#linuxcnc Logs

Dec 01 2018

02:14 AM Deejay: moin
02:23 AM gloops: how come i always end up drawing dovetails first thing in the morning
02:25 AM XXCoder: lol. heys
03:05 AM gloops: hi
03:29 AM XXCoder: hey JT-Shop
03:29 AM XXCoder: jthornton:
03:57 AM XXCoder: I wonder how well this would work as linuxcnc pc https://www.loverpi.com/collections/le-potato/products/libre-computer-board-aml-s905x-cc
03:58 AM XXCoder: problem is lack of parallel port, or any port for MESA or addition of parallel port
04:04 AM MarcelineVQ: plug a parallel breakout into that gpio :>
04:04 AM MarcelineVQ: or move to ethernet
04:11 AM gloops: https://ibb.co/XJd6VDh
04:12 AM rmu: XXCoder: it would work with SPI with the 7i90 or the upcoming (?) 7c80
04:13 AM gloops: so for box making, for a 100mm high box, cut the dovetails in a 100mm board, then saw the top off on table saw when the whole box is glued
04:13 AM XXCoder: 7i90 build of linuxcnc or?
04:13 AM gloops: 4mm seperation in the dovetails where the lid is sawn, for saw blade cut + a bit of planing
04:13 AM XXCoder: or MESA'
04:13 AM rmu: XXCoder: BUT you would need a rt-preempt kernel, I didn't manage to boot one and gave up in the meantime
04:13 AM rmu: MESA 7i90
04:13 AM gloops: then when the lid goes back on, the dovetails remain evenly spaced
04:15 AM rmu: XXCoder: and i suspect the hm2_spi driver won't work reliably
04:17 AM XXCoder: ok
04:17 AM XXCoder: gloops: so it worked well? blended and all?
04:20 AM gloops: ive not cut this version yet
04:20 AM XXCoder: ok
04:21 AM gloops: leaving the drawing there for today lol, ive got my head round it now
04:21 AM XXCoder: :)
04:23 AM XXCoder: lol https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DtRfOAqXgAIDfoP.jpg
04:23 AM XXCoder: man people is merciless on those blood trees.
04:24 AM gloops: what are they?
04:25 AM XXCoder: xmas trees. apparently.
04:25 AM XXCoder: the added stuff is its now those "yep" and "nop" muppets
04:27 AM gloops: ah yeah
04:30 AM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTc3PsW5ghQ yep yep yep yep
04:32 AM gloops: been a few years since i watched that lol
04:33 AM XXCoder: long time for me. that show never interested me, and when they finally started captioning shows, i was already past target age
04:33 AM XXCoder: btw they started captioning well before many kid shows did
04:34 AM gloops: something the majority never think about, but so important to the minority
04:35 AM XXCoder: one company who used to make sure games were captioned suddenly decided not to for one game
04:35 AM XXCoder: there was pretty large outage
04:35 AM gloops: if they ran a few shows with no sound people might start thinking about it
04:36 AM XXCoder: yeah
04:39 AM MarcelineVQ: that's weird, not captioning, half the places you'd watch a game at you can't hear it
04:39 AM MarcelineVQ: Not that you'll die if you don't heard the announcers ehe
04:40 AM XXCoder: not out world games. computer games
04:44 AM MarcelineVQ: Oh? There's definitely no excuse to skip sub-titles/captioning in games
04:44 AM MarcelineVQ: You already have a script :D
04:45 AM XXCoder: indeed
04:45 AM XXCoder: its worse when its remake, and orginial had it
04:46 AM sensille: for a 20mm face mill, fusion proposes 870PRM and 350mm/min, cutting wood. is this reasonable?
04:47 AM gloops: no
04:47 AM XXCoder: MarcelineVQ: https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-11-19-activision-does-poor-job-of-placating-spyro-fans-angry-at-missing-subtitle-accessibility-options
04:48 AM MarcelineVQ: Ah yeah, they also don't let you turn off motion blur which really messed with some people and streaming.
04:48 AM MarcelineVQ: That stuff aside it's a really good remake though
04:48 AM MarcelineVQ: Especially given that activision maked them rush it out
04:48 AM XXCoder: that one is awful as its "its my way or highway"
04:48 AM XXCoder: motion blurs would make me SICK
04:48 AM XXCoder: as in cant walk
04:49 AM gloops: sensille get spindle up to 16000+ - move as fast as practical
04:49 AM MarcelineVQ: I turn off motion blur and depth of field because I can't see the goddamn enemies, they blur into the fucking scenery
04:49 AM MarcelineVQ: "man, this blob keeps shooting me, what the heck"
04:50 AM XXCoder: heh reminds me of fighting polyagons movie
04:50 AM sensille: gloops: max spindle rpm is 24k. "move as fast as" means the feedrate? so something like 1000mm/min?
04:50 AM XXCoder: I cheered for one side, whatever it is, to win first so fight would end and I can finally see who won
04:50 AM gloops: yeah, depending how deep a cut you want to make, 1000mm+
04:51 AM XXCoder: because, like I said, it was just bunch of polyagons fighting. cant tell which is which lol
04:51 AM XXCoder: oh yeah real movie name is the first transformers movie
04:51 AM gloops: it wont cut well at 870 in fact i doubt it will cut at all
04:51 AM MarcelineVQ: haha, a.k.a. Sound Effect Battle: War For The Polygons
04:52 AM sensille: ok, thanks. i want to mill off 2mm
04:52 AM MarcelineVQ: That shit is obnoxious, be glad you're spared it. A person can lament missing some sounds but those weren't of them.
04:52 AM jthornton: morning
04:53 AM gloops: depends on your machine, i can take 2mm off pine in one pass with 20mm cutter easily, could do 2 1mm passes or whatever
04:53 AM gloops: those high speed spindles have all the torque at the top speeds, very little at low speeds, also router cutters are usually designed to work in excess of 12000 rpm
04:55 AM gloops: as a rule of thumb the bigger diamter cutter, the lower rpm you need - the outer edge of the cutter is moving faster
04:57 AM jthornton: XXCoder: I wonder if that has a real ethernet chip
04:57 AM XXCoder: good question
04:57 AM XXCoder: that'd play hell on latency if it hits cpu for ethernet handling.
