#linuxcnc Logs
Sep 19 2018
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:02 AM miss0r: trentser: you still around?
12:06 AM * miss0r is out
02:09 AM Deejay: moin
02:29 AM pink_vampire: what is the "P" value in the g64 command?
02:29 AM pink_vampire: G64 P0.05
02:30 AM pink_vampire: what is the 0.05?
02:31 AM Deejay: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.6/html/gcode/gcode.html#sec:G64
02:31 AM Deejay: tolerance
02:32 AM Deejay: example: G64 P0.015 (set path following to be within 0.015 of the actual path)
02:33 AM Deejay: hi pink btw ;)
02:39 AM pink_vampire: thanks!
02:39 AM pink_vampire: I'm faceing wood in 60K
02:39 AM pink_vampire: so fun
02:52 AM Deejay: wow
02:53 AM pink_vampire: it become dust
02:55 AM pink_vampire: Deejay: https://i.imgur.com/ZqWbp5y.png
03:01 AM MarcelineVQ: particle board? careful not to breathe that in
03:01 AM pink_vampire: i know i have a mask
03:04 AM Jin|away is now known as Jin^eLD
03:08 AM nallar is now known as Ross
03:25 AM MacGalempsy: yo
03:28 AM pink_vampire: hi
03:30 AM MacGalempsy: making chips PV?
03:30 AM pink_vampire: yeah
03:31 AM MacGalempsy: what are you making?
03:38 AM MacGalempsy: any nacho cheese to go with the chips?
04:12 AM pink_vampire: i'm working on my servo spindle
04:18 AM XXCoder: yo
04:23 AM pink_vampire: tinkerbell making some magic dust
04:23 AM XXCoder: is that codeword for cocoine? lol
04:24 AM pink_vampire: aluminum "chips"
04:25 AM XXCoder: not exactly snortable lol
04:25 AM pink_vampire: I just LOVE the super low load that the spindle apply to the material
04:29 AM pink_vampire: WTF was that?
04:29 AM pink_vampire: the end mill just gone in a bang
04:29 AM XXCoder: ow
04:30 AM XXCoder: if it was making owder it would be because it rubbed itself dull and broke by sideload
04:30 AM pink_vampire: no, my mistake
04:30 AM XXCoder: oh what was it?
04:32 AM pink_vampire: I bore the hole and left the retract on center..
04:33 AM pink_vampire: XXCoder: https://i.imgur.com/7r1HhgP.png
04:33 AM XXCoder: so it didn't clear hole?
04:33 AM pink_vampire: it clear the hole, and then cleat the end mill
04:34 AM XXCoder: no, clear as in went higher than hole so it wouldnt hit side
04:35 AM pink_vampire: I just found the end mill (half of it)
04:35 AM XXCoder: anyway it happens. I had to modify program at work today, because it would try to move X way too far to park table for operator to change part
04:36 AM pink_vampire: OMG
04:36 AM XXCoder: and for some weird reason one line was messed up
04:36 AM XXCoder: so fixed those and uploaded
04:36 AM pink_vampire: this is soo bad
04:36 AM XXCoder: is part fine or scrapped?
04:36 AM pink_vampire: the part is fine
04:37 AM pink_vampire: but the endmill is no joke
04:37 AM pink_vampire: https://i.imgur.com/x6knoSr.png
04:37 AM XXCoder: lol I have no idea how many tools I worn out or destoyed at work
04:37 AM XXCoder: hundreds easily
04:38 AM pink_vampire: https://i.imgur.com/V0OQTqd.png
04:38 AM XXCoder: so it center then slope down run to edge, then spirl cut down
04:38 AM gregcnc: oops, probably why enclosures are steel
04:38 AM XXCoder: then it centers while puck is still there?
04:39 AM XXCoder: okay I finally get the reason. ya some programs at work has m0 where I gonna clear out cutoffs
04:39 AM pink_vampire: but HF spindles are sooo fun
04:40 AM XXCoder: gregcnc: a61 at work has 2 panel bulletproof windows
04:40 AM XXCoder: both is cracked, and one has a hole
04:40 AM gregcnc: dang
04:40 AM XXCoder: programmer had a dumbs on one part, it went 10 times faster than supposed to and endmill one inch thick and 8 inches flute length broke and flew
04:41 AM pink_vampire: the best part is my wife not going to ask me anything
04:42 AM XXCoder: lol no worries for me, im single for life
04:42 AM gregcnc: pink did you move or wake everyone at home up?
04:43 AM pink_vampire: gregcnc: I'm the only one here.
04:44 AM pink_vampire: and TinkerBell of course.
04:57 AM jthornton: morning
04:58 AM XXCoder: yo
04:58 AM XXCoder: friday will be hot here
04:58 AM XXCoder: it will actually reach 66f
04:59 AM gregcnc: probably our last 87°F day tomorrow
05:02 AM jthornton: high 92 for today and tomorrow then it falls off to mid 70's :)
05:04 AM XXCoder: nice
05:05 AM jthornton: it's been cool enough to ride the mountain bike at sunrise
05:06 AM gregcnc: so yesterday I put a bunch of 6061 parts off the lathe into a cup with water to rinse them and walked away for lunch
05:06 AM gregcnc: some time later they were stained
05:06 AM jthornton: https://www.mtbproject.com/trail/7027125/wolf-creek-trail-849
05:07 AM gregcnc: that looks nice
05:07 AM jthornton: except the outer loop is 12 miles
05:09 AM gregcnc: our county has thousands of acres in preserves and you are not really allowed to use much for biking
05:09 AM gregcnc: as teenagers we did anyway
05:10 AM XXCoder: rusted?
05:10 AM jthornton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ghppRTfp2M
05:10 AM jthornton: that's me riding the trail
05:12 AM gregcnc: aluminum, brown staining, parts are fine if I blow them off with or without washing. i just forgot
05:13 AM gregcnc: I have to try to see if a dip in somethign will brighten them or if it's going to be scotchbright
05:14 AM jthornton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6QrWPboTvU
05:15 AM jthornton: they must ride the whole trail in 1:31
05:15 AM XXCoder: one min 31 seconds? ;)
05:15 AM jthornton: 1h:31m
05:15 AM XXCoder: yeah figured that
05:16 AM gregcnc: what distance?
05:16 AM jthornton: the forest service had it fixed up real nice
05:17 AM jthornton: the outer loop is 12 miles, if you ride all the trails it's 26 miles
05:21 AM jthornton: https://www.fs.usda.gov/nfs/11558/www/nepa/71062_FSPLT2_023858.pdf
05:21 AM jthornton: finally found the project map
05:24 AM jthornton: XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2IlOw_2hKg
05:27 AM XXCoder: looking
05:27 AM XXCoder: weird it didnt show up in my gmail
05:30 AM Tom_L: 74F Hi 93
05:31 AM gregcnc: when a new guy starts at the shop? https://www.instagram.com/p/Bn4I4WpHelw/
05:31 AM jthornton: you get email notification of myfordboy videos?
