#linuxcnc Logs

Sep 20 2018

01:51 AM Deejay: moin
02:03 AM Loetmichel: hmm... got two I5-7500 boxes here yesterday back from the CE test... 80W(125W peak) PicoPSU literally exploded when they first did "stress -c10" on linux mint. I have no put in a 125W(150W) PicoPSU... stress -c 10 ... runs... but the Lab PSU says "24V 2.1A load"... and thats a 65W TDP cpu... HOW?
02:16 AM CaptHindsight: bad supply
02:17 AM CaptHindsight: what does the rating really mean?
02:21 AM Loetmichel: so, just put ice spray to the heatsink... NOW it draws 2.6 amps... still not enough... but why does the /"§$/&% fan doesent spin up???
02:23 AM rmu: Loetmichel: you need proper load for cpu to max out TDP
02:24 AM Loetmichel: the "stress" command should place that on the CPU
02:26 AM rmu: not necessarily. you need to load the proper mix of different parts of the cpu
02:26 AM pink_vampire: hi
02:26 AM rmu: heavily depending on CPU
02:27 AM sensille: also the cpu might get clocked down when it gets too hot
02:28 AM rmu: i used to use setiathome for burn in and linux kernel compiles to test memory and disk
02:30 AM sensille: i wonder if even the manufacturer knows how to max out the cpu
02:30 AM Loetmichel: sensille: indeed
02:30 AM Loetmichel: thats my guess
02:30 AM Loetmichel: sensors says it sits at 76 tp 78°C
02:31 AM CaptHindsight: run windows without a firewall
02:31 AM sensille: :)
02:32 AM sensille: surely that how they test at intel, too
02:33 AM rmu: you can be sure that intel and amd use specific methods to test each "hot path" for each CPU
02:33 AM rmu: and there is more than one temperature sensore on the die
02:33 AM sensille: yes, but how to get max utilization?
02:34 AM sensille: that's an idle exercise anyway
02:35 AM rmu: that is an expensive optimization problem with unknown (to the ignorant public) dimensions and diminishing
02:36 AM rmu: e.g. going AVX2 -> AVX-512 is not necessarily a win
02:38 AM sensille: the question is how to charge as many lines as possible with each clock
02:38 AM rmu: sensille: https://www.agner.org/optimize/
02:38 AM sensille: oh, i know that blog
02:39 AM rmu: ;)
02:39 AM sensille: but the problem at hand is not how to get the best performace, but how to get the chip as hot as possible
02:39 AM sensille: no one needs that ;)
02:41 AM CaptHindsight: Prime95 with AVX and Small FFTs, powerMAX, or AIDA64’s Stress FPU
02:43 AM CaptHindsight: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Stress_testing
02:44 AM CaptHindsight: linpack is used for comparing supercomputers
02:44 AM CaptHindsight: and clusters
02:46 AM CaptHindsight: https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/19792/Intel-Processor-Diagnostic-Tool-64-bit-
02:47 AM sensille: master of googling
02:48 AM CaptHindsight: takes one to know one :)
02:49 AM CaptHindsight: try using one of the fur rendering tests on just the cpu
02:51 AM sensille: have still to read your cat-article yet
02:51 AM sensille: do you know the book 'our mathematical universe'?
02:59 AM CaptHindsight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Our_Mathematical_Universe
03:01 AM sensille: it's fun to read
03:01 AM CaptHindsight: 3:00 here, till later......
05:06 AM Loetmichel: soo, got the system running... 23.5V 2.3A is a bit low though for an I5-7500 under full load... strange, but i am not complaining... as long as the Picopsu doesent explode i am fine ;) -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=17207&g2_imageViewsIndex=1 (scroll down for details, and yes, i should clean up my desk ;)
05:51 AM jthornton: morning
06:02 AM slipalong: hello
06:02 AM slipalong: Anyone there?
06:02 AM XXCoder: nah nobody here
06:03 AM slipalong: Sorry just getting IRC working on a new machine, had to register NickServ
06:03 AM XXCoder: yeah freenode had awful bots attacks
06:03 AM slipalong: Don't remember dong that last time??
