#linuxcnc Logs
Oct 18 2018
#linuxcnc Calendar
02:12 AM Deejay: moin
04:42 AM Loetmichel: heeeelp... just started the company 6040... loaede a program, touched off... hit "r"... and broke the bit because the spindle didnt turn on...
04:43 AM Loetmichel: tested it: it works if i click on the icon for "spindle clockwise", but not if i hit F9 OR an M03 in the program. How could THAT happen?
04:43 AM Loetmichel: (and that was my last 8mm long 2mm TC mill bit :-( )
04:50 AM XXCoder: bleh
04:50 AM XXCoder: wonder what happened
04:51 AM Loetmichel: i think it has to do with the update of linuxCNC i was prompted to install two days ago... still had LCNC running, so today is the first time with the new version...
04:51 AM Loetmichel: aaand we have a new update waiting... i'll try installing that, maybe it remedies the issue?
04:53 AM XXCoder: look at update notes
04:55 AM Loetmichel: mope, doesent help at all
04:56 AM Loetmichel: still no reaction to F9 or M03, but the icon for "spindle clockwise" on the axxis gui works flawlessly...?!?
04:57 AM XXCoder: try m4
04:57 AM XXCoder: see if it works and spins backwards
04:57 AM Loetmichel: you mean counter clockwise?
04:57 AM XXCoder: fif you use S word with it? yeah
04:57 AM Loetmichel: yes i did
04:58 AM XXCoder: ok had to be sure maybe somehow its set to s0
04:58 AM jthornton: morning
04:58 AM XXCoder: hey jt
04:58 AM jthornton: dang this pc is getting harder and harder to wake up
04:59 AM Loetmichel: so, checked in the f5 tab: neiter M02, M03, M04 work.
04:59 AM Loetmichel: and it says "S24000" at the bottom of the tab, so it got the S command correctly
04:59 AM XXCoder: what exactly does cw start button do anyway?
05:00 AM Loetmichel: any more ideas?
05:00 AM Loetmichel: it switcehs a relay
05:00 AM XXCoder: hm I wonder if theres some HAL issue that appeared by change in linuxcnc
05:01 AM Loetmichel: i even treid to rerun stepconf again
05:01 AM Loetmichel: no help either
05:01 AM jthornton: Loetmichel: are you running master?
05:02 AM XXCoder: doubtful its HAL unless youre using some strange machine setup stepconf basically works as is for our cheap machines
05:02 AM Loetmichel: jthornton: what master???
05:03 AM jthornton: LinuxCNC version
05:03 AM XXCoder: does compile version show in About, like Master or whatever?
05:04 AM jthornton: ah it will say 2.8 with some stuff after that
05:04 AM XXCoder: he got it from update so I guess its whatever repos has
05:04 AM XXCoder: which is probably master
05:04 AM Loetmichel: LinuxCNC axis 2.8.0 pre1 3910 gbedc7e5
05:05 AM jthornton: whatever he started with not whatever the repo has
05:05 AM jthornton: well I think Andy's multi spindle was merged with 2.8 a few days ago...
05:05 AM XXCoder: I wonder if that changed how HAL works for spindle
05:06 AM Loetmichel: so what do you suggest to get that back to running condition?
05:06 AM Loetmichel: (also io am missing the "ref all" button for quite a few versions now, why did THAT disappear?)
05:06 AM jthornton: no clue, using master is always a risk
05:06 AM rmu: Loetmichel: any reason you are running the development version? 2.7.X would be stable
05:07 AM jthornton: if you have a gantry with two motors you need master
05:07 AM Loetmichel: rmu: its what autoinstalled when i made a new PC a few years ago
05:07 AM Loetmichel: so normal update path
05:07 AM jthornton: that don't sound right
05:08 AM jthornton: it's not the standard version that you get with the livecd
05:08 AM Loetmichel: never changed anything in the update config
05:08 AM rmu: jthornton: only if you want to drive the two motors somewhat independently. nothing prevents connecting two motors to one stepgen.
05:08 AM Loetmichel: this system is installed from live CD. i am not aware that i have ever changed anything regarding repos and versions
05:08 AM jthornton: the live cd does not install 2.8
05:09 AM jthornton: rmu: homing prevents you from connecting two motors to one stepgen as they are not longer independent
05:09 AM rmu: strange. i was under the impression that 2.8 needs additional sections in its ini file, and i wonder if upgrade of .deb can provide those...
05:10 AM Loetmichel: so what do i do now?
05:10 AM Loetmichel: is there a way to downgrade again without reinstalling the system?
05:10 AM jthornton: from 2.7 to 2.8 the configuration is not the same
05:10 AM Loetmichel: shouldnt that be remedied by using stepconf?
05:11 AM jthornton: yea you can change the repository
05:11 AM jthornton: no, stepconf has no clue what your OS or version is
05:11 AM Loetmichel: hmm..idea: maybe stepconf still thinks its the old LCNC version?
05:11 AM XXCoder: loet check menu see if you has 2 linuxcnc versions
05:12 AM jthornton: stepconf does not care what version you have, after you run it if you have 2.8 the conversion script converts your confiugration to 2.8 type
05:12 AM Loetmichel: nope
05:12 AM Loetmichel: only one version
05:12 AM jthornton: AFAIK 2.7 and 2.8 can't coexist
05:13 AM XXCoder: yeah doubted it just wanted to double check
05:13 AM jthornton: Loetmichel: do you have a backup copy of your configuration from when it was converted to 2.8
05:14 AM Loetmichel: jthornton: so if i ran Stepconf on "modify config" it autoconverts it?
05:14 AM Loetmichel: nope
05:14 AM Loetmichel: no backup
05:15 AM jthornton: no, stepconf does not know about 2.8 which has me confused about your setup
05:16 AM Loetmichel: i have installed that with a 2016 live cd IIRC, then just updated it as prompted by the /!\ gadget
05:16 AM Loetmichel: always the "safe update"
05:16 AM jthornton: then you should not have 2.8 as it would never be from the livecd
05:17 AM Loetmichel: no idea how that happened
05:17 AM XXCoder: I wonder if someone misconfigured repo and it had 2,8
05:17 AM XXCoder: server end not pc side
05:17 AM jthornton: doubt it
05:17 AM jthornton: Loetmichel: what OS are you using? Debian something?
05:18 AM Loetmichel: yes
05:18 AM jthornton: open the synaptic package manager
05:19 AM Loetmichel: and?
05:21 AM jthornton: settings repositories
05:21 AM jthornton: see what deb line you have for linuxcnc
05:27 AM Loetmichel: moment, just installed tightVNCserver on the machine... a bit to lazy to run across the company another 50 times.
05:28 AM jthornton: it will help you loose weight :)
05:28 AM XXCoder: iron legs
05:30 AM * jthornton struggles to try and understand what magic this program has to run the digole lcd http://my-small-projects.blogspot.com/2015/05/raspberry-pi-digole-oled-13-display.html
05:30 AM jthornton: and why so many includes?
05:31 AM XXCoder: is it still headless with screen showing logo and ip address? techinically speaking
05:32 AM jthornton: I think this is the magic line sprintf(buf,argv[1]);
05:32 AM Loetmichel: hmmm
05:32 AM Loetmichel: today is not my day... VNC connects... shows grey screen...
05:32 AM Loetmichel: maaaan
05:33 AM jthornton: what about teamviewer?
05:33 AM jthornton: I've used that in the past
05:33 AM Loetmichel: its VNC also, just routed thru america
05:33 AM Loetmichel: i wouldnt use it if i can avoid it
05:34 AM Loetmichel: anyways, where was the problem with the repositories?
05:34 AM jthornton: no problems that I know of with repositories
05:35 AM jthornton: just trying to figure out which one your using as there are two
05:37 AM Loetmichel: i see both linuxCNC.org and buildbot.linuxCNC.org in the sources list
05:37 AM Loetmichel: if you mean those two
05:37 AM jthornton: are both of them checked as enabled?
