#linuxcnc Logs
Aug 25 2018
#linuxcnc Calendar
01:01 AM fragalot: hi
01:04 AM XXCoder: yo
01:04 AM gloops: .
01:04 AM gloops: oh..im here
01:04 AM XXCoder: yo^2
01:04 AM gloops: howdy
01:40 AM * gloops ponders whether its too early for a fusion 360 tutorial
01:42 AM Wolf__: never
01:42 AM fragalot: why would it be too early
01:42 AM gloops: brain not fully awake yet
01:43 AM gloops: well it is, its not the work thats the problem, its making the effort to open f360 and click the play button on a video
01:43 AM fragalot: how are you even alive if clicking a button is too much work
01:44 AM gloops: its psychological
01:44 AM fragalot: how is complaining about it less work :P
01:44 AM XXCoder: some people spend a lot more energy avoiding work than work
01:47 AM gloops: tbh i dont know what the fuss is all about with f360, ive seen loads of people complain about how difficult it is to learn - its easy
01:47 AM gloops: it cant get much easier
01:48 AM XXCoder: you run a cad as professional?
01:48 AM XXCoder: or otherwise use cad a lot
01:48 AM Wolf__: going from something not f360 to f360 is a pain in the ass IMO
01:49 AM fragalot: the main issues with f360 is the lack of simple contraints in assemblies (like "just keep it parallel", or "these 2 faces should just be a fixed distance away but otherwise I don't care"
01:49 AM fragalot: and the shitty history browser they have at the bottom rather than a normal feature browser
01:49 AM fragalot: if they allowed those 2 things I might use it more at home
01:49 AM fragalot: and global parameters
01:50 AM fragalot: and a better drawing interface
01:50 AM fragalot: .. ok there are a lot of thigns :D
01:51 AM gloops: i dont use cad professionally no
02:10 AM gloops: well, having said it is easy, i wont be pushing the limits of f360, just simple drawing, but so far its simple, prompts for dimensions, warning messages, i tend to work with the mouse on menu buttons not from hotkeys - again with this it is easy to use that way
02:36 AM veek: https://i.imgur.com/8vwSHDY.gifv (tungsten ball on lead)
02:40 AM gloops: china syndrome
02:44 AM XXCoder: looks like long abused tool
02:47 AM gloops: hows the building going veek?
02:59 AM veek: hey gloops okay still on metallurgy - doing way too much reddit
02:59 AM gloops: you know, the time comes veek, when you need to just pick up the tools and start doing it
03:00 AM gloops: book learning is ok, but it doesnt work the brain the same as doing it does
03:01 AM * veek shuffles about
03:03 AM _unreal_: not awake? hehe its 4am here, I just woke up for some wierd ass reason? well I was very thirsty. May have drank a little to much
03:05 AM XXCoder: lol I woke up needing water before but not because im drinking beer or something
03:05 AM XXCoder: usually hot weather
03:09 AM gloops: alcohol can be good for falling asleep, but not good for staying asleep
05:00 AM jthornton: morning
05:03 AM XXCoder: hey
05:07 AM jthornton: only got up to 73f yesterday
05:07 AM jthornton: 91f today and we have a poker run to go to
05:09 AM XXCoder: it finally cracks 70f in peak at monday
05:46 AM jthornton: git my github cleaned up now for some coding
05:48 AM XXCoder: lol
05:48 AM XXCoder: also, awesome :)
06:25 AM Tom_L: 76°F Hi 92
06:40 AM jthornton: same here
08:26 AM Martiini: Arch linux is ok to install linuxcnc?
08:29 AM Martiini: emc2 is previous name?, or it emc2 some other software?
08:36 AM _unreal_: emc was the prior name yes
08:39 AM Martiini: IT will compile 30 minutes, i.e forever!, probably
08:39 AM _unreal_: as far as I can tell you can install it on arch...... Though I would reccomend installing it with its native BUILD
08:39 AM Martiini: majority of cnc machines use windows anyway,.. I dunno why
08:39 AM _unreal_: A time B less likely to run into issues.
08:39 AM _unreal_: mach3
08:39 AM _unreal_: and other grbl serial stream controllers
08:39 AM Martiini: Arch didnt compile
08:39 AM _unreal_: As I said I'd use its native build.....
08:39 AM _unreal_: Martiini, are you new to linuxcnc?
08:40 AM _unreal_: hello?
08:40 AM Martiini: I'm new to everything :/
08:40 AM _unreal_: first some background info? What kind of a mchine do you have or are you building
08:40 AM _unreal_: buying
08:41 AM _unreal_: do you have CAD experience?
08:41 AM Martiini: just testing, learning ... Interested in metal works, machining .. etc
08:41 AM _unreal_: I'm trying to get an idea of your pro's con's in getting into this venture
08:41 AM _unreal_: metal work..... as in aluminum or STEEL?
08:41 AM Martiini: Im not some business owner
08:41 AM _unreal_: I did ask that
08:42 AM Martiini: well, yes.. metals, alloys, machines ...
08:42 AM _unreal_: Do you have a machine yet?
08:42 AM Martiini: no
08:42 AM _unreal_: !! OK.....
08:42 AM Martiini: I've done welding work..
08:43 AM _unreal_: how much $$ are you willing to put into this?
08:43 AM Martiini: excellent questions... but don't waste time on me .. I can't help
08:44 AM _unreal_: METAL milling is way more expensive, In regards to the machine needs
08:44 AM _unreal_: ?
08:44 AM Martiini: big metal and machining businesses are in Germany, USA, Russia, China ..
08:44 AM _unreal_: slow down..... AGAIN I didn't say anything about business
08:44 AM _unreal_: Only you have
08:45 AM Martiini: ok, I'm not going anywhere ...
08:45 AM _unreal_: I assume your looking at a home machine
08:45 AM Martiini: I go smoke a cigarette and think a little ...
08:45 AM _unreal_: one questin before you go
08:45 AM _unreal_: to think about
08:46 AM _unreal_: What kind of material are you planning to work on and what "sizes" 12"x12" or are you looking at using a machine to cut materials that are feet or meters in size
08:47 AM _unreal_: just trying to play with some cnc software does you very little good.....
08:50 AM _unreal_: Martiini, if your going to get into this then the computer you use for the CNC control should be dedicated to the cnc machine only. If your going to use linuxcnc then that comuter would be best to run with debian or ubuntu... Keep the extra software at a minimum. meaning you only want to have CAD software and gcode software on it only.... or just the motion control software "linuxcnc" and use an other computer for building c
08:50 AM _unreal_: ad files.
08:51 AM _unreal_: the reason a lot of people use windows for there cnc machines has to do with a lot of the CAD software being windows based. There for it can be a bit of a choire to have one machine be in windows to do the cad work. then reboot linux to work the machine but if there is an issue with the file. have to reboot to widnwos to edit the file ETC.......
08:52 AM Martiini: _unreal_, ok. Thank You very much
08:52 AM Martiini: yes, dxf cad files is what they use
08:52 AM Tom_L: so purely 2d machining
08:53 AM Martiini: well, most metal worx use laser cutter, bending press, cnc mills, welding robots
08:54 AM _unreal_: your talking industrial. Are you looking at this for a company?
08:54 AM Martiini: University courses are in automation, cnc, robotics, metal machining..
08:54 AM Martiini: yes, for a career in metal machining
08:57 AM _unreal_: simple question... Martiini What is your goal here? What are you looking to learn? at this point I have no clue what your seeking.
08:58 AM Martiini: ? software ??
08:58 AM _unreal_: big companies dont use linuxcnc.... they use machines that are produced by closed sourced machines with dedicated functions.....
08:59 AM Martiini: I know ...
08:59 AM Martiini: .. so what
08:59 AM Martiini: is there any way to find proprietary windows software ??
09:00 AM Tom_L: that's not necessarily true. there are large companies using converted machines as well
09:00 AM Tom_L: Martiini google it
09:00 AM Tom_L: we don't deal in windows software much here
09:01 AM _unreal_: or illegal copies of software if thats what your seeking?
