#linuxcnc Logs
Jan 05 2019
#linuxcnc Calendar
02:12 AM Deejay: moin
04:36 AM TurBoss: morning
04:36 AM XXCoder: hy TurBoss
04:36 AM TurBoss: hello!
04:37 AM TurBoss: I'm trying to figure how to solve a noise issue
04:37 AM TurBoss: If I turn on a lamp the motors moves some steps
05:00 AM jthornton: morning
05:00 AM XXCoder: yo
05:25 AM gloops: yellow vests out in france again
05:26 AM gloops: must be something to make in wood that revolutionaries would buy
05:27 AM syyl: maybe kindling?
05:29 AM gloops: that i can do
05:41 AM gloops: my new years resolution is - do not start making any more machines, im back on the cnc router, when ive tidied up
05:43 AM XXCoder: But if you don't have Integer.Pos_Inf machines you need more?
05:43 AM XXCoder: ;)
05:44 AM XXCoder: anyway i have been looking at slicer stuff
05:44 AM XXCoder: luban seems best but fairly expensive
05:44 AM gloops: slicer ?
05:44 AM gloops: for 3d printing?
05:44 AM XXCoder: requires server connection so probably dead if company goes under
05:44 AM XXCoder: no different kind of slicer
05:44 AM XXCoder: it makes 3d stuff out of 2d plane cut stuff
05:45 AM gloops: i fathomed out model slicing in sketchup and fusion - tbh i think sketchup is more useable
05:45 AM gloops: i made some shelves from it anyway
05:46 AM gloops: and thinking now, wow it was 6 months since i did that ive forgot all those apps
05:46 AM XXCoder: cool :)
05:50 AM Deejay: re
06:02 AM jthornton: geez Brasero is not installed on linux mint wtf do they expect you to burn a dvd with
06:03 AM XXCoder: maybe theres too many software so they left dvd burner out ofnpackag
06:03 AM XXCoder: of package
06:03 AM XXCoder: or maybe too few use em nowdays?
06:04 AM XXCoder: besides wii u I havent touched a disc for qhile now
06:04 AM XXCoder: in fact I gonna need to buy dvd drive soon as I got myst cds but my oc dont have a cd drive lol
06:24 AM jthornton: well crap my dvd drive is not working
06:24 AM XXCoder: how longs it been since last usage?
06:25 AM XXCoder: some drives just die or lens gets issues if been long enough
06:25 AM jthornton: I'm not sure I've ever used it with this pc
06:46 AM * jthornton gives up trying to make a hello.py with a main class that gets installed with pip install -e .
06:46 AM jthornton: on to chickens
06:47 AM Tom_itx: morning
06:48 AM XXCoder: oh yeah
06:48 AM XXCoder: jthornton: saw something about subbing egg with fake rock egg in book made me wonder
06:48 AM XXCoder: when do you have to do this or dont have to?
06:49 AM jthornton: I'm just trying to get a basic framework working that uses pip install -e .
06:50 AM jthornton: https://github.com/jethornton/hello
06:50 AM jthornton: I can't sort out the correct syntax in the setup.py or the __init__.py not sure which one is messed up
06:52 AM XXCoder: good question
06:53 AM Tom_itx: i thought microsoft bought github
06:53 AM XXCoder: they did
06:53 AM Tom_itx: i'm surprised it still works
06:54 AM XXCoder: they said they will keep it working
06:54 AM XXCoder: jt dunno dont know enough python
06:55 AM Tom_itx: Intellectual Property Notice Short version: We own the service and all of our content. In order for you to use our content, we give you certain rights to it, but you may only use our content in the way we have allowed.
06:56 AM Loetmichel: Tom_itx: which company ?
06:57 AM Loetmichel: ah, github?
06:57 AM Loetmichel: hmmm
06:57 AM Tom_itx: yes
06:57 AM Tom_itx: https://help.github.com/articles/github-terms-of-service/#g-intellectual-property-notice
06:57 AM Loetmichel: isnt the content user-uploaded?
06:57 AM Loetmichel: how can it be owned by github?
06:57 AM Tom_itx: yes and ms thanks you for your donations
06:57 AM Loetmichel: ah, i see
06:58 AM Loetmichel: so they want you to belive that by uploading any code there you basically forfeit any rights on said code?
06:58 AM Tom_itx: that's what i gather from it
06:58 AM Loetmichel: wouldnt have thought them to be THAT cheesy
06:59 AM XXCoder: think that pre-dates MS
07:01 AM Tom_itx: Services Usage Limits You agree not to reproduce, duplicate, copy, sell, resell or exploit any portion of the Service, use of the Service, or access to the Service without GitHub's express written permission.