04:58 AM jthornton: well the rpi has a usb ethernet thing so can't use it for the ethernet boards
04:59 AM jthornton: dang it's going to be 70°F today!
05:00 AM XXCoder: one of those boards is $45 though I'd wait for confirmion they actually produced and shipped em out first.
05:00 AM XXCoder: 2 gb models. theres 512 mb ram and 1 gb editions also.
05:05 AM gloops: miserable drizzling rain here
05:05 AM gloops: always
05:05 AM XXCoder: washington state?
05:05 AM MarcelineVQ: XXCoder: hehe
05:05 AM gloops: yorkshire, UK lol
05:05 AM XXCoder: ah dont know there
05:05 AM XXCoder: it feels like 99% of rain goes to washinton state west side lol
05:05 AM jthornton: yea been raining all night here I'm pretty sure my fire has gone out by now
05:06 AM gloops: nothing has been dry for weeks
05:07 AM gloops: was going to do bandsaw today, old motor was kaput and strange fitting so made a pulley adaptor so any motor with a pulley can drive it
05:08 AM gloops: or engine heh
05:09 AM XXCoder: or you
05:10 AM gloops: pedals are a last resort lol
05:14 AM XXCoder: yep lol
05:14 AM XXCoder: just read a book and pedal you wuss
05:15 AM gloops: better off with 300 hamster wheels
05:30 AM sensille: gloops: that worked nicely. i still can slightly feel the pattern from the runs. does that mean the spindle isn't completely square? or do i need some overlap?
05:31 AM XXCoder: did you do perfectly edge to edge cut? or half overlap?
05:31 AM gloops: hmm, are you running the 20mm cutter at 20mm spaces?
05:31 AM XXCoder: usually good idea to have some overlap even of nicely square
05:31 AM gloops: yes, called 'stepover'
05:33 AM sensille: looks like fusion chose 19mm. i'll do another run with more overlap going vertically instead of horizontally
05:34 AM XXCoder: well if you got material to waste, do 2 squares of mill flat by tool
05:34 AM XXCoder: one in X rows, and other in Y rows
05:34 AM XXCoder: it'll tell you whats happening
05:34 AM gloops: you want to be less than half usually, depends what the task is really
05:34 AM gloops: lemme see what vectric gives as default for 20mm
05:36 AM gloops: for 19mm endmill stepover is is 7.6mm for pocketing
05:36 AM gloops: you want to try about 8mm
05:37 AM sensille: ok, thanks
05:37 AM XXCoder: sensille: after you do those squares, you will be able to see how far off tool is
05:37 AM gloops: if you get ridges then you need to tram the spindle
05:37 AM XXCoder: unless ridges is what you want lol
05:38 AM sensille: the ridges aren't completely consistent, so i'm afraid i'll never completely get rid of those
05:39 AM XXCoder: not consistent? you might be pushing spindle too hard
05:39 AM XXCoder: too much sideload
05:39 AM XXCoder: or maybe need tighten stuff up remove some backlash
05:40 AM sensille: not consistent between the 2 halfes of the board
05:40 AM sensille: i'm using the full range of the machine, trying to make a flat spoilboard
05:42 AM sensille: i don't see anything to adjust the spindle, i'll ask loetmichel later, he knows the machines (6040z)
05:42 AM weenerdog: good mawnin
05:43 AM gloops: could be some backlash or deflection somwhere, what machine is it sensille?
05:44 AM sensille: chinese 6040Z
05:44 AM sensille: i think the gantry is just not completly straight
05:46 AM gloops: yeah i think Loetmichel is up on those
05:46 AM XXCoder: sens yeah adjusting hardware itself to be better
05:46 AM XXCoder: you have something like two dial indictaor?
05:46 AM gloops: make sure its dead level all round
05:46 AM XXCoder: or maube just one
05:47 AM gloops: or at least, out of level consistently lol
05:47 AM gloops: you dont want one side up and one side down
05:48 AM sensille: i have one
05:48 AM Loetmichel: sensille: adjust it in which way?
05:49 AM sensille: but by milling the spoilboard it should be square to the board, no?
05:49 AM Loetmichel: yes
05:49 AM sensille: Loetmichel: i milled the spoilboard and got slight ridges
05:49 AM Loetmichel: ah
05:49 AM Loetmichel: you can only adjust it sideways
05:49 AM gloops: milling the spoil board will ensure a parallel plane to the cutter motion all over yes
05:49 AM sensille: even slightly different from one side to the other
05:49 AM gloops: but that is not always a solution
05:50 AM Loetmichel: if you losen all 4 clamps of the spindle (careful, it will fall down) you can turn it sideways a couple mm
05:50 AM weenerdog: would a big fat ass bit and tiny stepover work out the ridges?
05:50 AM sensille: sounds like it's very easy for me to only make it worse
05:51 AM Loetmichel: the other direction is done by shimming either the upper or lower clamp with "hasberg foil" (or aluminuim foil in a few layers, whatever you have handy)
05:51 AM gloops: you only need something you know is square, a metal block or something to get the spindle close enough to play with
05:51 AM gloops: push the square up to a long cutter in the spindle
05:51 AM gloops: and rotate the cutter by hand, see if it looks true
05:51 AM Loetmichel: gloops: even better if you have a ground dowel pin
05:51 AM Loetmichel: made of steel
05:52 AM gloops: yeah anything like that
05:52 AM Loetmichel: or a tool shaft that has no edges
05:52 AM gloops: if you want .0 accuracy you can start from there
05:52 AM XXCoder: can use dial test indictor or dial indictor to see how much angle you moved it
05:52 AM XXCoder: might make for fewer iternations of trueing
05:52 AM Loetmichel: sensille: in which direction do you have ridges?
