector. Not printer port, perhaps centronics compatible, I assume.
04:40 AM XXCoder: on pendant itself yeah its old kind of printer connector
04:40 AM Wolf__: anyways then, if trying to take over control of the thing with linux cnc driving it, cheap parallel break out would be faster than trying to reverse engineer the thing
04:40 AM XXCoder: not parallel port
04:41 AM pink_vampire: _abc_: linux cnc need a computer, what hardware do you have?
04:41 AM _abc_: XXCoder: it's the same connector on pendant and board. Enlarge picture.
04:41 AM _abc_: pink_vampire: that side is sorted, we have already running linuxnc pcs
04:41 AM XXCoder: looking now. lets see of i can find it. its quite old, dating from 80s to early 90s. parallel port replaced it
04:41 AM XXCoder: befre 80s also I think
04:41 AM jthornton: pink_vampire: did you see the probing tab?
04:42 AM _abc_: It's not quite old it's in the Centronics standard.
04:42 AM XXCoder: https://p.globalsources.com/IMAGES/PDT/B0865387683/POS-thermal-printer.jpg
04:42 AM _abc_: nope
04:42 AM XXCoder: directly googled the name. yeah some differences
04:43 AM pink_vampire: jthornton: did you post another one?
04:43 AM XXCoder: https://showmecables-static.scdn3.secure.raxcdn.com/media/catalog/product/cache/e4d64343b1bc593f1c5348fe05efa4a6/3/6/36-male-female.jpg
04:43 AM Wolf__: if its like the ali link, just pull the blue board (or equivalent) out and put in a https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32830611064.html
04:43 AM XXCoder: link fail
04:43 AM Wolf__: feed linux cnc and run it
04:43 AM jthornton: https://imagebin.ca/v/4Yu8X09iLNky
04:44 AM _abc_: https://www.cablestogo.com/learning/connector-guides/centronics see micro centronics 36
04:44 AM _abc_: Except this one is 50 I think
04:44 AM pink_vampire: I saw that - this is look AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!
04:44 AM _abc_: Wolf__: the mill box will not be modified, it has to be on the cables side
04:45 AM jthornton: pink_vampire: the pyvcp https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/MGjCpXHcHT/
04:45 AM _abc_: MDR connector is what that thing is called
04:45 AM XXCoder: _abc_: unfortunately seems not enough here tried that thing out
04:45 AM _abc_: ok
04:45 AM XXCoder: so you may well have to reverse enhineer it
04:46 AM _abc_: I had to ask heh. Yes I will.
04:47 AM XXCoder: i want pendant for my home cnc router lol
04:47 AM XXCoder: but probably not anytime soon, as no room to setup my machine :(
04:49 AM pink_vampire: jthornton: i need to finish some parts, and be done with the servo spindle' and then i will change stuff in the linux cnc interface
04:49 AM jthornton: ok, if you need help holler
04:49 AM Wolf__: I would just re wire the mill control box to make it a quick swap between the original control board or a parallel bob if it was me instead of wasting time messing with reverse engineering some odd proprietary thing
04:51 AM XXCoder: for anyone watching dragon dock, they just said go on dock
04:51 AM Wolf__: I still need to buy a extra pendant and send it to jthornton lol
04:51 AM _abc_: I would simply rewire a new cable to mate with a parallel port equipped pc already running linuxcnc and make a config for it.
04:51 AM pink_vampire: https://i.imgur.com/uBlBgPV.png
04:51 AM XXCoder: Wolf__: buy extra for me? ;)
04:51 AM pink_vampire: they need some gcode
04:51 AM _abc_: XXCoder: did they send an inflatable lady in that Ripley suit...
04:52 AM XXCoder: lol nh saw launch, it was full dummy looked heavy
04:52 AM XXCoder: had hook on head for moving around and dressing
04:52 AM XXCoder: removed for helmet
04:53 AM _abc_: Ahh. Only the best silicone and ballistic gel for our lonely men up there.
04:53 AM XXCoder: lol
04:53 AM Wolf__: XXCoder: only if you’re going to fix code in linux cnc for it =P
04:53 AM XXCoder: lol bleh my programming skill have seriously rusted.
04:54 AM Wolf__: I have no programming skills =/
04:54 AM XXCoder: if I saw car in "similiar" rust state I'd call it irrecoverable lol
04:54 AM _abc_: <new issue>I hacked a bit at the Axis ui, some buttons (homing mostly) are buried in menus and I needed them up on the ui. It seems there are several people who mod the ui in various ways. Is there a place/forum where they congregate and share their mods perhaps?
04:54 AM XXCoder: getting close to complete dock!
04:54 AM Wolf__: _abc_: that you may find a answer to in here, just not from me lol
04:55 AM XXCoder: thres new qtpytgx whatever thats spelled, looks to be MUCH easier to use, and theres new tutorial on it
04:55 AM XXCoder: i have yet to try it out
04:55 AM _abc_: Wolf__: link heh? :)
04:56 AM XXCoder: docked! amazing
04:58 AM _abc_: search for "linuxcnc forum wiki chinese mill parallel port" brings up several threads about 6040 (similar to what we have) mill conversions
05:00 AM Wolf__: I don’t have any links for UI stuff, haven’t yet poked at that stuff
05:01 AM _abc_: Does anyone know a controller board for parallel port with MDR connector for the pc side on it? Has a link to @?
05:05 AM Wolf__: nap time for me, guess later today I’ll tackle the wiring on my cnc that I have been putting off so I can finally get it moving around and dialed in lol
05:09 AM jthornton: for axis just add a pyvcp panel
05:09 AM _abc_: Hm?
05:10 AM _abc_: I modded the axis ui left panel where the normal buttons are. It works fine.