06:03 AM XXCoder: so most if not all channels is now register required
06:03 AM slipalong: Fair enough
06:04 AM slipalong: Is that why there are so few logged in do you think.
06:05 AM slipalong: Havent been on here for a couple of months and it used to be quire busy
06:05 AM XXCoder: nah its 4 am here
06:05 AM XXCoder: its very early
06:06 AM slipalong: Ah ok!
06:06 AM XXCoder: usually quiet at this time, though sometimes chattu
06:06 AM XXCoder: in a hour or 2 it will be again, sometimes
06:42 AM jthornton: some channels you don't have to be logged in to type
08:17 AM Jin|away is now known as Jin^eLD
08:17 AM Jin^eLD: hi
08:18 AM slipalong: hello
10:57 AM miss0r: 'evening
11:25 AM fragalot: hi
11:25 AM sensille: hey
11:27 AM syyl: ho
11:28 AM * fragalot is trying to work out how to add a Z way cover to the schaublin
11:28 AM syyl: i would just go with a wide leather cover
11:28 AM syyl: hanging over the front of the z-ways
11:29 AM fragalot: i've done that now but it gets in the way
11:29 AM fragalot: due to how everything moves
11:29 AM fragalot: i'm wondering if I could make a telescoping sheet metal ordeal instead
11:29 AM syyl: sure!
11:29 AM syyl: or look into some bellows
11:30 AM syyl: like on a fp1/fp2
11:36 AM fragalot: laminated telescoping ordeal it is.
11:37 AM fragalot: syyl: if you know where to find those..
11:38 AM fragalot: syyl: bearing in mind there is a whopping 10mm between the Z and the back of the vise
11:39 AM fragalot: and about 5mm between the Z column and the fixed part of the 'knee'
11:44 AM miss0r: hello fragalot
11:45 AM fragalot: Hey miss0r
11:45 AM fragalot: I got a package today
11:45 AM fragalot: sadly not from GLS
11:45 AM miss0r: When you say it that vauge, I didn't even get my hopes up
11:45 AM fragalot: xD
11:45 AM miss0r: Damn sad to see a tapmatic x50 lost forever
11:45 AM fragalot: Yeah...
11:46 AM miss0r: I was about to tell you the other day, that he has a few others for sale I could get cheap. But I don't know the brand & you already bought the chuck for the X50...
11:47 AM miss0r: plus: I don't trust any shipping company anymore
11:47 AM fragalot: i've not (recently) had any issues with DHL
11:47 AM fragalot: yet
11:47 AM miss0r: fragalot: Make your company hire me for something stupid & fast, so someone pays for the roadtrip down there. Then I will find and bring you another one :D
11:47 AM fragalot: xD
11:48 AM fragalot: we DO need technicians to cover for someone that's fallen ill
11:48 AM fragalot: but it's multi-day and basically just electrical & plumbing assmbly
11:48 AM miss0r: how multi day? :D
11:48 AM miss0r: I guess two is also multi? :)
11:49 AM fragalot: we're full up all the way through october with orders still pouring in :P
11:49 AM miss0r: hehe. Nah, I can't realy abandon my family and customers for too long :D
11:49 AM miss0r: plus: chances for them to accept someone from denmark to do it; slim ;)
11:49 AM fragalot: that'd depend on your rates
11:50 AM fragalot: so ... non-existant :D
11:50 AM miss0r: I mostly just hit stuff with a big club, while I scratch my unibrow (belgian picture of a dain) :)
11:51 AM miss0r: apparently, its 'dane' ha...
11:51 AM fragalot: whilst you're munching on a carrot, with a beer in one hand and the keg in another
11:51 AM miss0r: https://media3.5amily.com/prev_cache/25b7a095cca2e1ae7285bc57b3872e9abe75e07b.jpg <- haha
11:51 AM fragalot: miss0r: so anyway
11:52 AM fragalot: telescoping sheet metal cover for the Z ways
11:52 AM fragalot: yay or nay
11:52 AM miss0r: why would I munch carrot if I had beer? :)
11:52 AM miss0r: depends.. do you want you pretty schaublin looking like an abomination or do you want to use leather?
