#linuxcnc Logs
Dec 04 2018
#linuxcnc Calendar
02:17 AM Deejay: moin
04:49 AM jthornton: morning
04:50 AM XXCoder: hey jthornton
05:02 AM jthornton: what's up this morning?
05:06 AM XXCoder: not a lot. today I worked at cell. kinda fast but still better than croach
05:07 AM Tom_L: morning
05:07 AM XXCoder: hey
05:08 AM XXCoder: oh and we had ice frost today
05:08 AM XXCoder: first for year
05:08 AM Tom_L: 24°F Hi 40
05:08 AM XXCoder: tomorrow and next few days wont even reach 40f
05:10 AM jthornton: we didn't get that cold last night
07:04 AM weenerdog: howdy
07:07 AM weenerdog: everyone must be in the shop loading up their machine and getting it choochin :)
07:08 AM jthornton: still down here in the beer cave programming
07:09 AM weenerdog: finally getting the hang of nailing things together in sw assembly. fun sidetrack. i dont hate it anymore
07:09 AM jthornton: and trying to get linuxcnc loaded on the pc I stole from the garage server rack
07:11 AM jthornton: yea once you get the hang of defining relations in the assembly it gets easy, I like to use construction lines a lot to mate with so I can move things by changing the dimension
07:12 AM weenerdog: i been r'in tfm on linuxcnc.org too, getting ready for that adventure.
07:12 AM weenerdog: yeah that was the thing lol. i was rotating parts to nowhere in particular and making a bald spot til i got relations
07:13 AM weenerdog: autocad it aint
07:13 AM methods_: relations is the hardest thing to grasp when moving from 2d cad
07:13 AM methods_: after you get that sorted it's much easier
07:14 AM weenerdog: nah i been doing 3d for 25 years. i just needed to learn sw's paradidjum fer it
07:16 AM weenerdog: its gonna be way more useful. especially for the manner in which i use cad.
07:18 AM weenerdog: like... for years, even if i designed something stupid like a deck, i did it in 3d. had a library of lumber primitives and just sawed'em on the screen.
07:20 AM weenerdog: was lost without the mighty command line
07:30 AM weenerdog: i'm being tempted. 2 1500mm rails, 4 bearing slides, 1605 lead screw, pillow blocks, coupling blah blah blah $157 american pesos
07:31 AM weenerdog: pretty much everything for a chinesium x & y for 300
07:32 AM weenerdog: sbr16
08:04 AM jthornton: yea I think the deb is building on Linux Mint 18.3 now
08:13 AM weenerdog: the deb for what?
08:21 AM jthornton: linuxcnc uspace master
08:21 AM jthornton: looks like the preempt kernel is building now so time to hit the shower
08:52 AM PLger: someone on MESA here
08:53 AM PLger: pcw_home: Online ?
08:59 AM PLger: reeboot
09:03 AM jthornton: just ask your question...
09:39 AM PLger: In the Forum somoeone Named Jepler is this Person here
09:40 AM PLger: One here has Installed Stretch DVD to Harddrive
12:34 PM Tom_L: gloops how's the nose holdin up?
12:35 PM Tom_L: you smacked yourself a while back iirc
12:38 PM gloops: its just come right Tom_L, i can squeeze it and no pain, i think there was some kind of infection half of my face was throbbing and my ear, couldnt bite properly
12:38 PM gloops: i manned it out though
01:27 PM fragalot: hi
02:11 PM JT-Shop2: hi
02:18 PM emsjessec: hi, anyone know of a better way of de-tabbing waterjet parts?
02:22 PM fragalot: compared to what?
02:29 PM emsjessec: using a set of plyers, and grinding the tabs off on a belt sander
02:29 PM emsjessec: there are two problems, breaking the parts off the sheet and removing the remnants from the freed part
02:30 PM emsjessec: parts can be in various shapes and sizes on a sheet
02:37 PM SpeedEvil is now known as Guest29330
03:06 PM ziper: _unreal_, you around?