05:37 AM Loetmichel: yes
05:38 AM Loetmichel: actually its 2 linuxCNC.org and 3 or 4 buildbot lines active
05:38 AM jthornton: linuxcnc.org is 2.7 and buildbot.linuxcnc.org can be either 2.7 or 2.8
05:38 AM jthornton: wow
05:38 AM XXCoder: wow something strange happened
05:38 AM jthornton: yea if you have the dev installed then two per version
05:39 AM Loetmichel: buildbot has 2 lines "master-rt" and 2 lines "2.7rt"
05:39 AM XXCoder: you can force it to install earlier version in synaptic
05:39 AM XXCoder: then remove those extras
05:39 AM Loetmichel: each one compiled and one sources i belive
05:40 AM jthornton: AFAIK if you have both linuxcnc and buildbot enabled then the SPM will pick the latest one ie 2.8
05:42 AM Loetmichel: hmm.. wonder how THAT happened... i am the most qualified at the company when it comes to linux... and my expertise is "limited" to say the least... i suspect the russian coworker to have messed with it... he has that "what could go wrong" attitude...
05:42 AM Loetmichel: *sigh* not like i have enough to do already...
05:43 AM XXCoder: heh well simple enough to fix though
05:43 AM Loetmichel: is there a way to get the config up to 2.8 levels? so that the spindle works again?
05:43 AM jthornton: that sounds plausible for sure
05:43 AM XXCoder: in synaptic right click linuxcnc revert to previous version, then when done remove the buildot
05:43 AM Loetmichel: both or just the master?
05:43 AM XXCoder: cant de-admin that guy?
05:43 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: the CNC has only one (admin) account
05:44 AM XXCoder: just buildbot
05:44 AM Loetmichel: never bothered to make another
05:44 AM jthornton: 2.8 is the reason your spindles don't work I suspect from the multi spindle commits just added to 2.8
05:45 AM jthornton: do you still have the stepconf file?
05:47 AM XXCoder: Loetmichel: you can add sleath so your friend cant do it again though. simple enough
05:47 AM XXCoder: set repo priority to normal one very high and builddot very low
05:47 AM Loetmichel: jthornton: yes i have the stepconf file. thats what i used to rerun stepconf
05:47 AM XXCoder: so even if builddot has newer it wont install it
05:47 AM Loetmichel: sleath?
05:47 AM jthornton: just uncheck the buildbot repos
05:48 AM XXCoder: jthornton: that can easily be xhecked again
05:48 AM XXCoder: so altering repo priority is much harder to find and undo
05:48 AM * jthornton goes back to solving the digole problem
05:48 AM Loetmichel: so i revert to 2.7 and then uncheck the master and the linuxcnc?
05:49 AM Loetmichel: or unchec the master and the 2.7 buildbot?
05:49 AM XXCoder: not sure jt knows more which which repos has which than I do. I think buildbot has 2.8 one but maybe im wrong
05:49 AM Loetmichel: ... and then i will call the coworker over into the storage room for a chewout
05:50 AM jthornton: http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/
05:50 AM jthornton: http://linuxcnc.org/dists/
05:50 AM XXCoder: https://askubuntu.com/questions/135339/assign-highest-priority-to-my-local-repository example
05:53 AM Loetmichel: jthornton: doesent really help
05:53 AM Loetmichel: which one to stay checked? the linuxCNC.org or the buildbot 2.7?
05:54 AM jthornton: the safe one is linuxcnc.org
05:54 AM jthornton: buldbot anything will be the latest and may have problems
05:54 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder: i have 4 repositories with buildbot... 2 with master and 2 with 2.7
05:54 AM Loetmichel: jthornton: thanks
05:55 AM Loetmichel: do i have to restart the maschine after forcing the downgrade?
05:55 AM Loetmichel: or does it work without?
05:55 AM jthornton: in Linux usually not
05:58 AM Loetmichel: yeah. works again with 2.7.14.39
05:59 AM Loetmichel: and the "ref all" functionality is back
05:59 AM Loetmichel: niiice
05:59 AM jthornton: yippie
05:59 AM XXCoder: awesome
05:59 AM jthornton: so you went with the buildbot 2.7 I see
05:59 AM Loetmichel: ... now to grind down the shaft of anoother 2mm TC 2-flute to be able to punge in 8++mm...
05:59 AM Loetmichel: plunge
06:00 AM Loetmichel: because the last one i ground flew away this morning :-(
06:00 AM jthornton: can you zip up your config and post it somewhere, I'd like to pass it on to Andy
06:00 AM Loetmichel: which files?
06:00 AM jthornton: all the files in your configuration directory
06:01 AM Loetmichel: moment
06:01 AM rmu: also, then you have a backup ;)
06:01 AM jthornton: linuxcnc/someDiretoryName/*.*
06:13 AM Loetmichel: jthornton: sorry, lunch.. will gzip it after the break and upload it somewhere
07:12 AM jthornton: holy crap batman I've cracked the code to write to the digole lcd on the i2c bus!
07:13 AM XXCoder: is it just single write to serial? lol
07:14 AM jthornton: i2c = smbus.SMBus(1)
07:14 AM jthornton: then
07:14 AM jthornton: i2c.write_block_data(addr, 0x00, [0x43, 0x4c])
07:14 AM jthornton: that clears the screen with the CL command
07:15 AM jthornton: this writes TEST to the screen i2c.write_block_data(addr, 0x00, [0x43, 0x4c, 0x54, 0x54, 0x54, 0x45, 0x53, 0x54])
07:18 AM XXCoder: not too bad
07:19 AM jthornton: easy once you crack the code lol but no examples exist on the web so it's try try try
07:19 AM XXCoder: I bet
07:41 AM XXCoder: Loetmichel: uploaded yet?
07:43 AM * jthornton hits the shower to start his day
08:34 AM gregcnc: bansky's painting must have been awfully heavy https://youtu.be/vxkwRNIZgdY
08:35 AM Loetmichel: XXCoder/ jthornton: does that link work for you? -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=17217
09:02 AM JT-Shop: I passed the link on to Andy
09:03 AM Loetmichel: also: i noticed i had indeed not one but TWO backups :-)
09:04 AM Loetmichel: seems the upgrade/downgrade automatically makes a .old folder
09:05 AM JT-Shop: that is created by the upgrade script\
09:24 AM CaptHindsight: Shredding the Girl and Balloon - The Director’s Cut , the knife blades are all 90 deg off, https://youtu.be/vxkwRNIZgdY?t=14
09:26 AM CaptHindsight: gregcnc: @ 0:17 he's holding the hot part of the soldering iron :)
09:26 AM CaptHindsight: or is that a screw driver?
09:27 AM CaptHindsight: @ 0:12 it looks like the roller does the cutting
09:31 AM CaptHindsight: 0:08 knurled roller and cutting roller
09:31 AM syyl: the whole making off is like a mockup
09:31 AM syyl: 0:10 - that belt has seen better times
09:32 AM CaptHindsight: 0:09 why is the timing belt getting bunched up?
09:32 AM syyl: :D
09:32 AM syyl: because in 0:13 its a way heavier belt :D
09:32 AM CaptHindsight: so likely fabricated by an "artist"
09:33 AM CaptHindsight: should be on Hackaday next
09:33 AM syyl: set on fire
09:33 AM syyl: would be ok for me
09:36 AM CaptHindsight: "In rehearsals it worked every time" , well choose a better makerspace next time and avoid #reprap
09:36 AM syyl: lol
09:36 AM Rab: Screencap for viral lulz: http://reboots.g-cipher.net/shredder.jpg
09:37 AM CaptHindsight: "coudah gotten 4 smoothieboards inside of that space"
09:40 AM CaptHindsight: Rab: found the source https://i.imgur.com/xyHsTmz.jpg
09:42 AM Rab: It's about time we started using replicants instead of chinese children.