05:10 AM jthornton: the documents has examples as well as the forum
05:10 AM _abc_: Yes, but I am interested in discussing mods, etc. Is there a specific place where congregation occurs?
05:13 AM jthornton: the forum
05:16 AM _abc_: https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/shop-tools/1532098-bridgeport-boss-5-retrofit.html interesting teleype application!
05:17 AM XXCoder: lol tty indeed
05:18 AM _abc_: Those old cnc's used paper tape, amazing.
05:18 AM XXCoder: my mom owned big tank-like ones 2 of em
05:18 AM XXCoder: sadly my grandfather threw em away as my mon moved away
05:18 AM _abc_: I have ham radio friends who still refurbish and use those monsters.
05:18 AM _abc_: Sounds like there's a shooting war going on in the next room
05:18 AM XXCoder: i have much more modern one somewhere. 90s one, and unused since mid 2000s
05:19 AM XXCoder: lol
05:19 AM _abc_: Most people will use a computer for RTTY now but some few prefer the machine gun noise kind.
05:19 AM XXCoder: texting and videophone killed tty use
05:20 AM jthornton: but it would be easier to just build your perfect GUI than modding axis https://qtpyvcp.kcjengr.com/showcase/mill_vcps.html
05:20 AM XXCoder: I need to try that tutorial out
05:20 AM Deejay: syy__, your nick is broken
05:20 AM _abc_: Still the Brdigeport's innards look mint in that link. Very clean build and clealry the air filters worked over the years, usually it's totally messy inside after 30 years of dust oil fog and swarf
05:21 AM syy__: hu?
05:21 AM syy__: haha
05:21 AM syy__ is now known as syyl
05:21 AM XXCoder: jthornton: some of those restore videos is insane. way too much labor for tiny savings in money. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEjrh-Q40g4
05:21 AM XXCoder: enjoyable to watch in least lol
05:21 AM _abc_: jthornton: I just need a few more buttons moved (linked) from menus to the ui.
05:21 AM _abc_: XXCoder: I don't think they do it for money. It's love. OCD.
05:22 AM XXCoder: indeed
05:22 AM _abc_: jthornton: is there an intro to pyvcp api etc?
05:22 AM XXCoder: should be tutorial there
05:23 AM _abc_: I'll find it. Have other things on the menu for today.
05:23 AM jthornton: in the documents yes
05:24 AM XXCoder: man i cant get enough will to do anything. or i'd have finished writing vismach tutorial 100 years ago lol
05:28 AM _abc_: What type of axis servos would a Brdigeport like the one in the link have? https://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachments/shop-tools/2025826d1448868259-bridgeport-boss-5-retrofit-p7130065.jpg
05:28 AM _abc_: They look beefy, likely DC brushed? No?
05:29 AM _abc_: No, they are just steppers apparently.
05:34 AM gloops: finally! old pc running, new linuxcnc iso installed on brand new drive, now upgraded to 2.8
05:34 AM gloops: just the config to set up
05:35 AM XXCoder: :)
05:35 AM gloops: *just* the config haha
05:35 AM XXCoder: sucks that your hd crashed and burned
05:35 AM XXCoder: so its irrecoverable?
05:35 AM gloops: ive not spent that much time with the old one tbh, it wont boot on any of 3 PCs so..
05:36 AM XXCoder: dont try to boot it
05:36 AM XXCoder: add it as second drive
05:36 AM gloops: its not being found if i do that
05:36 AM XXCoder: if its stuck you might get away with constantly tapping hd spindle as its spinning
05:36 AM XXCoder: oh thats dead
05:36 AM XXCoder: yiu might be able to send it off to experts but eh money
05:37 AM gloops: well, theres nothing on it really old some gcode and configs, it was never on the net, never did anything else but cnc
05:37 AM XXCoder: should make backups
05:37 AM gloops: i backed up hal and ini but thats all
05:38 AM XXCoder: that helps yeah
05:38 AM gloops: should have saved all the files
05:38 AM XXCoder: yeah though having configs helps since it could be hard to do
05:38 AM gloops: but anyway, i did it before so i should be able to get it running again
05:41 AM XXCoder: yeah
05:46 AM _abc_: Whence does this rule come: “Never use a power supply voltage greater than 32 times the square-root of the motor inductance expressed in milli-Henries (mH)” -- found in the wiki
05:47 AM jthornton: somebody wrote it...
05:49 AM _abc_: no kidding.
05:49 AM _abc_: Monkeys? :)
05:49 AM jthornton: you would have to look at the bottom of the page
05:50 AM _abc_: I mean what about a cited source or the "rest" of this wisdom fountain.
05:50 AM fragalot: you are asking too much there
05:50 AM _abc_: Looks as arbitrary as anything, maybe result of several dozens of real life uses averaged?
05:50 AM _abc_: I am asking a legit question I think?
05:51 AM gloops: interesting that upgrading to 2.8 does update the existing 2.7 configs, i made a sample config before updating, it has been changed to 2.8 JOINT system
05:53 AM jthornton: yea when you run a configuration that has VERSION not equal to 1.1 the conversion script runs
05:53 AM _abc_: What if it is 1.1? No conversion?
05:55 AM jthornton: correct
05:55 AM _abc_: Does that mean that 1.1 settings are unchanged?
05:55 AM _abc_: In new versions?
05:55 AM jthornton: of course if you don't have the correct entries in the ini it won't run
05:56 AM _abc_: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Adding_Custom_MDI_Buttons this answers my MDI howto question from before. As an intro.
05:57 AM gloops: so, could have helped CNCBrian the other day, to upgrade, synaptic-other sources, check wheezy master-rt, add apt get line , return, mark linuxcnc to upgrade - apply
05:57 AM gloops: youre on 2.8
05:58 AM _abc_: 2.7.14 on wheezy iso is systemd-less?