03:28 PM Deejay: gn8
03:35 PM BitEvil is now known as SpeedEvil
04:31 PM weenerdog: howdy
04:51 PM jthornton: howdy
04:54 PM weenerdog: supp
04:55 PM jthornton: gotta clean off my table down here in the beer cave and organize my crap
04:56 PM weenerdog: haha right now the forecast says 8-12 inches saturday, 12+ inches sunday, 8-12 inches monday lol
04:56 PM jthornton: on the other hand I'm trying to figure out how to router 3 dovetails 120° apart on a chunk of wood... so far not having much luck getting the sides even
04:56 PM jthornton: snow I assume
04:56 PM weenerdog: ja
04:56 PM weenerdog: i've seen 4'
04:56 PM weenerdog: in 93
04:56 PM weenerdog: but 3 is a lot
04:57 PM jthornton: I've seen more than that but I cheat I was born in Alaska on King Salmon Island
04:58 PM weenerdog: heh i'm in NC
04:58 PM weenerdog: i was stationed in montana
04:59 PM jthornton: what part of NC?
04:59 PM CaptHindsight: somebody make this post on mail list, maybe Russian Spy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktF0dPyL890&feature=youtu.be
04:59 PM weenerdog: mountains. about the highest part. 4100'
04:59 PM weenerdog: 30 min south of boone right on the nc/tn line
05:00 PM jthornton: that is a cool place in the winter :)
05:00 PM jthornton: grandparents and aunts/uncles lived in Greensboro, sister lives in Concord
05:00 PM CaptHindsight: howdo of turbine for min=-jet engines
05:01 PM CaptHindsight: min=/mini
05:04 PM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/ktF0dPyL890?t=806 looks very crudeksy
05:13 PM weenerdog: he's handcrankin that shit?
05:13 PM jthornton: weird my monitor left roswell ga went to doraville ga then back to roswell ga and won't get here until the 11th... 8 days to ship from GA is a bit bad
05:13 PM andypugh: Results are simutaneously horrible and impressive
05:14 PM weenerdog: A for effort
05:14 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEy6t5uWg-Y
05:14 PM CaptHindsight: homemade RC sized Turbo-Jet
05:19 PM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/kHEqdVt4SGA?t=250
05:21 PM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/jje0wV4l0tM?t=23
05:23 PM andypugh: Oh UPS how I hate you!
05:24 PM andypugh: UPS have my package, they have posted a note through the door saying i was out.
05:24 PM CaptHindsight: and a bad time of year as well for shipping anything
05:25 PM CaptHindsight: was you home?
05:25 PM andypugh: But, after creating an unnecessary “UPS MyChoice” account in order to reschedule delivery they deny that I have any packages due to be delivered.
05:25 PM CaptHindsight: nice
05:25 PM andypugh: I have no idea how they link packages to customers, but clearly badly.
05:26 PM CaptHindsight: your Parcel Farce is worse from my experience
05:26 PM andypugh: No option to enter tracking or “infonotice” numbers in to the system
05:27 PM jthornton: do you have the tracking number?
05:27 PM CaptHindsight: they could not deliver a parcel to a business that had an entire street named after the business
05:27 PM CaptHindsight: anywhere on the street would have been fine
05:28 PM andypugh: I can (sometimes) get to a button in the “tracking” section that lets me enter an “infonotice” number, but that then tells me “please fix the following error: Our system is temporarily unavailable”. Surely it is their job to fix that error, not mine?
05:28 PM andypugh: jthornton: Yes, I have been tracking the package since it left the US
05:29 PM jthornton: it took me an hour yesterday to pay a UPS bill, it kept telling me it was broken
05:29 PM andypugh: It’s the most horrible web site, what you see in the tracking screens seems to depend on the route you took through the site to get there. And none of it seems to really work.
05:30 PM CaptHindsight: yeah UPS websites are often broken
05:30 PM andypugh: (Packages still show as due for delivery today, but today ends in 30 mins, and they already posted the card)
05:30 PM CaptHindsight: I only have a freight account with them
05:31 PM CaptHindsight: will probably track more accurately in 12+ hours
05:31 PM andypugh: Yes, but in 12 hours they will have, once again, found me out at work rather than at home.
05:33 PM CaptHindsight: of course, i waited for a package the Wednesday before Thanksgiving, they missed us by knocking silently then not retrying delivery until Monday vs the next business day FRIDAY
05:33 PM CaptHindsight: loads of fun
05:36 PM jthornton: signature required?
05:37 PM andypugh: Mine? Probably. Shipping alone cost ÂŁ270
05:37 PM andypugh: (It’s my Faro arm)
05:37 PM jthornton: ouch
05:37 PM jthornton: what is a Faro arm?
05:38 PM andypugh: It’s an Arm made by Faro :-)
05:39 PM jthornton: a digitizing arm?