11:20 AM gregcnc: Yes I thought the blades were odd but it seems there are slitting wheels on the roller. I think we can assume there is some "art" in all of it as most people wouln't know how the slitting discs work
11:21 AM CaptHindsight: Rab: Chinese children need to work. How else will they be able to grow up to become good consumers?
11:22 AM CaptHindsight: gregcnc: maybe the blades are part of a trap?
11:23 AM CaptHindsight: what we really need are robots and replicants that will become good consumers
11:23 AM gregcnc: hmm isn't that what they are creating?
11:24 AM gregcnc: what intrigues me is 12 years or patience to pull this off or the seller was in on it
11:26 AM Loetmichel: gregcnc: no way the lead acid batteries in there would hold for 12 years
11:26 AM Loetmichel: he HAD to be in on it
11:28 AM fragalot: Loetmichel: the weird part is that nobody noticed the trickle charger plugged into it all this time
11:28 AM CaptHindsight: is that what they are saying about how long the art was in storage or on display before it went to auction?
11:31 AM CaptHindsight: 10 years is a common lifetime
11:31 AM fragalot: CaptHindsight: with one of those cheap ebay remotes? I think not.
11:32 AM Loetmichel: fragalot: indeed ;)
11:32 AM CaptHindsight: 10 years is common for lead acid sealed batteries
11:32 AM CaptHindsight: did the remote use one of those?
11:32 AM CaptHindsight: I didn't read the article
11:33 AM fragalot: the youtube video shows one of those el cheapo garage door opener remotes
11:33 AM CaptHindsight: the video was just put together for more fun
11:33 AM fragalot: and there is no way that the receiver would be able to be powered for over a decade using a typical battery pack
11:34 AM fragalot: (it's not impossible, but HIGHLY unlikely)
11:34 AM Rab: Consider that the shredder only made it half way through the job.
11:34 AM CaptHindsight: maybe the buyer will post internal pics someday
11:34 AM Rab: Unless that was by design.
11:34 AM fragalot: Rab: it stopped dead in it's tracks, rather than slow down
11:34 AM Loetmichel: it wasnt
11:34 AM Rab: Personally I think they're all in on it.
11:34 AM fragalot: which to me means that it was intentionally stopped
11:34 AM CaptHindsight: I'm glad that they are having fun with all of this
11:34 AM Loetmichel: as he said in the vide at the end: "it worked every time in the rehearsals"
11:35 AM fragalot: CaptHindsight: yup :-)
11:35 AM fragalot: it's a /GREAT/ marketing stab from banksy
11:35 AM Rab: And that Banksy has joined Shepard Fairey in the hall of tiresome hacks.
11:36 AM gregcnc: does he make money from any of this? I have no idea
11:36 AM CaptHindsight: it drives up the value of their work
11:36 AM fragalot: I believe he does, going through a representative
11:36 AM pink_vampire: https://youtu.be/HXqWpUrOHi8?t=142
11:36 AM pink_vampire: so funny
11:36 AM Rab: Perhaps hype and/or fame are the currency of choice.
11:37 AM CaptHindsight: Banksy might have started as a single artist but he has accomplices/assistants now
11:37 AM fragalot: pink_vampire: weird how he doesn't include himself as one of the tools
11:38 AM Rab: pink_vampire, halarious
11:39 AM Rab: pink_vampire, he doesn't say anything about keeping them oiled.
11:39 AM fragalot: Rab: he does mention hammering on them
11:39 AM fragalot: so there is that
11:39 AM pink_vampire: the part with the nail as so funny
11:40 AM pink_vampire: w*as
11:40 AM gregcnc: I have to keep my kids from watching the dreadful life hack videos so it doesn't rot their brains
11:41 AM fragalot: gregcnc: but safty is nombar wan prirorty
11:41 AM pink_vampire: LOL
11:41 AM Rab: It's not any worse than reading Steal This Book back in the day.
11:41 AM gregcnc: not even that, just stupider than stupid stuff on some of them
11:41 AM Rab: Or Anarchist Cookbook
11:42 AM fragalot: Rab: what about the <insert anything here>'s manifesto?
11:43 AM Rab: fragalot, sure.
11:43 AM gregcnc: everyone talked about anarchists cookbook, but nobody I knew actually had it
11:44 AM CaptHindsight: gregcnc: I like the toothbrush in the cordless drill for cleaning the insides of pipe stubs
11:44 AM gregcnc: when internet came around I downloaded it and it was like use a lineman's phone to make free calls or dial this number to get a direct line to the prez
11:45 AM Rab: CaptHindsight, chucking random stuff in a drill seems like genius until it starts to whip.
11:45 AM CaptHindsight: then it's entertainment
11:45 AM Rab: Plastic spoon and whipping cream, here: http://reboots.g-cipher.net/cream.jpg
11:45 AM gregcnc: mine is a toss up between knocking teeth out or scalping oneself with corn on the cob ina drill
11:46 AM CaptHindsight: blockhead
11:46 AM gregcnc: fake, it's not even on the highest speed
11:47 AM pink_vampire: is that a fly wheel?
11:47 AM gregcnc: probably a treadmill motor and they couldn't be bothered
11:47 AM Rab: CaptHindsight, that's my ex-girlfiend, be nice
11:48 AM Rab: gregcnc, exactly. ;)
11:48 AM Rab: I took it off later though.
11:48 AM gregcnc: DC? how much HP?
11:48 AM CaptHindsight: ketchup bottles and TNT, good to the last drop
11:49 AM Rab: gregcnc, DC, I think it claims 1HP on the label but it sure doesn't put out that much.
11:50 AM Rab: Maybe at 5000 RPM.
11:50 AM gregcnc: you have full voltage?
11:50 AM gregcnc: yes it would be at rated speed
11:50 AM Rab: I think rated is 90V, I've never actually measured the voltage but I'm using the controller that came with it.
11:51 AM gregcnc: i have one somehwere i got years aog some science & surplus
11:51 AM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/pJ9-yw6EgCQ?t=67 they are not all silly
11:51 AM gregcnc: dang typing bad as ever
11:51 AM CaptHindsight: The V8 Rocking chair | Top Gear |
11:51 AM Rab: http://reboots.g-cipher.net/dcdrillpress.jpg
11:55 AM gregcnc: got this in email; wireless estop? http://www.laird-controls.com/e_stop.html?SessionGuid=d2f6d346-7ab1-42c1-9eba-76e43ef46f90
11:57 AM Rab: "It is also useful in Lock Out/Tag Out operations" shiver
11:58 AM fragalot: there are standards for wireless estops
12:07 PM CaptHindsight: gregcnc: next week http://www.theassemblyshow.com/index.php/attend/show-info
12:08 PM gregcnc: robots?
12:08 PM gregcnc: never done that one
12:08 PM CaptHindsight: yes, lots-a-bots
12:09 PM CaptHindsight: the most techie, more than manufacturing week
12:10 PM CaptHindsight: but smaller
12:11 PM Loetmichel: gregcnc: i worked with a truck with loading crane that had a wireless remote... and an estop on said remote... sad thing is it only cuts the remote.
12:11 PM Loetmichel: not the hydraulic valve
12:11 PM CaptHindsight: well you don't want a loose remote flying around hurting people
12:12 PM Loetmichel: so if (which happened regularily) the amplifiers for the prop valves on the crane shorted out the estop did exactly nothing because then the valves are in end position
12:12 PM Loetmichel: and will stay there when power is cut
12:13 PM Loetmichel: Italians... "intelligent design" ;)
12:13 PM Loetmichel: ... and that crane could do 15 metric tons... ;)
12:13 PM Loetmichel: and had a reach of close to 20 meters
12:14 PM gloops: decent desktop router to cut ally only?