07:01 AM Tom_itx: so once you upload it, you need written permission to use it
07:02 AM XXCoder: no thats site services only
07:02 AM XXCoder: not contents
07:03 AM Loetmichel: That wouldnt fly in any german court. And i believe the us also has laws that make that TOS void as a whole
07:03 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: THAT would make more sense
07:04 AM XXCoder: issue is "all our service and our content" is bit amgious was it exactly worded that way on site somewhere?
07:05 AM XXCoder: amgious because "our content" could mean all files including user files, or could be just website files and such
10:28 AM zeeshan: i have 8 of these motors: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Lin-Engineering-5718M-05E-05-2-00A-Stepper-Motor-/392050892092
10:28 AM zeeshan: i wonder how much i should sell them as a lot for
10:30 AM Rab: $20 seems reasonable. What's your PayPal?
10:30 AM zeeshan: haha
10:31 AM jthornton: well a linux version terminal finally does something right it shows the password with **** so newbees aren't confused by nothing showing up
10:32 AM Rab: But now I can see your password is 4 characters.
10:32 AM gregcnc: none of those have sold recently
10:33 AM jthornton: that was your password
10:33 AM * Rab = 0wned
10:34 AM zeeshan: looks like theyre 173 oz-in steppers
10:34 AM zeeshan: i dont think ill ever use them for anything
10:34 AM zeeshan: prolly good for a diy 3d printer
10:34 AM Rab: zeeshan, new or used?
10:35 AM zeeshan: practically new :P
10:35 AM zeeshan: so used
10:35 AM Rab: "New (Other)"
10:35 AM zeeshan: https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipMqPwEqoV5_qPW1xDsWTuKnMMgcwNZvGjB2hhM_n0zSpORUzhxid8MWzx7yshaikA?key=WWxnZnJKdjB0NmFtSWpxYzZxdlRJelpQRDN4cTJn
10:35 AM zeeshan: https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipMqPwEqoV5_qPW1xDsWTuKnMMgcwNZvGjB2hhM_n0zSpORUzhxid8MWzx7yshaikA?key=WWxnZnJKdjB0NmFtSWpxYzZxdlRJelpQRDN4cTJn
10:35 AM zeeshan: :D
10:41 AM gloops: 2 amp is a bit more torque i think
10:42 AM gloops: the lin 1.3amp is 173 oz
10:43 AM zeeshan: i'll throw em on ebay and see what happens
10:44 AM gloops: i dunno used, i suppose people are gonna think - well i can get a 200oz new motor for £25
10:45 AM gregcnc: you're competing with the cheapest stuff coming from china
10:45 AM gloops: https://www.ebay.com/itm/DE-Free-Ship-Schrittmotor-1-PCS-Nema-23-Stepper-Motor-270-oz-in-3A-Flat-shaft/272982214569?
10:46 AM gloops: $23
10:46 AM zeeshan: im gonna put up 8 of them for 100 usd
10:46 AM zeeshan: im sure someone will bid :P
10:46 AM gloops: if you have time - try high to start
10:46 AM zeeshan: cleaning out the basement :)
10:46 AM Rab: zeeshan, you might have better luck with two lots of 4.
10:46 AM gloops: put - not chinese crap these are quality steppers
10:47 AM gloops: made by US craftsmen
10:47 AM zeeshan: haha
10:47 AM zeeshan: made in USA with cheap chinese parts? :D
10:47 AM gloops: yeah nobody needs 8 steppers, most only want 3 or 4
10:47 AM Rab: That's about what I got from their page.
10:48 AM Rab: But Lin looks reasonably legit, even if they're just doing QC on chinese warez...who isn't, these days?
10:48 AM gloops: id have them but my new year resolution is not to start any more machines
10:48 AM gregcnc: that means a boduy on US soils handled the crate they came in
10:51 AM gloops: its all wrong really, the cheaper chinese product is probably a copy of the Lin
10:52 AM gloops: but everybody still buys them, its all about the $
10:52 AM gregcnc: you know your chinese produced product is decent when there a chinese knockoffs of chinese knockoffs
10:54 AM gloops: we demand health and safety, decent wages, reasonable hours, we wouldnt see our kids living in a factory - but when we see the prices we click on stuff made that way
10:54 AM gregcnc: some do
10:55 AM gloops: id try that facebook page - DIY cnc machines, lot of americans there
10:55 AM zeeshan: i threw it on ebay
10:55 AM zeeshan: lets see what happens
10:56 AM gregcnc: ebay needs comments for listings, that would be fun
10:58 AM fragalot: lol
10:58 AM fragalot: live chat
10:58 AM gregcnc: no just comments
11:00 AM gloops: with gifs button
11:13 AM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Electric-coil-winding-machine-Westminster-old-250-mm-swingy-200-mm-axial/292896365804?