09:07 AM Martiini: it's all "proprietary", secret patented technology/machines/products ..
09:11 AM Martiini: they use programmed welding cells with 10 welding robots, so jobs get done fast ...
09:12 AM Martiini: .. automated production lines .. etc
09:35 AM _unreal_: cant wait till my new computer arrives in the mail Tom_L . I ordered the asus tinker board. and the rasbery pi touch screen with enclosure its compatable with the tinker. I also ordered my motors and motor controllers
09:35 AM _unreal_: I ordered the flex nozzle for coolant.
10:54 AM veek: are gears in power tools tempered? where exactly is tempering used in daily life.. carpenter tools?
10:55 AM gregcnc: almost everything is hardened, then tempered to the desired rating
10:56 AM veek: oh hmm
11:01 AM fragalot: most power tool gears these days are sintered metal
11:01 AM cpresser: veek: gears in power tools are nowadays mostly made by sintering powder metal.
11:01 AM fragalot: which goes through a baking, hardening, and tempering process
11:02 AM cpresser: well, looks like i need to type faster :)
11:03 AM veek: ah hmm thanks not read about that yet
11:03 AM gregcnc: very few items are produced full hard in practice
11:04 AM pfred1: go hard!
11:04 AM _unreal_: If you have your choice between optical limit switches and machanical limit switches which would you choose?
11:04 AM fragalot: _unreal_: for limit, mechanical
11:04 AM pfred1: yeah?
11:04 AM fragalot: limit switches MUST break the signal, regardless of what happens
11:05 AM _unreal_: I ask because I have an optical switch control board that has 6 optical switch inputs. and 939 comparitors etc... to adjust the otical triger
11:05 AM fragalot: only mechanical can provide that with 100% certainty.. even if you crash the switch to bits, it will have tripped the signal
11:05 AM fragalot: for homing, optical
11:05 AM pfred1: I don't even have limit switches
11:06 AM fragalot: pfred1: That is your choice to make. I like having them.
11:06 AM _unreal_: fragalot, I need to go dig it out and take a photo. it has high quality blade style IR sensors
11:06 AM pfred1: what for?
11:06 AM fragalot: pfred1: machine loses position for some reason, goes outside soft limit boundary
11:06 AM cpresser: it also depends on the size of the machine. if the machine is small and has steppers, crashes are not that bad
11:06 AM fragalot: that's how my first cnc build went to the scrapyard ~12 years ago
11:07 AM _unreal_: I know there is the "DUST" and other issues. I dont see those being an issue if I locate them in safe locations
11:08 AM cpresser: i would also choose switches based on the dirt/chips i expect the machine to make. they might need cleaning
11:08 AM fragalot: _unreal_: the only gripe I have with optical limit switches is that they are not 100% reliable
11:08 AM cpresser: there is also reed-switches for limits
11:09 AM pfred1: oh that was good
11:09 AM _unreal_: I've never been a fan of reed switches.
11:09 AM pfred1: why not?
11:09 AM _unreal_: because they can get a faulse trigger from metal chips
11:09 AM pfred1: no they can't
11:09 AM fragalot: (so can your opticals)
11:10 AM pfred1: what are you machining magnets?
11:10 AM fragalot: lol
11:10 AM _unreal_: then its a stale mate :)
11:10 AM _unreal_: yes rare earth magnets
11:10 AM _unreal_: cleanup is a bitch
11:10 AM _unreal_: ;)
11:11 AM _unreal_: ugh..... T storm coming
11:11 AM _unreal_: got to love south florida
11:11 AM pfred1: how far south?
11:11 AM _unreal_: boca
11:11 AM pfred1: I drove to Key West once man a third of Florida really isn't land
11:11 AM _unreal_: ?
11:12 AM pfred1: it's more like stuff growing in the ocean
11:12 AM _unreal_: oh you mean everglades?
11:12 AM _unreal_: or driving in the keys area?
11:12 AM pfred1: nah before the keys
11:12 AM _unreal_: everglades then
11:12 AM pfred1: I drove though that city that got wiped off the map by a hurricane
11:12 AM pfred1: gainsville?
11:13 AM _unreal_: heh. I just tossed a curly tail lizard in the canal about an hour ago. caught the little bastard thats been shitting everywhere in the pool area.
11:13 AM pfred1: happened in the early 80s as I can recall
11:14 AM pfred1: there's still nothing there but empty concrete pads
11:14 AM pfred1: spooky
11:15 AM pfred1: Homestead
11:15 AM pfred1: yeah I remember that
11:17 AM pfred1: it looked like a nuclear bomb hit that place
11:17 AM pfred1: so that's where the pythons came from who knew?
11:18 AM pfred1: while invasive Burmese pythons began inhabiting the region after a nearby facility housing them was destroyed.
11:18 AM pfred1: I was always told it was people thssing their pet snakes out
11:18 AM pfred1: tossing even
11:18 AM _unreal_: some of both
11:19 AM _unreal_: tossing more likely escaping
11:19 AM pfred1: the pythons in Florida are unreal now
11:19 AM pfred1: I think they like it better in Florida than where they came from
11:20 AM pfred1: my aunt lives in Walton Beach Florida and I've spent a lot of time at her house
11:20 AM fragalot: The only thing I can think of when I hear florida is "Florida man" headliners
11:21 AM pfred1: my favorite beach there got ripped apart by a hurricane though
11:21 AM pfred1: it was called The bathtub because it was surrounded by 6 concentric rings of coral
11:21 AM pfred1: but the storm ripped all the coral up
11:21 AM _unreal_: so I'm waiting on this https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06VSBVQWS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
11:21 AM _unreal_: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07G243CRR/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
11:22 AM _unreal_: that
11:22 AM _unreal_: I ordered this one https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07236CFKC/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
11:22 AM pfred1: touch screen
11:22 AM pfred1: I get monitors at yard sales no touch screens though
11:23 AM pfred1: less and less PC stuff out there these days
11:23 AM pfred1: I got a nice nut driver set today though
11:23 AM pfred1: Ptoto 11 piece set i na blow molded case never used $5
11:23 AM pfred1: new it is like $90
11:24 AM _unreal_: pfred1, if you go to florida again, you should check out "the swap shop"
11:24 AM pfred1: I like Key West
11:24 AM pfred1: the rest of Florida I'm kind of tired of I've been there a lot
11:25 AM pfred1: cept for the redneck riverea I never been there
11:25 AM pfred1: that's the only part of Florida I've never been to
11:26 AM pfred1: I stayed 2 summers at my aunt's house when I was young so I practically lived in Florida
11:27 AM pfred1: she lives right on the Indian River
11:27 AM pfred1: so I had a crab trap in the river and I'd have crabs every day for lunch
11:27 AM jdh: mpja is in sofla. they have a warehouse/showroom
11:27 AM pfred1: she owned out to the intercoastal
11:28 AM pfred1: at one time she had the longest dock on the river
11:28 AM pfred1: it went almost out to the channel
11:29 AM pfred1: she worked at woplas so she got a deal on the PVC pilings
11:29 AM pfred1: I was a yard hand there one summer myself
11:31 AM _unreal_: nifty
11:31 AM _unreal_: I took my daughter sailing in the keys during fathers day
11:32 AM _unreal_: Homemade sailboat :)
11:32 AM pfred1: the blue of the water there is wild
11:32 AM pfred1: horrible beaches though
11:32 AM _unreal_: me being a marine engineer and all.
11:32 AM _unreal_: horrible?
11:32 AM pfred1: yeah
11:32 AM _unreal_: in what way
11:32 AM pfred1: I don't like the whole gulf side for the ocean really
11:33 AM pfred1: I remember one time I walked out of sight of land and the water was still only up to my knees
11:33 AM pfred1: I was like I can't swim
11:35 AM pfred1: that must have been Tampa?
11:36 AM pfred1: how's the red tide going?