12:14 PM gloops: (not for me)
12:14 PM CaptHindsight: well they invented Romans and look at all they did for us
12:15 PM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight: but aside from the streets the aequaducts.(and so on) ... what have they ever done for us?
12:15 PM Rab: gloops, ShopBot?
12:16 PM Rab: The Shapeoko class stuff is pretty terrible for Al, as one might expect.
12:16 PM gloops: hmm will have a look, budget is small i think
12:16 PM gloops: thanks
12:17 PM Loetmichel: gloops: the CNC 6040 stuff is useable with aluminium
12:17 PM Loetmichel: define decent
12:17 PM Rab: I completely glazed over the "desktop" part, not sure if ShopBot makes that. Loetmichel knows what's up.
12:18 PM Rab: And decent for 2D routing, or 3D contouring?
12:18 PM Loetmichel: 2.5d routing its pretty decent i would say
12:18 PM Loetmichel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJfZnqWUgfA&t=21s
12:18 PM Loetmichel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m7eO5cu-fXg
12:19 PM Loetmichel: i should get a better stand for it though ;)
12:20 PM Rab: They do make a desktop router but it's not a budget item: http://www.shopbottools.com/mProducts/desktop.htm
12:20 PM pink_vampire: Loetmichel: what is the recipe?
12:20 PM Loetmichel: recipe???
12:21 PM pink_vampire: recipe - feed/speed/doc.. etc
12:21 PM gregcnc: hmm not soup
12:22 PM gloops: he wants to make plastic injection molds from ally
12:22 PM gregcnc: good ones?
12:22 PM gloops: hmm, not nasa stuff, but decent, they look pretty simple
12:23 PM pink_vampire: https://i.imgur.com/qwsqdS8.png
12:23 PM gloops: norton blocked that page for some reason Rab
12:23 PM gloops: This is a known dangerous web page. It is highly recommended that you do NOT visit this page.
12:23 PM Loetmichel: pink_vampire: the latter vid is F1200 (mm/min), 24krpm, 0,15mm doc
12:23 PM FinboySlick: Loetmichel: You are abusing your Z axis.
12:23 PM Loetmichel: with a 2mm two flute tungsten carbide aluminium mill bit
12:24 PM Loetmichel: FinboySlick: not any more... look at the second vid... using cambam now, MUCH smoother ;)
12:24 PM pink_vampire: that is te aluminum thickness?
12:24 PM pink_vampire: the*
12:24 PM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1500W-Cnc-Router-Engraver-Engraving-Machine-3-Axis-6040-Artwork-Desktop-Carving/222910058602? how about that Loetmichel
12:25 PM andypugh: CaptHindsight: I think that the belt in that photo must have brokenm and the plastic has slid along the reinforcing wires.
12:25 PM pink_vampire: BRB
12:25 PM Loetmichel: gloops: lools good to me
12:25 PM Loetmichel: and the price is also useable
12:26 PM andypugh: CaptHindsight: I think that everything called “steel” melts at pretty much the same temperature
12:26 PM gloops: that would be ok for ally ?
12:26 PM Loetmichel: gloops: for 2.5D yes
12:26 PM Loetmichel: for 3d: you may need a bit more travel in Z
12:27 PM Loetmichel: pink_vampire: the sheet metal is 1,5mm thich in the second vid and 4mm in the first vid
12:27 PM Loetmichel: thick
12:29 PM Loetmichel: gloops: it even does sheet brass fine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkcJXdLp-ms
12:30 PM gloops: what machine is that Loetmichel?
12:30 PM Loetmichel: a CNC 6040
12:31 PM gloops: similar thing to the link i posted?
12:31 PM FinboySlick: Loetmichel: In the second video, you are abusing the rigidity of everything.
12:31 PM Loetmichel: FinboySlick: as i said: i should make a more rigid rolling desk for it ;)
12:32 PM Loetmichel: it starts accelerating the table instead of the gantry/head ;)
12:32 PM FinboySlick: Make a 1m tall box slightly larger than the router, pour concrete in it, sink the router 5cm into it.
12:32 PM Rab: gloops, injection molds? Ouch...I'd recommend a mill. Rigidity will directly impact the surface finish of the plastic products.
12:33 PM Loetmichel: gloops: ups, i overlooked that. so he wants to mill out moulds? he can do that but i doubt it would be fast.. or pretty
12:33 PM gloops: Rab yeah id be inclined to go with a mill..but, people seem to be doing this with routers
12:33 PM gloops: hmmm
12:33 PM Loetmichel: thats not a job for a router, its a job for a knee mill or similar
12:34 PM gregcnc: so what kind of molding machine will run these?
12:34 PM Loetmichel: it can be done on a router (provided your finsihed tool is lwer than 80mm even on a 6040) but it takes AAAGES to remove that much material
12:35 PM Loetmichel: FinboySlick: what i am abusing here? -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Ym4Y9HEm4s
12:36 PM Loetmichel: (OSHA?) ;)
12:36 PM CaptHindsight: andypugh: not sure who decides but they list a few that melt maybe 100-200C lower than others
12:38 PM FinboySlick: Loetmichel: human decency!
12:38 PM CaptHindsight: make molds on rickety router then micropolish
12:38 PM CaptHindsight: live with tolerances
12:39 PM Loetmichel: FinboySlick: why?
12:39 PM andypugh: CaptHindsight: Is 200C much a win when you are talking about 1600?
12:39 PM Loetmichel: if the machine has a hickup its my fingers alone that are in danger
12:40 PM CaptHindsight: andypugh: depends on how they come to the max temp rating on an electric kiln
12:41 PM FinboySlick: Loetmichel: Now now, you can't follow up your question with 'why?'. That means I have to justify my claim.
12:41 PM CaptHindsight: andypugh: was checking to see if there was something i might be missing
12:41 PM Loetmichel: FinboySlick: indeed!
12:41 PM CaptHindsight: bbl
12:42 PM gregcnc: aren't machines made to be used?
12:42 PM fragalot: no
12:42 PM fragalot: they are made to be kept pristine
12:43 PM FinboySlick: Expected from a Schaublin owner.
12:43 PM gregcnc: to me, pecking is time, but so many factors determine the outcome and the why
12:44 PM Xnke: what's happenin folks
12:46 PM Xnke: anyone here running the 7i96 Mesa control card?
12:46 PM Xnke: I am working out how to best arrange what I will need it to do
12:47 PM andypugh: I have other Mesa cards on machines, and there are similarities
12:48 PM Xnke: I am mostly wondering about the Ethernet pitfalls...will I need a dedicated Ethernet port, can it live on a two machine network etc
12:50 PM Xnke: like I run solidworks in the house, but the Linux CNC machine will be in the shop, and the Mesa card will be in the machine enclosure
12:51 PM fragalot: gloops: you can make molds on a haas GR510.. That's a router. basically.
12:52 PM gregcnc: you just need to get files to the Linuxcnc box
12:53 PM gloops: well the bloke has been quoted £500 a mold, he said its more economical to buy a machine and make his own, he isnt selling them
12:53 PM fragalot: depends on how many he makes
12:54 PM Xnke: right. I am unsure of if I need a sneakernet connection for that or if I can just run samba/Dropbox or something
12:54 PM gloops: i guess the 500 includes design/modelling ..which is no small thing
12:54 PM gregcnc: well, he should understand what it takes to make a 700$ mold
12:54 PM gloops: yes
12:54 PM methods_: live and learn
12:54 PM fragalot: gloops: I seriously doubt the 500 includes design
12:54 PM methods_: 500 for a mold is cheap
12:55 PM fragalot: it is
12:55 PM gloops: fragalot someone would have a go at it for that
12:55 PM fragalot: last mold we bought was 12k
12:55 PM gregcnc: again what kind of plastic injection machine is this running on?