05:52 AM gloops: yes
05:53 AM sensille: Loetmichel: also the first run showed that the spoilboard differed in relative height by about 0.5mm initially, might be the board, might be the bed itself
05:53 AM Loetmichel: thats normal
05:53 AM Loetmichel: the bed is made of extrusions.
05:53 AM gloops: thats ok, i was 1mm out
05:53 AM Loetmichel: those are not straight by any means
05:54 AM gloops: over 4 ft..
05:54 AM sensille: Loetmichel: i only tried milling along the longer edge
05:54 AM sensille: so never trust the bed?
05:54 AM Loetmichel: so the edge the gantry moves in?
05:54 AM sensille: yes
05:54 AM sensille: i'll try the other direction next, but with lower stepover
05:54 AM Loetmichel: yes, on those cheap machines its better to mill the spoilboard flat because the bed itself isnt.
05:54 AM sensille: i used 19mm for a 20mm mill
05:55 AM Loetmichel: router bit?
05:55 AM sensille: and with a vacuum bed you'd do the same?
05:55 AM Loetmichel: yes
05:55 AM XXCoder: Loetmichel: yeah though im not sure what would be best thing for me to do yet.
05:55 AM sensille: 20 mm router bit, yes
05:55 AM Loetmichel: and you got ridges in y direction?
05:55 AM XXCoder: sens i once ran one router (giant one) that had caps for vacuum when that spot woild not be holding a part down
05:56 AM XXCoder: interesting design. I learned to hate vacuum hold by that machine though
05:56 AM Loetmichel: (assuming you sit in front of it and not sideways like me)
05:56 AM gloops: you cant be certain that both rails are absolutely parallel, there will be some twist along the gantry movement, and some twist in the bed
05:56 AM gloops: small errors accumulate
05:56 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: i use painters tape to close any parts of the vaccum table that are larger than the workpiece
05:56 AM sensille: Loetmichel: ridges when moving my finger across the smaller direction, which i configured to be Y
05:57 AM gloops: for woodwork this is largely irrelevant unless you are talking a lot
05:57 AM XXCoder: I will never use vacuum hold.
05:57 AM Loetmichel: sensille: so your spindle is not aligned well in x
05:58 AM sensille: hard to talk in coordinates, i'm never sure we're talking about the same. misaligned in the direction i can fix by loosening the screws
05:58 AM Loetmichel: thats easy resolved: just losen up 3 of the four big inbus bolts that hold the spindle (DONT take them out, only losen them) , losen the fourth slightly but not completely and them take a brass/rubber mallet to tap the spindle in the right direction
05:59 AM Loetmichel: refasten all four bolts, try again
05:59 AM Loetmichel: if its good: try the other way for ridges
05:59 AM XXCoder: if has, use dial indictor to see how much you have moved it.
06:00 AM weenerdog: a speck of debris on the mating face would dick it up
06:00 AM Loetmichel: the otehr direction is harder because you would have to push some shims under one of the two holders of the spindle
06:00 AM Loetmichel: lets hope there are no ridges in that direction ;)
06:01 AM Loetmichel: weenerdog: spindle holder AND z plate are made of aluminium
06:01 AM Loetmichel: a spec of debris would just embed itself in the faces
06:01 AM Loetmichel: and not be a problem at all
06:01 AM XXCoder: only non alum parts of machines we are talking about is bolts, ballscrews and electrics stuiff
06:02 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: indeed
06:02 AM gloops: try this tramming method https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6pfIoyhgTc
06:03 AM Loetmichel: weenerdog: thats what sensille is doing atm: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=17171&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
06:03 AM Loetmichel: on the same kind of machine
06:03 AM sensille: Loetmichel: i compare it to the freshly milled spoilboard, right?
06:03 AM gloops: if you want to move the spindle along x dorection - shim top or bottom of the bracket
06:03 AM Loetmichel: just with a spoilboard, not a vacuumtable
06:04 AM Loetmichel: sensille: yes
06:04 AM sensille: using a square it is visibly very not square :)
06:04 AM Loetmichel: gloops: correct, its the only way
06:04 AM weenerdog: there you go
06:05 AM gloops: most woodwork is not required to be more square than a set square
06:05 AM gloops: (assuming the square IS square lol)
06:05 AM Loetmichel: (btw: that quarter inch phenolic paper stuff is a MESS when faced off ;)
06:06 AM Loetmichel: but its great as spoilboard because its waterproof but easy to mill
06:06 AM Loetmichel: so no problems when you accidentally or on pourpose mill into the board
06:06 AM sensille: i need to work my way up the precision ladder step by step :)
06:07 AM XXCoder: loet theres some plastics thats amazing good for milling also
06:07 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: its great because it doesent melt when the aluminium on top gets searing hot because of dull mill bit or overeager feedrates... ;)
06:07 AM Karlheinz: Hi together, just a short test if the reg. is successful :-)
06:08 AM Loetmichel: Karlheinz: looks like it.. german?