11:44 AM _unreal_: dont know
11:44 AM _unreal_: I never get out......
11:44 AM _unreal_: been stuck helping my father with his house and huricain damage BS......
11:44 AM _unreal_: only time I get out is taking my daughter to disney etc......
11:44 AM _unreal_: or working
11:44 AM pfred1: Disney World is kinda run down anymore
11:44 AM _unreal_: ?
11:44 AM pfred1: I was there when it was new it was nice then
11:44 AM _unreal_: ok....
11:44 AM _unreal_: seems nice to me. they have been updating a lot of stuff and working on new rides, new parks etc....
11:44 AM _unreal_: they just broke ground for the new TRON ride.
11:44 AM pfred1: the last time I went I got depressed
11:44 AM _unreal_: shrug
11:44 AM _unreal_: I'm an annual pass holder
11:45 AM pfred1: I don't know what year I went there first but the place wasn't too old
11:45 AM pfred1: like the concrete was all clean
11:46 AM pfred1: I do have to say that castle they got there is one of the biggest disappointments
11:46 AM pfred1: I remember seeing it as a kid and then going in
11:46 AM pfred1: there's nothing in there but a gift shop
11:47 AM pfred1: I hear there is a private apartment inside it but the public can't see that
11:53 AM _unreal_: pfred1, ahhh?
11:54 AM pfred1: _unreal_ ?
11:54 AM _unreal_: the castle at disney world has an entire restaurant inside, there are a few rooms to rent but I believe its 3 or 6 and they are BOOKED way in advance and cost a small fortune. and or are reserved for special people
11:55 AM _unreal_: https://disneyworld.disney.go.com/dining/magic-kingdom/cinderella-royal-table/
11:55 AM _unreal_: thats always been there
11:56 AM _unreal_: https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-1TQNINXuUIw/WtaZp8LI1kI/AAAAAAAADcI/7XULoClLioI5FaB3glI6pBdoYk2Ld7r4wCLcBGAs/s1600/Castle%2BBack_.jpg
11:56 AM _unreal_: see the windows
11:58 AM _unreal_: here is also a princess thing for young girls in the base
11:58 AM _unreal_: where girls get all dressed up
11:58 AM pfred1: the apartment was always there but it wasn't always open to the public
12:02 PM _unreal_: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYoYNvzNIVA
12:03 PM pfred1: I got bigger fish to fry right now
12:03 PM pfred1: those damned dirty chinks didn't ship me my transistors!
12:03 PM pfred1: mother phucker I confirmed receipt already too
12:04 PM fragalot: whoops
12:04 PM Roguish: now you're profiling. they're not all dirty.
12:04 PM fragalot: Roguish: debatable. :P
12:04 PM pfred1: the ones shipping electronics are
12:04 PM pfred1: it was the one thing in that order that i actually wanted the rest was just padding
12:05 PM pfred1: but I ordered it so long ago I'd forgot
12:05 PM _unreal_: hehe I just want my hardware
12:05 PM _unreal_: sweet my motors should arrive the 30th https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07236CFKC/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
12:06 PM pfred1: jeff bezos isn't rich enough?
12:12 PM _unreal_: ?
12:20 PM robotustra: by buying on amazon you enreach bezos
12:20 PM robotustra: bezos is building blue origin, so I BUY on amazon too
12:21 PM pfred1: bezos is a flaming liberal
12:22 PM robotustra: and what?
12:22 PM pfred1: and he's actively trying to destroy the USA
12:22 PM robotustra: if the guy is trying to build something cool - my policy is to help
12:23 PM pfred1: I think the USA is cool enough
12:23 PM robotustra: any globalists
12:23 PM robotustra: borders are not cool anymore
12:23 PM robotustra: wake up
12:23 PM pfred1: they sure are
12:23 PM pfred1: I am woke
12:23 PM robotustra: wake up once more again
12:23 PM robotustra: separatism is bad
12:23 PM pfred1: Molly Tibbetts won't ever wake up again
12:24 PM robotustra: I don't care who is she and why
12:24 PM pfred1: I worked with those cockroaches in construction
12:25 PM pfred1: once we caught a gang of them pinning one against a wall and ass raping him
12:25 PM roycroft: bezos is a libertarian - he's the farthest thing from a liberal
12:25 PM robotustra: we also hava a kid prime minister, and what of it?
12:25 PM pfred1: I don't need scum like that in my country
12:26 PM pfred1: they're fucking animals
12:26 PM robotustra: yes, I also like order, but any gov is shit
12:27 PM robotustra: no matter if it's liberals or conserv.
12:27 PM robotustra: they do all the same shit
12:27 PM robotustra: seperetism solve nothing
12:27 PM pfred1: it keeps them from commiting crime here
12:28 PM robotustra: crime is coming from the very origin of US
12:28 PM pfred1: Indians had poor immigration policy too
12:29 PM pfred1: they got wiped out
12:29 PM robotustra: a gang of peole came to america and killed indians
12:29 PM robotustra: after they started to killed each other for a centures
12:29 PM robotustra: to have a gun in US is a RIGHT
12:30 PM robotustra: not privilege
12:30 PM pfred1: that's not what Bezos' Washington Post would have its readers believe
12:30 PM fragalot: I love how the USA's debate version of godwins law seems to be guns
12:30 PM robotustra: so the crime in the roots of US, nothing to complain about
12:31 PM robotustra: paper now is a good stuff to wipe asses
12:31 PM robotustra: not to read
12:32 PM robotustra: by closing borders no problem will be solved IMHO
12:32 PM robotustra: problem is in the roots
12:33 PM pfred1: fortunately your opinion counts for nothing
12:33 PM CaptHindsight: a good portion of the US is just too dumb to discuss any of this in any rational way, they just want to be told what to think and do
12:33 PM * roycroft suggests that the channel get back to discussing cnc-related topics and leave the divisive politics alone
12:34 PM fragalot: guys, angle plates.
12:34 PM CaptHindsight: people need to vent
12:35 PM fragalot: buy cheap & machine them yourself
12:35 PM roycroft: there are channels devoted to that :)
12:35 PM robotustra: CaptHindsight, true, I'm not in US :)
12:35 PM fragalot: or buy expensive ?
12:35 PM CaptHindsight: anywhere, any time
12:36 PM * robotustra +1 roycroft
12:36 PM robotustra: I hate politics
12:36 PM robotustra: and love robots
12:36 PM fragalot: politics is fine. political games aren't
12:37 PM robotustra: politics IS a game
12:37 PM CaptHindsight: liberal vs conservative end mills?
12:37 PM fragalot: politics is a balance, not a game
12:37 PM fragalot: problem is that the balance is long lost
12:37 PM fragalot: if there ever was one
12:38 PM CaptHindsight: not a balance is non-democratic countries
12:38 PM robotustra: what is better ferromagnetic state in politics, of antiferromagnetic?
12:38 PM fragalot: robotustra: clear aluminium glass.
12:38 PM CaptHindsight: I see it more in a countries shoes
12:39 PM robotustra: ok, I have to teach my robot to track the motion somehow...
12:39 PM roycroft: the overton window has shifted so far to the right in the us that it's impossible to even try to discuss politics any more even within the country, and outwith the us folks have absolutely no context with which to understand us politics
12:39 PM fragalot: robotustra: use an AI.
12:40 PM robotustra: fragalot, I'm writing it right now
12:40 PM fragalot: stop writing start teaching
12:40 PM fragalot: let the AI figure it out
12:40 PM fragalot: :D
12:41 PM fragalot: (we have an IT admin at work that is convinced AI is the solution to our "unreliable data" problem)
12:41 PM fragalot: because apparently they reach far greater accuracies these days than other algorithms
12:41 PM fragalot: convincing him that AI's require training seems to fall on deaf ears
12:42 PM CaptHindsight: low intelligence in favor of artificial intelligence
12:42 PM CaptHindsight: but but but the media doesn't mention training
12:43 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: worse
12:43 PM fragalot: he went to a seminar
12:43 PM robotustra: no, I just do simple motion detect and try to program robot to follow the motion
12:43 PM robotustra: with eyes
12:43 PM CaptHindsight: sponsored b?y
12:43 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: some AI group.. no idea which one.