11:53 AM fragalot: i've got a flap of rubber on there now but it's super annoying with how the axis' all move
11:53 AM miss0r: do elaborate
11:54 AM fragalot: very long Z travel, not much clearance between column and vise, and Y goes from very close to back to very far forward
11:54 AM miss0r: that is why you should leather
11:55 AM fragalot: leather would work if it was stretchy
11:55 AM fragalot: because otherwise you have 300mm of rubber flopping onto your vise
11:55 AM miss0r: you can get "leather" pants that can do that :P
11:55 AM fragalot: being dragged sideways as the X moves
11:55 AM miss0r: but leather is more foldable than rubber
11:56 AM miss0r: don't you think that could fit between the table and the column?
11:56 AM fragalot: it would, but it would still get pulled sideways
11:56 AM miss0r: hmm....
12:02 PM miss0r: fragalot: do send me a picture
12:02 PM fragalot: gimme an hour or so
12:03 PM miss0r: long exposure time?
12:03 PM miss0r: :P
12:03 PM fragalot: :)
01:16 PM fragalot: miss0r: you still around?
01:17 PM miss0r: yup
01:17 PM miss0r: running back and forth to the cnc, though
01:17 PM fragalot: https://photos.app.goo.gl/thuarMvYNmgBGagu8
01:17 PM miss0r: Nice :D
01:18 PM miss0r: I like all the extras :D
01:18 PM miss0r: brb
01:19 PM miss0r: That situatuation you have it in is a bit extreme, imo
01:19 PM fragalot: sure
01:19 PM fragalot: but it should still not jam up
01:19 PM miss0r: (the second picture)
01:19 PM miss0r: I think you could get away with doing it with some soft leather
01:20 PM miss0r: and when you need to do something 'extreme' you can tie it back
01:20 PM fragalot: not shown is wat happens when you move the table left & right
01:20 PM miss0r: But lets be honnest, that is a very rare situation
01:20 PM miss0r: indeed
01:20 PM fragalot: or just up & down.. it's just annoying
01:20 PM fragalot: even with leather (yes, I tried)
01:21 PM miss0r: hmm.. Don't know of a realy good solution then. I mean, they were not meant to have it from factory :D
01:21 PM fragalot: yea :P
01:21 PM miss0r: Then you'll need to make an abomination
01:21 PM andypugh: I do like the design of those universal milling machines
01:21 PM miss0r: perhaps with a steel curtain
01:22 PM fragalot: miss0r: either that, or a telescoping sheet steel construction
01:22 PM fragalot: a slim version of what is popular on modern machines
01:22 PM miss0r: sure
01:22 PM miss0r: make one for both Z and Y ?
01:23 PM fragalot: Y points away from any chips and the leadscrew has it's own spiral cover
01:23 PM fragalot: wait, X does
01:23 PM fragalot: Y can't be done
01:23 PM gregcnc: why isn't your compressor 2.2kW?
01:24 PM fragalot: the Y retracts FULLY so there is nothing to mount any covers on
01:24 PM miss0r: sure
01:24 PM fragalot: gregcnc: because it's 2208W
01:24 PM miss0r: is the carbide endmill supposed to light up like this? :P
01:25 PM gregcnc: are HP ratings common?