06:08 AM XXCoder: yeah theres plastics like that
06:08 AM Karlheinz: it is
06:08 AM XXCoder: ah not cutting itself but alum. hmm maybe not yeah lol
06:09 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: i use it for spolboard/vacuumtable top
06:09 AM XXCoder: indeed
06:09 AM Loetmichel: so i can still cool with water spray occasionally
06:09 AM Loetmichel: but have no problems when i do my usual thing of perforating sheet alu ;)
06:10 AM weenerdog: when i build the rig i'm designing, i'll be thrilled if its straight by .5mm :)))
06:10 AM sensille: next run, hopefully the ridges are gone before the spoilboard is :)
06:12 AM XXCoder: lol yeah. just lower z by very slightly more than ridge height was ;)
06:15 AM Tom_L: 43�F Hi 49
06:20 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: in the beginning i used MDF as spoilboard. Works pretty well but lacks water resistance
06:21 AM Loetmichel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEQZ_TY5q8o <- right after i got my first 6040 ;)
06:21 AM Loetmichel: thats 1" thick MDF taped/screwed to the bed
06:21 AM XXCoder: fun
06:31 AM sensille: wow, much much better :) can't really feel ridges anymore, but it still feels a bit "wavy". might as well be the tool not being perfectly flat
06:32 AM XXCoder: do a quick sand on it
06:32 AM XXCoder: see if it is easily blendable
06:32 AM XXCoder: if it is, then its close enough for wood
06:33 AM sensille: it's still with only 1mm overlap on a 20mm tool
06:37 AM sensille: XXCoder: doesn't need much sanding to go completely away
06:37 AM XXCoder: maybe want trim more but if its for wood only it should be fine
06:38 AM sensille: the other direction measures ok with the square
06:39 AM sensille: XXCoder: i'm not sure i can do better with the means i have
06:40 AM XXCoder: yeah you'd need indictor to see how much you moved for better precision'
06:40 AM sensille: i want to do aluminum, though
06:40 AM XXCoder: and less loosen bolts and bit more rubber hammer
06:40 AM XXCoder: but without indictor its bit hard to say. theres really cheap ones that wouldnt pass at machinist shop but plenty precise for home
06:41 AM sensille: also i'm not sure it's not the tool, or a mixture of both
06:42 AM XXCoder: https://www.amazon.com/Clockwise-Tools-DIGR-0105-Electronic-Conversion/dp/B01G9K8U5G/
06:42 AM XXCoder: dont belive its .0005" its more like .002" maybe repeatability but plenty for home
06:42 AM sensille: yeah, i have one of those, but only one
06:42 AM jesseg: haha I ordered an R8 7/8"-20 shank for my boring head from a guy on ebay for $20 delivered, and they sent the 1-1/2"-20 instead by accident. I complained and they say they are sending me the correct one and that I can keep the wrong one.
06:43 AM weenerdog: sweet
06:43 AM XXCoder: you could use it on spindle side
06:43 AM XXCoder: see how far you move it
06:43 AM XXCoder: or touch it on smooth side of tool and rotate tool by hand
06:43 AM XXCoder: see how much runout it has
06:43 AM sensille: aren't there drill bits for squaring?
06:44 AM XXCoder: geez! this is super cheap https://www.amazon.com/All-Industrial-Tool-Supply-TR72020/dp/B002YPHT76/
06:44 AM XXCoder: everything for 32 bucks usd
06:45 AM XXCoder: used to be impossible to buy that cheap
06:46 AM Loetmichel: sensille: an old trick is to get a 4mm copper wire, make a "crank" out of it with 100mm or more in diameter, then put one end in the spindle, and a ballpen on the other end, then slowly rotate the spindle and move the spindle down 'til it touches the spoilboard. adjust the spindle until it makes a complete circle
06:46 AM Loetmichel: and you have a perfectly level and square spindle
06:46 AM weenerdog: thats a pretty cool tip, Loetmichel
06:46 AM Loetmichel: (that is considering that your spoilboard is milled reasonably flat)
06:46 AM jesseg: XXCoder, cool, allindustrialsupply is who I ordered that R8 boring shank from! The wrong one which arrived does look nice, but of course I have no idea how true it is
06:47 AM XXCoder: lol ok
06:47 AM XXCoder: Loetmichel: nice.
06:48 AM jesseg: XXCoder, by the way that style of articulated indicator arm mount is bloody awful to use. After suffering for years with one exactly like that, I'm gonna try one of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07178Z32C/
06:48 AM Loetmichel: weenerdog: my great-grandma used to say "ein fuulen abbider derf net dum sin!" (old german dialect, it translates to "a lazy worker shouldnt be a fool")
06:48 AM Loetmichel: and i took that to heart ;)
06:49 AM sensille: Loetmichel: nice, and the geometry of that 'crank' is completely irrelevant
06:49 AM Loetmichel: indeed
06:49 AM XXCoder: jess yeah I own one of those, and all of em is that tpe at work
06:49 AM jesseg: however this one is cheap and not as big as it says but does look like it'll work - but nuga has some nice looking ones
06:49 AM XXCoder: theres also snake type, dunno how good it is
06:49 AM Loetmichel: only thing that matters is that the spindle bearing is good
06:49 AM Loetmichel: and the spolboard "flat" to the axis
06:49 AM jesseg: XXCoder, I have a snake one and it doesn't work, but someone told me that a Starret brand snake type works but all the other off brands just don't have it
06:50 AM XXCoder: I guess cant hold on shape enough
06:50 AM XXCoder: you really dont wanna arm move when measuring something
06:50 AM XXCoder: it could move something to completely unknown position which might mean scrapped part
06:51 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: i used one like that: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=5383 and it works pretty well... but this one i bought recently is even better: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14166&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
06:52 AM XXCoder: yeah latter seems to be more and more standard.
06:52 AM XXCoder: mine come in badly misassemblied
06:52 AM XXCoder: I had to fix it, and worked really good since then. not bad for chineseium one
06:53 AM XXCoder: anyone with a lathe can easily make one
06:53 AM weenerdog: at least it aint harborfreightium
06:53 AM XXCoder: well in most cases. some stuff not too sure
06:53 AM XXCoder: weenerdog: harbor fright sells chinseium stuff
06:54 AM weenerdog: yeah but its a whole nother class of crappy
06:54 AM XXCoder: except some stuff I think may be actually rejects from them
06:54 AM weenerdog: except some of their stuff kicks ass. its either really good or really bad
06:54 AM XXCoder: or good bad
06:55 AM weenerdog: i got one of their oscillating spindle sanders and its awesome.
06:55 AM XXCoder: ie: something thats bad but easily hackable to do something else great
06:56 AM weenerdog: yeah if you're creative you can go in a HF and sometimes come up with a $5 solution to a $100 problem
06:57 AM sensille: Loetmichel: around 20 euro?
07:03 AM XXCoder: looks like bush sr died
07:04 AM sensille: 'magnetic' wouldn't make much sense with an aluminum bed, or where are the supposed to be attached to?