12:43 PM CaptHindsight: what has eyes but can't se?e
12:44 PM robotustra: it can
12:44 PM fragalot: robotustra: CaptHindsight is trying a riddle
12:44 PM fragalot: you're supposed to guess
12:44 PM robotustra: but can't move them yet
12:44 PM robotustra: I recognize no sarcasm via IRC and in english, sorry
12:44 PM CaptHindsight: keyboard is either going bonkers or I caught some bug
12:45 PM CaptHindsight: answer Potato
12:47 PM robotustra: teaching this guy to track objects https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om_hhY21Tbg
12:47 PM robotustra: and focus on one region
12:48 PM CaptHindsight: heh, shift key is acting as backspace, shift or 4
12:48 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: liquid damage?
12:48 PM CaptHindsight: dropped from lap height
12:48 PM robotustra: your kbd drinks too much coffee
12:49 PM CaptHindsight: I get about a year per keyboard
12:50 PM robotustra: my kbds live long lives
12:50 PM robotustra: 8+ years
12:50 PM fragalot: i've been using the same keyboard for 14 years now and it hasn't even had the letters wear off
12:51 PM robotustra: model?
12:51 PM fragalot: aldi special
12:52 PM CaptHindsight: this one has a trackpad
12:52 PM robotustra: i use logitech or microsoft
12:52 PM CaptHindsight: Adesso
12:52 PM Deejay: nobody needs letters on keyboards o0
12:52 PM fragalot: robotustra: agreed, both great keyboards
12:53 PM fragalot: though i'm not so sure about microsoft's new ergonomic range
12:53 PM fragalot: their previous ones were good, but the new ones are a bit ... too much
12:53 PM robotustra: I was thinking to use orthlinear kbd for my new machine as a input device
12:53 PM Deejay: the old microsoft natural keyboard is the best ;)
12:53 PM Deejay: using mine for 22 years now
12:56 PM robotustra: something like this https://olkb.com/
12:56 PM CaptHindsight: people talk about missing the old IBM thinkpad keyboards
12:56 PM CaptHindsight: T60 era
12:57 PM robotustra: oh, btf my frien gave me 2 laptops, T60 and T61 and the keyboard is really good on them
12:57 PM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight: T60 isnt old... i still have a working TP 600E ;)
12:57 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.notebookreview.com/assets/9328.jpg
12:58 PM CaptHindsight: Loetmichel: we looked at making new motherboards for them with modern processors and batteries
12:59 PM Loetmichel: isnt there a chinese company that already sells a refurbished T60?
12:59 PM CaptHindsight: http://openlunchbox.com/smf/index.php
12:59 PM CaptHindsight: yeah with the old motherboard and batteries
01:02 PM CaptHindsight: http://openlunchbox.com/open-laptop/
01:04 PM Loetmichel: CaptHindsight: no, i mean a company that tool an X60 (or was it a T60? and made a new motherboard for up to date I5 processors and stuff
01:04 PM CaptHindsight: maybe someone has, 4I stopped looking when we saw no way to have open firmware anymore
01:05 PM Loetmichel: they even remodeled the enclosure a bit to fit an USB3 and a mini-hdmi into the cardbus-slot
01:05 PM CaptHindsight: not difficult
01:05 PM CaptHindsight: but they have a closed BIOS
01:05 PM Loetmichel: yes, the difficult part is making the new motherboard
01:05 PM CaptHindsight: so there is limited interest
01:05 PM Loetmichel: probably.
01:05 PM Loetmichel: why?
01:06 PM CaptHindsight: certainly
01:06 PM Loetmichel: who needs an open bios?
01:06 PM Loetmichel: for what?
01:06 PM CaptHindsight: privacy and security
01:06 PM CaptHindsight: for you not from you
01:06 PM Loetmichel: hmm?
01:07 PM Loetmichel: all bios(es) i know have settings for admin PW and user PW and HDD PW
01:07 PM Loetmichel: what more do you need?
01:07 PM fragalot: for the bios to not call home
01:07 PM Loetmichel: ah, i see
01:07 PM Loetmichel: how could it?
01:07 PM Loetmichel: log into the wifi without you PW?
01:07 PM CaptHindsight: BIOS is 2-3 kernels
01:07 PM fragalot: you enter the password
01:07 PM CaptHindsight: before you load the one you want
01:07 PM Loetmichel: in windows or linux, yes
01:08 PM Loetmichel: sorry, bit that is a bit much of paranoia for me
01:08 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iffTJ1vPCSo
01:08 PM CaptHindsight: not paranoia
01:08 PM Loetmichel: thinking that some bios manufacturer will install a keylogger into it just to get data from its customers customers.
01:08 PM CaptHindsight: we have know about this since the 90's
01:08 PM Loetmichel: if you say so.
01:09 PM CaptHindsight: no it's backdoored for your protection
01:09 PM CaptHindsight: we even offered to write all the firmware for Intel for free
01:09 PM CaptHindsight: I though this was common knowledge by now
01:10 PM CaptHindsight: though/thought
01:10 PM CaptHindsight: all your super duper shielding has little benefit if they are connected to the internet
01:15 PM Rab: I think there are (plausibly) backdoors in the processor itself, in every major part of the chipset, and probably right down to the touchpad controller.
01:15 PM CaptHindsight: yes, in the CPU's as well
01:15 PM pcw_home: Yeah, This even affects LinuxCNC, you need to turn off AMT on some Intel CPUs or the ME sits there monitoring the Ethernet causing really bad Ethernet latency
01:16 PM Rab: Multiple simultaneous warring layers of US and Chinese intelligence gathering.
01:16 PM CaptHindsight: it is all transparent from the OS you think is only running
01:17 PM CaptHindsight: Loetmichel: one of the early LinuBIOS devs is from Germany, he works at Google now
01:18 PM Rab: The T60/T61 really had incredible keyboards. I now use a W530, which was the first generation to drop the contoured keyboard and 1920x1200 display. :(
01:18 PM CaptHindsight: writes the BIOS for all the chromebooks
01:18 PM Loetmichel: Rab: they indeed have
01:18 PM Loetmichel: the 600E (which is a few generations older) has the same though
01:19 PM Loetmichel: and may be more suitable for remodeling because it had more room in the base
01:19 PM CaptHindsight: http://openlunchbox.com/smf/index.php?topic=4.msg4#msg4
01:19 PM Loetmichel: or a T20 or something like that to be a BIT more modern so its easier to get them used in reasonable contidion
01:19 PM CaptHindsight: these are the keyboard part numbers for the T60
01:20 PM Rab: I still have a T60 at work, it's shocking to experience the keyboard in comparison to e.g. brand new XPS 15 or Macbook.
01:20 PM Rab: T60p IIRC
01:21 PM CaptHindsight: the guys in the #thinkpad channel know all the ins and outs
01:21 PM Rab: I went through three T61ps, but they all seem to have a chronic eventual failure where the GPU desolders itself and that got old.
01:22 PM Loetmichel: Rab: i own a TP 600E, an X21, an x60s, a T61p and lately i bought a E520 ;)
01:22 PM Loetmichel: all working ;)
01:22 PM CaptHindsight: or ## ibmthinkpad
01:23 PM Rab: Loetmichel, if you lived in USA I could send you a box full of T61p goodies like docking stations and WUXGA panels.
01:23 PM CaptHindsight: lots are still on ebay
01:23 PM Loetmichel: Rab: sad thing is to see the decline in quality.
01:24 PM Loetmichel: bought that E520 with a dead keyboard and touchpad...