12:56 PM gloops: ask him, hes on facebook - CNC router tips
12:56 PM gregcnc: does he need a consultant?
12:57 PM gloops: ill pass your number on gregcnc
12:57 PM gregcnc: lol
12:57 PM fragalot: "this guy said he'd help free of charge, call him any time"
12:57 PM gloops: reverse the charges
12:57 PM Rab: This guy? http://www.cncroutertips.com/
12:58 PM Rab: How legit are CNC Router Tips's CNC Router Tips if he needs this advice?
12:58 PM gloops: that looks like bill griggs
12:58 PM gloops: its someone on his facebook group
12:58 PM gregcnc: you know who bill griggs is?
12:59 PM gloops: yeah him in the photo
12:59 PM gregcnc: is he still doing RC airplanes?
12:59 PM gloops: no idea, he charges $250 an hour i know that
01:00 PM gregcnc: there you go 3 hours and the mold would be free
01:00 PM gregcnc: before any machine is even purchased
01:01 PM methods_: oh my the website is terribad
01:01 PM gloops: yes, so you know how to make a mold for injection, blowholes etc, thermal expansion who knows what, you can model it in solidworks, you got the CAM software right? and your machine will run it off in ...(how much time is left after all that?) 20 minutes
01:01 PM Rab: resolutely not allowing jawascript for ezpopups.io
01:02 PM gloops: + materials
01:02 PM fragalot: you vastly underestimate how long design for molds takes
01:02 PM fragalot: and spindle time for molds
01:03 PM gregcnc: we have no idea what the requirements are
01:03 PM gregcnc: if considering chinaco router, I'm not sure the client does either
01:03 PM gloops: im working on the 3 hour window
01:05 PM gloops: you can make a tenon on a 12x8 oak beam with a penknife
01:14 PM fragalot: Rab: alternatively you can install a plugin they provide to ensure you never have to run their javascript again.
01:14 PM Rab: fragalot, what a relief!
01:57 PM gloops: having problems CNC_Brian ?
02:35 PM ChunkyPuffs: I have a person who's new to the idea of using LinuxCNC here in a makerspace. He finds it silly that people aren't using mach3, can LinuxCNC be used as a **direct** replacement for Mach3 yet?
02:36 PM gloops: heh heh
02:36 PM gloops: mach3 is that still going then?
02:38 PM ChunkyPuffs: I looked up some stats, and apparently mach4 only has 4% market share now, reckon it'll catch up to linuxcnc?
02:38 PM ChunkyPuffs: either way, he finds it a bit odd that people would bother with linuxcnc
02:38 PM pink_vampire: ChunkyPuffs: just use Linux CNC if you need help, we can help you
02:38 PM ChunkyPuffs: He says there's no support.
02:39 PM ChunkyPuffs: Which is odd, since I'm talking to people such as yourselves who would help in a heartbeat haha.
02:39 PM gregcnc: are you building a machine?
02:39 PM gloops: theres the linuxcnc forum - very active
02:39 PM gloops: #here
02:39 PM ChunkyPuffs: he doesn't like forums
02:39 PM ChunkyPuffs: gregcnc, he has some random garbage router that he has no clue as to the specs of, and we need to figure out the specs
02:39 PM gloops: can he talk to the mach3 developers live?
02:40 PM pink_vampire: ChunkyPuffs: linuxcnc is open source so the help come from the community
02:40 PM gloops: yes what pink_vampire said
02:40 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, the ethos of making vs. consuming seems opposed to commercial closed-source software. Is he agitating for site-wide licensed Windows as well?
02:40 PM ChunkyPuffs: He can't, but he thinks, I think, presumably, because it's proprietary and has support that it must be better.
02:40 PM pink_vampire: and if you have some simple 3 axis machine, you can do the setup in almost no time
02:41 PM andypugh: Where is the support for Mach3 from?
02:41 PM andypugh: LinuxCNC has forum, IRC and mailing list. Talking to the developers directly. Not sure what extra Mach3 might offer over that?
02:42 PM andypugh: LinuxCNC can directly import a Mach XML config file so should be a drop-in replacement.
02:42 PM ChunkyPuffs: pink_vampire, His response is "yes, if you know what to put in the settings"
02:42 PM ChunkyPuffs: I think he's saying that he has no idea about the specs, so can't do anything with the router because those specs are not known.
02:43 PM andypugh: You need to put stuff in the settings for Mch3
02:43 PM ChunkyPuffs: I know nothing about cnc routing myself, but I'm just showing how easy it is to get support
02:43 PM pink_vampire: andypugh: mach3 offer random crashes
02:43 PM syyl_: mach3 also offers eyecancer
02:43 PM gloops: heres a recent linuxcnc build https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvqsVhICXkc
02:43 PM pink_vampire: lets start with the basics, what machine is that, and how do you want to control it
02:43 PM andypugh: If you know the settings for Mach3 then they are the same for LinuxCNC. (and, as I said, if you have a settings file for Mach3 you can use that with LinuxCNC)
02:44 PM gregcnc: specs of the machine have no relation to the control IMO. but figuring mechanical workings of a basic router is not difficult
02:44 PM ChunkyPuffs: pink_vampire, It's a Chinese, generic machine with no manual, no knowledge of the specs, it has some "cnet" thing on the side of it
02:44 PM Rab: gloops, whoa, nice to see that guy's still active.
02:45 PM gloops: pentapod could be a challenge
02:45 PM pink_vampire: I mean it is an engraver / mill? stepper / servo? LPT/FPGA card?
02:46 PM andypugh: ChunkyPuffs: If it is using a USB cable and a driver at the Mach3 end then it _won’t_ work with LinuxCNC.
02:46 PM andypugh: If it uses a parallel port connection then it will.
02:46 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, does this makerspace follow a do-ocracy model or what? Let the guy install Mach3 and knock himself out.
02:47 PM ChunkyPuffs: Rab, No, he just has no idea what linuxcnc, opensource, linux, etc is
02:47 PM ChunkyPuffs: I'm introducing him, despite knowing nothing about CNCs, etc, and so this is my avenue into the knowledge, I want to help him set it up from scratch, hopefully you guys will help too.
02:47 PM andypugh: Yeah, we only care what other folk use to confirm the validity of our own choice. None of us make any money from extra userts.
02:48 PM ChunkyPuffs: andypugh, I don't know about that, yet.
02:48 PM pink_vampire: ChunkyPuffs: is there a tool changer?
02:48 PM andypugh: Many people are extremely happy with Mach3, and make good parts (the poor deluded fools)
02:48 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, got a pic or wiki entry for the CNC?
02:49 PM ChunkyPuffs: Rab, Not yet, will in the future when he brings it down
02:49 PM ChunkyPuffs: All we have right now is the controller that came with the board
02:49 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, oh, he's bringing the CNC?
02:49 PM ChunkyPuffs: at some point, but right now we just have the controller that came with the machine
02:49 PM Rab: And is it running Mach3 now?
02:50 PM pink_vampire: controller means?
02:50 PM ChunkyPuffs: We're starting off with very little here, but he's talking about this mach3 shit and it's urking me lol
02:50 PM ChunkyPuffs: the front says "mini-cnc controller"
02:50 PM pink_vampire: can you take few picturs of the hardware?
02:50 PM CaptHindsight: I'm available 24/7 for mach support, it's only $500 for the first 5 minutes after that it's $1/min until the 2nd hour, then the $500 applies again
02:50 PM pink_vampire: and it connect to the computer via?
02:51 PM ChunkyPuffs: on the back there's a control output on the back that looks like a printer cable with its center hollowed out
02:51 PM gregcnc: https://www.ebay.com/p/CNC-Router-Engraver-Milling-Machine-Engraving-Drilling-3-Axis-3020-Desktop-USB/894312284
02:51 PM ChunkyPuffs: ac input and usb output
02:51 PM ChunkyPuffs: usb type a
02:51 PM gloops: could be grbl
02:51 PM pink_vampire: it is a stepper or servo?