01:25 PM fragalot: gregcnc: no, compressors appear to be the exception
01:25 PM gregcnc: huh
01:27 PM miss0r: smart move making carbide endmills light up, so you can see in the dark at the bottom of a slot :-/
01:27 PM gregcnc: great tip
01:28 PM fragalot: miss0r: I thought you were supposed to use the stream of orange chips to light up the way
01:30 PM fragalot: miss0r: btw, what the hell are these "drive dog" looking things on the center left of this drawer picture for? https://photos.app.goo.gl/r1MKuf71uBpUY12m7
01:30 PM fragalot: I recognize it from somewhere but I can't quite place it
01:31 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLcdm6gB6eE DragonFly $300,000 3D PCB Printer Prototype
01:31 PM CaptHindsight: only 200 x 200mm boards
01:32 PM miss0r: fragalot: They almost look like those loose jaws, you can place on the 'mounting plate' on the lathe. But I realy don't know.
01:32 PM miss0r: Lets get syyl in here, I'm sure he'd know
01:34 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: which has different diëeletrical properties than the final design will
01:34 PM gregcnc: wow inkjet printed pcb
01:34 PM Tom_L: fragalot not some sort of lathe jaws are they?
01:34 PM fragalot: Tom_L: the back side appears to be ground flat
01:35 PM fragalot: I mean, they COULd be, but it's a damn strange shape for lathe jaws
01:35 PM Tom_L: strange shape for anything i've come across..
01:35 PM CaptHindsight: fragalot: theirs is so slow that it can't be used for production
01:36 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: if you're using that tech for production you're doing it wrong anyway
01:36 PM CaptHindsight: odd they use layers, guess the software is too hard for them
01:36 PM fragalot: the PCB design itself is in layers
01:36 PM fragalot: why would you change that
01:36 PM CaptHindsight: fragalot: why do you think that?
01:37 PM CaptHindsight: the PCB only requires the outer layers where components can be placed
01:37 PM fragalot: because you can't reflow it yet
01:37 PM Tom_L: fragalot what are all the slotted couplers (spacers) for?
01:37 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: yes and no
01:38 PM Tom_L: horizontal mill cutter spacing?
01:38 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: the layers can be used by the engineer to create capacitance for filtering, or for EMI shielding
01:38 PM fragalot: Tom_L: yes
01:38 PM CaptHindsight: fragalot: been printing circuits with fluids for 10+ years
01:39 PM CaptHindsight: my question for their printer is how they will deal with all the patent trolls
01:40 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: is it faster, cheaper or more reliable than the conventional manufacturing methods used for mass manufacturing of PCB's?
01:41 PM CaptHindsight: since you're printing the core and traces it can be more like multiwire than layers
01:41 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: that certainly makes it interesting to design for the electronics engineer :D
01:42 PM CaptHindsight: not really
01:42 PM fragalot: surely they need to be able to spec how that wire is routed
01:42 PM CaptHindsight: multiwire has been around for decades
01:42 PM fragalot: you can't just willy nilly connect the dots and pray things work for all signals
01:43 PM fragalot: ethernet traces or dual ported ram being some examples
01:43 PM CaptHindsight: you can control trace and space in 3 dimensions
01:44 PM fragalot: i've not really used any software that supports that
01:44 PM gregcnc: why does yt want to know who i might vote for?
01:45 PM fragalot: gregcnc: because they sell said information
01:45 PM fragalot: and they can push the "right" videos to you
01:45 PM fragalot: which means you are more likely to view them, which generates more ad revenue if you're not using an ad blocker
01:45 PM CaptHindsight: why does a calculator app need my location, contact list and browser history?
01:46 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: location is to determine if it should use "," or ".3
01:46 PM fragalot: "." *
01:46 PM gregcnc: yeah i wanted to connect a speaker, same thing
01:49 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Z32_MYxYhc Fontus goes BANKRUPT!
01:50 PM CaptHindsight: self filling water bottle
01:50 PM fragalot: I would have NEVER expected that :D
01:51 PM fragalot: honestly if dave makes a video for every kickstarter that goes bankrupt after the company owners have paid themselves,.. he'd have his own booming YT channel
01:51 PM gregcnc: huh they shipped 9 olo printers https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/olo3d/olo-the-first-ever-smartphone-3d-printer/posts/2279850
01:52 PM CaptHindsight: they can't make the resin
01:52 PM CaptHindsight: for what they promised it would cost
01:53 PM CaptHindsight: I was happy they paid me for the sample resin
01:53 PM fragalot: lol
01:55 PM CaptHindsight: they will probably make some announcement soon about why they we cheated by some Chinese firm
01:55 PM CaptHindsight: we/were
01:55 PM fragalot: shocking
01:58 PM CaptHindsight: they are experienced scammers
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: they always have some story about what account they have to use for payments
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: paypal drama and non business shipping addresses
02:00 PM MarcelineVQ: Fontus is kind of an amazing study in how gullible people are.