01:24 PM Loetmichel: and had to change the keyboard because its no longer repairable
01:24 PM Loetmichel: repaired the touchpad though
01:24 PM Loetmichel: installed a new SSD (was missing)... perfect ;)
01:25 PM Loetmichel: NEVER had a bad keyboard on a TP before that
01:25 PM Loetmichel: it also feels a lot worste than the ones on the X60s and T61P
01:25 PM CaptHindsight: yeah most complain about thinkpads since the t60 or so
01:25 PM CaptHindsight: after t60
01:26 PM CaptHindsight: mechanical keyboards for desktops have made a comeback
01:26 PM CaptHindsight: maybe someone will build a new laptop with good keyboards
01:27 PM CaptHindsight: we just did not get enough interest in making a laptop since there is no way to build fully open firmware for any x86 anymore
01:28 PM CaptHindsight: we'd have to go back 10 years in cpu's to have open firmware
01:28 PM Rab: Nothing good on the ARM side?
01:28 PM CaptHindsight: only imx8 or maybe imx9
01:29 PM Rab: Any hope for RISC-V?
01:29 PM CaptHindsight: even risc-v is not open firmware
01:29 PM CaptHindsight: Ron has another post on risc-v
01:30 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=RISC-V-Not-All-Open-Yet
01:30 PM CaptHindsight: power8 or power9
01:30 PM CaptHindsight: but no GPU drivers for those
01:31 PM CaptHindsight: i.mx8 and i.mx9 have full open firmware and open GPU drivers, so you can have it all
01:32 PM CaptHindsight: but i.mx9 is not in the official linux kernel yet
01:33 PM CaptHindsight: i.mx9 may also make a good single device LCNC system
01:33 PM CaptHindsight: it has 2 microcontrollers integrated as well as multiple ARM cores
01:34 PM CaptHindsight: so could support software stepping without any additional hardware
01:34 PM CaptHindsight: well buffer to stepper driver
01:36 PM CaptHindsight: we should be able to port AMD graphics to power8/9 but...
01:37 PM CaptHindsight: they are expensive devices $3k ea and up
01:38 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.crowdsupply.com/raptor-computing-systems/talos-secure-workstation their project did not get funded
01:42 PM CaptHindsight: let try this keyboard........... \0/
01:45 PM CaptHindsight: https://puri.sm/ is working an imx9 supposedly all open firmware phone
01:45 PM fragalot: starting to get chilly here
01:45 PM fragalot: 13°C
01:46 PM CaptHindsight: we dropped the last couple of days, today back to jungle weather
01:47 PM SpeedEvil is now known as Guest78697
02:08 PM CaptHindsight: https://trmm.net/Vectrex forget who was looking for Vector displays, might be of interest
02:11 PM gloops: the old star wars arcade game!
02:14 PM gloops: must rank very highly in early arcade games, with asteroids
02:18 PM tiwake: I love my vector displays
02:18 PM tiwake: don't have any though
02:47 PM _unreal_: OMG!!!!! I have never seen this manual file before..... its all makse sense now...... every schematic I've ever seen has shown different values for the sla702X series motor controllers... now I know why. every manual I've see has all the controllers in one PDF but they pick ONE to do a schematic of.......
02:47 PM _unreal_: https://www.semicon.sanken-ele.co.jp/sk_content/sla7026m_ds_en.pdf
02:47 PM _unreal_: ordering parts now.
02:48 PM _unreal_: I have a bunch of 7024's and 7026's
02:51 PM flyback: haha
02:51 PM flyback: I have a bunch of those old things
02:52 PM flyback: well I did, had to toss them because folks kept bitching about circuit boards everywhere
02:52 PM flyback: I have a bunch of steppers too I am probbaly going to have to toss
02:52 PM flyback: cause grandma is going to go any day and I will have to move in a hurry
02:52 PM flyback: oh well
02:52 PM flyback: fuck me
02:52 PM flyback: bbl
02:53 PM _unreal_: flyback, what kind of stuff ya got?
02:54 PM flyback: my folks are going to get me a storage bin but I dunno how much it can hold
02:55 PM enleth: https://i.imgur.com/WRorh6s.png how would you machine several of that part on a manual lathe, starting with hex stock? this is pretty much a hex head bolt with an eccentric arbor sticking out of the head. my take on this is to machine the back (shank and thread), then put it in a holder made of larger hex stock, with some packing under one jaw, to machine the eccentric part.
02:55 PM _unreal_: sad you tossed those motor controllers. they are nice and simple
02:56 PM flyback: https://i.imgur.com/lz4R7Ny.jpg
02:56 PM flyback: oh it's another url hang on
02:56 PM _unreal_: If you have more somewhere HANG on to them. I'm about to order a HUGE kit of resistors/caps ETC...... enough for make a bunch of parts kits for the sla702X series
02:57 PM flyback: http://imgur.com/a/2J5D9/all
02:59 PM _unreal_: enleth, ether way..... if you have HEX stock.... and a lathe that can FEED stock through the chuck.... that would be the ideal. that way you can make the part. cut it off FEED out more stock and just bang them out
02:59 PM flyback: err
03:00 PM _unreal_: enleth, is that designed with an OFFSET or is that a cad error?
03:01 PM flyback: I dunno if it's my browser or what
03:01 PM flyback: it keeps fucking reloading back to the top
03:02 PM _unreal_: SAME HERE
03:03 PM flyback: mambye it's time to move to a new host, they blocked me 3+ yrs ago anyways I can't upload
03:03 PM flyback: not me directely but they shitlisted the entire hushmail email domain
03:03 PM flyback: trying chrome now
03:03 PM _unreal_: flyback, same issue with chrome.... I zoomed out max out
03:07 PM flyback: $5 says it's some fgt's little "fuck you for running a script or ad blocker" script
03:07 PM flyback: hmm I got it to load in chromium
03:07 PM flyback: ill have to shoot some new pics before I pack stuff
03:08 PM flyback: some of the stuff is gone
03:08 PM flyback: I have a bunch of minbear astrosyns
03:08 PM flyback: and ons oe fthose vexa 2 phase things
03:09 PM enleth: _unreal_: uh, I explicitly said "eccentric", and "manual lathe"
03:10 PM flyback: they probably need 2 balls after eating toner for 19 yrs
03:10 PM flyback: but it's a standard japan bearing easy to change
03:12 PM flyback: https://www.cncroom.com/images/Minebea23PM-C401-04.jpg
03:12 PM flyback: close except the bottom is open you can see the bearing held in by a c-clip
03:12 PM flyback: bbl
03:14 PM gloops: China says agrees with Britain to discuss 'top notch' free trade deal https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-britain/china-says-agrees-with-britain-to-discuss-top-notch-free-trade-deal-idUSKCN1LA0IB?utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_content=5b81b55c04d301023ccf32f9&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter
03:15 PM gloops: lol! we still get cheapo ballscrews
03:57 PM Deejay: gn8
03:58 PM hazzy-lab1 is now known as hazzy-lab
04:00 PM JessicaRN: hey folks, I just got my hands on a ton of 80/20 in various sizes and lengths. I'm thinking of building a 2"x4"x1" router with it. Any suggestions for decent slides/rails compatible w/ 8020?
04:01 PM JessicaRN: lol! that would be a pretty small router, eh?
04:01 PM JessicaRN: 2'x4'x1'
04:01 PM hazzy-lab: JessicaRN: That is a pretty small router? :D
04:01 PM hazzy-lab: LOL
04:01 PM JessicaRN: great minds....
04:02 PM JessicaRN: so, any suggestions?
04:02 PM roycroft: that's a lot of z for that small a router
04:03 PM JessicaRN: yeah, I know. I was thinking of making it desktop sized, but with an option to expand the table.