05:31 AM XXCoder: jthornton: no wonder it was 2 months ago!
05:31 AM XXCoder: yeah
05:31 AM XXCoder: sub then click bell
05:32 AM jthornton: ah
05:32 AM XXCoder: I click bell on ALL subbed channels because summary skips many of those
05:32 AM XXCoder: yes it means i get 10 to 20 emails a week but great list of videos to watch usually.
05:32 AM XXCoder: I remove channels that make daily videos because thats just too much and tend to be content-free
05:33 AM XXCoder: oh yeah that reminded me that he fgot facemill really cheap than ones at work
05:56 AM diverdude: Hi there - So my arduino uno runs a very imple loop where it just sends a number every second. I am trying to read this using boost::asio with a callback on my computer. For some reason it reads a number and then it reads 0 bytes and exits unexpectedly although it should just call the callback funtion whenever data is read from port. If I test same program when i emulate serialport w. socat instead - no problem? Why does it not wor
06:19 AM miss0r: G'day
06:22 AM diverdude: miss0r: hey there
06:22 AM miss0r: hello :]
06:22 AM diverdude: miss0r: ever did serialport communication btwn arduino and a linux machine? :)
06:22 AM miss0r: nope
06:23 AM diverdude: dang :D
06:23 AM miss0r: only to a windoze
06:23 AM diverdude: ah yes ok
06:23 AM miss0r: What is the issue
06:23 AM diverdude: no for some reason the connection gets disconnected after reading a few bytes
06:24 AM miss0r: That is odd. What are you using to read the serial communication with?
06:26 AM miss0r: Have you tried this description: https://playground.arduino.cc/Interfacing/LinuxTTY
07:20 AM miss0r: I'm seeking inspiration to help sold a problem: I have a 5mm thick flange mounted with 4x 8mm screws. The screws are welded to the surface the flange is attached to. Each screw protrudes 15mm. I have to lift the flange 11.5mm off the surface. Any good ideas as to how to do this?
07:20 AM miss0r: sold=solve*
07:21 AM miss0r: fragalot: This is something you'd come up with a solution to in a heartbeat ;)
07:21 AM fragalot: who what where when why?
07:21 AM miss0r: what I just wrote above :D
07:22 AM miss0r: The flange is a quite complicated one, that amongst other things holds a pneumatic cylinder. So the fixture needs to still be somewhat strong
07:22 AM fragalot: and an 8mm plate with hole pattern
07:22 AM fragalot: is not a solution, because.. ?
07:23 AM miss0r: 8mm ? :S
07:23 AM fragalot: 15mm screw minus thickness for an M8 nut :P
07:23 AM miss0r: Well. It only needs to be moved away from the surface, not in any other direction.
07:24 AM miss0r: The way i see it, when the flange is lifted 11.5mm, the m8 screw is 1.5mm short of sticking out the top of the flange
07:24 AM fragalot: ah the screws are welded from the opposide side, rather than being 15mm studs
07:24 AM miss0r: the screws are welded from inside the frame, before the machine was put together
07:25 AM miss0r: yeah... So its not *that* straight forward :D
07:26 AM fragalot: there's no way around this apart from either going chicaco screw style, or doing it properly and extending said bolts
07:26 AM fragalot: or cutting & threading female
07:27 AM miss0r: hmm.. No real way for me to extend the bolts
07:27 AM miss0r: so I guess, I'll have to go with the chicago style screws, and maker seprate spacers
07:28 AM fragalot: drilling out said bolts and tapping M8 is not an option either I guess?
07:28 AM miss0r: I should be able to drill the holes a bit larger in the flanges
07:28 AM miss0r: I would be afraid of doing so
07:28 AM fragalot: chicago it is.
07:29 AM miss0r: The box section they are protruding from is the main cable channel
07:29 AM fragalot: ha :D
07:29 AM gregcnc: hmmm I had to look that up, but wiki calls them sex bolt
07:29 AM miss0r: realy? I've always known under that name
07:29 AM fragalot: this is why I love having a selection of "sleeves" to put over drills to stop them poking through when drilling in plate
07:29 AM gregcnc: there is a list of names https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_bolt
07:30 AM miss0r: yeah... sleeves or not. I would still have a small heart attack each time
07:30 AM fragalot: (still wouldn't risk drilling into acable channel :D)
07:30 AM miss0r: its just alot of machining, making spacers & bolts.
07:30 AM miss0r: If only I had to move it out further, I would've just made a spacer with an M8 thread all the way through
07:40 AM fragalot: cut threads to 8mm long, make spacer with M8F on one end, and M8M on the other
07:40 AM fragalot: :P
07:41 AM miss0r: That sounds like somethat that could make you alot of money, should it work :D
07:42 AM fragalot: they exist, but the part is typically longer
07:42 AM fragalot: (eg. my schaublin uses those for the MC ->ISO30 adapters)
07:44 AM miss0r: sure... but the "thick part" would need to be -3.5mm long
07:44 AM fragalot: removing material is easy
07:44 AM fragalot: I don't see the problem
07:44 AM fragalot: :D
07:59 AM diverdude: I have an arduino program which sends a numeric value (integer) every second via serialport. I have a c++ program using boost::asio which should read this data. It disconnects from arduino stream after having read 1 integer. If i use same c++ program om socat serial simulation it works. Here is hexoutput( made from xxd /dev/ttyACM0 - over a period: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/MbSRm35HnV/) that no EOF or other strange meta is sent. W
08:46 AM fragalot: diverdude: might want to ask over in #arduino or similar
08:47 AM diverdude: i solved it
08:48 AM pink_vampire: dry fit - DONE
08:53 AM miss0r: This project is turning to shit right fast in a hurry :-/
08:53 AM miss0r: haha. I need to run out and find some more suitable stock to get this done.
09:02 AM pink_vampire: https://i.imgur.com/dSMI64K.png
09:09 AM fragalot: does it run yet? :D
09:10 AM pink_vampire: not yet, just first dry fit.
09:10 AM fragalot: miss0r: at least you can now use those ER32 hex blocks you haven't bought yet? :)
09:11 AM pink_vampire: I'm not 100% happy with how the pulley connect to the R8 cartridge
10:24 AM gimps_ is now known as gimps
11:13 AM Simonious: Our plotter is being sunset, because there will be no drivers for it for windows10. :/
11:13 AM Simonious: so new plotter!?
11:17 AM Loetmichel: Simonious: VM?