02:00 PM CaptHindsight: "we are traveling so can you ship it (some other country with mail forwarder)
02:00 PM CaptHindsight: same for US politics
02:00 PM MarcelineVQ: As though the idea of a dehumidifier was somehow new, or in any way poorly understood enough that the device could ever meet any of the expectations they set up.
02:02 PM fragalot: MarcelineVQ: kickstarter is an amazing study, fontus was just one of the cases. :P
02:03 PM Tom_L: it's easier to do a kickstarter than find a backer for your product
02:03 PM MarcelineVQ: While there's godd stuff that's come from kickstarter I still would't disagree with your assesment
02:03 PM Tom_L: and as usual with that comes the dishonest
02:04 PM fragalot: Tom_L: or the art students putting a product up there with no technical backing :P
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: hmm never noticed until now that styrofoam cups leak when holding vinegar
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: almost holding
02:05 PM Tom_L: seep thru the pores or eat it?
02:05 PM CaptHindsight: not sure yet
02:05 PM CaptHindsight: took a day
02:06 PM Tom_L: they shrink in deep water too
02:06 PM CaptHindsight: foam
02:06 PM MarcelineVQ: It's definitely a leak, not condensation that smells like the vingegar near it?
02:06 PM CaptHindsight: left a ring of vinegar
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: set a fruitfly trap
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: cider vinegar, ethanol and soap
02:08 PM CaptHindsight: ethanol = sweet vermouth
02:09 PM CaptHindsight: they seem more attracted to breads than alcohol
02:11 PM MarcelineVQ: We just use a paper cone taped to a jar with a piece of fruit in it, as per standard insect practice they go in and don't get out
02:12 PM CaptHindsight: picked up a $5 tennis racket electric swatter
02:12 PM CaptHindsight: goes zap zap when you get one
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: also sends fried bug parts flying all over
02:17 PM MarcelineVQ: haha
02:20 PM CaptHindsight: surprised nobody has put up a howto to convert one for killing electronic devices
02:31 PM CaptHindsight: "By default, the charge pump feature is turned on, with the “Pulse Switch” (next to the DB25 connector) set to the “Off” position (means “Charge Pump” on)."
02:31 PM CaptHindsight: why of course
02:47 PM miss0r: Today I was out doing some upgrades to a 2011 deckel maho machining center. I had to replace the linear guides for the access h
02:47 PM miss0r: robot access hatch. The stuff it was build with was insane!
02:47 PM miss0r: The linear guides was something you'd normally see used to hand curtains with
02:47 PM syyl: what machine?
02:48 PM miss0r: Can't remember exact name. Will be back there tomorrow
02:48 PM syyl: :D
02:48 PM miss0r: But the one thing that realy blew my mind was the wire pullet mount: https://imgur.com/a/XS1X3KF
02:48 PM CaptHindsight: t-slot guide
02:48 PM CaptHindsight: 10 x 10mm
02:48 PM miss0r: I made a replacement. it was already bend out of shape when I got there :D
02:49 PM syyl: crashed?
02:49 PM miss0r: They had a local guy come in and install it three years ago. and during the past few months they had 10 breakdowns
02:49 PM miss0r: syyl: well, the robot hit the access hatch, because it didn't move
02:49 PM syyl: well
02:49 PM syyl: that sucks :D
02:49 PM miss0r: because, amongst other things, that bracket there was bend
02:49 PM syyl: reminds me of the toolchanger of one of our dmgs.