11:15 AM zeeshan: do it!
11:18 AM gloops: no haha
11:18 AM gloops: thought it was an interesting curio though
11:18 AM zeeshan: everyone needs a coil winding machine
11:19 AM gloops: few BSP taps and dies here fragalot https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Job-lot-of-quality-HSS-BSP-taps-and-dies-Live-steam-engineers-workshop-LOOK/163459520625?
11:20 AM gloops: unfortunately in non-matching sizes
11:20 AM fragalot: they're hex dies anyway, i'm more interested in round ones
11:35 AM zeeshan: damn bsp
11:35 AM zeeshan: we're building a machine for australia
11:35 AM zeeshan: all the pipe connections are bspp or bspt
11:35 AM zeeshan: =/
11:37 AM fragalot: I'd say "sucks to be you" but that's a very common thread here
11:37 AM fragalot: what I don't understand is why it's so hard to find tap & die sets for it
11:37 AM fragalot: (for a reasonable price)
11:40 AM gloops: its tradesman gear, gas fitters are on decent money
11:41 AM fragalot: yea but NPT would be considered 'specialty' tools, yet those are common as mud
11:41 AM fragalot: or BSW
11:59 AM elmo40: what is BSW?
11:59 AM elmo40: british standard?
11:59 AM fragalot: withworth thread
11:59 AM fragalot: yes
11:59 AM Tom_itx: they still use wintworth?
11:59 AM elmo40: BSP and BST is how i know it
11:59 AM fragalot: Tom_itx: they don't
11:59 AM fragalot: elmo40: BSP is something else
11:59 AM Tom_itx: i didn't think so
12:00 PM fragalot: Tom_itx: that's the crappy part, but you can still find oodles of taps for it
12:00 PM zeeshan: bspp = parallel thread
12:00 PM zeeshan: bspt = tapered thread
12:00 PM zeeshan: bspp is a lot more common on say... pneumatic cylinders
12:00 PM fragalot: zeeshan: PIPE thread. not the same as BSW.
12:00 PM Tom_itx: what's zeeshan up to?
12:00 PM zeeshan: and valve banks
12:00 PM zeeshan: bspt is used a lot on pipes
12:00 PM zeeshan: Tom_itx: just hanging out-- about to go to the range with my friend :)
12:01 PM Tom_itx: what sort of range?
12:01 PM zeeshan: gun
12:01 PM Tom_itx: shooting
12:01 PM zeeshan: fragalot: i don't focus on bsw cause its ancient :P
12:01 PM gloops: france is looking a bit like a war zone atm
12:01 PM elmo40: yeah, BSPT is used a lot on imported compressors
12:01 PM elmo40: BSPP is used a lot on european hydaulics
12:02 PM Tom_itx: is bspp like a double lead thread?
12:02 PM elmo40: no
12:02 PM zeeshan: bo
12:02 PM zeeshan: its just a straight thread
12:02 PM elmo40: just straight thread
12:02 PM zeeshan: same as what youd use on a bolt for example
12:02 PM Tom_itx: ahh i see
12:02 PM zeeshan: uses an oring to seal the threrad
12:02 PM elmo40: uses an oring or sealing ring
12:02 PM Tom_itx: but for hydraulics etc
12:02 PM zeeshan: elmo40: parrot!
12:02 PM Tom_itx: yeah
12:03 PM * elmo40 wants my cracker!
12:03 PM zeeshan: https://cdn3.volusion.com/dfrau.gmyce/v/vspfiles/photos/6400-2.jpg?1340057344
12:03 PM zeeshan: that kind of stuff
12:03 PM Tom_itx: what about gas nipple threads with an angular seal?
12:04 PM Tom_itx: zeeshan both sides?
12:04 PM Tom_itx: looks like it
12:05 PM elmo40: left side is JIC
12:05 PM elmo40: right side is o-ring boss. not BSPP
12:05 PM zeeshan: yes
12:05 PM zeeshan: i was just giving an example
12:05 PM zeeshan: lazy :)
12:05 PM fragalot: a bad example :D
12:05 PM zeeshan: fine!
12:05 PM elmo40: usually Banjo fittings are BSPP.