05:59 AM gloops: im not a linux expert lol
06:01 AM _abc_: What's the current install/download size for custom install linuxcnc-uspace ?
06:04 AM rmu: _abc_: this rule is from gecko drive FAQ
06:04 AM _abc_: rmu: thanks. So is it gecko drive specific?
06:04 AM rmu: not really
06:05 AM rmu: but AFAIK it is a heuristic coming from microstepping and the mechanical resolution achievable with typical hybrid stepper motors (about 2000 positions or 10 microsteps)
06:06 AM rmu: but read yourself
06:06 AM XXCoder: jthornton: did I show you this link? https://www.aliexpress.com/item/0-25mm-0-01mm-Carbon-Steel-Outside-Micrometer-Caliper-Precision-Gauge-Vernier-Caliper-Measuring-Tools/32904069447.html
06:06 AM XXCoder: really funny
06:06 AM jthornton: yea saw that the other day, need to get a dozen of those C clamps
06:07 AM XXCoder: lol
06:07 AM XXCoder: likely as precise as c clamps also
06:14 AM whitequark: question, i have an FPGA board (of my own design) that's ideally suited for running the realtime parts of motor control
06:14 AM whitequark: is there some nice way to get linuxcnc to give me something like a servo command stream? just use it for motion planning
06:14 AM whitequark: i found http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?FPGA but it's ... sparse
06:24 AM rmu: whitequark: what kind of commands do you need?
06:25 AM rmu: whitequark: usually linuxcnc has one or two realtime threads that periodically execute functions from hal modules
06:26 AM whitequark: rmu: i'm thinking about starting with a fairly naive design, the usual three axis stepper gantry with no servo feedback
06:26 AM rmu: whitequark: so you would need position updates from the motion planner with e.g. 1kHz
06:27 AM whitequark: i would be fine with no realtime control at all, ie the motion planner giving me an infinite stream of "go here at this step rate at this monotonic timestamp"
06:27 AM whitequark: but that works as well
06:27 AM rmu: you would have to write a hal component that exposes whatever inputs you need as hal pins and talks to your hardware on the other side
06:27 AM whitequark: i can implement anything as long as linuxcnc can emit it
06:27 AM whitequark: removing all realtime control from the host system has the added benefit of using a completely stock kernel and bulk USB requests
06:28 AM rmu: i don't think that complete offline motion planning is possible at the moment, my experiments with jerk-less velocity profiles exposed some strange things the motion planner needs "just in time"
06:29 AM whitequark: this probably sounds very wrong to you but i've experimented extensively and with sufficient understanding of the USB stack i can do reliable realtime control over completely ordinary USB 2 bulk requests, not even isochronous. of course the safety features have to live inside the FPGA, but that's the easier way as well.
06:29 AM whitequark: hmm
06:30 AM jthornton: anyone know the url for the latest for some reason not released live dvd?
06:30 AM _abc_: Latest? 2.8 ?
06:31 AM jthornton: debian 9 I think
06:31 AM * Loetmichel just sends a coworker to burgerking, procuring lunch... MAAAN can there be ONE project finish in time please? i am pretty fed up with saturday and sunday work. :-(
06:32 AM _abc_: debian 9 is systemd
06:32 AM rmu: i don't have anything against USB, to me it looks like it could work just fine (SDRs, TV receivers and usb soundcards are a thing and those are latency-sensitive), it's just that nobody has done it yet ;)
06:32 AM _abc_: Loetmichel: you're working? I hope they pay overtime?
06:32 AM rmu: whitequark: are you whitequark from solvespace?
06:33 AM whitequark: rmu: yes
06:33 AM _abc_: white quark is such a common quantum physics concept. Now, pink quark... :)
06:33 AM whitequark: there's only one whitequark i know of :P
06:33 AM XXCoder: you making solvespace?
06:33 AM whitequark: i mean, there are no white quarks
06:33 AM Loetmichel: _abc_: nope. Double offdays... on top of those 26 days i still have from last year...
06:33 AM whitequark: QCD prohibits them
06:33 AM whitequark: that's the joke
06:33 AM whitequark: XXCoder: i maintain it
06:33 AM XXCoder: cool
06:34 AM _abc_: Loetmichel: so you will never cash in on them. Can't be away for more than a month. Stop accepting that "payment" right now.
06:34 AM rmu: "real" particles are white IIRC (whatever that means)
06:34 AM whitequark: right, but not individual quarks
06:34 AM whitequark: white just means no color charge
06:34 AM _abc_: means "colorless"
06:34 AM Tom_L: 15, Hi 18, Lo 6
06:35 AM Loetmichel: actually thats more like two moonths... and its not including the 8 days i have earned this year already OR the 25 paid holidays i am gtting this year...
06:35 AM rmu: yeah, they have something that is called "color" that works somewhat analogous to typical human color sight
06:36 AM Tom_L: busy morning
06:36 AM XXCoder: dragon they are about to open hatch!
06:36 AM whitequark: tbh the color analogy doesn't work all that well
06:36 AM whitequark: i mean it does make a cute nickname
06:36 AM XXCoder: up down strange heh
06:36 AM XXCoder: top and bottom too
06:36 AM Tom_L: XXCoder link?
06:37 AM whitequark: rmu: anyway re usb: have you seen my project Glasgow?
06:37 AM rmu: whitequark: have a look at the trajectory planner, it has a function that is called with 1kHz, generates position/velocity updates and calculates trajectory segments when the queue is about to run out
06:37 AM XXCoder: https://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/#public here you go
06:37 AM _abc_: Anyway whitequark so the new solvespace is windows only?