11:17 AM roycroft: i still use a designjet 650c
11:17 AM Loetmichel: i have a designjet 650C A0+ here. built in 1991... still running with win7
11:18 AM roycroft: there are no windows 7 drivers for it, but i got a copy of 64-bit windows xp and installed the driver from that
11:18 AM MarcelineVQ: I still can't imagine a reason to upgrade past windows 7 if your computer isn't for internet browsing
11:18 AM Simonious: Loetmichel: the plotter needs to be usable for several endusers, the company is moving to windows 10 with windows 7 sunset in 2020.
11:19 AM roycroft: mine is e size - it takes 36" rolls
11:19 AM Loetmichel: Simonious: 2023
11:19 AM Loetmichel: but right
11:19 AM roycroft: if you need an excuse to upgrade the plotter, this is a great one
11:19 AM Simonious: I think there are workarounds (ok), but we don't want to spend (much) time on workarounds.
11:19 AM roycroft: i don't know if windows 7 printer drivers work on windows 10
11:20 AM roycroft: but you might try installing the windows 7 driver to see if it does work
11:20 AM * roycroft knows as little as he can get away with about windows
11:20 AM Simonious: wait - which did you say was an upgrade? the dsignjet 650c? I thought that was an older plotter too?
11:20 AM Loetmichel: but where is the problem to set asidea "print server" box that runs winXP and only sees the internal network, not the internet?
11:20 AM Simonious: Loetmichel: that *might* be doable
11:22 AM * Loetmichel wouldt let go of his designjet 650C... i might have to soon though because i cant seem to get a new maintaineance station for it
11:22 AM Loetmichel: and the old one has cracked gaskets so the expensive ink tank/nozzes are drying out every few weeks
11:22 AM roycroft: teh internet suggests you may be able to install a windows 7 printer driver on windows 10
11:23 AM roycroft: loetmichel: i don't use my 650c often
11:24 AM roycroft: and i don't want to waste time/paper/ink doing a test plot every week or two to keep the ink cartridges "fresh"
11:24 AM roycroft: i've found that when they start drying out and don't work any longer, if i hold the print head under warm running water for a couple minutes the cartridge starts working fine again
11:28 AM Simonious: I guess if I do have to replace it - who has a newer plotter they love and what is it?
11:34 AM JT-Shop: https://semo.craigslist.org/sop/d/hp-designjet-500-plotter/6690749912.html
11:36 AM roycroft: that's not a bad plotter
11:36 AM roycroft: a little pricey for a d size plotter though
11:46 AM JT-Shop: it cost $2265
11:52 AM cradek: that's only like 3 sets of cartridges for a 650c
11:53 AM cradek: and they last right up until you have the nerve to stop plotting for 20 minutes
11:53 AM cradek: (I hate those machines)
11:53 AM cradek: but the way it grabs the knife to cut the roll off is neat
12:07 PM miss0r: fragalot: Good thing I remembered I had some 17mm hex stock on the shelf before going anywhere :D The bolts are done now. Now I just need to make some spacers
12:07 PM sensille: can anyone recommend a laser for engraving? i have no idea what the needed specs are
12:07 PM sensille: i want to mount it to a corexy and go fast
12:08 PM miss0r: fast as in 'wr00m wr00m' or fast as in speed ajuster is turned to rabbit rather than turtle?
12:10 PM sensille: up to 1000mm/s
12:10 PM miss0r: What are you planning to do engraving on ? :)
12:10 PM sensille: it's not for serious results, more to test the hardware
12:10 PM sensille: i want a way to record the path of the head, including ripples, overshoots etc
12:11 PM sensille: so i can test several strategies to reduce them
12:11 PM miss0r: ha... with a laser?
12:11 PM sensille: is that a stupid idea?
12:11 PM miss0r: Well.. overshoots & ripples can be hard to detect on an engraved line
12:11 PM miss0r: if you want to notice something smaller than 0.5m
12:11 PM miss0r: mm*
12:12 PM miss0r: even if it is a fine laser line
12:12 PM sensille: hm
12:12 PM sensille: is the focus of the laser not good enough, or does it depend on the material to engrave on?
12:12 PM miss0r: for that stuff, I normally use dial indicators & alot of setups :) I'm sure theres a smarter way though
12:13 PM miss0r: well.. in many cases the focus is ajustable.
12:13 PM miss0r: but lets be realistic here; you are going to engrave on wood or plastic
12:13 PM miss0r: if you want a laser than can engrave on steel, it will have a sizeable pricetag on it, probally not what you want for a test setup? :)
12:13 PM sensille: has to be cheap, because i'll do many runs
12:14 PM sensille: (the material to engrave)
12:14 PM miss0r: In any case; the lines on wood & plastic has a tendency to 'smear' ever so slightly
12:14 PM sensille: like... paper?
12:14 PM miss0r: sure - wood fibres. you *can* get pretty good results. But seeing the errors with your eyes will be a real challange
12:15 PM miss0r: unless they are quite sizeable
12:15 PM sensille: that's why i want to exaggerate the speed so much
12:15 PM sensille: to make the errors very visible
12:16 PM sensille: target printing speed will be around 100mm/s, so if i can't see errors at 500mm/s with my eyes, it will probably be fine
12:16 PM miss0r: I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish. Any machine can be forced to produce errors if it is run fast enough. You are in danger of noticing some errors that would not even be there at a more reasonable speed
12:16 PM sensille: really? aren't they just much smaller?
12:17 PM sensille: isn't it all deflection and stretch?
12:17 PM miss0r: It all depends. So many variables
12:17 PM miss0r: you *could* skip a step or outrun an encoder ect.
12:17 PM sensille: the driver would notice that
12:17 PM miss0r: but sure. the machine deflection would be amplified af speed
12:18 PM miss0r: I guess, I don't know your setup in detail
12:18 PM sensille: also skips are very audible
12:18 PM sensille: in a quiet setup
12:18 PM miss0r: plural, yes :)
12:18 PM sensille: so you think the line is not fine enough
12:19 PM miss0r: no. I would not think so.
12:19 PM miss0r: What I would do; a repitition test: move the spindle to a dial indicator and zero it. move back and forth at different speeds
12:19 PM miss0r: and see if it always zeros out the dial or if it overshootes ect
12:20 PM miss0r: preferably do this a few different places on the table
12:20 PM gregcnc: has nobody built a core xy with laser?
12:20 PM sensille: maybe some more background: i have a corexy 3d printer, and am trying to build a new firmware with very tight jerk control
12:21 PM sensille: and am searching for a way to directly visualize the differences
12:21 PM CaptHindsight: aqueous ink is cheap and easy to make or purchase by the gal/4L from China, always look for printers that are refillable
12:21 PM sensille: actual printing adds many more variables
12:22 PM sensille: so i though a laser can show the path more directly
12:22 PM gregcnc: how will you measure?