12:06 PM zeeshan: https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/41KbMKnEIvL._SX385_.jpg
12:06 PM zeeshan: there we go
12:06 PM gloops: basically, youve got a tin full of same size fittings - but no way can you make anything screw together to make a connection lol
12:07 PM zeeshan: its so ghetto but you can use a bspt fitting in a bspp thread
12:07 PM zeeshan: :)
12:07 PM elmo40: zeeshan, that is more like it ;-)
12:07 PM fragalot: zeeshan: or a BSPP in a BSPT if you try hard enough
12:07 PM elmo40: with enough teflon...
12:07 PM zeeshan: i've even seen someone jam in a 5/16-18 bolt
12:08 PM zeeshan: in a m8x1.25 thread
12:08 PM zeeshan: :)
12:08 PM fragalot: zeeshan: long live impact drivers
12:08 PM Tom_itx: wonder who that was :)
12:09 PM elmo40: 1/4 bolt in an M6 thread. Seen that, too.
12:09 PM elmo40: use whatever is lying around to 'get the machine going' is such a crappy way to do maintenance.
12:09 PM gloops: i think he installed my cooker
12:09 PM elmo40: if you buy a metric machine, buy metric components for it!
12:10 PM elmo40: LoL
12:10 PM zeeshan: elmo40: do you work at a plant?
12:10 PM zeeshan: i only see this stuff when going to supervise our eqiipment install
12:10 PM elmo40: I am a mobile repair guy.
12:10 PM zeeshan: and then discover these interesting things
12:10 PM Loetmichel: elmo40: 1/4 in an m6 thread sounds like "waaaay to much muscle applied"
12:10 PM elmo40: i am usually the guy they call after all the band-aids have failed.
12:10 PM zeeshan: elmo40: knowledgeable, i can tell :)
12:11 PM Loetmichel: or did you mean "after retreading the m6 hole"?
12:11 PM zeeshan: rofl
12:11 PM gloops: service engineer - probably the best job going
12:11 PM elmo40: Loetmichel, if you call threading with a bolt rethreading...
12:11 PM zeeshan: its called cold forming threads
12:11 PM zeeshan: :D
12:11 PM elmo40: ;-)
12:11 PM Loetmichel: then its way to much muscle
12:12 PM Tom_itx: one of the 2 sides is bound to be softer making an excellent repair
12:12 PM fragalot: and a very solid connection
12:12 PM Tom_itx: friction welding?
12:12 PM elmo40: it was into one of those formed sheetmetal holes. nothing too serious. i drilled it out and installed an M6 rivet nut to bring it back to 'factory spec'.
12:12 PM Loetmichel: M6 is 6mm outer diameter and 1/4" is 6.35mm... not to mention the total different TPI... if someone gets that 1/4" in the m6 thread they either have spend the night in a nuclear power plant and went green or the thread was in cheese not in steel
12:13 PM elmo40: https://5.imimg.com/data5/UO/DX/MY-1206280/rivet-nuts-500x500.jpg
12:13 PM Loetmichel: ah, sheet metal. OK. i thught full metal
12:13 PM Loetmichel: elmo40: i use tons of those
12:13 PM Loetmichel: but in M4 ;)
12:13 PM elmo40: they are great!
12:13 PM fragalot: we use the hex variants a LOT in stainless
12:13 PM elmo40: i love them
12:14 PM Loetmichel: fragalot: arent the hex variant rivet nuts are installed from the back side?
12:14 PM elmo40: prevented a lot of machines from getting scrapped because their in-house maintenance guy never heard of them...
12:14 PM fragalot: Loetmichel: no
12:14 PM Loetmichel: as opposed to those "front mount" "blind" rivets?
12:15 PM fragalot: Loetmichel: they install like you would expect, only they are flush and resist spinning more
12:15 PM Loetmichel: then i dont know of which type you speak
12:15 PM Loetmichel: i only have seen front mounted threaded rivets in round
12:15 PM elmo40: but you need to punch a hex in order to install them
12:15 PM Loetmichel: and the ones that you press in from the back in hexagonal
12:15 PM elmo40: http://rivetsinstock.com/images/halfhex2.jpg
12:16 PM Loetmichel: elmo40: NICE
12:16 PM elmo40: or this style? this one is flush
12:16 PM elmo40: https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTgHZWHjps2FpmfGlstaA1U6F7GTJoJTfdvVnaN9ouzDKsBdzbj
12:16 PM Loetmichel: should tell the boss to use these in our next enclosure
12:16 PM fragalot: elmo40: yeah - i'm talking about building new stuff where you just get the hex hole lasered
12:17 PM elmo40: i gotta build me a laser table.