06:37 AM whitequark: rmu: any pointers? I'm not familiar with linuxcnc's codebase at all
06:37 AM whitequark: _abc_: of course not, it supports linux and macos as well
06:37 AM XXCoder: last I read some ubuntu port was in works but it was couple years ago lol is it still windows only?
06:37 AM XXCoder: ahh cool
06:37 AM whitequark: it's supported linux and macos for years
06:38 AM whitequark: there are no .debs because.. ugh
06:38 AM rmu: whitequark: Glasgow: no, just looking at it
06:38 AM _abc_: whitequark: no problem.
06:38 AM whitequark: try maintaining debs and you'll see why there are no debs
06:38 AM _abc_: whitequark: license is?? Could not find one on the site easily
06:38 AM whitequark: _abc_: GPL3, it's in the README
06:38 AM _abc_: ok, thanks
06:38 AM whitequark: strictly speaking, dual licensed as GPL3/commercial with proceeds going towards further development
06:40 AM rmu: whitequark: probably start here https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/src/emc/tp/tp.c + headers, and look at the youtube videos by rob ellsberg explaining the "new" trajectory planner
06:42 AM Tom_L: gloops did you find the auto config conversion tool?
06:42 AM rmu: whitequark: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/src/emc/tp/tp.c#L2335 and https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/src/emc/tp/tp.c#L2395 translate the segments of the trajectory planner into a stream of positions/velocities
06:43 AM rmu: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/src/emc/tp/tp.c#L2991 is the entry point that is called periodically
06:45 AM jthornton: Tom_L: do you remember the url for the latest dvd?
06:45 AM rmu: hmm. i hope i didn't mix things up. didn't have a look at that stuff recently
06:45 AM jthornton: it's not in linuxcnc.org/dists/
06:46 AM rmu: whitequark: #linuxcnc-devel could be more appropriate
06:48 AM Tom_L: JT-Shop for stretch?
06:48 AM Tom_L: http://www.linuxcnc.org/testing-stretch-rtpreempt/
06:48 AM jthornton: yea that one
06:49 AM Tom_L: i was wrong about the pm yesterday, much further away!
06:49 AM jthornton: good thing lol
06:49 AM Tom_L: looks like ~4" maybe
06:50 AM Tom_L: 3-4
06:50 AM jthornton: we just have a dusting of snow so far
06:50 AM Tom_L: 15, Hi 18, Lo 6
06:51 AM rmu: whitequark: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/src/emc/tp/tp.c#L3311 is the entry point sorry
06:52 AM whitequark: hmm
06:55 AM _abc_: reading: https://en.industryarena.com/forum/linux-cnc-setup-g540-controller-chinese-6040--337448.html
06:55 AM _abc_: What is this planet-cnc ? a mach3 like thing? Just the driver controller?
06:56 AM gloops: Tom_L i have seen that, but dont think it will help much for gantry
06:57 AM gloops: im hoping i can run a sample config, then swap my old hal and ini files - dont think that will work but im trying it
06:57 AM Tom_L: i may try updating mine to 2.8
06:58 AM Tom_L: is the config alot different?
06:59 AM gloops: hmm it uses a different layout for each axis, seperate JOINT specified under each axis, not much different other than that
07:00 AM whitequark: rmu: so tp updates emcmotStatus, right?
07:00 AM gloops: so you can add more joints (motors) on the same axis
07:00 AM whitequark: and then that somehow gets propagated through hal
07:00 AM Tom_L: that should help you
07:00 AM gloops: thats what i ad the machine running on - computer died yesterday though lol, so just setting it up again
07:01 AM whitequark: rmu: or is it just calculating tp->currentPos and the lower level determines all it needs from that?
07:02 AM whitequark: oh wait, i think i understand it now
07:02 AM _abc_: Is BlenderCAM still currently supported?
07:02 AM _abc_: http://blendercam.blogspot.com/
07:03 AM gloops: they were still working on it last year it
07:03 AM _abc_: Anyone here using it?
07:03 AM gloops: if you can find the master online, seen when it was last changed
07:03 AM gloops: nah, ive installed it and had a look but never did much with it
07:03 AM _abc_: git spelunking
07:03 AM _abc_: Ok thanks gloops
07:04 AM gloops: i am close to making my first face with blender though (skull) haha
07:04 AM XXCoder: everyone does skulls :P
07:04 AM XXCoder: be creative
07:05 AM _abc_: Not p*****s?
07:05 AM gloops: i set out to do a horses head but decided on something a bit simpler
07:05 AM _abc_: This explains the low kid count of geeks/nerds?
07:05 AM _abc_: We're headed at full speed towards an idiotocracy, globally.
07:05 AM XXCoder: skullf* :P
07:05 AM XXCoder: not really
07:05 AM gloops: no not one of those
07:06 AM gloops: https://www.billelis.com/products/billelis-3d-skull-model-pack
07:06 AM gloops: copying one of those
07:06 AM XXCoder: boring
07:07 AM gloops: they would look good on top of a funeral urn!
07:10 AM gloops: _abc_ are you struggling for CAM software or something?
07:12 AM gloops: i could do my own face - if ever i get a month off with nothing else to do
07:13 AM _abc_: https://www.artsy.net/artwork/constantin-brancusi-princess-x much better picture
07:17 AM gloops: that still looks just like what i thought it was
07:17 AM gloops: (scorpions tail)
07:23 AM _abc_: Nope, it's a stylized woman's head and her legs/breasts (both of these things) and also obviously suggests what it is not.
07:28 AM pink_vampire: I love pvc foam
07:33 AM gloops: ok..got the old config to load..just to see if it actually moves the machine, take pc back in garage and connect up
07:34 AM gloops: but now pretty knackered been at this since 6 this morning lol
07:34 AM gloops: ive just got to know!