07:04 AM XXCoder: yeah that is unfortunate. you culd use a heavy steel plate though
07:04 AM XXCoder: ,aybe with one bolt hole to be able to bolt it somewhere
07:08 AM Loetmichel: sensille: the " messuhrhalter"?
07:10 AM gloops: theres a useful ground plate on ebay here for 20 quid
07:11 AM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/16-x-154-x-327mm-Ground-Flat-Steel-plate/323568670386?
07:12 AM gloops: not even worth grinding it for that
07:12 AM XXCoder: geez its almost as large as my router
07:12 AM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/25-x-304-x-505mm-Ground-Flat-Steel-not-hardened-cheap-surface-plate/323572739817?
07:12 AM gloops: 25mm x 300x500
07:12 AM XXCoder: that IS larger
07:13 AM gloops: maybe useful for working with ally on router
07:13 AM gloops: some drilling to do though lol
07:15 AM XXCoder: 1,000 drill and taps
07:15 AM gloops: with cordless drill
07:15 AM XXCoder: what, with battery and all?
07:15 AM XXCoder: if it moves electrons its too modern for you
07:15 AM XXCoder: ;)
07:16 AM gloops: hopefully with a spare battery..or 3
07:17 AM gloops: well ive given up on the saw for now, the weather has cheated me of final victory again, like Napoleon
07:17 AM XXCoder: no! give up and russia wins
07:17 AM XXCoder: just loike napoleon also lol
07:17 AM gloops: he who sits in front of the fire lives to fight another day
07:20 AM sensille: Loetmichel: yes. i'd need one to either use with nuts or bolt to the spoilboard
07:21 AM gloops: if you have a t-slot base, you can bolt strips of mdf to the highs, surface those, then you can still make use of the metal slots for clamping, shame to cover them
07:23 AM XXCoder: gloops: mine does. not sure how to do that
07:23 AM XXCoder: ff to bed before i die
07:23 AM Loetmichel: sensille: double sided tape and/or its own weight
07:23 AM Loetmichel: usually sufficient
07:23 AM gloops: you would need to drill the t-slot base, drill the strips with recess for the bolts
07:32 AM Karlheinz: 1
07:38 AM sensille: so i just buy the arm and make a boltable base
07:44 AM sensille: Loetmichel: can't even reach the spoilboard with a small tool, need to move the spindle lower :(
07:46 AM Loetmichel: sensille: its a cylinder so that shouldnt be a problem
07:46 AM Loetmichel: once you losen all four clamping screws it will fall down all on its own
07:48 AM sensille: or i don't put in the bit that much
07:48 AM sensille: hm. moving the spindle makes sense in the long run
07:54 AM gloops: did this machine come already assembled sensille?
07:55 AM gloops: they wont have put any thought into the spindle height, they just throw them together
07:55 AM sensille: it did
07:56 AM sensille: so i just move it down and re-align it
07:57 AM gloops: yes, wherever it needs to be
07:57 AM sensille: if i want to mill two parts that fit tightly, how much clearance would i give them?
07:57 AM sensille: aluminum
08:00 AM gloops: you wont be working to anything nearer than .05mm som trial and error with your machine might be needed
08:23 AM gloops: 81 people have been arrested as Paris fuel protests turn violent with riot police firing tear gas and stun grenades
08:24 AM gloops: another starkly divided country
08:25 AM gloops: Macron calls for a more united europe, he cant even keep his own country peaceful
08:28 AM weenerdog: heh i just vote and then turn off the tv for a couple years
08:30 AM gloops: im at the point where i think ill give up voting, they never do what they promise anyway, its all a sham
09:10 AM sensille: Loetmichel: so for aluminum: 24kRPM, F1200, 0.1mm depth?
09:12 AM sensille: also, what acceleration do you use on the 6040?
09:15 AM sensille: 750mm/s^2 seems to be too much for my table, the "official" "manual" seem to recommend 150mm/s^2
09:21 AM weenerdog: at .1mm, drive it like you stole it
09:39 AM sensille: how is it called in f360 if i want to clear a pocket completely into the corners by going too far into it?
09:41 AM fragalot: you mean mickey mouse ears?
09:41 AM sensille: probably :)
09:41 AM fragalot: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5Ppc4ikhkA
09:42 AM fragalot: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5Xa7oTPcYM
09:42 AM fragalot: and that
09:44 AM sensille: so the cam module can't do it, i have to model it
09:44 AM fragalot: as far as I know, yes
09:45 AM sensille: ok, so i can stop clicking through all options over and over :)
09:50 AM Tom_L: naw, keep clickin til you find it...
09:51 AM Tom_L: i don't use fusion but i just add an array of lines to my cutter path on a bolt head etc
09:51 AM HighInBC: dog boning it is called sensille
09:52 AM weenerdog: thats what we called hanging out with the girls' soccer team in college
09:52 AM HighInBC: lol
09:53 AM weenerdog: ba dum DUM
11:19 AM sensille: hm. is there a way to specify a max stepdown in f360 for all paths at once? it's easy to forget one path and lose an endmill
11:40 AM gregcnc: you can compare toolpaths
11:44 AM fragalot: regardless of how much you tinker with it, getting a good surface finish in a 60mm thick block of cast iron in a ~20mm bore using a tiny chinese boring head with screw-on MK2 shank, an MK2-ISO30 adapter, with an 8mm lathe boring bar, even if you custom make a thicker 20mm bar to go into the 8mm mounts... who knew.
11:44 AM fragalot: :D
11:49 AM cpresser: sensille: parameters?
12:32 PM sensille: cpresser: sorry?
12:37 PM cpresser: you can also use global parameters of fusion in toolpaths
12:37 PM cpresser: so one option is to make a stepdown variable, and use that
12:39 PM sensille: but is there a way that every new path has that prefilled?