12:17 PM Loetmichel: fragalot: you can do hexagons with a cnc milling machine...
12:17 PM Loetmichel: BTDT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7eO5cu-fXg
12:17 PM fragalot: Loetmichel: sure. laser is faster though
12:17 PM fragalot: in 2mm stainless
12:18 PM Loetmichel: although those are for air vents, not for rivets ;)
12:19 PM Loetmichel: and its 1.5mm aluminium
12:21 PM Loetmichel: we DO have problems with some m4 rivets (same type elmo40 showed) rotating in their holes... and my underlings tend to rip off quite a few of those "draw pins" in the (hand) rivet press
12:22 PM Loetmichel: which are NOT cheap
12:22 PM Loetmichel: everytime they rip off one i have to redraw half of the rivets they do thereafter for a while
12:22 PM Loetmichel: because they spin in the hole
12:23 PM fragalot: that's why we use hex
12:23 PM fragalot: and we have the same issue with the draw pins on our pneumatic tools
12:23 PM fragalot: just because of the sheer number of rivets & the material :P
12:24 PM Loetmichel: fragalot: they dont spind if properly tightened
12:24 PM fragalot: Loetmichel: in alu.. sure. in stainless: they always spin, especially the flush mount variants
12:24 PM Loetmichel: they DO spin if someone is frightened to destroy another pull pin and doesent pull them all the way in.
12:25 PM Loetmichel: (or doesent have enough muscle to do it)
12:25 PM Loetmichel: ... i managed to break one of the rivet tool handles...
12:26 PM fragalot: same. first time I used one 15yrs ago working on my trabant
12:26 PM Loetmichel: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=16161&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 <- one of these... WITHOUT the use of the pipes.
12:26 PM fragalot: didn't know you had to pull them tight, but not pop-rivet tight :P
12:27 PM Loetmichel: in fact the pipes are on the one because one of the handles is missing on that tool
12:29 PM Loetmichel: <- tends to have a bit much force sometimes... and since yesterday a blue index finger nail. MAN was that stupid to rivet in that screw retainer with a hammer while my finger was right next to it ;)
12:32 PM elmo40: Loetmichel, if you dont need them to be flush, and you can punch/laser a hex, then you should be using these:
12:32 PM elmo40: https://www.jhpfasteners.com/images/products/RNELHF_AD.jpg
12:32 PM Loetmichel: elmo40: yeah, look nice
12:33 PM elmo40: time to make production changes!
12:33 PM elmo40: these do cost more, though...
12:33 PM Loetmichel: we use them on the back of 24" thin clients with monitor for the vesa mount
12:33 PM Loetmichel: in 1mm sheet steel
12:33 PM Loetmichel: shouldnt be a problem to make hexagonal holes
12:34 PM Loetmichel: also in our standard PC enclosures (3mm thick sheet alu)
12:34 PM Loetmichel: to close the lid
12:34 PM elmo40: the higher price is the reason automotive doesn't do it. they'd lose $8/car !
12:34 PM elmo40: LoL
12:34 PM Loetmichel: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=15624&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 <- bunch of thin clients...
12:35 PM elmo40: i've had many of these rivet nuts spin in older cars. very frustrating.
12:35 PM Loetmichel: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14145 <- empty PC enclosure where you can see the rivets
12:37 PM Loetmichel: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14412&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 <- closeup of the thin client... 142 M3*6 stainless screws
12:37 PM elmo40: other than the usual asian sites... anyone able to locate for me a 12V1-26 tap?
12:37 PM Loetmichel: its a PITA to repair them when brolen ;)
12:37 PM Loetmichel: -l+k
12:37 PM Loetmichel: you get wrist pain just opening one by hand
12:37 PM elmo40: Loetmichel, that is a LOT of screws!!
12:37 PM elmo40: why so many?
12:38 PM elmo40: it doesn't hold water...
12:38 PM fragalot: elmo40: 'the hell is a 12V1 thread
12:38 PM Loetmichel: its cheaper to use screws every 30mm than to put RF gasket in between the screws
12:38 PM elmo40: ISO 4570 thread for valve stems.
12:38 PM elmo40: you need to contain the RF noise?
12:38 PM Loetmichel: those clients are "tempest proof"
12:38 PM Loetmichel: yes
12:38 PM elmo40: true
12:39 PM elmo40: fragalot, it is oh so close to M12x1.0
12:39 PM elmo40: but not quite... LoL
12:39 PM fragalot: lol
12:40 PM elmo40: the 12V1 nut will loosely thread onto the M12x1.0 but not the other way around.