04:03 PM JessicaRN: fixed gantry
04:03 PM roycroft: my concern is that it will almost be top heavy
04:03 PM JessicaRN: 4' wide x 2'deep
04:03 PM XXCoder: roycroft: just add more mass to base
04:03 PM roycroft: to get 12" of z you're going to have to make the thing closer to 2' tall
04:03 PM XXCoder: lead chunks or steel ones so on
04:04 PM JessicaRN: yeah, but the gantry will be centered, and I can always bolt it down
04:04 PM roycroft: well you know what you need to do more than i do, of course
04:04 PM roycroft: but routers are usually for making 2d features
04:04 PM roycroft: not 3d
04:05 PM roycroft: if it's a 3d carving machine then a tall z axis makes a lot more sense
04:05 PM roycroft: but if it's really going to be used as a router, primarily on sheet goods, then you might consider more like a 6" z
04:06 PM roycroft: that would save you a lot of money, as your gantry would not need to be nearly as beefy
04:06 PM JessicaRN: no, it will be a carver as well. and eventually a big 3d printer
04:06 PM JessicaRN: and laser
04:06 PM roycroft: ok, that's fine
04:06 PM roycroft: i was just reacting to "router" :)
04:06 PM JessicaRN: I'm thinking of replacable heads
04:07 PM JessicaRN: so, any suggestions for 80/20 compatible fixtures?
04:08 PM XXCoder: drill jaws work surpsing well. its 1.5 inches high and if your router have enough clearance it can mill small stuff
04:09 PM XXCoder: theres something I forgot name, that is directly mounted on table, and you use key to tighten or loosen
04:09 PM JessicaRN: drill jaws? for what? just workpiece hold-downs?
04:10 PM XXCoder: lemme get example may be using wrong world
04:10 PM XXCoder: word
04:10 PM XXCoder: https://images.ffx.co.uk/tools/FAIVDP75.JPG?w=1280&h=960&scale=both
04:10 PM XXCoder: drill press jaws
04:11 PM MarcelineVQ: [drill] press vice
04:12 PM JessicaRN: I'm looking for bearings and slides to manage my moving parts
04:12 PM XXCoder: sigh yes I suck with naming stuff something lol
04:12 PM XXCoder: dammit sometimes whats wrong with me today
04:13 PM JessicaRN: sure, i know what you are talking about. but it would be way too small. I need slide rails the size of the machine
04:13 PM JessicaRN: my x axis would be 4'
04:14 PM JessicaRN: y, at least 2'
04:14 PM XXCoder: oh its for workholding
04:14 PM JessicaRN: nonono
04:14 PM XXCoder: the vise I was talking about :)
04:15 PM XXCoder: still looking for other kind of workholding
04:15 PM XXCoder: cant find it
04:15 PM JessicaRN: the table is driven by an acme thread, but the rails provide support and a low friction surface (bearings, rollers, etc)
04:15 PM XXCoder: I dont really recommand SBRs, the flat kind is getting cheaper all time though!
04:16 PM JessicaRN: what is an sbr?
04:16 PM XXCoder: hm cant remember what flat type is called. oh supported bar rail
04:17 PM JessicaRN: ahh, yeah. the supported rod type of slide surface.
04:17 PM JessicaRN: I know now
04:17 PM XXCoder: know whats annoying? searching for rails. so many weapons appear in results even with -gun -weapons
04:18 PM JessicaRN: but what is the "flat kind"?
04:18 PM XXCoder: its similiar in concept really
04:18 PM XXCoder: MBR? lemme look for that
04:19 PM XXCoder: drat
04:21 PM XXCoder: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3D-print-parts-cnc-Kossel-Mini-MGN9-9mm-miniature-linear-rail-slide-1pc-MGN9-linear-rail/32806622073.html
04:21 PM XXCoder: finally. though that one is tiny
04:21 PM XXCoder: 650mm 24 bucks basically. thats bit over 2 feet long
04:22 PM JessicaRN: what is the benefit of flat vs round?
04:23 PM XXCoder: not sure if I can explain it well
04:23 PM XXCoder: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/NEW-MGN12H-block-for-MGN12-12mm-Linear-Guide-12mm-linear-rail-way-Long-linear-carriage-for/32819778972.html
04:23 PM XXCoder: 12mm versiobn, overkill or not? dunno
04:24 PM JessicaRN: anyone?
04:25 PM XXCoder: oh hey thats new variant to me https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1pcs-Silver-aluminum-Double-axis-roller-linear-guide-SGR20-L-600mm-1pcs-SGB20-block-linear-Motion/32858412299.html
04:27 PM XXCoder: interesting type https://www.aliexpress.com/item/44mm-width-Aluminum-Square-Roller-Linear-Guide-Rail-1pcs-SGR15N-Length-400mm-with-1pc-SGB15N-3UU/32807150900.html
04:27 PM hazzy-lab: JessicaRN: How heavy duty do you need the machine to be, and what is you budget? Are you going to be using ACME screws, ball-screw, belts .. for axis drives ? Give use a little more info on what you are trying to achieve.
04:27 PM hazzy-lab: For example this is my brother's router as of a few minutes ago: https://i.imgur.com/IPzNG7Z.png
04:27 PM hazzy-lab: He is using all linear rails and ball-screw actuators, is that the kinda thing you are planning, or simpler?
04:28 PM JessicaRN: acme or ball. I'm hoping to cut brass and aluminum, in addition to wood, etc.
04:29 PM Roguish: JessicaRN: what's the budget? more importantly, what are your expectations of performance? spindle size and HP, accuracy, repeatability, etc, etc.
04:29 PM JessicaRN: as far as budget, I'm like most. I want it all for nothing. I had put the idea on the shelf until I was recently gifted all this 8020
04:30 PM JessicaRN: minimum accuracy of .01" but I'd love to get .001"
04:30 PM Roguish: 80/20 ain't cheap, so that's a good start. but it does not make for a very stiff machine, that limits everything.
04:31 PM JessicaRN: speed isn't too huge a deal. I already have the steppers and drivers
04:31 PM XXCoder: .01" is pretty easy really. buy some of those rails I linked to
04:31 PM Roguish: don't gold plate the dog.
04:31 PM JessicaRN: Roguish: it isn't that stiff?
04:32 PM XXCoder: JessicaRN: I remembered some of sbr issue, it can take full force downwards rod down to base, sidewaysmaybe 40%? and pull outwards 10%
04:32 PM XXCoder: bit of a flaw
04:32 PM JessicaRN: I've only had wood frames in the past. I figured that 80/20 with a lot of cross reinforcment would be pretty solid. Am i wrong?
04:32 PM Roguish: read up a little bit. there is a significant difference between stiffness and strength.
04:32 PM enleth: JessicaRN: do you have all the 8020 brackets, corner pieces, nuts and other joining hardware, or just the extrusions?
04:33 PM JessicaRN: enleth: a bunch of the brackets and hardware. I'll prolly need to have a few things machined for me
04:33 PM JessicaRN: not much though
04:33 PM enleth: JessicaRN: FYI, all that little stuff adds up very fast to a very high price, it's not impossible for it to be more expensive than all the steel needed for a welded frame
04:33 PM JessicaRN: enleth: I have most of it.
04:33 PM Roguish: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stiffness
04:33 PM Roguish: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strength_of_materials
04:33 PM JessicaRN: the 80/20 was from salvaged machines.
04:34 PM JessicaRN: so I got all the parts when I did my tear-downs
04:35 PM enleth: JessicaRN: good. the second problem is that those are still bolted connections with relatively little surface contact on very long pieces, so that stuff likes to move and twist a tiny bit, which is one reason why 8020 frames lack rigidity
04:35 PM JessicaRN: Roguish: so, like cast iron is very stiff, but it is not very strong d/t brittleness.
04:35 PM JessicaRN: ?
04:35 PM BitEvil_: JessicaRN: 80/20 is not a lot stiffer than wood.
04:35 PM Roguish: sounds like a fun project. get FreeCAD and work it all out ahead of time, at least most of the design
04:35 PM BitEvil_: It is a lot more consistent than wood.
04:36 PM BitEvil_: But fundamentally - aluminium only has 5 or so times the stiffness of wood, and 8020 is far from solid
04:36 PM Roguish: structural stiffness is a combination of material stiffness and geometry.