12:22 PM miss0r: Sensille: hehe. Well, never say never. You can get a pretty cheap laser engraver. But if you are planning on running it realy fast, I would go for a 15watt one.
12:22 PM sensille: especially the ripple after taking a turn interests me
12:22 PM miss0r: I don't don't see how you will see it on the line, unless it is realy bad
12:22 PM gregcnc: i think you want measuring devices not a laser
12:23 PM sensille: hm. measuring devices for the dynamic movement?
12:23 PM sensille: i could add linear encoders to the axes
12:24 PM sensille: they should show overshoots, too
12:24 PM miss0r: that would make sense. Have a data logger draw it up
12:24 PM sensille: but it also changes the setup significantly
12:24 PM miss0r: sure
12:24 PM sensille: they don't move that easily
12:25 PM gregcnc: i'm a bit confused as I'm not sure how the laser comes into play
12:25 PM sensille: so they will dampen the ripple
12:25 PM CaptHindsight: if you can't see the errors are they really there?
12:25 PM gregcnc: you really do want to observe the actual position right?
12:25 PM gregcnc: not draw cartoons?
12:25 PM sensille: yes
12:26 PM gregcnc: linear encoder is probably the easiest though i don't know much about other options
12:27 PM sensille: i'm afraid of the friction they add
12:27 PM sensille: a 3d printer is not a cnc
12:27 PM gregcnc: which encoders did you look at?
12:29 PM sensille: one sec
12:30 PM fragalot: miss0r: pfft, who keeps hex stock around :D
12:30 PM * fragalot doesn't because it gets used up too quickly
12:31 PM sensille: gregcnc: i have one of those https://www.aliexpress.com/item//32827867788.html
12:31 PM sensille: and i already removed the dust protection
12:32 PM fragalot: sensille: magnetic read heads don't really add significant friction as it's non-contact
12:33 PM sensille: this one is optical. and the friction just comes from the mount
12:34 PM fragalot: those do add significant drag on light setups
12:34 PM sensille: i could disassemble it and mount the components separately
12:34 PM sensille: without the spring
12:35 PM fragalot: if there's no chips and coolant flying around, you could indeed reduce friction quite a bit on those
12:37 PM CaptHindsight: what is the actual problem with the laser? Trying to get a poorly working one better?
12:37 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: i'm more guessing he's working on step generation & trying to optimize pathing to have minimal overshoot
12:38 PM sensille: yes
12:38 PM CaptHindsight: stop the guessing
12:38 PM gregcnc: someone was here a couple weeks ago talking about jerk for 3d printer, must be a popular topic
12:38 PM sensille: i could use a small laser and 'engrave' on a ccd chip
12:38 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: when I said guessing, I meant "i've deduced that..."
12:38 PM CaptHindsight: please mention actual problem :P
12:38 PM sensille: gregcnc: probably me :)
12:39 PM gregcnc: i gave a link to yt
12:39 PM sensille: yes
12:39 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: you mean you don't like the xy problem? (or whatever it's called)
12:39 PM sensille: but he only started with jerk control
12:39 PM CaptHindsight: I have no feelings on the matter
12:40 PM CaptHindsight: define problem, solve problem
12:40 PM sensille: so, magnetic linear encoders?
12:40 PM CaptHindsight: feelings are for Twitter
12:41 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: that is exactly what the XY problem is..
12:41 PM gregcnc: if you put encoder on a flimsy frame will it give the answers you need?
12:42 PM fragalot: it depends on what you're after, really
12:43 PM fragalot: if you take only the actuator with a load on it, and measure the movement of said load, that is one thing
12:43 PM gregcnc: what about accelerometer on the axis?
12:43 PM sensille: too slow
12:43 PM fragalot: if you counterlever said load off-axis, the whole game changes
12:43 PM fragalot: sensille: accelerators do exist in high speed models
12:44 PM sensille: hm. they _should_ be able to show the overshoot
12:45 PM fragalot: for example the ADXL1005 should give you a 23kHz range
12:46 PM CaptHindsight: lets just say that we now now the exact amount of "overshoot" now what? Write research paper?
12:46 PM CaptHindsight: now know
12:47 PM sensille: observe the influence of jerk and acceleration on it
12:47 PM sensille: or even compensate it by modifying step generation
12:47 PM CaptHindsight: sounds like a research paper
12:47 PM sensille: without the paper part
12:47 PM fragalot: changing acceleration and jerk ARE step generation modifications :P
12:48 PM CaptHindsight: well if the point is smoother engravings then you can see the difference
12:48 PM sensille: ok, change the algorithm
12:48 PM fragalot: but I do believe that it can be possible to have higher decelerations than standard and compensate for overshoot some other way
12:48 PM fragalot: we do very strange things with our drive signals some times to achieve higher accuracies
12:48 PM CaptHindsight: modify settings, look at engravings, repeat
12:49 PM sensille: fragalot: that's what i have in mind, too
12:49 PM sensille: in the end it's just physics
12:49 PM sensille: but i need a way to measure the result
12:49 PM fragalot: sensille: agreed.
12:49 PM pcw_home: Don't 3D printers usually aim for constant velocity? on a constant velocity path so jerk is determined by the Gcode
12:49 PM CaptHindsight: only school would have you waste time and make you show your math
12:50 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: or industry trying to push the envelope
12:50 PM CaptHindsight: fragalot: nah
12:50 PM fragalot: in fact i've got whole papers written about certain tricks to make our controller faster
12:50 PM sensille: the gcode always dictates infinite jerk, at least the gcode that gets fed to 3d printers
12:50 PM CaptHindsight: that a research paper
12:50 PM sensille: only lines
12:50 PM fragalot: and the code & drive to prove it
12:51 PM CaptHindsight: again a research paper
12:51 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: WITH a real-world application and implementation
12:51 PM pcw_home: No, the path determines the jerk on a constant velocity path
12:51 PM CaptHindsight: what did school do to you? :P
12:51 PM sensille: pcw_home: what, with instant direction changes? that's infinite jerk and acceleration
12:51 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: nothing - on the job training did this to me :P
12:52 PM CaptHindsight: he just wants to plot faster
12:52 PM sensille: pcw_home: you'd have to stop completely and start again, but that's not constant |v|
12:52 PM sensille: CaptHindsight: you guessed wrong
12:53 PM pcw_home: the controller can determine the tangential jerk but not the path (unless its allowed to fudge the path)
12:53 PM fragalot: I'm all for sensille improving the standard S-curve used today
12:53 PM pcw_home: So at a constant tangential velocity you really dont control the jerk
12:53 PM pcw_home: your work does
12:53 PM sensille: fragalot: thanks :) it's hard to argue against "but we don't do it this way"
12:54 PM CaptHindsight: time wasting
12:54 PM sensille: CaptHindsight: not your time, though
12:54 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: agree to disagree?