12:40 PM elmo40: and it will pull out, if applied a little pressure
12:40 PM fragalot: amazon seems to sell 'm
12:40 PM elmo40: like i said. other than the usual suspects...
12:40 PM elmo40: they are $80 or more from there!
12:40 PM fragalot: you specifically said asian
12:40 PM fragalot: no, $22
12:40 PM elmo40: amazon is asian
12:40 PM fragalot: https://www.amazon.com/12V1-26-Schrader-Valve-Thread-ABBOTT/dp/B07227G4L9
12:41 PM fragalot: amazon is not asian. but it does sell asian crap :P
12:41 PM Loetmichel: elmo40: those systems are SDIP-27 level A compliant if that rings a bell
12:41 PM elmo40: that must be new. i looked before xmas and didnt see that one
12:42 PM elmo40: fragalot, it has become overrun by aliexpress sellers.
12:42 PM fragalot: elmo40: you mean drop-ship sellers?
12:42 PM fragalot: i've been contacted by quite a few sites too asking if I want to become a drop-ship seller
12:44 PM elmo40: do it
12:44 PM elmo40: make money
12:44 PM Loetmichel: elmo40: thats how an external DVD-RW drive looks after it went thru my hands: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=17204&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
12:44 PM Loetmichel: :-)
12:44 PM Loetmichel: (and the measurement chamber :-)
12:44 PM elmo40: all it takes is a metal case?
12:44 PM elmo40: you have an RF tool?
12:44 PM Loetmichel: and a bunch of filters and gaskets.
12:44 PM Loetmichel: indeed
12:45 PM Loetmichel: and double shielded cables and connectors
12:45 PM elmo40: this supression should be standard everywhere. So much noise in our lives now.
12:45 PM Loetmichel: two measurement chambers with R&S spectrum analyzers and antennas inside
12:46 PM elmo40: these 80" TVs are horrible! you turn them on and you feel your life force slipping away
12:46 PM Loetmichel: one set up for Sdip-27 and one for german "zone" model
12:47 PM Loetmichel: and we are allowed to do our own certification by german "BSI"
12:47 PM Loetmichel: hence all those "MEP" manipulation proof labels
12:48 PM Loetmichel: so nobody can tamper with the devices and smuggle a bug in or something
12:48 PM elmo40: that is a LOT of screws!
12:48 PM elmo40: cant you fold one half or make a lip, and screw the other half?
12:48 PM Loetmichel: i probably could
12:49 PM Loetmichel: did something like that for an IR remote...
12:49 PM Loetmichel: let me see
12:49 PM Loetmichel: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=17046&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 <- there it is
12:50 PM Loetmichel: was quite funny to build that... and boss was excited. the thought it looked great
12:51 PM Loetmichel: "sheet aluminium origami" ;)
12:54 PM Rab: Loetmichel, very nice. Did you machine those button caps in-house?
01:04 PM fragalot: I wonder how long those buttons are going to last
01:04 PM Rab: I was wondering the same thing.
01:04 PM fragalot: we've had issues with our membrane keypads (supplier changed manufacturing process to lower quality) when people used the touch-screen stylus on them
01:05 PM fragalot: and the point on those buttons looks awfully close to the tip of our pens
01:05 PM fragalot: and that remote looks awfully awful :D
01:16 PM Tom_itx: Loetmichel how do you calculate for the bends on something like that?
01:21 PM MacGalempsy: hello
01:31 PM JT-Shop: hi
01:58 PM renesis: fragalot: needs rubber bumper
01:58 PM renesis: rab: ^
01:58 PM SpeedEvil: Also stop.
01:59 PM SpeedEvil: to limit travel.
01:59 PM renesis: like instead of a point, do a hole and shove in an eraser
01:59 PM renesis: i think tactile feedback might be enough
01:59 PM SpeedEvil: Consider what happens if you drop it on a button
01:59 PM renesis: if you do the rubber right, can get away without a stop, stop can make consistent actuation a problem over time
01:59 PM fragalot: renesis yup
01:59 PM SpeedEvil: Or drop a tool on a button
02:00 PM renesis: clearly it needs drop spikes on the front
02:00 PM renesis: drop spikes (c) rencorp
02:42 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Linux-4.21-More-ARM-Code
02:42 PM CaptHindsight: i.MX8 SoC Support Is Heading Into Linux 4.21
02:44 PM CaptHindsight: the i.MX8 is the first ARM SOC that can support software stepping and 30fps+ HD res without on its own, no fpga needed
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: unfortunately it's only sold to a few vendors that make boards close to $100 and up
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: but it's a ~$25 part
02:50 PM fragalot: Neat.