04:36 PM Roguish: aluminum has 1/3 the material stiffness of steel.
04:36 PM BitEvil_: it is very easy to get a wood structure stiffer than a steel one.
04:37 PM BitEvil_: It is hard to keep it in one particular shape.
04:37 PM JessicaRN: I was planning on adding diagonal bracing across the longer pieces to increase the rigidity
04:37 PM BitEvil_: And it has issues with point loading
04:38 PM Roguish: JessicaRN: draw it all out the best you can and come on back. lots of assistance here.
04:39 PM Roguish: do some simple sketches and throw 'em up on imgur or something and ask for critique.
04:39 PM JessicaRN: BitEvil_: 8020 is more dimensionally stable than wood d/t moisture and temp changes, correct?
04:39 PM JessicaRN: Roguish: ty
04:39 PM JessicaRN: I'll do that
04:39 PM enleth: JessicaRN: by all means go ahead, you'll definitely get *something* in the end, but keep your expectations low for milling any metals - there's an extremely high chance that this router will produce absolutely horrible finishes in aluminum and brass even with very conservative speeds and feeds, and you can only reduce an endmill's feed so far before it stops cutting from trying to shave off too thin a
04:39 PM enleth: bite at a time and start rubbing
04:40 PM JessicaRN: well, if I can use it to get decent results in wood that will be something.
04:40 PM Roguish: do some web surfing to ebay and cnczone for examples. kinda window shopping
04:41 PM JessicaRN: and I can always do lost foam casting if I need metal
04:41 PM enleth: even failed designs are a type of success if you learn from the mistakes
04:41 PM JessicaRN: enleth: I don't have the budget for too many mistakes!
04:41 PM enleth: at least with 8020, you can always take it apart and make a smaller one
04:42 PM XXCoder: pretty cool https://hackaday.com/2018/08/24/a-peek-at-the-mesmerizing-action-of-a-cycloidal-drive/
04:42 PM _unreal_: !#$%!#@$%!@#$ amazon 25$ bs I have to add 2 dollars to my order for an "add-on" item or it wont ship WTF.....
04:42 PM XXCoder: hell of a backlash I bet though
04:42 PM JessicaRN: so, to my original question, what to you all think of round shaft versus profiled rails?
04:42 PM XXCoder: lol I tend to add junk on that
04:43 PM BitEvil_: JessicaRN: yes.
04:43 PM JessicaRN: BitEvil_: tyvm
04:44 PM BitEvil_: release speedevil
04:44 PM BitEvil_: doh
04:44 PM XXCoder: noooo evil is released!
04:44 PM enleth: JessicaRN: oh, and one trick for stiffening frames: attach a piece of sheet material. anything, even plywood, doesn't have to be sheet metal to make a difference
04:45 PM JessicaRN: enleth: yeah, I've got that one planned
04:45 PM enleth: JessicaRN: like the HDF back of most IKEA furniture, if you're familiar with those
04:45 PM JessicaRN: yep
04:45 PM XXCoder: enleth: lol yeah theres also fin variant
04:45 PM XXCoder: just angled alum extrusion
04:45 PM JessicaRN: BitEvil_: are you speed?
04:47 PM enleth: JessicaRN: also, with 8020 you might be able to design the gantry posts in such a way that the transverse part can be unbolted and moved up or down, introducing a Z axis "bias"
04:48 PM hazzy-lab: JessicaRN: Profiled rails are always superior to round rails, except for a very few exceptions
04:49 PM enleth: JessicaRN: so you could lower it as much as possible for cutting flat parts out of harder materials, greatly reducing Z overhang and the leverage on gantry posts
04:49 PM JessicaRN: enleth: I was going to have a friend cut 1/2" steel plate for the gantry sides
04:49 PM JessicaRN: hey speed, long time
04:49 PM JessicaRN: hazzy-lab: thanks for that info. what is the rationale for that?
04:50 PM enleth: JessicaRN: ah, right. make sure to add some sort of ribbing anyway, completely flat parts *will* flex at some frequency unless they're really unreasonably thick
04:51 PM XXCoder: ribbed for strength
04:51 PM JessicaRN: hey folks, I'm being hollared at to make dinner. thx for all the info. I'll be back
04:51 PM XXCoder: hey pingufan
04:51 PM XXCoder: er pink_vampire
05:00 PM pink_vampire: hi XXCoder
05:01 PM XXCoder: whats up
05:02 PM pink_vampire: nothing new :(
05:02 PM pink_vampire: I'm trying to program something on arduino :(
05:05 PM XXCoder: air pollution at 125. not too bad. was 166
05:06 PM pink_vampire: where???
05:06 PM XXCoder: tacoma
05:06 PM pink_vampire: here it's rain all the time
05:06 PM _unreal_: pink_vampire, Thats what it was like where I use to live. Maine/usa
05:07 PM _unreal_: always raining
05:07 PM XXCoder: lets just say I am REALLLLLLY looking forwards to rain on wed
05:07 PM XXCoder: finally cleaning out crap off air.
05:08 PM roycroft: we're forecast for some rain on friday
05:09 PM roycroft: it's still pretty smokey/hazy here
05:09 PM pink_vampire: my VFD is still not even mounted LOL
05:09 PM XXCoder: weather update, looks like light rain tomorrow, and no futher rain whole week
05:09 PM pink_vampire: and my low speed spindle is still not connected to the servo
05:09 PM XXCoder: bah
05:09 PM Tom_L: enleth did you figure out how to make your part?
05:09 PM _unreal_: pink_vampire, I just ordered $50 in stuff 60 seconds ago
05:10 PM _unreal_: including an LCD :)
05:10 PM Tom_L: did you get your money's worth?
05:10 PM pink_vampire: _unreal_: what did you ordered?
05:13 PM _unreal_: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01GPUMP9C/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
05:13 PM _unreal_: that and 4 multi packs of resistors, ceramic caps and other stuff. and some higher watt resistors so I can build a bunch of these motor controllers that I have
05:14 PM enleth: Tom_L: I'm probably going to make a "fixture" with a threaded hole to accept the bolt side of the part, with some jaw packing attached to it to get the proper offset in a 3-jaw chuck
05:14 PM pink_vampire: I like the 320*240
05:14 PM pink_vampire: lcd
05:14 PM Tom_L: that's what i was gonna suggest, or make a 'collet' with an offset to grip the unthreaded part
05:15 PM _unreal_: I didnt really need the LCD but I needed to add seomthing else so an "add-on" amazon item would shit.. I was $2 shy of the magic $25 mark becuase I dont pay for the stupid premire account
05:15 PM Tom_L: threads tend to not be as accurate for something like that than the solid round
05:15 PM pink_vampire: _unreal_: https://i.imgur.com/bsnfthM.png
05:16 PM enleth: Tom_L: the thread is long enough to take the machining loads with the hex head butted against the face of the fixture, with the straight part of the shank ensuring it's coaxial and all that
05:16 PM Tom_L: how many?
05:17 PM Tom_L: i'd probably do all one end first
05:17 PM enleth: yep, that's the plan
05:18 PM Tom_L: how much offset it it?
05:18 PM enleth: ~1.1mm
05:18 PM enleth: I need to make four of those now and might need more later, it's a guide bearing arbor for a horizontal bandsaw
05:18 PM Tom_L: 10mm thread?
05:18 PM Tom_L: 12 maybe
05:18 PM enleth: M8, and the straight part is 9.8mm dia
05:18 PM enleth: the bearing arbor is 10mm
05:19 PM _unreal_: pink_vampire, What software are you using?
05:19 PM enleth: there's a threaded hole in the arbor for a srew with a washer to hold the bearings on
05:19 PM enleth: *screw
05:19 PM pink_vampire: _unreal_: for what?