12:40 PM Loetmichel: sensille: F1200, 24krpm, 0,1mm depth with a 2mm two flute tungsten carbide cutter
12:40 PM Loetmichel: correct
12:40 PM Loetmichel: acceleration is 650mm/s^2 here
12:40 PM sensille: ah, good. used 200 now, and it's really slow
12:41 PM Loetmichel: and for the "mickeymouse ears" try exporting it as a DXF and then download CamBam
12:41 PM Loetmichel: and do the cam in there
12:42 PM Loetmichel: the preset is called "pocket and corners" or something.
12:42 PM Loetmichel: <- doesnt like F360, so cant do any advice there
12:44 PM cpresser: sensille: afaik there is no button that does exactly the thing you asked for
12:44 PM sensille: the first part came out 0.1-0.15mm too small
12:45 PM Loetmichel: at which size?
12:45 PM cpresser: there is an option to compare toolpaths, so you can quickly spot the differences of settings
12:45 PM sensille: cpresser: ok, so i just have to take care at each now path
12:46 PM sensille: Loetmichel: 6mm x 10mm
12:46 PM cpresser: yes, and if you use parameters, you can change that value globally
12:48 PM sensille: same effect on a pocket, 0.1-0.15mm
12:49 PM sensille: too wide
12:50 PM sensille: is that spindle runout?
12:52 PM fragalot: that's a lot of runout, but it is possible
12:53 PM sensille: should do the same test with different endmill diameters
12:54 PM sensille: or the same endmill, but only inserted half as deep?
12:55 PM fragalot: or just measure the runout with an indicator
12:57 PM sensille: just drilling a single hole should also do it
12:57 PM sensille: i ordered the indicator holder, takes a while to arrice
12:57 PM fragalot: that's assuming the drill is perfect
12:57 PM sensille: *arrive
12:58 PM sensille: how would i measure runout with an indicator? wouldn't i need a shaft-only bit?
12:59 PM fragalot: you measure against the flutes. spin it backwards and measure the "high spots"
12:59 PM sensille: and measure from different sides
01:00 PM fragalot: that shouldn't matter
01:01 PM fragalot: when I said spin, I meant slowly, by hand
01:01 PM fragalot: (just to make that clear :))
01:01 PM sensille: yes :)
01:05 PM sensille: finding a book with all the tricks of the trade would be great
01:08 PM fragalot: that's one of the issues.. afaik, there aren't all that many books that have a good collection of the special tricks that the oldtimers all use without thinking twice about it
01:12 PM sensille: "maschining for hobby cnc'ers"
01:26 PM syyl_: there are books on all of those things
01:29 PM syyl_: metall working sink or swim, machine shop trade secrets, "the tricks and secrets of old time machinists" 1-4, machinists bedside reader, toolroom practice, workshop techniques by famous g.h. thomas, "shop theory" by the henry ford trade school
01:30 PM fragalot: I've not seen any of those in my local bookshop. The closest thing they've got is the "blue machinists' bible' .. no idea what the official name is.. but it's blue.
01:30 PM syyl_: i had to buy them all ;)
01:31 PM sensille: syyl_: noted :) which one to start with, as a total newbie?
01:31 PM syyl_: a friend that has a machine and show you a few things ;)
01:31 PM * sensille was just looking at "machining for dummies"
01:32 PM syyl_: depends, most of them are older and for manual machining
01:33 PM fragalot: the friends, or the books?
01:33 PM syyl_: haha
01:33 PM syyl_: books
01:33 PM syyl_: but most of my machining buddys are manual machinists too
01:33 PM syyl_: haha
01:34 PM fragalot: :-)
01:34 PM sensille: i should have to make those friends first ...
01:36 PM sensille: s/should/would
02:12 PM sensille: fragalot: "machinery's handbook"?
02:17 PM cpresser: "Tabellenbuch Metall" they are cheap on ebay, because everybody needs to buy one :)
02:18 PM JT-Shop: machinery's handbook is great if you know the fundamentals of machining and need a formula or how to heat treat something
02:25 PM JT-Shop: sensille: the Machinery's Handbook is a Reference Book for the Mechanical Engineer, Designer, Manufacturing Engineer, Draftsman, Toolmaker, and Machinist.
03:26 PM gloops: https://www.facebook.com/GAMINGbible/videos/2154714664559164/
03:26 PM gloops: diy fully automatic crossbow lol
03:29 PM weenerdog: thats bad ass
03:30 PM gloops: i need to practice an insane german accent for if i make any videos
03:35 PM syyl_: as far as i know that guy doesnt live to far from me
03:36 PM gloops: syyl_ thats not good
03:46 PM gloops: i bet they would go like hotcakes on ebay though, not sure what the law on crossbows is here
03:48 PM gloops: Using a crossbow (or any bow weapon) for hunting is completely illegal here in the UK. The crossbow itself cannot be carried in public and a common sense approach should be adopted when transporting a crossbow. However, It is not illegal to own a crossbow.
03:48 PM SpeedEvil: Always carefully read your laws.
03:48 PM gloops: seems theyre legal if you dont use for hunting
03:48 PM SpeedEvil: Minor construction details can change something from no licence required to as illegal as a sawn-off AK47
03:49 PM gloops: well they have paintballing guns
03:52 PM gloops: also 18 year old age restriction, kinda does the ebay sales
04:21 PM Deejay: gn8
04:25 PM weenerdog: heh here you can hunt deer with a law rocket if you want
04:32 PM gregcnc: I haven't unwrapped by copy of "Machining for Dummies" yet.