02:52 PM CaptHindsight: mach email support is only $499 per question or part
02:52 PM XXCoder: lol
02:52 PM gloops: quite a lot of people use mach 3 for usb
02:52 PM syyl_: sounds more like the "i dont want to do it"-rate ;)
02:52 PM CaptHindsight: mach support over IRC is the same rate as by phone
02:52 PM syyl_: thats like quoting parts you dont want to make 5x the real price
02:53 PM andypugh: OK, LinuxCNC _can’t_ connect to that “Mini CNC controller"
02:53 PM syyl_: (and still get the fckn order)
02:53 PM gloops: but then they ask a lot of questions like 'why did the cutter plunge straight through the job'
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: get your CC's ready
02:53 PM pink_vampire: ChunkyPuffs: ?
02:53 PM ChunkyPuffs: gregcnc, That's exactly the machine
02:53 PM ChunkyPuffs: pink_vampire, usb type a, check Greg's link
02:53 PM gregcnc: what luck, though many look similar
02:54 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, it's not entirely clear to me what's going on. But if this dude is donating the CNC stuff, and he uses and likes Mach3, and is prepared to use/support it in the makerspace, it's probably poor taste to fight that. People are going to come to him with questions or problems.
02:54 PM andypugh: That Centronics connector is _probably_ carrying actusl stepper motor currents. It’s hard to say from the pictures.
02:54 PM ChunkyPuffs: Rab, It's not like that, the situation is that he wants to set up this garbage CNC from ebay that he happens to have
02:54 PM Roguish_ is now known as Roguish
02:55 PM CaptHindsight: ChunkyPuffs: what he said and find something else to do for fun, later if they have too many issues you can rub it in their faces like dogs in their turds!
02:55 PM ChunkyPuffs: his opinion on linuxcnc is neutral
02:55 PM MarcelineVQ: Making it linuxcnc won't make the machine magically better, in fact people might just blame linuxcnc for it being bad, people are weird after all
02:55 PM andypugh: I suspect that there is a smoothstepper clone lurking in the box.
02:55 PM ChunkyPuffs: he has no opinion, he's 49 and has never heard of open software
02:55 PM ChunkyPuffs: sn:y17051
02:56 PM ChunkyPuffs: that is a local file lmao
02:56 PM andypugh: ChunkyPuffs: Most of the LinuxCNC developers are around that age, including me :-)
02:57 PM CaptHindsight: pink_vampire: please post your IP address and PW for the backdoor
02:57 PM andypugh: ChunkyPuffs: At this point I would say that you should use Mach3 and get on with making parts.
02:57 PM Rab: pink_vampire, whoa, I can backspace to file:///C: and see all the files on your computer. Try it out!!
02:57 PM CaptHindsight: haha
02:58 PM pink_vampire: i have no idea why it is make it like that
02:59 PM andypugh: <furtle, rummage> Interesting images collection there Pinkvampire :-)
02:59 PM Rab: MarcelineVQ, very insightful; I've seen that happen.
02:59 PM Rab: (With other software)
02:59 PM pink_vampire: it is the second time it sent the url as c://
03:00 PM pink_vampire: i think it is a problem with my IRC client,
03:00 PM CaptHindsight: how many basketball can they fit in there? 8,9....
03:00 PM Rab: pink_vampire, where did you post the image?
03:02 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, let him know that Mach3 is shareware costing $175, and LinuxCNC is FREE. He should be able to understand that.
03:02 PM gloops: in windows explorer pink_vampire?
03:02 PM pink_vampire: I see the problem,
03:03 PM andypugh: pink_vampire: We all see the problem, it’s called Windows :-)
03:03 PM andypugh: But MacOS is even worse
03:03 PM pink_vampire: if you click copy image, instead copy image location, it just paste a local link. WHY?? i have no idea.
03:03 PM pink_vampire: andypugh: after you buy solidworks, you forced to use windows
03:04 PM gregcnc: in your browser?
03:04 PM pink_vampire: yeah
03:04 PM gregcnc: isn't that normal?
03:05 PM andypugh: On a Mac, if you right-click a link and select “copy link” then paste it you often just get the plain text of the linked words, not the link, if you paste into an email.
03:05 PM pink_vampire: no
03:05 PM gloops: upload them to paste pics or imagebb
03:05 PM Rab: pink_vampire, oh, because the image you're seeing is actually cached in your temporary internet files. If you copy image location, it should copy the web URL. If you copy image, it pulls the location of the cached file.
03:06 PM gregcnc: copy image doesn't paste anything from FF?
03:07 PM andypugh: pink_vampire: I run Autodesk Inventor in a VM, works OK.
03:07 PM pink_vampire: yeah it is a bug.
03:07 PM Rab: Maybe pink_vampire uses Microsoft Edge.
03:07 PM pink_vampire: andypugh: I can't it is soo slow
03:08 PM andypugh: Though Fusion running native is often easier (and, as you suggest, a lot smoother and snappier)
03:10 PM pink_vampire: on other services it is just paste it as image , I have no idea why the irc client do it as local url. it is huge bug.
03:13 PM ChunkyPuffs: Am back, it's makernight at the makerspace and it's a bit hectic
03:13 PM ChunkyPuffs: I know and am convincing him of the nice naature of free software
03:14 PM ChunkyPuffs: Rab, you don't need to convince me lol
03:14 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, simply offering tactice.
03:14 PM Rab: re tactics
03:14 PM Rab: er er
03:15 PM ChunkyPuffs: andypugh, So, you're saying that we're boned with that specific controller?
03:15 PM ChunkyPuffs: I don't mind experimenting with any possible controller, recommend one.
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: you can easily change from mach to LCNC down the road if there are too many problems
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: the big thing is wiring up the machine
03:16 PM andypugh: First thing to do is work out if the stepper drivers are in the base or in the box, ie which side of the Centronics cable the stepper drivers are on
03:17 PM andypugh: Well, the machine in question is nice that way. One USB cable and one Centronics cable.
03:18 PM andypugh: As there is no power supply to the machine base I assume that the stepper drivers are in the blue box.
03:19 PM andypugh: The machine probably comes with a pirated copy of Mach3. At this point I would say that switching to LinuxCNC is too much trouble for too little reward.
03:19 PM andypugh: I would do it, but I am a zealot :-)
03:20 PM CaptHindsight: what! And miss out on the sheer joy of being in this channel?
03:20 PM ChunkyPuffs: [ 8483.866608] usb 3-2: New USB device found, idVendor=a720, idProduct=f803, bcdDevice= 3.00
03:20 PM ChunkyPuffs: [ 8483.866612] usb 3-2: New USB device strings: Mfr=1, Product=2, SerialNumber=3
03:20 PM ChunkyPuffs: [ 8483.866614] usb 3-2: Product: RNR ECO MOTION 2.0
03:20 PM ChunkyPuffs: [ 8483.866616] usb 3-2: Manufacturer: RobotAndRobot.com
03:20 PM ChunkyPuffs: [ 8483.866618] usb 3-2: SerialNumber: 46CD9E1F732
03:20 PM ChunkyPuffs: [ 8483.868170] hid-generic 0003:A720:F803.0011: hiddev4,hidraw7: USB HID v1.10 Device [RobotAndRobot.com RNR ECO MOTION 2.0] on usb-0000:00:14.0-2/input0
03:20 PM ChunkyPuffs: Sorry about the spam
03:20 PM ChunkyPuffs: but that's what this board shows up as in linux
03:21 PM Rab: Robot & Robot is a creative agency based in New York City. We are a full-service studio creating strategy, design & production across all platforms. We specialize in brand identities, campaigns, social strategy & content creation, commercials, websites, apps, books, environments, and more.