05:19 PM Tom_L: that's visible
05:19 PM enleth: the original part had a c-ring groove in there, but a screw will work too and is simpler
05:19 PM enleth: as in, I don't have to hunt for proper rings
05:20 PM Tom_L: just so the bearing seal doesn't get chewed up on the hex
05:20 PM Tom_L: you may want a little offset on it
05:20 PM enleth: good point
05:20 PM Tom_L: i'm doing a similar part
05:20 PM Tom_L: just a sec
05:21 PM enleth: the whole reason I'm doing this is that the bandsaw got upgraded to a much wider blade, with wider wheels and all
05:21 PM enleth: but the guide bearings have to be doubled up now
05:21 PM enleth: so I need those parts with the bearing side almost twice as long
05:21 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Assembly/Shims/Cover_slide_bracket.jpg
05:21 PM Tom_L: i put the offset there to hold the bearing away a bit
05:22 PM Tom_L: the hole will be threaded as well
05:23 PM enleth: ah, so my saw has cast guide bearing mounts that take care of any large scale offsets and general layout of the bearings
05:23 PM enleth: those arbors are for fine tuning of the distance between side bearings
05:23 PM Tom_L: i know, a guy in #robotics is fixing his saw too
05:24 PM pink_vampire: Tom_L: just 2d machine on one side, then rotate 90 deg, probe it, drill, tap
05:24 PM Tom_L: my part is unrelated to a saw but i knew it had a bearing offset on it
05:25 PM _unreal_: for that arduino DRO?
05:25 PM Tom_L: pink_vampire, that's the plan but those holes aren't tapped just recessed
05:26 PM Tom_L: gotta make a left & right part
05:26 PM _unreal_ is now known as _unreal
05:27 PM enleth: Tom_L: so pretty much the only challenge I have here is to figure out how much stuff to pack under one jaw for the "fixture" to be offset by 1.1mm
05:27 PM _unreal: pink_vampire, I'm going to make a safe assumption that LCD cost more then $10
05:27 PM Tom_L: .55mm
05:27 PM enleth: yeah, there was a formula for that
05:27 PM pink_vampire: _unreal: wrong
05:28 PM Tom_L: just half the offset
05:28 PM Tom_L: index it if it needs to be on the flat of the hex
05:28 PM pink_vampire: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Hot-2-4-TFT-LCD-Display-Shield-Touch-Panel-240X320-for-Arduino-UNO-MEGA/401403567408?hash=item5d75845d30:g:ai8AAOSwhChZuOT4
05:31 PM Tom_L: but i'm used to a 4 jaw, 3 may be a tiny bit different
05:31 PM XXCoder: Tom_L: ever used 3 jaw before?
05:31 PM Tom_L: sure
05:31 PM enleth: Tom_L: well, it is a little more complex for a 3-jaw
05:31 PM Tom_L: i ran an Okuma cadet for a while
05:32 PM XXCoder: oh good was bit wondering because 3 is far more common from what I see
05:32 PM Tom_L: all i've got on my old lathe is a 4 jaw though
05:32 PM XXCoder: you gained more skills bec 4 is harder
05:33 PM XXCoder: 3 is self centering from what I remember
05:33 PM MarcelineVQ: not if your 4 is a scroll still :D
05:33 PM enleth: I'll have to test the offset on a piece of aluminum anyway, as the eccentric part is supposed to be flush with two sides
05:33 PM Tom_L: it's supposed to be
05:33 PM enleth: so it has to be more or less spot on
05:33 PM Tom_L: http://www.steves-workshop.co.uk/tips/lathetech/eccentrics/eccentricindex.htm
05:33 PM Tom_L: there's your formula
05:35 PM enleth: yep, found it a couple days ago
05:35 PM enleth: there's inaccuracy to be expected from the fact that jaws have a flat on them, thus the need to test it
05:35 PM Tom_L: now go turn me out a crankshaft
05:35 PM Tom_L: :)
05:36 PM Tom_L: i don't think on that, the eccentric needs to be spot on... likely quite a bit of room for error
05:37 PM Tom_L: you're just trying to squeeze the blade
05:37 PM enleth: yes, it's just for manual adjustment, but if I go too far out, I'll be cutting air
05:37 PM Tom_L: well don't do that then
05:38 PM enleth: and the arbor won't be a complete circle in cross section
05:39 PM Tom_L: not a huge deal
05:39 PM Tom_L: motors have flats on them etc
05:39 PM enleth: probably not on bearing journals
05:39 PM Tom_L: i'd try to get it as close as i can but i'm just saying....
05:39 PM enleth: but you have a point, it's not going to cause a problem here
05:39 PM enleth: if I miss the edge a little bit
05:40 PM Tom_L: so put it in a rotary axis and mill the offset with linuxcnc :D
06:27 PM jthornton: dang hot day for a ride
06:34 PM jdh: yes, it was.
06:35 PM JT-Shop: it was a St Jude benefit run so I ignored the heat as best as I could
10:05 PM _unreal: Just tested my optical limit switch board... works great
10:36 PM `Wolf_: 0.o
10:37 PM XXCoder: 102 in air quality. awesome!
10:37 PM XXCoder: it was peaking quite high at 166 few days agi
10:43 PM `Wolf_: that sounds good? bad? horrible?
10:43 PM XXCoder: 0 is perfect
10:43 PM XXCoder: 100 is ehh dirty but ok, 500 is deadly
10:44 PM XXCoder: 100-200 "sensive needs mask"
10:45 PM `Wolf_: ugh fun
10:46 PM XXCoder: I think it actually peaked past 200 in last week
10:48 PM XXCoder: ah its good, moderate 51-100, USG, 101-150 (sensive), 151-200 unhealthy, 201-300 unhealthy, 301-500 hazious
10:49 PM hazzy-lab1 is now known as hazzy-lab
10:50 PM XXCoder: 182 in 21th https://www.airnow.gov/index.cfm?action=airnow.local_city&cityid=258&mapdate=20180821
10:57 PM XXCoder: bagel +nhummus dip = yummy
11:00 PM `Wolf_: and so it begins https://i.imgur.com/PAYWw1V.jpg
11:02 PM XXCoder: :)
11:02 PM `Wolf_: new one is lol sized https://i.imgur.com/e8BYoEs.jpg
11:02 PM XXCoder: sometimes I wish reality is like minecraft, just get resources put em on craft table and take out finished item
11:03 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Bearing_Bracket/Bearing_Bracket3.jpg
11:03 PM `Wolf_: nice
11:03 PM `Wolf_: I’m gonna be wishing I had one of my cnc mills here pretty soon I bet
11:03 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Assembly/Shims/Cover_slide_bracket.jpg
11:08 PM XXCoder: nice
11:29 PM enleth: Tom_L: KYK bearings?
11:31 PM Tom_L: just some old 608zz bearings
11:33 PM _unreal: My optical limit switch board https://drive.google.com/open?id=1k8US9cI7WMIMn3FHjpq8DcqPiSpv5e6k
11:36 PM enleth: Tom_L: the red seals look like KYKs, but I've seen at least one other manufacturer use this shade of red
11:37 PM Tom_L: i dunno what they are, they're out of some of my kid's skates
11:49 PM Tom_L: run from line is imo one of the best additions to linuxcnc in recent months
11:51 PM Wolf__: wut
11:52 PM Tom_L: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/21-axis/8406-run-from-selected-line-working
11:52 PM Wolf__: about time
11:54 PM Tom_L: i knew it was there but didn't know how to use it. i ran across it somewhat by accident
11:56 PM _unreal: 1am bed time
11:56 PM Tom_L: oh i suppose
11:57 PM Lcvette: https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/VAxzgxBtBrPZtYQHwVKzgnZS
11:57 PM Lcvette: hey all
11:57 PM Lcvette: thoughts on the jog buttons?
11:58 PM Tom_L: only show ones that are in use?
11:58 PM Tom_L: ie no rotary axis, don't show A & B
11:59 PM Lcvette: that will be detemrined by the setup you select
11:59 PM Lcvette: but i have to design for all of them
11:59 PM Tom_L: yeah
11:59 PM Lcvette: same with DRO's
11:59 PM Tom_L: looking good overall though