12:54 PM gregcnc: don't most cnc controls use some jerk control?
12:54 PM CaptHindsight: fragalot: see ^^
12:55 PM pcw_home: many do but its well to remember that it doesn't provide much benefit on constant velocity paths
12:55 PM pcw_home: since the path determines the jerk
12:55 PM sensille: so that accelerometer might give me enough resolution
12:56 PM sensille: <0.01mm
12:56 PM sensille: that's one way
12:57 PM sensille: looks like the laser idea is not feasable, because the engraved line would be too smeared to see details
12:58 PM sensille: and 15W would be a lot for that
12:58 PM fragalot: laser is very impractical
12:59 PM fragalot: even if you aim it at a ccd and use a clever algorithm to find the exact center of the smear
01:00 PM sensille: ok, thanks for helping with my brainstorming
01:29 PM CaptHindsight: don't need the exact center of the smear since it's a smear
01:30 PM CaptHindsight: if smear = fuzzy
01:31 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: you do if you are more interested in it's target position than you are in the spot size
01:31 PM fragalot: there are common techniques for this used in astrophotography
01:31 PM fragalot: to get sub-pixel accuracy of position
01:33 PM sensille: i was about to say a ccd chip is too slow, but if i really only want to see the path, i don't need time resolution
01:33 PM fragalot: sensille: think 2D, move X axis at constant speed, and do your jerk on the Y
01:34 PM fragalot: tadaah, crude oscilloscope view of the path :D
01:34 PM sensille: ah :)
01:34 PM miss0r: fragalot: At last I am done with all the components for tomorrow morning
01:35 PM miss0r: Its always exciting to say yes to do a replace & upgrade on a robot access door on a cnc mill.
01:35 PM sensille: maybe there are other light sources that are easier to focus
01:35 PM miss0r: (especially when you have to finish in two days)
01:35 PM fragalot: sensille: doubt that.
01:35 PM fragalot: especially because a laser's whole game is a tightly focussed parallel beam of light :P
01:36 PM fragalot: miss0r: do the 2 days include lead-time for any spares? :P
01:36 PM CaptHindsight: but.... he's not using a star to engrave, unless the engraving story is just that a story
01:36 PM miss0r: fragalot: You a forgetting about 'mkwamg' light focus. It can be a bit random, but it always focus in a hurry when theres a bug near by
01:36 PM miss0r: Mean Kid With A Magnifying Glass
01:37 PM miss0r: fragalot: yes, why the hell else would I be standing here for HOURS doing parts I can get for next to nothing, if I had a few days :D
01:37 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: the engraving story is literally just a story.. a possible (poor) scenario to measure overshoot
01:37 PM CaptHindsight: ah hah!
01:37 PM sensille: maybe just rip a laser out of a cd player. they should be quite good at focussing
01:39 PM gloops: use the dambusters method
01:39 PM miss0r: sensille: Sure, but you'd want a bit more power if you want to engrave with it at a high speed
01:40 PM fragalot: miss0r: he's NOT ENGRAVING :D
01:40 PM miss0r: hey.. I was gone a few hours :D
01:40 PM sensille: miss0r: i'm at the ccd-idea at the moment
01:40 PM CaptHindsight: gloops: you want him to fly a Lancaster bomber a drop a rolling skipping bomb onto a laser?
01:40 PM CaptHindsight: can i watch?
01:41 PM gloops: CaptHindsight well the laser part isnt so important, but the lancaster bomber is
01:41 PM miss0r: fragalot: I spoke to GLS today. They now accept the parces is lost. I guess I will have to wait for them to reach out again then :S
01:41 PM miss0r: whats this with a lancaster bomber? :D
01:42 PM fragalot: miss0r: fun stuff.
01:42 PM CaptHindsight: miss0r: gloops idea to test his accuracy
01:42 PM miss0r: fragalot: not realy. It realy sucks to get something at a great price, only to have it lost in transit!
01:42 PM * miss0r is realy pissed
01:42 PM miss0r: I was hoping to the last moment!
01:43 PM miss0r: CaptHindsight: wha o_0 ?
01:43 PM CaptHindsight: lancaster bomber drones for package delivery
01:43 PM fragalot: more reliable than any shipping service i've used the past few months
01:43 PM gloops: to cut the story short, the RAF commander of the dambusters mission had a brainwave while at the theatre
01:43 PM miss0r: even if they miss the target by a few miles
01:44 PM miss0r: gloops: How is that cutting it short?!
01:44 PM gloops: think stage lights - spotlights
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: the airdrops worked in Berlin, why not just drop packages every day over villages at the same time and then let the villagers sort it out?
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: probably fewer lost packages
01:44 PM miss0r: I'd say
01:45 PM gloops: spotlight on each wing aimed at the surface at the same angle - when you hit the right height, the spots become 1
01:45 PM miss0r: I don't know what pisses me off more about them loosing the package; the fact that it is gone or the fact that fragalot will never get to undo the crazy amount of screws I put into that box...
01:45 PM gloops: do that with your lasers
01:45 PM fragalot: gloops: that does not in any way shape or form help with what sensille is trying to do
01:45 PM MarcelineVQ: miss0r: a service lost a package large enough to have screws in it?
01:46 PM miss0r: MarcelineVQ: Yeah. well.. I probally overdid it. but the package was 300x100x100mm
01:46 PM fragalot: MarcelineVQ: 22 screws.
01:46 PM miss0r: fragalot: That was only the lid, mind you :D
01:46 PM fragalot: miss0r: it's probably because yor box looked like garbage
01:46 PM CaptHindsight: thats the size package that every deliver service loses
01:46 PM miss0r: fragalot: I find that offensive, sir! I used a flush trimmer on the wood router this time, to spiff it up a bit :D
01:46 PM CaptHindsight: ~8 x 10 x 5"
01:46 PM MarcelineVQ: What's the point of living in first world countries if you can't even get mail to people. Let's make an assumption here that those are related things.
01:46 PM miss0r: it made a hellova mess
01:47 PM fragalot: miss0r: pics or it didn't happen and you never actually shipped it
01:47 PM fragalot: :P
01:47 PM miss0r: MarcelineVQ: Perhaps because most GLS drivers are not from first world contries... :P
01:47 PM miss0r: fragalot !
01:47 PM fragalot: :D
01:48 PM CaptHindsight: miss0r: found your box https://youtu.be/uxX1kA-nhZk?t=18s
01:48 PM miss0r: I'm not even sure I took pictures this time... checking
01:48 PM miss0r: CaptHindsight: haha yeah
01:48 PM MarcelineVQ: CaptHindsight: it's, beautiful
01:48 PM miss0r: I made if from 15mm 11layer plywood. Used glue'n everything
01:48 PM miss0r: (not on the lid, though, I have a heart)
01:48 PM fragalot: pfft, I used 18mm for yours!