07:42 AM * gloops thinks of changing out of pyjamas
07:51 AM fragalot: don't.
08:14 AM gloops: wtf, from running fine here to plugging in the garage - debian wont load, exit error 4
08:17 AM pink_vampire: file system problem
08:20 AM pink_vampire: did you run fsck?
08:20 AM pink_vampire: this is en exit code from fsck "4 Filesystem errors left uncorrected"
08:20 AM gloops: going to try fsck/dev/sda1
08:21 AM gloops: yeah i remember i had this before once, XXcoder fixed it quick
08:21 AM gloops: but how can that happen in the space of 5 minutes lol
08:21 AM pink_vampire: hope it is a good idea
08:21 AM pink_vampire: backup files first
08:33 AM gloops: ok thats now fine thanks, just 12v supply to connect, im having a coffee first
08:38 AM pink_vampire: did you backup the stuff?
08:38 AM gloops: well, the only stuff worth backing up - the cnc config is already on a usb
08:39 AM gloops: i found you can just copy paste files from one config into an newly made one, need to change halfile names in ini thats all - to the new config name
08:39 AM gloops: so at least i dont have to build a new config whatever happens
08:41 AM gloops: ill see if this works on the old pc shortly, but i dont trust it noe so will get a better one anyone and set it up ready
08:41 AM gloops: sht
08:41 AM gloops: lol - get a better one anyhow
08:43 AM pink_vampire: gloops: sound that you have some progress
08:44 AM gloops: yeah, got the computer working, installed linuxcnc, updated to 2.8, copied machine config to it, just going to see if it runs machine again in 5 minutes
08:45 AM gloops: (old hard drive was dead - this is a brand new drive)
08:47 AM pink_vampire: I also finish all the parts that support the HUGE cam switch
08:48 AM gloops: the CAM switch pink_vampire? are you changing the way you do it or is this a physical switch?
08:50 AM pink_vampire: https://i.imgur.com/W06n1J1.png
08:55 AM pink_vampire: gloops: ^
08:59 AM gloops: ahh nice
09:00 AM gloops: my machine moves again anyway, so thats me done for today, thanks for the input
11:03 AM _unreal_: FINALLY MY #$^#$% dip buttons showed up
11:04 AM _unreal_: now I can get this front panel setup done and move on with life
11:10 AM renesis: what are dip buttons
11:11 AM renesis: https://www.zazzle.com/guac_botom_button-145317562155811734
11:11 AM renesis: this what google thinks
11:12 AM pink_vampire: ???????
11:12 AM pink_vampire: _unreal_: ?
11:47 AM Daniel is now known as Guest79682
12:23 PM _unreal_: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071KX71SV/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
12:53 PM gloops: today i learned that any computer problem can be cured by removing the cpu and ram, and replacing it
12:54 PM gloops: i wonder how many millions of computers have gone in the bin, that could have been saved by doing that
01:09 PM fragalot: gloops: quite a few.
01:09 PM fragalot: it's a common problem
01:09 PM gloops: but what is the actual problem?
01:09 PM gloops: taking something out and putting it back is like - not doing anything
01:10 PM fragalot: bad connection
01:10 PM fragalot: some dust getting in between the contacts, some micro-corrosion, etc
01:11 PM gloops: must be yes, bit like a bad earth on a car
01:11 PM fragalot: exactly like that
01:15 PM Tom_L: gloops, i resoldered the connectors on a P100 and am still using it :)
01:16 PM fragalot: and that is indeed another very common failure
01:16 PM gloops: well i had a dead dell, took the chip out, put it back and its alive again lol
01:16 PM fragalot: especially with the early lead-free shite
01:17 PM gloops: i also learned you can paste the files from one linuxcnc config into a new one, so long as you rename the hal files in the INI
01:18 PM gloops: only thing is i pasted the files from an early saved config from my machine, not a recent one, so wondered why it was accelerating like sht
01:19 PM gloops: (hal references in the INI)
01:20 PM Tom_L: that's a problem with having too many backups too, you don't know which is which
01:20 PM * Tom_L waits for the github sermon
01:20 PM gloops: right, i should have sorted by date first, but when youre eager to get the thing working...
01:21 PM fragalot: Tom_L: the trick is to put finished zip files onto the git repo, with zero commits in between
01:59 PM Jymmm: Anyone know what PSRAM is ?
02:00 PM Tom_L: google does
02:01 PM Jymmm: not really
02:01 PM Tom_L: https://www.jedec.org/standards-documents/dictionary/terms/pseudostatic-random-access-memory-psram
02:02 PM Tom_L: internal refresh
02:02 PM Jymmm: That really doens't tell me what it is in layman's terms
02:02 PM pcw_home: used to be a thing: looked like a static RAM pinout wise, used DRAM inside
02:03 PM Jymmm: pcw_home: What would be it's purpose today (in a uC) ?
02:03 PM pcw_home: on chip?
02:04 PM Tom_L: a museum piece
02:04 PM Jymmm: pcw_home: On a dev board
02:04 PM Jymmm: 16MB Flash + 4MB PSRAM
02:05 PM pcw_home: usually just a lower cost pinout compatible SRAM replacement
02:06 PM Jymmm: Ok, I guess they are just expending the (internal?) 520KB SRAM then
02:06 PM Jymmm: expanding*
02:08 PM whitequark: is there any way to get *all* of linuxcnc's tk applications to run some tcl command at startup?
02:08 PM whitequark: i have a hidpi display and something's screwy with its scaling autodetection
02:09 PM whitequark: i imagine retina laptops are not very popular cnc controllers, but still
02:13 PM Jymmm: whitequark: Are you dual booting OSX and lcnc?