05:39 PM andypugh: Yes
05:46 PM _unreal_: _unreal_
05:46 PM _unreal_: ziper, yes?
05:49 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.faro.com/products/factory-metrology/faroarm/faroarm-7/
05:51 PM andypugh: Mine is much older, of course. And if I had known how much shipping would be I wouldn’t have bothered
06:14 PM _unreal_: do any of you guys know of cheap unipolar stepper motor drivers like the A4988's for example?
06:17 PM andypugh: Why do you want unpolar?
06:19 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.pololu.com/category/120/stepper-motor-drivers
06:19 PM CaptHindsight: selection of CHEAP
06:23 PM Rab: _unreal_, here's a board based on the SLA7078MPR: https://www.ebay.com/itm/280911250280
06:24 PM Rab: There are other chips like the DRV8805, but I'm not aware of any cheap breakout boards.
06:26 PM CaptHindsight: Rab: did you see my link above?
06:27 PM CaptHindsight: it's got a bunch of boards
06:27 PM Tom_L: andypugh what are you gonna 3d digitize?
06:28 PM Tom_L: well nothing... until you get it..
06:30 PM Rab: CaptHindsight, I did. Do any of those support unipolar steppers?
06:31 PM andypugh: Tom_L: I want it for measuring thinkgs like critical points on the area where the radiator mounts on the fire engine. That sort of reverse-engineering. PLus I want to play around with kinematics.
06:31 PM Tom_L: fun
06:32 PM andypugh: _unreal_: I repeat: Why do you want unipolar drivers? You can drive any stepper motor with a bipolar driver by ignoring some wires.
06:32 PM CaptHindsight: Rab: yes, since "like" was the word he used
06:32 PM andypugh: (and the stepper will perform better)
06:34 PM CaptHindsight: I think he's keeping us in suspense
06:34 PM CaptHindsight: _unreal_: are you still there?
06:36 PM Tom_L: how many decimal places do you typically use in a metric gcode file?
06:36 PM Tom_L: i want to make a metric post for my cam
06:36 PM Tom_L: i'm using 3.4 for linear and 3.2 for angular in inchi would imagine in mm you would need more in front of the decimal like 4.3 or maybe even 5.3
06:36 PM Tom_L: 0000.000
06:49 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXuJ4s7aAGw Circle Cycle engine
06:49 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7stg_fmtaQ running
06:57 PM andypugh: Tom_L: Any reason not to use 4.4 ? It’s excessive, but so what. only the nterpreter sees the G-code
06:57 PM Tom_L: no, just not that familiar with metric format
06:57 PM Tom_L: that's why i asked :)
06:59 PM Tom_L: that could go all sorts of wrong if those pistons got mis'aligned
07:00 PM sync: andypugh: you could just have told me
07:00 PM _unreal_: hi
07:01 PM _unreal_: baaa $60
07:01 PM _unreal_: was looking for the $6 ish at most $ boards
07:01 PM _unreal_: kills me everything has gone bipolar
07:01 PM andypugh: Can you explain what your objection is to bipolar?
07:02 PM _unreal_: andypugh, only because I have a CNC machine I built that has very nice unipolar motors on it...
07:02 PM andypugh: Do you have some kind of bipolar disorder?
07:02 PM _unreal_: I have the drivers I an just slugish to build the PCB's
07:02 PM _unreal_: MAYBE :)
07:02 PM andypugh: There’s no such thing as a bipolar stepper motor
07:03 PM _unreal_: I've had 2 beers so far "shock top belgian white" and now working on a large martini
07:03 PM andypugh: Sorry, I mean there is no such thing as an _exclusively_ _unipolar_ stepper motor
07:03 PM _unreal_: yes there is
07:03 PM _unreal_: 5 wire
07:03 PM andypugh: Well, apart from that…
07:03 PM _unreal_: .....
07:04 PM _unreal_: Rab, I thought drv8805 is bipolar?
07:04 PM andypugh: I read somewhere that any motor could be run bipolar, and I have only ever seen 4 6 or 8.
07:04 PM SpeedEvil: andypugh: switched reluctance?
07:05 PM andypugh: But yes, if it really is 4 phases and a common, then that’s pretty much dedicated unipolar.
07:05 PM _unreal_: andypugh, I have a small hand full of step-syn unipolar steppers....