01:48 PM fragalot: granted, that's mainly because I had no 12mm
01:49 PM gregcnc: some paper about jerking http://lbms03.cityu.edu.hk/theses/c_ftt/mphil-meem-b23405430f.pdf
01:49 PM fragalot: gregcnc: might want to rephrase that
01:49 PM miss0r: fragalot: haha yeah
01:49 PM gregcnc: it was just for you
01:49 PM miss0r: fragalot: LOL!
01:50 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: I wonder how long it's been going, and how long it would take for the corners to round over enough until it just rolls down
01:50 PM miss0r: I guess searching google for 'jerking issues' will come up with some less than relevant stuff, to the problem sensille has...
01:50 PM miss0r: or maybe not :P
01:50 PM sensille: i have more than one problem
01:51 PM gregcnc: basically in that case there was no difference in accuracy with jerk control
01:52 PM gregcnc: the machine looked pretty stout
01:52 PM CaptHindsight: jerks tend to be difficult to control
01:53 PM CaptHindsight: laser on delta robot
01:53 PM gloops: my favourite line from barnes wallis was when the prime minister was questioning his bouncing bomb idea - he said we havent got a plane that can carry this bomb, yes we have - the lancaster bomber wallis said, the RAF tell me it cant, how would you know better than them? said PM, because i designed the lancaster bomber said wallis hehe
01:53 PM CaptHindsight: interesting story
01:54 PM CaptHindsight: laser and "mirrors" mounted on delta robot
01:56 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.hindawi.com/journals/sv/2018/2945314/
01:57 PM CaptHindsight: https://etd.ohiolink.edu/!etd.send_file
01:57 PM CaptHindsight: https://etd.ohiolink.edu/!etd.send_file?accession=ohiou1460045979&disposition=inline
01:58 PM CaptHindsight: method of control is an improvement over traditional methods because it prevents the
01:58 PM CaptHindsight: occurrence of infinite jerk spikes, a problem that occurs with traditional robot and 3d printers
01:58 PM gregcnc: it's all been done before?
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: not everything
01:59 PM gloops: theres only 7 stories at the flicks
02:00 PM MarcelineVQ: At the cinerama
02:00 PM CaptHindsight: https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/a8bd/16f13a0fd1a5e494505ef9ac97bdd51311e2.pdf
02:01 PM CaptHindsight: An Application of Screw Theory to the Jerk Analysis of a
02:01 PM CaptHindsight: Two-Degrees-of-Freedom Parallel Wrist
02:01 PM MarcelineVQ: That just makes me want to watch The Jerk again.
02:01 PM gloops: the angle of the dangle is directly proportional to the ...
02:01 PM MarcelineVQ: Amazing entendre aside
02:02 PM CaptHindsight: https://openscholarship.wustl.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1688&context=etd
02:02 PM CaptHindsight: Minimum Jerk Trajectory Planning for Trajectory
02:02 PM CaptHindsight: Constrained Redundant Robots
02:02 PM sensille: oh damnit, he's also doing 5th order trajectory generation
02:02 PM sensille: it's all been done before
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: maybe 6th order
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: you'll show em
02:06 PM sensille: 5th order is a natural choice
02:06 PM MarcelineVQ: there's only 7 orders at the jerk analysys
02:07 PM gloops: if we stay in the box that is
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: so think outside the box...
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: hyperspaces?
02:07 PM gloops: what box?
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: the box is no longer a box
02:08 PM MarcelineVQ: it's still a box, it's just got too much box to hold onto
02:08 PM MarcelineVQ: You stick your hand in there and nothing makes sense anymore
02:09 PM gloops: now we're getting someplace
02:10 PM CaptHindsight: like teenagers
02:11 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.et.byu.edu/~ered/ME537/PowerPoint/Ch5.pptx
02:12 PM CaptHindsight: Constant Jerk Trajectory Generator
02:12 PM CaptHindsight: a novel approach
02:12 PM sensille: well, at least that thesis confirms that my approach is not completely crazy
02:12 PM CaptHindsight: every move is a jerk so the jerks are all moves
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: can't move the mountain so
02:18 PM pcw_mesa: You can use infinite order (sine)
02:19 PM sensille: sadly impossible to calculate
02:19 PM sensille: in finite time
02:21 PM sensille: but he executed the polynomial completely differently. well, interesting link
02:21 PM CaptHindsight: anything else I can Google for you? :)
02:22 PM pcw_mesa: Pretty sure GRBL is using sine interpolation now
02:22 PM sensille: probably in 5th order approximation
02:23 PM pcw_mesa: or one or those u-controller motion widgits
02:23 PM pcw_mesa: they make a big deal about infinite order
02:24 PM CaptHindsight: it's always something
02:24 PM sensille: can't do infinite order
02:24 PM sensille: limited jerk is enough
02:24 PM pcw_mesa: Sine interpolation has been done for many years in motion control
02:24 PM CaptHindsight: throw some non-linear in there
02:25 PM sensille: pcw_mesa: you can't calculate sin exactly
02:25 PM CaptHindsight: or irrational numbers
02:25 PM sensille: normally you approximate it with polynomials to the desired accuracy
02:26 PM pcw_mesa: not if you have a real CPU with FP trig
02:26 PM sensille: how so?
02:27 PM pcw_mesa: google sine motion interpolation
02:28 PM sensille: i think CaptHindsight has to do this for me
02:29 PM CaptHindsight: ok ok one sec
02:29 PM CaptHindsight: busy reading https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-06749-8
02:31 PM sensille: meanwhile i calculate some taylor polynoms to infinity
02:35 PM * gloops continues to calibrate the diy tachyon generator
02:35 PM djdelorie: once you get it working, it will be done yesterday?
02:36 PM gloops: very quick there djdelorie
02:36 PM djdelorie: yeah, well I had since tomorrow to come up with it
02:43 PM jesseg: hey are these power supplies any good? lol https://www.acopian.com/store/productdetail.aspx?q=i3945
02:44 PM jesseg: they seem pretty proud of themselves
02:44 PM JT-Shop: that must be for some high end thing
02:44 PM gloops: they want to be for $300
02:44 PM JT-Shop: are you looking for stepper drive power supply?
02:44 PM djdelorie: I clicked through to the product overview and it says "3-day power supply". I'd believe that.
02:45 PM JT-Shop: oh is that a battery power supply?