02:14 PM whitequark: it's not a macbook, it's a dell xps13 with a similar high density display
02:14 PM whitequark: and i just use debian
02:14 PM gloops: thats a brave effort https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Metal-Lathe-Tested-and-Working-Light-Engineering-Electric-Tool/273740697495?
02:14 PM whitequark: i *do* dual boot osx but i do it in a vm so that doesn't count :P
02:15 PM rmu: in theory tk apps should work regardless of DPI if done properly
02:15 PM whitequark: so it used to be that tk apps wouldn't scale, and everything would be tiny
02:15 PM whitequark: they fixed that. now they apply the scale factor *twice*
02:15 PM whitequark: and everything's unbearably huge
02:15 PM whitequark: but running `tk scaling 2.0` does exactly what i expect
02:16 PM whitequark: this wouldn't be too bad if there was one tcl/tk entrypoint instead of ... dozens?
02:16 PM whitequark: i checked with strace and it doesn't look like there's any rc file they read, but i might be missing something
02:18 PM rmu: i have Xft.dpi: 140 in xresources
02:19 PM Loetmichel: re at home after 10 hours of work... MAAN thats infuriating... still not all PCs done for delivery tomorrow. Thanks to the coworker that did 30% of the DVI cables with wire swaps or ripped off pins. And of course said coworker WASNT working yesterday or today. :-(
02:19 PM whitequark: rmu: oh
02:19 PM whitequark: that helped!
02:22 PM whitequark: ah I see, tk doesn't know how to get the scale factor from the environment
03:58 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
04:03 PM Deejay: gn8
04:04 PM Jymmm: Deejay: gn9
04:04 PM Deejay: :)
07:33 PM norias: hello
07:34 PM Tom_L: evening
07:34 PM XXCoder: evening
07:35 PM norias: reading up on cnc design
07:35 PM norias: just read about SERCOS
07:35 PM norias: (well, reading that part now)
08:33 PM _unreal_: sup
08:34 PM norias: reading
08:34 PM norias: you?
08:34 PM XXCoder: reafing
08:34 PM XXCoder: reading
08:40 PM _unreal_: soldering
08:45 PM XXCoder: so many ings
09:04 PM norias: I got a book about theory and design of cnc controllers
09:04 PM norias: interesting stuff
09:05 PM XXCoder: what is title?
09:05 PM norias: Theory and Design of CNC Systems
09:06 PM norias: I have another more generic control book
09:06 PM XXCoder: by suk-hwan suh?
09:06 PM norias: Automatic Control Systems
09:06 PM norias: yeah
09:06 PM Connor: I know own a 6x12 surface grinder. :)
09:06 PM norias: Connor: congrats!
09:06 PM Connor: Need to clean it up a bit.
09:07 PM norias: Be careful what you put to the left of it
09:07 PM norias: What are you going to make with it?
09:08 PM Connor: I've been doing research trying to find the age of it. It's a Walker, which was purchased by Harig at some point.. I just don't know whem.
09:08 PM Connor: norias: No clue yet. :) Just wanted one to expand abilities.
09:08 PM norias: right on
09:08 PM norias: You can do some fun stuff with them, if you try.
09:09 PM Connor: It's got a electromagnetic chuck too. Vs a On/Off lever style.
09:09 PM Wolf__: fancy
09:10 PM norias: eh.
09:10 PM norias: I'm indifferent on that part.
09:10 PM Wolf__: some day I hope I have enough shop space to set my grinder up https://i.imgur.com/Jw1eOEg.jpg
09:10 PM norias: I ran a Parker Majestic for a while
09:10 PM norias: really nice machines
09:11 PM Wolf__: and then figure out how much work I’m going to need to put in to it to make flat parts
09:12 PM norias: I interviewed RJ Newbould once
09:12 PM norias: he invented the Newbould Indexer
09:12 PM norias: neat device
09:16 PM Connor: Need to figure out how to add coolant to it.. It's tray has a nice lip, but, I didn't see a drain.. and I don't like the idea of the hose moving back and forth with the table.. How are they normally done ?
09:16 PM Wolf__: most have a gutter
09:17 PM Connor: and the drain moves over the gutter?
09:17 PM Wolf__: mine has the same problem, drain hole at the back corner of the table so need to fight the x/y movement
09:19 PM norias: you know
09:19 PM norias: i never paid attention to that
09:19 PM norias: the manual ones i used didn't have coolant
09:19 PM norias: and the automatics...
09:19 PM norias: i just never really paid much attention to
09:20 PM norias: just toss parts on, set limits, and run away
09:20 PM Wolf__: mine came from a edm/die shop so it probably got ran dry doing graphite
09:20 PM norias: I've really only done hardened tool steel and tungsten carbide
09:21 PM norias: removing at most .002" stock
09:21 PM norias: at least on the manuals
09:21 PM Connor: I've never used one.. so, no clue except for what I've watching on video.
09:21 PM Wolf__: https://i.imgur.com/JMBWHGL.jpg just little dirty
09:23 PM Wolf__: I cant help, haven’t used one yet either lol
09:24 PM norias: it's kinda simple, really
09:25 PM norias: the hard part is all the accessories, etc
09:25 PM Wolf__: put part on, move back and forth
09:25 PM norias: feed down
09:25 PM norias: slowly
09:25 PM norias: don't forget to dress the wheel
09:25 PM norias: there's tricks
09:26 PM Wolf__: accessories like https://i.imgur.com/gLbOXN0.jpg ? https://i.imgur.com/uIKjTwY.jpg =D
09:27 PM Connor: Damn that's nice.. I didn't get much.. just a diamond dresser and some wheels.