04:40 PM syyl_: a crossbow is sportsgear here, gloops
04:40 PM syyl_: but hunting with it is prohibited
04:41 PM gloops: a lot of wounded animals with bow hunting
04:41 PM syyl_: they are not considered a weapon, only a "dangerous item" at max
04:41 PM gloops: well ive seen some pretty lethal crossbows
04:41 PM syyl_: i guess most crossbows are pretty lethal ;)
04:42 PM gloops: there was a lot of fuss here years ago when someone got shot on a bus with one
04:43 PM syyl_: well, thats unique
04:44 PM Wolf__: arrow are fun, they defeat most soft body armor and can pass right through car doors and whatnot
04:45 PM weenerdog: i deer hunt with a remington model 783 .308
04:45 PM weenerdog: great cheap rifle
04:53 PM Wolf__: I dont hunt… and I dont have any cheap rifles lol
04:58 PM XXCoder: Wolf__: yeah it may be old type, but still very effective for all that
04:58 PM XXCoder: its why bow and arrows lasted for long time
04:59 PM XXCoder: im surpised its not used to assassate someone yet though carrying bow around is VERY visiable lol
04:59 PM weenerdog: ask the dude that went to north sentinel island
04:59 PM MarcelineVQ: These days classy assasins use meds that simulate heart attacks instead
04:59 PM Wolf__: mod a paintball gun to fire arrows
05:00 PM XXCoder: as well as bring a gun
05:00 PM XXCoder: im picturing pro assassin bringing a nice violin case, open it and pull out sections of bow and assemblies it
05:00 PM XXCoder: $1000 if you use that idea in movie
05:01 PM gloops: hmm, arrows are boring, it needs to be 5 sided sharpened metal discs
05:03 PM * Wolf__ wonders how you make a disk with 5 sides...
05:04 PM XXCoder: ask mr ecluid
05:04 PM XXCoder: he can do weird stuff
05:06 PM gloops: http://images.ontheedgebrands.com/images/var/A47-UC2683_700.jpg
05:06 PM XXCoder: thats not disc
05:07 PM gloops: isnt it it?
05:11 PM jesseg: well I guess if you modify the definition of disk just about anything could be a disk
05:11 PM gloops: its based on a disc, what would you call it?
05:12 PM jesseg: well what's not "based" on a disk to some degree?
05:12 PM Wolf__: rail gun + throwing stars = fun? =)
05:12 PM gloops: i dont know what other word to use for something like that
05:13 PM Wolf__: shuriken
05:13 PM Roguish: check this: go to about 2:30 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0gb0Lb2gzM
05:13 PM jesseg: You could take a sphere and say oh look it's round, so is a disk, it's a disk. Or a flat square and say oh, it has a flat side, and so does a disk, so it's a disk. Everything in the universe could be logically declared to contain some facet that was similar to part of a disk.
05:14 PM gloops: its a flat circular object lol
05:14 PM jesseg: gloops, a fan-blade, a zero pitch propeller,
05:14 PM gloops: i wouldnt say it was a fan blade, because it isnt
05:14 PM jesseg: and no it's not circular as a feature, but it does consist of a radial array of sector shapes.
05:15 PM jesseg: well sure it is a fan blade with a pitch of zero, assuming it's sharpened equally on both sides. If not, then it has a non zero pitch.
05:16 PM jesseg: a fan is in theory anything that has 2 or more essentially idental features arrayed in a polar fashion.
05:16 PM gloops: a fan describes a specific function like moving air, this is for flying
05:17 PM jesseg: sorry my friend, fan can mean lots of other things. Look up fan-out -- it's the number of downline network hubs can be connected to an output port on the master hub. That isn't about moving air, it's about the radial array of nodes as drawn on the wiring diagram.
05:17 PM MarcelineVQ: you can describe a sphere with a disc, you can also describe it with a line, or simply with a distance from origin. Being pedantic about whether a circular fairly flat object is a disc is a little silly though. That semantic was solved a long time ago, discus means disc after all, even though it's a lens shape.
05:18 PM jesseg: gloops, and here's how you fan out cards: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHD-Rjr2ey0
05:19 PM MarcelineVQ: is that shit roundish, is if flatish too? call a duck a duck
05:20 PM MarcelineVQ: there's better things to be upset about, like being arrested for taking a pocket knife camping with you in scotland
05:20 PM gloops: im not upset over this, it was a light hearted comment about a thing that probably doesnt exist
05:21 PM jthornton: or arrested for having a stray .22 bullet under the seat of your motorhome when you cross into Canada
05:21 PM MarcelineVQ: jthornton: those things get everywhere too
05:21 PM MarcelineVQ: so tiny
05:21 PM jesseg: MarcelineVQ, ok I could get upset about that. You can't take a pocket knife camping in Scotland? No wonder my grandpa left there!
05:22 PM jthornton: and work as fuses too lol
05:22 PM jesseg: yeah they let you knwo if you overcurrent them too
05:23 PM jthornton: hmm bootloader failed to install... I wonder if that is bad or not
05:24 PM XXCoder: jesseg: would be funny to see acciental death report: "Fuse blew and bounced around car and killed driver"
05:25 PM XXCoder: that diesnt sound good
05:25 PM XXCoder: the bootloader thing
05:26 PM jesseg: XXCoder, I doubt the lead goes much of anyplace. The brass is much lighter and would be the one to move, and probably sideways because it probably splits sideways and shoots off that way
05:27 PM XXCoder: lol ok
05:27 PM jesseg: but that's pure conjecture because I've never tried it
05:28 PM XXCoder: probabkly because your iq is higher than room temperate
05:28 PM jthornton: yea without anything to contain the pressure the bullet will not have much velocity
05:28 PM jthornton: lol
05:28 PM jesseg: well it's about 55F in here so it might be above room temperature
05:28 PM XXCoder: lol
05:29 PM jthornton: I unplugged the 1TB drive so the install doesn't get confused
05:29 PM XXCoder: would be very strange world if we were dependant on temperate for iq. iq = temperate area is at
05:29 PM XXCoder: we probably would heat the heck out of building, to max tolentable temperate
05:30 PM jdh: reptiles
05:30 PM jesseg: it's cold enough in here I might not be smart enough to turn on the heat to solve the problem though so I might be stuck dumb
05:30 PM XXCoder: indeed
05:31 PM XXCoder: probably have saying "I got stuck cold" as in got a dumb moment
05:31 PM jesseg: I might already be stuck dumb. I think I'm going to go outside where it's even colder. I hope I still have enough IQ left to come back indoors :P
05:31 PM XXCoder: lol
05:35 PM jesseg: take it easy folks, I'ml off.