03:21 PM ChunkyPuffs: I don't want to use Mach, stop telling me to use Mach lmao
03:21 PM ChunkyPuffs: I am not concerned with time, I want to simply get to grips with LinuxCNC
03:21 PM XXCoder: mach mach mach mach ;)
03:21 PM ChunkyPuffs: I have another board elsewhere that I'm going to get working with it "probotix or something"
03:21 PM XXCoder: might be wrong but I think it is worth it to figure out and use linuxcnc yeah
03:22 PM CaptHindsight: Rab: might be from the future, in 60 years Robot & Robot could be a machine controller galactic website on the GWW
03:23 PM Rab: Looks like it's something called a STB4100 Mach3 USB Motion Card: https://www.buildyourcnc.com/Documents/USB%20Motion%20Card%20STB4100%20Manual.pdf
03:23 PM ChunkyPuffs: I got a pic of the card
03:23 PM ChunkyPuffs: it's taken apart
03:24 PM Rab: Which is just a USB breakout board which talks to Mach3 over USB somehow.
03:24 PM pink_vampire: ChunkyPuffs: just get C10 board, LPT, and you done
03:24 PM Rab: You can replace it with this, which talks to LinuxCNC over a parallel port: https://www.ebay.com/itm/152833919438
03:26 PM CaptHindsight: got LPT port?
03:26 PM andypugh: To convert to LinuxCNC you would replace that with something like https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/292662602282 and use the parallel port. Or if you (very reasonably) think that the parallel port is an abomination, something Ethernet controlled from Mesa: http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=83_85&product_id=311
03:26 PM pink_vampire: ChunkyPuffs: I have that board https://cnc4pc.com/c10-bi-directional-parallel-port-interface-card.html
03:27 PM andypugh: I spent more on Mesa hardware for my lathe than thet entire CNC router + controller cost…
03:27 PM XXCoder: isnt ethernet not RT and parallel port is?
03:27 PM CaptHindsight: how much will I get for porting LCNC to work over USB poorly?
03:27 PM Rab: Mesa warez are obviously a superior solution, but a $120 card might be a lavish expenditure for a $400 machine.
03:27 PM andypugh: LinuxCNC + Preempt-RT + Ethernet is realtime
03:28 PM andypugh: Rab: Definitely
03:28 PM andypugh: And I doubt that engraver will do much rigid-tapping
03:28 PM XXCoder: interesting'
03:31 PM andypugh: XXCoder: 7i76E is becoming the go-to card for LinuxCNC stepper retrofits: http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=83_85&product_id=290
03:31 PM andypugh: (equivalent to 5i25 + 7i76 but easier cabling and better isolation)
03:31 PM Rab: CaptHindsight, I guess Mach3 sends non-RT data over USB, and the controller executes the data deterministically. If you can figure out the protocol, it doesn't necessarily have to work poorly.
03:32 PM CaptHindsight: yah just has a delay of 100mS is all
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: don't expect any position updates of something goes offtrack for that amount of time
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: of/if
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: for open loop it's easy
03:34 PM Rab: It would probably make legions of eBay CNC users happy. But those precious development hours could also be devoted to 5-axis CAM or some other lofty goal.
03:34 PM pink_vampire: mesa card is super overkill
03:35 PM CaptHindsight: for open loop you can just send the whole path over USB and put LCNC to sleep
03:36 PM rmu: isochronous USB transfers should be available in preempt-rt and if that works good enough for HD audio it could probably also kind of work for CNC
03:36 PM pcw_mesa: Yeah for something simple like a router, a open loop buffered system like Mach really doesn't have many disadvantages and has the advantage of not needing a real time host
03:38 PM pcw_mesa: well even if you make USB work, it still has lousy noise immunity and suffers from loan enumeration delays when anything goes wrong
03:38 PM pcw_mesa: s/loan/long/
03:39 PM CaptHindsight: yes, with mach and USB I'd have issues with noise
03:40 PM CaptHindsight: it's fun to lose keyboard, mouse and machine control all at once
03:41 PM rmu: ethernet clearly is superior
03:41 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Smoothieboard-5xC-v1-1-/172989603498 $170?!
03:42 PM CaptHindsight: I used to put power over Ethernet in the mid 90's
03:44 PM Rab: CaptHindsight, isn't that the usual price?
03:44 PM ChunkyPuffs: https://imgur.com/gallery/0T8S0aJ
03:44 PM CaptHindsight: it's been a while since I looked, isn't USB 2.0 only good to 2m?
03:45 PM andypugh: It would be interesting to turn up on a Mach3 forum and say you had a working LinuxCNC system you were thinking of converting to Mach3. I wonder what they would say?
03:45 PM CaptHindsight: ChunkyPuffs: maybe, just seems high for what you get
03:45 PM ChunkyPuffs: TX14207
03:46 PM andypugh: Spiral cable wrap is something of a quality touch.
03:48 PM Rab: It's this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/222755044531
03:50 PM ChunkyPuffs: Thanks Rab !
03:50 PM ChunkyPuffs: Any serial number/product code?
03:51 PM ChunkyPuffs: https://www.hobbytronics.co.za/Content/external/979/Datasheet%20-%20MOT-02092%20-%20Red.pdf
03:52 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, very easy to swap it with a parallel port breakout board. But that would be required for LinuxCNC; the USB controller won't work.
03:52 PM ChunkyPuffs: So I need to toss this
03:53 PM rmu: 4 inputs for limit switches etc... is a joke
03:53 PM ChunkyPuffs: toss this shitty controller, and replace it with a arduino of some sort to run linuxcnc?
03:53 PM Rab: uhh
03:54 PM Rab: LinuxCNC requires a computer...you could run something like GRBL on an Arduino I guess.
03:55 PM rmu: the board doesn't look that bad. you could probably run something like TinyG directly on that board if the STM is not locker. but that would probably involve some programming.
03:55 PM rmu: s/locker/locked/
03:55 PM Rab: I shan't offer an opinion on GRBL vs Mach3.
03:55 PM andypugh: ChunkyPuffs: Mach3 needs a PC, LinuxCNC needs a PC. We are talking about the stuff between the PC and the stepper drivers.
03:56 PM ChunkyPuffs: Right
03:56 PM ChunkyPuffs: This controller, right now, is incapable of speaking to linuxcnc though?
03:56 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, correct.
03:56 PM ChunkyPuffs: So, how do I resolve that?
03:56 PM andypugh: (LinuxCNC can also run on Raspberry Pi and Beaglebone, but GUI performance is pretty poor)
03:56 PM ChunkyPuffs: Or replace it with something that is, arduino uno?
03:56 PM Rab: ChunkyPuffs, either use Mach3, or replace the USB board with a parallel port board.
03:57 PM andypugh: ChunkyPuffs: You would need to swap the USB interface card for a P-port breakout card, and then find a PC with a Parallel port to run LinuxCNC on.
03:57 PM andypugh: That’s the cheapest solution. There are more capable hardware solutions for rather more money.
03:59 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-25-pin-PCI-E-Express-Parallel-LPT-printer-Card-Moschip-9901-Support-64bit/121928279663
04:03 PM CaptHindsight: before CNC https://imgur.com/gallery/Ocy4vsP
04:05 PM Deejay: gn8
04:12 PM gloops: should cnc pottery making https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmiziIcOq2E
04:13 PM andypugh: Throwing pots is too much fun to automate
04:14 PM andypugh: But a lot of the 3d printers can be configured to extrude clay, and I have seen some very inteesting things
04:14 PM gloops: hmm never thought of extruding clay
04:15 PM andypugh: https://all3dp.com/1/3d-printing-ceramic-3d-printer/
04:16 PM gloops: yep https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onTUVlev8iY
04:16 PM CaptHindsight: "they sped that video up!"