09:27 PM norias: yeah, some of those will be useful
09:27 PM norias: i don't see any sine plates
09:27 PM Connor: I need to pickup some of those vises and some transfer parallels etc..
09:27 PM Connor: I do have a 5c spindexer though.
09:27 PM Wolf__: sine plates got bid up too far
09:27 PM norias: when i learned
09:27 PM norias: we started with making our own parallels
09:28 PM norias: +/- .00005" tolerance
09:28 PM norias: on all surfaces
09:28 PM Wolf__: I bailed out at $390/ea for lot of 3 mag sine =(
09:28 PM norias: oh snap
09:28 PM norias: $390 is not a bad price
09:28 PM norias: but you need the blocks to go with it
09:29 PM norias: and know how to wring them, etc
09:29 PM Wolf__: no it wasn’t, but I didn’t have the budget for $1k just for the sine
09:29 PM norias: fair
09:29 PM Wolf__: only spent $1500 at the auction
09:30 PM Connor: $600.00 for mine.
09:30 PM Wolf__: $450 for the grinder, $15 for wall of grinder wheels
09:30 PM Connor: I wanted a smaller one for the space it's going in..
09:33 PM Wolf__: I think mine is good for small shop use https://i.imgur.com/ViaAewx.jpg
09:35 PM Wolf__: my mag chuck needs a tuneup tho, need to redo the handle and add a bushing for it
10:04 PM _unreal_: ya rough day today in south florida jigsy https://drive.google.com/open?id=1L5TGCqnUR8I2aKC6VXmtnc4tQMoIClyM https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ZiHl5lYy8hkTQ5r8hc657Kgnl8EhxpFt https://drive.google.com/open?id=1AqJJk3gauW8we71o2Gq6llxlyLjZhNVs
10:10 PM CaptHindsight: those monsters grow to incredible size
10:15 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QohcgiZXmE0
10:16 PM XXCoder: funny how fire starts from inside driver area
10:16 PM XXCoder: not from bottom by fuel
10:19 PM MarcelineVQ: and how it shrinks into a tiny model
10:20 PM XXCoder: yeah lol
10:21 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: https://i.imgur.com/DYASkL5.jpg
10:46 PM CaptHindsight: https://3dprint.com/237446/researchers-create-scalable-system-for-3d-printing-micro-nanoscale/
10:47 PM Jymmm: IS there any 3d printing that uses other than PMMA ?
10:48 PM CaptHindsight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poly(methyl_methacrylate)
10:49 PM CaptHindsight: all that I can think of
10:49 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: OTHER than pmma, like pvc, hdpe, pu, pe, etc
10:49 PM CaptHindsight: who told you that any only use PMMA?
10:50 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: you did of course (that's all I see used)
10:51 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: I haven't dine or even looked at 3d printing in any serious as the results are far from a "polished" product imo
10:51 PM CaptHindsight: sounds like some imposer mislead you
10:52 PM CaptHindsight: you poser
10:52 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: I looked once I wasn't impressed, and that was a commercial product.
10:52 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: Feel free to prove me wrong on sub $1000 units
10:53 PM CaptHindsight: not sure what you are asking
10:53 PM CaptHindsight: what printers use PMMA?
10:53 PM CaptHindsight: what/which
10:54 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: then what do they use?
10:58 PM whitequark: i don't think you can 3d print pmma
10:58 PM CaptHindsight: depends on the form
10:59 PM CaptHindsight: neat PMMA vs contains PMMA
10:59 PM whitequark: huh, there *is* pmma filament after all, would not have expected that
11:00 PM CaptHindsight: thermoplastic versions
11:00 PM CaptHindsight: thermosets are cast
11:00 PM whitequark: right, i assumed the filament would be too prone for shattering
11:00 PM whitequark: but looks like it works well enough to sell commercially
11:01 PM whitequark: Jymmm: anyway, the usual plastics used in consumer 3d printing are pla and abs
11:01 PM CaptHindsight: depends on the copolymer/s
11:02 PM whitequark: and yes, sub $1000 3d printers will never and cannot possibly match the $10k+ injection molds, it would be quite absurd to expect otherwise
11:02 PM XXCoder: theres cheaop injection system actually
11:02 PM XXCoder: but you need mill to make molds
11:04 PM Jymmm: Fine, will just route some melted milk jugs then =)
11:05 PM XXCoder: Jymmm: lol I planned that, i melted few milk jugs worth
11:05 PM XXCoder: but it didnt end reallt well
11:05 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: why's that?
11:06 PM XXCoder: i couldnt get it to be flat enough
11:06 PM XXCoder: couldnt get it hot enough was concerned about ruining oven lol
11:06 PM Jymmm: Ah, yeah. you need good temp control and kitchen over aint it
11:06 PM Jymmm: oven*
11:07 PM Jymmm: Hey, that's an idea... I have some 2K F probes
11:08 PM Jymmm: not for hdpe , flue temp logging
11:08 PM XXCoder: you could convert a oven into pid controlled one
11:08 PM XXCoder: for other uses besides food
11:08 PM XXCoder: and maube food also, might be better with fine control
11:08 PM XXCoder: more so if you could move probe around lol
11:08 PM Jymmm: I'm actually thinking air
11:09 PM Jymmm: Radiant heat doens't work too well
11:09 PM XXCoder: induction eh
11:10 PM Jymmm: Literally a modified hot air gun with temp control
11:10 PM XXCoder: that'd work I guess
11:11 PM Jymmm: And a nice insulated oven to stablize the temperature
11:12 PM Jymmm: I should be good to 2000F, not that I'll need that high
11:12 PM Wolf__: air fryer
11:12 PM Jymmm: Wolf__: Kinda yeah, but bigger and more useful
11:12 PM XXCoder: could add some fire wool
11:12 PM Jymmm: no need and fire wool is expensive
11:13 PM Jymmm: I've molten salt (1400F) with one inch of insulation and exterior temp was 140F
11:15 PM XXCoder: interesting so not really nesscary just careful with placements
11:16 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: perlite baby, perlite damn good high temp insulator
11:16 PM XXCoder: interesting just googled it
11:16 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: any garden supply store too
11:17 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: good for around 2400F
11:17 PM Jymmm: fireproof
11:17 PM XXCoder: i watched video about starlite. it might have been discovered
11:17 PM Jymmm: non casongenic
11:17 PM XXCoder: *re
11:17 PM XXCoder: but it also might have exposed why he never let it out of his control and allowed others to test it alone
11:18 PM XXCoder: it would rot
11:18 PM Jymmm: what would rot?