05:35 PM XXCoder: later
05:35 PM XXCoder: looks like bush sr died
05:35 PM jthornton: now it wants to know if I want to force UEFI mode...
05:35 PM jdh: heh
05:35 PM XXCoder: a bios replacement. interesting
05:45 PM jthornton: I'm running Linux Mint 18.1 here but can't find the disk...
05:46 PM XXCoder: flash drive?
05:46 PM jthornton: never done that.. I always use CD or DVD
05:47 PM jthornton: I'll download 18.3 in the morning during free time
05:47 PM XXCoder: cool
05:47 PM jthornton: I think I had that boot thing error before with two drives plugged in
05:47 PM XXCoder: i wonder if theres a program to automatically download stuff you wanna download at assigned time
05:49 PM weenerdog: on linux or win?
05:49 PM XXCoder: whatever os jt uses
05:49 PM XXCoder: I have unlimited here
05:49 PM weenerdog: heh the only thing about living in the boondocks is my internet
05:49 PM jthornton: most of my pc's are linux
05:50 PM * jthornton lives out past the boondocks lol
05:50 PM weenerdog: its unlimited, but i have to pay $50/mo. for 1 (one... uno) megabit
05:50 PM jthornton: hmm the barbie should be warmed up and ready to slap the meat on
05:51 PM weenerdog: i have 60 megabit at work tho. i do big stuff there
05:52 PM HighInBC: dang
05:56 PM XXCoder: you menioned food, you must send some to me
05:56 PM XXCoder: drinking soylent now. yummy
07:48 PM weenerdog: never bang a woman with the crazy-eye https://www.cbsnews.com/news/chelsea-cook-skyridge-high-school-teacher-kills-her-ex-husbands-girlfriend-in-front-of-her-kids-utah/
07:48 PM norias: whoa
07:54 PM skunkworks: I make awesome videos.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7dI0JYC5q4
07:54 PM XXCoder: you better
07:54 PM XXCoder: its steady cam, captioned
07:54 PM XXCoder: way to go
07:55 PM XXCoder: wellll autofocus a negative
07:56 PM skunkworks: heh
07:56 PM skunkworks: It is my f'in phone.. circa 2013
07:56 PM skunkworks: ;)
07:57 PM XXCoder: :)
07:57 PM skunkworks: really? captioned? cool
07:57 PM XXCoder: was you here when jt and me talked a lot about vismach?
07:57 PM skunkworks: No.
07:58 PM XXCoder: lol ok. i made a new vismach example with more comments than you (or anyone) can handle lol
07:58 PM XXCoder: its now part of linuxcnc
07:58 PM skunkworks: awesome!
07:58 PM skunkworks: I have only looked at vismach in passing
07:58 PM XXCoder: comments alone probably tripled the file length
07:59 PM XXCoder: its named rolfmill
08:00 PM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTdDBzkMwVQ video I made
08:03 PM XXCoder: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/configs/sim/axis/vismach/rolfmill/rolfmill peer the comments lol
08:04 PM skunkworks: cool - nice work
08:04 PM XXCoder: welcome
08:57 PM cawfeet: when i'm welding galv iron i get a headache
08:57 PM cawfeet: will this go away with prolonged exposure?
08:57 PM norias: hmmmmm
08:58 PM cawfeet: kind of like how i'd get stiff from lifting weights... if i keep doing it i won't get stiff anymore?
08:58 PM norias: you got the fever
08:58 PM XXCoder: cawfeet: look up zinc fever
08:59 PM cawfeet: here's a legit question
08:59 PM weenerdog: milk is supposed to make zinc fever go away faster
08:59 PM cawfeet: if i spin a VFD backwards before starting it will that damage the motor?
08:59 PM weenerdog: really the calcium. i'd do coral calcium.
09:52 PM CaptHindsight: yes if you breath in the vapors from welding galvanized deeply then after death you'll feel no pain
09:53 PM CaptHindsight: add another nick to the galvanized troll list
09:53 PM XXCoder: lol
09:56 PM * roycroft votes for avoiding toxic fumes vs. embracing anecdotal remedies for ameliorating the effects of the fumes
09:58 PM skunkworks: wtf
10:07 PM CaptHindsight: and the "legit" question was also weird, why would you spin a VFD? it's a piece of solid state electronics
10:08 PM roycroft: one might want to spin it for fun
10:08 PM CaptHindsight: true
10:08 PM roycroft: however, spinning it should not affect its functionality unless it is spun very fast
10:08 PM CaptHindsight: who am I to judge
10:09 PM roycroft: keeping the cabling connected properly while it is being spun would be an interesting challenge
10:09 PM MarcelineVQ: What if VFD's actually spin the world around them to work
10:09 PM CaptHindsight: how bored do you have to be to troll about hurting yourself?
10:10 PM MarcelineVQ: 20 bored
10:10 PM CaptHindsight: we certainly get a few weirdos in here
10:10 PM roycroft: it may be more a function of drugs than boredom
10:10 PM CaptHindsight: or lack thereof
10:10 PM XXCoder: or function of zinc
10:10 PM roycroft: welcome to the internet!
10:12 PM roycroft: yes, they could be the result of zinc fever
10:13 PM roycroft: anyway, when the real kooks come around i don't mind so much
10:13 PM ziper: my chinese power supply has an inductor rattling around inside
10:13 PM roycroft: it makes me feem not so odd in comparison
10:14 PM roycroft: feel, rather
10:23 PM Tom_L: ziper they put spare ones in them sometimes just to rattle around
10:24 PM Tom_L: are zinc fumes better than crack?
10:24 PM XXCoder: no idea as never tried either
10:24 PM roycroft: nor i
10:24 PM Tom_L: me either
10:25 PM roycroft: i prefer different kinds of vises :)
10:25 PM roycroft: but
10:25 PM roycroft: different strokes for different folks
10:25 PM ziper: yeah never know when you might need a spare
10:26 PM roycroft: a spare vise?
10:26 PM Tom_L: i wanted to get one but not sure i will