02:50 PM syyl: decided to spin the tool-carousell while the spindle was in to pick up a tool
02:50 PM miss0r: ha... so the pickup arm was bend? :)
02:50 PM miss0r: or did it just drop all the tools?
02:50 PM syyl: cleared the whole toolchanger. sounded completely insane when all the 40 taper tools got knocked out and droped down
02:51 PM syyl: it was a changer without an arm
02:51 PM syyl: the spindle drops down into the carousel
02:51 PM syyl: and picks the tool directly
02:51 PM miss0r: indeed.. any spindle damage?
02:51 PM syyl: the spindle craped out a few months later
02:51 PM syyl: so, possible, yes
02:51 PM miss0r: so.. thats a yes :]
02:52 PM syyl: but it already had 8000 hours on it
02:52 PM miss0r: How many endmills did die?
02:52 PM syyl: all of them. and the renishaw
02:52 PM miss0r: bah...
02:52 PM methods_: ouch
02:52 PM XXCoder: syyl: robo cnc machine eh]
02:52 PM syyl: the dmg guy that came in was a bit puzzled
02:53 PM miss0r: have you given any thought to your photograph talk the other day? :)
02:53 PM syyl: and then took almost two days to bend everything back in shape..
02:53 PM miss0r: syyl: I don't know about the german division of DMG, but the danish ones are 'iffy' at best
02:53 PM syyl: the dmg service is
02:53 PM syyl: hmm
02:53 PM syyl: hit and miss
02:53 PM syyl: sometimes you get a brilliant service tec
02:53 PM miss0r: yeah. My experience as well :]
02:53 PM methods_: yeah i don't know what mori seiki was thinking
02:54 PM syyl: and sometimes you get the dropout
02:54 PM syyl: i have the photo in back of my head
02:54 PM miss0r: I think I've only ever seen *ONE* dmg tec that wasn't to be considered the dropout
02:54 PM syyl: but i have a very busy week
02:54 PM syyl: :D
02:54 PM miss0r: He doesn't work there no more :)
02:54 PM miss0r: syyl: Yeah; me as well. I'm only clocking out now. and I started at 06:00
02:55 PM syyl: ouch
02:55 PM syyl: the joy of beeing self employed, hu? :D
02:55 PM miss0r: yeah :]
02:55 PM syyl: and then this tony guy bugs me all the time
02:55 PM syyl: :D
02:55 PM miss0r: Its more like: if I make a commitment to a client, I will keep it - even if I don't get any sleep
02:56 PM miss0r: tot? did he make fun of you again ? :)
02:56 PM syyl: we will see
02:56 PM miss0r: hehe
02:57 PM miss0r: I've often wondered if it would be possible to get abom in here to hang. I would love to pick his brain from time to time :]
02:57 PM XXCoder: hire him as consultant
02:57 PM miss0r: hehe yeah. I should do that :D
02:58 PM miss0r: I've also watched these guys called 'physics anonymous'.. I've stopped watching them. They started talking about some stuff that sounded interresting. But everything they do... well.. They are not realy skilled
02:59 PM miss0r: in the machining department, anyway
02:59 PM miss0r: Thats it for tonight. I need to catch some sleep. See you guys around.
02:59 PM XXCoder: later :)
03:00 PM syyl: cu
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: miss0r: try the mail list or the forums
03:29 PM XXCoder: telsa model 3 stolen from mall by just phone. lol
03:29 PM XXCoder: IOT fail.
03:34 PM Jin^eLD: XXCoder: you missed the "S" in there... IO(Shitty)T
03:34 PM Jin^eLD: was a marvellous article on heise.de
03:34 PM XXCoder: indeed
03:35 PM XXCoder: I planned on IOS but then some people might not know that one
03:36 PM XXCoder: off to work wheee
03:59 PM Deejay: gn8
04:26 PM dan3wik is now known as dan2wik
05:39 PM Jin^eLD is now known as Jin|away
08:57 PM X704 is now known as tiwake
11:27 PM MacGalempsy: good evening