11:18 PM XXCoder: starlite
11:18 PM XXCoder: in least something with similiar properies would. unknown what real one was really like.
11:19 PM Jymmm: Never heard of it before. I did a lot of research about perlite as a high tempinsulator, then tested it using molten salt, I was impressed
11:20 PM XXCoder: not surpised it was while ago. guy was super secretive and died before he told anyone
11:20 PM XXCoder: not even his family knew
11:20 PM Jymmm: heh
11:20 PM XXCoder: but rediscovery well it looked same, and it acted same as starlite example videos did
11:20 PM XXCoder: but not nessicarily same
11:25 PM XXCoder: anyway ya theres bunch of interesting materials lol
11:25 PM XXCoder: saw picture of torch burning bottom and ice on top and not melting
11:26 PM XXCoder: or more properly, melting like its in room temperate
11:34 PM Jymmm: Well, perlite works for most things I need
11:34 PM XXCoder: yeah
11:34 PM XXCoder: match price properies to needs :)
11:35 PM Jymmm: Though, I still would like to find a better binder than mortar, but not there yet
11:36 PM XXCoder: http://s3.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/photoshop/6/6/8/689668_v2.jpg lol
11:37 PM veek: Jymmm, how much do you pay for perlite
11:37 PM veek: heh
11:38 PM veek: first thing i did when I started gardening
11:38 PM Jymmm: veek: $13 for 4 cubic feet
11:38 PM veek: Jymmm, how much is that by weight
11:38 PM Jymmm: veek: no clue
11:38 PM XXCoder: 20 tons
11:39 PM XXCoder: kidding
11:39 PM veek: hmm 10kg apparently
11:40 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: you use propane?
11:40 PM XXCoder: for?
11:40 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: anything?
11:40 PM XXCoder: oh bbq thats about it i think
11:41 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: Oh, not torches, generator, heaters, etc?
11:41 PM XXCoder: nah
11:41 PM XXCoder: though maybe if shop is built and i need heat
11:41 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: Ah, then you won't appreciate what I've done =)
11:41 PM XXCoder: lol
11:42 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: a quick connect to the 250gal tank https://i.imgur.com/DYASkL5.jpg
11:42 PM XXCoder: ya saw it
11:42 PM XXCoder: i guess its quick way to change to other stuff that needs prop
11:43 PM Wolf__: flame thrower
11:43 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: It's a acme fitting on the left (just like a 5gal bbq tank), and a quick connecot on the right that will be plumbed into the rest of the pipe later on
11:43 PM XXCoder: shop wide hose system?
11:44 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: Oh gosh no, just a temporary setup, mostly for the generator and emergency heater
11:45 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: But that ACME fitting you just can't find/get locally
11:46 PM Wolf__: odd, little plumbing shop has them in my town
11:46 PM XXCoder: so made a quick adoptor. not bad
11:46 PM Wolf__: so does tractor supply
11:46 PM Jymmm: Wolf__: Link to tractor supply page?
11:48 PM Wolf__: idk, about link, I just picked up stuff in store to make 2 4’ hoses to hook 100lb tanks up to a camping trailer auto changeover reg
11:48 PM Jymmm: Wolf__: "Not carried in stores" https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/mr-heater-1-4-in-male-pipe-thread-x-female-pol-with-acme-thread
11:49 PM Wolf__: I picked up something else to make the hoses
11:49 PM Wolf__: inline gauge or something of the sort
11:50 PM Wolf__: I dont quite remember because I did it 6-7 yrs ago
11:50 PM Jymmm: Wolf__: Most folks never use MALE Acme fittings, just female (big plastic knob/nut)
11:52 PM Jymmm: Wolf__: no worries, it's all good.
11:53 PM Jymmm: XXCoder: I do wish I could figure out some kind of handle/grip for the acme side though
11:53 PM XXCoder: got a 3d printer?
11:53 PM Jymmm: nope
11:54 PM Wolf__: channel locks
11:54 PM XXCoder: hmm some handle attached to it by zipties or ribbon clamps heh
11:54 PM Jymmm: I might just heat up some pvc pipe, slip it on then instantly cool it
11:55 PM Jymmm: Wolf__: less ghatto than channel locks would be preferred =)
11:55 PM Wolf__: lol
11:55 PM Jymmm: ghetto*
11:55 PM Wolf__: ...
11:55 PM Wolf__: thats what I use on mine
11:56 PM Jymmm: I'll eventually run black pipe then won't have to worry about it
11:56 PM Jymmm: Wolf__: the the plastic knob?
11:56 PM Wolf__: https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/mr-heater-stay-a-while-propane-tee?cm_vc=-10005 I used one of these to make one of my extension hoses
11:57 PM Wolf__: they use to have them in store lol
11:59 PM Jymmm: Wolf__: I don't get it. what the thing on the top?
11:59 PM Wolf__: little bottle type connector
11:59 PM Jymmm: 1lb tank connector?
11:59 PM Wolf__: yeah