02:51 PM CaptHindsight: if Rockchip or Allwinner used Vivante and added some M4 microcontrollers then it would be a $5 chip
02:52 PM CaptHindsight: but the Chinese have no use for a 2+ core ARM SOC with a couple of microcontrollers onboard
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: 9 times out of 10 the Chinese use malin vs Vivante
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: mali/malin
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.nxp.com/products/processors-and-microcontrollers/arm-based-processors-and-mcus/i.mx-applications-processors/i.mx-8-processors/i.mx-8m-family-armcortex-a53-cortex-m4-audio-voice-video:i.MX8M
02:54 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.nxp.com/assets/images/en/block-diagrams/NXP-iMX_8M_BlockDiagram-FINAL.jpg
02:54 PM fragalot: I'm more interested in the software stepping part you mentioned
02:55 PM fragalot: but I can't really see it in the specs, unless i'm looking in the wrong place
02:55 PM CaptHindsight: 2-4 ARM A53 cores so 1 for real time tasks and 1-3 more for non-real and 2 M4's for software stepping
02:55 PM fragalot: ah like that
02:56 PM CaptHindsight: like the BBB only with an GPU that has open drivers
02:56 PM CaptHindsight: so you get accelerated HD graphics vs 1-2 fps
02:56 PM fragalot: the little chip that could.
02:57 PM CaptHindsight: so x86 is still lower cost
02:58 PM CaptHindsight: I saw a dual core Atom board for $34 with some GPIO, only 6 GPIO that can software step but nothing left for inputs
02:58 PM fragalot: does it have SPI pins?
02:58 PM fragalot: because SPI based I/O chips can be more than fast enough these days
02:59 PM CaptHindsight: was thinking you could probably use a $1-2 FPGA to mux the GPIO to get more available
02:59 PM CaptHindsight: i think it had SPI and PCIe
02:59 PM CaptHindsight: let me find the link
03:00 PM CaptHindsight: http://linuxgizmos.com/intel-cherry-trail-based-hacker-board-launches-for-34/
03:00 PM CaptHindsight: has open schematics
03:00 PM fragalot: pretty neat really
03:01 PM CaptHindsight: TTL serial debug up to 3.6Mbps , not usre of the latency through the UART's FIFO
03:01 PM CaptHindsight: usre/sure
03:01 PM fragalot: for debug i've really come to like Segger's RTT
03:02 PM fragalot: print out debug strings all you want (within reason) and the cpu cost is equivalent to a simple memcpy
03:02 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.digital-loggers.com/api.html
03:04 PM CaptHindsight: not sure if the BIOS lets you configure the 6 GPIO outs as suitable for real time stepping
03:05 PM CaptHindsight: they aren't using coreboot
03:07 PM CaptHindsight: over 100 million Alexa devices have been sold....
03:07 PM fragalot: and the 3-letter agencies have never been happier
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: if you told me 20 years ago that people would be lining up to buy devices that spy on them I would not have believed you
03:08 PM fragalot: I like to go into people's homes that have them and ask 'alexa, please set up a monthly order for toilet paper'
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: I don't think any of this will be solved in my lifetime even if i live to be 120
03:09 PM CaptHindsight: yeah tons of fun
03:09 PM CaptHindsight: South Park did a wonderful episode on Alexa and similar
03:10 PM fragalot: I loved the fallout from that episode
03:10 PM fragalot: devices around the globe going wild
03:10 PM CaptHindsight: watching the show with the volume loud enough started all sorts of fun in peoples homes
03:10 PM CaptHindsight: yeah, and still they don't learn
03:11 PM CaptHindsight: i think you can get people to line up to be shot in the head first if you market it right
03:11 PM fragalot: i've got a similarly annoying issue here
03:11 PM fragalot: my tv *THINKS* it has a microphone
03:11 PM fragalot: so every time you do something that has an input field
03:11 PM fragalot: it says "please say what you want to do"
03:11 PM fragalot: followed by
03:11 PM fragalot: "I didn't get that"
03:11 PM CaptHindsight: hah
03:11 PM fragalot: and THEN you can enter it manually
03:12 PM fragalot: but even though it has the letters on the remote, T9 style input doesn't work
03:12 PM fragalot: >.>
03:12 PM CaptHindsight: I just shout profanities to do things to itself when the opportunity presents itself
03:13 PM CaptHindsight: haven't seen any Alexa on Alexa action yet though
03:13 PM CaptHindsight: someday
03:13 PM fragalot: I'd imagine they would have safeguarded it from looping?