02:45 PM jesseg: no it's just an aerospace quality power supply that can be configured and delivered in 3 days
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: Acopian has been around for decades
02:46 PM jesseg: I'd never heard of them, but a customer wanted a good quality power supply and said he didn't care what it cost so I googled made in USA power supply
02:46 PM CaptHindsight: good stuff
02:46 PM jesseg: JT-Shop, nah it's not for a stepper drive.. it's umm. ok laugh now then I'll tell you what it's for :P
02:47 PM jesseg: This guy bought this really expensive 2.5 story house, which has an automated lighting system. All the lights are controlled from dimmer boxes in the basement, and instead of light switches, there are RS485 connected touch panels.
02:48 PM jesseg: so the 38v 1.5a power supply that runs the logic board died during a thunder storm, so none of the lights in the house work.
02:49 PM jesseg: so rather than putting in another cheap chinese power brick, we're going for something hopefully that will last better... and put a surge arrestor in line..
02:51 PM CaptHindsight: 120VAC 60Hz input?
02:51 PM CaptHindsight: closed? and special form factor?
02:51 PM CaptHindsight: and / any
02:52 PM gregcnc: yeah for progress
02:52 PM XXCoder: must be seperate from this plane of reality
02:55 PM CaptHindsight: jesseg: what did they quote you?
02:58 PM jesseg: CaptHindsight, I don't understand your questions.
02:58 PM CaptHindsight: jesseg: did you get a price from Acopian?
02:59 PM jesseg: The power supply is supposed to be PFC 90-265VAC 49-420hz or 110-350DC,
02:59 PM jesseg: Oh, I did not ask for a discount. They list $300 on their website.
03:00 PM djdelorie: you could just buy three cheap ones and put two on the shelf for later...
03:00 PM jesseg: LOL
03:01 PM jesseg: customer doesnt care about price but hates hassle
03:01 PM djdelorie: buy three cheap ones and diode-OR them together? ;-)
03:01 PM jesseg: lol
03:01 PM CaptHindsight: should be fine, they don't make junk
03:01 PM jesseg: good thanks
03:08 PM JT-Shop: jesseg: take a look at Antek power supplies (not Antec) for stepper drives
03:11 PM CaptHindsight: Acopian reminds me of another brand that looks like they are gone, they made modular enclosed/sealed bricks into the KW's
03:12 PM CaptHindsight: were all black anodized
03:12 PM CaptHindsight: low profile
03:18 PM jesseg: JT-Shop, thanks!
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: jesseg: just as good http://www.vicorpower.com/ as Acopian
03:18 PM jesseg: cool
03:18 PM jesseg: but I have a secret to tell you
03:19 PM jesseg: I hate steppers :P I'm a closed loop / servo nut
03:19 PM CaptHindsight: me too!
03:19 PM jesseg: ok great but these would make fine servo power supplies too :D
03:20 PM CaptHindsight: my servo drives input AC
03:20 PM jesseg: cool
03:21 PM JT-Shop: you can get Antek power supplies with both 5vdc and 24vdc regulated outputs for logic and field power
03:22 PM CaptHindsight: Vicor prices are even higher than Acopian
03:27 PM Rab: Mean Well, The Brand You're Willing To Pay For!
03:28 PM XXCoder: there should be company called "customer doesnt care about price"
03:28 PM CaptHindsight: Mean Well vs Built Well
03:29 PM CaptHindsight: Good Intentions -------
03:29 PM Rab: XXCoder, TDK-Lambda
03:29 PM CaptHindsight: you often get what you pay for
03:30 PM Rab: I have found Mean Well to be generally reliable, against all my expectations.
03:31 PM Rab: But I don't know that I would put thousands of dollars of equipment behind one.
03:31 PM CaptHindsight: when derated
03:31 PM Rab: Sure, usually 50%. I apply that to all switching supplies though.
03:38 PM jesseg: I was running a Power-One 300A 5V power supply at full current at around 3 volts.. and it was pushing 295 amps according to my cheap amp clamp
03:39 PM jesseg: its actually a dual 150A output with paralleling bars
03:41 PM * Loetmichel once ran 3 5V50A PSUs on the same bus for a 640*32 "pixel" text display with 3mm green leds as pixels
03:41 PM jesseg: that sounds like fun Loetmichel
03:41 PM Loetmichel: and yes, i had to derate the pixel current in software wen more than 50% of the pixels were lit or they would have switched off
03:42 PM Loetmichel: soldering that beast was "fun"
03:42 PM jesseg: that's like over 20k leds?
03:42 PM CaptHindsight: I once had to design a power supply for a cluster that had 480V 1,000A 3phase input
03:42 PM jesseg: so how many LEDs a second did you have to solder to get done in a lifetime :P
03:42 PM Loetmichel: 20k+ 3mm leds, 641 Atmega8, double that in shift registers, and a bunch resistors ;)
03:43 PM Loetmichel: it took a bit more than a month
03:43 PM Loetmichel: 8 hours a day
03:43 PM jesseg: wow... just wow...
03:43 PM Loetmichel: all THT i may add
03:43 PM Loetmichel: not SMT
03:43 PM jesseg: so was that for "fun" or did you receive some other solid form of gratitude?
03:43 PM Loetmichel: work
03:44 PM jesseg: gotcha
03:44 PM jesseg: that was one expensive reader board
03:44 PM jesseg: is it still in service today?
03:44 PM Loetmichel: customer wanted to have a text display thats visible and READABLE from the other wall of a 200ft long beer tent
03:44 PM Loetmichel: nope, it was for a single 2 day event
03:45 PM jesseg: haha.. wow... uhm maybe I should stop asking questions now
03:45 PM Loetmichel: for the "drivers tent" where all the "mister and misses rich" drivers were "parked" until the riches wanted to drive home
03:45 PM jesseg: Didn't they have another 2-day event a year later and use it again?
03:46 PM Loetmichel: nope, we actually kept it. i was working for a stage rental company at that time
03:46 PM Loetmichel: customer wanted it, costomer got it, paid for it full and we had the display to use it in some more events later
03:46 PM jesseg: well it sounds like quite a project all in all
03:47 PM jesseg: how fast could you update it?
03:47 PM jesseg: could you show video on it?