07:05 PM _unreal_: there equals in bipolar motors are like $40 each easy
07:05 PM _unreal_: they are all 400+ oz'inch
07:06 PM andypugh: Have you considered taking the back cover off to see if there is an obvious way to separate the phases at the common wire?
07:06 PM _unreal_: I'm kind of stuck in a bleep spot. though the CNC machine I'm SLOOOOOOOOOOWly working on is using bipolar. the one I'm talking about currently is a home machine
07:06 PM _unreal_: no way
07:06 PM _unreal_: to much risk of killing the MAG...
07:06 PM _unreal_: and loosing power
07:07 PM _unreal_: never EVER take apart a stepper.
07:07 PM andypugh: Of all the possible motot mods, splitting at the common seems about as easy as it gets.
07:07 PM andypugh: You can take the back off, as long as you leave the rotor in place.
07:07 PM _unreal_: you DONT take the risk.... if the core goes out of field. it kills the mag field for ever
07:08 PM _unreal_: out of field is just 1 degree
07:08 PM andypugh: Yes, so don’t take the rotor out
07:08 PM _unreal_: that is TILT
07:08 PM andypugh: <not convinced>
07:09 PM _unreal_: Wow 1lb no rinse sanatizer for home brew $7 amazon
07:09 PM andypugh: Anyway… Sleep
07:09 PM _unreal_: I do a lot of home brew
07:09 PM * _unreal_ goes wide eyed.... I've tried just opening a motor before a lost a lot of power... NEVER again
07:09 PM _unreal_: a=and
07:10 PM _unreal_: I killed a nice set of steppers doing that...... never let my self get over it
07:18 PM sync: _unreal_: it really depends on which kind of magnets you have in there
07:18 PM sync: most newer ones you cannot kill anymore
07:18 PM sync: well "kill", only the torque constant will be lower
07:24 PM _unreal_: as far as I am concerned loss is KILL
07:25 PM _unreal_: if it does not match the lable its been killed
07:27 PM sync: pfft
07:27 PM sync: so what, it's legacy anyway
07:45 PM ziper: _unreal_, i have a plug I want to use, but the surface finish sucks. any reason I can't just drape it in release film
09:08 PM _unreal_: gu
09:08 PM _unreal_: hi
09:08 PM _unreal_: ziper, I dont know just had bad the surface finish sucks
09:08 PM _unreal_: I need details... and NO there is no reason you cant but with out providing a few more details my responces are limited...
09:09 PM _unreal_: got I fee like irobot :)
09:09 PM _unreal_: god
09:21 PM _unreal_: ziper, long/and the short of it.. depending on what you need/want for a finish or what is acceptable... if your building a PLUG that is a one off that your likely to kill... depends on what you need want..... if you dont need a perfect finish. you could easly wrap it with a PEELPLY or use 2" blue tape the 2020 I believe... the resin resistant tape.... and then wax it with green wax.........
09:22 PM _unreal_: there are a lot of options available... it really depends on what is it that you need and or what you need for minimums... in regards to finish quality..
09:22 PM ziper: I have a plug that I want to take a female off of
09:22 PM ziper: I'll make two products from the single mold
09:22 PM _unreal_: back in 5 at most.. putting my daughter to bed..... yes its late
09:26 PM _unreal_: ok tickled the hell out of my daughter :)
09:26 PM _unreal_: i?
09:26 PM _unreal_: ?
09:26 PM _unreal_: got photos
09:26 PM _unreal_: 2 products from the same mold has me saying whaaa?
09:27 PM ziper: https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=48024&g2_serialNumber=7
09:27 PM ziper: see the plastic hatch?
09:28 PM ziper: I want to take a mold off that, and also put a seat in it
09:28 PM ziper: like this https://sailstiletto.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/20160229_171604.jpg
09:28 PM _unreal_: plastic hatch or plastic DARK windshield?
09:29 PM ziper: it doesnt need to be seethru
09:30 PM _unreal_: ok.... so wax the hell out of it. and mold it with epoxy.
09:30 PM _unreal_: epoxy and boat cloth
09:31 PM _unreal_: you can mold anything as long as its not going to chemically react
09:31 PM ziper: why not junk resin
09:31 PM _unreal_: as in VE? OR poly?