03:14 PM fragalot: hmph
03:14 PM fragalot: I got a trackball the other day
03:14 PM CaptHindsight: thought about doing to RE on them to see what fun can ensue
03:14 PM fragalot: and it appears to respond to "left" moves more than "right" so the cursor always veers left
03:15 PM CaptHindsight: quality
03:15 PM fragalot: it was cheap. ish.
03:15 PM CaptHindsight: how was work this week? Seems like full swing won't be until Monday
03:16 PM fragalot: doesn't matter for my current job, that one's full swing every day
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: what's the school year like there? Are most out the 2 weeks around xmas to New years?
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: or longer
03:17 PM fragalot: I think it's longer
03:17 PM fragalot: but I may be wrong. :-)
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: http://linuxgizmos.com/worlds-smallest-quad-core-sbc-starts-at-8-dollars/
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: connect to FPGA over ethernet
03:19 PM fragalot: what will you use for the interface then?
03:19 PM fragalot: USB -> HDMI ?
03:20 PM CaptHindsight: has integrated Ethernet MAC
03:20 PM CaptHindsight: so real time ethernet -> Mesa FPGA
03:20 PM fragalot: doesn't the mesa board require to be alone on the network to guarantee realtime operation?
03:20 PM CaptHindsight: yeah
03:20 PM fragalot: so the only other user interface option is the USB connection
03:21 PM CaptHindsight: so you can have a second Ethernet on USB for connection to a LAN
03:21 PM fragalot: does it have a real ethernet interface, or is it also on the same USB bus like the older RPi's
03:22 PM CaptHindsight: no it's integrated in the SOC
03:22 PM CaptHindsight: internal high speed bus
03:22 PM fragalot: I may get one of these. looks like fun
03:22 PM CaptHindsight: but looking at the pinout I don't see that they connected the GPU outs
03:22 PM CaptHindsight: :(
03:24 PM CaptHindsight: I think the cheap board makes always look at what a CNC machine might need and make sure those signals are not routed :)
03:24 PM fragalot: :D
03:24 PM CaptHindsight: makes/makers
03:25 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.orangepi.org/
03:26 PM CaptHindsight: ^^ these all have integrated NIC's
03:26 PM CaptHindsight: but mali GPU's
03:27 PM CaptHindsight: with enough cores you can still get fast video (software rendered)
03:27 PM CaptHindsight: to run Axis GUI
03:27 PM CaptHindsight: SPI or ethernet to --> Mesa FPGA
03:29 PM CaptHindsight: vs the recent Raspi with SPI --> Mesa FPGA, and the GPU has open drivers now
03:32 PM CaptHindsight: gotta run, almost dark here again
03:32 PM fragalot: hasn't even gotten light out here today
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: way up to 50F here today
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: 10C
03:33 PM fragalot: yea we kinda skipped winter entirely
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: >10C more than average
03:34 PM fragalot: Aye
03:36 PM CaptHindsight: it's grey here nearly the entire winter
03:36 PM CaptHindsight: bbl
03:45 PM Deejay: gn8
03:46 PM enleth: have you ever seen a coax indicator that has a secondary display showing whether the feeler's plane of movement is currently parallel or perpendicular to the dial/restraining arm? it just occurred to me that this would be a mechanically simple and useful feature for powered use in a mill
03:48 PM enleth: something like those displays on a pimped out analog wirst watch showing the moon phase and other misc information, just a window in the dial face with a sliding part painted in two colors with a dividing line underneath
03:49 PM enleth: so it would alternate between all white and all black for example, as the feeler traverses quadrants of the full circle
03:51 PM enleth: as a visual aid to see which axis is contributing more to the needle deflection without having to track the position of the feeler, kinda difficult when dialing in under power
03:55 PM enleth: actually, it could also just be a third needle, or a disc with the feeler's position marked, side by side with the rotation counter
06:49 PM Vitran: Is there an f error pin for the spindle
07:28 PM andypugh: Vitran No because even if you have a closed loop spindle LinuxCNC is unaware of that fact
07:30 PM andypugh: To an extent the spindle-at-speed pin has a similalr function. But a spindle will generally be not at speed very much more often than an axis will be out of position.
10:16 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
11:58 PM elmo40: how do you guys find the stability of LinuxCNC?