03:47 PM Loetmichel: it could actually take that whole 200ft by 80 ft tent and paint it bright green at night ;)
03:48 PM Loetmichel: nope, no video
03:48 PM Loetmichel: just scrolling text
03:48 PM Loetmichel: i used 19k2 serial daisi chain link between the AVRs
03:49 PM Loetmichel: so about a second for a full update
03:50 PM Loetmichel: (recalculating: it was more like a 160 ft by 70ft tent, 20 by 50 meters "oktoberfest beer tent")
04:03 PM jesseg: Loetmichel, pretty cool alright! and yes, 150W of LED light is going to be pretty bright
04:05 PM Loetmichel: jesseg: it was high brightness 3mm green leds
04:05 PM Loetmichel: the kind you have orange dots in your retina for a while if you look at them at 20mA
04:05 PM Loetmichel: just 20k of them ;)
04:06 PM Loetmichel: its a LOT brighter than 150W blue with yellow converter paint (a.k.a white) leds with just 100 led chips on a single module
04:07 PM jesseg: yeah
04:07 PM Loetmichel: its like mercury lamps compared to natrium lamps of same wattage
04:08 PM Loetmichel: and it was this sick green thats almost cyan
04:08 PM Loetmichel: (fitting the colour of the events sponsor logo) ;)
04:09 PM jesseg: LOL
04:09 PM jesseg: I like a more natural green myself
04:09 PM Loetmichel: The event was the marriage of a big german beer company heiress... an audiance like the oscars
04:09 PM Loetmichel: :-)
04:10 PM jesseg: oh that's why it was a one time event
04:10 PM Loetmichel: indeed
04:10 PM jesseg: I thought maybe it was an annual beer fest
04:11 PM jesseg: but yeah most people don't want to get married every year
04:11 PM Loetmichel: its fun though when you try to get a signal thru 300m of still working bottling plant on a xlr mic wire.
04:12 PM Jin^eLD is now known as Jin|away
04:12 PM jesseg: lol
04:12 PM Loetmichel: had to pump in 50VSS at one end from a 2kW amplifier and set a DI box on the other end to get the noise down to acceptable levels ;)
04:13 PM Deejay: gn8
04:13 PM Loetmichel: you know: if you cant get rid of the noise: up the SNR until it doesent matter :-)
04:13 PM jesseg: yeah if you can't bring the noise down, bring the signal up :P
04:18 PM Loetmichel: it was a fun jon for 10 years you get old quick in stage rental though
04:18 PM Loetmichel: job
04:19 PM Loetmichel: not 2 days the same cathastropes. and you got to see the world... ever built a stage in the middle of the maroccan desert?
04:19 PM Loetmichel: :-)
04:25 PM jesseg: what film was that for? lol or are you under strict NDAs
04:25 PM jesseg: or was it a life performance of the Thief of Baghdad ?
05:14 PM infornography: what are we building today?
05:16 PM gloops: looks like Ichsguckslives youtube channel has gone
05:16 PM gloops: nothing atm infonography
05:19 PM gloops: next build is a primitive kind of 4 axis for wood
05:20 PM _unreal_: This is going to drive me crazy.....
05:20 PM gloops: thing is, its no challenge now, i know its going to work
05:20 PM _unreal_: I had a few PCI expansion slot parallel port adapters....... I have no clue where any of them are.
05:21 PM gloops: yes madness usually sets in around this stage unreal
05:21 PM _unreal_: I just need one for the PARALLEL port shape so I can mill it out in the lid of my cnc control box.
05:21 PM _unreal_: Cant find a single one
05:21 PM infornography: I can identify with this
05:22 PM infornography: Put it where I can find it and now can't find it
05:22 PM _unreal_: Soon as I find one. I'll just trace it out and take it to my drill press with the stupid harbor freight XY table and mill it out
05:23 PM infornography: I got two of these from old hardware store https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EF87J3O
05:23 PM _unreal_: Also discovered my drill press Dept setting collar is made out of plastic and cracked AND its only designed to stop the press in one direction
05:23 PM infornography: but only two bins
05:25 PM infornography: you gonna make another stop then?
05:25 PM _unreal_: when I finish my new cnc machine YES
05:25 PM _unreal_: I'll mill a new one
05:25 PM _unreal_: aluminum
05:29 PM CaptHindsight: where is a cheap supplier in the USA for machinable wax?
05:30 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.machinablewax.com/product.php?product=8
05:31 PM andypugh: _unreal_: https://pdl.designspark.com/api/v1/manufacturers/53f31be59b4759f8698f1fc2/part/53f329ed9b4759f869b07fa3/558a70028759c5f5638b4876/1.pdf
05:32 PM andypugh: CaptHindsight: https://www.instructables.com/id/Machinable-Wax/
05:33 PM CaptHindsight: andypugh: it's not easy to find paraffin these days
05:33 PM _unreal_: andypugh, thanks but I'm not going to redraw it...
05:33 PM _unreal_: I'll come across it sooner or later
05:33 PM CaptHindsight: it's has some sort of magic qualities for hippies
05:34 PM _unreal_: CaptHindsight, paraffin? what are you talking about. its whats used in out door lamps
05:34 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.amazon.com/General-Purpose-Candles-Canning-pound/dp/B0012T4BT4
05:34 PM CaptHindsight: _unreal_: no those use LED's :)
05:34 PM _unreal_: What?
05:35 PM _unreal_: https://www.walmart.com/ip/WaxWel-Unscented-Paraffin-Wax-Refill-Blocks-1-lb-6-count/33943342
05:35 PM CaptHindsight: are you from the 50's?
05:36 PM gloops: get casting wax
05:36 PM CaptHindsight: yeah maybe a try a walmart in Hootersville
05:37 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.machinablewax.com/product.php?product=54
05:38 PM hazzy-m: around here you can get paraffin just about anywhere, but its mostly sold for canning
05:38 PM CaptHindsight: I was in a Walmart in a city. They laughed at me when I asked where the fabric aisle was
05:39 PM gloops: or..go round the flea markets and buy all the big candles
05:39 PM CaptHindsight: by tomorrow?
05:40 PM gloops: they always have those big 4 inch diameter candles that nobody really wants
05:40 PM CaptHindsight: damn maybe England is a much better place
05:40 PM CaptHindsight: Fish and Chips, Scotland, Ireland.... hey your on to something
05:40 PM CaptHindsight: you're
05:43 PM CaptHindsight: andypugh: you missed the discussion earlier about measuring and reducing jerk
05:47 PM _unreal_: Strange turn of events
05:48 PM _unreal_: So I ordered the right sized fan grill PC fan.... only to discover it was to large??? I ordered the worng size FAN which was the right size. only to discover it was the right size for the hole..... now I need to order a NEW grill that is 70mm not 90mm :)
05:48 PM _unreal_: how the hell I did that I'm not sure
06:06 PM CaptHindsight: Quantum physics is in an undefined state between valid and invalid and we must wait for a cat to resolve the state?
06:06 PM CaptHindsight: Of course it's right. Clearly we can't rely on a physicist is resolve it, and cats are well known for having a definite opinion on everything.
06:07 PM _unreal_: arg....
08:17 PM MrHindsight is now known as CaptHindsight
08:50 PM nallar is now known as Ross
11:59 PM CaptHindsight: By default, the charge pump feature is turned on, with the “Pulse Switch” (next to the DB25 connector) set to the “Off” position (means “Charge Pump” on).
11:59 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.leadshineusa.com/UploadFile/Down/MX3660hm_V1.2.pdf Page 11