04:17 PM gloops: probably going to be the future of construction, maybe not with clay but similar stuff
04:18 PM CaptHindsight: nah nanites and particle beam constructors
04:18 PM gloops: why have a bricklaying machine when you can just print the wall
04:19 PM CaptHindsight: best will be when you can just think of something and it will materialize...
04:19 PM andypugh: Well, I had a good chat with oine of our 3d printing experts at work about that. He reckoned that bricks were still the way to go, but you print large bricks in a factory that already contain all the openings, insulation gaps and ducts for the services.
04:20 PM gloops: or you think it has materialised
04:20 PM CaptHindsight: but they will charge tons of $$$ to remove whatever you imagined
04:24 PM CaptHindsight: not much happening new in housing construction
04:24 PM CaptHindsight: mostly just cheaper materials
04:24 PM gloops: suppose a problem with printing concrete or such, viscosity and drying time, needs to be soft enough to extrude, but then you have stability problems with something like a wall while its setting
04:24 PM gregcnc: print lego bricks, build legp stacking bot
04:25 PM gregcnc: I think ICF is pretty quick
04:25 PM gloops: double skin lego block with cavity
04:26 PM gregcnc: there are all sorts of air gapped brick already
04:26 PM CaptHindsight: there is little interest
04:26 PM gloops: yeah there are
04:26 PM CaptHindsight: nahhuh
04:26 PM gregcnc: not here
04:26 PM gregcnc: europe much more so
04:27 PM CaptHindsight: pre-fab
04:28 PM gregcnc: like lincoln log houses?
04:28 PM gloops: but to keep 100mm wall either side with say 60mm cavity - heavy block for humans to throw around
04:29 PM CaptHindsight: it's been done and redone, but there's little interest
04:29 PM gloops: plus the cavity will always be bridged where the 2 sides join
04:32 PM CaptHindsight: robot poured foundations, bamboo and aluminum framing and surfaces
04:33 PM CaptHindsight: stone roofs
04:34 PM Jin^eLD: anyone tried these? https://www.aliexpress.com/item/LT4-foot-switch-foot-switch-machine-tool-foot-switch-silver-contact/32809170543.html look solid but I am somewhat confused by such a low price...
04:35 PM Jin^eLD: my beadroller is getting a VFD and I want to control forward/reverse using a foot pedal
04:35 PM gloops: wont need it when the ice age comes - no cement needed for ice walls
04:37 PM Jin^eLD: gloops: ice age may take a while, we'll probably get roasted first
04:37 PM CaptHindsight: under water first
04:38 PM Jin^eLD: oh right
04:39 PM Jin^eLD: allthough probably not so acute for my location, quite far away from seas and oceans
04:39 PM gloops: our minds will be safely uploaded to hard drives by then
04:39 PM CaptHindsight: future ocean front property :)
04:41 PM CaptHindsight: all restaurants will be Taco Bell
04:41 PM gregcnc: not starbucks?
04:42 PM CaptHindsight: didn't you see Demolition Man?
04:42 PM gregcnc: not in recent history
04:43 PM CaptHindsight: the 3 sea shells
04:44 PM rmu: Jin^eLD: interesting, that foot switch is about 0.8kg mostly aluminium, here you would pay more for raw aluminium stock
04:44 PM gregcnc: oh sandra bullock
04:45 PM CaptHindsight: "you really matched his meat"
04:45 PM gregcnc: i guess i haven't seen it at all
04:45 PM CaptHindsight: some great lines
04:46 PM Jin^eLD: rmu: I am sure its some aluminum powder based stuff, which is probably good enough for the use case, but yes, those switches cost *a lot* more around here, even used
04:46 PM andypugh: Jin^eLD: Presunably just a switch not a potentiometer?
04:47 PM Jin^eLD: andypugh: yes, just a switch, I had some thoughts on this and figured that I probably do not want to control the beadroller speed dynamically by foot
04:47 PM Jin^eLD: this is also how Lazzes beadrollers work
04:47 PM Jin^eLD: so will select the speed manually first and then just use the pedals to go forward/reverse
04:48 PM andypugh: TIG welders (and car drivers) control speed by foot with great siccess
04:48 PM Jin^eLD: andypugh: in a car you have a nice steady sitting position, you're not standing with a chunk of sheet metal
04:49 PM Jin^eLD: did not do TIG yet so can't tell how they do it :)
04:49 PM Jin^eLD: and I can probably mod the pedal if I really decide I need to control the speed by foot
04:50 PM andypugh: Suck-blow tube like some disabled people use?
04:51 PM Jin^eLD: not sure I know what that is?
04:53 PM andypugh: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sip-and-puff
04:53 PM Jin^eLD: oh wow.. I think I'm fine with chosing the speed with a wheel knob first ;)
04:54 PM andypugh: Just seems like a potential way to do the control when your hands are full.
04:55 PM Jin^eLD: well, it may be a personal preference, I tried a beadroller that was controllable by a foot switch and found that it was less convenient, had to balance on one foot and make sure not to press the pedal too much
04:56 PM Jin^eLD: and in most cases I did not really need the speed change, I'm not really doing meter long roof parts or stuff like that
04:57 PM ChunkyPuffs: right, so maker night is over now
04:57 PM ChunkyPuffs: was very hectic so couldn't get a lot of information through, everyone was throwing their bits and pieces of knowledge in
04:58 PM CaptHindsight: STAINLESS STEEL ROLL-UP machine cover 14" x 24" $1400ea
04:59 PM CaptHindsight: think I'll pass
05:00 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.hennig-inc.com/aprons-and-roll-ups/
05:03 PM Jin^eLD: heh
05:38 PM JT-Shop: I bought a couple of hennig aprons for the 308 last year
05:42 PM CaptHindsight: JT-Shop: off the shelf or custom?
05:47 PM JT-Shop: custom size to replace the old ones
05:47 PM Jin^eLD: nite
05:48 PM Jin^eLD is now known as Jin|away
05:48 PM CaptHindsight: not sure why the roll up covers are so much other than they either get that price or they really don't want to make them
05:49 PM SpeedEvil: Jin|away: mouth switch might work well, but has other issues.
05:49 PM JT-Shop: I think the roll up mechanism is expensive, mine are just hanging type
06:41 PM rene_dev_: https://imgur.com/a/YkiSmdD
06:42 PM methods_: so wrong
06:42 PM methods_: you're going to hell for that
06:43 PM methods_: the linux gods shall smite thee for this blasphemy
06:55 PM CaptHindsight: sometime back around 1995 we used Winders with a real time patch for embedded
06:55 PM CaptHindsight: found it https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTX_(operating_system)
06:56 PM CaptHindsight: latencies are under 10 microseconds
06:56 PM CaptHindsight: hardware dependent
06:59 PM CaptHindsight: was done by ex-Intel people
06:59 PM CaptHindsight: can't recall the name right now
06:59 PM rene_dev_: methods_ did you know that emc originally ran on windows nt?
06:59 PM CaptHindsight: http://files.iccmedia.com/pdf/ecemay13-p13.pdf BS claim of down to 1uS (hardware dependent)
06:59 PM methods_: i had no idea
07:00 PM rene_dev_: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/common/emc-history.html
07:01 PM CaptHindsight: this was back in the i386 days
07:01 PM rene_dev_: I was bored with a windows machine, and played with wsl
07:01 PM rene_dev_: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Subsystem_for_Linux
07:03 PM CaptHindsight: what! bored! and you didn't work on a new Linux desktop?
07:06 PM rene_dev_: my macbook broke, and now I happen to have a laptop that came with windows 10
07:28 PM andypugh: Still, a useful tool for testing and developing. I do a ton of work in a VM on my Mac, and that’s got shockingly unusable latency.
07:37 PM rene_dev_: so do I
07:38 PM rene_dev_: it gets even better when you give priority to the vm
08:55 PM gregcnc: some Emco machines run Windows with realtime thing called SPOX
11:58 PM fragalot: hi