09:31 PM ziper: cheap poly
09:31 PM _unreal_: or are you talking more like swill gelcoat/ve-poly
09:32 PM _unreal_: what ever
09:32 PM _unreal_: as LONG as its not going to attact it chemically
09:32 PM _unreal_: I dont know
09:32 PM _unreal_: i"m just looking at a photo
09:33 PM ziper: its lexan or PMMA or whatever
09:33 PM _unreal_: most plastics will not tolerate acetone. if it cant take acetone be careful with ve/poly on it... they may react
09:33 PM _unreal_: again I dont know I'd suggest looking it up
09:34 PM _unreal_: You can always also wax/PVA to be on the safe side
09:34 PM _unreal_: poly vynal acetate
09:34 PM ziper: but is there any reason I can't skip that crap and just drape it in vacuum bang and peel ply?
09:35 PM _unreal_: if you dont mind risking messing up the original...
09:35 PM _unreal_: I would always use a release agent
09:35 PM _unreal_: hell mold release 818
09:36 PM _unreal_: https://www.grp-solutions.com/products-release-agents/
09:36 PM ziper: oh, the old one is all dinged up, thats why the surface finish sucks, from old repairs
09:36 PM _unreal_: USE a resperator with this stuff
09:36 PM _unreal_: ya but you have a STRONG chance of bonding if not using a release
09:36 PM _unreal_: or having to CHIP out the old form....
09:36 PM _unreal_: and loosing it
09:37 PM ziper: is there any reason to use the old style wax instead of that wipe on stuff like that?
09:37 PM _unreal_: you can always use clay to fill in scratches etc...
09:37 PM _unreal_: That is one question I'm not 100% sure about
09:37 PM _unreal_: nice question
09:38 PM _unreal_: I would assume that the wax will do a better job then a wipe on mold release
09:38 PM _unreal_: as far as being a chemcial barrier
09:39 PM _unreal_: but dont quote me on that.... again PVA is the kind chumb chumb of barriers
09:39 PM _unreal_: kind=king
09:40 PM ziper: i have no idea what chumb chumb means lol
09:40 PM _unreal_: chum chum
09:40 PM _unreal_: chum=chump
09:40 PM _unreal_: typically stated as chum
09:41 PM ziper: whats the deal with making gasoline tanks?
09:41 PM ziper: no epoxy?
09:41 PM _unreal_: king chum chum. must be a Maine thing.
09:42 PM _unreal_: can be VE or epoxy... but often finished with a custom epoxy resin liner
09:42 PM _unreal_: also depends are you talking GAS or diesel?
09:42 PM ziper: gasoline
09:42 PM ziper: the one i'm thinking about making is about 5 gallons, custom shape and size
09:43 PM _unreal_: gas is typically done with a special epoxy ligner resin
09:43 PM ziper: easy enough to just build it and slosh it around inside, no?
09:44 PM _unreal_: ya if its personal the reason does not matter much... but most fuel tanks are done with a special fuel grate epoxy... NOT for glass layup but to seal. period
09:44 PM _unreal_: depends on the viscosity so yes/noe
09:44 PM _unreal_: no
10:17 PM roycroft: the folks who make por-15 make a gas tank liner that works brilliantly
10:19 PM roycroft: i've used it on several volkswagen fuel tanks that were decades old and not in the best shape
10:19 PM roycroft: i take them to a radiator shop to have them boiled out, then i slosh the por-15 sealer around the inside and paint the outside
10:19 PM roycroft: https://www.por15.com/POR-15-Fuel-Tank-Sealer
10:28 PM sync: yeah that stuff works well
10:28 PM sync: although I had it fail for whatever reason once
10:32 PM roycroft: the tank needs to be squeaky clean for it to work
10:32 PM roycroft: i've always used it right after getting a tank back from being boiled out
10:33 PM roycroft: i don't always paint the outside right away, but i always use the por-15 immediately
10:33 PM sync: yeah, I etched the inside like I always do with phosphoric acid but it did not work
10:33 PM sync: another tank I did together with it is still fine
10:34 PM roycroft: there might have been some contaminant that the phosphoric acid cold not remove
10:34 PM roycroft: maybe a silicone based sealant
10:34 PM sync: maybe, but unlikely
10:36 PM sync: I did it again after I stripped it out and it worked
10:36 PM sync: idk
10:38 PM sync: I should possibly start being more aggressive with the cleaning agents
10:38 PM sync: so far I only use KOH + phosphoric
10:40 PM ziper: does that need metal to bond to or is it plastic?
10:46 PM sync: it's just some epoxy
10:58 PM ziper: sweet
11:16 PM roycroft: but it is very gasoline and alchol resistant
11:16 PM roycroft: alcohol